# Shun's



## Keith Sinclair (Jan 23, 2014)

At the Culinary school here students & teachers get shuns 70% off.So have sharpened tons of shuns.Never owned one.One of the teachers said he had 3 shuns that chipped really easy.Told him I would restore them if I could use them for couple months since he was not using them.115mm petty,155mm small slicer,& 210mm Gyuto.All had major chipping.I got them cleaned up 2K sharp finished leather strop.

He also had a Sabatier 150mm carbon petty with alot of rust.Cleaned that up some leftover pitting on bladeface.

Another teacher had a small 210mm Yanagi also rusty esp. around Buff. Horn & some on bladeface.Cleaned that up know the carbon steel is pretty good was able to get a very sharp edge on it.

I will not return the Sabatier or the Yanagi until they get some mineral oil learn how to care for their carbons.

I have found that VG-10 is not that hard to sharpen.Also Shun's get a bad rap as well as VG-10.Have a VG-10 Tojiro cleaver over a year that performs well.I have felt that the Shuns get damaged more from knife abuse because everywhere sells them so there are alot out there.Now I will put these to the test doing all kinds of cutting to see if they really are prone to chipping or if it is because of abuse:knife:


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## Geo87 (Jan 23, 2014)

I've read a few people say that vg-10 being chippy is a myth... Im thinking most likely shun is usually a choice by people who have limited knowledge on knife care... So chipping results from abuse. I've seen a lot of them and sharpened a few. All the damage I've seen resulted from drops, aggressive steeling & improper use( e.g heavy tasks) 
People who look after them have had no issues with chipping. 
As for sharpening. I have found them easy to sharpen if there regularly sharpened from day one. But I sharpened one old shun that just would not take an edge. My first encounter with very fatigued steel I think. It took an extreme amount of thinning / metal removal before it took a great edge. 
In summary: I've found their not that bad if you look after them ... But let's not forget you can still get better knives for much less. Although 70% off would be a good deal.


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## NO ChoP! (Jan 23, 2014)

I think as you said, there are millions out there. Most have no idea how to sharpen them properly. After extended use on a fatigued factory edge, I would expect them to chip.


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## Timthebeaver (Jan 23, 2014)

NO ChoP! said:


> I think as you said, there are millions out there. Most have no idea how to sharpen them properly. After extended use on a fatigued factory edge, I would expect them to chip.



+1. Nothing to do with VG10 being "chippy" or Shun doing a crap heat treat. User error, plain and simple. If you gave them a high end Japanese carbon they'd chip the hell out of that too.


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## toddnmd (Jan 23, 2014)

Interesting thread. I like the idea of the direct comparison.

I tend to agree that there are a lot of Shuns out there in inexperienced users hands, and improper use is likely the issue for a lot of damage that occurs. I have also heard that the factory edge tends to be chippier, although I can't remember the reason why (or maybe it was never explained). But I can recall seeing that a few times. Would be curious to hear an explanation if anyone out there has one.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jan 23, 2014)

I can't stand shuns but I think your are right about them getting more abuse. For me it's not that I think they are bad knives but that they are over priced.


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## Crothcipt (Jan 23, 2014)

The couple Myoubi's I have tried were very expensive for what you got. As for vg10 I have seen quite a few that is very nice and very little chipping, even with my banging the board work.


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## Benuser (Jan 23, 2014)

Have seen a lot of other blades - non VG-10 - that came chippy OOTB. Must have to do with factory buffing. Once the factory edge removed everything got alright.


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## easy13 (Jan 23, 2014)

Is $120 over priced for an 8 inch VG-10 "Japanese Chef Knife" with solid F&F and a handle that isn't some cheap porous wood with a plastic ferrule that you pretty much have a life time warranty/return policy for (As long as you buy at Sur La Table)? I have a 7 year old 10 inch Shun Classic that I havent used in many a year and definitely did chip when my former naive self tried to crack chicken bones with it. Now fixed it serves as a fine beater knife for prep cooks or a friend to use.


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## Timthebeaver (Jan 23, 2014)

$120 for a 8" VG10 blade with good fit and finish is not overpriced imo. Shuns are generally bashed because the profile (massive belly/upswept tip) doesn't fly round here in general. However, I also think the fact they are common/vanilla comes into play too.

If you like the Shun profile, check out the "Zhen" VG10 Taiwanese knockoff. $50 for an 8" last time I checked.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jan 23, 2014)

I can't find any 8in shuns for $120. Found a 6.5 utility for $120 and a 7in chefs for $140. Most of the larger knives seem to be $180 to $300 depending on the series and I'm not sure the more expensive knives are much different. In fact some look worst like the edo and ken onion. There are many better japanes knives in this price range.


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## easy13 (Jan 23, 2014)

ChuckTheButcher said:


> I can't find any 8in shuns for $120. Found a 6.5 utility for $120 and a 7in chefs for $140. Most of the larger knives seem to be $180 to $300 depending on the series and I'm not sure the more expensive knives are much different. In fact some look worst like the edo and ken onion. There are many better japanes knives in this price range.



