# Toyama



## El Pescador

Maxim- can you expand on your write up on this maker? I have both a gyuto and a suji and am very impressed with both. I'd like to know more about him.

Thanks, Pesky


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## Von blewitt

I like the look of the Toyamas, definately on my list.

I wouldn't hold my breath for an answer from Maksim here, he hasn't logged in to KKF since January. Might be worth an email.


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## marc4pt0

I'd like to hear what you find out


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## Smurfmacaw

Yeah, I'd like to get some Jnats but his site says he's moving and etc.....had a good transaction on a shig kitaeji but now I'll wait and see.


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## brainsausage

I'm curious as well. Very impressed with the 270 gyuto I picked up.


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## aboynamedsuita

Smurfmacaw said:


> had a good transaction on a shig kitaeji



YES!!! Now you won't ask for me to sell mine anymore
:bliss:

About Toyama, I've read that there is an apprentice relationship with Watanabe going back several generations. Suppose that explains the similarities.


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## Twistington

Sent the link to him, but atm he is really busy. New house that requires a lot of renovations etc.


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## Smurfmacaw

tjangula said:


> YES!!! Now you won't ask for me to sell mine anymore
> :bliss:
> 
> About Toyama, I've read that there is an apprentice relationship with Watanabe going back several generations. Suppose that explains the similarities.



Nope! That was a Yanagiba lol. I still need Gyutos in 240 and 270. :muahaha:

You know it needs a good home.


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## DamageInc

Twistington said:


> Sent the link to him, but atm he is really busy. New house that requires a lot of renovations etc.



Do you know why he hasn't posted for nearly a whole year?


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## Mucho Bocho

DamageInc said:


> Do you know why he hasn't posted for nearly a whole year?



Have been thinking the same thing for a while. Maxim is like a ghost these days, its too bad cause this forum really values his insight. 

He's an original OG Knut.


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## marc4pt0

Nothing wrong with being over busy running your own business! That said, I do miss reading his wise words


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## Asteger

My impression has been that Maxim is a great guy with his gear and tools and know how, but some kinds of communication aren't so much his thing, 1-1 or via forums, even considering that this is an English language forum and the language gap. I imagine his business is doing well enough and he's more focused on other aspects of that and/or perhaps just his personal stuff and that's his preference. Fair enough, but yes the forum does lack some useful voices compared to the past. 

Even with vendors, I guess interest in participating here comes and goes.


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## aboynamedsuita

I've gotten responses to messages on his website in due course. I can understand staying off the forums too, I kinda have a love-hate relationship with spending so much time online.


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## joyless

Those knives look great, I think this is going to be my next purchase. Can't go wrong with anything from Maxim. I love my Itinomonns to death.


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## Twistington

DamageInc said:


> Do you know why he hasn't posted for nearly a whole year?



Just too few hours in a day.


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## DamageInc

joyless said:


> Those knives look great, I think this is going to be my next purchase. Can't go wrong with anything from Maxim. I love my Itinomonns to death.



I highly recommend them. Some of my favorite knives.



Twistington said:


> Just too few hours in a day.



Sometimes the simplest explanations make the most sense. While many miss his posts, it's good to know that he's busy for the right reasons.


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## maxim

Thank you so much all that you miss me  i miss bing on forum as well  But i do watch out on forum and Dan updates me regularly on what happening here  
I been moving all my stuff to a new house. So i had a lot to do past year, house sale, new house, moving building new workshop New wife, Child etc etc ... 
So it is simply thats why and you have to know i love being on forum and wish i have much more time to be here. But right now i just to overrun  
My priority will still be to answer emails , fulfill orders and try constantly to get cool and new stuff 

On Toyama i go to Japan this April and try to get cool video Out about Toyamas knives, he really deserves as much attention as Kato and Shig people just don't know him yet


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## Matus

maxim said:


> ... new workshop New wife, Child etc etc ...



OK, that is admittedly the most compact way to say that your whole life changed from the ground. I hope all is going well.


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## Marcelo Amaral

Wow! Big changes. Good to know everything is alright. Thanks for being such a good vendor! God bless!


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## DamageInc

Can't wait to see that Toyama video. The one you made of Kiyoshi Kato was what made me start buying Kato knives. Absolutely incredible, and I hope the one on Toyama will be as good.


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## XooMG

I've been considering a Toyama for a long time but could never quite bring myself to order. Considered the 210 gyuto but I have a few too many knives in that range...considered the 210 nakiri but not sure if it'll be my cup of tea...and considered a single bevel like the 180 mukimono but couldn't think of a practical use for it.

Still, I look at the Toyama page every once in a while and consider ordering one...just glad I cannot decide which.


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## DamageInc

The nakiri is giant just so you know. There is an image floating around somewhere of a comparison between the Toyama 210mm and some other nakiris of 180 and 165mm. It's huge.

I love my 240mm. Use it just as much as my 240mm Kato, even though they are a bit different.


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## aboynamedsuita

I'm glad to hear that you're keeping busy in the best possible ways Maksim. I'm looking forward to the Toyama video; enjoyed the Shigefusa and Kato ones. I really like my Toyama 135 mukimono, so much so that I'm having a custom handle made for it.


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## TheDispossessed

There was a left handed mukimono by Toyama that I regret not buying. Whoever you are out there.....


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## SolidSnake03

Gotta agree with you on that one (the Mukimono) being a fellow lefty, shouldn't have waited and thought about it


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## chinacats

tjangula said:


> I'm glad to hear that you're keeping busy in the best possible ways Maksim. I'm looking forward to the Toyama video; enjoyed the Shigefusa and Kato ones. I really like my Toyama 135 mukimono, so much so that I'm having a custom handle made for it.





TheDispossessed said:


> There was a left handed mukimono by Toyama that I regret not buying. Whoever you are out there.....





SolidSnake03 said:


> Gotta agree with you on that one (the Mukimono) being a fellow lefty, shouldn't have waited and thought about it



Yep, no guess where that may have gone.:tease:


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## joyless

I love my Toyama 240mm gyuto! I wish the fit and finish would be better, but this is an easy fix. My only gripe with this knife is that it will discolour onions pretty badly, to the point where I had to bring another knife to work, just for onions.


