# Binchotan Charcoal



## madelinez (Jun 2, 2020)

Can you light this charcoal by just placing it directly on a standard indoor gas burner without any fancy equipment? I've seen guides saying it takes about 30 minutes before it's self-sustaining. 

Any general tips for grilling on a Konro yakitori bbq?


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## rob (Jun 2, 2020)

You could, but i certainly wouldn't be doing it indoors. Binchotan tends to snap crackle and pop and i could imagine it setting fire to your kitchen.

I find it takes a bit longer to get going compared with other charcoal, I've had the best results getting it lit in a chimney starter on a wok burner outdoors.

In terms of tips make sure it is completely lit (turned white) before placing in the Konro, this normally takes about 20 minutes. Also a general tip would be to make sure you have all of your ingredients prepared beforehand as once you start cooking the heat is incredibly high and things cook very quickly. I would suggest pork and chicken yakitori as a great meal on the Konro. 

Lastly, i love cooking on mine and find the whole process really rewarding. 
Good luck!


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## madelinez (Jun 7, 2020)

Can anyone point me to a pot with holes for heating up the charcoals indoors on a gas stove? Would a 2000w electric charcoal starter work instead (https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-2000w-electric-charcoal-starter_p0014130)? I don't have any gas burners outdoors so not too many options.


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## Michi (Jun 7, 2020)

madelinez said:


> Would a 2000w electric charcoal starter work instead


Seeing that it's a charcoal starter, I would expect it to work. But looking at this now, I'm wondering whether that could be used to sear meat after sous vide…


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## Carl Kotte (Jun 7, 2020)

I have one of those small saucer looking things with holes in it that I’ve placed on my gas stove to get the coal going. I really don’t like doing it and I think twice before doing it. Fan maxed and windows open (in all other rooms) make it bearable but still kind of unpleasant.


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## Tristan (Jun 7, 2020)

madelinez said:


> Can anyone point me to a pot with holes for heating up the charcoals indoors on a gas stove? Would a 2000w electric charcoal starter work instead (https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-2000w-electric-charcoal-starter_p0014130)? I don't have any gas burners outdoors so not too many options.


You can buy this for $28
Starter pot for binchotan.


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## Carl Kotte (Jun 7, 2020)

Tristan said:


> You can buy this for $28
> Starter pot for binchotan.


That’s the one I have.


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## Bear (Jun 7, 2020)

Wow, first time I've seen these, so you use them indoors?
My egg lighter(not for indoor use)


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## Carl Kotte (Jun 7, 2020)

By pure accident I just met the guy behind the looftlighter (at the playground). Does anyone know whether they work?


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## Tristan (Jun 7, 2020)

Bear said:


> Wow, first time I've seen these, so you use them indoors?


Traditionally used on stovetop. Usually there would be a window in the kitchen so keep that fully open to avoid carbon monoxide. Konros take very little charcoal so the few pieces don’t pose a risk so long as there is a window.


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## MontezumaBoy (Jun 7, 2020)

rob said:


> I find it takes a bit longer to get going compared with other charcoal, I've had the best results getting it lit in a chimney starter on a wok burner outdoors.



I use the chimney starter as well with a few pieces of lump/brickets at the bottom to start. Takes some time given the combustion but then I just transfer with tongs and place them in the konro.

As for grilling on a konro / I bought the large (36" ?) and do a two zone heat with piled high and low to allow for searing / finishing. my $0.02

I use both the stainless mesh grills & steel skewers (flat) sized to sit on the sided (for me bamboo/wood skewers never hold up soaked or not). Also being able to re-use charcoal is great ... I will often use the re-used bits for my low temp zone FWIW ...


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## parbaked (Jun 7, 2020)

I’ve used the starter pot outside on a propane burner.


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## boomchakabowwow (Jun 7, 2020)

Where is the best source for thus charcoal?

id like to try some.


