# Ever fire someone and......



## knyfeknerd

The next day you're scared they're going to come and shoot you? Should've brought Mr glocky to work today. Hindsight is 20/20. At least I've got a fighting chance with some sharp knives


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## WildBoar

Yeah; we had two people last year we fired, as both were letting their mental unstableness show more and more often. They both were very upset at being fired, and they both owned multiple guns. I'd say a few of us were on edge for a couple months...


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## Crothcipt

ya same, you even look over your shoulder for a while. Scary feeling.


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## Salty dog

People ask me why I have a carry permit. See OP.


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## tk59

Yup.


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## brainsausage

knyfeknerd said:


> The next day you're scared they're going to come and shoot you? Should've brought Mr glocky to work today. Hindsight is 20/20. At least I've got a fighting chance with some sharp knives



There's been a couple times I've contemplated smuggling my Mossberg semi-auto 12 gauge into work after hours and stashing it under one of the prep tables in a quick release rig... Some of our dishwashers lover the last year have been highly questionable...


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## knyfeknerd

Sweet. Made it home alive with no incident. This isn't the first time this has been an issue in my long illustrious glamorous career, but it's been a while. I'm definitely going to be packin' on Monday. It sucks to have to look over your shoulder, but that's yet another thing they don't teach you in culinary school. 
It kills me to have to deprive someone of a paycheck, but stealing liquor from a client's house on my watch(while you are secretly drinking their booze on the job at the same time) is a liability no one can dismiss. And in your mind, you've done nothing wrong and I'm the a55h0le. 
Now I've gotta watch my back.
Managing people sucks. The most expensive and potentially disappointing aspect of any foodservice operation.


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## Crothcipt

/agree


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## brainsausage

Crothcipt said:


> /agree



+1


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## Candlejack

America seems to have anger-issues or very much paranoia indeed. No offense.
This has never been a problem at any of the places i've been. (I don't have as many years experience as you guys, but i've never seen or heard anything about this. And it seems to be quite normal judging by your replies)
Worst we've had is drunken dudes with something to prove. Or people drinking at the job.


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## Salty dog

I was involved with a full on knife fight in the kitchen. Well, sorta. He had the knife.


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## Pachowder

Luckily it's rare that it happens but scary nonetheless.


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## SpikeC

Yes, America does have serious anger issues.


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## Candlejack

SpikeC said:


> Yes, America does have serious anger issues.



Should add that i was 30% trolling and 70% worried and curious.
Combine that with the US very, very open gun laws and it explains quite a few things.

Is this really so common that it's something to actually worry about?


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## SpikeC

Given the number of people in the country the incidents are not all that common, but there are enough that one has to keep the possibilities in mind.


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## kalaeb

I have opened restaurants all over the country and inevitably there are a few people who don't make the cut after the first week. It certainly makes you think twice when you have to make cuts in cities like Detroit and Brooklyn, but I have never had an incident.


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## sachem allison

Salty dog said:


> I was involved with a full on knife fight in the kitchen. Well, sorta. He had the knife.



been there myself, boss fired a guy and walked leaving him in the kitchen by himself. told me to handle it. 6' 2" angry ex-con on work release with knives and authority issues. not a good day for Chef Son. I feel much better now!


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## Crothcipt

usually a gun doesn't come into the picture, always a possibility tho. But having a knife right there even with any kind of fights can be scary.


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## Salty dog

sachem allison said:


> been there myself, boss fired a guy and walked leaving him in the kitchen by himself. told me to handle it. 6' 2" angry ex-con on work release with knives and authority issues. not a good day for Chef Son. I feel much better now!




My guy was an ex con as well. Fortunately smaller than me.


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## Keith Sinclair

I have seen alot in my 40 yrs. in Hi. hotel kit.The worst was a good friend of mine was Sous Chef at Sheraton Waikiki.A unstable cook came into the Chef's office and killed him with a knife.It was senseless & a dark day for us who knew Tom well.


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## mano

When I was working as a prep cook in grad school for clinical psychology I got a call from the restaurant about how to deal with a clearly off balance cook they needed to fire. I told them I'd get back them in three years after I got my degree and then gave them the best advise I could. I knew they guy's quirks and it helped diffuse the situation, but for a few days people were worried he'd go home, get high and come back. 

IMHO restaurant people are a unique group, which makes them so great but a lot are unpredictable. The pace, pressure, long night hours, cash business, high exposure to alcohol and transient nature of the field attracts fast-lane folks. It's tough to put together a stable crew without having a few hot-heads among them.


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## Cipcich

People are nuts. Not just people in the food services business, hence the phrase, "Going Postal".
This is not a happy economy/country/civilization; there are a lot of unbalanced folks out there, not just in food service. 
If you're rich, you can effectively insulate yourself from the negative effects of capitalist society, but, for most people, you just have to keep your head down.
So, maybe a bullet-proof vest for Christmas?


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## mano

Cipcich said:


> People are nuts. Not just people in the food services business, hence the phrase, "Going Postal".
> This is not a happy economy/country/civilization; there are a lot of unbalanced folks out there, not just in food service.
> If you're rich, you can effectively insulate yourself from the negative effects of capitalist society, but, for most people, you just have to keep your head down.
> So, maybe a bullet-proof vest for Christmas?



Yeah, I've worked with post office employees and understand the meaning of the phrase. But most of them are good salt-of-the-earth type people, which is true for most folks. There are plenty of great people around, you just have to hang out with them. This forum is a good example. Money usually isn't a factor.