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## DamageInc

joyless said:


> I love my Toyama 240mm gyuto! I wish the fit and finish would be better, but this is an easy fix. My only gripe with this knife is that it will discolour onions pretty badly, to the point where I had to bring another knife to work, just for onions.



That's strange. After an hour of use out of the box, my 240mm is damn near non-reactive. Just two days ago I diced three kilos of onions without the slightest of discoloration.


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## TheDispossessed

Did you remove the lacquer? 


DamageInc said:


> That's strange. After an hour of use out of the box, my 240mm is damn near non-reactive. Just two days ago I diced three kilos of onions without the slightest of discoloration.


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## Asteger

joyless said:


> I love my Toyama 240mm gyuto! I wish the fit and finish would be better, but this is an easy fix. My only gripe with this knife is that it will discolour onions pretty badly, to the point where I had to bring another knife to work, just for onions.



Reactivity is normal for me. The finish is good, particularly because it's very easy to maintain. Scratches from sharpening/thinning? - easily polished off, not something you could say with a Kato for eg. The tip-heel Sanjo-style finish is ideal for this. Also I've noticed the spine-parallel polish lines are not too deep but deep enough that they have remained when I've used a bit of slurry to erase sharpening/thining scratches, and so easy to restore it all. Good knives in several ways.

Dispossed - Lacquer? Neither of my Toyama were lacquered


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## TheDispossessed

My 210 was definitely lacquered.


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## maxim

Toyamas is not lacquered


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## TheDispossessed

I have just shamed myself for all time. 


maxim said:


> Toyamas is not lacquered


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## maxim

Nehh... some Camille oil and wax i put on them can be confused with lacquer


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## Asteger

Asteger said:


> Dispossessed - Lacquer? Neither of my Toyama were lacquered





TheDispossessed said:


> My 210 was definitely lacquered.





TheDispossessed said:


> maxim said:
> 
> 
> 
> Toyamas is not lacquered
> 
> 
> 
> I have just shamed myself for all time.
Click to expand...


Haha, enjoyed this. I also live in fear of ***** up, which happens frequently given the hour and state I usually post in, those tiny touchscreens, and because I often mess things up.

However, let us still remember this. Future generations will pour over our words: to them we have a solemn responsibility. :eyebrow:


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## TheDispossessed

I usually say my stupidest things on here whilst drunk but this one can be chalked up to straight stupidity.


Asteger said:


> Haha, enjoyed this. I also live in fear of ***** up, which happens frequently given the hour and state I usually post in, those tiny touchscreens, and because I often mess things up.
> 
> However, let us still remember this. Future generations will pour over our words: to them we have a solemn responsibility. :eyebrow:


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## Asteger

TheDispossessed said:


> I usually say my stupidest things on here whilst drunk



Glad it's not only me. At least you and I have an excuse!


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## maxim

drunk and post is the best way of post


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## cheflarge

:goodpost: lus1: :bliss: :cool2:


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## SolidSnake03

Well yeah, now I have a pretty good idea where that lefty mukimono went...

That said, I definitely want to get a hold of one of these someday, they (Toyama) are on my bucket list of knives I someday hope to own/try out along with Kato, Shigehiro and Syousin Sakura. The list has become so much shorter over time and finally dwindling to these few haha!


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## Asteger

Shigehiro are lacquered.

Dispossessed- did you somehiw confuse Toyama with them above?


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## TheDispossessed

Asteger said:


> Shigehiro are lacquered.
> 
> Dispossessed- did you somehiw confuse Toyama with them above?



No this was definitely a Toyama 210 gyuto ordered from JNS.
I might as well chime in with some impressions of the knife if I'm gonna take up space in this thread.

Nice hefty profile but still felt agile, serious heel height would be a plus for most. The knife felt solid, had a little flex but not much, clean and even lamination lines, a great profile, beautiful kanji. I like the finish marks ran lengthwise, a la Shigefusa to ease the work of future refinishing by hand. The little bit of work I did with the knife was more than satisfactory, really really good ootb edge. Cut very well and was able to handle small and precise tasks with as much ease as more heavy work. I even thought the handle was decent, but I'm in the minority here that I love a good old ho wood d handle.
You can keep your bog oak........
The only two cons, which are really really minimal for me were the rough choil, more ocd here than actual discomfort while using. The other was I'm not crazy about the bead/media blasted 'Kasumi' finish but it will surely appeal to some and looks good in its own regard. Could easily be finished out by hand in a matter of 15 minutes if one so desired.
Overall, impressed and the price seems very very fair. Dollar for dollar the best carbon San Mai I've bought at or even near that price point per mm.
Thanks again Maksim!
Cheers
Matteo


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## wbusby1

TheDispossessed said:


> The other was I'm not crazy about the bead/media blasted 'Kasumi' finish but it will surely appeal to some and looks good in its own regard. Could easily be finished out by hand in a matter of 15 minutes if one so desired.



What do you mean by "finished out"? I'm not that in love with the kasumi either but didn't think it was really changeable. ?


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## TheDispossessed

The finish from the blasting should be extremely shallow. So you could sand it out with paper or finger stones quite easily without significantly altering the geometry.


wbusby1 said:


> What do you mean by "finished out"? I'm not that in love with the kasumi either but didn't think it was really changeable. ?


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## aboynamedsuita

TheDispossessed said:


> There was a left handed mukimono by Toyama that I regret not buying. Whoever you are out there.....





SolidSnake03 said:


> Gotta agree with you on that one (the Mukimono) being a fellow lefty, shouldn't have waited and thought about it





chinacats said:


> Yep, no guess where that may have gone.:tease:





SolidSnake03 said:


> Well yeah, now I have a pretty good idea where that lefty mukimono went...



Actually the 135 I got is the RH version and I got it on purpose. For smaller tasks off of the board I often hold the cutting edge up and towards me, which works out well for RH SB. That said, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a LH version in a larger size or a different knife altogether from Toyama.


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## SolidSnake03

Gah, so then who got the lefty?!


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## Andrey V

Let me add my 2 cents. 
I tried many Toyamas- i found the proper one ( for me). 
And the winner is.... Toyama Suji 270!!!
Not the Gyutos, not his petties. Btw- i have even 2 Yanagibas- 300 and 330, one Sakimaru, one " normal ". 
But the Suji..270... It's really cool. It's amazing. It gives the proper laser feeling. I love it. Really.


