# Massdrop III: Kamon



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

I wonder who it is this time?


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## refcast

prolly kamijo


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## TSF415




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## RockyBasel

Thanks to @alterwisser, we will be announcing a Massdrop trois very shortly. @alterwisser used his skills of persuasion to get this single-man shop smith to do a one-time only Massdrop for us. Hand forged of course. All will be revealed very shortly. For the one who can guess who it is, we have a very special prize


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## Bensbites

shihan?


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## RockyBasel

Nope


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## TSF415

Kamon?!?


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## M1k3

MazaToyamanabeZuno?


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## M1k3

HSC? Wakui? Yoshikane? Isasmedjan (A.K.A. Janus, A.K.A. Mr. Convertible Serbian Cleaver)?


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## RockyBasel

Hint….think horse rasps


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## M1k3

Chelsea Miller?


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## RockyBasel

M1k3 said:


> Chelsea Miller?


 No, but I could not resist throwing that in there


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## TSF415

M1k3 said:


> Chelsea Miller?



Finally she can get her due respect!


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## M1k3

RockyBasel said:


> No, but I could not resist throwing that in there


My second guess was going to be MicroPlane.


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## Delat

Harbeer?


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## M1k3

Delat said:


> Harbeer?


I said that. Then @RockyBasel hinted at Chelsea Miller, then backtracked.


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## Giovanny Torres

Suntravel


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## BillHanna

Radiona?


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## Delat

M1k3 said:


> I said that. Then @RockyBasel hinted at Chelsea Miller, then backtracked.



I think we’ve seen that deny and distract tactic from Rocky on the last one when somebody correctly guessed Jannis too early.


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## captaincaed

If we had a couple hints maybe someone could pull if off again!

I'm personally rooting for a British maker. Maybe Catcheside, Two Sticks or Pendergrast.


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## ian

Would be pretty cool if Catcheside did one at some point.


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## RockyBasel

ian said:


> Would be pretty cool if Catcheside did one at some point.


Good idea!


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## xxxclx

Milan Gravier maybe? or Raquin


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## spaceconvoy

Isasmedjan


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## tostadas

Smedja Aspen


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## BillHanna

Henckels?


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## tostadas

BillHanna said:


> Henckels?


and sharpened on a work sharp ken onion at 15 degrees


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## Corradobrit1

Would love it to be Catcheside. Better not be Willey's choppers or Jesse James


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## ew_ut

Dave Martell?


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## Matt Jacobs

someone has to say Mazaki


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## Logan A.

I’ve seen this mass drop thing pop up a couple times on here. What is it everyone’s anticipating?


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## spaceconvoy

Logan A. said:


> I’ve seen this mass drop thing pop up a couple times on here. What is it everyone’s anticipating?


Disappointment


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## ian

Logan A. said:


> I’ve seen this mass drop thing pop up a couple times on here. What is it everyone’s anticipating?



Read the other Massdrop threads. Rocky and nakiriwifulifuspicefu (and @alterwisser?) get a maker to agree to make a bunch of copies of a knife, usually with minimal options for customization (e.g. length), then KKFers ask to be buyers of said knives once they're completed, some people are chosen, and those people get to buy the knives.

The advantage is that often the books of the maker are closed, so it's hard to get a knife from them otherwise. And there may be a small discount because it's a bulk order, but maybe not.


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## esoo

Fredrik Spare?
Andrei Markin?


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## Corradobrit1

Raquin or Yannick si vous plait


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## timebard

Marko?


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## M1k3

spaceconvoy said:


> Isasmedjan


*Janus


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## M1k3

Ken Onion


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## RockyBasel

Corradobrit1 said:


> Raquin or Yannick si vous plait


Mais bien sur monsieur


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## RockyBasel

ian said:


> Read the other Massdrop threads. Rocky and nakiriwifulifuspicefu (and @alterwisser?) get a maker to agree to make a bunch of copies of a knife, usually with minimal options for customization (e.g. length), then KKFers ask to be buyers of said knives once they're completed, some people are chosen, and those people get to buy the knives.
> 
> The advantage is that often the books of the maker are closed, so it's hard to get a knife from them otherwise. And there may be a small discount because it's a bulk order, but maybe not.


