# One-stop thinning stone?



## timebard (Apr 24, 2020)

If you had to recommend one coarse to medium-coarse stone as a do-it-all stone for routine to moderate thinning jobs, what would it be? 

I'm a mediocre (but improving!) sharpener and I'm starting to get in my head that I have a few knives that could stand to go on a diet behind the edge. My little collection includes AUS-8, ginsan, and white and blue #2 san mai, as well as beater stainless knives that I'll probably practice on; from what I've read it seems that most stones excel at particular types of steel and struggle with others so I'm aware that a one stone option may be a bit of compromise.

I currently have a 1k/6k Gesshin combo stone (thanks @CiderBear !) which I like a lot and a super coarse Norton stone fixer (something like 120-160 grit). Based on reading a whole bunch of threads/reviews here, I'm thinking that a stone in the 300-400 range would be about where I want--coarse enough to move metal reasonably fast but fine enough that I could go straight to the 1k to remove scratches. It sounds like Shapton glass 320, Shapton Pro 320, or Cerax 320 are all reasonable options; the SG500 also seems very popular as an all around medium-coarse stone. 

I don't have strong preferences on soaker vs splash and go or other tradeoffs, having only tried a few stones. No firm budget, but <=$50 would be nice. Any clear winner of these options or something I'm missing?

(Also, I'm aware that belt sanders seem to be the preferred solution for thinning projects, but the better half is not gonna let me drag one of those into our apartment!) 

Thanks in advance.


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## Nemo (Apr 24, 2020)

One stop? You could try the Kasfly sandpaper holder.

Upsides- Stays flat. Choose your grit.

Downsides- need to replace sandpaper intermittently. Feedback sucks.

If you want a versatile stone, I quite like the Chosera 400. Good for sharpening Western stainless too. Not so good for heavy duty thinning, though.


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## M1k3 (Apr 24, 2020)

Shapton Glass 500, Chosera 400 or Gesshin 800 diamond?


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## Benuser (Apr 24, 2020)

Shapton Glass 320. Very effective, and leaving a most regular scratch pattern, allowing to go straight to a 1k from there. I do love the Naniwa Pro 400 dearly, but not for thinning. Requires heavy pressure for removing only a bit of steel.


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## Ruso (Apr 24, 2020)

Benuser said:


> Shapton Glass 320. Very effective, and leaving a most regular scratch pattern, allowing to go straight to a 1k from there. I do love the Naniwa Pro 400 dearly, but not for thinning. Requires heavy pressure for removing only a bit of steel.


Can you talk more about chosera 400?


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## Benuser (Apr 24, 2020)

Ruso said:


> Can you talk more about chosera 400?


Have worn out a Chosera and replaced it by the new Naniwa Pro. 
Often my first stone in a progression, especially with AS, where when used lightly at the very edge it contributes to edge stability. With light edge leading strokes it allows an almost complete deburring. Remarkable tactile feedback for a relatively coarse stone. Not the same as with the 800 though. Can benefit of raising some slurry. 
Very little work afterwards. You may easily jump to the Chosera 2k.
One and only stone with Krupp's 4116. I than start with some pressure. 
Naniwa grit system doesn't exactly follow the JIS standard. The 400 corresponds to some JIS600. End result seems even finer. 
The Naniwa Pro is even denser than the old Chosera. The thinner format and absence of a base allow a faster and more even drying — I'm quite aware this point of view isn't generally shared.


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## Ruso (Apr 24, 2020)

Thank you Benuser. I am aware of chosera/pro grit being a tad finer than the standard JIS thats why I am intested in this 400 (600) grit one.
Looks like it can be a good fit for me.


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## inferno (Apr 24, 2020)

timebard said:


> If you had to recommend one coarse to medium-coarse stone as a do-it-all stone for routine to moderate thinning jobs, what would it be?
> 
> I'm a mediocre (but improving!) sharpener and I'm starting to get in my head that I have a few knives that could stand to go on a diet behind the edge. My little collection includes AUS-8, ginsan, and white and blue #2 san mai, as well as beater stainless knives that I'll probably practice on; from what I've read it seems that most stones excel at particular types of steel and struggle with others so I'm aware that a one stone option may be a bit of compromise.
> 
> ...



the best overall stone for material removal i have tried is the glass stone 220. its extremely fast and aggressive. and stays quite flat too. its slow wearing id say.

also the dmt diaflat (200 dollars) plates are fast but they plow very deep scratches in the steel. and you need a 220 stone to remove them. 

