# Vegeterian food. Where to start?



## Nemo (Jul 12, 2017)

I'm thinking of reducing the amount of meat and animal produce that I eat. We always have lots of veggies but usually the meal or at least it's flavours are built around meat. Not planning to become hardcore vegetarian or vegan, just incorporate some of that type of food into my eating.

I'm interested not just in learning a few recipees but more in learning the techniques and flavour (and texture) combinations which work. I realise that you do this by cooking recipees but I find that some cookbooks for example will basically just give a bunch of unrelated recipees while some will explain why and how particular flavour and techniques things work and use the recipees to demonstrate this.

So thanks in advance for your various perspectives on eating more plants and fewer animals and the best way to learn how to make this tasty.


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## daveb (Jul 12, 2017)

I'm trying to eat more veg. (What is said here, stays here, right?) I find they're considerably more flavorful when roasted to a slight char. A little oil to help keep them from drying out. Grilled is also good but a little more work. Saute is more work still and not nearly as interesting. I'm not a fan of steamed, boiled or anything that turns them into flavorless mush. Cauli, butternut do quite well SV, esp with a little chicken stock. Playing with puree. 

Onions will play well with most anything. Otherwise like hard veg (carrots, parsnips,, hard squash) together and softer veg (peppers,, soft squash, etc) together. Brocc and cauli work together usually, again with onions. 

And grouping seasonal veg together typically works well. "Seasons" as we know them are becoming less relevant at the market but the veg that come in to harvest together almost always compliment each other. And following the seasons can add another level of interest to meal planning.

That said the best use for a veg garden is to draw in deer:whistling:


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## Nemo (Jul 12, 2017)

daveb said:


> I'm trying to eat more veg. (What is said here, stays here, right?) I find they're considerably more flavorful when roasted to a slight char. A little oil to help keep them from drying out. Grilled is also good but a little more work. Saute is more work still and not nearly as interesting. I'm not a fan of steamed, boiled or anything that turns them into flavorless mush. Cauli, butternut do quite well SV, esp with a little chicken stock. Playing with puree.
> 
> Onions will play well with most anything. Otherwise like hard veg (carrots, parsnips,, hard squash) together and softer veg (peppers,, soft squash, etc) together. Brocc and cauli work together usually, again with onions.
> 
> ...



It'll be our secret Dave... 

Yeah, I quite like them roasted. SV is an iteresting idea that I hadn't considered. What temp and how long?

Seasonal groups is a good point. I have a book on this theme (simon Bryant's "Vegies") that I'll have another look at.

We don't get deer or even 'roos in our garden. Maybe they do in the high country. The bloody horses are always sticking their heads in though. I think I'd be in trouble if I did anything to them though


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## foody518 (Jul 12, 2017)

Do you ever stir fry? Easy to build veg centric dishes imo. I kind of group what i use by desired textures in the end result


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## Nemo (Jul 12, 2017)

foody518 said:


> Do you ever stir fry? Easy to build veg centric dishes imo. I kind of group what i use by desired textures in the end result



Yes. I stir fry a lot. This is a good point. I have done some stir frys where I've replaced part or all of the meat with tofu and/or eggplant.

I hadn't thought about selecting veggies by texture. Interesting idea, which I guess makes sense, thinking about the mouthfeel of stirfry.


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## GorillaGrunt (Jul 12, 2017)

+1 for roasted; grilled is so much easier with a grill basket than without, I wouldn't call it hardly any more work than roasted. A couple shakes of the basket instead of tossing halfway through. I do a fair bit of sautéing; I prefer a little char from the pan just like with roasting, especially on broccoli, cauliflower, Brussels sprouts, and sometimes asparagus. Stewing with or without broth is also good, ranging from things like caponata to vegetarian curries to ratatouille.

I don't know your cuisine and spice/flavor preferences, but in addition to stir fry I found it helpful to look into Indian and Middle Eastern cuisines.

It also helps to experiment with the less commonplace vegetables, for instance celery root, rutabaga, different greens, Asian varieties of squash and cabbage family e.g. gai lan, yu choy, etc. as well as varying grains and bean types, to keep it interesting.


