# MORITAKA ISSUES OF THE PAST ARE SOLVED?



## bere1821 (Jun 5, 2016)

Hi Guys,

New to the forum.

I read so many things regarding the issues with Moritakas in the past. Most of these were around 2011 - 2012.

Since then, i have not noticed too many reports. I actually got a 240 Gyuto Aogami Super, directly from them and i did not notice any issues apart from some minor finishing issues in the ferrule / handle alignment.

As i am getting ready for my second Moritaka (Kiritsuke 270 Aogami Super), please let me know if you are still aware of any issues.

Thanks


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## Jaspernowhere (Jun 5, 2016)

I had a 240 that was a few years old and it was a good grind, great ht. My coworker loves his 250 ks, although it has a much different geometry. It has a much more pronounced distal taper.


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## Jaspernowhere (Jun 5, 2016)

I forgot to mention that the kurouchi basically falls off and the cladding is extremely reactive. I sold mine because I found it to be to much to keep up with, not just on the line but during prep as well. It was in a sense a brilliantly cutting rust bucket.


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## chinacats (Jun 5, 2016)

Just curious, but with hundreds of makers to choose from, why would you risk it? 

BTW, AOsuper was never as bad as his other Ao line from my recollection.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jun 5, 2016)

From the former threads on them one got the impression that these knives come in two flavors: One for customers that expect these defects to be there, and use technique that makes holes in the edge irrelevant, and one for those that consider them a big problem. I remember reading that thread and thinking to myself "if that is so, it is the resellers and not the makers being ambigous or even dishonest"... Could the current state of affairs be just changes in who distributes which knives, where, to whom?


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## bere1821 (Jun 6, 2016)

chinacats said:


> Just curious, but with hundreds of makers to choose from, why would you risk it?
> 
> BTW, AOsuper was never as bad as his other Ao line from my recollection.



The reason to choose it was the following:

As i live in Qatar, my options to choose were very limited. In Qatar you can find only Zwilling, Miyabi, Global, Shun and Wusthoff. 

No one is shipping from US, in Europe there are limited options and still difficult to ship, and my final option was to buy directly from Japan. The only collaborative person i could find was Akiko Moritaka that replied with exceptional service and the knife arrived in 3 days from Japan.

On the other hand, even though i read the issues, i have not seen lately any problems and my Knife came in very good shape (apart from minor defects that i corrected).

By the way I contacted also Konosuke but Kosuke told me that there is no stock and they do not even know when there will be stock.....

So far i am happy with the knife, but it is still new. We'll see.

If anybody could give me more options to buy, i would be gratefull.


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## ynot1985 (Jun 6, 2016)

Have you tried Maksim at Japanese natural stones?

He has free worldwide shipping over a certain amount. 

You can also try Japanese chef's knives. $7 usd shipping worldwide. 

I have brought from both and both are great


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## Charon (Jun 6, 2016)

ynot1985 is spot on. 

There is also BlueWayJapan on ebay that ships worldwide. They have more specialized monosteel blades. 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Japanese-GINGA-White-Steel-Wa-Sujihiki-Knife-240mm-/381538917014#shpCntId

Finally some vendors on Rakuten ship internationally but your risk is higher since google translate is poor and most vendors know little English. 

You can get something like a Yoshikane SKD 240 for 200$ + shipping and whatever import stuff you have at home. 
http://item.rakuten.co.jp/yminfo/10004544?s-id=top_normal_histreco_bh


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## aboynamedsuita (Jun 6, 2016)

I can also recommend Maksim at Japanese Natural Stones. Great service and products, my orders usually arrive to Canada about 48 hours after they ship via DHL.


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## daveb (Jun 6, 2016)

Maxim at "JNS" (Denmark) and James at "Knives and Stones" (Australia) are both site supporting vendors that will ship internationally.


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## krx927 (Jun 6, 2016)

You can also purchase directly from Watanabe and Heiji...


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## JBroida (Jun 6, 2016)

I've also shipped to Qatar before... Have friends working out there and more moving there soon


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## Dave Martell (Jun 6, 2016)

You know the saying, "ignorance is bliss"? When it comes to Moritaka maybe it's best not to go looking for problems that you don't see and just be happy.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jun 6, 2016)

By the way, can or cannot one sharpen a hole-infested blade so that the edge will be sharp within and without the holes, usable for off-board work?


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## Dave Martell (Jun 6, 2016)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> By the way, can or cannot one sharpen a hole-infested blade so that the edge will be sharp within and without the holes, usable for off-board work?




One could use the corner/edge of a stone, a flexible belt sander/grinder, or rod type sharpening device to work into and out of the hole infested edge.  

Moritaka recurve? :lol2:


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## daveb (Jun 6, 2016)

Or one could start with a blade that was not hole infested?


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jun 6, 2016)

Asked that question because if they are/used to be made that way, and customers in japan were satisfied (as was claimed in emails in that long thread), there must be a method to actually use them that way  And if they were used much as off-board slicers (as was also suggested IIRC) it kind of sounds plausible if you can keep them sharp...


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## Pensacola Tiger (Jun 6, 2016)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> Asked that question because if they are/used to be made that way, and customers in japan were satisfied (as was claimed in emails in that long thread), there must be a method to actually use them that way  And if they were used much as off-board slicers (as was also suggested IIRC) it kind of sounds plausible if you can keep them sharp...



