# Soak or Splash Natural Stones? Binsui Red



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

Just got my natural stone in, took like a month! But it looks good right now I cant wait to test it out tonight.

But do I soak binsui natural stones? Or just splash them? Also the natural nagura stone do I splash or soak? Thanks!


----------



## cheflivengood (May 17, 2018)

Don't submerge, run water over it or spray it till you see it not soak it up anymore. nagura no soak. binsui doesn't crack that easy but shelaqing isn't a bad idea.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

cheflivengood said:


> Don't submerge, run water over it or spray it till you see it not soak it up anymore. nagura no soak. binsui doesn't crack that easy but shelaqing isn't a bad idea.



Thanks! Shelaq it with what exactly?


----------



## Marcelo Amaral (May 17, 2018)

Jnats are usually splash-and-go, with the exception of mikawa naguras (botan, tenjyou, mejiro, koma), from what i remember.


----------



## cheflivengood (May 17, 2018)

There are a few threads on sealing natural stones, search away.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

cheflivengood said:


> There are a few threads on sealing natural stones, search away.


Haha okay thanks


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

Marcelo Amaral said:


> Jnats are usually splash-and-go, with the exception of mikawa naguras (botan, tenjyou, mejiro, koma), from what i remember.


Cool thanks


----------



## cheflivengood (May 17, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Haha okay thanks



There is just too many ways and options for me to explain


----------



## nutmeg (May 17, 2018)

I find porous jnats works better when soaked few hours in water before use.
Not sure for binsui but Uchigumori or some soft suitas are much smoother after being soaked.


----------



## niwaki-boy (May 17, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Thanks! Shelaq it with what exactly?



Shelaq is different dont. Just use some marine lacquer. Traditional in Japan is urushi but youll never see that here. Next would be cashew lacquer which can be purchased here in the states.. pm me if want info.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

nutmeg said:


> I find porous jnats works better when soaked few hours in water before use.
> Not sure for binsui but Uchigumori or some soft suitas are much smoother after being soaked.



Interesting, this one definitely seems softer than I thought it would be...


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

Can I just use nail polish? And only do the sides and bottom or the whole thing?


----------



## panda (May 17, 2018)

binsui is kind of useless unless you are just using it as a base for slurry from other stones, why did you even bother with this one?


----------



## preizzo (May 17, 2018)

panda said:


> binsui is kind of useless unless you are just using it as a base for slurry from other stones, why did you even bother with this one?


I don't get it.
Did you try it or you are just talking because you think is not a good stone?
I have one and it work really fine when I want to make a nice Kasumi finish.


----------



## panda (May 17, 2018)

yea i got one from metalmaster and threw it away same day lol


----------



## cheflivengood (May 17, 2018)

panda said:


> yea i got one from metalmaster and threw it away same day lol



novelty imo


----------



## brooksie967 (May 17, 2018)

Marcelo Amaral said:


> Jnats are usually splash-and-go, with the exception of mikawa naguras (botan, tenjyou, mejiro, koma), from what i remember.



I tend to agree though some people soak their uchigumori to help soften it even more. My full size botan nagura bench stone definitely isn't splash and go (i let it sit under a running tap for a few minutes and then it's ready to rock).


----------



## K813zra (May 17, 2018)

Looks like Amakusa (Torato) to me. They drink water like a fish. Some are medium soft (Harder) and some are wicked soft, sandy and fast (I prefer these as they eat metal). My Binsui (Johaku) have all been much harder, slower to slurry, don't like to auto slurry and will seem to cut slowly if you do not kick up some slurry with a diamond plate but if you do they tend to become more aggressive. The two stones are nothing alike, to me. One soft and sandy/gritty feeling and the other hard and glassy feeling (for a Naka-to). I have had the harder amakusa and they still feel more sandy.

Generally speaking I find that I prefer Amaksua to Binsui and soft one in particular because they will remove a fair bit of metal at a quick rate. Similar to a 600(ish) grit synthetic with more of an 800-1000 grit finish with light, light pressure. Binsui tend to cut significantly slower and leave only a marginally finer edge. A harder Amakusa will split the difference.