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## pleue (Jun 7, 2020)

Korin sells lots of different grades. Also note, you can extinguish (throw in water) binchotan when you're done and re-use it later. Agreed on not starting it indoors, it pops a lot as it gets started. You can start it by starting regular charcoal in a chimney, dumping it out and gathering it under the chimney and then loading the binchotan inside. Cooking something without a lot of fat may help you get to know the grill a bit before adding that dimension to it. Chicken hearts would be good or cut up hanger steak or something. Vegetables are also a good place to start. Cut and skewer things before hand. You can foil your grill sides if you want it to clean up easy (thick foil).


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## ian (Jun 7, 2020)

@madelinez, you are the worst influence. now I have to go get one of these grills. ****


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## Bert2368 (Jun 7, 2020)

I would NEVER start charcoal indoors, it is one of the classic ways to experience Carbon monoxide poisoning. A very little bit of CO goes a long way, it has about 400X the affinity for sticking to hemoglobin than Oxygen, will build up even if there is very little CO and plenty of O2 in your vicinity- Even with your windows open. Why risk this? Plus, the snap crackle and pop which lump charcoal does when lighting up has ruined more of my (synthetic fiber) clothes than I can remember. All my Polartec pullovers look like the opening of original Star Trek when I'm putting them on, from grilling in the cold months...

I light mine outdoors, using a propane torch. Light a few pieces in the bottom of a starter chimney or even a big tin can with holes punched into it, then put more charcoal on top of the burning bits you started with the torch. In my experience, within 30 minutes, they should all be ready to cook.

In a clean Webber type grill, I just pile up the charcoal on the bottom grate and stick a lit torch nozzle through one of the open vent holes as close to center underneath charcoal as possible. Takes maybe 2 minutes to start the bottom layer, the rest get going in another 20 or so.


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## big D (Jun 7, 2020)

I am so tired of all of the constant warnings of things which I feel are so very overblown out of proportion, I was a bit reluctant to post these.

I went on a search to find out if this charcoal was smokeless and these are the first two which I clicked on. You may wish to read them and confirm that your space is adequate enough to cause you no concerns.

start at second comment


ChefSteps Community Beta



read top section before square insert and then to heading- smokeless








Can you use konro grills indoors? Here's why you shouldn't


You should not use Konro Grills indoors as it is a fire hazard. The grill exterior can get scorching hot, including the base. Using it on top of a carpet or tatami will certainly ruin them. Only fireproof and heat-resistant surfaces are safe enough to put the grill on. Moreover, a Konro Grill...




www.bitemybun.com





Best wishes 
D.


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## Bert2368 (Jun 7, 2020)

I know a little bit about charcoal and making charcoal- Because it is a major ingredient in black powder and several fireworks mixtures, a rather different application. My experience of Japanese charcoal is with hemp or Paulownia sp. for fast powder and pine charcoals for long lasting spark effects.

From the description of making this "binchotan" material, it is not so much the wood species, but is what you get when a dense hard wood sourced charcoal is cooked completely free of volatiles, then further heated without enough Oxygen to burn to the red hot point where the Carbon molecular structure rearranges to a graphitic type structure. Damned hard to light, useless for black powder, rocket fuel or stars, great for smelting Iron from ore, making or forging steel.

You might be able to take commercial USA lump hardwood charcoal and cook it at a very high temperature, driving off the remaining volatiles to make your own version of this fuel. I used to make such hard, glassy, shiny fracture and "clinky" sounding coal by packing an old Dutch oven with hard wood, covering and placing it in the firebox of a locomotive type steam boiler where the flame would heat the Iron red hot for a couple of firing cycles.


big D said:


> I am so tired of all of the constant warnings of things which I feel are so very overblown out of proportion, I was a bit reluctant to post these.



I have had CO poisoning twice, once from a gasoline engine driven air compressor operated by a careless French person on Martinique while SCUBA diving, once from sleeping in a diesel tractor which had developed leaks in the exhaust system under the sleeper cab. It is not something to be trifled with. Hyperbaric chambers suck, avoid them.