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

Ease into it. Be a weekend carnivore for a while and stick to vegetarian during the week, then slowly cut down on carnivorous portions and replace them with vegetarian portions. I think the key is diversity. For me it's mainly about how it's spiced. I cant eat salt (hypertension) so I need to work my way around the taste issue created by the lack of salt using spices. This contributes a lot to how I cook my food and how I spice and season it. I think the main factor to success is no fanaticism. Instead of tagging yourself "vegan" or "vegetarian" ad "ish" at the end and allow yourself various food that you love occasionally - not as a matter of "guilty pleasures" but as a matter of diversifying your diet without over doing anything in any particular direction.


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2017)

GorillaGrunt said:


> +1 for roasted; grilled is so much easier with a grill basket than without, I wouldn't call it hardly any more work than roasted. A couple shakes of the basket instead of tossing halfway through. I do a fair bit of sautéing; I prefer a little char from the pan just like with roasting, especially on broccoli, cauliflower, Brussels sprouts, and sometimes asparagus. Stewing with or without broth is also good, ranging from things like caponata to vegetarian curries to ratatouille.
> 
> I don't know your cuisine and spice/flavor preferences, but in addition to stir fry I found it helpful to look into Indian and Middle Eastern cuisines.
> 
> It also helps to experiment with the less commonplace vegetables, for instance celery root, rutabaga, different greens, Asian varieties of squash and cabbage family e.g. gai lan, yu choy, etc. as well as varying grains and bean types, to keep it interesting.



We eat a lot of Asian and European food. I quite like spice and heat but I'm the only one in the family who does. Might have a look at some middle eastern though.


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2017)

tsuriru said:


> Ease into it. Be a weekend carnivore for a while and stick to vegetarian during the week, then slowly cut down on carnivorous portions and replace them with vegetarian portions. I think the key is diversity. For me it's mainly about how it's spiced. I cant eat salt (hypertension) so I need to work my way around the taste issue created by the lack of salt using spices. This contributes a lot to how I cook my food and how I spice and season it. I think the main factor to success is no fanaticism. Instead of tagging yourself "vegan" or "vegetarian" ad "ish" at the end and allow yourself various food that you love occasionally - not as a matter of "guilty pleasures" but as a matter of diversifying your diet without over doing anything in any particular direction.



Yeah, I don't particularly want (at this stage) to give up animal products all together. Just to change the balance. I think at first, it will be one or two days a week beacuse trying to concentrate on cooking new and different food is not so easy when you come home after a big or stressful day at work. I'm certainly not going to be dogmatic about it.


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

Nemo said:


> trying to concentrate on cooking new and different food is not so easy when you come home after a big or stressful day at work. I'm certainly not going to be dogmatic about it.



For me it is the exact opposite. I mean, it's still challenging - but my kitchen time is my winding-down time after a day of work. I guess it's all about how it's embraced.


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## JayGee (Jul 13, 2017)

There's an excellent vegetarian Japanese book called Kansha that is very much a way of eating and managing a kitchen and pantry. The recipes are complex because lots of elements interrelate but once you get started things get easier.


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2017)

tsuriru said:


> For me it is the exact opposite. I mean, it's still challenging - but my kitchen time is my winding-down time after a day of work. I guess it's all about how it's embraced.



Yeah, I totally get what you mean and I generally find the same thing. Reflecting on it some more, I think that it's the planning (and I guess shopping for different ingredients) that goes into cooking unfamiliar food that's more difficult during the week. Especially when there is pressure to get food on the table for kids so that they go to bed early enough because of school the next day...


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

Nemo said:


> Especially when there is pressure to get food on the table for kids so that they go to bed early enough because of school the next day...



Sure, I remember that. Small kids = small problems  of course, they also bring great joy.


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2017)

Yep, lots of work but even more joy.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 13, 2017)

@tsuriru I thought people would die if you gave them no salt at all (as in, none added and none in ready to eat products)?


