# How to force a patina



## Hermes7792

I messaged Mr. Rader about how he forces a patina using mustard this was his reply

"Just take some simple mustard and dab it on with your finger. (Clean blade first w/rubbing alc.) Let dry for an hour or so in warm, dry air. Then wash off with soap and hot water. Repeat until you like it."

So is this how everyone else does it?

Can other acids be used insted of mustard?

Would the type of steel affect the patina?


Also post some pictures of your mustard patinas... or natural patinas!


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## oivind_dahle

http://*****************.com/2011/01/forcing-patina-on-shigefusa-240-kasumi.html


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## wsfarrell

oivind_dahle said:


> http://*****************.com/2011/01/forcing-patina-on-shigefusa-240-kasumi.html



+1 for the best picture caption of all time: "Shigefusa in cabbage hell."


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## Hermes7792

wsfarrell said:


> +1 for the best picture caption of all time: "Shigefusa in cabbage hell."



:lol2: I actually laughed... out loud! 

Reason I'm asking is that im getting my first Carbon steel knife for christmas this year. A Delbert ealy 200x90mm O1 cleaver, and I just want as much protection from rust as possable. I know natural is better and better looking too but Im scared I might mess up and forget to wipe it or somthing...


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## Benuser

I add some wine vinegar as well. Make sure to degrease before with petroleum or alcohol. Granny Smiths and fresh meat give beautiful results though less durable. Forcing a patina will dull the edge somewhat.


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## jm2hill

Benuser said:


> I add some wine vinegar as well. Make sure to degrease before with petroleum or alcohol. Granny Smiths and fresh meat give beautiful results though less durable. Forcing a patina will dull the edge somewhat.



+1 to this: buy a pack of fresh chicken and slice it for stir fry. Then proceed to slice some steak for stir fry as well. Cut a lime or two for stir-fry flavouring. Then you should be good to go! If there isn't a full patina on it yet - there will at least be a natural base - finish that off with mustard!


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## SpikeC

I did this one as per Mr. Rader, but I did not leave it on for very long at all, and did not degrease before hand.

View attachment 2690


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## Hermes7792

SpikeC said:


> I did this one as per Mr. Rader, but I did not leave it on for very long at all, and did not degrease before hand.
> 
> View attachment 2690




dead link.


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## Dubsy

your link doesnt work. and will the off white/champagne color appear on every carbon steel if you did it that way?


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## SpikeC

Strange, it works when I click on it. I used the "insert image" link as I always have, but now it doesn't work.


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## Hermes7792

SpikeC said:


> Strange, it works when I click on it. I used the "insert image" link as I always have, but now it doesn't work.
> 
> 
> View attachment 2692
> 
> 
> View attachment 2693



cool looking knife, on a side note what kind of knife is it exactly?


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## SpikeC

It's one that I made. I was thinking gyuto at the time, butt now it appears more like a monster Santuko!


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## stevenStefano

The times I've forced a patina I only left the mustard on for about 2 mins at a time. A lot of the time you have to rinse and dry the blade before you actually see the patina so at first you might think you haven't let it sit for long enough. Another thing is that many carbon knives come with a sort of lacquer coating so won't immediately form a patina no matter what you do. I think if you scrub hard enough with a green scrubby pad you can get it off or I've heard of some people using acetone. Personally I just use the knife for a few days the the coating sort of wears off


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## Lucretia

My first attempt at a forced patina--started off wrapped in a paper towel soaked in white vinegar. Kinda scary when it was unwrapped to see a layer of brownish crud, but it wiped right off and left a pebbled pattern from the paper towel texture. Then dabbed on some mustard, and followed up with cutting up a beef roast for stew. It's a lousy photo and doesn't show all the blues and purples. No problems with off flavors or discoloration on onions, apples, etc.


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## slowtyper

The other huge thread on patina here said blood works well for making a blueish patina. 

what makes cabbage so bad for knives?


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## sachem allison

slowtyper said:


> The other huge thread on patina here said blood works well for making a blueish patina.
> 
> what makes cabbage so bad for knives?



sulphur


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## markk

i have tried the mustard patina and did not really like it. I have found that if I cook a couple of boneless chicken breasts and then slice through them while they are still very hot and they make sure to rub the hot slices over the newly cleaned surface it leaves very nice blues and purples. 
I just use the chicken for chicken salad afterward.
This patina seems to last and I think it is due to the heat. I have other meats as well but I like the colors I get from the chicken the best.


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## SpikeC

SpikeC said:


> It's one that I made. I was thinking gyuto at the time, butt now it appears more like a monster Santuko!



While I did not do so consciously, the profile of that knife is just like the Takeda gyuto, so I guess this IS a gyuto!


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## smilesenpai

I hope that some one still reads this link and can tell me what patina will last the longest?
Will 000 steel wool damage a knife or patina for that matter?


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## NO ChoP!

I use 0000, it doesn't scratch.


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## Benuser

Any patina will get restored in no time after abrasion. That's at least what I noticed after thinning.


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## Lucretia

smilesenpai said:


> I hope that some one still reads this link and can tell me what patina will last the longest?
> Will 000 steel wool damage a knife or patina for that matter?



Not sure which will last the longest, but here's a brand new mustard patina on 52100:




And a year later:





Other side:




A year later:





The knife isn't used daily, but gets used several times a week. The second side had to be scrubbed down when it got put down on what I thought was a clean place on the cutting board that had lime juice or something on it. After a year lot of the colors and details from the original mustard patina have disappeared and the blade has darkened overall, but much of it is still visible.


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## SpikeC

Ya, butt the cork has dissolved!


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## smilesenpai

NO ChoP! said:


> I use 0000, it doesn't scratch.


Cheers.


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## smilesenpai

Lucretia said:


> Not sure which will last the longest, but here's a brand new mustard patina on 52100:


Thanks.
That is plenty long. I was thinking it would only last a few months. The darkening you talk of is natural patina, right? As long as there is patina to save my food tasting like something C3PO would eat, then I am fine.
I read that when using for long periods of time you should wipe the blade on a damn cloth. Does this mean mineral oil on the cloth?


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## 99Limited

Although some of the forced patinas look pretty cool, I like the one that naturally forms from use. If I remember correctly, hot beef, like a cooked standing rib roast or a steamship round of beef will leave a bluish tint. And a natural patina lasts forever unless you try to remove it.


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## chinacats

smilesenpai said:


> Thanks.
> That is plenty long. I was thinking it would only last a few months. The darkening you talk of is natural patina, right? As long as there is patina to save my food tasting like something C3PO would eat, then I am fine.
> I read that when using for long periods of time you should wipe the blade on a damn cloth. Does this mean mineral oil on the cloth?



Save the mineral oil for storage...


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## ThEoRy

No, water. Then a dry cloth.


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