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## big D (Jun 7, 2020)

@Bert2368 
It was the fact that the very first two things I turned up both cautioned about the CO, which is why I decided to post the links for investigation. I thought that it may be possibly valid. Thanks for taking all the time to write about the binchotan...interesting. 
Thank you
D.


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## btbyrd (Jun 7, 2020)

+1 again for not starting it inside because of popping. I would also not use the grill inside unless you're sure that you have adequate ventilation. Charcoal grills are a not unpopular tool for killing yourself.


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## btbyrd (Jun 7, 2020)

The aramaru binchotan from Korin has the best bang for the buck. It's better and more satisfying than extruded "bincho" (like Korin's sumi or Ricker's Thaan, [though sumi is better than Thaan]) but isn't nearly as expensive as the white oak binchotan. And it's purdy.


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## MontezumaBoy (Jun 7, 2020)

boomchakabowwow said:


> Where is the best source for thus charcoal?
> 
> id like to try some.








So I bought a Konro Grill ... Do I follow it up with Binchotan


Anyone have any experience with the various types, thoughts on each, whether they are worth it ... I will certainly try it but just figured I'd get some thoughts first. Have used high end lump (nakewhiz.com reference) in my various BGE's for many, many years and love it - just @ 8X Price per Lb...




www.kitchenknifeforums.com





Jon/JKI has carried it in the past (I have a bunch) see this post/contact Mr Broida ... I love cooking with the stuff he sold me - hard as a rock/dense/etc. ... 

Sent you a PM with the same info.


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## Bert2368 (Jun 7, 2020)

I got interested and am now overthinking this, probably. Got some questions? Never even HEARD of this before today.

I understand the cooking/cooling process for these charcoals.

Looking at the 30 varieties offered at Korin, I see the hierarchy being, first, whole branches yielding about .75" or 20mm sticks of round charcoal, then halved larger branches split to smaller size, then split logs, finally, lump charcoal of irregular size/shape and lastly, for the undiscerning gaijin such as myself, extruded sticks of ground charcoal (Kingsford 様式).

Round sticks = most burning surface per approximate same dimension/weight of sticks, which might = highest heat output, other factors being equal?

If any have knowledge of the sourcing of wood for this product? Are trees grown and harvested solely for this use, perhaps as the smaller branches harvested from "copiced" oak trees as was done in pre industrial age Europe?









Coppicing - Wikipedia







en.m.wikipedia.org





Or is wood for this charcoal a byproduct of trees felled whole for other uses, made from the slash and trim of trunks destined for use as lumber?

If the wood is being harvested primarily for charcoal making, do the foresters prefer to do this at a particular TIME OF YEAR? Summer harvested wood has significant ammounts of sugars and other chemicals stored in the sap wood, plus the bark falls off easily upon drying. Winter harvested wood will have less sugar & etc. in sapwood and the bark will remain tight to the pieces.


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## Tristan (Jun 7, 2020)

How it’s made


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## RDalman (Jun 8, 2020)

Heat gun if you're in a hurry.


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## lowercasebill (Jun 8, 2020)

Carl Kotte said:


> By pure accident I just met the guy behind the looftlighter (at the playground). Does anyone know whether they work?


Yes it works. I use map gas and the looftlighter to start my BGE. I did a test for BGE forum years ago. About 3 minutes for either one. Using both works great start a spot with map and then put looftlighter to it the fan really gets it going


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## Bert2368 (Jun 8, 2020)

I took a quick look at Looftlighters. I wondered about the rather wide range in price and different appearances. I had NO idea until now that Chinese were counterfeiting every successful BBQ tool and device they ever learn of, but I should have guessed.









Amazon: A Necessary Evil?


