# THE "KS" PROFILE GYUTO CONTENDERS



## DitmasPork (Dec 21, 2017)

I was inspired to make this post after seeing a Masamoto KS on B/S/T, selling for a considerable amount above retail. [Personally, I'm not a collector that is swayed into paying a premium for a knife's rarityas there's always other knives I can find to fancy. To each they're own.] 

The Masamoto KS is an immensely popular gyuto, with an almost cult-like following, that's sadly discontinued by Masamoto. I bought my 240 lefty KS from JCKI was influenced by Salty's engrossing video review of it. My KS is a regular in my rotation, nimble, dependable, easy to sharpensleek and sexy as hell, like a Jaguar E-Type. The KS is a gyuto with a very distinct personalitymy other knives with a lot of personality are the Kato and Kochi.

Now that the Masamoto KS has gone the way of the Dodo and Passenger pigeon, I'm curious about the performance of other gyutos using the KS profile. Specifically large production knives, sub-$500, not those made by custom makers (i.e. Bloodroot, Marko Tsourkan, etc.). 

What are some good KS profile gyuto options currently out there? There are a handful of KS profiled, mass produced J-knives out there, Moritaka, Sakai Yusuke, Shibata, etc. Would love to hear impressions on any of those knives from KKF people that have used themespecially if you've also used a Masamoto KS.

Also, Koki from JCK mentioned that they're working with Mizuno Tanrenjo on a KS profile gyuto in Ao Hagane DX Blue Steel No.1 Clad and Honyaki White Steel No.2which is 24 months from completion. Excited to see how these come out.






Here are some KS profile gyutos from various makers. Images sourced from the internet for educational and comparison purposes.





My 240 lefty Masamoto KS next to a 10 inch carbon ****Elephant Sabatier chef knife.




KS with Saya




Shot of KS, lefty D-handle


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## labor of love (Dec 21, 2017)

James Knives and stones Akebono is KS ish. Pretty thin at the edge and great tip. Moritaka KS is disappointing. I would like the Marko at some point, his interpretation is probably more to my liking than the real KS.


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## DitmasPork (Dec 21, 2017)

labor of love said:


> James Knives and stones Akebono is KS ish. Pretty thin at the edge and great tip. Moritaka KS is disappointing. I would like the Marko at some point, his interpretation is probably more to my liking than the real KS.



The Akebono appears like a taller, more tapered, riff on the KSgood looking handles. I've never held a Marko, but his knives look impeccablewould love to have one if I had the money. Saw a Marko in the case at JB Prince a while agogorgeous!


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## panda (Dec 21, 2017)

miz honyaki ks shape??? say it aint so!!??


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## Andreu (Dec 21, 2017)

panda said:


> miz honyaki ks shape??? say it aint so!!??



Also, Koki from JCK mentioned that they're working with Mizuno Tanrenjo on a KS profile gyuto in Ao Hagane DX Blue Steel No.1 Clad and Honyaki White Steel No.2which is 24 months from completion. Excited to see how these come out.

I am the guilty person. I actually have the email still from Koki requesting for this knife to be made. I am a big fan of Mizuno knives and after buying a few Mizuno knives from Koki including the Mizuno Suminagashi, I inquired if Mizuno would be willing to do a custom knife for me. I am in constant communication with Koki via phone calls and this is what had transpired...a Mizuno honyaki with a KS profile. He did tell me that it will take about 3-4 months to finish and this was in November. I am waiting for it patiently and he told me that since Im the one who requested it, I get the first dibs. &#128512; I got tired of waiting for a Masamoto KS to surface up in BST and when it did come up for sale, it was north of $500. So this is the beginning of the Mizuno honyaki KS profile. Guilty as charged.

Panda, you may not have to wait too long for your Masamoto KS honyaki unicorn. This may replace our obsession for that Masamato KS. But then again, Im pretty sure you will still be going after that unicorn.


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## GorillaGrunt (Dec 21, 2017)

I have the Shibata and the Doi. Love the profile both for aesthetics and practicality. The Shibata is a laser, very thin all the way back and up; the Doi has some serious mass, about half a pound, and a little distal taper but not very much until maybe 40mm from the tip. Feels like what people say about the Toyama and the Kato, though I dont have those yet. Two great knives, to be sure.

Those who have the KS may have some better insight on this, but from what I hear the KS is like both - severe distal taper like the old forged carbon Sabatier. Also, the grind seems not to have been replicated yet, and all the copies are clad instead of monosteel. Ill likely snap up the Mizuno when it comes out and have begun to hear some good things about Tsourkans KS.