….but it will be refined yet toothy


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## BillHanna

Matt Jacobs said:


> someone has to say Mazaki


It’s Mazzy Star, regardless of the name on the tin.


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## lemeneid

spaceconvoy said:


> Disappointment


Empty wallets and broken relationships too


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## RockyBasel

This one will be different, unique, really fun to do. The blade smith is super looking forward to working with us sports fans at KKF. Let’s see how it will play out

More to come shortly….


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## ian

RockyBasel said:


> This one will be different, unique, really fun to do. The blade smith is super looking forward to working with us sports fans at KKF. Let’s see how it will play out
> 
> More to come shortly….



Yea, it’ll be exciting to see! I love his handles and the denty finish gyutos. Really interesting stuff.


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## Jovidah

So Kamon then? You really gave that away ian...


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## Bodine

Man, I came in dead last on the last one, I am due, lets go.


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## LostHighway

I think it is safe to assume it will be a European maker. I'd be very happy to see Catcheside, I find his knives aesthetically unappealing but I've heard nothing but raves about performance. Puig, Isasmedjan, Smedja Aspen, maybe Suntravel, maybe Herde,... long list of possibles.
I'd definitely be down for 14C28N cleavers from Jonas! Next time around I'd really like to see a North American or Australian maker working in something other than low alloy steels, one of the new Larrin Thomas steels would be great!


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## ian

Jovidah said:


> So Kamon then? You really gave that away ian...



 I have no inside info here. Just adding to the drama by phrasing my guesses like they’re fact.


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## Dan E

Hyped for the next chance! Kamon or 9 would be pretty neat


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## TSF415

So if it is kamon do I automatically win my spot?

also @coffeelover191919 there’s a new mass drop about to happen. Be prepared to throw your name in the hat so you don’t have to ask a million different ways how you can cut the line.


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## ModRQC

I don't care who does what and who gets it but... wish the very best of luck upon this third edition. May it be a tremendous success!


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## Jville

Raquin, Kamon, or the 9.


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## McMan

I'm guessing Kamon, too--on the basis that it's got to be somebody that can bang out 30-50 knives with very little variance in a relatively short amount of time and Kamon has his **** together. 

Full disclosure: I asked for a Kamon massdrop after MD1. Seed-planters get an automatic spot on the list.


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

McMan said:


> 30-50 knives


that's kind of a lot

i will accept this gross exaggeration of my organizational prowess as a complement


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## IsoJ

Kamon or something wild like Will Catcheside making traditional profile gyuto


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## xsmx13

Please be Kamon, please be Kamon, please be Kamon!!! I've been obsessively checking email for a newsletter announcing custom slots... and now I'll be doing the same with this thread!


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## M1k3

convertible Serbian Cleaver


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## McMan

M1k3 said:


> convertible Serbian Cleaver


Is it too late to add another "like" emoji?


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## captaincaed

Kamon does do batch work...
I'm voting for Kamon, fully forged, even handle, Lin Rhea style. Badass.


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## captaincaed

HSC/// would also rock.


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## Rainman890

What about the9 or that other Australian maker? Those are perty..


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## Marcelo Amaral

Talking about an australian makers, Tansu and Kippington are awesome.

Can't get enough of their blades.


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## lemeneid

I’m gonna cut my d1ck off with my newly bought Denka if it’s not one of the makers listed above! 

Watch this space!!!


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

lemeneid said:


> I’m gonna cut my d1ck off with my newly bought Denka if it’s not one of the makers listed above!
> 
> Watch this space!!!


bet

@RockyBasel @alterwisser


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## alterwisser

Ok, it’s Kramer


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## RDalman

Is this not the ~100usd thin cleaver drop we planned?