8 inch - http://www.surlatable.com/product/PRO-268912/Shun+Classic+Chefs+Knives

I don't use and am not really endorsing Shuns and there are definitely lines that are both overpriced and ugly. The classic paring knives have always been solid though. Just commenting on my experience in the past with em


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

I own three Shuns (a classic utility and parer that I use pretty often, and a 5.5 inch Santoku that my wife uses), and I've owned several others. I've never had chipping issues. I've sharpened many Shuns for friends, and they invariably come to me badly chipped, but so do the other knives they send me, including Forschners, which aren't too chippy in my experience. One thing that I've noticed is that the knives have become inconsistent in regards to the grind. The Shun classic chef knives I owned were all pretty thin behind the edge, and had decent distal tapers. I've recently seen some that were really quite impressively thin, and others that were complete pigs. Anyway, if they didn't have such a pronounced belly, and were all thin behind the edge, they would be a great deal, in my opinion.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

Shun, over hyped and overpriced when I can buy a Tojiro DP VG10 at have the price. VG10 is getting the bad rap but not Shun.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> Shun, over hyped and overpriced when I can buy a Tojiro DP VG10 at have the price. VG10 is getting the bad rap but not Shun.



Sure, the Tojiro DP has a much better profile than the Shun classic chef knife, but it's a lot harder to walk into a store and buy one, in the US, and the F and F is inferior to Shun.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

Anyone with a computer can buy a Tojiro as easy as all the rest of us and the better F&F is not worth double the price to me considering the Tojiro isn't that bad. I'm sure many Shun owners did research and looked at Shun's on a computer, read deeper into the marketing hype and then went out and bought them. Many probably even came across the Tojiro but there was little hype and the Shun cost more so it must be better.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> Anyone with a computer can buy a Tojiro as easy as all the rest of us and the better F&F is not worth double the price to me considering the Tojiro isn't that bad. I'm sure many Shun owners did research and looked at Shun's on a computer, read deeper into the hype and then went out and bought them. Many probably even came across the Tojiro but the Shun cost more so it must be better.



You aren't the target audience. If the Shun classic chef knife had the same profile as a Tojiro, I think it would be worth the extra money.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

Actually I am the target audience. I am just a home cook that went looking for better knives. But unlike many others, through my research I saw through the hype and bought better j-knives for the same price. I was just more thorough and didn't just see and read what I wanted to to justify my purchase.


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## Lefty (Jan 23, 2014)

Shuns are good knives, hated by guys like us, because we "are better than that". The profile on the classic sucks, but they seem to be getting much closer. They are nice looking knives and they feel good in hand. I won't get into Tojiros, but given the choice between Tojiro and Shun, I'd take the latter. If my wife bought me one, I'd quite happily use it, and likely grow to really enjoy it. We can be our own worst enemies.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

I don't hate Shuns, I hate the marketing hype that drives the prices up on products like "Shun". But hey, it's the job of a lot of people to create hype to get people to pay that premium to own that product so they can tell people they have that "name your product here".


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> Actually I am the target audience.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> I don't hate Shuns, I hate the marketing hype that drives the prices up on products like "Shun". But hey, it's the job of a lot of people to create hype to get people to pay that premium to own that product so they can tell people they have that "name your product here".



The last time I saw Shun hype was on an episode of good eats 2/3rds of a decade ago.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

I guess your right. Their target audience are those that buy the BS and aren't smart enough to find a forum like this. I found this forum when I first started to research knives, Shun included.


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## Lefty (Jan 23, 2014)

I honestly think we hate that they are mainstream, and that our neighbor who is a good cook, but lives by Ray Ray's recipes, and Martha Stewart's recommendations owns Shuns and knows jackshit about knives. We pride ourselves on understanding the nuances and to an extent, the process that goes into high-end knives. 

Success and being able to charge top dollar (and get it by the boat load) is what Shun can do, and does very, very well.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jan 23, 2014)

I totally agree I think I hate how they are marketed more then the knives them selves.


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## Chef Andy (Jan 23, 2014)

EdipisReks said:


>



The fact that you spent enough time to make that image is pretty funny, you have to admit.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

Chef Andy said:


> The fact that you spent enough time to make that image is pretty funny, you have to admit.



with a meme generator, it took about 20 seconds.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> I guess your right. Their target audience are those that buy the BS and aren't smart enough to find a forum like this. I found this forum when I first started to research knives, Shun included.



That's pretty silly.


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## bahamaroot (Jan 23, 2014)

If you say so.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 23, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> If you say so.



I do. Forums and their ilk are hardly the root of all knowledge. Just look at Reddit.


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## mkriggen (Jan 24, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> I guess your right. Their target audience are those that buy the BS and aren't smart enough to find a forum like this. I found this forum when I first started to research knives, Shun included.