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## chinacats (Dec 21, 2017)

panda said:


> miz honyaki ks shape??? say it aint so!!??



÷1

I believe the added length also contributed to the KS functionality...believe you'd have to go to a 270 Mizuno or have a custom maker build it to about 255 to get close to a 240 match. 

The KS grind was hit or miss, pretty inconsistent. All the more reason not to pay a bunch of $ for a used one.


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## DitmasPork (Dec 21, 2017)

Andreu said:


> Also, Koki from JCK mentioned that they're working with Mizuno Tanrenjo on a KS profile gyuto in Ao Hagane DX Blue Steel No.1 Clad and Honyaki White Steel No.2which is 24 months from completion. Excited to see how these come out.
> 
> I am the guilty person. I actually have the email still from Koki requesting for this knife to be made. I am a big fan of Mizuno knives and after buying a few Mizuno knives from Koki including the Mizuno Suminagashi, I inquired if Mizuno would be willing to do a custom knife for me. I am in constant communication with Koki via phone calls and this is what had transpired...a Mizuno honyaki with a KS profile. He did tell me that it will take about 3-4 months to finish and this was in November. I am waiting for it patiently and he told me that since Im the one who requested it, I get the first dibs. &#128512; I got tired of waiting for a Masamoto KS to surface up in BST and when it did come up for sale, it was north of $500. So this is the beginning of the Mizuno honyaki KS profile. Guilty as charged.
> 
> Panda, you may not have to wait too long for your Masamoto KS honyaki unicorn. This may replace our obsession for that Masamato KS. But then again, Im pretty sure you will still be going after that unicorn.



Brilliant! Cheers for making the initial request. I hope you'll do a review of the knife when you get it. Koki also mentioned that he'd put in a request for a lefty grind with a pre-orderas well as choice of handles. I got my Masamoto KS back in 2014, after a fairly long wait for restockingI had seriously considered getting a Sakai Yusuke, which I'd read positive things about. It'll be interesting to see if more makers decide to through a KS-esque knife into the ring.


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## Andreu (Dec 21, 2017)

I will try my best to do a review when I get it. But it might serve us better if you review it, too if you do decide to get it since you can compare it with your KS. I will keep you all posted.


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## panda (Dec 21, 2017)

Tell him to make multiple, there will be buyers


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## Andreu (Dec 21, 2017)

panda said:


> Tell him to make multiple, there will be buyers



After I made the the request, Koki had stated that Mizuno agreed to make it and it will be in multiple production. Once its made, its up for grabs in Kokis site. Not sure how many will be made but it will be multiple. I can call him tonight and see if I can get more info in regards to the status of the delivery time and the quantity.


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## turbochef422 (Dec 21, 2017)

I have a KS and like it a lot but also like the Moritaka Ks. Of the others with the same profile Ive tried I like the Moritaka the best. And zero grind issues. Nice consistant wide bevels, no overgrinds. Maybe I got lucky but a wide bevel AS steel with a KS profile. Has a nice taper. I use it all the time.


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## fujiyama (Dec 22, 2017)

The Ikeda, Moritaka and Shibata versions interest me. Cant comment on any of them though. Someday I may try acquiring these for a comparison. 

Hoping this Mizuno turns out similar to the HS-3124. I expect price to be north of $1000 USD. Regardless, the KS value will continue to rise. Even those unfortunate enough to receive a shoddy KS are cuddling it to sleep. 

To put price into perspective, dozens of Japanese makers have increased their prices in the last 2 years since the Masamoto has become unavailable. Read here for example. Shigefusa, Konosuke, Yoshiaki Fujiwara and most relevant being Mizuno are just a few. I remember witnessing a $250+ increase of Mizuno Tanrenjo honyaki knives last year. Many knives selling for north of $500 today are questionably worth it, but I believe the KS is an exception.


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## Andreu (Dec 22, 2017)

chinacats said:


> ÷1
> 
> I believe the added length also contributed to the KS functionality...believe you'd have to go to a 270 Mizuno or have a custom maker build it to about 255 to get close to a 240 match.
> 
> The KS grind was hit or miss, pretty inconsistent. All the more reason not to pay a bunch of $ for a used one.



I agree that the length of the KS was also a contributing factor to its functionality and this is the same reason I requested that the Mizuno knife be made in a 240 cutting edge. So the overall blade length will be 255ish.


