# I've worn out my Idahone ceramic honing rod after two years use. Can it be resurfaced?



## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

My beloved Idahone "fine" ceramic honing rod seems to have lost its' "grit" after using it very sparingly for a bit over two years. The rod now feels completely smooth along its; entire length, somewhat akin to a burnisher. The rod is clean, with zero loading, and looks brand new. I clean it thoroughly with a Superaser which does a fantastic job. The only knife I use this rod on is a 6" Victorinox utility knife, and occasionally, on a French-made paring knife. Typically, when I use the knife, I check the edge both before and after using it, and if I feel the slightest sign that my edge has started rolling, I'll give it a quick touch-up, usually a couple of very light edge trailing passes. I never let that knife get dull, and the knife still breezes through tomatoes. I've now had this knife for 2 years and 8 mo. and it has yet to see a sharpening stone. I'd like to see just how far I can stretch the honing-only approach.

I recently tried wrapping the rod in wet/dry SiC sandpaper (180 grit and 80 grit) to see if that would help in resurfacing the rod, unfortunately, it had no effect.

Has anyone here managed to resurrect one of these? I'm thinking that I'll probably have to toss it and buy a new one. I'm a little surprised that the life-cycle seems so short. Many vendors seem to suggest that in "home use", it should last up to 10 years or more. I really like the performance of the product, and if need be, I'll simply replace it.


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## jwthaparc (Jul 14, 2021)

If the sandpaper didn't do anything. Idk.


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## RonB (Jul 14, 2021)

Is it possible that the material in the rod is harder than the material in the sandpaper? If so, the sandpaper would have gotten smoother. You might need something with a harder abrasive.


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## jwthaparc (Jul 14, 2021)

RonB said:


> Is it possible that the material in the rod is harder than the material in the sandpaper? If so, the sandpaper would have gotten smoother. You might need something with a harder abrasive.


Silicon carbide should be harder than a ceramic honing rod. Usually things described as ceramic abrasives, are aluminum oxide. 

It should abrade it. I think you either need to go with either lower grit silicon carbide paper. Or you need to give it more time with the paper you have.


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## stringer (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> My beloved Idahone "fine" ceramic honing rod seems to have lost its' "grit" after using it very sparingly for a bit over two years. The rod now feels completely smooth along its; entire length, somewhat akin to a burnisher. The rod is clean, with zero loading, and looks brand new. I clean it thoroughly with a Superaser which does a fantastic job. The only knife I use this rod on is a 6" Victorinox utility knife, and occasionally, on a French-made paring knife. Typically, when I use the knife, I check the edge both before and after using it, and if I feel the slightest sign that my edge has started rolling, I'll give it a quick touch-up, usually a couple of very light edge trailing passes. I never let that knife get dull, and the knife still breezes through tomatoes. I've now had this knife for 2 years and 8 mo. and it has yet to see a sharpening stone. I'd like to see just how far I can stretch the honing-only approach.
> 
> I recently tried wrapping the rod in wet/dry SiC sandpaper (180 grit and 80 grit) to see if that would help in resurfacing the rod, unfortunately, it had no effect.
> 
> Has anyone here managed to resurrect one of these? I'm thinking that I'll probably have to toss it and buy a new one. I'm a little surprised that the life-cycle seems so short. Many vendors seem to suggest that in "home use", it should last up to 10 years or more. I really like the performance of the product, and if need be, I'll simply replace it.



I would get a new one but buy a medium or coarse or resign yourself to replacing it every couple of years. The fine might feel coarse enough to remove metal when it's brand new but that's not really what it's designed for. Mine is 10+ years old. Still works great as the last step in a full sharpening regime on stones or to touch up an edge that's in good shape. But it gets loaded up quick, especially if you're using it with softer stainless. I've never tried sanding mine. I just scrub it with hot water, soap, and a scotch-brite pad. 
I might be overly cautious, but reconditioning it with anything more aggressive and you might risk screwing up the geometry of the hone. That could be real bad on the micro bevel level and introduce all kinds of other issues.

Maintaining a knife only on hones is possible. But make your life easier and get a coarser one. There isn't anything wrong with your other one. You're just asking more of it than it's really designed to bring to the table.