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

Avoiding salt entirely, even if you eat whole foods and no added salt is impossible. I meant I dont cook with salt or sprinkle it on the food, and entirely avoid high salt content foods. I do ingest some salt inevitably though.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 13, 2017)

tsuriru said:


> Avoiding salt entirely, even if you eat whole foods and no added salt is impossible. I meant I dont cook with salt or sprinkle it on the food, and entirely avoid high salt content foods. I do ingest some salt inevitably though.



I think you need a second opinion on your high blood pressure. Trying to isolate one necessary micronutrient is like trying to win at chess by only moving one piece. Salt is not an option. If you don't season your food you're not ever going to taste the potential of those ingredients. Your tongue will not function properly without the presence of NaCl. Life's too short man, get a second opinion.


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

Mucho Bocho said:


> I think you need a second opinion on your high blood pressure. Trying to isolate one necessary micronutrient is like trying to win at chess by only moving one piece. Salt is not an option. If you don't season your food you're not ever going to taste the potential of those ingredients. Your tongue will not function properly without the presence of NaCl. Life's too short man, get a second opinion.



I appreciate the concern - but I assure you I am getting all the NaCl I need and my health really is being looked after by experts. I did not say I do not season my food either. I use plenty of ingredients that contain NaCl - but using raw salt is risky for me simply because it is the one single element that will drive BP high up really fast. Not just a notion of mine btw...I think most doctors would agree. So I use other things instead to activate the taste and smell buds.


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## foody518 (Jul 13, 2017)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> @tsuriru I thought people would die if you gave them no salt at all (as in, none added and none in ready to eat products)?



Always struck me as you'd have to try hard to put together a diet where none of the whole plant foods have any sodium content


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## tsuriru (Jul 13, 2017)

foody518 said:


> Always struck me as you'd have to try hard to put together a diet where none of the whole plant foods have any sodium content



That. Even if my whole diet consisted entirely of fresh, raw, unmolested plants - I would still be getting more than enough - much less if I "dab" a tiny bit of soi sauce or have an occasional small bowl of misu and some wakame.


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## ecrphoto (Jul 13, 2017)

Check out Plenty, or Plenty More, by Yottam Ottelenghi. As a life-long carnivore, a few years ago I realized the need to up my veg content. Plenty was the gateway drug, and a fantastic one at that.


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## Nemo (Jul 13, 2017)

ecrphoto said:


> Check out Plenty, or Plenty More, by Yottam Ottelenghi. As a life-long carnivore, a few years ago I realized the need to up my veg content. Plenty was the gateway drug, and a fantastic one at that.



I have been eyeing those books.

Maybe time to have another look.


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## TheVincenzo (Jul 14, 2017)

I've been looking at those 2 books for awhile now also. After I read your post I went to Amazon and looked again. The Kindle version of Plenty is only $2.99. Had to pick it up for that price.


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## boomchakabowwow (Jul 14, 2017)

i did it.

i think i eat meat once or twice a week as a target. dont overthink it. i didnt approach it like i was trying to make veggies substitute meat. i just started cutting out meat. if i do eat meat..4-6 oz. my plate has way more veggies on it.

last night i ate a bagel with eggplant spread on it piled high with greens.


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 15, 2017)

STIR FRY in a WOK . with practice you can learn to achieve "wok hay ".or ," breath of the wok". There is a lot of factors involved, but if done properly the end result is ,slightly charred food with a smoky flavor and crispy texture that is unique to food cooked in a wok . The most important factors are, extremely high heat,
Kife skill and technique used on chopping ingredents, rhythm/ timing . A few moments too long your food is burned a few moments too little, food will be undercooked and "wok hay " will be non-existent.

Aside from Wok cooking ,sometimes I like slow roasting vegetables in the oven ,in a cast iron skillet
.I use olive oil or butter, black pepper, oregano, garlic, Chile peppers, parsley and course Himalayan pink salt. results are good but different.