Hearth & Home Magazine - A Publication from Village West Publishing




www.hearthandhome.com


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## Michi (Jul 13, 2020)

It appears that the warnings about not using a charcoal grill are well-founded:









Nine children and two adults leave hospital after carbon monoxide poisoning from charcoal grill


Eleven people have now been discharged from hospital after treatment for carbon monoxide poisoning from a charcoal grill used inside a Hobart house.




www.abc.net.au


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2020)

Michi said:


> It appears that the warnings about not using a charcoal grill are well-founded:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I was just thinking the same thing after seeing that terrible news today.


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## madelinez (Jul 13, 2020)

So to update this thread, the electric charcoal starter doesn't work. I ended up putting 4 smaller pieces on the gas stove indoors for about 15 minutes. I kept all the windows open and the extractor fan on, although it's clearly got risks as per the above post.

Once the charcoals had turned white/orange I added to the grill with some new charcoal and used a little battery fan to increase airflow for another 15 minutes before finally getting up to temp.


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## Chips (Jul 14, 2020)

I hope this is a journalistic error, not a(n) actual direct quote from that linked article.

_*"Acting Deputy Regional Fire Chief Phil Smith said carbon monoxide was a "flammable and volatile gas.* "

_

I've treated these patients firsthand over the years. It requires a good bit of community education and outreach, believe it or not. The last patient I treated was a pediatric case where the family had a party, and brought in a Weber style kettle into the apartment to keep the family warm late into the night after the party had ended. They had many children sleeping on the floor in the living room where this was placed. Turns out, it's not uncommon for people to use heat methods like this in colder areas of poorer countries, in this case Mexico. The parents meant no ill-will, they just didn't know. American dwellings are for the most part, much more air-tight than many structures in Mexico, and in the very poorest of areas can be partially open sheds, or whatnot, made with whatever material is available.


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## Michi (Jul 14, 2020)

Chips said:


> *Acting Deputy Regional Fire Chief Phil Smith said carbon monoxide was a "flammable and volatile gas.* "


I do hope that he didn't actually say that. Because, if he did, we'll have to look for a new acting deputy regional fire chief… 

Defective heaters can kill people or cause permanent injury. It is not uncommon for people to die, or end up suffering permanent brain damage. Carbon monoxide is odourless, and there are few warning signs. People might get a headache or feel dizzy, or maybe get nauseous. If carbon monoxide sneaks up on people while they are asleep, chances are that they'll never wake up, or wake up as a vegetable.

Charcoal indoors is most definitely not a good idea.

PS: A famous djembe teacher, Abdoulaye Diakite from Senegal, was found unconscious in his room in California in 2008. He suffered CO poisoning from a defective fuel heater. He survived, but never recovered, ending up with permanent brain damage. (I happen to know because I was part of the djembe scene for many years.)


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## madelinez (Jul 14, 2020)

I had the unfortunate pleasure of working next to a large temporary generator in a low wind environment once. Most of the crew complained about headaches so we got measurements taken and carbon monoxide was too high, so definitely a warning sign if the carbon monoxide comes on slowly enough versus walking into a room with a high concentration.


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## lowercasebill (Jul 14, 2020)

Carbon monoxide is flammable. Anyone who has a BGE and has experienced flashback knows first hand. CO is the result of incomplete combustion when given 02 it completes the process and becomes CO2. Most BGE owners have singed arm hair or eyebrows.


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## lowercasebill (Jul 14, 2020)

Flashback -- Naked Whiz Ceramic Charcoal Cooking


Information about dangerous flashbacks with ceramic cookers.



www.nakedwhiz.com


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## Michi (Jul 14, 2020)

lowercasebill said:


> Carbon monoxide is flammable.


I live and learn. Thank you!


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## lowercasebill (Jul 14, 2020)

Michi said:


> I live and learn. Thank you!


Problem is carbon monoxide victims are unconscious or dead before concentration levels become flammable. With the exception of BGE owners and nerds (i am both) no one knows.


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## Michi (Jul 14, 2020)

lowercasebill said:


> Problem is carbon monoxide victims are unconscious or dead before concentration levels become flammable. With the exception of BGE owners and nerds (i am both) no one knows.


