# How old are pre-Sabatier Trompettes?



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 6, 2016)

I just acquired a pre-Sabatier Trompette chef's knife. Can someone lead me to a history of Trompette knives and if this manufacturer merged with one of the Sabatier houses, or did Sabatier market their own knives (starting around 1874) using the La Trompette name? Is it possible to tell how old, at the least, a La Trompette without the Sabatier stamp
might be?

Thank you
Pfeifermaschinenbau


----------



## Benuser (Oct 6, 2016)

La Trompette is the trade mark used by Jean Auguste Sabatier. His knives were amongst the best of his time.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 6, 2016)

https://s19.postimg.org/qn5tu0pcz/image.jpg


----------



## Benuser (Oct 6, 2016)

http://www.sabatier.com/gb/ancetres/histoire.html


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 6, 2016)

Benuser said:


> La Trompette is the trade mark used by Jean Auguste Sabatier. His knives were amongst the best of his time.



Thank you for the links! It appears Jean Auguste Sabatier started using the La Trompette trademark round 1874. Do you know when his manufactory began stamping both "LaTrompette," and "Sabatier" on the same blade?


----------



## Benuser (Oct 6, 2016)

Pfeifermaschinenbau said:


> Thank you for the links! It appears Jean Auguste Sabatier started using the La Trompette trademark round 1874. Do you know when his manufactory began stamping both "LaTrompette," and "Sabatier" on the same blade?







Only seen it with this stainless from the fifties, meant for the North American market.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 6, 2016)

Could you send us some photos of your new acquisition?


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 17, 2016)

I'd really like to, but for some reason I cannot post attachments.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 17, 2016)

But you may post a link to your image host, e.g. postimage.org


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 17, 2016)

https://scontent.ftul1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/t31.0-8/14633336_10209316397900273_3101947651639352974_o.jpg


----------



## Benuser (Oct 17, 2016)

Wow! What a beauty...
It seems in really excellent shape, none of the very, very common issues here. I hope you didn't pay a fortune. 

Just for fun: by the same maker, from la Belle Époque, a Falcon, small carbon steel knife, solid silver, partially gold plated, given to a boy at the occasion of his solemn communion, a Roman-Catholic ritual.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 17, 2016)

Curiously, it won't be easy to establish with certainty your knife's age. I only recently heard of Nogent blades made even in the fifties. It won't be simple to say whether it is from 1890 or 1936, if it has been made with an old school rat-tail tang and an ebony handle.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 17, 2016)

http://m.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Chefs...abatier-Carbon-Steel-/381794142491?nav=SEARCH

That's how they usually come.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 17, 2016)

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/f...-Levine-s-Knife-Collecting-amp-Identification


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 18, 2016)

Thank you. I really like the shape and light weight of this knife. It is more gracile than my more modern German cooking knives, which are enjoyed as well, but ever since seeing this blade shape on a cooking show I was hooked. It was not inexpensive, but justified it as a 50th birthday present to myself.


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 18, 2016)

That knife screams Belle Époque! Thank you for sharing.


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 18, 2016)

The finger guard has concentric machining marks with the tang as the epicenter. Some of these have been ground away, but I am nearly certain that the tang was machined in a lathe. It might make this knife younger than I was imagining.


----------



## Benuser (Oct 18, 2016)

Could you make a photo of the handle's butt?
When it's the original handle, in Levine's words:
The tang would have been longer than the handle, peened over a tiny nickel silver burr at the butt end. 
Also very thin.
The original ebony handles tend to split, because they are bored down the center with a large diameter hole, leaving just a thin web of wood on the sides. They look solid, but they're not.


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 18, 2016)

Yes, I'll take a photo and post it. Indeed, the end of the tang is very thin and appears to be peened at the butt end. I think I'll take the knife to work tomorrow and make an X-ray of it for fun, and hopefully see the dimensions and geometry of the tang, and any gaps between the tang and the handle.


----------



## Dave Martell (Oct 19, 2016)

According to Goins' Encyclopedia of Cutlery Markings

La Trompette c.1846-1941 - A trademark used by Societe Anonyme



According to Levine's Guide to Knives and Their Values (4th Edition)

"In the United States up through World War I, the standard French-made sabatier chef knife was the Trumpet Brand, _La Trompette. _Goins states that this was J. A. (John Augustine) Sabatier's own brand, and remained in his family until 1920. From 1920-1941, it belonged to a Louis S. M. Pouzet. Trumpet sabatiers have high quality lightweight blades, but their one piece ebony handles are weak and brittle."


----------



## Pfeifermaschinenbau (Oct 19, 2016)

Thank you Benuser and Dave Martell! It seems my knife was made sometime between 1920 and 1941! I took it to work today and made a radiography of it (see enclosed image). Like Benuser said, the tang is very thin and one can clearly see empty space between the (rather crooked) tang and the wall of the bore through the handle. It appears that the part of the tang that goes through the ferrule has been machined on a lathe.








https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...3&set=a.1262155767326.37781.1632663205&type=3


----------



## Dave Martell (Oct 19, 2016)

You're welcome.

BTW, your link doesn't work.


----------

