# Time for a new 1K, thoughts?



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

Hey folks, I think it's time to upgrade from from the King KDS 1000. Great cheap stone for learning, but also a cheap stone overall .

These days my progression is the King 1K, then light on a Morihei Hishiboshi 4K, then leather strop. I like the 4k toothiness cleaned with the strop.

So, question is, what stone in the 1K neighborhood, around $100 would you buy?


----------



## Elliot (May 31, 2019)

Every day and twice on Sunday: http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/jns-1000-matukusuyama/


----------



## MrHiggins (May 31, 2019)

Gesshin 1000 XL from Japanese Knife Imports. Silky, soft, muddy stone. Super nice. Leaves a dark grey finish if you like that sort of thing.


----------



## Barmoley (May 31, 2019)

I've had really good results with https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co.../products/gesshin-1000-grit-extra-large-stone and https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co...edium-stones/products/gesshin-2000-grit-stone but 2000 is sold out at the moment.


----------



## Elliot (May 31, 2019)

Also... just throwing it out there, I bet this is good. Don't know anyone who has used the 1k, but I have heard from multiple sources the 200 and 400 are the shizzzznit.
https://nanohone.com/collections/wh...lash-and-go-whetstones?variant=28211176898640


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

Oh, and if it makes a difference, it will be used for a variety of steels. Currently B2, W1, UHB20c, AEB-L, and some softer stainless stuff (Forschner). Least concerned with how it does on that latter .


----------



## RDalman (May 31, 2019)

I like the shapton pro/kuromaku 1000.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

RDalman said:


> I like the shapton pro/kuromaku 1000.



I have the 5000, which is honestly my least fav stone. But I've heard the 1k's are great - and if you like it, I'm sure it's much better than the 5K .


----------



## RDalman (May 31, 2019)

JustinP said:


> I have the 5000, which is honestly my least fav stone. But I've heard the 1k's are great - and if you like it, I'm sure it's much better than the 5K .


Haha alright I haven't tried the 5k, but the 1k is the fastest 1k I've tried and doesnt dish very fast, and works well on every steel I've tried. But I bet the jns and jki stones are good too.


----------



## chinacats (May 31, 2019)

Gesshin 1k...or of you prefer splash and go, Gesshin 1.2k.


----------



## GoodMagic (May 31, 2019)

I have experience with five stones in this range. Shapton pro 1k, shapton glass 1k, chosera 800 and choosera 1k and Jki diamond. All are good stones. All work fine with variety of steel, although I am not a stainless guy so limited experience except ginsan. No problem with high hr steels. No cracking on my choseras, but they are sealed. Least favorite is sg, but I may be in minority. As mentioned the shapton pro is fast and lasts forever- mine is ten years old and still going strong in home environment, so it’s a great value too. Can’t go wrong with any of these. If I had to buy one now I would chose one of the choseras, primarily based on there nice feel and speed. The cho 800&2000 are a great progression for most knives imo.


----------



## daveb (May 31, 2019)

Best 1K is the Gesshin 2K. By far.

Shapton Pro 1K is a nice, wham bam, thank you ma'am, solution.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

GoodMagic said:


> I have experience with five stones in this range. Shapton pro 1k, shapton glass 1k, chosera 800 and choosera 1k and Jki diamond. All are good stones. All work fine with variety of steel, although I am not a stainless guy so limited experience except ginsan. No problem with high hr steels. No cracking on my choseras, but they are sealed. Least favorite is sg, but I may be in minority. As mentioned the shapton pro is fast and lasts forever- mine is ten years old and still going strong in home environment, so it’s a great value too. Can’t go wrong with any of these. If I had to buy one now I would chose one of the choseras, primarily based on there nice feel and speed. The cho 800&2000 are a great progression for most knives imo.



Even though the Gesshin 1k is getting a lot of love here, I'm kinda leaning towards the Shapton pro. I can get it locally, and I like instant gratification . How would you rate the feedback on it? The 5K gives you nothing. You can see it taking off metal, but can't feel anything. As I said, my current fav stone to finish on is the Morihei Hi 4K. I think 1000-4k would be better than 800-4k. Of course I'm a noob.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

daveb said:


> Best *1K* is the Gesshin *2K*.



Wait, what?


----------



## Barmoley (May 31, 2019)

Gesshin 2K is excellent, cuts fast and feedback is amazing.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

Any experience with the Morihei Hishiboshi 1K here? Maybe since I like my 4k so much I should consider that. Carbon has them locally.


----------



## labor of love (May 31, 2019)

I really want to try a mid grit stone from sigma, maybe something like this.
https://www.mtckitchen.com/sigma-power-select-ii-1000-sharpening-stone-for-knives-medium-grit/

Gesh 1200 is likely the one mid grit stone I’ve used that I like enough to rebuy.
Also, Shapton will take a lifetime to wear down so it doesn’t count


----------



## MrHiggins (May 31, 2019)

JustinP said:


> Even though the Gesshin 1k is getting a lot of love here, I'm kinda leaning towards the Shapton pro. I can get it locally, and I like instant gratification . How would you rate the feedback on it? The 5K gives you nothing. You can see it taking off metal, but can't feel anything. As I said, my current fav stone to finish on is the Morihei Hi 4K. I think 1000-4k would be better than 800-4k. Of course I'm a noob.


