# Home cook vs professional



## Geo87 (Oct 14, 2013)

I've been thinking alot lately how I'm so thankfull I'm a chef or cook (depending on your country) that's obsessed with knives and not a home cook obsessed with knives . 

1. I can justify (kind of) my purchases as they are tools of my trade
2. I get to use my knives for hours and hours everyday 
3. I have an endless arsenal of food to turn into shreds with these "tools" 
4. I can infect others at work and then get to see and play with more "tools"
5.I can test my edge durability by sliced 20kg of onions... 

What the heck do you do as a home cook & knife enthusiast ? 
It must be frustrating... Like do any home cooks put on dinners for friends just as an excuse to use their knives more???  
I feel for you, if I couldn't work in kitchens I think I'd go mad!


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## Vangelis (Oct 14, 2013)

I am a home cook and I can't say I am frustrated with this situation, after all working into a proffesional kitchen is supposed to be one of the most stressfull jobs. While in my case cooking and taking care of the knives is a destress activity  

Personally I love cooking and I am the one preparing the dinner at 90% of the time and it is almost every day something different. I dont need an excuse (see big dinner) to use my knives. 

1. I also can justify my purchases as these are tools for my passion/hobby (ok maybe not ALL  - I will never need a 21cm deba for example)
2. I also get to use my knives for a while, almost, every day
3. I am creative enough when I am cooking so I can use more than 2 knives (not of the same type) per dinner - Maybe I don't use 2-3 gyuto's per day but sometimes I may use 2 just for the fun of it.
4. I can infect my friends and familly, by showing them how easier and fun it is to use good quality knives and then I can take to the next level (sharpenning, modifications etc ....)
5. I can't test my edge durability within a day but at least I dont feel like doing a "fordism" type of work by slicing and dicing 20kg of onions... 

V


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## chefcomesback (Oct 14, 2013)

I am pro , I spend 10+hours a day in my kitchen and don't always cut,slice or dice things . Whenever I need to break into a new knife I usually use it on my day off when I cook for myself and family. Then I can compare cutting performances , food release etc. And when I mean I cook home I am talking about cooking and prepping for 5-6 hours for fun. When I run my kitchen on daily basis one of the last things I will concentrate on will be the profile or the steel of my knives. Yes, because of my profession I can justify having 5-6 gyutos and total XX knives , but most of my purchases were influenced by the members who are home users who took their time to analyze a knife in depth and bother to write review about it. As a pro I may have a faster knife skills than home cooks or I may judge the reactivity or the edge retention of a knife in a professional kitchen .
Also I do use the slicer attachment of Robocoupe if i need to slice 20kg onions


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## Geo87 (Oct 14, 2013)

Would just like to add. after reading over my previous post it may seem I am attacking home cooks. 
This is not the case, sadly it's hard to portray humor or sarcasm through text  
As I have 2 children under 3 cooking at home is rather limited to something you can whip up quickly , hence if I weren't a professional I wouldn't be able to really enjoy this hobby


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## hobbitling (Oct 14, 2013)

It's been said: Do what you love as a career, and you'll never have to "work" a day in your life
It's also been said: Be careful about turning hobbies into careers, or you may ruin the fun.

I can see both sides of the argument. I'm an ecologist, so I spend a lot of time outdoors hiking as part of my job during certain parts of the year. It sure beats working in an office, but after a week of hauling gear in and out of the same patch of woods, I don't generally feel like hiking for fun on the weekend. But after a week or two indoors I'm itching to get outdoors again. I imagine it's the same for professional chefs. It's a fun job, but it's still a job.

By the way, I originally got into knives because I did a lot of animal dissections at work. Basically scientific butchering/taxidermy/skinning. So my two obsessions are connected, in a way.


