# masamoto ks owners!



## jai (Mar 22, 2013)

hey guys to all you masamoto ks owner what is the patina usally like visually on this knife is it pretty or more on the dull side and if anyone has pics please feel free to show them im very interested thanks


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## K-Fed (Mar 22, 2013)

I don't own a ks but I have had a few white steel knives. The patina really depends on what you are cutting. Blues and purples from proteins and onions, citrus, acidic fruits produce more of a grey patina.


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## Vladimir (Mar 22, 2013)




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## chinacats (Mar 22, 2013)

That has to be one of the nicest lineups of knives ever!


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## schanop (Mar 22, 2013)

This was the last patina before I sold the KS.


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## Anpanman (Mar 23, 2013)

It goes from dull gray to rather radiant colors depending of the light. I have been cutting a little bit of everything with mine and this is what it looks like today. Avatar is KS too.


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## jayhay (Mar 23, 2013)

Here's mine. Takes a nice blue patina.


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## NO ChoP! (Mar 24, 2013)

A little faux honyaki patina; pre Henry handle....


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## schanop (Mar 24, 2013)

That's one of a hell creativity!


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## marc4pt0 (Mar 24, 2013)

:notworthy:


NO ChoP! said:


> A little faux honyaki patina; pre Henry handle....View attachment 14125



I'm always playing with patina on my carbons, but I have to say this is rich! Would you mind sharing your secret? :begging:


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## Dave Martell (Mar 24, 2013)

NO ChoP! said:


> A little faux honyaki patina; pre Henry handle....View attachment 14125




:ggodjob:


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## NO ChoP! (Mar 24, 2013)

Thanks guys! A little silly, but fun.

It's just the standard mustard thinned with a touch of vinegar and painted on with one of my kids cheap watercolor brushes. I also wipe the face with some cows blood to emulate the honyaki rainbow laquer.


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## Mike9 (Mar 24, 2013)

Ha Ha - sweet!! Hey Chris - getting a patina on that Ontario yet? My Goodell is coloring up fast. Damn - this is a great knife!!!


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## NO ChoP! (Mar 24, 2013)

Oh Yah, its taking a nice brilliant blue. I still can't get over how light and nimble it is, especially being so old.


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## vai777 (Mar 27, 2013)

NO ChoP! said:


> A little faux honyaki patina; pre Henry handle....View attachment 14125



awesome


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## NO ChoP! (Mar 29, 2013)

Here it is with Mikes Russian Bog oak, Russian birch burl handle...


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## gentlecook (Mar 29, 2013)

wOw , its so exotic =)


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## daddy yo yo (May 2, 2013)

i am trying, desperately, not to pull the trigger... but then again, i want to shorten my waiting time for my marko custom gyuto a little... 

how do you guys describe the profile of the KS? it seems to be quite flat, no?


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## rdpx (May 2, 2013)

daddy yo yo said:


> i am trying, desperately, not to pull the trigger... but then again, i want to shorten my waiting time for my marko custom gyuto a little...
> 
> how do you guys describe the profile of the KS? it seems to be quite flat, no?




Are you thinking about getting the 252mm KS suji over in the FOR SALE thread?

It is a great price - I wouldn't hesitate were it not for fact I had just ordered a Misono that is on a plane as I type...

[EDIT - ooops sorry if I got hopes up I see it just sold. Someone got a good deal]


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## stevenStefano (May 2, 2013)

Yeah the profile is super flat, that's one of the reasons why I got rid of mine


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## daddy yo yo (May 2, 2013)

rdpx said:


> Are you thinking about getting the 252mm KS suji over in the FOR SALE thread?


no, i am actually interested in the 240mm gyuto...



stevenStefano said:


> Yeah the profile is super flat, that's one of the reasons why I got rid of mine


that's what i expected... i am not into superflat... but hey, then i don't have to buy that one. you helped me save money, thanks a lot!!!


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## NO ChoP! (May 2, 2013)

I would actually say the spine has less curvature than normal, making the tip very lean and pointy. The edge does have some belly, just not a ton. If you do a lot of tip work, the KS is hands down a great knife.


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## jgraeff (May 2, 2013)

I didn't find it too flat at all great profile overall IMO


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## stevenStefano (May 2, 2013)

I know everyone says the profile is great and all, but I really did not like it. Too flat and not tall enough though I am aware that there is some variation from one to another


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## labor of love (May 2, 2013)

I like the profile, my problem was the blade height. Mine was very used when I purchased it,it almost felt like a suji.


