# yoshihiro vs sakai takayuki



## petefromNY (Feb 12, 2015)

hey guys im pulling the trigger on a yanagiba in the next coming days. Im purchasing a entry level piece and these are the two ive come up with and have no clue about. Yoshihiro Shiroko High Carbon Steel Kasumi Yanagai Sashimi Chef Knife 10.5" (270mm) and the Sakai Takayuki Kasumitogi Yanagi 270mm (10.6"). I have no experience with either two makers, just the usual questions of f&f and overall what you guys think of them. I appreciate any feedback 

thank you, Pete


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## mhlee (Feb 12, 2015)

petefromNY said:


> hey guys im pulling the trigger on a yanagiba in the next coming days. Im purchasing a entry level piece and these are the two ive come up with and have no clue about. Yoshihiro Shiroko High Carbon Steel Kasumi Yanagai Sashimi Chef Knife 10.5" (270mm) and the Sakai Takayuki Kasumitogi Yanagi 270mm (10.6"). I have no experience with either two makers, just the usual questions of f&f and overall what you guys think of them. I appreciate any feedback
> 
> thank you, Pete



Here's my anecdote about Yoshihiro.

Years ago, I bought a very similar, or possibly the exact same knife you're looking to buy from Yoshihiro. I got it and noticed that the spine was not flat - it curved up starting about 2-3 inches from the tip. The tip was probably 2 mm off of a flat surface. When I asked if this was bent, and, if so, could I get a replacement, Yoshihiro told me that they're all like that, or I could just return it. I returned it.

I've since bought at least 5 single bevel knives in the US and Japan, and inspected dozens more. None of them were bent like that.


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## the_edge (Feb 13, 2015)

mhlee said:


> Here's my anecdote about Yoshihiro.
> 
> Years ago, I bought a very similar, or possibly the exact same knife you're looking to buy from Yoshihiro. I got it and noticed that the spine was not flat - it curved up starting about 2-3 inches from the tip. The tip was probably 2 mm off of a flat surface. When I asked if this was bent, and, if so, could I get a replacement, Yoshihiro told me that they're all like that, or I could just return it. I returned it.
> 
> I've since bought at least 5 single bevel knives in the US and Japan, and inspected dozens more. None of them were bent like that.



I'm not sure I understand. I tried an image search of what you speak and only found Shuns that fit your description. I wouldn't return them for that reason either. Can you elaborate? Did you try using the knife, and found that it didn't function as it should? Did it negatively affect your experience or finished product? How can you say 'none of them were bent like that', if you had to ask if it was bent?

I have a few Gyutos that one could describe as bending up on the spine (I'd call it curving). I consider it a good thing; making it more like a slicing knife (less drag), and having better precision. 

Please elaborate.


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## Keith Sinclair (Feb 13, 2015)

I think he is talking about bent looking down the spine near the tip. It happens sometimes with Yanagiba.

Again I say call Jon at JKI. He offers a 200.00 Uraku white steel Yanagi. It has a lot going for it at that price range. Most sashimi knives under that price are of far lesser quality. It's a crap shoot trying to save money getting a cheap sashimi knife.


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## Matus (Feb 13, 2015)

My understanding so far is that with single bevel knives, one should be very careful when looking for a lower price option as the single bevel allows for more errors on the maker side. I would second the advice to give Jon a call. It just reminds me that I should give him a call soon as well


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## Mortnate (Feb 13, 2015)

I've been using a 270mm yoshihiro Kasumi yanagiba for about 4 years now. I also experienced a small bend toward the soft iron side of the blade, about last inch or so of the tip. Not really a problem and I've read of single bevel knives by many makers doing this. Certain venders can straighten them if it becomes an issue. I will say there was a few high and low spot on the bevel, but nothing that wasn't beyond what I was able to flatten out on a course stone. I also own a Shimatani and I like that the spine is thinner on the Yoshihiro. Maybe consider getting the blue steel hon kasumi yanagi by Yoshihiro, might be worth the little extra for better fit and finish, or contact Jon as stated in the post before mine. Jon's also has an upgraded octagonal handle. 

Can't comment on your other possible option as I don't have experience with it. 






Picture showing the slight bend. I haven't noticed any performance issues from it. Spine is very straight otherwise. I only slightly notice it when sharpening the ura.

Hope this helps. Any other questions about this knife I'll help if I can.


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## mhlee (Feb 13, 2015)

the_edge said:


> I'm not sure I understand. I tried an image search of what you speak and only found Shuns that fit your description. I wouldn't return them for that reason either. Can you elaborate? Did you try using the knife, and found that it didn't function as it should? Did it negatively affect your experience or finished product? How can you say 'none of them were bent like that', if you had to ask if it was bent?
> 
> I have a few Gyutos that one could describe as bending up on the spine (I'd call it curving). I consider it a good thing; making it more like a slicing knife (less drag), and having better precision.
> 
> Please elaborate.



We're not talking gyutos.


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## mhlee (Feb 13, 2015)

Mortnate said:


> I've been using a 270mm yoshihiro Kasumi yanagiba for about 4 years now. I also experienced a small bend toward the soft iron side of the blade, about last inch or so of the tip. Not really a problem and I've read of single bevel knives by many makers doing this. Certain venders can straighten them if it becomes an issue. I will say there was a few high and low spot on the bevel, but nothing that wasn't beyond what I was able to flatten out on a course stone. I also own a Shimatani and I like that the spine is thinner on the Yoshihiro. Maybe consider getting the blue steel hon kasumi yanagi by Yoshihiro, might be worth the little extra for better fit and finish, or contact Jon as stated in the post before mine. Jon's also has an upgraded octagonal handle.
> 
> Can't comment on your other possible option as I don't have experience with it.
> 
> ...



That's not the soft side. The ura side is the core steel (or mostly core steel). 

Yes, some makers do that. That doesn't mean it's right. The more expensive single bevel knives I own have completely flat (or nearly completely flat) ura.


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## JBroida (Feb 13, 2015)

mhlee said:


> That's not the soft side. The ura side is the core steel (or mostly core steel).
> 
> Yes, some makers do that. That doesn't mean it's right. The more expensive single bevel knives I have are completely flat (or nearly completely flat) ura.



mike- i think you might have misunderstood him... he was saying the bend is towards the soft steel side, which is correct if the ura is lifting up off of the surface.

@mortnate that being said, this kind of bend does actually cause problems with sharpening the tip on the bevel side in the long run, and you should probably have the knife straightened out before additional sharpening. (however, its not a particularly big problem in this case)


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## Mortnate (Feb 13, 2015)

Thanks for the reply Jon. I notice I'm lifting up when approaching the tip when sharpening the ura to keep in contact with the stone. I do see how this will be an issue in the long run. I'm considering having you straighten it, but I'm also currently looking for an upgrade and will be buying something soon, and depending on how often I'll still use this knife, determines when the straightening procedure will be done. I'll message you when the time comes. 

Still hoping someone has input on a Sakai Takayuki. I'm curious myself. I have my eye on Masamoto, Gesshin Hide, or higher grade Yoshihiro. It might be a step up from what the original poster is looking for, however after working with entry level single bevels, I'm under the impression it's better to wait and go the next step if possible. Less problems to frustrate yourself over on the stones, and better fit and finish.


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## Mortnate (Feb 14, 2015)

Jon, I reread what you posted. Realized how this is a problem on the bevel side as well. If I understand correctly... a bent single bevel tip, an over grind may develop due to the bent part contacting the stone more then the rest of the bevel. I'll keep an eye on this next time I sharpen.


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