# Would this variable speed controller work?



## Chef Niloc (Feb 10, 2012)

I don't see why it wouldn't, but never hurts to ask. Would this speed controller:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001NIK6PC/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Work on this motor?

http://www.motoragents.com/pdf/Baldor/L3406M.pdf


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## Dave Martell (Feb 10, 2012)

I believe it won't Colin, different types of motors.


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## Mike Davis (Feb 10, 2012)

The router controller will not work with an ac motor. The way it works( at least on a belt grinder) is that the motor is a 3 phase and the controller converts it to a single phase with variable speed. Basically it is a variable speed phase convertor. The router control is a single/single phase speed controller.


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## Hattorichop (Feb 10, 2012)

Colin,

I can not see why this speed controller would not work.
Your motor is 120volts and 6 amps. 
The speed controller you are looking at will operate a 120 volt motor not in excess of 20 amps.
Your motor is right in the parameters of this controller.
The only down side is there is only 3 speed you can use from this controller.
If I were you I would look at getting a variable speed controller for a ceiling fan.
Just make sure it is rated for 6 amps or better.
A rotary dial type will give you a full range of speed adjustment plus you can probably pick one up at your local hardwear store.


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## Hattorichop (Feb 10, 2012)

Ok, maybe not hardware store but electrical wholesaler will carry a speed controller for an industrial ceiling fan. I checked quickly on the Internet and they definatley make some that are rated to handle a 15 amp load.


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## Marko Tsourkan (Feb 10, 2012)

I believe this type of VFD is to be used with motor with brushes, like router or drill motor. For your regular AC motor, fan controller is likely to work (fan uses a small AC motor). 

M


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## Hattorichop (Feb 10, 2012)

Regardless of which motor is being used I believe this controller will still work as long as it is 120volt motor. Just because a motor has brushes does not make it operate different from a standard 120 volt motor. 120volts is 120volts.


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## Marko Tsourkan (Feb 10, 2012)

I will test it. I have both.

M


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## Bill Burke (Feb 11, 2012)

It will slow the motor down but will also result in a lose in power making the motor unable to be used on anything other than the smallest loads. So the big question is--What are you going to do with this combination?


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 11, 2012)

It says


> From the Manufacturer
> Features include: Adjustable speed from 0 RPM to full speed, 3 position rocker switch-Variable, Off or Full Speed, Full power and torque at all speeds,


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## GLE1952 (Feb 11, 2012)

Looks like the motor is capacitor start, probably won't work.
From another sales website:
"NOTE: Will not work with soft start or variable speed routers. Will not work with "AC capacitor start induction" type motors."

Glen


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 11, 2012)

GLE1952 said:


> Looks like the motor is capacitor start, probably won't work.
> From another sales website:
> "NOTE: Will not work with soft start or variable speed routers. Will not work with "AC capacitor start induction" type motors.
> 
> Glen



Thank you!
Yes the motor does have a start capacitor. I read the part that sad 


> NOTE: Will not work with soft start or variable speed routers


I did not know that is what a "slow start" motor was. I did not see or read anything that sad


> Will not work with "AC capacitor start induction" type motors.[quote/]
> I'm glad I posted this, think the fan controller will have the same trouble here. What does a motor need that has a start capacitor? Or are these types of motors not able to be run at all with V.S.C ?


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## GLE1952 (Feb 11, 2012)

From my limited experience 20 or so years ago it is not possible. Maybe some one has come up with something since then.
I'd call a motor supply house or even a Graingers and ask.
These motors work with a centrifugal switch that kicks the main winding in at 75% of rated speed.
If you mess with the speed you can get a burnt start winding or blown capacitor. 
Not saying it's impossible, but I don't know of any way.

Glen


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## PierreRodrigue (Feb 11, 2012)

The best option is a VFD and a 3 phase motor, not a cheep option, but it wont let you down.


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## Eamon Burke (Feb 12, 2012)

Colin, is your home/shop wired for 3 phase?


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## PierreRodrigue (Feb 12, 2012)

The VFD's are phase converters, they convert residential 120 single phase into 220/230 3 phase. With this set up, you will get high torque from your motor across the spectrum of speeds


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## Hattorichop (Feb 13, 2012)

A variable frequency drive is actually a soft start starter. 
It will allow you to ramp up the speed of your motor at a safe rate. This makes the initial starting of the motor a lot smother on the mechanical side of things and also reduces the amount of inrush current drawn by the motor which reduces the arc on the contacts of the starter. And it also provides speed controll.

A phase convertor is a totally different beast. It will utilize the 2 legs of your single phase power to create a third artificial phase. This is not true three phase power but it is sometimes the only option depending on the transmition line you are taped off of.

I'm not saying you can not get a combination VFD/phase convertor but this a a very expensive way to try to obtain speed control of a fractional horsepower motor.


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## Rottman (Feb 13, 2012)

But variable frequency drives with single phase input always include a phase convertor.


