# Impressions of Konosuke Fujiyama Blue #2 Gyuto 210mm?



## jacko9 (Dec 17, 2015)

Anybody have experience with this knife? Is it worth the price compared to similar or compatible offerings?

Jack


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## jklip13 (Dec 17, 2015)

I have a blue super 270 Gyuto in the same line and the thing is awesome, in my opinion its more than worth the price.


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## J_Style (Dec 17, 2015)

I had a 240. Own a white 240 and a Kono HD. The blue is worth the price and then some. I always thought they were way undervalued. Only sold it to fund a 2x72 grinder


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## ThEoRy (Dec 17, 2015)

It is a nice blade.


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## inzite (Dec 18, 2015)

supposed to be good, since they often sell quick quickly on "some site"


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## OneS (Dec 18, 2015)

I have the one Tosho sells. Have only had it 3 months so early impressions but love it. Just waiting for a 270 version to come on sale.


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## Asteger (Dec 18, 2015)

I'll disagree with what's been said so far. I've just had one Kono Fujiyama (Blue2 240mm) but was not a big fan. Yes, a 'nice blade' but one I think that's made above all to look good with its nice finish and wide bevels and clear straight shinogi. 

You'd think it'd be an easy knife to maintain, just thinning along the wide bevel and then tending to the edge. The wide bevel and clear, uniform shinogi are machined and polished on, however, and do not reflect the real contours/geometry, which come out as soon as you put it to the stones along the wide bevel. The one I had was ground irregularly, kind of like you'd expect with a cheap KU nakiri. The front of the blade was especially bad, with the natural shinogi waving toward the tip away from the superficial shinogi and bevel curing upward to the spine. (The problems were more so on the front/right side of the blade where geometry features more, rather than the flatter back.)

The blade also didn't cut well and needed thinning. (I wasn't the first owner and maybe previously only the edge had been sharpened, with no thinning to maintain geometry. (However, I think the knife was only used lightly before and when I had it it was not very different from being new.) Thickness was more pronounced toward the front half of the blade, I thought, which was too thick and had extra steel/mass. I felt if more effort had been put into creating the right taper and getting the geometry right, instead of a snazy polished wide bevel + shinogi, with too much thickness left above the shinogi, then you'd have a better knife. 

Overall, my impression is these are overrated/overpriced for what they are, designed to look good and appeal to international buyers who go for a good finish, polished spines, etc. The performance was disappointing and, if you look to thin as you go and maintain geometry over time, not just sharpen the edge, while still trying to keep a knife that's supposed to look good looking good (ie. without grind problems revealled, and with that uniform shinogi maintained which isn't possible when the grind is irregular) then this knife would be a pain. :bat:


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## inzite (Dec 18, 2015)

Asteger said:


> I'll disagree with what's been said so far. I've just had one Kono Fujiyama (Blue2 240mm) but was not a big fan. Yes, a 'nice blade' but one I think that's made above all to look good with its nice finish and wide bevels and clear straight shinogi.
> 
> You'd think it'd be an easy knife to maintain, just thinning along the wide bevel and then tending to the edge. The wide bevel and clear, uniform shinogi are machined and polished on, however, and do not reflect the real contours/geometry, which come out as soon as you put it to the stones along the wide bevel. The one I had was ground irregularly, kind of like you'd expect with a cheap KU nakiri. The front of the blade was especially bad, with the natural shinogi waving toward the tip away from the superficial shinogi and bevel curing upward to the spine. (The problems were more so on the front/right side of the blade where geometry features more, rather than the flatter back.)
> 
> ...



great insights!


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## marc4pt0 (Dec 18, 2015)

I had one but wasn't 100% in love w/ it so I sold it. After I sold it I started to regret it, go figure. But then I got a 240 Blue #2 Syousin Sakura, in fact I think I was the first one to jump on this newer line earlier this year when James released it. I put it up against the Kono 240 I sold to a buddy of mine and we both agreed the Sakura is a much better performer. 
Take in mind that was just _our_ thoughts, and for what it's worth that same buddy of mine still has and uses the Kono on a regular basis. I doubt he'll ever sell it.


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## Smurfmacaw (Dec 18, 2015)

Don't mean to jack the thread but.....Marc, have you sharpened the Syousin yet? Just wondering if the bevel is flat or if it takes a couple of times on the stones to get them really flat. (they are sand blasted so it's hard to tell.) Great performer though, as good as my shig's. Blue super seems to hold it's edge well, I haven't had the urge to sharpen it yet anyway. My wife likes it a lot too and commented on how well it cuts. (interesting picture, 5 foot tall woman running around the kitchen with a 240 gyuto in her hands lol). The only two wide (or single) bevel knives I've had that had truly flat bevels are the shig's and the Haburn. I've heard the Heiji's are flat but I've not had one of those.