Anyway, godspeed


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## LostHighway

In the event that it is Kamon please offer something shorter than 250mm gyutos. With 250s or longer my kitchen cabinets would likely end up all scarred up and it would further terrorize my wife and the dog.


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## ian

RDalman said:


> Is this not the ~100usd thin cleaver drop we planned?
> 
> Anyway, godspeed



This was a great gift to the community. I still don’t know how you were able to make all 30 of them in a week. I love the finish: I’ve never seen a fully mirror polished denty cleaver before. The intricate engravings on the handles are also amazing, although imo mine is a little heavy on the religious imagery. Thanks again for doing the drop! I’m absolutely loving mine.


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## Sdo

Jovidah said:


> So Kamon then? You really gave that away ian...


Another one for Kamon.


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## marc4pt0

Ol‘ Ben Jammin Kamon. That man definitely could pull this off, with finesse.
lots of other great names being thrown out as well.


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## esoo

TF Denka + Blades finished by Forty with handles by JoBone?

Kaiju?


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## ian

esoo said:


> TF Denka + Blades finished by Forty with handles by JoBone?
> 
> Kaiju?



Those would be cool too


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## esoo

Considering the rate that Y Tanaka appears to pump out blades (lots) and the rate that Kajiu come out (never), I think it would be faster to make the KKF Kaiju - Y Tanaka + Myojin + Forty for final finish.


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

[QUOTE="esoo, post: 837700, member:]
KKF Kaiju - Y Tanaka + Myojin + Forty for final finish.
[/QUOTE]

Are you guys just naming random things at this point ?


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## ian

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> Are you guys just naming random things at this point ?



Weren’t we always?


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## lemeneid

esoo said:


> TF Denka + Blades finished by Forty with handles by JoBone?


I will buy this!!!

oh wait…


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## mk4pi

alterwisser said:


> Ok, it’s Kramer



this would be cool, as long as we accept kidney as payment.


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## lemeneid

mk4pi said:


> this would be cool, as long as we accept kidney as payment.


It’s ok, as long as the “free willy” one is available.


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## Todd762

I would guess Kamon as well. I ordered a knife from him, the guy is organized and efficient. So many great makers I haven’t tried, I doubt anyone selected is less than phenomenal


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## RockyBasel

Well… we are doing the reveal momentarily


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## esoo

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> Are you guys just naming random things at this point ?



Considering I have no clue what the actual choice is, pretty much yes.

On the other side of it, I suspect we could get that knife to happen with better odds than a Kono Kaiju.....


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## Knivperson

Birgersson? Ahh, Im guessing Kamon as well. A 360mm denty bread knife for those big sour dough loafes.


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*The Three Mass(drop)kateers @RockyBasel, @alterwisser, and I (NKW) are very pleased to officially announce *

*Massdrop III: Kamon*

@KAMON Knives​
*We are huge fans of his, and judging from the reactions in the past few pages - you all are too *

*This knife will be a classic Kamon, dripping with all the apex predator performance, moon-crater denty KU, and impeccable F&F that we love him for.*




* Knife Details *
​*Style: Gyuto*

*Total Pieces: TBD

Sizes (2):
225 x 55
260 x 58

Prices: TBA

Construction:*
*Monosteel 1.2519 at 65 HRC
supersexi Denty KU Finish
Convex grind with strong distal taper
~6mm at heel, quick taper down to 2mm in middle, unmeasurably thin tip*

*Handle:*
*Heirloom Rokkaku Hanmaru shaped handle in bog oak with stainless steel end cap*
*All pieces will come with PE Saya*



*Knife will look something like this:*


*The handle will look something like this:*


*Saya will look something like this:*





*More details on how to participate will be shared later *​Cheers,
NKW


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## xsmx13

Omg! I will give my significant other and a Kamon production knife for a spot!


