# Can you make a Hagane/Jigane Contrast with Synthetics?



## Tler (Feb 13, 2018)

Is it possible to create a good contrast between the Hagane and Jigane on a yanagiba using synthetic whetstones? If so, how? What grit is ideal? etc


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## rick_english (Feb 13, 2018)

The King 800 works great for me.


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## Matus (Feb 13, 2018)

Soft coarse and medium grit synthetics do best it would seem On top of that there are stones like Gesshin Jinzo Aoto or JNS Red Aoto that seem to have been designed with kasumi in mind. Once you start to get higher up in the grid the constrast tends to get muted. I personally think it is the best to use synthetics up to about 4k - 6k and then switch to a softer natural like Uchigumori. But just browse the 'Uchigumori thread' for more details


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## Badgertooth (Feb 13, 2018)

King 800
King Hyper 1k
King Hyper 2k
Chosera 3k sometimes


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## ThEoRy (Feb 13, 2018)

Yup. My progression for the blade road is Gesshin 400, king 800 then Gesshin Jinzo Aoto.

Looks like this.


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## Panamapeet (Feb 13, 2018)

King hyper 1k is great for this, but I guess you will need to cut a microbevel on single bevel knives in order to get it sharp and polished nicely


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Feb 13, 2018)

@ThEoRy is that a primary bevel with only very little angle difference, hamaguriba-like? Or is that nearly zero ground with some kind of masking material used?


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## PalmRoyale (Feb 13, 2018)

Matus said:


> Once you start to get higher up in the grid the constrast tends to get muted.



The only high grit synthetics that I know of that can create a somewhat decent contrast are the Sigma Select II 10000 and 13000.


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## ThEoRy (Feb 13, 2018)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> @ThEoRy is that a primary bevel with only very little angle difference, hamaguriba-like? Or is that nearly zero ground with some kind of masking material used?



I don't know what a masking material is or how that would work. I just did a hamaguriba edge. I get the blade road how I like it then change the pressure points from behind the shinogi line then down to behind the edge. Check my YouTube channel and see yanagiba and deba sharpening.

[video=youtube;-hlGkgj-ZAQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hlGkgj-ZAQ&t=[/video]

[video=youtube;jqe71SKhajI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqe71SKhajI&t=[/video]


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## Grunt173 (Feb 13, 2018)

ThEoRy said:


> I don't know what a masking material is or how that would work. I just did a hamaguriba edge. I get the blade road how I like it then change the pressure points from behind the shinogi line then down to behind the edge. Check my YouTube channel and see yanagiba and deba sharpening.
> 
> [video=youtube;-hlGkgj-ZAQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hlGkgj-ZAQ&t=[/video]
> 
> [video=youtube;jqe71SKhajI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqe71SKhajI&t=[/video]



Thanks for the videos.Very good.


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## ThEoRy (Feb 13, 2018)

Grunt173 said:


> Thanks for the videos.Very good.



Np. Not sure if they are still there or if they appear on mobile but I don't speak much in the videos so I annotate the instructions with subtitles.


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## Nemo (Feb 13, 2018)

It depends a lot on the stone.

I've never had any luck with Chosera 1k or 3k or Junpaku 8k. My polishing experience is a miniscule fraction of Badgertooth's so it's encouraging to hear that he can sometimes get the Chosera 3k to make a contrast.

OTOH, I have produced nice contrast with AI1000, JNS blue aoto (synth) and Kitayama without any difficulty.

I'm not sure why some stones do and others don't produce contrast.


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## brooksie967 (Feb 14, 2018)

Contrast? Yes. With the right technique I believe it's doable. Kasumi? That's a different beast IMO. 

Here are three videos. First is shapton glasss 500 grit, second is a naniwa chosera 1k and last is a very soft narutaki Iro. This is all in the same progression on a bent and beat up old yanagi that i'm trying to make submit. 

[video=youtube;sBuphCyv21E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBuphCyv21E[/video]

[video=youtube;d69viSIHAlI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d69viSIHAlI[/video]

[video=youtube;BILSXyp2NWQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BILSXyp2NWQ[/video]


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Feb 14, 2018)

@ThEoRy with "masking material" I meant any thinner equivalent of electrical tape (which would obviously be too thick).


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