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## chinacats (Dec 18, 2015)

Smurfmacaw said:


> I've heard the Heiji's are flat but I've not had one of those.



Heijis are slightly concave on the wide bevel...though in my experience very consistent.


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## Asteger (Dec 18, 2015)

Smurfmacaw said:


> ..have you sharpened the Syousin yet? Just wondering if the bevel is flat or if it takes a couple of times on the stones to get them really flat. (they are sand blasted so it's hard to tell.)



It's another thing with this style of knife. The wide bevels must be ground with a grinding wheel and the bevels end up concave. You can't see the contours because the bevels are polished to look uniform. If the grind's done uniformly, then when you try the wide bevels on your stones you'll see the untouched lower area in the middle between near the edge and the shinogi going consistently along the blade road (and if the grind is wonky like on my Kono this is a mess) and so the finish won't look good after you thin unless you polish the whole bevel with sandpaper/fingerstones/etc. Either that, or you can spend some time evening the bevels on your stones so you get rid of the concavity. I guess the concavity gives more thinness above the edge and could help with food release at first, so you'd be losing some of this if you smooth/flatten the bevels yourself and over time you wouldn't be able to maintain the concavity anyway. The catch with knives like these I think is that their wide-bevelled looks are a big selling point, but you can't maintain the original finish easily once you go beyond touching up the edge only, unless you're also good and polishing and re-finishing. You can't maintain the knife by only sharpening the edge, though.

My Kono had an irregular grind and so you couldn't maintain the shinogi either, unless you spend hours thinning and raising the shinogi to correct it, and of course you'll need the face above the shinogi to be uniform too (which I don't think it was on my knife - another thing to correct). On the other hand, I'd hope the Sakura wouldn't have this irregularity and I haven't tried one. I tried a Kagekiyo which has this style of build and it was pretty consitent, though too thin/light for me, and it also had the concavity on the wide bevels which was showed when put to the stones. Both the Sakura and Kagekiyo cost more than the Kono and are quite expensive, but I still think the Kono's overpriced based on the one I had.



chinacats said:


> Heijis are slightly concave on the wide bevel...though in my experience very consistent.



I've got one, and no problems with mine. Narrower bevels on the gyuto than the others, though, and so sharpening/maintaince is more straightfoward and finish/looks isn't the big selling point with Heiji like it is with the Kono/Kagekiyo/Sakura.


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## marc4pt0 (Dec 18, 2015)

I've touched up the Sakura, but did so at about a 13-15 degree angle on the stones. The knife came extremely sharp and held its edge for a while. After it lost some of its bite I just opened it up on the stones and hit it with the ol' micro bevel.

For wide bevel sharpening, I don't have a lot of experience. I had a Kochi stainless clad 240 gyuto and used it quite often. It started to lose its cutting magic so I decided to embark on this style of sharpening. First couple of attempts were not that stellar. I did notice the concave grind to the bevel. So I started to mess around with that and ended up leveling it out a bit. This did bring back some of that Kochi Magic, but not entirely.


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## Asteger (Dec 18, 2015)

marc4pt0 said:


> For wide bevel sharpening, I don't have a lot of experience. I had a Kochi stainless clad 240 gyuto and used it quite often. It started to lose its cutting magic so I decided to embark on this style of sharpening. First couple of attempts were not that stellar. I did notice the concave grind to the bevel. So I started to mess around with that and ended up leveling it out a bit. This did bring back some of that Kochi Magic, but not entirely.



Sounds like you let it get too thick above the edge and it still needs more thinning. 

My general impression is that these types of gyuto with clear shinogi and wide bevels don't have the best geometry for cutting and moving through things, but the advantage should be that thinning and maintenance is more straightforward. It's definitely the case with my Heiji, but with the more expensively finished and aesthetic knives like the Kono you can quickly lose what you pay a lot extra for (the finish) if you just do routine maintenance (thinning when sharpening).


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## jacko9 (Dec 18, 2015)

Thanks for the information. A Konosuke Fujiyama Blue #2 came up on a site so, I went ahead and ordered it since it's so rarely available. I already have a Konosuke 240mm HD2 Gyuto and a Teruyasu Fujiwara Nashiji 240mm Gyuto so I decided that I would go with a 210mm Gyuto. I'm a home cook and woodworker so I already have many sharpening stones to thin if I need to go through that step.

Thanks for the insight and I'll report back when I have had the chance to use the knife with any concerns/issues.

Jack


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## Dardeau (Dec 18, 2015)

Neither of the Heijis I currently own came to me very concaved . My 210s bevels were actually very near to dead flat when I got it, I convexed the right side to release a little better and it has stayed that way. I only sharpened the 240 a couple of times, but didn't hit any of those convex holes you see in other wise bevel knives. I had a Sakai Ichimonji that looked for all the work like a Fujiyama and it had cosmetic holes all through the grind. It cut really well, but I never got it to look nice.