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## brainsausage

mano said:


> Yeah, I've worked with post office employees and understand the meaning of the phrase. But most of them are good salt-of-the-earth type people, which is true for most folks. There are plenty of great people around, you just have to hang out with them. This forum is a good example. Money usually isn't a factor.



+1


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## Keith Sinclair

mano said:


> Yeah, I've worked with post office employees and understand the meaning of the phrase. But most of them are good salt-of-the-earth type people, which is true for most folks. There are plenty of great people around, you just have to hang out with them. This forum is a good example. Money usually isn't a factor.



Maybe it has something to do with culture but not much.As you said most people are good.Even with the pressure when things can get heated,it blows over.The truly unstable who are prone to extreme are rare,but it only takes one.


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## NO ChoP!

I carry a .380 in my chef pants pocket; a nine with a thirty round clip in my glove box and a carbine riffle in the trunk.

I've pissed off my share of employees....


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## Birnando

I believe I have had to lay off about 20-25 people over the years.
Not once have I feared for my own security or life, not even for a second.
What I have done though, is worry about the unfortunate people who just lost their jobs.
That I have done plenty..

It is without doubt the single worst thing one has to as a manager, and it gets to me every time.
Still, if it is needed, one simply has to step up and do the deed.


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## NO ChoP!

Yah, that sucks....


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## Tristan

I can imagine knife fights... but packing a weapon to your ex place of work... Serious issues here. 

But the kitchen is already one of the few places where people get a chance despite their backstory. Guess that is a part of the reason so much madness happens?


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## Seth

...and I thought musicians were crazy. Then I read that Bourdain book.


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## brainsausage

NO ChoP! said:


> I carry a .380 in my chef pants pocket; a nine with a thirty round clip in my glove box and a carbine riffle in the trunk.
> 
> I've pissed off my share of employees....



Better watch those grill shifts. It'd suck if you cooked a round off instead of steak or what have you:/


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## Jmadams13

We had a dishwasher break in and steal food out of the reachin (walking gets locked at night) a week after we gird him. Funny thing, we were all hanging out in the dining room have some drinks when it happened. We heard something, went to look, and caught him red handed. He knew he was guilty so he didn't run, just waited for the cops to show up


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## Cutty Sharp

Just noticed this thread for the first time, and like some others above it has struck me too. The looking over shoulders, Mr Glockys, packing, permits to carry and so on, along with the anger as Candlejack first pointed out. I'd say it's not normal at all - well, or at least it shouldn't be normal if it is. If it is for some, it might be hard to get a perspective on it, but probably worth it - stepping back and looking at all from a different position. I don't know what you could do about it, but it's probably helpful to discuss, as people are doing here.

I'm not a pro - just worked in a couple kitchens as a student, and later for a few months - and so I've got limited experience. This was all in Canada, and while there were various personalities around, luckily there wasn't any anything extreme where I was, and guns were definitely not an issue, though I can only say that was in my experience. I'm curious about people's experiences in other countries too. I meet lots of Korean chefs and will have to ask them next time.


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## eshua

I don't understand the last two posts, but since this hasn't been bumped from too long ago....


Discerning defense from vengeful judgement is a simple matter. 
Disgruntled people usually only transition from posturing ---> serious violence when they feel there is no hope, so convince them otherwise.

As someone who's had food, plates, and pans thrown at them...been threatened, punched, and seen the pointy end of a knife waved in a disconcerting way, I recommend that a cook acting erratically use the transition to a new job to regain their self respect, and be forced to cut back on the drinking. Rarely, if ever, have I seen a guy get out of control and worry for myself or the restaurant. Lets be honest the money lost from a lazy/sloppy cook will almost always be more than losses from one theft or fight.

A few years ago, one cook came in to eat ... maybe 10 drinks into his night, got cut off, got angry, and started swinging...he was fired. When I ran into him a few weeks later, I reminded him that I'd gladly put up with his attitude, his disdain for managers, his consistent 15 minutes late, and crazy loud singing in the kitchen and still always want to steal him from another restaurant, because he was a beast on line... but knowing his wife and boys I couldn't have him on as a drinker ... and in a smaller town he knew I told the same thing to a dozen other restaurants. Today we're both a little older, get home a little less drunk, and get paid more.

Setting aside the rare, saddening, serious mental conditions, most outbursts will be isolated to some sort of trauma eg. divorce, or the mark of someone too old to be drinking that heavy. I'm sure there are lots of other explanations, and not to sound like a HR douche, but first try to identify the issue, show some level of validation, and present the dismissal as a positive change. Because frankly, most guys in the industry know the salary cap for line cooks are low enough that parity isn't going to be perfect, but its manageable.


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## knyfeknerd

I think the last 2 posts are a troll. -not eshua obviously


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## Cutty Sharp

Anger, guns and knives ... just seemed this thread was indicating some serious issues, so I don't think it's trolling if discussion leads on from there.


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## knyfeknerd

Cutty Sharp said:


> Anger, guns and knives ... just seemed this thread was indicating some serious issues, so I don't think it's trolling if discussion leads on from there.


No, there was a troll earlier this morning pimping some woodworking site. I wasn't speaking of any legitimate members.


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## SpikeC

And due to the exemplary performance of our mod team it never made it to my screen! Sometimes the fast response makes for puzzling posts!


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## Cutty Sharp

knyfeknerd said:


> No, there was a troll earlier this morning pimping some woodworking site. I wasn't speaking of any legitimate members.



Wow, those mods are quick, aren't they! :O


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## Carl

Dang, I missed the trolls.


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