I found this forum right after I bought a Shun:slaphead:


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 24, 2014)

The students get quite a few 10" Shun Premier chef knives.Have sharpened a dozen of these.On Amazon they are 199.99 at the school under 120.00.

They have alot of bling & looks when new,easy sell.For 120.00 it is not a bad knife,to much rocker at tip for my tastes,but much better than some of the other ridiculous shun profiles students have picked up.

None of the chef knives I reccom. are fancy damascus.Some students have bought these.I push stones more than knives,cuz if not willing to get a stone learning freehand is remote.


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## panda (Jan 24, 2014)

right on keith, sharpening is crucial. i rather have/use a properly sharpened beater knife than a not so optimally maintained high end knife any day.

i find myself more interested in trying new stones than knives these days..


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## labor of love (Jan 24, 2014)

besides the profile, the shun premier is pretty decent. check out the choil/grind on them sometime, theyre surprisingly nice.


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## ohbewon (Jan 24, 2014)

labor of love said:


> besides the profile, the shun premier is pretty decent. check out the choil/grind on them sometime, theyre surprisingly nice.



+1 

I have one that was given to me as a gift one year for a birthday that I can't bring myself to get rid of for sentimental reasons. (Grandparents bought it) Aside from the fact that it's been back to Kai twice for a tip repair, I like the feel it has in my hand. I don't use it at work, because I have too many fun toys to play with there that are far better cutters. I dulled the factory shine with a green 3M and some 1000 grit paper, and I think it looks better than the tacky super shine that comes factory. To each his/her own...maybe it's just the way I grab my knives.


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## Geo87 (Jan 24, 2014)

Lefty said:


> I honestly think we hate that they are mainstream, and that our neighbor who is a good cook, but lives by Ray Ray's recipes, and Martha Stewart's recommendations owns Shuns and knows jackshit about knives. We pride ourselves on understanding the nuances and to an extent, the process that goes into high-end knives.
> 
> Success and being able to charge top dollar (and get it by the boat load) is what Shun can do, and does very, very well.




+1 Well said


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## Geo87 (Jan 24, 2014)

panda said:


> right on keith, sharpening is crucial. i rather have/use a properly sharpened beater knife than a not so optimally maintained high end knife any day..



Exactly. I think a lot of people would buy shun because they are "sharp" without realising they don't stay magically sharp... 

Take a rosewood victrinox add some stones and some skills and you have a better performing knife than most people would ever use... At a fraction of the price.


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## Flyingpigg (Jan 24, 2014)

Lefty said:


> ...Martha Stewart's recommendations owns Shuns and knows jackshit about knives.



Martha Stewart doesn't use Shuns I thought. I remember seeing a post on this forum awhile back where she was praising her Fujiwara knives, or maybe it was Suisin knives; I just remember that it wasn't Shun.


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## Lefty (Jan 24, 2014)

You're right. I just picked the most notable/influential "celebrity chef" I could think of. I don't have anything against Martha Stewart or other celebrities (in fact, I quite like many of them), but I do hate that brownies can no longer be brownies; They have to be double fudge, Bailey's infused, salted top brownies, done Au Bain Marie. Everyone has to look/appear to be the best, and Shuns are a very good embodiment of this statement. I'm glad people care about food and their tools, but why is it that every time we go out for dinner some dipwad has to pull out his camera to show his 54 Twitter followers what he's throwing down his throat hole?


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

There have been times, at restaurants, where I have felt like I was the only person _not_ taking pictures of my food.


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## Yamabushi (Jan 24, 2014)

Lefty said:


> ...why is it that every time we go out for dinner some dipwad has to pull out his camera to show his 54 Twitter followers what he's throwing down his throat hole?



Haha! Fortunately, my wife doesn't do that, but just about every other Japanese female I know does!


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## bear1889 (Jan 24, 2014)

On the subject of shun knives, I have owned a few and gave them away, I like them my go to knife is a 10 in Shun Kramer, why is it my go to knife, I have big hands, it fits my hands, and it's stainless for when I am in a hurry. Chipping issue, let's just say I had a couple of adult beverages a while back and it slipped out of my hand and fell on vinyl covered concrete slab floor, I watched it bounce on the floor three or four times as I was jumping out of the way. I thought, that's trashed....not one chip not one ding etc. Overpriced? You bet but I got it on clearance. Why do I use it? It is the only knife that truly feels good, yes I know it's Kramer's design that's why it fits my hand. Now I am just dying to try a Zwillings Kramer in 52100 because I love carbon and I can't afford a real Kramer. You go with what feels best. I have used other knives, got a kochi, got an Ealy 240mm in O1, a Sabatier 10 etc, but I keep coming back to my Shun.

It's kind of like cooking, no matter how upscale a dish one can fix, I can't help but think some always come back to meatloaf, mashed potatoes, and a veg when seeking some comfort and reminder of simpler times. Meatloaf reminds me of that threadbare t-shirt we all have, it should have been thrown out three years ago but we still wear it because it fits and feels good. Sorry it's Friday and didn't mean to hijack the thread. Came to some realizations this week about cutlery.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

If you like the Shun Kramer, the Zwilling version is going to blow you away.