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## Justinv (Jul 14, 2021)

I have one that is about 8 years old and its definitely quite smooth but it still hones and can sharpen a slightly dull edge even in extremely hard steel (works on a 66HRC knife). I thought these are supposed to get finer and smoother over time which is a good thing. 

It sounds like you want to use it more as a sharpening stone. Perhaps you would be better served with a diamond loaded strop for touchups instead of a honing rod. Fine stones work too but it sounds like you are trying to avoid stones. It is not realistic to go years without a real sharpening. Using just hones like this for extended time changes the angle of the edge and it needs a proper sharpening to fix that.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

Justinv said:


> I have one that is about 8 years old and its definitely quite smooth but it still hones and can sharpen a slightly dull edge even in extremely hard steel (works on a 66HRC knife). I thought these are supposed to get finer and smoother over time which is a good thing.
> 
> It sounds like you want to use it more as a sharpening stone. Perhaps you would be better served with a diamond loaded strop for touchups instead of a honing rod. Fine stones work too but it sounds like you are trying to avoid stones. It is not realistic to go years without a real sharpening. Using just hones like this for extended time changes the angle of the edge and it needs a proper sharpening to fix that.



Yes, I can see how it'll "work" as a burnisher after the grit is gone, but no longer as a "sharpener".

You're right about "avoiding stones", but that's a temporary thing. It's an ongoing experiment to see just how far I can go without resorting to stones on the "soft steel" of the Vic. The knife itself is still razor sharp.

I first noticed that the honing rod wasn't performing in the usual manner about two days ago, when I noticed it wouldn't immediately "bite" into a ripe tomato skin. When I examined the rod, I found that the only part of the rod that had any "grit" left, was the last inch or so, near the tip. The rest of the rod is almost as smooth as glass. I've just stropped the knife with a few strokes on my diamond strop, and I'm right back in business,,,, effortless see-through tomato slices,,,, but, that's not the point. I've got more stones than I'll ever need, but I still want to see how far just honing will take me. That rod is soooo handy and quick.

Regarding "stones", I've got the Shapton Glass Diamond Lapping plate, SG120,220,320,500,1k,2k,4k,8k, plus Norton 220,1k,4k,8k, Naniwa Green Brick of Joy, a King, a few Atoma's, (400 1200) Naniwa large flattener, Norton flattener, 3M Micro abrasive sheets, a Tormek, a Chef's Choice Trizor, several steels, silicon carbide paper as well as several grits of powder, and my diamond strop, etc. It's not as if I'm short of options,,,, I specifically want to see how far the "fine" ceramic honing rod will take me with that Vic.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

stringer said:


> I would get a new one but buy a medium or coarse or resign yourself to replacing it every couple of years. The fine might feel coarse enough to remove metal when it's brand new but that's not really what it's designed for. Mine is 10+ years old. Still works great as the last step in a full sharpening regime on stones or to touch up an edge that's in good shape. But it gets loaded up quick, especially if you're using it with softer stainless. I've never tried sanding mine. I just scrub it with hot water, soap, and a scotch-brite pad.
> I might be overly cautious, but reconditioning it with anything more aggressive and you might risk screwing up the geometry of the hone. That could be real bad on the micro bevel level and introduce all kinds of other issues.
> 
> Maintaining a knife only on hones is possible. But make your life easier and get a coarser one. There isn't anything wrong with your other one. You're just asking more of it than it's really designed to bring to the table.



You're 100% right,,, I've just got to wrap my head around the fact that these rods do eventually wear out. I'm just a bit shocked that I hadn't realized this sooner. I simply had not given that aspect any consideration, yet, just as any sharpener, some degree of wear should always be factored in.

I'm still a bit surprised though, that it wore so quickly, given that so many suggest that these things will last almost "forever" in a home environment.

Regarding cleaning,,, get yourself a Superaser,,,, you'll be amazed at how quickly and how well it works, and it's dirt cheap. I've tried everything, including Bar Keeper's Friend, Comet, soap and water, various scrub pads, and they're all terrible compared to the Superaser. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if a regular pencil eraser works just as well.

Regarding knife edge maintenance, I'm only using the ceramic rod to lightly "clean up" the honed edge, not so much for "sharpening". I sometimes use the ceramic rod as part of a two-step process where I hone with a Zwilling steel, followed by a quick "cleaning" touch-up with the ceramic rod. I never allow the knife to get dull,,,, I'm constantly checking the edge after every use.