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## fujiyama (Dec 22, 2017)

To clarify, the cutting edge will be 255mm? 

I never knew about the Yusuke til today.. found this video. Is it only made in Swedish Stainless? Doesnt look available at the moment. 

[video]https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&v=Q2OJgA1EHo8[/video]


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## K813zra (Dec 22, 2017)

fujiyama said:


> To clarify, the cutting edge will be 255mm?
> 
> I never knew about the Yusuke til today.. found this video. Is it only made in Swedish Stainless? Doesnt look available at the moment.
> 
> [video]https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&v=Q2OJgA1EHo8[/video]



I have not seen one available in a long time.


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## rogue108 (Dec 22, 2017)

fujiyama said:


> To clarify, the cutting edge will be 255mm?
> 
> I never knew about the Yusuke til today.. found this video. Is it only made in Swedish Stainless? Doesnt look available at the moment.
> 
> [video]https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&v=Q2OJgA1EHo8[/video]



The Sakai Yusuke are available on EBay from a seller BluewayJapan. They come in White #2 as well.


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## fujiyama (Dec 22, 2017)

Thank you. I had a look at Blueway earlier but the ones I found arent French profiled. Just curious if theyre discontinued.


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## Andreu (Dec 22, 2017)

fujiyama said:


> To clarify, the cutting edge will be 255mm?
> 
> I never knew about the Yusuke til today.. found this video. Is it only made in Swedish Stainless? Doesnt look available at the moment.
> 
> [video]https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=83&v=Q2OJgA1EHo8[/video]



No, sir. The cutting edge will be 240. The blade length (handle to tip) will be 255ish.


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## Andreu (Dec 22, 2017)

fujiyama said:


> Thank you. I had a look at Blueway earlier but the ones I found arent French profiled. Just curious if theyre discontinued.



I inquired about the french profile in October with Blueway and was told that this is no longer in production.


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## fujiyama (Dec 22, 2017)

I had a feeling they were discontinued. 



Andreu said:


> No, sir. The cutting edge will be 240. The blade length (handle to tip) will be 255ish.


Okay, thanks for clarifying. Im slightly less interested now. :whistling:


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## Andreu (Dec 22, 2017)

fujiyama said:


> I had a feeling they were discontinued.
> 
> 
> Okay, thanks for clarifying. Im slightly less interested now. :whistling:



I wonder how slightly..&#129300;. Lol

That was my request to Koki. Will Mizuno follow it exactly, maybe. All I know for sure is that it will be longer than the regular Mizuno 240.


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## fujiyama (Dec 22, 2017)

Mizuno honyakis generally run short ~230mm. The KS runs long at ~255mm. Its hard to call it a 240 or a 270, its.. exactly in the middle. Thats appealing to me. You can find short 270s but theyre still ~260mm.

With an edge of 240 these be longer than the average 230mm Mizuno. I do admit it sounds like a cool knife, but I dont think it will closely resemble a KS. Its too short, so even if they nail the profile, grind and taper, it will be off proportion to the Masamoto. It wont be a clone but it may be a great alternative. 

Id be hesitant to drop this kind of coin without seeing it out first. 

Not saying they wont produce a knife that I fall in love with, but my expectations have seriously dropped. Thats a good thing for my wallet and relationship. :angel2:


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## Andreu (Dec 22, 2017)

Yes, that is correct that the regular Mizuno honyakis runs short and the KS runs long (more like a short 270). However, I personally feel that my sweet spot is at 250 to 255. Not too long as a 270 and not too short as a 240. I understand your reservation on this matter, but I did not request the knife to be an exact replica of the KS. Otherwise, it wont be much different than any other KS clones out there. My intention was to have a KS profile (since I favor a flatter profile) with a good distal taper and a height of 50mm at the heel. It was not my intention to have an exact copy of the KS including the dimension. I dont know how the knife will turn out. I am just hoping for the best. As we all know, like with any knives out there, it just boils down to an individual preference. Some may love it, some may like it, or some may hate it. If you decide not to purchase one, I will PM you of my thoughts of the knife once I have it in hand and tried it. Cheers - Andreu


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## panda (Dec 22, 2017)

honestly id be happy with a 250-255 length regular miz honyaki. i got rid of mine because it was too short.
i will probably not get this new one, just hold out for my unicorn. pretty thrilled with original ks + custom watanabe combo i got now.


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## chinacats (Dec 22, 2017)

panda said:


> honestly id be happy with a 250-255 length regular miz honyaki. i got rid of mine because it was too short.
> i will probably not get this new one, just hold out for my unicorn. pretty thrilled with original ks + custom watanabe combo i got now.