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## limpet

I was tempted to buy the k-gyuto during the sale but I already have the regular gyuto. Instead I purchased the 180 damascus petty. Used it for the first time today. Just excellent.  Not octagonal handle however, it was d-shaped ho wood, but I don't mind. The handle was pretty small in circumference, which I like for a petty I want to use on the board.


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## DamageInc

Very nice. I was tempted to pick up the 210 damascus gyuto, but I just couldn't justify it. Maybe next time.


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## DamageInc

I was thinking, as we saw a Toyama honyaki yanagiba a few weeks ago, could we possibly be seeing some honyaki gyutos in the future from him? I for one would be very interested in getting my hands on one.


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## aboynamedsuita

DamageInc said:


> I was thinking, as we saw a Toyama honyaki yanagiba a few weeks ago, could we possibly be seeing some honyaki gyutos in the future from him? I for one would be very interested in getting my hands on one.



I think it's very possible. I have a honyaki (kensaki) yanagi from Watanabe and notwithstanding the differences with the tip, they look remarkably similar, as do the sujis and gyutos. I recall reading that there was a working relationship with Toyama and the Watanabe forefathers which may explain some similarities (same shape/profile, hamon on honyaki, Damascus pattern, etc.)

I guess what I'm thinking is that it seems very likely that a knife made by Watanabe can also be made by Toyama and vice-versa


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## niwaki-boy

tj .. I saw your 300 suji review on jns, pretty sure it's you. I'm thinking of picking one up... question is ... is it as right hand biased as the choil shot indicates on the item listing?


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## DamageInc

niwaki-boy said:


> tj .. I saw your 300 suji review on jns, pretty sure it's you. I'm thinking of picking one up... question is ... is it as right hand biased as the choil shot indicates on the item listing?



I have one as well, and I have used it nearly every day since I got it a little over a year ago. I have not noticed any bias. Then again, these knives are very much hand made and can vary.


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## aboynamedsuita

niwaki-boy said:


> tj .. I saw your 300 suji review on jns, pretty sure it's you. I'm thinking of picking one up... question is ... is it as right hand biased as the choil shot indicates on the item listing?



I'm actually a lefty and haven't had a problem using it. The choil shot picture also looks a bit deceiving because the right side is eased a bit more for a right hand pinch grip, but I polished out the grind marks on the choil and eased the left side.

Never thought I'd say this but I'm going to be putting my Toyama suji on BST, as after a 1+ year wait I am now getting a handle for my Watanabe honyaki suji so will have a similar knife to fill the roll of the Toyama.


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## niwaki-boy

Damage and tj ..Thanks for the replies. Maksim has put the hurt on me lately so not sure if can pull it off. But will definitely be in near future!


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## zetieum

I am really considering buying Toyoma guyto. Although I am hesitating for two things:
1. I am left handed and I have seen some choil shoot with some right-handed bias
2. Toyoma or Watanabe ?


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## Matus

I have used Watanabe 240 and found the grind to be rather symmetric. Since the blade is thinnly ground with not too pronounced convex grind, there is not that much space left for asymmetry.


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## zoze

Matus said:


> I have used Watanabe 240 and found the grind to be rather symmetric. Since the blade is thinnly ground with not too pronounced convex grind, there is not that much space left for asymmetry.


Mathieu tried exactly this same knife, already. He might be worried whether the grind is more or less equal on other examples.
Anyways, no relief. He's hooked.


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## zetieum

zoze said:


> Mathieu tried exactly this same knife, already. He might be worried whether the grind is more or less equal on other examples.
> Anyways, no relief. He's hooked.



Yeah. I am indeed completely hooked. It took me 30 sec. I grabbed the knife, cut two slices of a carrot and that was it. WOW effect. 
I will definitively buy one or the other with my xmas bonus. The question if which one...


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## wbusby1

my 2 cents: bought a toyama 240 gyuto from JNS and a Watanabe direct. Sinichi told me he would select me one suited for a lefty, didn't tell Maksim I was a lefty. Both makers claim to be 50/50. The toyama was more lefty-friendly of the two, both were ground with slight bias for righty. Those were just 2 examples though.


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## DamageInc

zetieum said:


> I am really considering buying Toyoma guyto. Although I am hesitating for two things:
> 1. I am left handed and I have seen some choil shoot with some right-handed bias
> 2. Toyoma or Watanabe ?



You will be happy with the quality of either, but shipping and customs will be much more friendly with Toyama from JNS. Neither my 240 or the 210 Toyama gyutos I've tried have had any bias. The handle is a soft d-shape, but I don't think that should be an issue.


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## El Pescador

I couldn't tell the difference between my Toyama gyuto and my Watanabe. Profile almost the same to cut the same, grind the same, pretty much exactly the same knives.


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## zetieum

@ElPescador: very interesting to read. When trying the watanabe I was impressed by the grind: it is a heavy knife, quite a lot of steel, still it goes through hard ingredient like a charm and does not crack carrots. The Toyoma does the same?

Same Question to you @wbusby1 since you seem to own both !


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## brainsausage

Just posting a couple crappy pics of my Toyama 270 for Labor of Love, as I can't seem to attach images to PM's through the mobile. I guess the rest of you all can take a look too if you'd like


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## skewed

zetieum said:


> @ElPescador: very interesting to read. When trying the watanabe I was impressed by the grind: it is a heavy knife, quite a lot of steel, still it goes through hard ingredient like a charm and does not crack carrots. The Toyoma does the same?
> 
> Same Question to you @wbusby1 since you seem to own both !



I realize this is from a few weeks ago but was unanswered.

I haven't had the pleasure of using a Watanabe but I certainly can speak of the Toyama: when cutting carrot coins at high speed for a commercial kitchen, I laugh and giggle like the Joker. The grind combined with the heft makes carrots feel like a cucumber. Beautiful shiny carrot coins go flying everywhere.


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## dwalker

My Toyama is the best cutter I have. Highly recommend.


