# silver skin remover



## labor of love

What does everybody prefer for this? I get by just fine with a petty but I’m doing enough of this sorta thing where I’m cleaning large primal cuts I feel like I could get a knife dedicated just for this task.
Things like hankotsu sound like they’re best for working in between bones and such, where as I just want to remove silver skin as efficiently as possible.
Stiff boning? Flexible boning? Flexible petty? What do you guys prefer?


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## Michi

Flexible fish filleting knife works well, as does an ordinary (stiff) boning knife.


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## labor of love

Yeah, but I don’t think I’d want a curved fish fillet blade but a straight one.


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## daveb

180 petty, very little flex. Its GD carbon but I'll keep it anyway. Says Marko on it.


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## Michi

labor of love said:


> Yeah, but I don’t think I’d want a curved fish fillet blade but a straight one.


This is the one I use. It's also available in a 20 cm version:


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## Jville

Recently, silverskin removal has been a main task of mine, and i expect that to continue for quite sometime. I bought this for the task from doberman forge and love it: https://www.etsy.com/listing/629371030/perfect-model-fillet-knife?ref=shop_home_active_2&frs=1
I tried using pettys, and i like the filet knife much better.


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## labor of love

@Jville Im curious if you looked at silverthorne. I like your knife a lot and it sorta reminds me of silverthorne stuff.


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## labor of love

@Michi maybe I do need a curved blade. I really don’t know.


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## Michi

labor of love said:


> @Michi maybe I do need a curved blade. I really don’t know.


I wouldn't agonise over it. If you have an ordinary stiff boning knife already, it'll do the job just fine. Mine looks like this, but I have the older stiff version (which they apparently no longer make). This one is flexible:






I find that removing silver skin is a little easier with a flexible knife, but not so much because it's flexible, but because it's thinner. Either works and, personally, I wouldn't buy a knife just for removing silver skin. Pick a fish fillet knife or a boning knife, and then fillet or bone away


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## Jville

labor of love said:


> @Jville Im curious if you looked at silverthorne. I like your knife a lot and it sorta reminds me of silverthorne stuff.



I definetely looked at silverthorne. They were not in stock at the time, so it made the decision easier. Honestly, i still may grab one. I almost bought it the other day, when it was in stock. If i wasnt broke, i would of bought it. I know alot of guys dont like to spend much cash on butcher knives, but it was money well spent.


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## krx927

There was a great video posted some time ago:

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/the-video-diary-collections.41510/#post-612633

The guy is using Honesuki for removing silver skin on beef Tenderloin. He was really efficient with it.


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## stringer

I trim a lot of beef tenderloin, skirt, flank, flap, strip, rib, etc, doing hotel work. All just boneless trimming and portioning. I have tried honesuki, honkatsu, Western boning and filet knives and petties of all sizes. For the last year or so I've been using an Ashi Ginga 210 petty in swedish stainless. Honesuki and hankotsu are too thick for being quick at the silverskin for me. Western boners edge retention sucks. I used a Kanehide 180mm petty for a few years. I liked the thinness behind the edge and the edge retention. But 180 is too short, the heel gets stuck in stuff and you have to grab a different knife to slice/dice portions for most stuff. The 210 is long enough to portion tenderloin and short rib and stew meat comfortably. Which means you only have to switch to a longer slicing knife when dealing with big guys like ribeye or striploin.


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## GorillaGrunt

I like a single bevel petty for tenderloins, but something like a 210mm petty is better for bigger cuts. The shape of a honesuki works pretty well too, I use that for a wider scope of butcher tasks than just poultry.


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## labor of love

I’m attracted more to the flexible fillet style knive over 210mm Sakai laser petty because it’s more narrow.


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## daveb

There's a trade-off between the 180 and 210 petty. 180 are typically pretty stiff but a tad short. 210 are typically a little flexi (which I can't stand). I would rather deal with the length than the flex so 180 works for me. I want enough blade height to be under the silverskin without breaking/cutting it, and for that height to be uniform - rules out gyuto.