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## Mucho Bocho (Oct 14, 2013)

Geo, welcome and thanks for an interesting thread. I didn't take offense to your comments. I agree with what you say about needing to be able to spend hours and hours pounding your knives if looking to test edge durrability. Thats why marko test his knives this way. I've got five gyutos in several flavors of steel. I liked Vangelis comments that a lot of professional-home cooks like myself quite often get to cook for the fun of it. 

True I have a very serious interest in kitchen knives and have thousands of dollars in sharpening equipment. But i use these bad boys or they get sold. Excelt the 210 Deba as Van also noted. Also, home cooks can keep their knives sharper longer and if your like me, insist that they are scary sharp at all times. To the extent that they almost always get a light unloaded leather strop before and after use.


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## Chuckles (Oct 14, 2013)

I think many of the home cooks here don't need to justify their purchases because they can actually afford them. And have enough time to cook what they actually want to eat because they work far fewer hours. Doesn't seem too bad to me.


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## skiajl6297 (Oct 14, 2013)

Home cook here - and I have limited myself to only having two gyuto's at any one time. If I want a new one, one of the old ones has got to go. It's not the easiest thing in the world to stick to, but a method to keep this from becoming a hoarding exercise rather than an extension of why I like knives in the first place - using them to cook. Same is true for a single slicer, single parer, and vintage/restore project knife. I may add one more specialty to the mix (honesuki) for my weekend stockmaking/poultry work when I do it, but that is purely an accessory knife without an actual need. If I buy a new knife (of any type), I would spend some time going head to head between it and whatever else I already have, and then decide whether to keep the new one, or BST it. I like to think of it as knife fantasy football.

With the 2 gyuto limit, at present I am trying to keep things different - have one laser 240 stainless, and one more substantial 270 carbon. Just yesterday I used 3 knives to prep/cook dinner. (Beefier carbon knife for thick carrots for glazed carrots side dish, lazer for fine shallot/garlic work for garlic cream sauce for roasted chicken, and slicer for roasted chicken). It was plenty satisfying, even though not NECESSARY to use 3 knives. I find ways to keep everything in use.

I am TRYING to convince myself that my wife needs a similar setup as me with gyutos so my limit of 2 can be expanded to four. But she is pretty fond of smaller blades in stainless, and I am trending towards 270's in carbon. :O


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## boomchakabowwow (Oct 14, 2013)

i admire pro-chefs..but not for their cutlery. i may as well get a nipple hard-on for their spatula collection.

i cook at home. slicing and dicing. for me it is about watching my family scarf my food..i get very little excitement from seeing the tiny perfectly diced onions in the sauce. this "rush" for a chef must be intoxicating. seeing all the happy patrons.

i love tools. i am a tool junkie. my favorite tools take big pieces of things and turns them into smaller pieces of things. axes, knives, chainsaws...etc.

my car tools?..lots of love as well. i dont get excited about hearing the clean clicking of a Snap-On ratchet..meh!!..but the smooth idle of a perfectly tuned Porsche flat six? yup..i get movement. but i would hate to be a pro mechanic. 

sucks none (my tools) of them are tax deductable..like i suppose it is for a pro chef.

"interesting" thread.


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## cookinstuff (Oct 14, 2013)

I am a pro chef, and I enjoy cooking at home. It's a funny thing, I just feel honoured to be involved in a business that so many people find desirable. In my opinion everyone should know how to cook well, it's embarassing to hear people talk about how they just grab takeout, or can't cook for their kids, it's shameful. I also feel special when my brother asks me for advice in cooking and so on, he does data entry for a living, and I can't say I've asked him for too much advice in that field, not that there is anything wrong with it, but it just doesn't have the romanticism that cooking does. 