Custom Wat?


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## KCMande (Dec 22, 2017)

chinacats said:


> Custom Wat?


Was wondering that myself. Might just write that email instead


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## panda (Dec 22, 2017)

255 length thinner tip


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## rickg17 (Dec 22, 2017)

Ok, I'm pretty new to the whole j-knife thing but explain to this novice why the KS profile is so coveted by some? Is it just that it's not as tall? Somewhat French-like in feel? Is it how it cuts?


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## chinacats (Dec 22, 2017)

panda said:


> 255 length thinner tip



Sounds awesome...I feel like 10" makes a perfect gyuto length. Combined with a thinner tip I can see why your love it.




rickg17 said:


> Ok, I'm pretty new to the whole j-knife thing but explain to this novice why the KS profile is so coveted by some? Is it just that it's not as tall? Somewhat French-like in feel? Is it how it cuts?



Profile, profile, profile and length. Good distal taper with a thin tip... when it's ground well there are very few knives that feel as good...imo it rewards good technique.


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## panda (Dec 23, 2017)

it cuts like a dream, doesnt even wedge on celery!


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## Andreu (Dec 23, 2017)

Additinal info regarding the knife. Koki gave me a more concrete info in regards to the dimension and also sent me the drawing of the knife. I was wrong to inform you of the dimension as I gave you the dimesnion of my original request of the knife. I guess he made some adjustment to it to really be close to a KS. The approximate cutting edge is 255mm and the height is approximately 49mm. The drawing he sent me was based on the KS model KS3124 which is the original KS profile. They will make the knives with a good distal taper with a thin tip. They are also making it with a blue #1 steel iron clad in addition to a honyaki version. I hope this help clarify any confusion.


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## DitmasPork (Dec 23, 2017)

Andreu said:


> Additinal info regarding the knife. Koki gave me a more concrete info in regards to the dimension and also sent me the drawing of the knife. I was wrong to inform you of the dimension as I gave you the dimesnion of my original request of the knife. I guess he made some adjustment to it to really be close to a KS. The approximate cutting edge is 255mm and the height is approximately 49mm. The drawing he sent me was based on the KS model KS3124 which is the original KS profile. They will make the knives with a good distal taper with a thin tip. They are also making it with a blue #1 steel iron clad in addition to a honyaki version. I hope this help clarify any confusion.



That's sounds very good indeedalso like how there will be a choice of handles. Any sense of what the prices will be?


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## Andreu (Dec 23, 2017)

I asked Koki about the price but he couldnt give me a definitive answer yet. He said that it may be a bit more compare to the regular 240 only because of the additional length.


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## tgfencer (Dec 24, 2017)

Not really sure how relevant this is to the ongoing conversation regarding Koki's blades, but for those who miss out or whatnot, Mert has made several KS-profiled knives. I used one for a bit and I was very impressed.


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## Andreu (Dec 24, 2017)

tgfencer said:


> Not really sure how relevant this is to the ongoing conversation regarding Koki's blades, but for those who miss out or whatnot, Mert has made several KS-profiled knives. I used one for a bit and I was very impressed.



Yep and I am waiting for him to be done with mine. It will be close to a year before he finishes with my knife. He has almost a year delivery time now.


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## fujiyama (Jan 2, 2018)

Masamoto KS Gyutos will be available for purchase again very soon! 

Im uncertain that the knife is discontinued. :scratchhead:


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## HRC_64 (Jan 2, 2018)

fujiyama said:


> Masamoto KS Gyutos will be available for purchase again very soon!



source/?


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## dwalker (Jan 2, 2018)

CKTG is getting some soon.


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## chinacats (Jan 2, 2018)

dwalker said:


> CKTG is getting some soon.



I wouldn't but anything from Mark, even if it was a KS for $1...but that's just me


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

chinacats said:


> I wouldn't but anything from Mark, even if it was a KS for $1...but that's just me



+1
But I called anyways, apparently they found a very small batch of old stock


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## ramenlegend (Jan 2, 2018)

Anton said:


> +1
> But I called anyways, apparently they found a very small batch of old stock



HA! give us the inside scoop on when they are posting!


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## DitmasPork (Jan 2, 2018)

chinacats said:


> I wouldn't but anything from Mark, even if it was a KS for $1...but that's just me



Ive never had any problems/issues on the half dozen times Ive bought from ***go, happy with service I got, I base my opinions on personal experiences. I know that many on KKF feel differently, but I do credit them (also JKI, KKF and Korin) for turning me onto Japanese kitchen knives.