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## jljohn

skewed said:


> I realize this is from a few weeks ago but was unanswered.
> 
> I haven't had the pleasure of using a Watanabe but I certainly can speak of the Toyama: when cutting carrot coins at high speed for a commercial kitchen, I laugh and giggle like the Joker. The grind combined with the heft makes carrots feel like a cucumber. Beautiful shiny carrot coins go flying everywhere.



This is such an awesome mental picture. I can't wait to get my hands on a Toyama gyuto!


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## El Pescador

zetieum said:


> @ElPescador: very interesting to read. When trying the watanabe I was impressed by the grind: it is a heavy knife, quite a lot of steel, still it goes through hard ingredient like a charm and does not crack carrots. The Toyoma does the same?
> 
> Same Question to you @wbusby1 since you seem to own both !



Sorry for not answering sooner, I wanted to go back and look at both knives to answer your question. The Mighty Watanabe is a little bigger; 3mm and 12 grams heavier. Not enough of a difference to differentiate the 2. they cut the same for the most part, but the tip on the Toyama is thinner.


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## limpet

Took some not-very-good-pictures-but-anyways of my Toyama Damascus Petty 180. 

It's beside my Tanaka gyuto since they look pretty similar with the damascus pattern. The Toyama is more polished though. 

I really like this petty, it feels very "mini-gyuto-ish" in its proportions, 35 mm tall.


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## dwalker

I've been tempted by that petty myself. Now even more so after seeing your pics. Is it heavy ish like the gyuto?


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## limpet

dwalker said:


> I've been tempted by that petty myself. Now even more so after seeing your pics. Is it heavy ish like the gyuto?


The weight is 113 grams. The blade gives a solid, stiff impression, but scaled down to this size it feels more "normal" than the gyuto (I have the 240 Toyama Gyuto). All my other pettys to compare with are smaller and lighter than this. I would say the Toyama is more blade heavy than my other pettys, with the balance point approx 15 mm in front of the heel. Maybe this is because of the rather small handle. The handle I got was d-shaped, not octagonal, and rather small in circumference (21 mm tall and 16 mm wide at the ferrule), giving it a bit of a suji feel. But I like it. Don't want to have big handles on pettys, because I like to use them on the board and it gives more clearance.


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## limpet

limpet said:


> Took some not-very-good-pictures-but-anyways of my Toyama Damascus Petty 180.
> 
> It's beside my Tanaka gyuto since they look pretty similar with the damascus pattern. The Toyama is more polished though.
> 
> I really like this petty, it feels very "mini-gyuto-ish" in its proportions, 35 mm tall.



CORRECTION: My Toyama Damascus Petty 180 is *38 mm tall* at the heel. (Spec is 35 mm at JNS)


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## brianh

Confession: I was kinda eh about mine until last two days when I've been prepping potatoes, root veg. That was fun.


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## cenc

I am definitely going to be a Toyama collector for the rest of my life. I hope he gains the prestige he deserves. The 210mm Nakiri I own is phenomenal.


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## TheCaptain

cenc said:


> I am definitely going to be a Toyama collector for the rest of my life. I hope he gains the prestige he deserves. The 210mm Nakiri I own is phenomenal.



+1. Picked that up recently from JNS as my first Toyama. It won't be my last...


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## trvn

Just put in an order for a 240 Toyama kasumi, along with a 240 Munetoshi gyuto and the munetoshi butcher. Looking forward to seeing what all the fuss is about! Looking for something heavier and couldn't resist


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## fatboylim

TheCaptain said:


> +1. Picked that up recently from JNS as my first Toyama. It won't be my last...



And +1 

I don't normally keep 2 from the same maker to try more variations, but Toyama is an exception!


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## labor of love

Anybody here used a Toyama ktip gyuto yet?


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## trvn

Got my Toyama today...noticed there had been some obvious work done on the tip. It's all scuffed up and not polished like the rest of the blade. I'd post pics but I don't think I can yet. Anyone else get this?


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## dwalker

trvn said:


> Got my Toyama today...noticed there had been some obvious work done on the tip. It's all scuffed up and not polished like the rest of the blade. I'd post pics but I don't think I can yet. Anyone else get this?



It's common. Mine is the same. If you are referring to the gyuto, that is.


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## trvn

dwalker said:


> It's common. Mine is the same. If you are referring to the gyuto, that is.



Ok that is good to hear. I got a Munetoshi gyuto and butcher in the same order that also have some concerns, so I was beginning to wonder what was going on. Emailed Maxim but just thought I'd see what KKF thought


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## dwalker

trvn said:


> Ok that is good to hear. I got a Munetoshi gyuto and butcher in the same order that also have some concerns, so I was beginning to wonder what was going on. Emailed Maxim but just thought I'd see what KKF thought



Attack some onions with it and you won't be concerned about the tip ever again. That knife is a prep beast and probably my favorite gyuto in the rotation. Once you get some patina going you won't notice it and you can even it out when you need to thin it. I, for the time being, am afraid to touch it for fear of lessening performance. I don't have a Munetoshi so I can't help you there.


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## trvn

dwalker said:


> Attack some onions with it and you won't be concerned about the tip ever again. That knife is a prep beast and probably my favorite gyuto in the rotation. Once you get some patina going you won't notice it and you can even it out when you need to thin it. I, for the time being, am afraid to touch it for fear of lessening performance. I don't have a Munetoshi so I can't help you there.



Yeah, I don't think I'll worry about it after I use it some. The tip shape doesn't look quite right but I might be swayed by all the scuff marks on it.


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## dwalker

I thought mine might have had a tip repair until I saw another exactly the same way. I think that's just how they are.


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## trvn

dwalker said:


> I thought mine might have had a tip repair until I saw another exactly the same way. I think that's just how they are.



Sounds good. Loving the Toyama so far! No concerns with the tip after I've used it some and this knife is quickly becoming my favorite :thumbsup:


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## brainsausage

trvn said:


> Sounds good. Loving the Toyama so far! No concerns with the tip after I've used it some and this knife is quickly becoming my favorite :thumbsup:



Both of my gyutos were the same in regards to the tip. And they are also the only gyutos I've never felt the need to grind the tips down. They're perfect as is, especially considering the heft and height of the blades overall. He's doing something very right with his gyutos for sure. And yes, I'm a well avowed fanboy at this point.