Yeah, the Gesshin is a soft, dishing stone, and you need to soak it. I like the soft, muddy feel, but I could also make an argument for a harder stone. Shapton is a fine choice.


----------



## tundraotto (May 31, 2019)

I really like the Shapton Pro 1000 and the Chosera/Naniwa Professional 800 – and Suehiro Cerax 1000 for a soaker stone


----------



## Lars (May 31, 2019)

Bester 1K2. If you can soak it, it's a wonderful stone.


----------



## ojisan (May 31, 2019)

I really love my Shapton Pro 1000. It cuts fast and doesn't leave deep scratches, no hassle for flattening, that what I expect for this grid.
I'd save space for muddy stones for finishing grids (but getting attracted by Gesshin 1000).


----------



## Benuser (May 31, 2019)

Naniwa Pro 800, extremely versatile. Vary with more or less water, raising a bit of mud or not, more or less pressure. Fast, relatively hard, offering a lot of tactile feedback. 
End result will be some JIS1200.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

Well, it seems I might need two or three 1k range stones


----------



## GoodMagic (May 31, 2019)

Can’t go wrong with shapton plus it’s cheap. Feedback is ok, not great. Doesn’t feel as nice as choseras. As others have said it strengths are its speed and longevity. Also, the shapton 5 k is imo a good finisher. It is hard and smooth with minimal feedback, but pots a nice polish on the edge.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

Well, I'm gonna go with the shapton 1k. Thanks all for the thoughts. I think I'm also going to grab the Morihei Hi 1K from Carbon, since there's not a lot of info or reviews around for those stones, and I really like the 4K.


----------



## GorillaGrunt (May 31, 2019)

Shapton Pro or King Hyper. Haven’t used any of the mentioned Gesshin stones but every one I do have is excellent.


----------



## labor of love (May 31, 2019)

Where can I read more about morihei 1k? Carbon doesn’t have a product description


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

labor of love said:


> Where can I read more about morihei 1k? Carbon doesn’t have a product description



I can't find much info on them. Hitohori has a little more.

https://hitohira-japan.com/collections/morihei-whetstone/products/aaeaa-020-1000

And a thread here.

https://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/threads/morihei-suzu-series.40787/


----------



## valgard (May 31, 2019)

Elliot said:


> Every day and twice on Sunday: http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/jns-1000-matukusuyama/


This, best 1k I have used so far.


----------



## valgard (May 31, 2019)

JustinP said:


> Well, it seems I might need two or three 1k range stones


I have three [emoji23], have used 7-8 so far.


----------



## JustinP (May 31, 2019)

valgard said:


> I have three [emoji23], have used 7-8 so far.



Well, I promised myself I at least wouldn't get into Jnats.


----------



## inferno (May 31, 2019)

I did a shooutout thread not too long ago with 1ks.

To be honest there is really not that much difference in speed between quality 1ks. 
I have tried this with HSS cutoff steel, talonite chunk, soft SS, carbon and powder SS. Not that much difference in speed imo. And i'd say speed is what you want at 1k. 

With that being said i still found some favorites in the bunch.

the king hyper and naniwa hibiki 1k are soakers. And it will takes them i guess close to 1 week to fully dry out. the hyper creates very good contrast and the hibiki removes all contrast between cladding and edge.
The hibiki seems to wear very slowly and the hyper faster but not in any way fast for the grit imo.

in the non soaking area i think the good old Shapton pro1k is the absolute best. I think its the absolute fastest 1k there is, very slow dishing, true s&g. And its cheap. 
The glass is similar fast and even slower wearing, but its only 6-7mm thick. and its usually more expensive. I think the pro will last longer. Maybe not by much but still.
Kunsuto 1k is a cheap 1k and it definitely does the job, don't feel as good as the the rest though, feels very gritty and rough. 
Chosera naniwa pro 800. very good stone. feels very nice, probably the best feeling out of all 1ks. releases a bit of grit as opposed to the shaptons. but not excessive for the work it performs. 

The way i see it is that you either want the nani pro 800 or the shappro 1k. done. taking speed/feel/economy in to consideration. imo get both!


----------



## inferno (May 31, 2019)

JustinP said:


> Even though the Gesshin 1k is getting a lot of love here, I'm kinda leaning towards the Shapton pro. I can get it locally, and I like instant gratification . How would you rate the feedback on it? The 5K gives you nothing. You can see it taking off metal, but can't feel anything. As I said, my current fav stone to finish on is the Morihei Hi 4K. I think 1000-4k would be better than 800-4k. Of course I'm a noob.



the 5k is the worst in the series. the 220, 1k and 2k are pretty much gold stones!! make no mistake.