Just my opinion as a Naka-to nerd. There is nothing wrong with collecting and using naka-to but there are more logical choices out there for finishing things like softer carbon or stainless blades. Or even general use on double bevels. Ikarashi, Aizu and a good Aoto come to mind.

Anyway, I don't like to soak naturals. To each their own but I am a worry wort.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

K813zra said:


> Looks like Amakusa (Torato) to me. They drink water like a fish. Some are medium soft (Harder) and some are wicked soft, sandy and fast (I prefer these as they eat metal). My Binsui (Johaku) have all been much harder, slower to slurry, don't like to auto slurry and will seem to cut slowly if you do not kick up some slurry with a diamond plate but if you do they tend to become more aggressive. The two stones are nothing alike, to me. One soft and sandy/gritty feeling and the other hard and glassy feeling (for a Naka-to). I have had the harder amakusa and they still feel more sandy.
> 
> Generally speaking I find that I prefer Amaksua to Binsui and soft one in particular because they will remove a fair bit of metal at a quick rate. Similar to a 600(ish) grit synthetic with more of an 800-1000 grit finish with light, light pressure. Binsui tend to cut significantly slower and leave only a marginally finer edge. A harder Amakusa will split the difference.
> 
> ...



Yeah when I was looking it up it seemed like it was a Torato Amakusa from the redness. There were Two selections when you bought it but he listed them both as Binsui, there was a red lower grit one which is the one I got and the little bit high grit Blue one. This stone is definitely a soft slurry maker from the few seconds I played with it a little bit ago. Ill be sharpening tonight and let you know more. But dry it also seems soft and sandy like you said. I know a lot of people were going to talk **** like panda etc but I dont really care, its a start for me and will be just fine for what I need. One day Ill get a finer grit natural and from what Ive seen I have to spend about $100 min, so panda and all of you others will be real happy!

Fred Bear has his hunting videos and he was the last person allowed to hunt tigers in India. He met up with a master huntsman who carried a bag of knives around that were Razor sharp. You know what his sharpening stones were?! Whatever stones he found while he was out hunting. That was it. Just whatever stone he came across that he felt would sharpen good, he basically got small ones and used as finger stones. Ill find the video later its awesome! That old man is what got me really stoked about natural stones and using what you could fine. Instead of spending $1k on a stone!


----------



## nutmeg (May 17, 2018)

brooksie967 said:


> I tend to agree though some people soak their uchigumori to help soften it even more.



Yes uchigumori are like sponges. When soaked you can use them sometimes 3-5 minutes without adding any water drop to the slurry. 
They also feel much less sticky and makes the moves smoother.
I got like 100-150 pieces of uchigumori and none of them broke so I keep going on..


----------



## Grunt173 (May 17, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Yeah when I was looking it up it seemed like it was a Torato Amakusa from the redness. There were Two selections when you bought it but he listed them both as Binsui, there was a red lower grit one which is the one I got and the little bit high grit Blue one. This stone is definitely a soft slurry maker from the few seconds I played with it a little bit ago. Ill be sharpening tonight and let you know more. But dry it also seems soft and sandy like you said. I know a lot of people were going to talk **** like panda etc but I dont really care, its a start for me and will be just fine for what I need. One day Ill get a finer grit natural and from what Ive seen I have to spend about $100 min, so panda and all of you others will be real happy!
> 
> Fred Bear has his hunting videos and he was the last person allowed to hunt tigers in India. He met up with a master huntsman who carried a bag of knives around that were Razor sharp. You know what his sharpening stones were?! Whatever stones he found while he was out hunting. That was it. Just whatever stone he came across that he felt would sharpen good, he basically got small ones and used as finger stones. Ill find the video later its awesome! That old man is what got me really stoked about natural stones and using what you could fine. Instead of spending $1k on a stone!