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## Lucretia (Jan 24, 2014)

bahamaroot said:


> I guess your right. Their target audience are those that buy the BS and aren't smart enough to find a forum like this. I found this forum when I first started to research knives, Shun included.



I disagree. It's not that people aren't "smart enough to find a forum like this". When I started looking at knives, I was considering a Shun because there are many, many reviews out there by people who really like them. I asked someone who was a professional cook which were the best knives, and he recommended a Shun. Who knows--I might have bought one and been perfectly happy with it. (And my wallet would be much thicker!) Shuns are probably much, MUCH better knives that what you see in most home kitchens. Are the they best knives for the price? Many on this forum tend to think not. But they are readily available from well known vendors, and if you check reviews from vendors like Amazon, most people are really happy with them. Add celebrity chef endorsements (and you KNOW celebrities would never lie to us!) and there's a comfort level in buying a knife that is widely known and generally well liked and getting it from a big-name store who can be relied on to stand behind their product. Going from a $39 knife set to a knife that costs $100 or more is a big step for many people, and it's easy & convenient to just buy the same thing that hundreds of people love rather than trying to dig deeper. 

Most people don't give a rat's behind what a choil or distal taper is, they just want something that will chop their carrots.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jan 24, 2014)

Wise Woman

LOL: Rats ass about distal taper or polished choil.

Lucretia, true, their mostly concerned with proper HT and Rockwell scores.



Lucretia said:


> I disagree. It's not that people aren't "smart enough to find a forum like this". When I started looking at knives, I was considering a Shun because there are many, many reviews out there by people who really like them. I asked someone who was a professional cook which were the best knives, and he recommended a Shun. Who knows--I might have bought one and been perfectly happy with it. (And my wallet would be much thicker!) Shuns are probably much, MUCH better knives that what you see in most home kitchens. Are the they best knives for the price? Many on this forum tend to think not. But they are readily available from well known vendors, and if you check reviews from vendors like Amazon, most people are really happy with them. Add celebrity chef endorsements (and you KNOW celebrities would never lie to us!) and there's a comfort level in buying a knife that is widely known and generally well liked and getting it from a big-name store who can be relied on to stand behind their product. Going from a $39 knife set to a knife that costs $100 or more is a big step for many people, and it's easy & convenient to just buy the same thing that hundreds of people love rather than trying to dig deeper.
> 
> Most people don't give a rat's behind what a choil or distal taper is, they just want something that will chop their carrots.


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 24, 2014)

Yamabushi said:


> Haha! Fortunately, my wife doesn't do that, but just about every other Japanese female I know does!



So true.Then again when I went to Japan a couple times I took alot of pictures.The japan tourist like to pick out signs for group pictures to show where they have been.It's all good as long as your having a good time:bliss:


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## mkriggen (Jan 24, 2014)

I seem to remember Jon posting alot of pictures of food on his last Japan trip:whistling:

Be well,
Mikey


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

mkriggen said:


> I seem to remember Jon posting alot of pictures of food on his last Japan trip:whistling:



Yeah, that's a little different than posting a picture of your spicy chicken sandwich at Wendy's.


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## Lefty (Jan 24, 2014)

Jon's the man. And, yes, he posts A LOT of food pictures. However, it's all related to his business, in a roundabout way.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

Lefty said:


> Jon's the man. And, yes, he posts A LOT of food pictures. However, it's all related to his business, in a roundabout way.



Closer to travel journalism than what we are complaining about.


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## Lefty (Jan 24, 2014)

And, yes, I'm being a bit hypocritical with this one, as my Instagram account has a few of those types of pictures. However, most of them are knives, food I've made and pictures of my dog. Also, sometimes I bug myself when I take these pics. Haha. 

Meh, honestly, I'm glad we all love great food here, but the cultural change regarding food is a tad hard to swallow.

Back to Shuns. They aren't all bad. Are they what we all know and love? No, but for mass produced knives, they're pretty impeccable and perform well.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

It this knife didn't say Shun on the side, I think a lot of people here would be very interested. Hell, I'm interested, I just don't have the budget to try it right now.


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## daveb (Jan 24, 2014)

Rerun but apropos.


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## easy13 (Jan 24, 2014)

EdipisReks said:


> It this knife didn't say Shun on the side, I think a lot of people here would be very interested. Hell, I'm interested, I just don't have the budget to try it right now.



Link goes to home page of website, not knife. But if you are talking about the Blue Kiritsuke Im with you.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 24, 2014)

easy13 said:


> Link goes to home page of website, not knife. But if you are talking about the Blue Kiritsuke Im with you.



That is indeed the knife I'm talking about.