with coarse stones the type of steel dont matter as much, the abrasive resistant carbides is too small and the stone grains are so big so it just scoops it all out en masse, but the harder the steel it longer it takes. make no mistake. alloying content dont seem to matter as much as it does with higher grit stones.

so a good stone for carbons is a good stone for any steel imo in the low grit range. 

i also have the 220 shapton pro and its faster wearing. and slurries a lot more. this could be a pro or a con. its twice as thick. it will last about as long as the 7mm glass. but the glass is less of a chore to use.

i also tried a black 100 grit SiC stone. and it sounded and felt like i was tearing a hole into hell with it. but after 30 seconds or so it stopped removing metal. it just sounded like it was. so avoid these imo. SiC is very brittle and the grain in the stone rounds over in no time. and then it stops to cut. 

------------------

glass 500 is nothing like a 220 or 120. the glass 500 is fast coarse stone, like a turbo 1000. but the 220 120 and such is when you need to remove lots of metal. then its the only choice. 

i have a 500. and i found it too slow for what i wanted to do. so i got 2 different 220ies. pro/glass. and even these seem to slow to be honest. so i got a 100 SiC and it was crap. DMTs out of the question... life is hard.


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## inferno (Apr 24, 2020)

btw a 4-600 or so stone can be followed up in literally seconds witha 3k stone. i gave my cousin a 500 and a 3k glass. we sharpened almost all his knives (never ever been sharpened) in a few h with me teaching him how to do it. 500 to 3k is pretty seamless imo. no need for a 1k or 2k in between. a 4k would probably have worked too. almost the same. maybe 30 seconds more.

id say any good C stone folloew up by a 3-4-5k stone will be more seemless than one might think. ok you spend like 1 minute more on the 5k than the 3k to get sharp. or 1 min more with the 3k than a 1k intermediate. 

its a piss in the ocean.


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## Renzwerkz (Mar 10, 2021)

I have both Shapton Pro 320 and Naniwa Pro 400..

For a quick thinning job, i definitely go for Shapton Pro 320 all day, yes it wears out faster than Naniwa, but it really is get the job done..
And i think i need Shapton Glass in near future, between 150 or 220, for even faster job that less wears out..

Naniwa Pro 400 sumhow, i dont feel any aggresivity at all in terms of "grinding feel" on my hand..


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## GorillaGrunt (Mar 10, 2021)

Pink brick 220. Chosera 400 is a great coarse stone for edges, both meh stainless and good carbon, but poor for thinning


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## Alder26 (Mar 10, 2021)

Agreed on cholera 400 for very quick edge setting but it's not going to accomplish heavy lifting. Shapton Pro or glass 220 or 320 are good choices, the 120 is a monster but you need special equipment to keep it cutting. Gesshin 220 will do a good job on almost any steel but dishes quicker than the shaptons.


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## M1k3 (Mar 10, 2021)

Alder26 said:


> Agreed on cholera...


 Autocorrect strikes again! Or did it?


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## DavidPF (Mar 10, 2021)

M1k3 said:


> Autocorrect strikes again! Or did it?


Cholera might make your knife very skinny very quickly, but unfortunately would have the same effect on you...


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## Alder26 (Mar 11, 2021)

DavidPF said:


> Cholera might make your knife very skinny very quickly, but unfortunately would have the same effect on you...


if I were thinning Honyaki cholera might be less painful though


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## DavidPF (Mar 11, 2021)

Honyaki thinning recipe "The Forty Plan" (no cholera required):

- pack of 40-grit sandpaper
- 40 oz bottle containing 40% alcohol
- pack of 40 Band-aids


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## M1k3 (Mar 11, 2021)

DavidPF said:


> Honyaki thinning recipe "The Forty Plan" (no cholera required):
> 
> - pack of 40-grit sandpaper
> - 40 oz bottle containing 40% alcohol
> - pack of 40 Band-aids


Bad recipe. Missing honyaki.


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## DavidPF (Mar 11, 2021)

M1k3 said:


> Bad recipe. Missing honyaki.


Recipe is for thinning; recipe for honyaki please see Chapter 3.


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## Runner_up (Mar 11, 2021)

I'm a big believer in the shapton glass 220/320.

To me the shapton pro line around those grits just dish too quickly - same goes for the Gesshin 220. Good stones but need to be flattened really often.


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## Bart.s (Mar 13, 2021)

Cerax 320, if you dont mind a soak and a soft and muddy stone. It dishes pretty quickly but is very easy to flatten. Cuts fast. Comes in a regular size and double thick and is quite cheap. And for a medium-coarse stone, feedback is pretty decent.


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