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## labor of love (Jan 2, 2018)

From what Ive heard the entire KS line going extinct. So if you want a suji or petty you might as well track one down while you still can.


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## Chicagohawkie (Jan 2, 2018)

Come on, did anyone really believe that the KS was extinct? Masamoto could have anyone make these and theyd sell out in an instant! Whats the over/under on price?


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## HRC_64 (Jan 2, 2018)

Anton said:


> +1
> But I called anyways, apparently they found a very small batch of old stock



What is the hotline number


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## labor of love (Jan 2, 2018)

Chicagohawkie said:


> Come on, did anyone really believe that the KS was extinct? Masamoto could have anyone make these and theyd sell out in an instant! Whats the over/under on price?



Marko just quoted me $450 for his KS inspired gyuto. If mark retails these Masamotos anywhere near that price it would be laughable.


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## Chicagohawkie (Jan 2, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Marko just quoted me $450 for his KS inspired gyuto. If mark retails these Masamotos anywhere near that price it would be laughable.



But Mark will just put one of his fancy handles on to justify the 500 dollar price! Ha Ha!


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## HRC_64 (Jan 2, 2018)

Chicagohawkie said:


> But Mark will just put one of his fancy handles on ...



That should be criminal TBQH


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## chinacats (Jan 2, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Marko just quoted me $450 for his KS inspired gyuto. If mark retails these Masamotos anywhere near that price it would be laughable.



Is pay that before of pay 300 for a KS. Wait time is likely similar. You'll wind up with a better knife...and much better looking.


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

Not Too different from whats happened to Shigs


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## chinacats (Jan 2, 2018)

DitmasPork said:


> Ive never had any problems/issues on the half dozen times Ive bought from ***go, happy with service I got, I base my opinions on personal experiences. I know that many on KKF feel differently, but I do credit them (also JKI, KKF and Korin) for turning me onto Japanese kitchen knives.



My opinion is based on multiple personal experiences as well...guess it's just luck of the draw or differing expectations.


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

Found one stashed away yesterday and put to use. 
Quite a joyous knife, and the steel sharpens great


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## panda (Jan 2, 2018)

it's the s2000 of knives


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

panda said:


> it's the s2000 of knives



Doubt many would know what this means, but yes, dead on.


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## panda (Jan 2, 2018)

which so happens to be my ride also


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

Great car 
Back in my track days those s2000 were pesky little things, in the right hands hard to shake off and easy to maintain


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## labor of love (Jan 2, 2018)

Anton, are you the one that scored a spicy white Marko in BST awhile back?


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Anton, are you the one that scored a spicy white Marko in BST awhile back?



Hmm, not sure, maybe around 2 years ago?


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## Wdestate (Jan 2, 2018)

Chicagohawkie said:


> But Mark will just put one of his fancy handles on to justify the 500 dollar price! Ha Ha!



pretty sure one sold here for 500$ on BST not long ago... apparently that wouldnt be crazy at all, people here are good at buying hype trains


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## K813zra (Jan 2, 2018)

Wdestate said:


> pretty sure one sold here for 500$ on BST not long ago... apparently that wouldnt be crazy at all, people here are good at buying hype trains



I remember one being along those lines in asking price but no idea if it sold or not. Lots of razz about it though.


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## Wdestate (Jan 2, 2018)

K813zra said:


> I remember one being along those lines in asking price but no idea if it sold or not. Lots of razz about it though.



There is one a page back on BST with custom handle for 650$... Only thing I see in response is SOLD..choo choo


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

Wdestate said:


> pretty sure one sold here for 500$ on BST not long ago... apparently that wouldnt be crazy at all, people here are good at buying hype trains



Hype is fueled by supply and demand, and yes call it hype. But thats how most of the commercial world works whether we like it or not. We just like to argue against it.

Not contradicting you as I respect your comments


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## valgard (Jan 2, 2018)

Wdestate said:


> pretty sure one sold here for 500$ on BST not long ago... apparently that wouldnt be crazy at all, people here are good at buying hype trains



that was a used one and there was a queue. new ones are selling for more than $500 behind scenes.