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## franzb69 (Jan 24, 2014)

Once you sharpen out the chippy bit of the knife you're pretty much all good. Then there's also the free lifetime sharpening service for those who don't wanna bother.


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## labor of love (Jan 25, 2014)

not the best pic but heres the choil shot of a shun premier 8" my buddy uses at work. probably never properly sharpened. definitely never thinned.


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## Guss2 (Jan 25, 2014)

easy13 said:


> Link goes to home page of website, not knife. But if you are talking about the Blue Kiritsuke Im with you.



I own the blue Honesuki and the blue Utility for about 3 weeks now and so far they've been pretty good to me. I bone out a lot of chicken and the Utility sees quite a bit of action as well. So far no issues with chipping and such and as of now I would recommend these knives, but they do require attention. Now I need a good all-arounder . Great site, you guys are a very knowledgeable group. Gary


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## EdipisReks (Jan 25, 2014)

labor of love said:


> not the best pic but heres the choil shot of a shun premier 8" my buddy uses at work. probably never properly sharpened. definitely never thinned.



Pretty nice grind, on that one.


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 25, 2014)

Yeh I think the 10" Premier is one of the better Shuns.Fairly long flatter edge profile heel toward the rise in the tip.Nice grind,easy to sharpen,& hammer finish.I have had a couple hammer finish carbons over the years they do work for less stiction.


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## Stumblinman (Jan 25, 2014)

I've had a premier never used, it was handle heavy but pretty to look at. Been using an 8 inch classic and western classic for a while now and still chippy but not as bad as the ootb edge. I liked how it felt in my hand but hate it when cutting certain things like shallots because of the curve and accordion cuts. I got it initially cause I could go to the store touch hold it and it was the best ones there. Plus the 20% industry discount... Both have no tips, they were the first to go. But I did have to cut an onion blindfolded once and no tip is a great thing. Lemonade outta lemons I guess.


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## Geo87 (Jan 26, 2014)

Green or gold shallots? Different country's call em different things I guess either way what's your cutting technique? 
The shuns would work better from rocking if you did that it shouldn't accordion.

How chipped are the tips exactly? 
Not too hard to fix a tip, unless it's extremely chipped and you don't want to remove all that metal to fix it?


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 26, 2014)

with broken tips I like to take more from the spine than the cutting edge,say 3-2


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## Stumblinman (Jan 26, 2014)

Ahh from the spine, that makes a lot a sense. Thanks. 

I'm talking about purple shallots. And well i think fine brunoise of anything while rocking sucks. The tip moves in a way it leaves knuckles in harms way.


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## cheflarge (Jan 26, 2014)

I still have a blue kuritsuke & Kramer by Shun damascus suji and am very fond of both of them....... Just don't tell anyone!


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## ThEoRy (Jan 26, 2014)

I've gone back and forth with Shun over the years. First one I ever had extensive experience using and sharpening was an old 210mm gyuto which belonged to a previous boss. I hated that thing. Maybe it was from his sharpening over the course of 10 years or so but that thing sucked. No knuckle clearance, sharpened like wet rubber, cut like a wedge. ******* terrible! No matter what I tried with that thing it still just cut like **** and sharpening it was not enjoyable either. After having used/sharpened other Shuns I realized it was most likely due to his knife's age/wear. Eventually I ended up putting an 80/20 right hand edge on that thing and called it a day. Really it was the only thing I could do other than major steel removal from the face which he wasn't into the idea so much. With the knuckle clearance issue still being present and all I just decided to buy him a proper gyuto as a going away gift. Seen here. http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/9458-Kagayaki-Etched?highlight=kagayaki

Anyway, having used, sharpened and repaired many Shun since then I'll say this.. They aren't terrible knives as some would have you believe. Do I like them? No. They're just simply not for me. And the majority of you as well for that matter. Why is this? Perceived value I believe. We all know of many a knife that can stand at or above Shuns for equal or lesser cash. So they just don't hold any value for us. Their successful commercial marketing hurts them here as well. Backlash if you will. They are marketed as and commercially accepted as the end all be all of Japanese knives. Average Joe and Jane believe this and go on and on about their "best knives in the world" while the rest of us know better and I believe we are just tired of listening to these know nothings spew this regurgitated garbage.

Are they terrible cutters? No. Are they fantastic cutters? No. Are they easy to sharpen? Yes. Can you get them ridiculously sharp? Yes. Do they retain their edge? Not particularly. How's the profile? Sucks. Geometry/Grind? I've seen much better. Are they worth the money? No. Does Suzy Homemaker know or care about any of the above? No. If someone who has only ever used Wusthof/Henckels etc. picks up a Shun and uses it will they be blown away? Most likely. And that's what Shun is counting on. 

When people first hear that I use Japanese knives, if they have any interest they will ask me, "What about Shun? I hear those are the best Japanese knives, they sell a lot right?" Most likely because that's the only name they've ever heard. I respond with a McDonald's analogy. McDonalds sells the most hamburgers and everyone recognizes the name but it's certainly not the best hamburger you can buy. Not even close.