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## RockyBasel

Super Stoked! Thanks to @alterwisser for making this one happen


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## Jville

I guessed it. I should win a prize spot.


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## RockyBasel

Jville said:


> I guessed it. I should win a prize spot.


You certainly deserve it, for sure. 

The prize we came up with is a gold star to stick on your saya, should you be lucky enough to be selected by NKW’s “algorithm”  …just kidding


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## lemeneid

Whew!!! My d1ck is safe!!!!!


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## esoo

Jville said:


> I guessed it. I should win a prize spot.



Ask @ian about Massdrop prizes...


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## Vdark

Phallic handles is the best prize


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## LostHighway

ian said:


> This was a great gift to the community. I still don’t know how you were able to make all 30 of them in a week. I love the finish: I’ve never seen a fully mirror polished denty cleaver before. The intricate engravings on the handles are also amazing, although imo mine is a little heavy on the religious imagery. Thanks again for doing the drop! I’m absolutely loving mine.



Which handle did you get? I got the one with Hugin and Munnin but the ones with the valkyries or the one with Sköll and Háti were very cool too. @RDalman does nice work, so detailed.


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## ian

LostHighway said:


> Which handle did you get? I got the one with Hugin and Munnin but the ones with the valkyries or the one with Sköll and Háti were very cool too. @RDalman does nice work, so detailed.



Mostly my handle was covered in replicas of the carving referenced below. I think making my earlier handle really helped him: the small detail work was incredibly lifelike.


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## Jville

lemeneid said:


> Whew!!! My d1ck is safe!!!!!


Teruyasu Bobbit.


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## TonyZ

im a sucker for a good 225 gyuto... I’m in


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## TSF415

RockyBasel said:


> You certainly deserve it, for sure.
> 
> The prize we came up with is a gold star to stick on your saya, should you be lucky enough to be selected by NKW’s “algorithm”  …just kidding


 Wait I was first.  I want the sticker


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## Jason183

I’m in for this lottery, always been wanting a Kamon Knife, this is a great opportunity.
If I’m lucky, I’ll pick the 260 x 58, Thanks.

I’m also wondering if it’s possible to get some extra handles if we pay more?


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## RockyBasel

Jason183 said:


> I’m in for this lottery, always been wanting a Kamon Knife, this is a great opportunity.
> If I’m lucky, I’ll pick the 260 x 58, Thanks.
> 
> I’m also wondering if it’s possible to get some extra handles if we pay more?


What do you mean “extra handles”? Do you mean “extra handles”? The same handle but “extra”?  we can certainly ask Ben


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## DisconnectedAG

I'm in if possible!


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## Jason183

RockyBasel said:


> What do you mean “extra handles”? Do you mean “extra handles”? The same handle but “extra”?  we can certainly ask Ben


Yes Same handle but with different color, I really liked the blue color handle he made. Would liked to have at least two different color handles. Switching back and forth depends on the mood, I know it’s really easy to change handle for Kamon Knives. I won’t mind paying extra for more handles.


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## CA_cook

Interested.


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## M1k3

RockyBasel said:


> What do you mean “extra handles”? Do you mean “extra handles”? The same handle but “extra”?  we can certainly ask Ben


@ian


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## Rainman890

Sounds good, I'd like to support a EU maker!


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## KAMON Knives

Hey Guys

Just wanted to write a few words here also. I'll spare you from talking about me too much but I'd like to say something about this project. 

I'm really excited about it already as I think it could be a cool thing to execute from an craftsman perspective and also make some people happy that would otherwise not have a chance to get ahold of my knives.
And... how can I say no when there are such dedicated people organizing mass drops for the knife community? The community that means so much to me. Not only because it brings food to my table nowadays, but also because it was giving enough to let me learn this craft in the first place, make connections, find friends and last but not least find customers that bring up enough trust to give me their hard earned money for what I've crafted for them. 
So here's a big thanks for the organization from my end to @RockyBasel, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser in advance! 