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## stringer (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> You're 100% right,,, I've just got to wrap my head around the fact that these rods do eventually wear out. I'm just a bit shocked that I hadn't realized this sooner. I simply had not given that aspect any consideration, yet, just as any sharpener, some degree of wear should always be factored in.
> 
> I'm still a bit surprised though, that it wore so quickly, given that so many suggest that these things will last almost "forever" in a home environment.
> 
> ...



I like the affect of the fine rod highly burnished. Mine is a shiny dull grey and very smooth. Probably the equivalent of a 12k stone. To me, this isn't "worn out" but "broken in". Eventually your geometry will suffer as mentioned above. But I have known plenty of people over the years who maintain Vic's on hones alone. They usually just use a diamond coated steel and then deburr on a smooth or ceramic steel. The fine ceramic steel just doesn't hold a lot of sharpening power for real long.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

i dont know what these rods are made out of but i'm guessing its sintered alox, like a spyderco. 

what i would do:
sprinkle some sic powder on something flat. add a bit of water.
roll the rod between the flat surface and whatever you have. some wood maybe.
do this for 2-5 minutes.

done (most likely)


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## TB_London (Jul 14, 2021)

If sandpaper didn’t cut it perhaps a small diamond file, like a blue DMT could refresh it? Otherwise if you can get some loose diamond grit cheaply you could use that on a scrubby. I maintain my ceramic hone with bkf powder on a bit of kitchen towel, cleans all the metal off pretty quick


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

another option might be to scratch it up with diamonds. but i wouldn't recommend it if you want to keep your d plate in good condition.

i have a spyderco UF and all of those are warped from the factory so you need to condition them.
and if i was to attempt to flatten in on a dmt plate it would have totally killed it. it would most likely have killed 2 plates.

yeah diamonds are harder and sic is harder than alox. but its still VERY VERY hard, and you will still kill the harder material.
Its just a matter of time.

its the same with steel and food right. you have this 65hrc steel and never touch a board, yet the steel gets dull. and the food is like 1 hrc.
its just a matter of time here too of course.

how can water plow though stone? just a matter of time.

on a sidenote. i actually tried flattening my UF with SiC sandpaper. it didn't do jack ****! well maybe it worked for like 5 seconds.
a better option was to simply burn the sandpaper, collect the grit, and roll the stone on that. that worked.


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## coxhaus (Jul 14, 2021)

If you are going to have to replace it every 2 years it might be cheaper to buy a Worksharp KO.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

stringer said:


> I like the affect of the fine rod highly burnished. Mine is a shiny dull grey and very smooth. Probably the equivalent of a 12k stone. To me, this isn't "worn out" but "broken in". Eventually your geometry will suffer as mentioned above. But I have known plenty of people over the years who maintain Vic's on hones alone. They usually just use a diamond coated steel and then deburr on a smooth or ceramic steel. The fine ceramic steel just doesn't hold a lot of sharpening power for real long.



In my particular case, I found that the rod didn't perform nearly as well when loaded. When cleaned with the Superaser, it worked soooo much better with even the lightest touch,,, barely any pressure applied.

It looks like I'll have to think this one over for a few more days. I was going to order a couple more of those ceramic rods this morning, but before pulling the trigger I decided to try my leather strop with green paste, and the result was astonishing. Roughly 3-4 light trailing-edge strokes and the knife was instantly razor-sharp again. I was able to slice a ripe tomato with almost zero pressure. The "bite" was instantaneous. That said, I had tried my Zwilling steel last night, and that step alone was not very productive. The strop obviously cleaned up the result of honing with the steel.


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## Benuser (Jul 14, 2021)

Has nothing to do with the initial question, but why using edge _trailing_ strokes on a rod?


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## TB_London (Jul 14, 2021)

I was just suggesting roughing the surface with a diamond file, not a big flattening session. With light pressure the diamonds will barely wear. A cheap plate would do, and you can pick them up for cheap on AliExpress or equivalent for peanuts


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> *on a sidenote. i actually tried flattening my UF with SiC sandpaper. it didn't do jack ****! well maybe it worked for like 5 seconds.
> a better option was to simply burn the sandpaper, collect the grit, and roll the stone on that. that worked.*



I LOVE it!!!!