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## Hattorichop (Feb 13, 2012)

Rottman said:


> But variable frequency drives with single phase input always include a phase convertor.



Ok, I've never came across this secenerio. I've always installed vfd's in an industrial setting.


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## Mike Davis (Feb 13, 2012)

This is the stuff you need.
http://www.waynecoeartistblacksmith.com/Motors___VFDs.html
You should grab me one while you are at it


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 13, 2012)

BurkeCutlery said:


> Colin, is your home/shop wired for 3 phase?


Yes

I know I can just get a new motor but I'd rather wate to upgrade to a bigger grinder befor I do. Just trying to see it there was a way to hook up a VFD to the one I have for under $300.00


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## Rottman (Feb 13, 2012)

With a little searching 300 might get you a vfd and a motor (here's a vfd for ~150: Link).


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## Hattorichop (Feb 13, 2012)

Another one to check out may be the optidrive e2. Single phase input and single phase output.
VFD rated for 1/2hp sells for $410.


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## Hattorichop (Feb 13, 2012)

Colin, sorry for giving you hope in a cheap option. This was another product of me not reading the context fully before making an opinion. I just saw the motor ratings and totally skip over the motor type.

Good luck in your quest.
BTW We still do not know what you are trying to achieve with this.


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## Mike Davis (Feb 13, 2012)

ebay can be your friend. I have found motor/vfd combo's for around $300. Just takes a butt load of searching lol.


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 16, 2012)

I have a kalamazoo 1sm belt sander that I would like a variable speed control on. The motor spc. I posted is the motor that it came with. I have had this thing for 5-6 years now, made a few cool mod's to my self and it's a good little grinder. It's easy to move around and doesn't take up much space. Even if/ when I get a bigger grinder I think I would still find it to be useful. So I wouldn't mind putting a few $100.00 into it. It would also be nice to run it in reverse (motor can handle that, I checked). A VDF would be ideal I think, but I would settle for just being able to slow the belt down. Since its a 2 wheel grinder with the Drive wheel directly attached to the motor I don't think a step pulley is a option? Not without relocating the motor, making a mounting plate ext. that would make the whole unit bigger thus taking away from it being easy to move. It has a 4" drive wheel that I was thinking about just changing out for a smaller one, but 3.75/3.5" is as small as I could go tops without it screwing up the belt ran. It would not clear the space that the belt runes to the platen. I also don't know if 1/4-1/2" reduction in wheel size would give me a noticeably reduction in speed? 
Other options that I'm not thinking of? Or is there a controller that would work on this motor? 


Hattorichop said:


> Colin, sorry for giving you hope in a cheap option. This was another product of me not reading the context fully before making an opinion. I just saw the motor ratings and totally skip over the motor type.
> 
> Good luck in your quest.
> BTW We still do not know what you are trying to achieve with this.


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 16, 2012)

Rottman said:


> With a little searching 300 might get you a vfd and a motor (here's a vfd for ~150: Link).



With that vfd I would still need a deferent motor, or would that work on the one I have?


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 16, 2012)

If I got a dc motor that fit right I would just need a ac/dc converter and cheep voltage controller, right? Or would I lose torc power going this route thus running into a problem with the motor staling?


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## Mike Davis (Feb 16, 2012)

hmmm....I am looking into this. I might call Kalamazoo direct, as they are almost local to me(40 min west) and see what their thought's are on this.


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## GLE1952 (Feb 16, 2012)

If you are ok with a set lower speed, the 3.5" wheel compared to the 4" by my calculation of the circumference of the wheels, would reduce your speed from the rated 1800 SFPM to 1584 SFPM or a 12% reduction. (disclaimer: I'm Not a math major)LOL.

Glen


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## JMJones (Feb 16, 2012)

Chef Niloc said:


> With that vfd I would still need a deferent motor, or would that work on the one I have?



You would need a three phase motor to hook the vfd to, a single phase motor would not work. 

As far as DC, If you found the correct size and spec motor to fit, you can get a dc speed controller for 170
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=11-2102

I run my disc grinder/ buffer combo on the above controller and it works fine.


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## Chef Niloc (Feb 16, 2012)

Mike Davis said:


> hmmm....I am looking into this. I might call Kalamazoo direct, as they are almost local to me(40 min west) and see what their thought's are on this.



That would be cool, thanks



GLE1952 said:


> If you are ok with a set lower speed, the 3.5" wheel compared to the 4" by my calculation of the circumference of the wheels, would reduce your speed from the rated 1800 SFPM to 1584 SFPM or a 12% reduction. (disclaimer: I'm Not a math major)LOL.
> 
> Glen


I got the same math, I'd like to get it own to about 800 sfpm, but thank you for looking that up for me.


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## Drybonz (Sep 3, 2012)

I use the lower model of that controller (the red one) with my craftsman buffer. It works pretty well.


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