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## lagrangeL2

I've been looking at buying a Toyama 240 gyuto. Has anyone noticed if the grind is slanted towards right-handers?


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## labor of love

lagrangeL2 said:


> I've been looking at buying a Toyama 240 gyuto. Has anyone noticed if the grind is slanted towards right-handers?



Usually, but not always.


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## DamageInc

Did a few videos with my Toyamas, if anyone is interested. Not many videos out there showing them off.

[video=youtube;fYoUNOnCZpQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYoUNOnCZpQ[/video]

[video=youtube;Kv5VXpQ96YE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kv5VXpQ96YE[/video]


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## khashy

DamageInc said:


> Did a few videos with my Toyamas, if anyone is interested. Not many videos out there showing them off.
> 
> [video=youtube;fYoUNOnCZpQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYoUNOnCZpQ[/video]
> 
> [video=youtube;Kv5VXpQ96YE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kv5VXpQ96YE[/video]



I have actually watched these vids multiple times. Grateful for these as they aided my decision to get a big T!


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## Badgertooth

Yo.. there are a few vids because we all lost our minds trying to win a ktip gyuto on a JNS competition. @matus production levels are unreal 

https://youtu.be/K6m8JJobFuI

Here is my sloppy attempt

https://youtu.be/sz35AG1rMN0


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## fatboylim

Badgertooth said:


> Yo.. there are a few vids because we all lost our minds trying to win a ktip gyuto on a JNS competition. @matus production levels are unreal
> 
> https://youtu.be/K6m8JJobFuI
> 
> Here is my sloppy attempt
> 
> https://youtu.be/sz35AG1rMN0



+1 Matus' videos look pro! Mine was all over the place!


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## Matus

thanks guys. I was motivated by a video made by a friend of mine so I payed those 15 for a full version of iMovie and spent 10 hours putting those few minutes together. It still is a very amateur video (very static), but I had quite some fun doing it. Seeing how long it took and how imperfect it is makes me to appreciate the well made videos more


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## Panamapeet

I'm thinking of buying a Toyama damascus, I assume from reading this that these are as well received as the normal gyuto? And does anyone have any experience with the k-tip gyuto?


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## stuplarosa

Spipet said:


> I'm thinking of buying a Toyama damascus, I assume from reading this that these are as well received as the normal gyuto?



I would be interested in an answer to this as well...


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## Matus

I would love to hear on the K-tip too. On Maxim's photos the K-tip seems to have a pronounced asymmetric grind. A very interesting knife indeed.


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## Sleep

I have the k tip. It's really nice. Edge profile is the same as the 270mm gyuto. Just missing 30mm off the tip. It's thinner than the 270 but still has great food release. Not sure how asymmetric it is. Haven't thought to look.


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## Matus

Sleep said:


> I have the k tip. It's really nice. Edge profile is the same as the 270mm gyuto. Just missing 30mm off the tip. It's thinner than the 270 but still has great food release. Not sure how asymmetric it is. Haven't thought to look.



Cool, thanks. I just noticed that 240 k-tip should be lighter than the 240 gyuto while having the same heel height - that would indicate that the grind is thinner.


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## Sleep

240mm just arrived. Lightweight.


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## ob-gym

My 210mm Toyama is downright nimble for the level of cutting power and convexing it has

The 240 looks amazing!


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## tommybig

Just to add one more data point.

My 240mm came with 220g. Lost 1g from polishing/sharpening and gained 20g from a heavier handle. So now at 239g and it feels better this way (with a heavier handle, not blade).


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## fatboylim

+1 the handle upgrade gives it an even better balance.


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## KimBronnum

@ob... I totalt agree reg the 210 gyoto feeling almost nimble in use. Very different to the 240's. 
I won the k-tip from JNS and I feel that I owe a review but I havn't had it done yet. 
In short I find the k-tip to be very similar to the original 240 only a little more robust feeling and with a lover tip. It is a superiour knife for puscutting vegs. The differences are minute on paper but in the feel of the knife in use, the k-tip has a bit of a really long nikiri-ish-feeling to it. It is a little bit hard to explain. The original 240 feels like a big knife. The k-tip feels taller and a bit shorter, but you don't mis any length at all. 
I hope it makes sence... 
- Kim


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## fatboylim

KimBronnum said:


> @ob... I totalt agree reg the 210 gyoto feeling almost nimble in use. Very different to the 240's.
> I won the k-tip from JNS and I feel that I owe a review but I havn't had it done yet.
> In short I find the k-tip to be very similar to the original 240 only a little more robust feeling and with a lover tip. It is a superiour knife for puscutting vegs. The differences are minute on paper but in the feel of the knife in use, the k-tip has a bit of a really long nikiri-ish-feeling to it. It is a little bit hard to explain. The original 240 feels like a big knife. The k-tip feels taller and a bit shorter, but you don't mis any length at all.
> I hope it makes sence...
> - Kim



Definitely interested in a review. I've only read that a k-tip is like a cross between a sujihiki slicer and a specialist vegetable nakiri and nothing like a standard gyuto. It sounds like it succeeds in push cutting and slicing, but is poor at tip chopping and rock chopping. 

Most interested in you hands on review.


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## Choppin

+1 on the 210 Toyama feeling nimble. Mine weights 175g and is really thin behind the edge, super thin tip also

210-220g for the 240 is a fairly big difference from the 250g at JNS's product page...


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## cyberbaton

Toyama is on middle weight side nowadays, mine 240 was around 220 gr too


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## Badgertooth

You lot have got me really interested in the 210. 270 makes my 270 Kato feel dainty. Not that that's a bad thing, it's such a pleasure to smash out dinner with. HT is nuuuuuuts too, apologies to anyone who's spammed by this from my other thread but this shows the edge this beast can take 

https://youtu.be/oEoZtY_DcYc


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## ob-gym

Badgertooth said:


> You lot have got me really interested in the 210. 270 makes my 270 Kato feel dainty. Not that that's a bad thing, it's such a pleasure to smash out dinner with. HT is nuuuuuuts too, apologies to anyone who's spammed by this from my other thread but this shows the edge this beast can take
> 
> https://youtu.be/oEoZtY_DcYc



Sick edge. Is that after some stropping or straight off the iromono? 