*disclaimer* I am not a vegetarian and most all meals involve meat.:hungry:


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## Nemo (Jul 15, 2017)

WOK-a-holic said:


> STIR FRY in a WOK . with practice you can learn to achieve "wok hay ".or ," breath of the wok". There is a lot of factors involved, but if done properly the end result is ,slightly charred food with a smoky flavor and crispy texture that is unique to food cooked in a wok . The most important factors are, extremely high heat,
> Kife skill and technique used on chopping ingredents, rhythm/ timing . A few moments too long your food is burned a few moments too little, food will be undercooked and "wok hay " will be non-existent.
> 
> Aside from Wok cooking ,sometimes I like slow roasting vegetables in the oven ,in a cast iron skillet
> ...



I always stir fry in a ($10 carbon steel) wok.

What's wok hay if it's not too rude to not already know  ?


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## foody518 (Jul 15, 2017)

It's that unique smokiness and essence to good stir fried foods cooked in a wok


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 15, 2017)

Mucho Bocho said:


> I think you need a second opinion on your high blood pressure. Trying to isolate one necessary micronutrient is like trying to win at chess by only moving one piece. Salt is not an option. If you don't season your food you're not ever going to taste the potential of those ingredients. Your tongue will not function properly without the presence of NaCl. Life's too short man, get a second opinion.



I totally agree man.
salt has gotten a bad rap because so many people use highly refined table salt. with all kinds of anti-caking Agents that alter the way your body processes salt.
the only salt I use is Himalayan pink salt ,Real Salt brand, diamond crystal brand kosher salt.

most people don't get enough potassium in their diet to balance the sodium levels in their body
avocado and potato are the two most potent sources of potassium .that's why they taste so good with salt. yes I am aware of bananas are also high in potassium I don't know if they would taste good with salt on them


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 15, 2017)

double post


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 15, 2017)

Nemo,
the cheap carbon steel Woks is what I use.
very thin ,round bottom ,and jet burner stove,
"WOK HAY " is a term the Chinese use. some believe a wok has a soul. and breathes life into food through extreme thermal energy and the rhythmic tossing Motion in the wok. creating food with a flavor unique to being cooked in a wok.
EXTREMELY HIGH HEAT is the most important factor to achieve ""WOK HAY "

Google WOK HAY and it will lead you to a lot of interesting articles on subject.
also you tube


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## Nemo (Jul 15, 2017)

WOK-a-holic said:


> Nemo,
> the cheap carbon steel Woks is what I use.
> very thin ,round bottom ,and jet burner stove,
> "WOK HAY " is a term the Chinese use. some believe a wok has a soul. and breathes life into food through extreme thermal energy and the rhythmic tossing Motion in the wok. creating food with a flavor unique to being cooked in a wok.
> ...



OK I'll have a look on google.

I cook on a wok burner on my kitchen stove but we do have LPG (bottled gas) which seems to burn hotter than any natural gas butner that I've used.

I like my carbon steel wok so much that I'm moving towards carbon steel frypans too. Once seasoned, the non stick properties are great.


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## panda (Jul 15, 2017)

what the heck is vegetarian food??


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## daveb (Jul 15, 2017)

Vegetarians are delicious.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 16, 2017)

@WOK-a-holic I think myopically chasing wok hei and maximum heat can lead people up the garden path - I find if you don't have a jet engine and brutal skill, intelligent choice of vessel (sometimes it's carbon, sometimes cast iron, sometimes non stick**, sometimes light wok, sometimes heavy wok, sometimes heavy saute pan*) and ingredient sequence helps along most...

But then, most of us are probably using their wok as more of a karahi than a chinese wok 

*for one reason: on a home stove, it uses ALL OF YOUR BURNER AREA. Most Wok's don't.

**If you can always handle starchy stuff (noodles and rice) or sticky seasonings (doubanjang!) on carbon steel, great! I for sure can't


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## DDPslice (Jul 24, 2017)

Look up http://www.indiacurry.com/ you can tell its authentic by the interface that predates DOS. Also beans are an easy and good idea. Fruit is expensive but also delicious. Go to an Asiatic grocery store your best bets are Indian or Vietnamese to start with then try other places once you feel comfortable. Watch Anthony Bourdain Parts Unknown, he has the voice of what I imagine you are looking for.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 24, 2017)

Yep - if you are looking for "natively" vegetarian dishes, look at indian, thai, chinese cuisine. If you are looking for dishes that can be well modified to use meat alternatives - same.