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## cclin (May 2, 2013)

labor of love said:


> I like the profile, my problem was the blade height. Mine was very used when I purchased it,it almost felt like a suji.



labor, what is your ks' heel height?? mine ks never sharping is about 49mm....


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## mpukas (May 2, 2013)

The height of Don's pass-around 270 KS is about 52mm at the heel.


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## labor of love (May 2, 2013)

I dunno. I sold it. It was probably 45mm or so. I prefer tall gyutos anyway.


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## jgraeff (May 2, 2013)

Ya the one I used was plenty like 50mm

Mario hybrid is barley 45mm and I find that plenty as well... If you get smaller handle which I actually like after getting used to it height isn't as import


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## Johnny.B.Good (May 2, 2013)

My 240mm (actually, 250mm) KS gyuto is 48mm at the heel.


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## daddy yo yo (May 3, 2013)

well, i have been looking at pics of KS gyutos for a while and i had always asked me if it just looked rather flat or if it really was rather flat. it's enough that some people find it rather flat... i am sure i wouldn't like the profile then...


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## mpukas (May 3, 2013)

The KS is definitely flatter than most "standard" gyuto's, but it's not so flat that you can't rock it, if you want to use it that way. It's not dead flat from the heel forward, and has an ever so slight curve, which is it saving grace. Being that it is so flat, the tip is lower to the board, and having such a pointy tip, makes it very easy to use. It's actually no where near as flat as the Moritaka kiri-gyuto - I find it too flat and almost unusable. No fun to use for me.


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## dannynyc (May 8, 2013)

Can anyone compare the ks profile to the Richmond ultimatum and/or the Konosuked funayuki shape (in terms of flatness)?


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## Pensacola Tiger (May 8, 2013)

dannynyc said:


> Can anyone compare the ks profile to the Richmond ultimatum and/or the Konosuked funayuki shape (in terms of flatness)?



The Ultimatum profile is a direct copy of the Masamoto KS. The geometry, though, is completely different.


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## labor of love (May 8, 2013)

DannyNYC, check out the grind shot comparison photos mpukas took in the masamoto pass around. He compares a 270mm masamoto to a 240 Sakai Yusuke ks clone. Pretty sure the ultimatum grind is much thicker overall.


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## Pensacola Tiger (May 8, 2013)

Here are choil shots of the Masamoto KS and the Ultimatum. Guess which is which.


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## Marko Tsourkan (May 8, 2013)

It goes without saying, Rick - LOL.

To get best of your Masamato KS, one needs to thin 10mm or so above the edge. Lay the blade flat on a Bester 500 or equivalent, press with your finger above the edge, and thin both sides until factory bevel is gone. Tip on KS very much of need of thinning. You will need to refinish the blade afterwards. A bit of work, I know but you will be getting a good improvement in performance.

M


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## mpukas (May 8, 2013)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> The Ultimatum profile is a direct copy of the Masamoto KS. The geometry, though, is completely different.



I had purchased - and returned immediately - a 52100 Ultimatum from the first batch. One of the things I didn't like about it was that it really wasn't a very good copy of the KS. Sure it was flat from the heel forward to about the 1/2 point - DEAD flat, which too me is too flat, and the KS and Yusuke KS-clone are not - but at the last bit towards the tip I thought that it turned upwards too much. Maybe I'm remembering it wrongly. PT - can you post a comparison shot of the tip profiles?


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## dannynyc (May 8, 2013)

That's a dramatic difference!


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## Marko Tsourkan (May 8, 2013)

mpukas said:


> I had purchased - and returned immediately - a 52100 Ultimatum from the first batch. One of the things I didn't like about it was that it really wasn't a very good copy of the KS. Sure it was flat from the heel forward to about the 1/2 point - DEAD flat, which too me is too flat, and the KS and Yusuke KS-clone are not - but at the last bit towards the tip I thought that it turned upwards too much. Maybe I'm remembering it wrongly. PT - can you post a comparison shot of the tip profiles?



The flat spot on KS is not 1/2, it's shorter.


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## cclin (May 8, 2013)

Marko Tsourkan said:


> The flat spot on KS is not 1/2, it's shorter.



The flat spot on brand new, never sharping 240mm KS...


