# 1 Medium Grit to RULE THEM ALL?



## SolidSnake03 (Aug 5, 2015)

Alright so mildly sensationalist title aside I'm interested in picking up 1 medium grit stone for a friend as a present. I want to ideally try and find something that is just a great all around 1 stone sharpening solution type of thing where he can use just that stone and maybe strop on some leather after for a good all purpose kitchen edge (all knives are double bevel). Want to keep this fairly simple (1-stone) and keep him away from anything too coarse like a 400 grit or something. In the past I've been helping keep his knives up to snuff for him. The guy has a variety of knives some in Stainless, some Carbon and some PM (R2 and SG2) so the stone needs to be able to work well for them all.

I already have a few in mind but am having trouble trying to decide on what to go with. Price isn't a huge issue but don't really want to go over $100. That said, I don't need to spend a ton of cash if something cheaper works well because honestly, part of me wants to just get him a King 1000 and say "have at it!" and let him work with that for a while.

Anyhow, these are the stones I'm looking at:

King 1000
JNS 800
JNS 1000
JKI 1200
JKI 1500
JKI 2000
Naniwa 2k (Green Brick)
Chosera 1000
Bester 1200

*anything else I'm missing?*

I know this is a lot of stones to think about but I figured you guys probably have owned or used a good many of these and may have some useful comparative insight. Also, totally open to buying one off anyone looking to unload a great medium grit stone, doesn't have to be new, just wanted to throw that out there as well.

Thanks!


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## knyfeknerd (Aug 5, 2015)

You're missing the King 800. great stone!


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## daveb (Aug 5, 2015)

From yr list: G2K


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## chinacats (Aug 5, 2015)

List is pretty solid overall...I'd replace the King 1k with the 800 and drop the green brick (it's pretty worthless for anything other than cheap stainless imo).


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 5, 2015)

Just curious about those mentioning the King 800, I'm not overly familiar with this stone, is it just a faster and better version of the King 1000? To be honest, most of what I've read about the King stuff is usually in relation to using the King 1000 and 6000 as a pretty affordable 2 stone set up.


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## psfred (Aug 5, 2015)

The difference between a King 800 and a King 1000 is minimal. Almost non-existant, in fact, I have a great deal of difficulty telling mine apart, finally wrote on them with a magic marker. Same virtues and faults, which is why I only use them to hold other stones up to working height now.

I do like the Bester 1200, but can only compare it to the King stones, it's good, stays flat, and will cut hard steel well without anywhere near the wear one gets with the King stones -- I bought it to sharpen Marples chisels, A2 plane irons, etc. Knives came later.

The Green Brick isn't really a grinding stone -- I don't have it, but I do have a synthetic blue Aoto of similar construction grit and characteristics, and I use it to finish stainless knives like my Chicago Cutlery. Too slow and soft for edge restoration. I don't know if the Green brick is harder or not, but even if it were it's really a finishing stone.

A Gesshin 2k should be excellent as well, and a Naniwa Chosera or SuperStone in 1000 or 2000 would work fine, but that would be pushing your monetary limit. 

An inexpensive flattening stone and a Bester 1000 or 1200 would be what I would suggest -- the 1200 in particular will give a very usable edge and be easy to maintain.

Peter


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## aboynamedsuita (Aug 5, 2015)

Haven't used King, but I thought I've read in a thread somewhere that the King 800 is better than the 1000, something about dishing and getting a good "Kasumi" finish, IIRC


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## daveb (Aug 5, 2015)

My experience with the King 800 is that it makes a good "extra" stone for removing scratches, putting on a finish and maybe some sharpening. Pretty much the same experience with the JNS 800 but liked it better (and kept it). I would not have either 800 as an "only" stone. YMMV.


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## osakajoe (Aug 5, 2015)

You're list is missing the one medium grit to rule them all. 

The sigma select II #1200 

Hands down the best imo. Designed for your high speed steels, and cuts like a dream.

Go read Stus review of it on his website toolsfromjapan. He knows his stones


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## V1P (Aug 5, 2015)

[video=youtube_share;XHX8fIdXfN4]http://youtu.be/XHX8fIdXfN4[/video]

[video=youtube_share;tnsXO__jB3Q]http://youtu.be/tnsXO__jB3Q[/video]

That is my knife in the video that I ordered from Cris Anderson. He set the bevel, finished on the same stone and the cutting video is the result.


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## mkriggen (Aug 5, 2015)

I would probably go with the Gesshin 2K. The gesshin 1.2K is also a great stone, but I think it's a little to soft to be an only stone. I haven't tried one yet, but the Gesshin 1000 looks good too. Yeah, I'm a little biased toward Jon's stuff, but only because it's never let me down.