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## Nemo (Jul 24, 2017)

Yeah I like these quisines but not everyone in my household likes the spicy stuff.


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## tsuriru (Jul 24, 2017)

Nemo said:


> Yeah I like these quisines but not everyone in my household likes the spicy stuff.



Im lucky in that respect. The general demeanor is "If it ain't taking the enamel off your teeth - it ain't really hot


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## Badgertooth (Jul 24, 2017)

ecrphoto said:


> Check out Plenty, or Plenty More, by Yottam Ottelenghi. As a life-long carnivore, a few years ago I realized the need to up my veg content. Plenty was the gateway drug, and a fantastic one at that.



+1 my wife is vegetarian and I'm the cook at home so I had to quickly adapt to making veg-centred meals interesting. Plenty builds meals around different plant "families" with a strong Mediterranean slant.

There are cuisines where veg is prominent and the hero and you can have a field day with Indian, Greek, Thai, Chinese, Turkish. Tomato based pasta sauces are a winner too and the springboard for so much embellishment that does not require meat. So a week at ours could go like this

Sunday night - tacos with cumin and garlic roasted capsicum and onion; fiery hot slaw; blackened sweetcorn and lime; fresh salsa, sour cream & queso

Monday - spaghetti with sauteed brunoise of aromatics & courgette with half a jar of dolmio; tonnes of Parmesan 

Tuesday - mixed roast veg worked through couscous with feta and bitter greens and roasted nuts

Wednesday - stir fry

Thursday - pan toasted sourdough sandwiches with pesto, tomato and mozzarella 

Friday - steak for me; enormous bag of pick 'n mix lollies and icecream for my wife

Saturday - frittata or quiche


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## Badgertooth (Jul 24, 2017)

I found the key as extracting the innate sweetness of veg that have the capability for it with roasting or sautéing.
Rounding out flavours with oils. 
Salt. 
Cheese.
Acid.
Spice.

And my wife doesn't really like eggs. Add that as a an ingredient and you can go nuts.


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## krx927 (Jul 24, 2017)

DDPslice said:


> Look up http://www.indiacurry.com/ you can tell its authentic by the interface that predates DOS. Also beans are an easy and good idea. Fruit is expensive but also delicious. Go to an Asiatic grocery store your best bets are Indian or Vietnamese to start with then try other places once you feel comfortable. Watch Anthony Bourdain Parts Unknown, he has the voice of what I imagine you are looking for.



Thanks for the link - looks very nice and authentic indeed. 

I am a big meat lover it it would be hard for me to go 100% vegetarian. Only Indian veggie dishes bring sometimes the same satisfaction as eating meat i.e. while eating them I do not miss the meat.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 24, 2017)

Ratatouille?


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 24, 2017)

My quick vegetarian meal right now (well, assembled from stuff I precooked in batches during the last few days, but two of three items could be made fresh reasonably quick. Sadly neglected to take wokshots. Can be made vegan or lacto-vegetarian): Coconut Pulao, Avial (essentially all kinds of steamed veg cut finger sized, and dressed with ground together fresh coconut cumin and green chilies, curry leaves, turmeric and yoghurt, and simple tempering), and some of an attempt at Lime pickles that I hope won't kill me


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 24, 2017)

Lime pickle. Yum. Now you e got my attention. I pickle everything. Latest pickle was Persian Torshi. I've never attempted Indian pickle but why not. I love mixed pickle myself but mango is delish too. Share my friend...


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 24, 2017)

After 2-3 days without eating meat I look like this ::zipper::doublebanghead::angry1:


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 24, 2017)

@Mucho Bocho I tried this Sanjay Thumma recipe before:

[video=youtube;O54L55067Ww]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O54L55067Ww[/video] for mango pickle before ... flavor was excellent but skin stayed a tad hard (probably choice of mango variety, or waxed - you don't get that much choice in Germany if you want unripe* mango, a given asian grocer will have one or no type usually...)

*important hint for reading indian-english recipes: "raw" means "unripe" when talking about fruit and has nothing to do with whether it will be cooked or not.