I've been hearing the 210 is a completely different beast and than 240/270 for a while now, and I'm thinking the same thing as you, a 240 might be on the horizon...


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## KimBronnum

Must say that having both 240 and 210 makes good sence in this case. Not just to own them &#128512;
- Kim


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## ob-gym

KimBronnum said:


> Must say that having both 240 and 210 makes good sence in this case. Not just to own them &#128512;
> - Kim



Pretty strong case to buy just to own them at this point, Toyama has got to be pushing 77/78 years old at this point and according to Maxim, has NO apprentices helping out.

How much longer can he keep forging, HT, grinding and sharpening?

By all accounts, Watanabe Shinichi is doing very similar and high quality work, but surely 50+ years (longer than Shinichi has been alive) of experience makes for a higher quality blade, no?


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## Badgertooth

ob-gym said:


> Sick edge. Is that after some stropping or straight off the iromono?
> 
> I've been hearing the 210 is a completely different beast and than 240/270 for a while now, and I'm thinking the same thing as you, a 240 might be on the horizon...



I swiped a bit on my jeans but no leather or balsa or compounds for this edge.


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## tommybig

ob-gym said:


> Pretty strong case to buy just to own them at this point, Toyama has got to be pushing 77/78 years old at this point and according to Maxim, has NO apprentices helping out.
> 
> How much longer can he keep forging, HT, grinding and sharpening?
> 
> By all accounts, Watanabe Shinichi is doing very similar and high quality work, but surely 50+ years (longer than Shinichi has been alive) of experience makes for a higher quality blade, no?



Shinichi refers to Toyama as one of his Masters. I think among blacksmiths they constantly help out each other if necessary. 

I do want to own a knife of both at some point, but going through the same thought process, i figured starting with a Toyama made more sense.


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## ob-gym

Badgertooth said:


> I swiped a bit on my jeans but no leather or balsa or compounds for this edge.



Very nice, apparently edge leading strokes aren't bad at all...

Also, that spray bottle is really handy for precise control of slurry!


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## ob-gym

tommybig said:


> Shinichi refers to Toyama as one of his Masters. I think among blacksmiths they constantly help out each other if necessary.
> 
> I do want to own a knife of both at some point, but going through the same thought process, i figured starting with a Toyama made more sense.



Murray Carter mentioned that blacksmiths don't have long lifespans (charcoal fumes, metal dust, hard physical labor, etc), even if he doesn't stop, a drastically reduced output could happen any time.

Definitely want knives from both, some people say Toyama has thinner grinds, so there are some differences


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## labor of love

Off the shelf Toyama are lighter knives but watanabe does custom work. Pick your poison.


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## cenc

Please someone... buy that honyaki yanagiba so I won't be tempted anymore.

I wonder how his honyaki feels.. 
Can anyone chime in about it?


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## Choppin

cenc said:


> Please someone... buy that honyaki yanagiba so I won't be tempted anymore.
> 
> I wonder how his honyaki feels..
> Can anyone chime in about it?



I have heard his single bevels are top notch... but no experience here

I want to know who is buying the takobiki...


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## BlueSteel

OK - I'm in the club...and hooked!

Received my Toyama 270 kasumi gyuto on August 31 (a mere 2.5 days after placing the order...delivered to me in Canada...great service from JNS!)

It is a true beast. Measuring 275mm heel to tip, 58mm at the heel, and 268g. Beautiful. (By comparison, my Shig 270 kasumi with the same type of handle is 278mm heel to tip, 53mm at the heel, and 265g. The knives are quite comparable, but the profile is so much different, mainly because the lower heel of the Shig makes the edge seem a lot flatter, but also the profile of the tip/nose is entirely different. Both are awesome cutters...two of the best I have!)

This came OOTB razor sharp...it cuts into my end grain walnut board with only moderate downward pressure on vegetables. Goes through carrot, potato, etc like they were butter.

The knife is quite reactive. I started a natural patina, first using it to cut many slices of salami (pork and chicken) as a snack, and then building on that a couple days later by slicing a large medium-rare rib steak. Right now, there is a fantastic electric blue and orange patina on the core steel and the first inch or so of the cladding...nice! (I'm crap with pics - I might figure out how to take one and post...maybe.)

Not sure why it took me this long to get on the Toyama train, but I'm definitely on board now.

Cheers,
Blair


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## Mute-on

I have a confession ... 

I totally folded when I saw Maksim's sale email. No self restraint. It's my birthday next month so I gave myself a "little" present ... 

270 Gyuto
270 Suji
180 Nakiri (gift to wife  )

Can't wait!

Happy Birthday to me!


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## dwalker

Mute-on said:


> I have a confession ...
> 
> I totally folded when I saw Maksim's sale email. No self restraint. It's my birthday next month so I gave myself a "little" present ...
> 
> 270 Gyuto
> 270 Suji
> 180 Nakiri (gift to wife  )
> 
> Can't wait!
> 
> Happy Birthday to me!


Sweet, I picked up a 270 gyuto as well to join the family. Happy early birthday.


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## naifu

Now is the time to buy. He will be out of that 270 gyuto in a day or two I bet. I loaded up on the last sale, otherwise I would be buying some also.


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## dwalker

Already out


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## cenc

I got my 270mm gyuto in the mail yesterday. It's a beast of a knife, and I already own the 210mm nakiri which also has some serious mass. Can't wait to prep today.

My Toyama collection is coming around nicely with the addition of a 300mm suji and that 80mm paring. I like the handling of the suji the most cause of that perfect extension of hand feeling I get with it.


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## naifu

@cenc -- do you like that 210 nakiri? I have been curious about it and tempted now that 15% off, but I do not know what I would use it for since I also have a Toyama 270 gyuto. When do you choose the nakiri?


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## cenc

naifu said:


> @cenc -- do you like that 210 nakiri? I have been curious about it and tempted now that 15% off, but I do not know what I would use it for since I also have a Toyama 270 gyuto. When do you choose the nakiri?





I love the straighter edge profile of the nakiri. I also push cut/chop with the nakiri and I have a great feeling I won't do that as much with the new 270mm gyuto. I love having a nakiri around just in general. 