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## Butters (Aug 6, 2015)

Why not consider a combi stone. I've never used it but the Suehiro 1k/3k seems to be highly thought of. I started on a King 1k/6k combi and was able to sharpen things by rubbing them on it in an awkward fashion..


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 6, 2015)

Thanks for the suggestions all!

Narrowing list down to 
King 1000 or 800 or King 1000/6000 combo stone
Bester 1200
Gesshin 2000
JNS 1000
Sigma Select? 

Honestly never heard of the Sigma before so not sure what to think of it. I read stu's review but that is just one data point, not taking away from it just saying there doesnt seem to be a lot out there about it.

Regarding the Kings, would PM steels be an issue with those? Or just take a very long time? I dont want to get him something that is going to be slow for those types of steel. I basically want something that is fairly easy to use, minimal fuss and just straight up cuts like a beast while still leaving a great all around edge.

The Gesshin 2k is attractive as is the Bester for the price but cant help but think a fairly hard true splash and gp might be just simpler? Just thinking out loud here.

Thanks again guys, keep this stuff coming, loving it


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## ThEoRy (Aug 6, 2015)

The king 1200 is a better stone than the king 1000 IMO. I've had both and preferred the 1200.


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 6, 2015)

Forgot to say that i didnt really think too much about combo stones as ive never been a fan. Dont like having to soak the whole thing if you just want one side or just need a bried touch up or something. Not totally opposed to it but im more partial to separate stones and just getting him 1 good stone.


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## berko (Aug 6, 2015)

ive owned all of the stones of your new list except for the bester.

i dont like the sigma select II 1200 at all. it needs to be soaked for like 35 minutes and i experienced that it clogs fast, which slows it down, so it requires a diamond stone to open.

the kings dish fast and wont last as long as the other ones. also they need to be flattened more often, if you dont murray carter them.

gesshin 2k is great and probably leaves the best finish of those (king 6k aside), still i recognize similar issues that the sigma select has, if not as bad. but maybe i just dont like soakers as much as splash and go stones...

havent used the jns 1k as much as the others. till now i think its great, but feels a lil coarse for beeing a 1 stone solution.

i have been using a 1.5k shapton pro for that matter and found it to be quite versatile. followed by 2-4 µ diamond spray.

how about that cerax/rika combo stone that stu sells? i think its one of the better combo stones available at a good price.

hard decision...


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## osakajoe (Aug 6, 2015)

berko said:


> ive owned all of the stones of your new list except for the bester.
> 
> i dont like the sigma select II 1200 at all. it needs to be soaked for like 35 minutes and i experienced that it clogs fast, which slows it down, so it requires a diamond stone to open.



Are you sure it was the sigma select 1200? Do you have a picture of your stone or video using it? I soak it for 8-10 minutes and it's ready to go. Don't have problems with it clogging. 

The sigma select II 1000 cuts fast but dishes and clogs up. It also drinks a lot of water. 

What color was your stone ?


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## mhlee (Aug 6, 2015)

I tried the Sigma Select stone several years ago and didn't like it. It's an aggressive cutter which, IMHO, does not make this a good stone for beginners. I also recall not liking the lack of feedback.

I also think the King 1200 is a better stone than the 1000. I have both. 

FWIW, there's no one best stone. It really depends on what you want from the stone.


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## idemhj (Aug 6, 2015)

mhlee said:


> FWIW, there's no one best stone. It really depends on what you want from the stone.



While I completely agree with this, I still think the Chosera/Naniwa Pro 800 should be on the list


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## aboynamedsuita (Aug 6, 2015)

SolidSnake03 said:


> Honestly never heard of the Sigma before so not sure what to think of it. I read stu's review but that is just one data point, not taking away from it just saying there doesnt seem to be a lot out there about it.



If you want another source to read, Lee Valley sells Sigma Power Select II from 240-13000 and has a bit of an overview about them on the product page and also when you click the "Tech" link


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## panda (Aug 6, 2015)

new cerax 1k/3k combo stone, leave it perma soaked. it's dirt cheap and works great! very easy to use as well.


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 6, 2015)

Appreciate the further source on the Sigma's

I get that there isnt a best stone but it was more a question of what would be the best stone for the situation im describing


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## berko (Aug 6, 2015)

its this one:





the chosera 800 is really great, but not as a one stone solution.


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 6, 2015)

The cerax us a suehiro stone right? Japan tools i assume?


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## panda (Aug 6, 2015)

yes suehiro, i got mine off ebay. knivesandstones (james) has it for $20.


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## JBroida (Aug 6, 2015)

Great stone, but faster wearing than the others he's really considering right now, and it seems like the softest stones have been ruled out by him already


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 6, 2015)

That is correct Jon, ive ruled out the soft stuff mostly because i think it might be simpler and easier to not have to deal with a whole bunch of dishing and flattening.