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## Wdestate (Jan 2, 2018)

Anton said:


> Hype is fueled by supply and demand, and yes call it hype. But thats how most of the commercial world works whether we like it or not. We just like to argue against it.
> 
> Not contradicting you as I respect your comments



absolutely, i was not for or against it, more pointing out that people saying it would be crazy to charge that much for a new one clearly has missed that it has been going on already, and from watching the way this community works, that price is only going to keep going up until everyone has scratched that itch to try one.


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## Jacob_x (Jan 2, 2018)

$1k by 2019! Quick get em now while they're still cheap!


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## Anton (Jan 2, 2018)

None of us would sell a house for less than current market top dollar and many other hobbies for that matter so not sure we can critique much


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## fujiyama (Jan 2, 2018)

When you have a long list of knives to try some will have to wait. You say, someday. Then someday comes and the knife is out of stock. Months go by, even years, but no signs anywhere. Youve spoke to many retailers who have no estimated delivery time. You turn to translators, Japanese websites, auctions.. everywhere. You set up accounts for mail forwarding services because they dont ship to your country. You've found it. You place an order for your KS3124, but alas, get an email notifying you its actually out of stock. You turn to the community, forum classifieds, but no one will sell theirs. 

Its not a hype train. Ive wanted this knife since late 2012!


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## chinacats (Jan 2, 2018)

fujiyama said:


> Its not a hype train. Ive wanted this knife since late 2012!



Then you've not been paying attention...they were fully available until about 2 years ago.


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## QCDawg (Jan 2, 2018)

Ashi ginga from @carbonknife


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## fujiyama (Jan 2, 2018)

chinacats said:


> Then you've not been paying attention...they were fully available until about 2 years ago.


With all do respect, you must be kidding cats! 

If you were paying attention youd see this was one of the knives I said someday about. I thought it would always be available so I put off buying it.. like a few other knives that have been discontinued. I know Im not the only one. In 2012 I wasnt ready to take the dive into jknives. 

Id be interested in the percentage of people who own a KS vs those who comment on it. I actually own two. :spankarse:


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## fujiyama (Jan 2, 2018)

Not a personal comment china, I realize you've owned at least your fair share of KS gyutos. 

The resale of these knives have been all over the market, from sub $200 to $600 plus.


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## labor of love (Jan 2, 2018)

Ive owned 4 KS gyutos. It would be really sweet if sukenari tried to make a KS 2.0


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## chinacats (Jan 2, 2018)

Yes, I misread your post, sorry. As to me, I've only owned one. I was blown away by the profile and steel but completely underwhelmed by the grind (and finish and handle). While I realize there was a lot of variation, I'll take a profile clone by a trusted maker any day.


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## Chicagohawkie (Jan 2, 2018)

chinacats said:


> Then you've not been paying attention...they were fully available until about 2 years ago.



Absolute truth here! These were always available! Most old timers know this. There were guys who liked these back in the day and I respect that. But most of this hype is from newbies who have no idea!


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## alterwisser (Jan 3, 2018)

I never got the hype. I had one and sold it pretty quickly. I dont regret letting it go at all. Well, maybe I shouldve held on to it and sold it for a lot more money haha....


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

alterwisser said:


> I never got the hype. I had one and sold it pretty quickly. I dont regret letting it go at all. Well, maybe I shouldve held on to it and sold it for a lot more money haha....



I just let one go(almost new) about 9 monthes ago for $290 Haha! I really dont have the stomach to profit on knife stuff though. And kudos to whoever let go of a kato 240mm gyuto a couple weeks ago for $600.


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## fatboylim (Jan 3, 2018)

chinacats said:


> Yes, I misread your post, sorry. As to me, I've only owned one. I was blown away by the profile and steel but completely underwhelmed by the grind (and finish and handle). While I realize there was a lot of variation, I'll take a profile clone by a trusted maker any day.


+1

Totally over rated and underwhelming compared to other French profile knives made by Japanese blacksmiths.


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

chinacats said:


> Yes, I misread your post, sorry. As to me, I've only owned one. I was blown away by the profile and steel but completely underwhelmed by the grind (and finish and handle). While I realize there was a lot of variation, I'll take a profile clone by a trusted maker any day.



+2
The things that make the KS great among its fans is specs/measurements. A profile and distal taper can be easily recreated if someone wanted too. KS grind is mediocre, steel/heat treat definitely leaves room for improvement.


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

Blueway has a white ks 240 up right now on the bay for $337 shipped


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## panda (Jan 3, 2018)

niwaki-boy said:


> Blueway has a white ks 240 up right now on the bay for $337 shipped



Whut??


