# To which extent is it better to add more stones in your progression?



## Marcelo Amaral (Feb 20, 2015)

Not long ago, when i started sharpening my double bevel knives with the help of you guys, i had the idea that the more stones one had in the progression, the better, as it would be possible to refine the edge more and more.
Nowadays, it looks to me it might not be necessarily the case and other factors like finding the right stone for the steel at hand are more important.
What's your take on this? Thank you for the answers.


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## petefromNY (Feb 20, 2015)

I also thought the same thing ! i found going higher than 5-6 on my knives does terrible things for the edge retention. It may look awesome but its just not my thing. I have recently only been going to a 3k and have never been happier !ha


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## TheDispossessed (Feb 20, 2015)

to the extent that your wallet allows...
seriously, i may be wrong, but from what i've heard on this forum over the years, most people gravitate towards fewer stones in the long run.
finding the right progression is just trial and error i suppose, and also where you like to stop (strop?)
bad pun sorry.
for newbies, fewer stones can sometimes mean fewer 'mistakes' too, in the sense that, you're a little more likely to get a consistent set of bevels with less jumping around.
in any event just enjoy it! sharpening is one of my favorite things, it's my zen time.


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## TheDispossessed (Feb 20, 2015)

also, something i think gets neglected in discussions regarding finishing grit and edge retention,
the higher finish, offering an ultimately smaller/finer edge, will be more fragile in a sense, so care needs to be taken when cutting.
adjusting the level of force applied when hitting the board is really important to edge life.
it takes a little practice to use just the amount of force needed to cut and not push into the board. 
people hate on poly boards (myself included) but someone who knows how to cut can do better on one than someone hammering into an end-grain.
just my opinion.


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## Matus (Feb 20, 2015)

The 'right' stone progression is something that will it you need and/or taste. For most times I use 2 stones (2000 and 6000) and only when the blade is really dull or needs some repair I start from 400. I am learning to use natural stones so some blades will see one more step, but that is more for me to enjoy it, than the knife really needing it.


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## Ruso (Feb 20, 2015)

Having many stones is a plus in a terms of selection and finding the ones you like better for a specific grit range.
In terms of actual sharpening progression on a double bevel knives I rarely use more than 3.


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## mkriggen (Feb 20, 2015)

Depends on the knife and what condition it is in. If the edge is in pretty good shape I'll start with something in the 1200-2000 range to refresh the edge and draw a burr. I follow this with a Gesshin 4000. Depending on the knife I may stop here. In the past, if I wanted to go higher, I'd finish up with an 8000 kitayama. I recently come into possession of a Gesshin 8000 and a Takashima-awasedo from JKI, so I'm not sure what my high finish progression is going to turn into yet.

Be well,
Mikey


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## Asteger (Feb 20, 2015)

For me it's almost always 1-3 stones, and usually 1 as often as 2, with 3 less usual. As you might guess with me, these are all naturals which I think of course helps as they have that range beyond where they start in coarseness. I recently got a few new synths to try out and compare (kind of a culture shock) and with them I felt I needed more, so maybe 2 or 3 instead of 1 or 2.

The bulk of my stones are mediums, so these are what I usually use. Occasionally I might pull out one of 3 coarse ones (say, 500 gritish and less) and occasionally I'll use an awasedo (5k and beyond) of which I have a few more; at least 2/3 of what I have are meds, but the variety is nice. Of the synth stones I have, my 3k Chosera seems a perfectly acceptable endpoint following a 1k or 800 if necessary. I should also say thay when I think of this I'm imagining sharpening my 'standard' knives; I like heavier gyuto, but I might want to go finer on lighter/smaller gyuto, so into the 5k+/ awasedo range for these.


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## CompE (Feb 20, 2015)

No matter how beaten up a double-bevel knife is, I won't use more than 4 stones on it. Gesshin 400, Bester 1200, Rika 5K and Takenoko 8K (actually 6K) is my core set. Most of the time I can skip the Gesshin. I may decide to use my Beston 500 instead of the Gesshin. Sometimes I'll start with my 2K Aoto and work up from there. I might stop at the Rika or I might skip it and go straight for the Takenoko. I might just decide to give a quick touch-up on the Takenoko alone. I may decide to try a crazy experiment like following a 2K Aoto with a polish on a Chinese 12K. (I really need to start taking notes on my experiments).