Fred Bear was the man !
I just got my first natural and love it. It's an Aizu. You might want to consider that one too. They range in the 3k to 5k grits. I am finding mine a very useful stone.


----------



## brooksie967 (May 17, 2018)

nutmeg said:


> Yes uchigumori are like sponges. When soaked you can use them sometimes 3-5 minutes without adding any water drop to the slurry.
> They also feel much less sticky and makes the moves smoother.
> I got like 100-150 pieces of uchigumori and none of them broke so I keep going on..



Ben please feel free to send those via air, sea or teleporter. However you like


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

brooksie967 said:


> Ben please feel free to send those via air, sea or teleporter. However you like



Haha for real if you have that many extra Ill take one, just one will do


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 17, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> Fred Bear was the man !
> I just got my first natural and love it. It's an Aizu. You might want to consider that one too. They range in the 3k to 5k grits. I am finding mine a very useful stone.



Yeah he was! His hunting videos which were done by either just him or maybe one other guy sometimes are still to this day better than most of the hunting videos out there.

Awesome glad you like it Ill definitely have to snag one one day soon, where did you get yours? How much?


----------



## nutmeg (May 18, 2018)

brooksie967 said:


> Ben please feel free to send those via air, sea or teleporter. However you like


 
Throw your name in the hat, it could be your lucky day 

(correction: ONLY 20 pieces left..!)


----------



## khashy (May 18, 2018)

nutmeg said:


> Throw your name in the hat, it could be your lucky day
> 
> (correction: ONLY 20 pieces left..!)



Only


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

nutmeg said:


> Throw your name in the hat, it could be your lucky day
> 
> (correction: ONLY 20 pieces left..!)



Okay awesome! Im throwing my name in the hat! Should I pm you?


----------



## Grunt173 (May 18, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Yeah he was! His hunting videos which were done by either just him or maybe one other guy sometimes are still to this day better than most of the hunting videos out there.
> 
> Awesome glad you like it Ill definitely have to snag one one day soon, where did you get yours? How much?



I got mine on ebay for less then a hundred bucks. A bunch came up being sold by one person so I pulled the string on one.Seriously,I am not an expert in natural stones but the Aizu was recommended to me by a gentleman on here and I am so pleased that I took his advice because I like the stone a great deal,so much so that I bought another Aizu because it is of a different color and maybe a different feel in sharpening,although they both maybe pretty close to the same grit.I maybe selling one of them at a later date because it is senseless to have the same stone,really.I find it is a stone I like to finish on.
I'm old enough ( 71 ) to remember watching Fred on television going around the world hunting all the top game with his bow.His movies are responsible for my getting interested in archery and bow hunting.


----------



## K813zra (May 18, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> I got mine on ebay for less then a hundred bucks. A bunch came up being sold by one person so I pulled the string on one.Seriously,I am not an expert in natural stones but the Aizu was recommended to me by a gentleman on here and I am so pleased that I took his advice because I like the stone a great deal,so much so that I bought another Aizu because it is of a different color and maybe a different feel in sharpening,although they both maybe pretty close to the same grit.I maybe selling one of them at a later date because it is senseless to have the same stone,really.I find it is a stone I like to finish on.
> I'm old enough ( 71 ) to remember watching Fred on television going around the world hunting all the top game with his bow.His movies are responsible for my getting interested in archery and bow hunting.



Senseless to keep both? I have 4...:tease: Had 5 but one was cut into nagura. If course I am crazy.


----------



## Grunt173 (May 18, 2018)

K813zra said:


> Senseless to keep both? I have 4...:tease: Had 5 but one was cut into nagura. If course I am crazy.



I think what you have is catchy too.I wonder if there is a cure for it.It is like Poison Ivy,the more you scratch,the more you get.


----------



## Pensacola Tiger (May 18, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> I think what you have is catchy too.I wonder if there is a cure for it.It is like Poison Ivy,the more you scratch,the more you get.