About the actual knife:

Essentially it will be this knife right here regarding blade profile and handle construction but with my denty (tsuchime) KU finish and bog oak wood instead of the ash seen in the pics/video.






Regarding additional handles:

I understand those wishes completely as one has the option to take the handle off with my knives and exchange it with another one. 
However... This is a mass drop so organization is a little different than what I usually do. Making extra handles will make the whole process more complicated by a reasonable amount so I can't confirm yet that any customization will be possible. After all a mass drop is a mass drop for the reason of efficiency. If efficiency lacks too much that would defy the sense of it. I have to think about this topic a little. 

If you guys got other questions that are not answered by my website (informing about the basic info regarding my work), don't hesitate to ask them!


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## Corradobrit1

Bog oak is a nice choice. Should compliment the Ku finish very well.


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## Knivperson

It will look soooo cool with tsuchime and bog oak handle!!!


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## parbaked

I will buy this…


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## Ruso

Looks very tempting, awaiting for the price point. Any speculations?


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## Campbell

$$$$


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## Bodine

Please add me to the list of those who desire to obtain one of these spectacular pieces of work.
I AM IN. 225 por favor


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## hukdizzle

So how does one get in the lottery for this? I have not been a part of the prior massdrop's.


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## TSF415

Ruso said:


> Looks very tempting, awaiting for the price point. Any speculations?



enough to cause an uptick bst postings


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## xsmx13

Campbell said:


> $$$$


I will gladly pay this much.


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## ModRQC

$$ would be damn nice…


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## BillHanna

TSF415 said:


> enough to cause an uptick bst postings


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## JayS20

Really good choice. 
Ben does excellent work and I advise everyone to try one of his knives.
Also happy that my wallet is safe for this time.


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## crocca86

Good luck to everyone


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## MOCDaddy

LETS GOOOOOOOOO


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## Campbell

In the meantime...


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## Campbell

and for the Dark Lord Sauron


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## Campbell

BT-dubbs, when can we get a mass-drop on a 10' magnetic knife bar?


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Campbell said:


> BT-dubbs, when can we get a mass-drop on a 10' magnetic knife bar?


when you gift me a global courier company with at least one 747 in its fleet.


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## Corradobrit1

Given the appearance I dub this the Denkamon


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## Hz_zzzzzz

I’m in for a 260 if possible. Thanks


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## lemeneid

Corradobrit1 said:


> Given the appearance I dub this the Denkamon


BKBKBKBK?


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## TSF415

I think his handle will be too straight and his bevels too even to justify relating it to a denka.


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## ModRQC

TSF415 said:


> I think his handle will be too straight and his bevels too even to justify relating it to a denka.



Will his sweats be as pink though?


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## Corradobrit1

TSF415 said:


> I think his handle will be too straight and his bevels too even to justify relating it to a denka.


Will Happy Time be just as Happy?


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## M1k3

TSF415 said:


> I think his handle will be too straight and his bevels too even to justify relating it to a denka.


And his (Kamon) overgrinds are non-existent


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## TSF415

Corradobrit1 said:


> Will Happy Time be just as Happy?



Only time will tell


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## ampersandcetera

I'm really excited for this, but I honestly still don't quite understand how the process works. Are we all just waiting for massdrop to issue this, or is there a lottery, or what?

How much will the 225 be and how can I get one?


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## lemeneid

Corradobrit1 said:


> Will Happy Time be just as Happy?


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## Koop

I'll ask again - how do we enter the lottery? I want in if possible.


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## dough

They will make an obvious post… it will include more facts and let you know the details for how to get a chance to purchase one. You might want to look through the old threads… you can just look at nakiri’s past posts


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## Delat

ampersandcetera said:


> I'm really excited for this, but I honestly still don't quite understand how the process works. Are we all just waiting for massdrop to issue this, or is there a lottery, or what?
> 
> How much will the 225 be and how can I get one?