That 180mm nakiri is still in stock too. I like the 210mm size because I work in a busy kitchen and like having that extra 30mm and weight in the blade. Extra oomph in the cut gives me more confidence and I can work faster.


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## dwalker

The 210 Nakiri is awesome. I never liked a Nakiri until I got this one. I have a 240 gyuto already and a 270 on the way, I am somewhat of a Toyama fan. I find I reach for the Nakiri way more often than I thought I would. It might be the most fun knife to use that I own. You should definately pick one up.


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## cenc

dwalker said:


> The 210 Nakiri is awesome. I never liked a Nakiri until I got this one. I have a 240 gyuto already and a 270 on the way, I am somewhat of a Toyama fan. I find I reach for the Nakiri way more often than I thought I would. It might be the most fun knife to use that I own. You should definately pick one up.


+1


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## TheCaptain

FWIW I've used the 210 Nakiri to do all kinds of stuff to hard squash that you probably shouldn't be doing with a Japanese knife. Before I got my 210 Toyama Nakiri, it was a rubber mallet and a stubborn german chef's knife for the job, and then only DH could handle it.

Haven't chipped it yet, though if I were honest it should have picked up a few by now. I attribute that more to the excellence of the blade than my crummy knife skills.

That lovely 210mm of fineness has enabled brown butter sage squash to be on our plates a lot more often since it's no longer a chore to prep.


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## naifu

OK, that is that -- I just purchased the 210 Toyama nakiri. Thanks for your reviews/opinions.


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## guitarmanchu

So you guys were the ones who bought up all the 270 gyutos! I guess you snooze you lose...


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## BlueSteel

Hmmm...seems like I did not receive the e-mail. Is it 15% off all Toyama knives? How does one get the 15% off - seems like there is no reference to the sale on JNS website?

Cheers,
Blair


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## KCMande

BlueSteel said:


> Hmmm...seems like I did not receive the e-mail. Is it 15% off all Toyama knives? How does one get the 15% off - seems like there is no reference to the sale on JNS website?
> 
> Cheers,
> Blair



Coupon code is "october"
15% off site wide 
Shig and Kato exempt 
There is a banner across the top of the jns homepage for me


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## BlueSteel

KCMande said:


> Coupon code is "october"
> 15% off site wide
> Shig and Kato exempt
> There is a banner across the top of the jns homepage for me



Thank you very much! I was bypassing the homepage and going straight to certain product pages, so I missed the sale ad!

Cheers,
Blair


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## cenc

Just wanted to add, I find that my 210mm Nakiri is noticeably more reactive than my other 3 Toyama knives, but reaches razor-like edge quicker. It is nice and thick behind the edge too. Perfect workhorse.

The new 270mm gyuto is the least reactive ootb so far. It has an amazing heat treat and grind; Thin behind the edge. It is actually a bit tough to sharpen compared to the other 3, but I prefer that though because spending a little while longer at the stones is good practice and meditative for me.


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## Choppin

Cant speak about the 210 nakiri, but the 180 blew me away. Veggie destroyer.


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## dwalker

Interesting observation, cena. My 210 Nakiri and my 240 gyuto seem to be very similar with reactivity. If I had to choose one to be more reactive, it would have be the Nakiri.


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## Konge

Anyone with a comment on his single bevels? I think I'll be springing on either the 300 suji or yanagi before the sale ends. I'm not too concerned with the difference between the two types, since a few years down the line I'll probably own one of each. I'm just interested in opinions on whether Toyama does the yanagi or the suji best. All else being equal, I'm partial to buying the yanagiba first, but I'd be very interested in hearing from people with first hand experience with the maker.


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## KimBronnum

Most seem to agree - myself included - that Toyamas generally are very well made knives. That said Toyama makes single bevels of particulally high quality. I own 9 Tayamas incl the knives in question. I find the suji to be my absolut favorite suji of all time. Very thin behind the edge and an overall light weight knife. The yanagis feel more substantial. His fugobekis are ofcourse thin and light. Sujis are much more versatile and thus would probably be the more clever first choise. But really I want to say: get them both. They only become more rare and expensive over time. The man i 75+ years old [emoji2]
Hope this was helpfull. 
- Kim


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## Konge

KimBronnum said:


> Most seem to agree - myself included - that Toyamas generally are very well made knives. That said Toyama makes single bevels of particulally high quality. I own 9 Tayamas incl the knives in question. I find the suji to be my absolut favorite suji of all time. Very thin behind the edge and an overall light weight knife. The yanagis feel more substantial. His fugobekis are ofcourse thin and light. Sujis are much more versatile and thus would probably be the more clever first choise. But really I want to say: get them both. They only become more rare and expensive over time. The man i 75+ years old [emoji2]
> Hope this was helpfull.
> - Kim



Almost making it harder 

I strongly prefer a suji and and a yanagi from two different makers. Since I'm starting out a collection, I like trying different things more than I like committing to one, no matter how great - there's something to be said for discovering personal preference. One thing pulling me to the yanagi is a sense of there being a greater availability of quality sujihikis, or perhaps that's off-base? So, if Toyama is well-renowned for his single-bevels, I might spring on that first, although there is something to be said for versatility - and the sujihiki _does_ look sexy.


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## labor of love

If I needed a suji in my kit it would certainly be Toyama. Blade shape and tip looks perfect. Plus several members have already stated that the sujis are even MORE enjoyable than the gyutos. Toyama only get pricier each year, pretty sure I purchased a Toyama 240mm gyuto new for $250 around the time maxim started carrying them. I wish I could come up with a good excuse to take advantage of Maxims sale.


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## naifu

Konge said:


> Almost making it harder
> 
> I strongly prefer a suji and and a yanagi from two different makers. Since I'm starting out a collection, I like trying different things more than I like committing to one, no matter how great - there's something to be said for discovering personal preference. One thing pulling me to the yanagi is a sense of there being a greater availability of quality sujihikis, or perhaps that's off-base? So, if Toyama is well-renowned for his single-bevels, I might spring on that first, although there is something to be said for versatility - and the sujihiki _does_ look sexy.



Watanabe Yanagiba and Toyama Sujihiki would be my choice.