Cooking will always attract people from all walks of life, because everyone HAS to do it at some point, for some people it's simply functional about filling yourself up, and for some people it's about providing enjoyment for others. I love this forum, and the people on it, because we are clearly like minded people who just can't sit by and fill people up on horribly tasting processed foods (only sometimes )

So, I would have to say the majority of home cooks on this forum have my utmost respect for having a drive in something that isn't even their bread and butter, I certainly don't take hours out of my day to get great at anything other than cooking. In professional kitchens allot of the time, you are not even sure what your cooks are looking for in the business, do they care? Do they want to open a great restaurant? or are they a high school drop out? They could be any number of things, but it certainly doesn't mean they care about food or knives, or anything involved. 

For me, the home cook vs professional cook argument is an interesting one. You have a great number of pro cooks that are int his for life, and read/cook and try and improve. You have a great number that come in hung over, don't show up on time, are bad at their jobs and generally don't learn well. It's like any job I guess, you have good ones and bad ones. But I would imagine the people on this forum aren't in this category of pro. 

But, if you are a home cook who enjoys cooking, you probably have a certain level of contempt for the utility cook who uses house knives and really doesn't focus on their craft, I'm not sure, but let me tell you, those types of cooks don't bug you nearly as much as they do the professional cooks. We are lumped in with these guys all the time. At the same time, I have worked with a ton of people that have only used house knives for their whole lives, and would cook for 300 every day no problem, so it's hard to have preconceptions about tools and knives and cooks, it's all about attitude.

At the same time, I would rather cook a big meal for my friends every day and watch them enjoy it, than paying customers I don't know (I still love doing this, but lets face it) That's why meals like today's (Canadian) thanksgiving are so special, we just slung out Turkey all weekend for people, come Sunday night I wasn't exactly enthusiastic after laying turkey out onto plates, and into take outs all weekend, but this morning the turkey enthusiasm is back in full effect, because it's family time! Sorry for the rant, just thought I'd weigh in on the home vs pro debate, as it's very close to the heart. (oh and I still can't justify my knife purchases just because they are tools, that's crazy talk, oh but I have a 24 cm deba, it's one of my most used knives, so maybe I can justify some...)


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## cookinstuff (Oct 14, 2013)

awww boomchakabowwow you would like my full set of nogent peltex spatulas from france :doublethumbsup:


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## slowtyper (Oct 14, 2013)

Geo87 said:


> I've been thinking alot lately how I'm so thankfull I'm a chef or cook (depending on your country) that's obsessed with knives and not a home cook obsessed with knives .
> 
> 1. I can justify (kind of) my purchases as they are tools of my trade
> 2. I get to use my knives for hours and hours everyday
> ...



Yeah, thats all true. But the home cook earns more money so they can buy knives for fun! Oh, but you didn't say what job the home cook has? Answer: it doesn't matter.


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## RRLOVER (Oct 14, 2013)

Geo87 said:


> I've been thinking alot lately how I'm so thankfull I'm a chef or cook (depending on your country) that's obsessed with knives and not a home cook obsessed with knives .
> 
> 1. I can justify (kind of) my purchases as they are tools of my trade
> 2. I get to use my knives for hours and hours everyday
> ...




As a "Home cook and Knife enthusiast".....I grind out my own knives:razz:


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## brianh (Oct 14, 2013)

Home cook here who has a ton of respect for you pros. The hours you guys work would kill me. I don't have too many friends or family who appreciate quality food, but I enjoy cooking for my wife who always appreciates what I prepare. I have weekends to cook, weekdays for leftovers and eating out at the many great restaurants and unique eateries outside of NYC. I get to cook often yet still spend time with my wife and son.


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## bear1889 (Oct 14, 2013)

I'm a home cook and I have a knife hanging on my wall that if Julia Child walked in to cook something she would say "I'll use this one here dear"

I love my knives no matter what I have used them all.

I envy the pros because you are artists of food, you create, you have style, you have panache, and usually have the good herb.