I think you've missed the point that not every Moritaka has an overgrind that will result in a hole, but that enough of them did to warrant Dave's words of caution.

I've owned three Moritakas, and none of them had the "hole issue". 

Rick


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## ynot1985 (Jun 6, 2016)

Moritakas were the first *** knives that I have owned.. They are great value for it's price point with Super Aogami steel. You just have to accept that it's like Russian Roulette when you order one. **** happens


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## bere1821 (Jun 7, 2016)

JBroida said:


> I've also shipped to Qatar before... Have friends working out there and more moving there soon



Thanks for your reply

Could you give me an indication for a 2 Kg package to Qatar, how much it would cost and how long would it take to arrive??

I am already going through your items, but i need an indication of the total cost

Thanks


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## kizam (Jun 7, 2016)

I'm curious...when you guys mention "hole" what exactly does that look like. My mind just keeps envisioning chip but this seems much larger...and rounder.


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## MAS4T0 (Jun 8, 2016)

kizam said:


> I'm curious...when you guys mention "hole" what exactly does that look like. My mind just keeps envisioning chip but this seems much larger...and rounder.



If you picture the 3d shape of the blade, and consider a plane which passes through the midsection of the blade (running along the centre to the spine and edge).

With a "hole" there is one (or more) area(s) where there is an over grind so significant that it actually passes through that plane. When the blade is thinned and sharpened up to this point, there is no material there, resulting in a hole at the cutting edge.


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## kizam (Jun 8, 2016)

Thanks, hope I never have to gain personal, first hand knowledge of this


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## Bill13 (Jun 8, 2016)

MAS4T0 said:


> If you picture the 3d shape of the blade, and consider a plane which passes through the midsection of the blade (running along the centre to the spine and edge).
> 
> With a "hole" there is one (or more) area(s) where there is an over grind so significant that it actually passes through that plane. When the blade is thinned and sharpened up to this point, there is no material there, resulting in a hole at the cutting edge.



Excellent description!!


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## Dave Martell (Jun 8, 2016)

MAS4T0 said:


> If you picture the 3d shape of the blade, and consider a plane which passes through the midsection of the blade (running along the centre to the spine and edge).
> 
> With a "hole" there is one (or more) area(s) where there is an over grind so significant that it actually passes through that plane. When the blade is thinned and sharpened up to this point, there is no material there, resulting in a hole at the cutting edge.





Bill13 said:


> Excellent description!!




lus1:


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## aboynamedsuita (Jun 8, 2016)

I've read dribs and drabs of this and the other thread so may have missed it, but I'm curious if the issues are exclusively about the grind, or are there also issues with San-Mai not being flat prior to grinding (eg wavy core), which then gets ground unevenly and creates holes in the core (but filled with cladding). I thought I read a response email from moritaka saying something about waviness


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## kizam (Jun 9, 2016)

hey op...these gentlemen don't seem dismayed!!


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## Ruso (Jun 10, 2016)

chinacats said:


> Just curious, but with hundreds of makers to choose from, why would you risk it?
> 
> BTW, AOsuper was never as bad as his other Ao line from my recollection.



What are other options for high hardened AS for a reasonable price? Taked is so expensive now.


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## F-Flash (Jun 10, 2016)

Kurosaki?


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## chinacats (Jun 10, 2016)

Ruso said:


> What are other options for high hardened AS for a reasonable price? Taked is so expensive now.



I guess that I don't really shop by steel so hadn't thought of it that way...off the top of my head I would probably go with a Zakuri if it was available. As to Takeda, it is such a distinct critter that I don't like to compare it to other knives but once you try it, you will quickly realize whether or not it is the right knife for you.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jun 10, 2016)

Ruso said:


> What are other options for high hardened AS for a reasonable price? Taked is so expensive now.



a couple SS clad AS which come to mind are Ikazuchi from JKI, and Mutsumi Hinoura Tsuchime (I got the Hinoura petty and gyuto from Tosho and Buttermilk Supply)


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jun 10, 2016)

Sakon/Hokiyama has an AS migaki series that claims to be 64+. Not advertised as fully handmade, can only find it at their german distributor http://gx2.japan-messer-shop.de/de/Hokiyama-Cutlery-Sakon/SAKON-Aogami-Super-Wa-Hocho/. Have one from that series (which I would generally rate a 4 out of 5), cannot check the HRC claim but noticed that a standard IKEA ceramic rod (which will readily abrade [email protected]) will do very little to the edge metal on that one (will give a noticeable honing? effect that results in the knife being sharper, but will hardly even abrade the patina).

Azai also claim 64+ AS, but might a little above the envisioned price range.


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## Pensacola Tiger (Jun 10, 2016)

Ruso said:


> What are other options for high hardened AS for a reasonable price? Taked is so expensive now.



Syousin Chiku sold by Knives & Stones: http://www.knivesandstones.com/syousin-chiku/


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## Ruso (Jun 10, 2016)

All great options, and something to consider, especially Kurosaki. However none* are even close to $150 for 240mm (direct from Moritaka) or $170 from some retailers. 

*didnt check Zakuri


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## brainsausage (Jun 10, 2016)

Ruso said:


> All great options, and something to consider, especially Kurosaki. However none* are even close to $150 for 240mm (direct from Moritaka) or $170 from some retailers.
> 
> *didnt check Zakuri



I'd rather pay a bit extra for peace of mind...


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