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## Pensacola Tiger (May 8, 2013)

mpukas said:


> I had purchased - and returned immediately - a 52100 Ultimatum from the first batch. One of the things I didn't like about it was that it really wasn't a very good copy of the KS. Sure it was flat from the heel forward to about the 1/2 point - DEAD flat, which too me is too flat, and the KS and Yusuke KS-clone are not - but at the last bit towards the tip I thought that it turned upwards too much. Maybe I'm remembering it wrongly. PT - can you post a comparison shot of the tip profiles?








Masamoto on bottom.


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## mpukas (May 8, 2013)

Thanks for the pic, PT. That's a much better looking tip on the Ultimatum than the one I had.


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## mpukas (May 8, 2013)

Marko Tsourkan said:


> The flat spot on KS is not 1/2, it's shorter.



Yes, I know - I'm referring to the flat spot on the Ultimatum and how was different than the KS.


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## Slipstenar (Jun 9, 2019)

daddy yo yo said:


> i am trying, desperately, not to pull the trigger... but then again, i want to shorten my waiting time for my marko custom gyuto a little...
> 
> how do you guys describe the profile of the KS? it seems to be quite flat, no?



Well I had the luck to win a masamoto KS 240 gyuto, and in my opinion it's crap.. The grind is so uneven and needs like 4 hours of thinning to even get close to cut as all of my other knives.


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## DitmasPork (Jun 9, 2019)

Slipstenar said:


> Well I had the luck to win a masamoto KS 240 gyuto, and in my opinion it's crap.. The grind is so uneven and needs like 4 hours of thinning to even get close to cut as all of my other knives.


Sounds like you got a problematic one, sorry to hear that. Is it one of the newer ones? Mine, circa 2013 if quite good.


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## chinacats (Jun 9, 2019)

At least you didn't pay for it...


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## Jville (Jun 10, 2019)

Slipstenar said:


> Well I had the luck to win a masamoto KS 240 gyuto, and in my opinion it's crap.. The grind is so uneven and needs like 4 hours of thinning to even get close to cut as all of my other knives.


I only had one, but the grind was nice. A little laserish but nice.


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## Michi (Jun 10, 2019)

Mine is OK. It's a very plain knife. Nothing much to say, really. White #2 mono steel. Simple.

F&F on mine is OK, but not brilliant. I received it with a very faint grind mark running for about three inches on one side. You have to look closely to spot it, so it's not a big deal. Handle is fine, but nothing to write home about. Very simple D-shaped handle with Ho wood and a simple buffalo horn ferrule. Same basic handle that you see on hundreds of other knives.

The profile is nice though. It just works, whether I'm pull-cutting, push-cutting, rocking, or chopping. And the tip is stiff and fine enough to do detail work. The profile is what makes a KS shine. The laser-ish grind is solid enough to do reasonably heavy work, but thin enough for it to fall through carrots with ease. Food release is OK, but not brilliant, IMO.

The one thing that sucks is how easily it rusts. I pulled mine out on the weekend after it sat in the drawer (in its Saya) for ten or maybe fourteen days. I was dismayed to find a whole bunch of red rust spots in a long line on one side. Bugger  It was fairly short work to get rid of the rust, so not a big deal. But, personally, I'm not a fan of knives that rust this easily. Not really suitable for Brisbane climate. It's Tsubaki oil from now on before the KS goes back into the Saya (which is a pain, because I need to wash the oil off before using the knife, and then put it back on before putting the knife away).


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## chinacats (Jun 10, 2019)

Personally, i think the rust is probably not related to ks... it's just a mono white 2... likely more related to 1) storing in saya when 2) knife wasn't completely dry.

Grinds can be all over the place with the newer ones being a bit more consistent, though generally thinner than the older models.

As stated above, profile is why people desire these...


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## parbaked (Jun 10, 2019)

Michi said:


> The one thing that sucks is how easily it rusts. Not really suitable for Brisbane climate.



As already stated your rust is really a result of storing a carbon blade in the saya.
Saya are for transporting, NOT storing your knife.
Either use the knife regularly or store it in its box with the VCI paper.

As far as being suitable for your climate, Japan is almost as humid as Brisbane...


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## Slipstenar (Jun 10, 2019)

DitmasPork said:


> Sounds like you got a problematic one, sorry to hear that. Is it one of the newer ones? Mine, circa 2013 if quite good.



Mine is from around 2016 or 2017 I believe. 
It has a perfect grind 2/3 from the heel and forward but the last 1/3 is horrible, thick direct behind the edge so it cuts like a bar of chocolate.