All that said, most any knife will do. If I've got one loin to clean I prob won't open up the roll for the petty and just use what's handy. If I have 10 loins I certainly will.


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## ojisan

Some commercial trimming videos. 






Honesukis and sujihikis seem commonly used in Japan.


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## ryanjams

I like my silverthorn a lot for the task, not too curved or flexible for my taste. Better edge holding than western boners but easy to bring back and durable around bones. I used a sharpened down 180mm a type petty before that and still do when it's handier. My mini-gyuto mazaki petty is definitely uncomfortably tall for this kind of trimming. Silverthorn and Munetoshi butcher are a winning combo for me. 
I wish they made masahiro bessaku in petty shapes, my honesuki is super tough, toothy semi stainless and dirt cheap. Probably skd or the like as it patinas quite a bit. They have a hankotsu but these are like 99/1 and I don't see lefty available.


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## labor of love

ryanjams said:


> I like my silverthorn a lot for the task, not too curved or flexible for my taste. Better edge holding than western boners but easy to bring back and durable around bones. I used a sharpened down 180mm a type petty before that and still do when it's handier. My mini-gyuto mazaki petty is definitely uncomfortably tall for this kind of trimming. Silverthorn and Munetoshi butcher are a winning combo for me.
> I wish they made masahiro bessaku in petty shapes, my honesuki is super tough, toothy semi stainless and dirt cheap. Probably skd or the like as it patinas quite a bit. They have a hankotsu but these are like 99/1 and I don't see lefty available.


Jon’s got a lefty semi hankotsu that’s in that sub $100 budget.


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## ryanjams

Might be the same oem even, it'd be worth the small premium to have the jki touch. Handle scales are wonky and bigger than the tang on the masahiro. Worth a try if the hankotsu shape appeals to you.


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## M1k3

I like nice pointy, thin but not fragile thin tips. Suji's are great for this. Other style knives with these tips work also. I find the tip makes more of a difference than the particular style of knife.


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## turbochef422

I’ve been using a western HD 220 Suji/petty. It’s been an all star for me.


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## labor of love

turbochef422 said:


> I’ve been using a western HD 220 Suji/petty. It’s been an all star for me.


Yes. I need to think about it some more but either an HD western that’s actually instock or a silverthorne is what I’ll likely get.


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## Jville

stringer said:


> I trim a lot of beef tenderloin, skirt, flank, flap, strip, rib, etc, doing hotel work. All just boneless trimming and portioning. I have tried honesuki, honkatsu, Western boning and filet knives and petties of all sizes. For the last year or so I've been using an Ashi Ginga 210 petty in swedish stainless. Honesuki and hankotsu are too thick for being quick at the silverskin for me. Western boners edge retention sucks. I used a Kanehide 180mm petty for a few years. I liked the thinness behind the edge and the edge retention. But 180 is too short, the heel gets stuck in stuff and you have to grab a different knife to slice/dice portions for most stuff. The 210 is long enough to portion tenderloin and short rib and stew meat comfortably. Which means you only have to switch to a longer slicing knife when dealing with big guys like ribeye or striploin.



Thats what so great about the doberman filet knife, edge retention is great. I had the same problem with my mercer filet knife.


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## Jville

labor of love said:


> Yes. I need to think about it some more but either an HD western that’s actually instock or a silverthorne is what I’ll likely get.


The silverthorne i think would be nice. Doberman will make whatever flex you like. He was great to work with. I got mine medium flex and its been phenomenal, edge retention has been great.


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## daveb

Jville said:


> ....my cheap mercer...



Redundant alert!


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## daveb

labor of love said:


> Yes. I need to think about it some more but either an HD western that’s actually instock or a silverthorne is what I’ll likely get.