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

Benuser said:


> Has nothing to do with the initial question, but why using edge _trailing_ strokes on a rod?



For "feathering".


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Benuser said:


> Has nothing to do with the initial question, but why using edge _trailing_ strokes on a rod?



to get the max amount of burr of course! same as with stones.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

TB_London said:


> I was just suggesting roughing the surface with a diamond file, not a big flattening session. With light pressure the diamonds will barely wear. A cheap plate would do, and you can pick them up for cheap on AliExpress or equivalent for peanuts



Actually, I have some 3M diamond abrasive sheets in various micron grits. It can be used the same way as you would any sandpaper. Wrap the rod, and pull. I tried that yesterday with my SiC sheets in 180, then 80 grit. That got me nowhere. No perceptible difference.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

TB_London said:


> I was just suggesting roughing the surface with a diamond file, not a big flattening session. With light pressure the diamonds will barely wear. A cheap plate would do, and you can pick them up for cheap on AliExpress or equivalent for peanuts



problem with this is that its not gonna be very "random" so you will basically plow straight lines in the rod.

this the good part with SiC powder. its basically random. and this is how it should be imo.
just look at a glass plate used with SiC powder. its evenly frosted. since this is a random operation more or less.
and i guess you want your rod to be like this too. evenly frosted in the end.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> Actually, I have some 3M diamond abrasive sheets in various micron grits. It can be used the same way as you would any sandpaper. Wrap the rod, and pull. I tried that yesterday with my SiC sheets in 180, then 80 grit. That got me nowhere. No perceptible difference.



dont do this!


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

coxhaus said:


> If you are going to have to replace it every 2 years it might be cheaper to buy a Worksharp KO.



I've already got a Tormek that I bought over 20 years ago. "Dry" sharpening is just not my cup-of-tea.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

bobby try to do edge leading strokes in the future. i think its better. edge trailing will always leave some kind of burr folding over the other side.

i never do any kind of trailing on stones either. it just sucks. and never on belt grinders either. if an edge is what i want that is. and i've been working around industrial grinders since i was 15. and even then i found out it has to be edge leading to get less burrs.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> I've already got a Tormek that I bought over 20 years ago.



what about using that one? free hand on top of the wheel?


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> I LOVE it!!!!



yeah try rolling it on SiC powder between glass/tile and whatever crap you have. i think it will work very very good!


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## coxhaus (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> I've already got a Tormek that I bought over 20 years ago. "Dry" sharpening is just not my cup-of-tea.



That should work.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> what about using that one? free hand on top of the wheel?



As I stated above, I'm basically doing a long-term experiment to see how long the edge lasts on a relatively soft steel like my 6" Victorinox utility knife, and to find the relationship difference compared to using a harder steel and stones. At the end of the day, does one simply balance the other?


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> bobby try to do edge leading strokes in the future. i think its better. edge trailing will always leave some kind of burr folding over the other side.
> 
> i never do any kind of trailing on stones either. it just sucks. and never on belt grinders either. if an edge is what i want that is. and i've been working around industrial grinders since i was 15. and even then i found out it has to be edge leading to get less burrs.



I can dig it, but,,,,,, edge-leading may also require more thinning,,,, so counter-productive to the experiment I'm trying to do,,,,, which is to remove as little steel as humanly possible.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> yeah try rolling it on SiC powder between glass/tile and whatever crap you have. i think it will work very very good!



Yeah, I may try that at one point. I bought a bunch of SiC powder for deglazing my low-grit Shapton Glass stones, specifically the 120, 220, and 320. I've got the Shapton Diamond Glass Lapping plate, but as Shapton states, that plate can't be used on anything below 500 Grit.

That said, I believe that in a de-glazing operation, the SiC might work, but,,,, I'm not de-glazing the ceramic rod. It has zero loading,,, clean as a whistle.


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## Benuser (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> bobby try to do edge leading strokes in the future. i think its better. edge trailing will always leave some kind of burr folding over the other side.
> 
> i never do any kind of trailing on stones either. it just sucks. and never on belt grinders either. if an edge is what i want that is. and i've been working around industrial grinders since i was 15. and even then i found out it has to be edge leading to get less burrs.