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## EdipisReks (Jan 26, 2014)

ThEoRy said:


> When people first hear that I use Japanese knives, if they have any interest they will ask me, "What about Shun? I hear those are the best Japanese knives, they sell a lot right?" Most likely because that's the only name they've ever heard. I respond with a McDonald's analogy. McDonalds sells the most hamburgers and everyone recognizes the name but it's certainly not the best hamburger you can buy. Not even close.



I'd probably say Shun is closer to Five Guys than McDonalds. Knives that came free with the purchase of $200 of bad non-stick pans seems to be about the average acceptable knife in most homes, which seems like a good McDonalds analogy, to me. Even with Shun being a good seller at stores like SLT and WS, they are still expensive, and most people aren't buying them. My MIL loves to cook, and is a good cook (though not necessarily to my taste), and she uses Rada paring knives for almost everything. Rada is McDonalds.


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## ThEoRy (Jan 26, 2014)

EdipisReks said:


> I'd probably say Shun is closer to Five Guys than McDonalds. Knives that came free with the purchase of $200 of bad non-stick pans seems to be about the average acceptable knife in most homes, which seems like a good McDonalds analogy, to me. Even with Shun being a good seller at stores like SLT and WS, they are still expensive, and most people aren't buying them. My MIL loves to cook, and is a good cook (though not necessarily to my taste), and she uses Rada paring knives for almost everything. Rada is McDonalds.



Yet no one can tell you the brand name of said free knife. My point is the marketing behind Shun makes then well known to non nuts. Not everyone has heard of a Five Guys. Yet. Everyone has however heard of a MickyDees.


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 27, 2014)

Rick thats the thread that got me into etching,After I took all the chips out I etched one of the Shuns,looks much better.This is my first experience using Shuns.Push cuts, chops, rocks.I find them a little handle heavy.Don't know why all the endcaps which seem to take a beating with the elements.

They are OK cutters nothing special so far my edges are holding up only been using a few days with home cooking.


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## daveb (Jan 27, 2014)

Shun has certainly done a good job of marketing their knives to the "foodie" homemaker through WS, SLT and other culinary stores. Rocker profiles on even the Santoku work well for their target market. 10 years ago they were the new kids on the block. Now they compete well with the Wusties and Henckels. And to their credit they are the only Japanese brand to establish a (largely unused) sharpening infrastructure so that the knives can be somewhat maintained.
​ But most of their target market does nothing to sharpen. Some will use a steel occasionally, some may use a pull thru device. A very few savvy customers will use an in-house sharpening service that gets them a few pulls thru grinding wheels set for 20 degree bevels. I've used "sharp" Shuns that are duller than an Al Gore speech.​ 
They are not bad knives, most people can't or won't maintain them as good knives.

:my2cents:​


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## Guss2 (Jan 27, 2014)

"They are not bad knives, most people can't or won't maintain them as good knives."
Completely agree.


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## NO ChoP! (Jan 27, 2014)

We have a guy at the club who has a bag full of Shuns. He takes very good care of them. They are always whistling sharp. I would happily use any of his knives in a pinch...

Since I've come along, he's picked up a few new toys, though.


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## Ruso (Jan 27, 2014)

Given that Shun is part of Kershaw knives, and Kershaw being an US company I do not see that surprising that they have a great success in the marketing department. US always have been a top notch when marketing is involved.


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## Guss2 (Jan 27, 2014)

I always thought Kershaw hunting knives were supposed to be pretty good, am I wrong? Honestly, I have no idea. Gary


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## CoqaVin (Jan 27, 2014)

I understand that they look cool and everything the appeal they have looking wise but if you don't take care of it it won't be that great as I have seen before a nice Shun Premier looking like the Rocky Mountains


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 27, 2014)

CoqaVin said:


> I understand that they look cool and everything the appeal they have looking wise but if you don't take care of it it won't be that great as I have seen before a nice Shun Premier looking like the Rocky Mountains



:rofl2:True they lose some of their bling with use even if look like rocky Mts. guess main thing is can still take an edge & cut decent.


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## labor of love (Jan 27, 2014)

actually, most pros i know are either shun or miyabi people. personally if i had to choose id go with miyabi just because the profile is better. whats even weirder is that ive overheard many cooks loyal to shun insist that the profile is too curvy. but they usually enjoy everything else about the knife so they just deal with it. wonder who out there really enjoys that crazy high tip profile?


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## CoqaVin (Jan 27, 2014)

some people think shun, miyabi, etc are the only thing little do they know the Miyabi is really not that bad though but the Shun I am definitely not a fan of the profile on that thing


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## jared08 (Jan 27, 2014)

When I went looking for my first real knife, after a set of whustoff from my mother for christmas, all I knew existed was shun along side masahiro and misono bc of my newest chef at the time. After "simple" reasearch I found the miyabi and got a 240 kaizen. I can't really complain about it for 150 $. And at the time the same size misono was still 200+. . I bought a shun nakiri shortly after, took a tidiculous edge, but not my style and sold to my saute guy.