Plus i have a bit of a preference for harder stones and the few times he has used mine it seemed fine.

The price on those is awesome though for sure!


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## Keith Sinclair (Aug 6, 2015)

Don't know how other's feel, but I always liked a Large medium stone at work. Kept it in the Chef's office. Used the King Big Brick 1000. Like the Besters used at work also. Last few years all my purchased stones are Gesshin both soakers & splash & go. An overlooked not mentioned stone is the Gesshin 1000 Extra Large 150.00. It is much thicker & wider than average stone. It is white in color & better than the Large King. I wore down both gesshin 2K & 1.2K S&G at the school sharpening a lot of knives. Now am using a Large 600 S&G & the Large 1K. They should last years even with the # of knives I sharpen.

The Shapton Pro 2K is a hard S&G. Slow to dish. I like it as a touch up stone. For everything Carbon & Stainless, powder steels the Gesshin's are up to the task.


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## osakajoe (Aug 7, 2015)

tjangula said:


> If you want another source to read, Lee Valley sells Sigma Power Select II from 240-13000 and has a bit of an overview about them on the product page and also when you click the "Tech" link



That's a pretty accurate description of the stones. I should probably state why I prefer them over other stones. I do sharpen professionally and I sharpen lots of high speed steel knives. So I need something that sharpens fast and can handle the strength of high speed steels. This is why I always reach for my sigma stones.


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## lucabrasi (Aug 7, 2015)

I've found shapton pro 1500 to be quality. Hard, slow dishing, cuts fast. 

I've also liked the suehiro cerax 1k more and more with use, though it needs to soak longer than advertised. It's softer than the shaptons for sure, but still a fairly hard stone. Fairly large, wears I'd say slower than the bester 1.2. Has a great feel and cuts very fast. Finishes fairly well with a light touch considering its speed.


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## lucabrasi (Aug 7, 2015)

Both stones I mentioned have cut a wide variety of steels very well, including some powdered steels within reason. Not great for s110v, but nothing but diamonds really seems to be. 

Will say the cerax loads up quite s bit. I did not love it at first, but as I've used it I've come to really enjoy it's feel and speed.


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 8, 2015)

Thanks so much for the help everyone, I managed to score a Bester 1200 along with a Rika 5000 in a wonderfully priced combo deal from a generous member here. I plan on still picking up probably the JNS 1000 and potentially the JKI 2000 and that Cris Anderson Stone just for my own experimentation and interest but I'm highly content in what he will be getting to use (Bester).

Quick question on the Bester 1200, can it be perma-soaked? I have read it takes a long long time to soak thoroughly so I'm wondering if you could just perma-soak it and change the water every week or couple days? I have a pretty good feeling the Rika shouldn't be treated this way but is it ok with the Bester? 

Thanks!


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## daveb (Aug 8, 2015)

Yes.


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## JBroida (Aug 8, 2015)

both are fine soaking


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 9, 2015)

Excellent! 

Also, regarding changing the water, is there a set amount of time for this? I generally change it once a month or so for no really good reason to be honest. I don't know how I settled on that time frame I just do, anyhow, is there a better time frame? Since I'm helping/teaching someone else a few things I figure I might as well get all my bases covered beforehand.

Thanks!


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## JBroida (Aug 9, 2015)

i would do more than once a month... algae grows faster than that. If you want to extend the time, add a little bleach (a capful or two), but know that this will take off any writing on the stones, so you need to remember which is which if you have similar colored stones.


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## havox07 (Aug 9, 2015)

What about throwing some silver in the water? I know I do that with my watercooled computer, piece of silver prevents algae.


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## daveb (Aug 9, 2015)

They've lived the last 3 years underwater. I change it "sporadically", approx monthly or every time I see squiggly things moving. Do keep a lid on the cambro and add a minimum amount of bleach.


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## aboynamedsuita (Aug 9, 2015)

havox07 said:


> watercooled computer



Now that is something else, you must have mad processing power to need that setup


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## havox07 (Aug 9, 2015)

tjangula said:


> Now that is something else, you must have mad processing power to need that setup



Aha not too much, my old hobby used to be all about computers. Water cooling them allows for better heat dissipation and higher over clocks. Now it's just kind of there because its too difficult to remove. Havent really updated my desktop in 4 years. Back in the day she was a beast though


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## SolidSnake03 (Aug 10, 2015)

Thanks for that info! Looks like I should be changing it a bit more often than that. I'll go with weekly from this point on and see how that goes. Not like it's a big deal to change the water, just a different (more frequent) habit I need to get in the groove of.

Appreciate it


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## spoiledbroth (Aug 10, 2015)

I find putting a lid on my stones actually seems to make the water skanky faster... Am I the only one?


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