I'm ready to ship your knives back. Thanks. I'll put in an extra Silverthorne and if you like it we can talk.


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## Jville

daveb said:


> Redundant alert!


Haha, true that. My bad, edited.


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## Ivang

I use a 220~ ginga suji in w2, or a 150 petty for smaller things. cktg has a lefty hankotsu from their kanehide line, it is 70, might be worth looking into


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## labor of love

daveb said:


> I'm ready to ship your knives back. Thanks. I'll put in an extra Silverthorne and if you like it we can talk.


Ditto


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## labor of love

Silverthorne comes in O1 so it has my complete attention. What steel does Doberman work with?


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## fimbulvetr

I trim a lot of silverskin. I’ve never found a knife that was perfect for all of it. I’ve liked: a Forschner boning knife (curved); silverthorne; a Bessaku atamatori/kashiratori; a Bessaku hankotsu; a 210 Munetoshi slicer rehandled with a much heavier handle (to make it kinda a big ass boning knife); and, most recently, Bernal’s Konosuke butcher’s petty. I hate a lot about that last one, including the handle and the price point, but I love the edge it takes and I love how easily it takes it. It’s killer for tenderloins.


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## Jville

labor of love said:


> Silverthorne comes in O1 so it has my complete attention. What steel does Doberman work with?



He uses 52100. I havent had to baby it all. Full carbon hasnt been an issue at all. I thought i might have to keep an eye on it a little more, but have been pleased to just use it and wash/dry like normal.


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## ojisan

ryanjams said:


> They have a hankotsu but these are like 99/1 and I don't see lefty available.



I see the lefty Kanehide bessaku hankotsu at chefsknivestogo for $65 (as an option). Is this not what you want? Hirohira has the elastomer handle version as well.


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## Matus

I use my single bevel petty from Gesshin Ittetsu. Works really well for that.


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## Chuckles

I have a Harner boner I really like for that. I have a Silverthorn but don’t favor it for silver skin.


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## labor of love

Chuckles said:


> I have a Harner boner I really like for that. I have a Silverthorn but don’t favor it for silver skin.


Do you prefer the stiffness over flex? Or just boner blade over fillet blade?


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## Chuckles

Straighter profile, longer and stiffer. If it were mostly tenderloins I don’t think it would matter as much to me. 

The meat cutters at my last job used 6 inch boners and 10 inch breaking knives. When I jumped in I preferred the 8 inch Harner and not changing out knives. The career meat cutters that cared about knives at all universally preferred the Silverthorn FWIW. 

There might be a badass Marko out there somewhere too. If I remember correctly they had the forshner profile.


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## Chuckles

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/boning-knife-comparison.29714/


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## thirsty0ne

I use a Petty for that, 140mm Xerxes...
those vids above are great though!


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## panda

strictly silverskin, i would probably want a longer laser petty like this https://carbonknifeco.com/products/ashi-ginga-white-2-petty-180mm


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## labor of love

Chuckles said:


> Straighter profile, longer and stiffer. If it were mostly tenderloins I don’t think it would matter as much to me.
> 
> The meat cutters at my last job used 6 inch boners and 10 inch breaking knives. When I jumped in I preferred the 8 inch Harner and not changing out knives. The career meat cutters that cared about knives at all universally preferred the Silverthorn FWIW.
> 
> There might be a badass Marko out there somewhere too. If I remember correctly they had the forshner profile.


Got a silverthorn on loan from a guy here. I like enough that Im buying it off him. TBH the curvature doesnt really lend itself to silverskin removing, im still reaching for my 150mm petty. Also the silverthorne is bullet proof at the edge. It really shines doing work around bones or scraping bones.


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## Suhail Karimi

cktg has a kanehide fillet knife in semi stainless @ 200mm for like 80bucks that i just ordered, i'll report back when i get to test it out as i currently break down 6-8 fillets/day


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## podzap

I use a Mac PF-60 (150mm).


