# Eden knives



## mark76 (Feb 14, 2017)

Knives and Tools is the largest knife supplier in the Netherlands and one of the largest in Western Europe. They were so kind to loan me two Japanese gyutos of their house brand Eden.

At first sight these gyutos are quite different: the Eden Kanso Aogami knife is relatively cheap, made of carbon steel (Aogami #2) and it has a kurouchi finish. The Susumi knife is quite a bit more expensive, made of SG2 steel, which is stainless, and it has a Damascus cladding. But as we will see, they also have a lot of similarities.





*Finish and looks*

The finish of both knives is very good. There is no gap between the blade and the handle. Moreover, the ferrule is made is wood, instead of plastic, which results in a smooth transition from the main part of the handle to the ferrule. The transition is slightly better on the Kanso knife than on the Susumi.

The Kanso knife has a kurouchi finish. This is a black coating that results from the forging process. Sometimes it is also artificially put on a knife. The advantage of a kurouchi finish is that the kurouchi does not rust as easily as the remainder of the knife. The Kanso is a carbon knife and if it is not properly cared for, it will rust. It will also discolor. Make sure you wipe it after every use and if you store it for a longer time, coat it with some oil.

The Susumi knife has a Damascus cladding. Whether you like it is a personal matter, but it does give the knife its own character. 





*Profile*

Both knives have very similar profiles. Their profiles are in between a traditional Japanese profile (with little curvature) and a Western profile (with quite a bit of curvature and belly). I liked the profiles a lot and both knives are suitable both for rocking and for chopping/push-cutting. I think this is perfect for a Western market where many people prefer rocking and sometimes chop.









*Steel*

The Kanso is made of Aogami #2 steel (Blue #2). As I wrote, this is a carbon steel, so you do have to care for it. An advantage of Aogami #2 steel is that you can get it very sharp. So even though the knife came out of the box very sharp, I could not resist sharpening it with very fine grit stones and strops. And you cannot only get this knife very sharp, it sharpens very easily, too. The result was a knife that was wickedly sharp. On the other hand, this steel is not the most wear-resistant, so you will have to touch it up regularly. And, because the steel is not the toughest, you will have to be careful when wriggling the knife on the board.

The Susumi is made of SG2, which is a stainless steel. But it is not an ordinary stainless steel. It is very wear-resistant (one of the most wear-resistant steels used in kitchen knives), which means you won't have to sharpen it very often. You can also get it very sharp, much sharper than most other stainless steels. Because of these properties, and because it is quite new, it is quite expensive.

*Geometry*

The geometry of a knife determines an important part of its cutting performance. One thing that is often overlooked is that a knife should not only be sharp, but also quite thin just above the edge. Otherwise you run the risk that the knife wedges, which is something you don't want. Luckily both the Kanso and the Susumi are 0,5 mm thick 5 mm just above the edge, which is quite thin.

As you can see in the choil shot below (the factsheet), the Kanso is not entirely straight from the edge to the top. Luckily this had little influence on its cutting performance. The Susumi has a slightly better vertical profile.

Both knives taper down from the handle to the tip, but not spectacularly. The Susumi tapers slightly more and is one millimeter thinner near the tip.

*Use*

Both knives cut excellently and remarkably similar. This is probably because their profile and their geometry are so similar. The things that make them different, the steel and the finish, more influence their maintenance. And the Kanso definitely requires more maintenance.

I'd describe both knives as all-round knives: they cut nearly everything very well. Only their tips are not the thinnest I've seen, but I had not problems cutting, for example, mushrooms.





*Conclusion*

Both knives are excellent knives with a similar profile and geometry. Their steels and finish differ a lot, however. As a consequence they cut pretty much the same, but require quite a different maintenance. Finally I'd like to say that these knives have a very good price/quality proportion. It will be hard to find similar knives with this level of finish and these steels.

*Factsheets*

The blade lengths provided in the factsheets are shorter than those reported by Knives and Tools, because I measure from the tip to the end of the cutting area.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Feb 14, 2017)

How are these wide necks in real life - they always look odd in photos?

On German forums, it is considered more or less a fact that at least the Kanso are from Sirou Kamo's workshop.


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## Jovidah (Feb 14, 2017)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> How are these wide necks in real life - they always look odd in photos?
> 
> On German forums, it is considered more or less a fact that at least the Kanso are from Sirou Kamo's workshop.



This... same boxes and exact twins to some of the Kamo lines. I'm pretty sure K&T even confirmed it at some point.

What's really interesting about these knives is that they are rather tall. A lot of 21 cm gyuto's tend to be around 45mm high, which is by many perceived to be too low...resulting in the popularity of 24 cm gyutos. The profile of these is almost a bit of a compromise between a santoku and a gyuto.

Too bad they kind of misrepresent the lengths. The chef knife sold as '23 cm' is really just a 21 cm gyuto.

FWIW, if I recall their other lines correclty, the Eden Dento was from Masakage and Eden Takara from Yu Kurosaki.

The cheaper lines (the VG10) aren't really worth the 'effort' to review. Although they're cheap for what you get, there's a pretty big variability between the blades (in thickness). Also they're all too thick behind the edge.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Feb 14, 2017)

"Too bad they kind of misrepresent the length"

Measuring by edge length, vs tip to where tang leaves daylight, has always been a contentious issue with J knives.


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## Jovidah (Feb 14, 2017)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> "Too bad they kind of misrepresent the length"
> 
> Measuring by edge length, vs tip to where tang leaves daylight, has always been a contentious issue with J knives.



True. But I doubt these were sold as '23 cm knives'... I've never seen Japanese smiths advertise 230's (or at least extremely rarely). Given how it's sort of 'their' product they could have called it whatever they wanted, and it would be fairer to keep it more in line with the rest. If they sold it as 210 that'd be pretty spot on. Or the '20 cm' as a 180.

For what it's worth.... that's still a minor caveat in what is otherwise a great deal for the Kanso line. Their price-performance ratio is awesome. If I didn't want to try a 240 at the same time I bought my first 'proper' gyuto, this was probably the knife I'd have bought. It's a screaming deal. The SG2...well... there are a lot more contenders in that price range and it's quite a bit more expensive than the Takamura R2 line... so that's up for debate.


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## mark76 (Feb 15, 2017)

Thanks guys. I added some of your remarks (particularly about the knife height) to the review on my blog.


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## shownomarci (Feb 15, 2017)

I've had the Eden Kanso Aogami for 3 and a half years and i have to add that it doesn't need as frequent sharpening as you would think.
Going through 30kg+ veg (mostly potatoes and carrots) and still shaving sharp. Blue #2 @~63HRC is not a softie. 
I find it quite sturdy with a thick spine and a wide bevel. Not really suitable for detailed fine work but you can throw any root veg at it all day long.
The steel and the cladding is reactive and it will discolor onions and other acidic foods, but once the patina is set it should be fine.
This is a knife and a half for 90 quid.


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