On the Böker LongLife I use in some emergency cases, my last strokes are 'sur place', along the edge, to catch the last burr remnants. Normal strokes are as light as possible, edge leading, but do already create a burr. Edge trailing creates an unnecessary big one.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> Yeah, I may try that at one point. I bought a bunch of SiC powder for deglazing my low-grit Shapton Glass stones, specifically the 120, 220, and 320. I've got the Shapton Diamond Glass Lapping plate, but as Shapton states, that plate can't be used on anything below 500 Grit.
> 
> That said, I believe that in a de-glazing operation, the SiC might work, but,,,, I'm not de-glazing the ceramic rod. It has zero loading,,, clean as a whistle.



the plate can probably be used on whatever stone you want but you will wear it out pretty quickly. basically diamond plates dont like coarse stones since the grit is so coarse it will dislodge the diamonds.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

Benuser said:


> On the Böker LongLife I use in some emergency cases, my last strokes are 'sur place', along the edge, to catch the last burr remnants. Normal strokes are as light as possible, edge leading, but do already create a burr. *Edge trailing creates an unnecessary big one*.



That has not been my experience so far with the Vic. I sometimes vary the honing angle by what would seem to be a rather extreme amount,,, somewhat akin to what Cliff Stamp (R.I.P.) suggested with his "plateau sharpening" method. I've only needed to do that once,,,, maybe twice, since I bought the knife in November, 2018. That involves a very low angle on the side of the apex, followed by a very light stroke at 45 degrees or more across the top of the apex, then back to the side of the bevel for finishing. Worked surprisingly well.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> the plate can probably be used on whatever stone you want but you will wear it out pretty quickly. basically diamond plates dont like coarse stones since the grit is so coarse it will dislodge the diamonds.



Yeah, My plan was to buy the SG120, 220 and 320 for successively deglazing/flattening each other,,,, then SiC powder for the 120. There's also the 3-stone method; Example; three 120's for flattening each other.


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## inferno (Jul 14, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> Yeah, My plan was to buy the SG120, 220 and 320 for successively deglazing/flattening each other,,,, then SiC powder for the 120. There's also the 3-stone method; Example; three 120's for flattening each other.



if youre smart this is what you should do:

get a 120 and 220 pro. then a 500 double thick glass. 
the 120 and 220 are real coarse stones. the 500 is for regular worn knives. 

now to maintain these 2 coarse stones you just put the knife where the stone is not dished, where it sticks up. and then voila its flat again. these stones wear so fast so you can basically direct where the wear is going. got it? no flattening will ever be needed.

i have the 120 and 220 pro, then the 220 glass. and my strategy is basically to not ever flatten them. i just leave the slurry on there and work the slurry. doing this is what keeps them cutting.
its basically 10 minutes regular sharpening and then 10 minutes on the sides only. and to be honest you dont need more flat than that. its flat enough. and if doing edges only the stone can look like fukn half pipe for snowboards! dont waste your stone.

i have gound out 2 62-63hrc monosteel single bevel blades with the 220, never flattened it. still the bevel is 100% flat. and the back side is mirror flat too. i cant say its 1/6 lambda flat (wavelenght @ 535 nanometer flat, how you judge optical mirrors for telescopes) but still its totally flat. its the indian not the arrow! never forget. 







the thread My first knife


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## jwthaparc (Jul 14, 2021)

I've heard edge leading strokes on leather are better for burr reduction too


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## coxhaus (Jul 14, 2021)

How do you keep from cutting your leather or shaving it?

I would think it would be pretty dangerous on a power tool felt or leather.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 14, 2021)

inferno said:


> if youre smart this is what you should do:
> 
> get a 120 and 220 pro. then a 500 double thick glass.
> the 120 and 220 are real coarse stones. the 500 is for regular worn knives.
> ...



I already have the SG 120, 220, 320, 500, 1k, 2k, 4k, and 8k. plus a Naniwa Green Brick, and a Norton 4-stone kit (220,1k,4k, 8k) plus a few Atoma and more, plus three flattening plates.(Large Naniwa, smaller Norton, and Shapton DGLP). I have been considering adding a few of the Shapton Pro's for quite some time, but I just can't justify those for the time being. I'm overloaded.