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## daveb

180 petty ftw. Doesn't hurt that it's a Marko.


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## Kippington

If you guys can come up with a good design, I'm willing to make it and send it on a passaround.
I've noticed concave sharpening really helps for silverskin.


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## Travis petosa

Grandfather was a butcher all his life. Passed some skills down to me, FWIW. I break at least 4 tenderloins down a day at the restaurant. My go to for silver skin is a victorinox 8” flexi boning knife. 

It’s annoying having multiple knives for a job but I find the boning knife is really good for all things silver skin and my fell petty 180mm for most of the rest of the work.


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## suntravel

M390 K-Tip Petty, very thin tip, but almost no flex at HRC 65 












Regards

Uwe


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## daveb

The no flex part is the most important to me for taking on silverskin.


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## panda

Kippington said:


> If you guys can come up with a good design, I'm willing to make it and send it on a passaround.
> I've noticed concave sharpening really helps for silverskin.


the ks 165 shape, but made into 180


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## labor of love

shigehiro 180 petty, looks like a KS petty but with balls


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## Kippington

There really seems to be two distinct parties here: Flex and no flex. I get the feeling flex is easier but does a worse job. It's possible to make a knife where only the tip flexes.
There's also some mention of the professional meat-cutters, but often they don't deal with the silverskin which is why this thread is up in the first place.
Two things that people here agree on: Low heel height is good, and tenderloin is easy to clean up.

The Silverthorn is fascinating. Is it flexible at all?


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## panda

never flex!


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## M1k3

For me, no flex. But I'm that weirdo that regularly uses a 240mm Gyuto to take silverskin off pork tenderloins, Ribeye, New York, etc. But something like a silvethorn, no flex, but thin, sounds ideal for me. But with a beefy but not to beefy finger guard? 160-180mm...

P.S. I'm no butcher, just a lowly line cook in an upscale place.


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## Ryndunk

Sounds odd but for Pismos (I do about 12/week), 270 yanagiba is my choice. No flex, single bevel works great on the silverskin, perfect for slicing portions.


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## Kippington

Ryndunk said:


> Sounds odd but for Pismos (I do about 12/week), 270 yanagiba is my choice. No flex, single bevel works great on the silverskin, perfect for slicing portions.


Of the wide selection of Japanese knives to choose from, you'd think portioning beef would be the one time you'd choose a "_beef sword_".
If you use a gyuto for everything else, you've done a 180° backflip.


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## Ryndunk

Irony.


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## M1k3

Kippington said:


> Of the wide selection of Japanese knives to choose from, you'd think portioning beef would be the one time you'd choose a "_beef sword_".
> If you use a gyuto for everything else, you've done a 180° backflip.



My head Chef uses a Yanagiba as Chefs knife


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## Kippington

Sounds like a


M1k3 said:


> My head Chef uses a Yanagiba as Chefs knife


I'll only say this here because I'll never get another chance to say the words ever again - A kiritsuke would be a great fit for that guy...
Hooray!


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## suntravel

Monstermuck,

40cm Kitchensword 



Regards Uwe


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## Kippington

suntravel said:


> Monstermuck,
> 
> 40cm Kitchensword
> 
> 
> 
> Regards Uwe



Das Messer needs a Nagel!


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## suntravel

an other long slicer made by Xerxes:





Regards

Uwe


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## M1k3

Kippington said:


> Sounds like a
> 
> I'll only say this here because I'll never get another chance to say the words ever again - A kiritsuke would be a great fit for that guy...
> Hooray!



You would think. But he likes the shortness because because potatoes don't stick


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## mise_en_place

If the knife is sharp, I prefer using a knife with no flex and some convexity. 

If I'm using house knives, the 6" shanks (they used to be boning knives, but have been ground to approx. 1.5 tall) are my preferred knife. They are really thin (and therefore have flex) so they aren't as terrible when they dull. 