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## Geo87 (Oct 14, 2013)

Yes the hours any the money are indeed terrible for most  
So it seems home cooks win on most fronts. I'm very jealous of home cooks that have time to cook for your family's! 
My OP was more about a light hearted look at the truly knife obsessed individual. As a bottom line, you can't use yours as much at home... Without getting funny looks or concern from family  

I truly wish I could be home more, and had the time to cook for family and friends.
But funnily enough, despite everything , and all the b.s we put up with. I wouldn't change a thing! I love what I do and I don't care about money  ok well that's a lie... But it helps if I tell my self this to justify my choice of career.
The reason I say I'd go crazy if I didn't work in kitchens? It's too late for me I'm a cook, through and through, if I changed industry's now it would be like trying to dress up a pirate and call him a business man 
Arrrrrr


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## mc2442 (Oct 14, 2013)

Home cook here that does not even cook enough to justify a lot of the purchases. You could probably put me know in the loves high performance tools camp, although I always have the intention to cook more.

I also would like to put in a vote that the use of my knives and the sharpening of them are definitely stress relieving activities.

And anyone else find hobbitling's avatar creepy?


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## Mingooch (Oct 14, 2013)

Geo87 said:


> I've been thinking alot lately how I'm so thankfull I'm a chef or cook (depending on your country) that's obsessed with knives and not a home cook obsessed with knives .
> 
> 1. I can justify (kind of) my purchases as they are tools of my trade
> 2. I get to use my knives for hours and hours everyday
> ...



As a home cook and enthusiast I can tell you it is great. 
1. I make enough where I dont need to justify my purchases
2. I probably dont get to use my knives as much daily as a pro would, but I also dont have to if I dont want to either. Some days we all like a break, even from things that we love and enjoy.
3. I can cook what I want, for whom I want, when I want. For example this Sunday I decided to cook with beer. Made a beer fondue dip, beer marinated fajitas, and asian chicken with a beer glaze. All because I could and wanted to. No menu limits, no one telling what the theme is, or any other limitations. I also host large parties and cook all the food. Usually about 50 adults and 15-20 kids. And love making it all myself.
4. I too have shared the gift of knives. I have given many people who like to cook their first jknife and several have now started buying on their own.
5. Edge retention isnt a concern for me because I never have to cut 20kg of onions in a day.


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## mc2442 (Oct 14, 2013)

mmmmm.....beer cooking!


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## Chuckles (Oct 14, 2013)

> 50 adults and 15-20 kids. And love making it all myself.



You like cooking more than I do for sure.


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## Keith Sinclair (Oct 15, 2013)

Hotel kitchens were my domain for 30 yrs.Plus had an Ice Carving business on the side.Using knives forced me to get good gear.Union hotels no more help than you need,so must work fast,knife is your main tool so sharp edge is important.It can be stressful with limited help & a bunch of banquet sheets hanging.It doesn't help to get excited,emotional.I learned out of survival that being calm & organized works best & ask for help if you need it.

My love of knives came out of my job & sharpening skills.Now I'm retired so hang out on my favorite forum.I like to cook for my friends,still cook most nights.I have no problem with home cooks buying nice knives & sharpening equipment.Some of these home dudes are excellent sharpeners much better than vast majority of pro cooks.

I'm a tool junkie too like things that need to be sharpened,Axes,Machete's,Wood chisels,Folders,kitchen knives,garden tools.My feeling is the more sharpeners on stones out there the better no matter if home or Pro.


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## Geo87 (Oct 15, 2013)

Lol, it speaks very poorly for the industry but I agree, most chefs/cooks knife knowledge & sharpening skills are absolutely terrible! If your a regular on these forums I'd say your a better sharpener than 90 % of professionals I've met ....


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## echerub (Oct 15, 2013)

Home cook here. I definitely don't get to use my knives as much as I'd like... nor can I get my wife to use as many of my knives as I'd like 

It's true that when you combine a strong interest in knives and getting them in top shape with the amount of time a home cook is likely to spend in the kitchen that you can get a bit of... knife-use blue-balls, as it were. It's a busy time at the office right now, so I tend to get home a little late, and practically the third thing I ask my wife each weekday evening is, "Is there anything I can help with in the kitchen?"