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## Andreu (Jan 3, 2018)

fujiyama said:


> When you have a long list of knives to try some will have to wait. You say, someday. Then someday comes and the knife is out of stock. Months go by, even years, but no signs anywhere. Youve spoke to many retailers who have no estimated delivery time. You turn to translators, Japanese websites, auctions.. everywhere. You set up accounts for mail forwarding services because they dont ship to your country. You've found it. You place an order for your KS3124, but alas, get an email notifying you its actually out of stock. You turn to the community, forum classifieds, but no one will sell theirs.
> 
> Its not a hype train. Ive wanted this knife since late 2012!



And one was just sold last week in the other forum when one posted a WTB. I just got lucky also with a KS this week. A KKF member sold me one of his at a very, very reasonable price and it should be arriving Saturday. My long awaited KS is finally coming!


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## Andreu (Jan 3, 2018)

niwaki-boy said:


> Blueway has a white ks 240 up right now on the bay for $337 shipped



Is that a Masamoto KS or maybe just Sakai KS profile?


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## K813zra (Jan 3, 2018)

Andreu said:


> Is that a Masamoto KS or maybe just Sakai KS profile?



I looked as soon as he posted and didn't see either.


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

I purchased the KS off blueway. Its a Masamoto. Im going to try and trade it BNIB for a shig or Kato(plus cash)or something else... If I cant find a trade partner, Ill sell it here for the price I paid.


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## chinacats (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I purchased the KS off blueway. Its a Masamoto. Im going to try and trade it BNIB for a shig or Kato(plus cash)or something else... If I cant find a trade partner, Ill sell it here for the price I paid.



LOL, that's awesome. Knew someone here grabbed it, glad you got it! Who knows, may be the one.


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I purchased the KS off blueway. Its a Masamoto. Im going to try and trade it BNIB for a shig or Kato(plus cash)or something else... If I cant find a trade partner, Ill sell it here for the price I paid.[/QUOTE
> 
> Glad you got it! I was going to do the same but my money has already been turning into too many ones and zeros lately ...


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## Andreu (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I purchased the KS off blueway. Its a Masamoto. Im going to try and trade it BNIB for a shig or Kato(plus cash)or something else... If I cant find a trade partner, Ill sell it here for the price I paid.



So youre the lucky one, Craig. &#128512;


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

Thanks! My angle is to try and trade rare knife for rare knife whenever I receive the KS. If that doesnt work out Ill just throw everybodys name in a hat and resell for the price I paid.


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## Barmoley (Jan 3, 2018)

Picking a random name sounds very cool for selling a rare knife. Will give a chance to those that are not haunting the forums seemingly constantly, picking up all the rare knives.


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## DitmasPork (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I purchased the KS off blueway. Its a Masamoto. Im going to try and trade it BNIB for a shig or Kato(plus cash)or something else... If I cant find a trade partner, Ill sell it here for the price I paid.



I thought you already had a Kato?


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## YG420 (Jan 3, 2018)

@labor, is the kanji stamped or screened on? Looked screened on in the pics


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

YG420 said:


> @labor, is the kanji stamped or screened on? Looked screened on in the pics



Hard for me tell from pics. Ill confirm whenever I receive it.


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

YG420 said:


> @labor, is the kanji stamped or screened on? Looked screened on in the pics



I had this question as well.. while I stared at it for ten minutes


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

DitmasPork said:


> I thought you already had a Kato?



Ive already owned 3 Katos. But they were all pre 2013. Would like to acquire a newer one. But Ill likely sell it too haha(but for a fair price)


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

I didnt realize there were variations in KS kanji.


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## Andreu (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I didnt realize there were variations in KS kanji.



Me neither. I thought they were all stamped. I havent seen one that is screen printed.


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## rickg17 (Jan 3, 2018)

Hey... is this the Moritka you all are talking about above - http://moritakahamonoen.ocnk.net?

The yen prices are pretty cheap if so but I don't see anything designated KS...


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

rickg17 said:


> Hey... is this the Moritka you all are talking about above - http://moritakahamonoen.ocnk.net?
> 
> The yen prices are pretty cheap if so but I don't see anything designated KS...



Prob have to get moritaka KS through cktg.


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I didnt realize there were variations in KS kanji.



Screened kanji is happening with kono as well, I think w/2 and Swedish Stainless. I personally hate it and hope it is not trending to the venerable ks.


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## rickg17 (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Prob have to get moritaka KS through cktg.



Yeah. But they have none on the site and what caught my eye is this - http://moritakahamonoen.ocnk.net/product/25. 10,000 yen is about $88...