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## Mr.Wizard (Jul 17, 2021)

I have not been able to duplicate the velvety matte factory finish of the Idahone Fine Rod using silicon carbide lapping on other ceramics, such as an Idahone Fine bench stone. I have a suspicion that the Fine Rod finish may be produced though chemical etching or fine abrasive blasting.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 18, 2021)

Mr.Wizard said:


> I have not been able to duplicate the velvety matte factory finish of the Idahone Fine Rod using silicon carbide lapping on other ceramics, such as an Idahone Fine bench stone. I have a suspicion that the Fine Rod finish may be produced though chemical etching or fine abrasive blasting.



Yeah, abrasion of any kind seems rather counter productive. The rod will wear just as any stone would, and I just have to accept that. I'm ordering another one though, because I do like how this rod performs, and it's so handy.


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## jwthaparc (Jul 18, 2021)

coxhaus said:


> How do you keep from cutting your leather or shaving it?
> 
> I would think it would be pretty dangerous on a power tool felt or leather.


Hhhmmm. Idk I guess it just took some practice, but mostly it just came naturally to me. 




(It was just a joke)


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## Benuser (Jul 18, 2021)

For others who might consider getting a ceramic rod: I don't know the Idahone, but the synthetic rubin Sieger LongLife, distributed by Böker, does not wear as far as I have noticed. Leaves a 2k-like result. Two sizes. I have the long one, but don't know why the much cheaper short one wouldn't do the job, even with long blades.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 19, 2021)

Benuser said:


> For others who might consider getting a ceramic rod: I don't know the Idahone, but the synthetic rubin Sieger LongLife, distributed by Böker, does not wear as far as I have noticed. Leaves a 2k-like result. Two sizes. I have the long one, but don't know why the much cheaper short one wouldn't do the job, even with long blades.



That looks interesting Benuser, thanks for that tip. I'll check it out in the morning.


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## Mr.Wizard (Jul 19, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> Yeah, abrasion of any kind seems rather counter productive. The rod will wear just as any stone would, and I just have to accept that. I'm ordering another one though, because I do like how this rod performs, and it's so handy.



Since you will be replacing it perhaps you could experiment on the worn out rod, like etching with phosphoric acid?


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 19, 2021)

I'm definitely going to hang on to the old one for the time being, and keep it as a quasi burnisher . I just ordered a new one from PaulsFinest, so that should arrive mid-week. I also threw in a few other items with that order; Felco pruners and shears, plus a holster,,,,, just in time for harvesting fresh tomatoes from my garden. Looks like a super crop this year.


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## rocketman (Jul 20, 2021)

I wonder if sand blasting the rod with very fine grit would do the job. Not really sand, but aluminum oxide.


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## Kawa (Jul 20, 2021)

Would that be worth the effort/cost? Or do you have a sandblaster at home


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## Benuser (Jul 20, 2021)

Duplicate


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## rocketman (Jul 20, 2021)

I have a cabinet blaster I use for cleaning forged knives, and getting handles ready for adhesive. Use aluminum oxide as a media.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 20, 2021)

I;ve got a small sand-blaster,,,, somewhere. I've never used it. I doubt it would do much good.

I've got to find out how this rod is made, and whether a thin abrasive layer is simply applied and adhered onto the surface of the rod, or,,,,,, is the rod and abrasive one solid material through and through (like a stone) which would allow for some surface wear,,, and simultaneously exposing a new surface as it wears.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 21, 2021)

Well I'll be damned,,,, and,,, I may have to eat my words. The *old* rod seems to be working quite well today, thank-you-very-much.

My new rod had just arrived in the mail this morning, and when I unpacked it and checked the surface of that new rod, I found there was no appreciable difference with my old rod, Hmmm,

So,,,,, today I was making a breakfast sandwich and needed to cut some thin tomato slices, and lo and behold, the 6" Vic utility knife I was using had finally dulled just enough over the last week or so, to the point where it did not instantly bite into the tomato skin. Perfect time to test the old rod again. So,,,, I dug out my *old* rod ,, gave the Vic a few trailing-edge swipes, noticed that the rod was showing traces of loading again, and therefore was actually removing material and sharpening, and voila,,, success. The knife cut that tomato like a razor blade. Back in the saddle again, now with *2* Idahone ceramic rods.

I have no idea why. Last week when I first posted this thread, the rod simply was not removing metal.

Go figure.