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## jared08 (Jan 27, 2014)

Ill add. That shun nakiri was an upgrade from his porche chroma santoku. One of the ugliest knives I've seen..


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## easy13 (Jan 27, 2014)

Im not mad at a Miyabi Kaizen. Profile is eons ahead of a shun, nice weight and fit in the hand too.


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## Geo87 (Jan 28, 2014)

keithsaltydog said:


> I find them a little handle heavy..



I think it's the wood ... Here's a pic of one without the handle.
This is a friends shun he is letting me convert to wa & thin.... 
Why? Why not


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## Geo87 (Jan 28, 2014)

Woops...should have said converting to octagon instead of D shape .


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## Stumblinman (Jan 28, 2014)

Weird has wondering what was in there. I've always liked their bolsters


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 28, 2014)

Nice geoff post a picture when your pau


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## XooMG (Jan 28, 2014)

I have been wondering about the apparent (if not explicit) disdain for Shun, but I haven't been exposed to them much, so I went to the website to look at the lineup.

My impression is that the tips are really high and there's a lot of curve/belly to the knives and that doesn't mesh well with the cutting styles of folks here.

Some pieces, like the nakiri and some utility and the blue kiritsuke, actually don't look too bad...and at least one parer looks nice. I guess in those cases, it's just a matter of comparing to other available knives and finding them not worth the price or hype.

I can't find anything in the Shun line that really appeals to me other than _maybe_ the nakiri, but I have a few of those already. Plenty of other options that I like more, but I don't think I'd ridicule anyone for owning/liking or wanting one.


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## Sharbuckle (Feb 5, 2014)

I don't mind the shun premier series, I think that ken onion series was vomit inducing though, maintain the edge on shuns and they can be great


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## Keith Sinclair (Feb 10, 2014)

Well I have been using the Shuns over 3 weeks now.It takes some desipline as I have some fine cutters on my magblock.Been doing alot of chopping to give the Gyuto a workout.I like the small slicer the best,it was the knife wt. some major chips.

I have not experienced any chipping at all.Which leads me to conclude that the chipping in Shuns is because of their widespread use and outright knife abuse


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## Stumblinman (Feb 10, 2014)

Ouch a little rough there. Maybe shun should have a new slogan. Buy our knives cause they can be abused in professional kitchens for years and the chips sharpen right out ! Where's the shamwow guy with a cinder block and a wet stone ?


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## The Anti-Chrysler (Mar 17, 2014)

My first Japanese knife was an 8" Shun classic that I bought about 5 years ago. It's a nicely made knife, was stupid sharp out of the box, and I got it for substantially cheaper than retail. My only complaint with it is the high tip/big belly. Last year I got a screamin' deal on some Shun Fuji,, and they are truly excellent. Nice profiles, fairly thin (could be a touch thinner, but one would need to have good handling skills), flawless F&F. I use the 6-1/2 gyuto almost daily, no chipping at all and edge maintenance is a breeze with a wood-backed leather strop. I have yet to put it to the stones.

For someone who wants a nicely made VG-10 knife with a better profile, similar quality, and for less $ than Shun classic, here is what I would recommend. http://www.hocho-knife.com/yaxell-mon-3-layers-vg-10-micarta-handle-chef-knife-gyuto-200mm/
Or look at the Zen line for about 10% more $. Still much less than Shun Classic, and I can say from personal experience that they are quite good.


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## labor of love (Mar 17, 2014)

$99 for a tojiro dp seems to be a better deal to me than any shun or mayabi offering.


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## panda (Mar 19, 2014)

labor of love said:


> $99 for a tojiro dp seems to be a better deal to me than any shun or mayabi offering.


only $75 from amazon which is where i got mine :thumbsup:


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## rodneyat (Mar 19, 2014)

I had one Shun (classic 8") that I purchased on Ebay a while back just to see what all the fuss was about. My take: like many have said...they are not necessarily bad knives. Personally, I did find it VERY handle heavy. Which, is just not my thing at all. It almost feels in your hand like a German knife that is pretending to be Japanese.  And yes, the blade was quite thick. Personally, it was not my thing. And yes, I think there are a lot of other knives that I like better in the same price range. After using the Shun a few times I sharpened it really well and put it back up on Ebay and even made a few bucks.  For a home chef that is looking for a "knife for the masses" I think the Miyabi line is probably a slightly better choice and the Mac knives are a WAY better choice. They all have very consistent fit and finish and have a good company backing them. But, these are all still japenese knives made for the US market for sure.


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## jamaster14 (Mar 19, 2014)

rodneyat said:


> It almost feels in your hand like a German knife that is pretending to be Japanese.  And yes, the blade was quite thick. Personally, it was not my thing. And yes, I think there are a lot of other knives that I like better in the same price range. .



thats because thats basically what it is... any knife mass marketed in the U.S. is going to be at the very least a tad handle heavy... because american's as a large general consumer base associate the weight of a knife with quality and dont take balance into account. they'll sell better with heavier handles.