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## WOK-a-holic (Jul 25, 2017)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> @WOK-a-holic I think myopically chasing wok hei and maximum heat can lead people up the garden path - I find if you don't have a jet engine and brutal skill, intelligent choice of vessel (sometimes it's carbon, sometimes cast iron, sometimes non stick**, sometimes light wok, sometimes heavy wok, sometimes heavy saute pan*) and ingredient sequence helps along most...
> 
> But then, most of us are probably using their wok as more of a karahi than a chinese wok
> 
> ...



"WOK HEI " or "WOK HAY " is not easy to put into words.
Is more so a description of a combination of things. Every step is important. Timing, technique ,experience, ect. JET BURNER STOVE is the most important . ...if you don't have one ,get one, or forget about wok hay. All the skill in the world is no substitute for ,the extremely high heat of a jet burner stove . when food is added to hot wok the thermal energy vaporises moisture and oil .
This creates a partial barrier between the wok and food .The food will be gliding on steam and oil vapors. Imparting a unique Smokey flavor and texture to food . If you have a jet burner stove you can use a saute pan for similar results, it's the high heat that makes the magic happen. :flame:

* Amazon sells jet burner stove $90 "HUAMING H205 fast stove" (104 jet nozzles 78,000 BTU's) 
this is the model I have. It's performance is impressive. also it doesn't cost thousands like the burners used at Chinese restaurant.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 25, 2017)

Life, Thanks for this, I'm not crazy about his technique but looks like he has the right ingredients, except I'm going to kick it up with a few tablespoons of homemade Shio Koji (Asperiguillus). I want the fruit tangy and lacto fermented. 

I'm going to follow the recipe but then seal the bags under high in the chamber vac and leave them in the North Carolina sun for a few days, until the bags puff up a bit. Then jar and cool completely.

I'll also be using a better knife than this Indian Chef--oh my.

Thanks Life!




LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> @Mucho Bocho I tried this Sanjay Thumma recipe before:
> 
> [video=youtube;O54L55067Ww]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O54L55067Ww[/video] for mango pickle before ... flavor was excellent but skin stayed a tad hard (probably choice of mango variety, or waxed - you don't get that much choice in Germany if you want unripe* mango, a given asian grocer will have one or no type usually...)
> 
> *important hint for reading indian-english recipes: "raw" means "unripe" when talking about fruit and has nothing to do with whether it will be cooked or not.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 25, 2017)

@Mucho I simply am not going to make a big fuss over the knife choices of a trained chef that has made literally thousands of great instructional videos  And using tools of a similar quality as viewers typically use at home might even be a good choice in that case...

...


To be clear, I am no food chemist, and can't assume responsibility for the safety of anyone's room temperature pickling recipes...


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 25, 2017)

Life, You sound freaked out by my comments?

I don't mind saying that this Indian Chef is using an extremely dull and unsafe knife, let alone this rudimentary mango chopping technique. Because I care so little about tradition when cooking, I think this recipe could be elevated by some tweaking. I'm interested in fascinating textures and maximizing flavors. 

Sorry to scare you but I appreciate the recipe share.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 25, 2017)

No, I noticed I had forgotten that warning 

...

More fascinated by you being able to tell "dull and unsafe". I assumed when he seems to get stuck with the knife cutting the whole mango he is actually cutting a bit into the core (which can be cut on an unripe mango, less hard than an avocado pit), not using a very dull knife. How would you chop it differently, btw?


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## Mucho Bocho (Jul 25, 2017)

I would slice off the bottom cheek in a single downward slice. Then Put the cut end on the board so the fruit is stable. Slice the cheeks off, chop in uniform chunks.


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## Khorax (Jul 25, 2017)

Good on you for trying to find some meat alternatives. My wife is a dietitian and deals a lot with low income families who cannot afford meat that many times a month. I could talk for hours about tips and tricks and various recipes but most impressive substitute you can make is to try to incorporate more lentils into your dishes. There are... TONS of recipes with lentils, and it can be intimidating just to buy some at the store since there are dozens of kinds. You can start with normal red lentils or green lentils. They pack a punch with insanely high protein, fiber and iron. This high protein and fiber also leads to quicker and longer feelings of satiety to help regulate your appetite and blood sugars throughout the day. The best part: It's DIRT CHEAP. 