This IS the same Moritaka, though, yeah?


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

rickg17 said:


> Hey... is this the Moritka you all are talking about above - http://moritakahamonoen.ocnk.net?
> 
> The yen prices are pretty cheap if so but I don't see anything designated KS...



The ks is Masamoto-Sohonten Ltd


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## HRC_64 (Jan 3, 2018)

YG420 said:


> @labor, is the kanji stamped or screened on? Looked screened on in the pics



https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/c7QAAOSwIFtaTKUg/s-l1600.jpg

this is ~high res and I don't think confirms screened on, 
but its also not looking very deep or hand chiseled ... YMMV


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## rickg17 (Jan 3, 2018)

niwaki-boy said:


> The ks is Masamoto-Sohonten Ltd



Yeah but people above were talking about a Moritaka as an alternative and while these aren't KS profiled they look like nice knives for a great price if it's the same Moritaka.


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## HRC_64 (Jan 3, 2018)

rickg17 said:


> Yeah but people above were talking about a Moritaka as an alternative and while these aren't KS profiled they look like nice knives for a great price if it's the same Moritaka.



At 210mm vs 250mm for the KS,
its profile is not very likely to be anywhere close,
(just based on the math of ~triangles).

Its also a wholly different construction,
so people maybe looking for wa-monosteel knives
are also not going to consider it a very close comparison.

IMHO ithout construction or profile at all similar,
its too far away to really debate the merits of it
here in this OPs thread.


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## chinacats (Jan 3, 2018)

Moritaka could tend to suck...


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## Anton (Jan 3, 2018)

Moritaka beats Shigs and Katos


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 3, 2018)

rickg17 said:


> Yeah but people above were talking about a Moritaka as an alternative and while these aren't KS profiled they look like nice knives for a great price if it's the same Moritaka.



Haha my bad! I read this thread when it first started then let it go for a bit so when I picked back up on it I went to the last page and paged backwards to where I left off to start reading. The problem with that is I forgot about the first two pages :O ...doh


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## labor of love (Jan 3, 2018)

Anton said:


> Moritaka beats Shigs and Katos



Thats the spirit! Now who do I have to harass about a spicy white Marko KS?


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## panda (Jan 3, 2018)

Moritaka is the shiznit!!


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## valgard (Jan 3, 2018)

Anton said:


> Moritaka beats Shigs and Katos



having fun lately [emoji23]


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## DitmasPork (Jan 3, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I didnt realize there were variations in KS kanji.



If it's screened send it back!


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## chinacats (Jan 3, 2018)

Anton said:


> Moritaka beats Shigs and Katos





panda said:


> Moritaka is the shiznit!!



OK, so I'm guessing that I'm talking blue and you guys are talking AS... or do i need to go back to school?


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 4, 2018)

DitmasPork said:


> If it's screened send it back!



Very clean.. is that one stainless? 
...gotta go to the fridge and fill the void opened up by that pic :hungry:


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## labor of love (Jan 4, 2018)

niwaki-boy said:


> Very clean.. is that one stainless?
> ...gotta go to the fridge and fill the void opened up by that pic :hungry:



I think I can see both the grind marks and patina on that one.


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## niwaki-boy (Jan 4, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I think I can see both the grind marks and patina on that one.



Ill go with that, was looking on phone screen, back on pad screen. Still pretty clean looking for a ks


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## panda (Jan 4, 2018)

that's a trifecta hitting picture right dur. nice cutting board, nice meat, nice knife!


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## Lazarus (Jan 4, 2018)

Kato non workhorse seem pretty close to the KS just looking at pictures of the KS, I haven't actually used a KS however.


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## Grunt173 (Jan 4, 2018)

DitmasPork said:


> If it's screened send it back!



The heck with the knife,I'll take the meat.Man that looks soooo good.I'm starved!


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## DitmasPork (Jan 4, 2018)

panda said:


> that's a trifecta hitting picture right dur. nice cutting board, nice meat, nice knife!



Cheers!

Cutting board is a Sani-Tuff. I don't use my maple BoardSmith cutting board with meats, since I share it with my vegetarian wife.

Meat is char siu made with pork neck meataka pork collar, fresh capicola, gabagooldense, slightly chewy, well marbled, inexpensive in Brooklyn Chinatown.

Knife is a 240 Masamoto KS, left handed d-handle and lefty grind, bought from Koki in 2014. Not stainlessthe harsh lighting washed out the patina.


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