I've experienced flashback on barbeques. I always thought that it is caused by the combustible material getting overheated while there is a lack of oxygen. Then I open the lid, lots of air (and oxygen) rushes in, and I get the flashback. It never occurred to me that part of this might be due to carbon monoxide.


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## lowercasebill (Jul 14, 2020)

Always burb your ceramic cooker.


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## lowercasebill (Jul 14, 2020)

Burp


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## Michi (Jul 14, 2020)




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## Nemo (Jul 14, 2020)

Yeah, CO is only half oxidised, so would be further combustible to CO2.

As mentioned, it'll kill you at much lower concentrations by poionining your haemoglobin and the oxidative enzymes in your mitochondria.

Many who survive CO poisoning end up with neurogical disorders (I've heard it referred to as "brain rot") a couple of months later.

Not nice.


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## Dc2123 (Jul 14, 2020)

At the restaurant we would start it on a sheet tray under the salamander.


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## Chips (Jul 18, 2020)

lowercasebill said:


> Carbon monoxide is flammable. Anyone who has a BGE and has experienced flashback knows first hand. CO is the result of incomplete combustion when given 02 it completes the process and becomes CO2. Most BGE owners have singed arm hair or eyebrows.




Correct. I meant in the 400th of one percent of total ambient gas that causes these symptoms. It's deadly at that level, but not flammable or explosive. Fortunately, we don't normally experience pure CO gas.


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## Bert2368 (Jul 19, 2020)

The old fashioned "town gas" used in gas lamps for illumination before electric lights took over that market was a mixture of Hydrogen and Carbon monoxide. It was made by blowing steam over red hot coke- The Carbon would react with the Oxygen from the water, leaving the Hydrogen free, but Carbon was always in excess, so CO was mostly formed rather than CO2 as happens when excess Oxgen is available.

This is the origin of "turning on the gas" being a euphemism for suicide. Because all you had to do back then was turn on the gas lamps and/or kitchen stove without lighting the gas, close the windows and wait.


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## Paraffin (Jul 19, 2020)

Cool info about "town gas," thanks!

Our house is a Victorian built in 1888, it still has the old town gas pipes in the attic. The chandeliers in the parlor and other main downstairs rooms are all electric reproductions. They all have fake gas valves. I doubt many people today know about early gas light systems, or why these reproduction lights have those little fake valves in the lamp stems.


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## lowercasebill (Jul 19, 2020)

As an aside go to YOU tube and japanology plus charcoal. Very interesting. Seems the Japanese during wwii had charcoal burners on busses that generated CO to power the bus.


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## Bert2368 (Jul 19, 2020)

Japanese, Germans along with nearly every axis and axis occupied country in Europe/Asia did the wood pyrolysis gas generator hack to keep their vehicles moving after the war ended civilian access to petroleum based fuels. The technique is still being tinkered with by people here in USA.

Those wood gas generators don't make much CO. The destructive distillation of wood mostly releases a mixture of methane and volatiles dominated by methanol, along with some cyclic hydrocarbons such as toluene, benzene, xylene. (My very first hands on chemistry lab class in 7th grade was destructive distillation of wood and analysis of the products).

In the case of Japan, there was a wartime program to have school aged children dig up pine stumps and roots for distillation aimed at producing a fuel suitable for running aircraft engines! This was a large enough effort that 30 years after the war, the Japanese fireworks industry was still using a byproduct of it, a hard, tarry pitch which boiled out of the pine roots and was condensed out in the purification process. This pine root pitch was found to be an excellent low temperature fuel for colored fireworks stars- We have been hard pressed to find anything so good AND so cheap as pine root pitch since they finally ran out of that wartime byproduct back in the 1970s.

The pine root sourced liquid fuel ran aircraft engines for only a few hours before the residues it left in the engines gummed them up and destroyed them- Another "last ditch" defense project. 

Can you tell that chemistry, history of technology and fireworks are mania level hobbies of mine yet?


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