And i'm not talking about cooking a huge boring side dish of 100% boiled lentils. That would be gross... I recommend you buy one bag of one kind, bring it home, google a few recipes and try it out. If you feel adventurous buy another type the next time, and try new recipes. You can also buy them in a can pre-cooked. You will find your favorites and they can be part of a normal rotation in your household. Your wallet and health will thank you. Our family has started a "Meatless Monday" tradition and it's usually a lentil dish.

You can also keep cooked lentils in your fridge and sneak them into various other normal recipes like omelettes in the morning (you will be full for hours), rice, pasta sauces, blend it into soups, dip, etc. 

GO LENTILS!!!!!!


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

There are lentil-based pasta on the market these days - not super cheap and the cooking time is tricky, but they certainly can be made tasty - and the protein content is off the scale


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

Maybe I'll look at this. I try to avoid flour (my metabolism doesn't xope with it).


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## tsuriru (Jul 26, 2017)

Khorax said:


> Good on you for trying to find some meat alternatives. My wife is a dietitian and deals a lot with low income families who cannot afford meat that many times a month. I could talk for hours about tips and tricks and various recipes but most impressive substitute you can make is to try to incorporate more lentils into your dishes. There are... TONS of recipes with lentils, and it can be intimidating just to buy some at the store since there are dozens of kinds. You can start with normal red lentils or green lentils. They pack a punch with insanely high protein, fiber and iron. This high protein and fiber also leads to quicker and longer feelings of satiety to help regulate your appetite and blood sugars throughout the day. The best part: It's DIRT CHEAP.
> 
> And i'm not talking about cooking a huge boring side dish of 100% boiled lentils. That would be gross... I recommend you buy one bag of one kind, bring it home, google a few recipes and try it out. If you feel adventurous buy another type the next time, and try new recipes. You can also buy them in a can pre-cooked. You will find your favorites and they can be part of a normal rotation in your household. Your wallet and health will thank you. Our family has started a "Meatless Monday" tradition and it's usually a lentil dish.
> 
> ...



+1. Another thing you can do with lentils - and this will guarantee you are getting absolutely 100% of the nutrients they have to offer is eat them uncooked. I usually soak a bowl in water overnight and then strain out the water and add them to a green salad. Tastes better than cooked IMHO but that is a matter of personal taste.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

Lentil and chickpea* flours make great binders for all kinds of pancakes and veggie burgers  And they aren't cheating even: You get protein where there is supposed to be protein.

*Used in north indian cuisine a lot. Besan ka Cheela (a spiced pancake), Gatte ki Sabzi, the batter on a Pakora, the marinade on a Tikka... And the burmese make a kind of Tofu from it.


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

Pancakes- interesting. I had given up eating pancakes (the kids like them, so I still make them)

Do you just add water to make a batter? I guess one could add an egg (assuming still happy to eat eggs)?


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

Gram flour (that's how it will be called at your indian grocer*. I would assume the difference to "chickpea flour" at the whole foods is $4 a kg  ) makes a working batter just with water - you can add wheat flour, rice flour (crisps it!), baking powder, turmeric (for color), kala namak (for eggy stink without eggs  ), oil... don't layer it in the pan TOO thick (this batter really tastes beany weird when undercooked), don't make very thin (hard to set) or thick (tastes dusty) batter. Savory seasonings? Mix in what you got ... cilantro, finely diced veg, pepper, chile powder, cha om (a stinky, garlicky thai herb), ajowan (a turbo-thyme that comes as a seed - ask asian grocer), kitchen king masala (also get some at the asian grocer... kind of a curry-ish spice mix. Great when you want an indian-ish flavor, can't be bothered to mix spices, and are tired of curry powder. Sambhar powder could work too, haven't tried in this...)....

Only weakness with the kind of pancake/omelette you get: it gets soggy in liquids rather quick and is rather stiff, so using it as soup topping is tricky (but possible - I think I posted a soup topped with just that on the photo thread a while ago..) , and you can't make nice spirals


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

Got hungry, cooked up a demo...