If Kip does one for a passaround I vote stiff. Would love to give it a go at the butcher shop!


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## labor of love

Ginga, Kono HD is a fine amount of flex for me for silverskin, but fish fillet knife level of flex would not be enjoyable.


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## panda

mise_en_place said:


> If the knife is sharp, I prefer using a knife with no flex and some convexity.
> 
> If I'm using house knives, the 6" shanks (they used to be boning knives, but have been ground to approx. 1.5 tall) are my preferred knife. They are really thin (and therefore have flex) so they aren't as terrible when they dull.
> 
> If Kip does one for a passaround I vote stiff. Would love to give it a go at the butcher shop!


this! cheap white handle 8" chef knife ground down into honesuki shape is dope for silverskin and other butchering and doesnt steer cause it aint stupid single bevel meaning you can use it in any direction.


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## Kippington

mise_en_place said:


> If I'm using house knives, the 6" shanks (they used to be boning knives, but have been ground to approx. 1.5 tall) are my preferred knife. They are really thin (and therefore have flex) so they aren't as terrible when they dull.


Yeah these are really common. You'd never be able to buy something like that new though, there's basicly no steel left on them.


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## Brandon Wicks

When I did a lot of meat butchering I used a honkotsu for taking apart primals and whole critters. Honesuki did a great job on removing silver skin as did a 150mm petty. Never got used to using a honkotsu for silver skin. I think last time I removed silver skin recently I just used a really old ground down 210 carbon gyuto. It’s more like a 200mm sujihiki at this point really.


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## Hassanbensober

I use a normark fillet knife I took out of a tackle box in my dad’s garage many years ago. The tip is so fine it glides right under the silver skin with little to no damage or waste. I have a pass around rapula one as well. Try it works way better than a petty betcha.


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## labor of love

Bumping this thread again...tried a silverthorn and quickly learned I’m not really into the curved profile for silverskin.

Im really digging shihan 210mm petty/suji...anybody own one?

For the time being I’m just using different 150mm pettys.

@Kippington whats up with that pass around idea? Have you given it anymore thought?


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## Brian Weekley

Kikuichi Elite Carbon Hankotsu ... 150mm ground 90-10 about $160


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## mise_en_place

labor of love said:


> Im really digging shihan 210mm petty/suji...anybody own one?
> 
> For the time being I’m just using different 150mm pettys.



Any interest in trying something like this? Close in size to 150mm.

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/hsc-boning-knife.44597/


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## Kippington

labor of love said:


> @Kippington whats up with that pass around idea? Have you given it anymore thought?


I wanted to seed a conversation on the design aspects of a good butchery knife. I would've made one based off the ideas but nobody took the bait. 
Working on the hook passaround though, which is enough for the moment.



mise_en_place said:


> https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachments/05cc3466-eebf-474a-9cf9-28747ac8b83d-jpeg.68931/


For a second there I thought Mert had somehow stamped his logo on a natural stone...


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## Michi

Kippington said:


> Working on the hook passaround though, which is enough for the moment.


Yes, please!!!


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## labor of love

Kippington said:


> I wanted to seed a conversation on the design aspects of a good butchery knife. I would've made one based off the ideas but nobody took the bait.
> Working on the hook passaround though, which is enough for the moment.
> 
> 
> For a second there I thought Mert had somehow stamped his logo on a natural stone...


Tease


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## Runner_up

Munetoshi 210mm slicer is excellent for this task.


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## panda

ask kip to make you a 180 laser petty


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## Nino-chan

labor of love said:


> What does everybody prefer for this? I get by just fine with a petty but I’m doing enough of this sorta thing where I’m cleaning large primal cuts I feel like I could get a knife dedicated just for this task.
> Things like hankotsu sound like they’re best for working in between bones and such, where as I just want to remove silver skin as efficiently as possible.
> Stiff boning? Flexible boning? Flexible petty? What do you guys prefer?


21cm sujihiki will do the job


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