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## TJ Watson (Jul 21, 2021)

Puzzled - we've pretty much the same ceramic rod (which, BTW, has a ceramic coating over a metallic core), and after 20+ years it's showing some wear, but is still perfectly usable as a hone. We hone as a final step before stropping, taking 10 alternate strokes (20 total), with each stroke into the edge, running from heel to tip at whatever angle seems best for each blade. 

From time to time the honing rod shows silver/grey streaks which we assume are removed blade material - which gets gently washed away with warm water and dish soap applied with a <plastic> (not steel wool) pad. A few minutes of cleaning appears to remove all the metallic fragments and whatever burnishing the rod has taken, and the rod's surface now has the same slightly matte finish as when new.


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## Bobby2shots (Jul 21, 2021)

OK,,, good to know about ceramic coating over metal. Thanks and much appreciated.

As I mentioned earlier, I generally need only 3-4 very gentle trailing-edge strokes when honing my Vic utility knife. I clean the rod with the Superaser, which works exceptionally well compared to everything else I've tried. I've never allowed this knife to get dull, and I'm on it immediately if it even starts to show signs of losing cutting efficiency. 

I should also mention that I sometimes use the rod as a quasi "feeler-gauge" , by dragging the rod very gently along either side of the bevel, to detect the slightest trace of the edge rolling over. A gentle grip on the rod allows the rod to transmit any vibrations from contact with deformities along the edge, directly to the hand, and that shows me fairly precisely which areas along the blade require special attention. Seems to work well for me.


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 10, 2021)

Update,,, (scratching my head on this one);

OK,,, so I ordered a new "fine" ceramic rod from Paul'sFinest.com and received it last week. That said, I haven't needed to use it,,,,yet. It seems that the old rod is now working fine. The rod still feels much smoother than when it was new, but it is definitely removing metal once again.

As for the Vic knife, I went for roughly 2 weeks using one of my honing steels, but wasn't really getting the results I wanted with very ripe tomatoes. I was starting to think my experiment was coming to an end, and that I'd shortly need to re-sharpen the Vic on stones. I continued using the Idahone despite the fact that I could not see any traces of that rod removing metal. After roughly 5 days, I started seeing the rod very gradually improving. The gritty "feel" still wasn't back to normal, but it was definitely removing metal. (dark traces on the white rod)

Yesterday, I decided to make a breakfast sandwich (egg, sharp cheddar, tomato, lettuce, mayo on toast) I used a very large and verrrry ripe tomato that I had picked in my garden last week,,, very soft to the touch. The Vic bit into that soft-skinned tomato like a razor blade and I'm at a loss to explain why. The knife seemed to cut as if it were brand new again. So,,,, it looks like the experiment continues.

In the last two weeks, the only thing I did differently, was stropping the blade on my leather strop. A few (3-4) passes on each side. Each time I did that, the knife was razor-sharp with immediate bite into tomato skins. When the knife was at its' worst, it still cut tomatoes reasonably well. however, it was not "immediate" bite on the first stroke. It sometimes took 2-3 strokes.


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## dafox (Aug 10, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> Update,,, (scratching my head on this one);
> 
> OK,,, so I ordered a new "fine" ceramic rod from Paul'sFinest.com and received it last week. That said, I haven't needed to use it,,,,yet. It seems that the old rod is now working fine. The rod still feels much smoother than when it was new, but it is definitely removing metal once again.
> 
> ...


Is the strop loaded with anything?


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 10, 2021)

dafox said:


> Is the strop loaded with anything?



Yes, Green honing compound that I bought from Lee Valley Tools many years ago. That strop however, may be a bit of a "red herring".


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## coxhaus (Aug 10, 2021)

Wonder how you know what compound? I had an old manual strop that came with green compound but my new stropping leather belt for my Ken Onion came with white compound.


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## MowgFace (Aug 10, 2021)

coxhaus said:


> Wonder how you know what compound? I had an old manual strop that came with green compound but my new stropping leather belt for my Ken Onion came with white compound.



Same way you can tell if its Forged vs. Stamped. You cant. Apparently no one even knows. Not even the manufacturer.


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## HumbleHomeCook (Aug 10, 2021)

There is no universal color-to-grit standard. One company's green might be course and another company's might be fine.