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## FoRdLaz

I just have to say that your posts (and yes - I blame _all_ of you!) resulted in me buying the 300 suji and 180 nakiri right now from JNS....thanks in advance!!!


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## Konge

300 suji as well :laugh:

You made me worry about them being sold out on me, so I blame you in turn!


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## FoRdLaz

[emoji23][emoji1303]


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## dwalker

The family welcomes a new arrival.


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## cenc

dwalker said:


> The family welcomes a new arrival.


How do you like the grind of your 210mm nakiri?


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## dwalker

cenc said:


> How do you like the grind of your 210mm nakiri?


Love it. Maybe my most fun knife to use as long as you acknowledge its strengths and limitations. It is somehow thin at the edge and strong shouldered at the same time. It can crack hard produce like large carrots, but destroys cabbage and peppers and the like. Im very happy with it.


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## cenc

I can't believe how much I enjoy my 270mm gyuto. The grind and edge retention is just exceptional. The edge profile is perfect for my needs and what I cut at work. Generous curvature that I'll try to capture in a picture at some point.


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## naifu

I received my Toyama 210 nakiri yesterday, finally after DHL lost the package but found it a week later. Whew, glad they found it! This thing just glides through vegetables. Very tall, hefty, and nice. I'm glad I bought it during the discount.


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## labor of love

Okay...so who grabbed that Toyama honyaki today like 30 minutes after Maxim put it up?


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## TheCaptain

I looked and drooled. Couldn't believe I actually had a shot at it but too many customs in the works...


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## Matus

I had a look at is after it was gone. The photos barely show any hamon.


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## valgard

Matus said:


> I had a look at is after it was gone. The photos barely show any hamon.



I dont think it was mirror polished but i looked quickly. And it would be the typical straight line, at that price point it wouldnt be my choice.


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## labor of love

Matus said:


> I had a look at is after it was gone. The photos barely show any hamon.



Is that a bad thing? Are you suggesting the differential hardening isnt too differential?


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## labor of love

valgard said:


> I dont think it was mirror polished but i looked quickly. And it would be the typical straight line, at that price point it wouldnt be my choice.



Whats the preferred blue steel honyaki at the $925 price point?


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## valgard

labor of love said:


> Whats the preferred blue steel honyaki at the $925 price point?



Id go Watanabe, if its not mirror polished you would get the same for significantly less cash.


----------



## valgard

but thats me and my choice [emoji6]


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## labor of love

valgard said:


> but thats me and my choice [emoji6]



Awesome. I had no idea.


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## valgard

labor of love said:


> Awesome. I had no idea.


His Honyaki is only 110% more than his normal Pro knives (so more around $700), it's the extra 50% for mirror polish that makes them expensive.


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## khashy

valgard said:


> Id go Watanabe, if its not mirror polished you would get the same for significantly less cash.



What he said [emoji115]


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## labor of love

Theres still something to be said about getting something off the shelf and in your mailbox in 3 days vs whenever wat makes a honyaki for you. I think its worth noting that the Toyama honyaki was priced very fairly when you compare it to other vendors instock honyakis.


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## Anton

valgard said:


> Id go Watanabe, if its not mirror polished you would get the same for significantly less cash.



And you can somewhat custom ....


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## valgard

Anton said:


> And you can somewhat custom ....



that too, just dont ask for thin tip [emoji23]. But I love gyuto with machi i got recently.


----------



## labor of love

Anton said:


> And you can somewhat custom ....



Probably for much more $$$. Which was valgards original argument. FWIW the only thing Id would change would be the tip. Wat honkers are gigantic.


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## Badgertooth

I think cev isn't arguing the tips aren't honkers. It's just that the tip he ended up with was a sliiiiiightly pointier tip. It was kinda hilarious. I'd have jumped at that Toyama, just for the sake of rarity and soon to be retirement. There's time for Watanabes


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## panda

wat is already tough to sharpen, i couldnt imagine trying to grind a honyaki version, haha. i would consider one if he would make one from white.


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## valgard

Badgertooth said:


> I think cev isn't arguing the tips aren't honkers. It's just that the tip he ended up with was a sliiiiiightly pointier tip. It was kinda hilarious. I'd have jumped at that Toyama, just for the sake of rarity and soon to be retirement. There's time for Watanabes


yuuup, the "thinner tip" I got was hilarious indeed. I got the message, I won't ask for the thinner tip next time.


----------



## Meesterleester

Ive had my 210 gyuto for about 3 months now, still cant believe how nicely it cuts. Its easily one of my favorite knives. Now I have to decide whats next. Thinking a 180 nakiri or maybe a deba any thoughts and opinions are welcomed. Thanks for an incredible line of knives.


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## naifu

Meesterleester said:


> Ive had my 210 gyuto for about 3 months now, still cant believe how nicely it cuts. Its easily one of my favorite knives. Now I have to decide whats next. Thinking a 180 nakiri or maybe a deba any thoughts and opinions are welcomed. Thanks for an incredible line of knives.



I have a Toyama 180 deba and it is very nice. Takes a great edge and holds up -- no microchipping.

My favorite Toyamas are the 270 Gyuto and 210 Nakiri.


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## panda

valgard, the semi-custom wat i ended up with has a much thinner tip than a standard 270 i had before. i wasnt the one who ordered it this way though. he told me he simply asked for more taper at the tip.


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## valgard

panda said:


> valgard, the semi-custom wat i ended up with has a much thinner tip than a standard 270 i had before. i wasnt the one who ordered it this way though. he told me he simply asked for more taper at the tip.



Interesting, seems to be somewhat random then. I've talked to two others that ordered customized Wat. One ordered a thinner (overall) and got just that, the other ordered thinner tip and didn't even get my pointier tip. I guess my tip is ever so slightly thinner than normal but it's a nearly ridiculous difference. Still love the wide neck I got on mine tho, and the knife is a beast, not a smooth cutter but nothing can stop it (and it can be turned into a smooth cutter with minor tweaks).


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## tommybig

I rehandlet my Toyama 240 again two months ago. Thought i´d share here too. Weight is at 249g now with balance point 3,5cm in front of handle. Feels quite optimal for me now.


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## Badgertooth

Lets take a moment to admire the finish on that Toyama Tommy. Superb. Nice rehandle too


----------