The point is, I don't think that I need more than the 4 stones in my core set (and I could easily live without one of the Rika or Takenoko), but that's no reason for me to limit myself to just 3 stones in my collection.


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## osakajoe (Feb 20, 2015)

When it come to double bevel sharpening two stones is enough. 

One medium grit stone and one fine grit stone. That's all you need. 

Although it is recommended you get a rough grit stone to lap you sharpening stones and if necessary repair damaged blades. 


Single bevel will require a few more.


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## psfred (Feb 20, 2015)

Depends entirely upon the steel, the knife, and the purpose.

Cheap stainless gets run on the Bester 1200 and the synthetic aoto and stropped. Tojiro DP gyuto gets the same treatment, but finished on the King 6K or Arashiyama 6K and stropped. Hard carbon steel gets the Kitayama before stropping.

This gives what I think is the best edge for each steel and knife. Paring knives get a bit more polish sometimes, and so do slicers even in cheap stainless because I like screaming sharp edges on those knives. 

There are no hard and fast "rules" about which stones to use for what, or what progression is "best" -- knives and users are very individualistic, after all. What suits you I may really dislike.

Peter


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## Benuser (Feb 21, 2015)

I tend to agree, adapt the progression to both steel and use. But generally speaking, more stones = more fuss. More errors, more fatigue.


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## salmonkiller (Feb 21, 2015)

1k to 6K two stone progression followed by a strop is what I currently do for my carbon kitchen knives.


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## Marcelo Amaral (Feb 22, 2015)

I must admit i was expecting some few defending a progression with more stones (four or more) and the majority with less, but it looks like people are reaching a consensus of two with strop or three stones. Thank you for you feedback.


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## JBroida (Feb 22, 2015)

Marcelo Amaral said:


> I must admit i was expecting some few defending a progression with more stones (four or more) and the majority with less, but it looks like people are reaching a consensus of two with strop or three stones. Thank you for you feedback.



there's a big difference between practical and for fun... most people here also sharpen for fun, and use more than 4 stones often. But even dorks like me still use a 3 stone setup (or similarly uncomplicated set) when doing more practical sharpening.


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## psfred (Feb 22, 2015)

Any stone finer than about 4000 grit is just polishing the already established edge. If you don't need or want a highly polished edge, there is no point in running through a long progression of stones.

Woodworking tools are different, and I always run 1200-3000-6000-8000-strop on chromium oxide, usually with an angle jig. Very highly polished edges are vital -- the closer to a perfect flat plane intersection with no surface texture you can get the better the tool cuts wood. Dull chisels are very hazardous, just like dull knives but much more likely to severe a finger. 

Most knives don't work any better with a super polished edge for general food prep than they do with a much less polished one, so a 1000/3000 or 1000/6000 set of stones is perfectly adequate and leaves a nice edge that lasts. Single bevel knives are a different subject all together, that's where you will find people polishing and edge on a 12,000 grit stone all the time.

Not only that, but if you sharpen when the knife just starts to get dull, it's a breeze. If you wait until you have to use a hammer on the back to cut potatoes, it's gonna be a huge chore. 

Peter


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## gregg (Feb 25, 2015)

psfred said:


> Any stone finer than about 4000 grit is just polishing the already established edge. If you don't need or want a highly polished edge, there is no point in running through a long progression of stones.
> 
> Woodworking tools are different, and I always run 1200-3000-6000-8000-strop on chromium oxide, usually with an angle jig. Very highly polished edges are vital -- the closer to a perfect flat plane intersection with no surface texture you can get the better the tool cuts wood. Dull chisels are very hazardous, just like dull knives but much more likely to severe a finger.
> 
> ...



:biggrin: I _love_ the hammer bit; had an in-law complain that a blade I had done wasn't "that sharp", and when I looked at it I had a moment of doubt about my work in that it had a _hugely_ folded over edge. I finally realized that she had been whacking the back to cut through chicken bones when I looked at the spine. She was a bit cagey about it at first, but finally admitted to using the knife as a cold chisel! Doh!!


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