# What defines a beginner finishing stone? Rika 5k, Arashiyama 6k, Gesshin 4k & 6k?



## DitmasPork (Jul 23, 2014)

I have a Bester 1200 and want to get a good finishing stone, looking at the Suehiro Rika 5k, Arashiyama 6k, Gesshin 4k, Gesshin 6k.

I've often read that the Suehiro Rika 5k is a good 'beginner's stone.' My question is, what defines a beginner stone? Is it ease of use, or just cost related?

My sharpening skills are decent for a beginner, can hold a steady anglebut I'm still learning. Any advice would be appreciatedespecially on the stones mentioned. My knives are mostly carbon.


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## Asteger (Jul 23, 2014)

Actually, of those I've only ever used the Arashiyama but I'm sure they're all great options in the sense that they're easy and pleasant to sharpen on. 

There might be other factors to consider, however, which are related to care. For example, are they soakers or not, does one dish more than others, do any have a rep for cracking. In my case I think long ago I made a mistake and soaked my Arashiyama and it developed cracks, though just hairline, and was probably saved due to it being mounted on a stand. I didn't know any better at the time.


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## DitmasPork (Jul 23, 2014)

Asteger said:


> Actually, of those I've only ever used the Arashiyama but I'm sure they're all great options in the sense that they're easy and pleasant to sharpen on.
> 
> There might be other factors to consider, however, which are related to care. For example, are they soakers or not, does one dish more than others, do any have a rep for cracking. In my case I think long ago I made a mistake and soaked my Arashiyama and it developed cracks, though just hairline, and was probably saved due to it being mounted on a stand. I didn't know any better at the time.



Good point about stone care. I've been thinking that the splash and go stones would be a good option.


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## Norton (Jul 23, 2014)

I think the main thing a beginner might want in a finisher would be something a little on the softer side. Super hard stones are not very forgiving, and can result in "faceted" edges if not used properly. Of the ones you mentioned, I like the Rika---after it soaks for an hour or so.


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## XooMG (Jul 24, 2014)

The more I play with stones, the more I'm convinced the word "beginner" is mostly used to identify good practical purchases while trying to justify a larger collection. After the "beginner" stone is acquired, one can either stay where they are (which generally is not a disadvantage in the sharpening game), or can more easily move in a direction of preference (softer/harder, soaker/splasher, size, feel, whatever).


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## rami_m (Jul 24, 2014)

XooMG said:


> The more I play with stones, the more I'm convinced the word "beginner" is mostly used to identify good practical purchases while trying to justify a larger collection. After the "beginner" stone is acquired, one can either stay where they are (which generally is not a disadvantage in the sharpening game), or can more easily move in a direction of preference (softer/harder, soaker/splasher, size, feel, whatever).



+ 1. you get the beginner set. Then you want bits and pieces to polish and get the edges perfect. Then you wonder what the heck is special about natural stones. Then it's too late.


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## mistascoopa (Jul 24, 2014)

DitmasPork said:


> I have a Bester 1200 and want to get a good finishing stone, looking at the Suehiro Rika 5k, Arashiyama 6k, Gesshin 4k, Gesshin 6k.
> 
> I've often read that the Suehiro Rika 5k is a good 'beginner's stone.' My question is, what defines a beginner stone? Is it ease of use, or just cost related?
> 
> My sharpening skills are decent for a beginner, can hold a steady anglebut I'm still learning. Any advice would be appreciatedespecially on the stones mentioned. My knives are mostly carbon.



They are cheaper than average and easier in it's usage IMO, and probably cheaper to produce as well. I've never thought of the Rika as a beginner's stone though. Cuts many steels fast enough and the feedback is very much to my liking. Also, higher cost stones do not always equal better stones overall. Rika is an exceptional buy for the money. Definitely consider one if you haven't decided yet.


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## DitmasPork (Jul 24, 2014)

mistascoopa said:


> They are cheaper than average and easier in it's usage IMO, and probably cheaper to produce as well. I've never thought of the Rika as a beginner's stone though. Cuts many steels fast enough and the feedback is very much to my liking. Also, higher cost stones do not always equal better stones overall. Rika is an exceptional buy for the money. Definitely consider one if you haven't decided yet.



What's creating some major indecision is reading too many great stone reviewsand thinking that if I will someday upgrade the stones, why not just buy the best stones I can? I think I'm leaning towards the Rika, mainly because of the consistent reviews and lower price point. Had thought that the convenience of a Gesh splash n go would be good, but the Rika seems a wiser choice at this stage of my sharpening skills.