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## HomeCook (Dec 19, 2015)

Asteger said:


> You'd think it'd be an easy knife to maintain, just thinning along the wide bevel and then tending to the edge. The wide bevel and clear, uniform shinogi are machined and polished on, however, and do not reflect the real contours/geometry, which come out as soon as you put it to the stones along the wide bevel. The one I had was ground irregularly, kind of like you'd expect with a cheap KU nakiri. The front of the blade was especially bad, with the natural shinogi waving toward the tip away from the superficial shinogi and bevel curing upward to the spine.



Have you seen or handled any others, or heard from other Fujiyama owners? I guess what I'm wondering is if this is standard for the line, or if you just happened to get a one-off dud?


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## Asteger (Dec 19, 2015)

HomeCook said:


> Have you seen or handled any others, or heard from other Fujiyama owners? I guess what I'm wondering is if this is standard for the line, or if you just happened to get a one-off dud?



Nope just the one for me, as said in the same post. I have heard a few comments, though, where owners maybe get their new Konos and are happy and impressed, but then commentary slows when it comes to how well the knife performs (aside from the usual 'scary sharp' etc) and how easy it is to maintain, which is an overlooked characteristic I think. After the recent posts, I also got a PM along these lines.

At any rate, I'm not interested in being a Konosuke critic. Just interested in discussion and people's reactions, beyond the usual comments on F&F and all that. Often people fawn over knives but don't go much into how things can be disappointing too. It could be that with a knife like this, with its rep, maybe people get them and are glad and happy with the looks but maybe this fades and the knifes don't seem to have any special magic beyond that, and I wouldn't be surprised. People also want to like their pricey knives and maybe it's hard to critique how they might be better.


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## jklip13 (Dec 19, 2015)

I definitely think people are slow to criticize the knives they spend so much on and love, but others are often too quick to put things in black and white. HRC is quantitative, and so is weight and length, but how something performs when cutting and how an individual feels it can be maintained is all subjective. The point of these forums I think is to express our opinions, but that's ultimately all we can provide. Getting back to the Konosuke Fujiyama, they are good knives for sure, but not everyone's cup of tea. They sure are mine though.


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## 420layersofdank (Dec 19, 2015)

marc4pt0 said:


> I had one but wasn't 100% in love w/ it so I sold it. After I sold it I started to regret it, go figure. But then I got a 240 Blue #2 Syousin Sakura, in fact I think I was the first one to jump on this newer line earlier this year when James released it. I put it up against the Kono 240 I sold to a buddy of mine and we both agreed the Sakura is a much better performer.
> Take in mind that was just _our_ thoughts, and for what it's worth that same buddy of mine still has and uses the Kono on a regular basis. I doubt he'll ever sell it.



I WILL NEVVERRRRRRR EVERRRRR SELL IT !!!! ITS GOING WITH ME TO MY GRAVE B


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## alwayssharp (Dec 19, 2015)

I have a pair, suji and gyuto.
They are my favorite knives!
The steel is a joy to sharpen and polish! It does patina from time to time, which is easily solved with a rust eraser and some slurry off a polish stone.
In my opinion, it is a very competent knife, i have no complaints about these 2 konosukes.


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## Chicagohawkie (Dec 19, 2015)

alwayssharp said:


> I have a pair, suji and gyuto.
> They are my favorite knives!
> The steel is a joy to sharpen and polish! It does patina from time to time, which is easily solved with a rust eraser and some slurry off a polish stone.
> In my opinion, it is a very competent knife, i have no complaints about these 2 konosukes.




Are those the kono white 2 steel? How you like the edge retention on those? My white 2 loses edge pretty fast!


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## jacko9 (Dec 20, 2015)

I had a chance to use my 210 B#2 Gyuto and the OOTB sharpness was less then impressive. I worked it on the kangaroo strop and got it to cut somewhat but, it needs to go to the stones. The steel is very reactive cutting red onions and tomatoes and had to be cleaned with Bar Keepers to remove ugly streaking. I love the feel of this knife and look forward to getting a working edge.


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## alwayssharp (Dec 21, 2015)

Chicagohawkie said:


> Are those the kono white 2 steel? How you like the edge retention on those? My white 2 loses edge pretty fast!



I use those hi soft boards, so that probably helps my edge stay sharp longer, but honestly, I polish every morning before service, so I'm not exactly sure how long it can go without sharpening/polish.
Maybe over a week (50 hours).
Compared to other knives I've used like misono, kikuichi (spelling), tojiro, masamoto, I'd say it ranks fairly high in retention.


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## JayGee (Dec 21, 2015)

I thought concave was desired on wide bevels - so you can sharpen hamguri style as on a single bevel. I get confused when people talk about flattening blade roads because the instruction I received was that you definitely want to maintain a rounded bevel.