----------



## inferno (May 31, 2019)

someone said the 2k is a good 1k. and some 2k's are almost as fast as some 1ks. i did a back2back test with the chosera nani pro 1k and the shapton pro2k and while yes the chosera is a bit faster but its very close in speed. but the shappro 2k is still extremely fast. and it gets your steel much much sharper than the 1k chosera ever will. i'd say the chosera 1k is about 40-50% faster than the shapton 2k. but the shapton 2k is at least 100% sharper than the chosera 1k. the 2k shapton pro is the best shapton pro stone they make imo.


----------



## chinacats (May 31, 2019)

inferno said:


> someone said the 2k is a good 1k. and some 2k's are almost as fast as some 1ks. i did a back2back test with the chosera nani pro 1k and the shapton pro2k and while yes the chosera is a bit faster but its very close in speed. but the shappro 2k is still extremely fast. and it gets your steel much much sharper than the 1k chosera ever will. i'd say the chosera 1k is about 40-50% faster than the shapton 2k. but the shapton 2k is at least 100% sharper than the chosera 1k. the 2k shapton pro is the best shapton pro stone they make imo.



He was talking about Gesshin 2k...


----------



## labor of love (May 31, 2019)

Chosera is all about good feeling. If you simply wanna just get your sharpening over with quickly then yeah definitely look elsewhere.
This is why I really like the gesh 1200 it’s a balance of great feedback and cutting ability.


----------



## Knife2meatu (May 31, 2019)

Chosera slurry is pretty particular as well, in my experience.


----------



## inferno (May 31, 2019)

chinacats said:


> He was talking about Gesshin 2k...




I know. I was just trying to make a point as to why someone would recommend a 2k as a 1k.


----------



## inferno (May 31, 2019)

labor of love said:


> Chosera is all about good feeling. If you simply wanna just get your sharpening over with quickly then yeah definitely look elsewhere.
> This is why I really like the gesh 1200 it’s a balance of great feedback and cutting ability.




I would say the choseras are almost as _all biz no fu_n as shapton pros. not much difference to be honest there. both are top quality stones.


----------



## labor of love (May 31, 2019)

If for some reason I don’t feel like jumping from 1k to 6k I’ll use a 2k instead.


----------



## labor of love (May 31, 2019)

I’ve never used chosera 1k but I’m surprised to hear you say it cuts as fast as a shapton pro 1k. If that is infact what you’re saying.


----------



## ojisan (May 31, 2019)

The reviews by inferno are really great!

Morihira stones look quire new (sold since last year?). What I could find was a blog post by the maker. 

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&tl=en&u=https://morihei.exblog.jp/28754380/

Looking good for kasumi finishes.


----------



## valgard (May 31, 2019)

labor of love said:


> I’ve never used chosera 1k but I’m surprised to hear you say it cuts as fast as a shapton pro 1k. If that is infact what you’re saying.


I have used both and I don't think the Chosera is as fast as the Shapton pro.


----------



## panda (May 31, 2019)

chosera 800


----------



## zizirex (Jun 1, 2019)

JustinP said:


> I can't find much info on them. Hitohori has a little more.
> 
> https://hitohira-japan.com/collections/morihei-whetstone/products/aaeaa-020-1000
> 
> ...



1K go for the Morihei Hi, it will give good contrast and cut fast. if you want something cut faster, go with SP 1K.

The Morihei 6k is my fav though... I like it better than the karasu.


----------



## psfred (Jun 1, 2019)

I vote for a Bester 1k or 1200 -- very hard, fast cutting, stays flat a long time, can handle things like A2 well (which is why I bought it, A2 plane blades).

You will be happy with the Shapton though -- in fact, almost all the modern fairly hard stones in the 1k range work well, just a matter of what you prefer. I don't like muddy stones and require minimal wear for sharpening woodworking tools, a little different than knives. Really matters that all the stones in a progression are very flat for plane blades, otherwise you get uneven sharpening on the actual edge. Knives don't have linear edges.....


----------



## Keith Sinclair (Jun 1, 2019)

JustinP said:


> Well, it seems I might need two or three 1k range stones



Medium grit stones are most logical to have several. 

Have quite a few mentioned here


----------



## dough (Jun 1, 2019)

I know above your price range but the diamond 1k is my hands down favorite if I could only have one. I think I have 7 or 8 though.
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/diamond-1000-stone-kit


----------



## daveb (Jun 1, 2019)

The diamond stone (both of them) are definitely up there on my list but priced a little out of norm for a "which stone?" discussion. Now you've got me counting 1K's. Too many.


----------



## Stonetherapy (Jun 2, 2019)

daveb said:


> The diamond stone (both of them) are definitely up there on my list but priced a little out of norm for a "which stone?" discussion. Now you've got me counting 1K's. Too many.



I agree with all but your last sentence @daveb! 
My mind will not process those two words together in a stone discussion, might need a nap...


----------