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## JDA_NC (Jul 24, 2014)

DitmasPork said:


> What's creating some major indecision is reading too many great stone reviewsand thinking that if I will someday upgrade the stones, why not just buy the best stones I can? I think I'm leaning towards the Rika, mainly because of the consistent reviews and lower price point. Had thought that the convenience of a Gesh splash n go would be good, but the Rika seems a wiser choice at this stage of my sharpening skills.



I think what makes a stone 'best' is a very subjective thing. The Rika is a good starting point to figuring out what you like - it's inexpensive, it feels great, cuts fast, & leaves a really nice, toothy edge. If you don't mind soaking (and with your Bester you can leave them both in a bucket 24/7), it's what I'd recommend.

There are a lot of great options in the 3-6k range. Once you get familiar with a Rika you could then decide if you want a slightly coarser edge, or a more refined one, if you want to go Splash & Go or stick with soakers, if you want something soft & muddy like the Rika or something harder.


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## Asteger (Jul 24, 2014)

DitmasPork said:


> What's creating some major indecision is reading too many great stone reviewsand thinking that if I will someday upgrade the stones, why not just buy the best stones I can? I think I'm leaning towards the Rika



Sure, at $50 or less ($30 or less in Japan without shipping) I think there's no risk.


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## IndoorOutdoorCook (Jul 25, 2014)

rami_m said:


> + 1. you get the beginner set. Then you want bits and pieces to polish and get the edges perfect. Then you wonder what the heck is special about natural stones. Then it's too late.



It's like you are describing my life right now. I'm completely satisfied with my current sharpening. I dont need more stones at all. Yet, I'm still considering some j nats...


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## CutFingers (Jul 25, 2014)

I believe you get what you pay for with natural stones. Synthetic stones it honestly does not matter so much as far as branding as long as the particles are well held together. The reality is that synthetic stones are a cost effective way to insure uniform particle size. 

Rika, Arashiyama, Gesshin are all more than likely manufactured using very similar methods of manufacture.What really matters is how you use the stones, keeping them flat, using good technique to keep the stones uniform. Subjectively people prefer how various synthetics brands feel when sharpening but that is not relevant because ultimately what matters is how the edge cuts.


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## JDA_NC (Jul 25, 2014)

CutFingers said:


> I believe you get what you pay for with natural stones. Synthetic stones it honestly does not matter so much as far as branding as long as the particles are well held together. The reality is that synthetic stones are a cost effective way to insure uniform particle size.
> 
> Rika, Arashiyama, Gesshin are all more than likely manufactured using very similar methods of manufacture.What really matters is how you use the stones, keeping them flat, using good technique to keep the stones uniform. Subjectively people prefer how various synthetics brands feel when sharpening but that is not relevant because ultimately what matters is how the edge cuts.



I don't agree with this at all. Kind of a strange statement.

I own multiple stones in each coarse/med/fine grit range and they all differ in feel, speed, behavior, & resulting edge.

I'd say that is definitely relevant...


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## Ruso (Jul 25, 2014)

CutFingers said:


> I believe you get what you pay for with natural stones. Synthetic stones it honestly does not matter so much as far as branding as long as the particles are well held together. The reality is that synthetic stones are a cost effective way to insure uniform particle size.
> 
> Rika, Arashiyama, Gesshin are all more than likely manufactured using very similar methods of manufacture.What really matters is how you use the stones, keeping them flat, using good technique to keep the stones uniform. Subjectively people prefer how various synthetics brands feel when sharpening but that is not relevant because ultimately what matters is how the edge cuts.



If you mean that similar method is abrasive + binding then you are correct.
But keep in mind that there are many different abrasive materials. Different binding materials. Different proportions of each. And I am sure different manufacture process depending on selection of former.

It's like saying that all the cars are manufactured using very similar methods since they all will get you from point A to point B.


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## CutFingers (Jul 26, 2014)

Exactly my pont Ruso...a slow cutting stone will still get you to the same apex as a faster cutting medium. I guess what I'm trying to say is the nature of what constitutes a beginner stone is experience not brand name. An experienced sharpener with keen attention to detail can likely bring a great edge on any brand of stone. But people all like to have a different sense of feel when sharpening. 

I think Murry Carter is right when emphasizes technique not equipment because the end result is always going to be the same if you do a good job of paying attention to what the edges are doing.


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