The technical term is SAD - Stone Acquisition Disorder. No known cure.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> I got mine on ebay for less then a hundred bucks. A bunch came up being sold by one person so I pulled the string on one.Seriously,I am not an expert in natural stones but the Aizu was recommended to me by a gentleman on here and I am so pleased that I took his advice because I like the stone a great deal,so much so that I bought another Aizu because it is of a different color and maybe a different feel in sharpening,although they both maybe pretty close to the same grit.I maybe selling one of them at a later date because it is senseless to have the same stone,really.I find it is a stone I like to finish on.
> I'm old enough ( 71 ) to remember watching Fred on television going around the world hunting all the top game with his bow.His movies are responsible for my getting interested in archery and bow hunting.



Dang brother you are killing it! Yeah man he definitely peaked my interest in it I actually have a Mongolian 80lbs now that I love! Havent shot it or hunted in yearsss though just too busy with cook work and farming.

Well if you sell Ill buy it from you!


----------



## K813zra (May 18, 2018)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> The technical term is SAD - Stone Acquisition Disorder. No known cure.



Right. See, I have taken short breaks before but always go back to buying more stones. More come in than go out too...


----------



## Grunt173 (May 18, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Dang brother you are killing it! Yeah man he definitely peaked my interest in it I actually have a Mongolian 80lbs now that I love! Havent shot it or hunted in yearsss though just too busy with cook work and farming.
> 
> Well if you sell Ill buy it from you!



Holy smokes,a Mongolian bow? You are really going back into time of anchent history. Although,I used to shoot Self Bows.


----------



## Dave Martell (May 18, 2018)

To make these stones work they don't need much water but they need slurry so add water and use a diamond plate to break the surface loose a bit and watch the stone come alive. Add water only as required for lubrication or else you'll wash away the slurry. Keep working the surface with the diamond plate as you go.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

Dave Martell said:


> To make these stones work they don't need much water but they need slurry so add water and use a diamond plate to break the surface loose a bit and watch the stone come alive. Add water only as required for lubrication or else you'll wash away the slurry. Keep working the surface with the diamond plate as you go.



Cool thanks, yeah this one slurries with just the knife and a splash of water


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> Holy smokes,a Mongolian bow? You are really going back into time of anchent history. Although,I used to shoot Self Bows.



Self bows? Yeah its nice but its definitely Not a Real Real Mongolian, they used yak horn I think and glued it together to the wood with fish glue they made the first compound bows, and theyre real bows were 150+lbs!!! Anddd they were Amazing archers even on horse back and they shot with completely different technique... have you seen Lars Anderson!? This guy is insane! https://youtu.be/BEG-ly9tQGk


----------



## swarth (May 18, 2018)

Mind blown.


----------



## Grunt173 (May 18, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> Self bows? Yeah its nice but its definitely Not a Real Real Mongolian, they used yak horn I think and glued it together to the wood with fish glue they made the first compound bows, and theyre real bows were 150+lbs!!! Anddd they were Amazing archers even on horse back and they shot with completely different technique... have you seen Lars Anderson!? This guy is insane! https://youtu.be/BEG-ly9tQGk



That video is worth while going off topic.I can't believe what I just watched.Everybody should see this.
Thanks for sharing.


----------



## niwaki-boy (May 18, 2018)

swarth said:


> Mind blown.



Yup... hmy:
As the narrator said.. Lars took it a step further

Dahhamm!!


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

For real! Hes insane! The catching the arrows and shooting back immediately and splitting a flying arrow in flight! Glad you all enjoyed! I figured that off topic video was necessary. I wish I had the place to practice like that but Id end up losing all the arrows haha!


----------



## Grunt173 (May 18, 2018)

TEWNCfarms said:


> For real! Hes insane! The catching the arrows and shooting back immediately and splitting a flying arrow in flight! Glad you all enjoyed! I figured that off topic video was necessary. I wish I had the place to practice like that but Id end up losing all the arrows haha!



Good thing he didn't train all the Indians or we would be on the reservations.


----------



## TEWNCfarms (May 18, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> Good thing he didn't train all the Indians or we would be on the reservations.



Haha!


----------