What I'm really asking is, "Is there any reason at all for me to use one of my knives?" Seriously, on some days, I'm happy when she "throws me a bone" and asks me to dice up some garlic or an onion.

However, at other times, usually on weekends, it's great to let loose and just make what I want to make and use what I want to use.

What also frustrates me about lack of time in the kitchen - including time with knife and board - is the inability to keep refining my skills because the time gap in between sessions means I'm just keeping my skills where they were or even playing catchup because my technique or skill somewhere is a little rusty. Slow progress towards the kind of excellence in the kitchen I aspire to, not just in terms of how the food turns out but also how smoothly everything went in the kitchen to make and plate it.


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## boomchakabowwow (Oct 15, 2013)

a pro buys all their own knives?

i know my stepdad got each of his chefs their knives..he said that way they dont steal his.

it is just knives? the rest of the tools the restaurant owns, right? 

please show us home guys a peek of the "inner circle" please! dont high end knives get stolen? i would use a forschener knife in a public kitchen..hahaha.


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## Mucho Bocho (Oct 15, 2013)

echerub said:


> knife-use blue-balls, as it were.



This is something I never would have though knifes could cause. Good one Len!


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## Keith Sinclair (Oct 15, 2013)

I've used Many fine blades in kitchens never lost any of them with the exception of a Masamoto petty.Pepper grinders,Tongs,spatulas, measuring cups etc. I have lost & recovered some when I hunt them down.


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## Lucretia (Oct 15, 2013)

Geo87 said:


> 1. I can justify (kind of) my purchases as they are tools of my trade



Justify? What is this justify? When you're a home cook your loved ones fall on their knees and offer you new knives as a small token of their gratitude and adoration.





Geo87 said:


> 4. I can infect others at work and then get to see and play with more "tools"



I don't have to share.


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## Vangelis (Oct 15, 2013)

Lucretia said:


> Justify? What is this justify? When you're a home cook your loved ones fall on their knees and offer you new knives as a small token of their gratitude and adoration.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You don't have "enough" knives for sharing or colleagues


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## bahamaroot (Oct 15, 2013)

Being a home cook I don't get to use my knives as much as I would like but I have more time than the pros to lay them out and masturbate while looking at them.:saythat:


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## Mrmnms (Oct 15, 2013)

bahamaroot said:


> Being a home cook I don't get to use my knives as much as I would like but I have more time than the pros to lay them out and masturbate while looking at them.:saythat:



Excellent point. Almost passed beer through my nose.


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## eshua (Oct 15, 2013)

Don't care to comment on commitment or focus. 

Only can say... on a cook's salary...I couldn't do 10% of what I do at work at home.


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## Geo87 (Oct 15, 2013)

boomchakabowwow said:


> a pro buys all their own knives?
> 
> i know my stepdad got each of his chefs their knives..he said that way they dont steal his.
> 
> ...



It depends what country your in. Her in Australia it's mandatory as an apprentice chef to purchase certain tools before you go to trade school ( mainly knives , utensils etc) 
Not one chef (please note all qualified professionals are called chefs here) I have ever met has not had there own knives. 
There are almost no "house knives " here although sometimes a few. 
I understand that it's different in the u.s , a lot of line cooks use house knives, and most places especially hotels supply house knives. Any decent cook will have his own knives... House knives are terrible abused lifeless things. 
Knives and gear gets stolen all the time if you let it happen. Kitchens can be ruthless. So you have to be ruthless. Luckily where I am now I have a locker with padlock for all my gear, my knives in a case which I also lock, everyday.
. I have almost $2000 worth of gear at work so I don't take any chances. Kit at work ranges from knives, stones ,strop, steel, thermometers , garnish tools, measuring tools, tweezers, fish descaler... Etc etc. the list goes on. 
I will post a pic of some of it when I figure out how . 