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## labor of love (Jun 10, 2019)

Slipstenar said:


> Mine is from around 2016 or 2017 I believe.
> It has a perfect grind 2/3 from the heel and forward but the last 1/3 is horrible, thick direct behind the edge so it cuts like a bar of chocolate.


Good lord. I’ve handled Atleast half a dozen KSs made between 2016-to present and none of them performed that way.
This reminds me of all the raving I did for Wakui and how crazy thin they are. Only to find out not all of them were as thin as my specimens.
BTW I don’t doubt you, sounds like you just got a lemon.


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## Jville (Jun 10, 2019)

Slipstenar said:


> Mine is from around 2016 or 2017 I believe.
> It has a perfect grind 2/3 from the heel and forward but the last 1/3 is horrible, thick direct behind the edge so it cuts like a bar of chocolate.



Thats interesting. Could you post a pic? Also, does it cut like dark or milk chocolate?


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## chinacats (Jun 10, 2019)

Maybe that's why someone gave it away?


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## Michi (Jun 10, 2019)

chinacats said:


> Personally, i think the rust is probably not related to ks... it's just a mono white 2... likely more related to 1) storing in saya when 2) knife wasn't completely dry.


Yes, the rust isn't the fault of the KS, it'll happen with any white steel knife. I was just having a little rant… 

I'm usually very careful about making sure things are dry before I pack them away. I might have been careless that time.

I have the knife in a Saya because it lives in a drawer. (I'm out of room in my knife block.) I wouldn't have thought that the Saya would make it rust more easily. Maybe I'm wrong there. The other option would be a plastic knife guard. But the felt covering on that would absorb moisture even more easily and make rust more likely, I expect?


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## chinacats (Jun 10, 2019)

Sounds like you should either invest in tsubiki oil or as suggested store in the original box w vci paper...sayas are definitely not the best option (nor the lined plastic ones).


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## Jville (Jun 10, 2019)

Michi said:


> Yes, the rust isn't the fault of the KS, it'll happen with any white steel knife. I was just having a little rant…
> 
> I'm usually very careful about making sure things are dry before I pack them away. I might have been careless that time.
> 
> I have the knife in a Saya because it lives in a drawer. (I'm out of room in my knife block.) I wouldn't have thought that the Saya would make it rust more easily. Maybe I'm wrong there. The other option would be a plastic knife guard. But the felt covering on that would make absorb moisture even more easily and make rust more likely, I expect?



I store lots of knives in sayas without issue. The felt knifeguard will be way worst imo, do not do that. I have had issues with knife guards, especially felt. The vci paper works good, if you are still having issues with the saya.


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## labor of love (Jun 10, 2019)

I don’t know what VCI paper is...bout of curiosity is it thin enough to wrap around a knife before you place it in the saya?


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## Nemo (Jun 10, 2019)

labor of love said:


> I don’t know what VCI paper is...bout of curiosity is it thin enough to wrap around a knife before you place it in the saya?


It's just the brown anti rust paper that new knives are often shipped in. I guess you might be a le to fit it inside a (loose fitting) saya, but I never tried.


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## labor of love (Jun 10, 2019)

Hell I’ll do it with my San mai, couldn’t hurt.


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## Jville (Jun 10, 2019)

labor of love said:


> I don’t know what VCI paper is...bout of curiosity is it thin enough to wrap around a knife before you place it in the saya?


Depends on how loose the saya and how neatly wrapped.


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## bahamaroot (Jun 10, 2019)

I have some knives stored in a drawer wrapped in VCI paper and then slid into a thin cardboard sleeve like some knives are shipped in.


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## Slipstenar (Jun 11, 2019)

chinacats said:


> At least you didn't pay for it...




Thats true, but the price for such a knife is waaay off. A mono steel gyuto that is so hyped should be perfect in shape and grind. I dont have anything against the profile of the knife, but the grind is not good. I will have to fix it some day, but there are too many knives in the drawer so this knife isnt being used as much.


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## Nemo (Jun 11, 2019)

Slipstenar said:


> A mono steel gyuto that is so hyped should be perfect in shape and grind.



Only if you believe that reality shouild reflect hype.


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## LucasFur (Jun 11, 2019)

Very interesting you have this issue. When you were awarded, is there any chance the knife was bent/ re-profiled / re-ground?


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