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## Bigdaddyb (Mar 19, 2014)

There are 6 Shuns in my home. Two of them are my son's. I bought all of mine from eBay either used or "floor models". They continue to serve me VERY well, sharpen to an edge that I'm quite impressed with, have shown no sign of chipping, or failing in any way. To this, I add the following caveats.

1. I am NOT a working chef. My needs aren't nearly as demanding as those who are "on the line" will have.

2. I am NOT a knife snob. I LOVE great knives. I also LOVE solid, functional knives, especially when I can get a steal of a deal on them. 

3. I have been told I have "hobby ADD". This means I've been on lots of web forums over the years. I've noticed common human trends on all of them. Some folk absolutely MUST have "the best" and what they have must be the end-all be all. Some folks are like that. It doesn't make them bad. Others could care less about "brand" and are seeking to get the job done with some level of "affordability" that is unique to them. They demand quality, but not necessarily "the best". They are very loyal to the task at hand, but not so much to "brands". These two basic personalities annoy the snot out of each other. Transparency demands that I confess my membership in the latter group.

For me, getting great deals on Shun knives has served me well. The knives serve me well. I included the rest to provide context, since I'm new to the discussions here.


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## The Anti-Chrysler (Mar 19, 2014)

I picked up all of my Shun/Kai products for substantially below retail price. The only one I really no longer use is the Classic 8" chef's knife. The tip is too high for my liking. The Fuji line is excellent, and are much more Japanese in design, not to mention flawlessly made.


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## Mucho Bocho (Mar 19, 2014)

Bigdaddyb said:


> There are 6 Shuns in my home. Two of them are my son's. I bought all of mine from eBay either used or "floor models". They continue to serve me VERY well, sharpen to an edge that I'm quite impressed with, have shown no sign of chipping, or failing in any way. To this, I add the following caveats.
> 
> 1. I am NOT a working chef. My needs aren't nearly as demanding as those who are "on the line" will have.
> 
> ...



A lot of wisdom shared here. I'm in the echelon crowd but appreciate those that are not. Can't stand those in the middle


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## labor of love (Mar 19, 2014)

There is a lot of room between "the best" and shuns though. It really isnt challenging to find a nicer knife in the $100-150 price range whatsoever. But enjoy what works for you.


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## JHunter (Mar 19, 2014)

I fully agree with the abundance of nicer knives in a lower price range but for what they offer in better performance they sorely lack in marketing and brand recognition that the Shun does have.


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## Bigdaddyb (Mar 19, 2014)

Mucho Bocho said:


> A lot of wisdom shared here. I'm in the echelon crowd but appreciate those that are not. Can't stand those in the middle



I'm a skilled home cook. I dislike when my friends call me a "chef". I'm not. I haven't earned that title and would fail in the job.

I have no argument for those who posit that there are better for the money. There are probably better at the killer deals that I got on mine. I've long used Kershaw knives as daily carry tools, so dealing with KAI was a comfortable starting place for me. 

I take issue with those who declare Shun, Wusthof, and other reputable "retail" brands "junk", etc. Mine have served me well. Are they overpriced off the shelf? Absolutely, though not nearly so much as the real garbage that's out there.

Thanks for the kind words.


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## Keith Sinclair (Mar 20, 2014)

Just finished repairing a Ken Onion 10" chef knife. The tip was bent & broke.The scale on one side was separating from the tang.Quite a bit of epoxy after blasting the bacteria with a hot hair dryer.This is a 200.00 dollar knife on Amazon.

I do not have to have the best however a knife like this brings out the snob in me.It has many artistic curves,very little blade contact on the board 1.5" at the heel,on a 10" blade the rest is in the air. It has a thick heavy bolster with built in pinch grip curves.If you do use the pinch grip the rest of the handle is extremely uncomfortable with a big bulge on the bottom of the grip.I cannot find any position where this crappy handle is comfortable.

I don't hate all shuns,think the premier chef knives are not bad.However I can think of at least a dozen Japan blades at 200.00 & under that would take over a Shun.Probably a lot more out there that I don't know about.


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## labor of love (Mar 20, 2014)

Overlooking the profile, the premiere is a totally decent knife for the price.


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## marc4pt0 (Mar 20, 2014)

I've got 3 shun Fuji, and 2 of the shun Bob Kramer meiji. The BK's are nice, but their handles are among my favorites ever. The Fuji line is darn near impeccable. Things like chipping and sticking are practically non-existing with mine and they do get their turns in rotation at work.

Certainly didn't pay store prices for these. Some were floor models plus my 20% discount and others off the bay.
I would put my 8.5" Fuji gyuto up against most of the knives I have, it will hold it's own. In fact I'll go ahead and say the same about the Fuji slicer and honesuki as well.


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