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

That looks yum, Life.


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## foody518 (Jul 26, 2017)

@Life - you're using pancake in terms of savory pancakes, not sweet, right? Due to lack of a good English word parsing out what these are called in their respective native languages. Like Korean 'jeon' or Chinese 'bing'


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

That is the unleavened type, with turmeric, onions, ginger, garlic and curry spices, and ca. 1/5th rice flour. No wheat flour or eggs at all.


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## LifeByA1000Cuts (Jul 26, 2017)

Oh, you could make a sweet pancake that way too - the chickpea taste gets buried easily under fruity aromas (and most of them work with a nutty taste anyway) and sugar. But yeah, I tend to mean both sweet and savory when I say pancakes. And even I wouldn't be so wack as to arrange sweet pancakes on salad.

..

I think salad (and soup)toppings are one of the surprisingly tricky topics in vegan food  The hidden truth: Pure vegetable (as in, literal vegetables) salads don't work, taste balance wise (unless you use VERY fresh and tasty greens, or so much dressing that you make a cold soup). We want fat, starch, protein in a meal - I think if you make it taste balanced without, you are skilled but actually creating something low-calorie but unhealthy  Cooked beans as a topping violate modern emissions standards. Tofu, tempeh, seitan only work in the capacity if you put so much work into marination and cooking that you could just as well make a hot dish. Storebought vegan cheeses or processed meat substitutes just feel wrong.


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## foody518 (Jul 26, 2017)

Thanks Life

Feel similar to you on salads. I don't bother with em most the time. One exception somewhat recently was an attempt at making goi chay that went alright. Very fresh
http://www.thekitchn.com/recipe-goi-chay-67437


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

LifeByA1000Cuts said:


> I think salad (and soup)toppings are one of the surprisingly tricky topics in vegan food  The hidden truth: Pure vegetable (as in, literal vegetables) salads don't work, taste balance wise (unless you use VERY fresh and tasty greens, or so much dressing that you make a cold soup). We want fat, starch, protein in a meal - I think if you make it taste balanced without, you are skilled but actually creating something low-calorie but unhealthy  Cooked beans as a topping violate modern emissions standards. Tofu, tempeh, seitan only work in the capacity if you put so much work into marination and cooking that you could just as well make a hot dish. Storebought vegan cheeses or processed meat substitutes just feel wrong.



This is a clever solution to the problem of getting protein into a vegan salad.


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## foody518 (Jul 26, 2017)

Nemo said:


> This is a clever solution to the problem of getting protein into a vegan salad.



Tbf as a % of total calories, greens usually are decent in protein. They just utterly lack caloric density (calories vs weight), leading to your typical all veg salad being a calorie deficient meal unless you go hard on the dressing


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

foody518 said:


> Tbf as a % of total calories, greens usually are decent in protein. They just utterly lack caloric density (calories vs weight), leading to your typical all veg salad being a calorie deficient meal unless you go hard on the dressing



I must say, I've never really looked up the macronutrient composition of veggies. I had assumed that they were mainly fibre and carbohydrate, so that is interesting information.

I do like some oil or fat in my salads. Having said that, the odd calorie deficeint meat is probably not a bad idea. OTOH if you are eating this sort of food constantly, you might need to keep the calorie count up, I guess.


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## foody518 (Jul 26, 2017)

Weird, right? Of the whole plant foods, it's really the fruits that are low in protein as a % its total calories. 

Most times I center meals around starches (a comfortable caloric density, good micronutrient content, carb content, some fiber) for decent satiety, and am recently trending more towards smaller and more frequent meals/consuming food over a longer period of time spread out


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## Nemo (Jul 26, 2017)

foody518 said:


> Weird, right? Of the whole plant foods, it's really the fruits that are low in protein as a % its total calories.



Makes sense once you think about it though. Fruit has a loooot of sugars in it in general. Obviously fruits like avocado and olives are exceptions that have a lot of fat in them. And yes, I guess fruits do tend to be a bit more calorie dense than most veggies.


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