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## Asteger (Dec 21, 2015)

Not sure if maybe you, or maybe someone else or I above, have mixed up concave and convex. Hamaguri is convex. But these wide bevel gyuto tend to be concave on the wide bevel, away from the edge and before the shinogi, I guess because they're ground on round grindstones and then not flattened or given hamaguri after. They'll be left with low spots above the edge along the blade.

A complaint I have is that these are finished to sell well, and you pay for the finish, and the main feature is probably the polished wide bevel. The polish hides the concavity, however, and so the knife looks like [email protected] when you put the wide bevel on stones, and so the main part of the pricey finish (for eg. on the Kono) ends up being a bit of a sham because you can't maintain it. You can then try and polish like before (not easy) or flatten out the concavity (then add hamaguri if you wish) but this takes effort too. I've read comments where people say they like the wide bevels because they're easy to maintain, but unless you've broken the knife in well, I don't think it's the case. (Heiji are an exception to me though.)


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## spoiledbroth (Dec 21, 2015)

Function over form all day !


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## jacko9 (Dec 22, 2015)

I had a chance to put my Fuji to the 1K Shapton Glass and the 5K Shapton Pro and then on a strop with .75 micron CBN. Now the knife is scary sharp and the Blue2 was really easy to sharpen. I used some Bar Keepers Friend on it but I think I'm going to see if I can achieve a uniform patina.


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## turbochef422 (Dec 22, 2015)

I love mine. Well made, nice steel, looks great with the ebony handle. Performance is very good along with edge retention. The price is ok I guess. I've paid more for less definitely.


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## jacko9 (Dec 22, 2015)

The Konosuke Fujiyama Blue #2 Gyuto looked great out of the box but, when I used it for the first time I noticed that the initial sharpness was not quite up to par with my other knives. I also noticed that after a few slices of red onion the blade had a lot of reactivity so I cleaned the knife with Bar Keepers Friend and wiped it with Camelia Oil.

I then took it to my Shapron Glass 1K and Shapton Pro 5K stones and finished with a kangaroo strop with 0.75 micron CBN. I also re-wiped the knife with Camelia oil.

Next day I used it to cut up onions and tomatoes for dinner salad and didn't see any reactivity at all after wiping it dry. I also noticed that the knife is now one of the sharpest knives I've ever used. I think this knife has found a happy home for many years to come.

Jack


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## toddnmd (Dec 22, 2015)

I've seen numerous accounts of Kono Fujis not being very sharp OOTB. I actually thought the cutting was pretty good, until I sharpened it, and then it was amazing. Some folks also like them because the geometry allows them to cut well, even after losing some of the edge sharpness.


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## YG420 (Dec 22, 2015)

I have both white #1 & 2 240 fuji gyutos and they are very good performers. It seems like the white #1 gets a bit sharper than the #2 and they both came very dull ootb. Very fun knives for the money!


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## alwayssharp (Dec 23, 2015)

Every one of my japanese knives came with a slight dull edge, but this is normal, they want you to set your own bevel, at least what I've been told.

Several knives came with this paper showing different edge angles.


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## jacko9 (Dec 23, 2015)

Both of Teruyasu Fujiwara Nashiji knives came incredibly sharp of the box I have a 240mm Gyuto and a 150mm Petty. These are White #1 clad in stainless steel and keep a great edge for quite a while.


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## Keith Sinclair (Dec 23, 2015)

jacko9 said:


> I had a chance to put my Fuji to the 1K Shapton Glass and the 5K Shapton Pro and then on a strop with .75 micron CBN. Now the knife is scary sharp and the Blue2 was really easy to sharpen. I used some Bar Keepers Friend on it but I think I'm going to see if I can achieve a uniform patina.



You won't get an even patina the core steel is more reactive than the cladding even though both are carbon steel.


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## jacko9 (Dec 23, 2015)

keithsaltydog said:


> You won't get an even patina the core steel is more reactive than the cladding even though both are carbon steel.



I need more experience with this knife but after cleaning it the first time with Bar Keepers Friend and applying a coating of Camelia oil it is staying pretty stable after onions and tomatoes last night. I'm sure it will get some character to the looks but I love how it cuts!

Jack


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## Tall Dark and Swarfy (Dec 24, 2015)

I have found the cladding to be significantly more reactive than the core steel.


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## jacko9 (Dec 24, 2015)

Tall Dark and Swarfy said:


> I have found the cladding to be significantly more reactive than the core steel.



I've noticed that about the core steel. I'm trying to decide weather to let the knife patina naturally or to force the patina or to keep cleaning it with Bar Keepers Friend?


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## Keith Sinclair (Dec 25, 2015)

I did force a patina on mine equal parts mustard and white vinegar + fresh lemon juice. The edge became darker than the cladding.


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