Echerub: knive blue balls... That is brilliant 

Bahamaroot: that is exactly the kind of post I was looking for. Good to see some humor! I could barely contain myself

Lucretia: that would be Awsome , perhaps I'm doing something wrong all I get for tokens if adoration is... Physical affection. Would much prefer knives


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## Keith Sinclair (Oct 16, 2013)

Not in Hawaii I worked at Nick's Fishmarket before going to Sheraton Waikiki first big Hotel job.In all the places I never saw house knives,everyone had their own.Even beginning culinary students must buy knives.


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## panda (Oct 16, 2013)

only got into knives as i wanted to learn if better tools would make my work easier. if it wasn't for pro use, i'd be just fine at home with a ceramic knife and a pull through sharpener to be honest.


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## apicius9 (Oct 16, 2013)

As the saying goes: "Professionals have everything they need, hobbyists have everything." I am a hobbyist and while there are clearly others here who are even crazier than I am, I have more knives than any reasonable single person needs. At the same time, I cook much less frequently than I used to years ago. Part of it is convenience (out here it's often cheaper to go to a small Asian hole-in-the-wall place than buying ingredients for cooking), part of it is a smaller and less appreciative circle of friends, and part of it is just plain laziness. So, not only do I have knives that hardly ever get used at all, I even have problems to keep some of them from just rusting in the humid climate out here. i know there are 6 or 8 in boxes somewhere that I haven't take out in a while. I'm not proud.... For me the joy is in having choices, and knowing that if I ever get to prepare fugu (fat chance) I have a knife for it. Sometimes I think it would make much more sense to have 8 or 10 really good knives than 40 midlevel ones, at least they would get used more regularly, but I have separation anxiety and a hard time letting them go. What if I do want to make fugu next week? You would not want me to cut it with a yanagi, right?

Anyway, I often notice that playing more in the kitchen is an indicator that I am in a good mood. Maybe I should play in the kitchen more to improve my mood. I was trying to get a few people to come together and cook occasionally, but this is so difficult in the US: In a group of 6 you will find 5 with different or opposite food allergies, all kinds of 'intolerances', 1-2 vegans, people who don't eat red meat/chicken/fish etc. Drives me nuts.

But I could never imagine doing this as a pro, you people are all crazy  I am not shying away from hard work, but I often wonder how the pros handle the stress, pressure, low pay for many, crazy work times etc. 

Not even sure I addressed the question, but that's what was going through my foggy brain. 

Stefan


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## Vangelis (Oct 16, 2013)

bahamaroot said:


> Being a home cook I don't get to use my knives as much as I would like but I have more time than the pros to lay them out and masturbate while looking at them.:saythat:



The definition of knife-porn !!!


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## Geo87 (Oct 16, 2013)

apicius9 said:


> In a group of 6 you will find 5 with different or opposite food allergies, all kinds of 'intolerances', 1-2 vegans, people who don't eat red meat/chicken/fish etc. Drives me nuts.
> 
> But I could never imagine doing this as a pro, you people are all crazy  I am not shying away from hard work, but I often wonder how the pros handle the stress, pressure, low pay for many, crazy work times etc.



I don't mind dietary requirements. Most people are very thankfull that you take the time to do something special, the worst type is a person who has an "allergy" say... Wheat intolerance, at a function ... A wedding . you make them something nice 
Something special , and they eat the lemon curd tart instead... So many allergys disappear at the sight of good sweets. 
As for the hours / stress etc. like any job you get used to it. Most of us enjoy the fast pased action packed rush of a busy service . I couldn't imagine sitting down all day staring at a computer ...


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## Keith Sinclair (Oct 16, 2013)

I hear you Geo,it is true many thrive on the fast pace action I know I did.Some people come in & don't last at all it's just not for them.It is like Teachers go to collage get their teaching degree,get thrown in public middle school with kids with attitude certain % wash out the first year.Other's adapt & become good teachers.


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