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 10, 2021)

O.K, ,,,, I may be on to something here; 

1st, there's the Idahone rod losing its' grit and cutting ability, which directly reduced the sharpness of the knife. Why/how did that happen? Is it possible that the "pores" of the honing rod somehow became clogged with something that wasn't visible? After-all, I had thoroughly cleaned the rod with the Superaser, and SOS?

Enter the strop,,,,,,

Is it possible that the waxy green honing compound left a fine/clear/invisible residue on the knife, then in turn clogging the surface of the honing rod when I used it on the knife??? 

Hmmm


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 10, 2021)

coxhaus said:


> Wonder how you know what compound? I had an old manual strop that came with green compound but my new stropping leather belt for my Ken Onion came with white compound.



I have a large block of green compound. Basically, it's a buffing compound that can be used on strops, or buffing wheels, etc. Grade was extra-fine as I recall. Actually, I have a few of those green buffing compound bars, as well as several brands of diamond pastes such as Tormek, etc.) You can use a lot of materials for simple stropping, but the buffing compounds and fine abrasive pastes give you that extra dimension of polishing.


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## coxhaus (Aug 11, 2021)

The honing compounds do have a wax in them. I would think you could use brake cleaner and clean your honing rod if it is wax.

It could be that using a white compound with power works better than green. From what I remember is the people that use different colors use different wheels. You have a wheel for each color.


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 23, 2021)

*AHA!!!!!!! *I may have isolated the issue. While watching a Jef Jewell video on sharpening with Nanohone stones, he expressed his disappointment with one stone in particular. He later realized that he had cleaned that stone with a rust eraser, which is precisely what I had done with my ceramic rod. The rust eraser had left a deposit on the stone, which greatly reduced the cutting capability and feel of the stone. The deposit was subsequently removed when Jef lapped the stone with the Nanohone Diamond lapping plate.

Now, I won't get those results unfortunately, since the rod is cylindrical and can't be lapped in the traditional manner, but there's hope. The rod has started working again, so that lends credence to Jef's observation. The rod is still not back to "normal", but it's much better than a few weeks ago.


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## refcast (Aug 23, 2021)

Yeah you could try a sandpaper to return texture to the hone too

Silicon carbide is harder, than some ceramics so it might work


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## stringer (Aug 23, 2021)

Bobby2shots said:


> *AHA!!!!!!! *I may have isolated the issue. While watching a Jef Jewell video on sharpening with Nanohone stones, he expressed his disappointment with one stone in particular. He later realized that he had cleaned that stone with a rust eraser, which is precisely what I had done with my ceramic rod. The rust eraser had left a deposit on the stone, which greatly reduced the cutting capability and feel of the stone. The deposit was subsequently removed when Jef lapped the stone with the Nanohone Diamond lapping plate.
> 
> Now, I won't get those results unfortunately, since the rod is cylindrical and can't be lapped in the traditional manner, but there's hope. The rod has started working again, so that lends credence to Jef's observation. The rod is still not back to "normal", but it's much better than a few weeks ago.




If that's all you think it is then I would just go with a fresh green scotch Brite scour pad and some dish soap. Should be more than enough abrasive and detergent to remove the residue without doing any damage.


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 23, 2021)

refcast said:


> Yeah you could try a sandpaper to return texture to the hone too
> 
> Silicon carbide is harder, than some ceramics so it might work


Yes, I tried SiC wet/dry paper last week, but no luck. As I said earlier, the rod cuts now, so whatever was causing the rod to stop cutting, seemingly evaporates or degrades over time. I'm not sure exactly about the make-up of the Superaser, but I'm going to try a degreaser next. That said, the rod is cutting marginally better with each passing day.


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## Bobby2shots (Aug 23, 2021)

stringer said:


> If that's all you think it is then I would just go with a fresh green scotch Brite scour pad and some dish soap. Should be more than enough abrasive and detergent to remove the residue without doing any damage.



Yes, I tried that early on, but no luck. I used Dawn and very hot water on an abrasive pad,,,, no go,,,, tried Barkeepers' Friend,,,, nope,,,, tried S.O.S.,,,, same result.

Jef Jewell speculated that rubber from the rust eraser was imbedding itself into his stone. After he lapped it, the stone was great. I might try playing around with some different grit ratings of SiC powder. The rod however, has steadily improved since I first posted here. Strange.


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