Relax guys. At some point Rocky and team will post more details about the knife, the number available, and the whole process.

Nakirifufu will then post an impossible-to-miss very brightly colored large-font post with instructions. You’ll PM him and he’ll post the list. Then he’ll do a random number generator and pick “winners” off the list who’ll be the actual purchasers. Everybody not selected goes on the waitlist.

Newbies like myself will initially be bitterly disappointed at not making the cut, then you’ll realize you can actually go buy several other quite decent knives with the money you would’ve otherwise spent. Win-win either way.

Just keep an eye on this thread, there’ll be plenty of time to get on the list and everything will be published and above-board.


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## spaceconvoy

Where is the Buy-It-Now button?!?!


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

As I stated in my main post, further details on signup/purchasing/etc. will be coming in due time. There's a process, don't worry - no bots or F5 refreshes needed.

@dough @Delat thanks guys


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## Justinv

I don’t want to be a downer, but I’m disappointed in a few aspects. Stainless cladding is much appreciated and I have no need for screw holes in my bolster. A nice looking hot glued handle is preferred. Handles get replaced when they they look bad or cheap. Put a good handle on it and use traditional construction.


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## Jovidah

We're looking forward to the alternative drop you're organizing!


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## Barmoley

Justinv said:


> I don’t want to be a downer, but I’m disappointed in a few aspects. Stainless cladding is much appreciated and I have no need for screw holes in my bolster. A nice looking hot glued handle is preferred. Handles get replaced when they they look bad or cheap. Put a good handle on it and use traditional construction.


Fortunately, no one is forcing you to participate.


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## Justinv

Correct, I do not need to participate. This is a custom design that is not finalized. Options with custom work are appreciated. Past drops included options. I’m particularly concerned about the proposed handle as it looks unsanitary and not suitable for commercial use.


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## McMan

Justinv said:


> I don’t want to be a downer, but I’m disappointed in a few aspects. Stainless cladding is much appreciated and I have no need for screw holes in my bolster. A nice looking hot glued handle is preferred. Handles get replaced when they they look bad or cheap. Put a good handle on it and use traditional construction.


Seriously?! C'mon man...

Plus, if you saw a Kamon handle up close, you'd be singing a different tune. He makes and machines the bolsters flawlessly--the level of f/f is akin to jewelry.
Stainless-clad, schmainless-clad--this isn't a custom for one person, it's a drop.

This is a chance for a wider audience to try the knives of a sought-after (and excellent!) maker, and for Kamon to chime in a bit about his production process.

Hats off to @KAMON Knives and much respect to the three-massketeers.


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## McMan

Justinv said:


> Correct, I do not need to participate. This is a custom design that is not finalized. Options with custom work are appreciated. Past drops included options. I’m particularly concerned about the proposed handle as it looks unsanitary and not suitable for commercial use.


There's a solution--put up a WTB for a production Kamon. He used pom handles without screws. They are also accessibly priced.


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## TSF415

I mean given the option, some people would prefer a phallic shaped handle over the stock one.


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## lemeneid

Justinv said:


> Correct, I do not need to participate. This is a custom design that is not finalized. Options with custom work are appreciated. Past drops included options. I’m particularly concerned about the proposed handle as it looks unsanitary and not suitable for commercial use.


Past drops included what options? A wooden box with golden pubes of a Swedish forge god?


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## Justinv

lemeneid said:


> Past drops included what options? A wooden box with golden pubes of a Swedish forge god?



The last drop has options for steel, blade profile, and length.


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## childermass

Justinv said:


> The last drop has options for steel, blade profile, and length.


I think you need to pay a bit more attention while reading. As far as I remember the only option for both of the last massdrops was length (with limited choices) as is with this one.


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## McMan

Justinv said:


> The last drop has options for steel, blade profile, and length.


The Dalman drop was "Swedish Steel honyaki" and offered a choice of four lengths.
No choice of profile, no choice of steel.

The Xerxes drop was clad 1.2562 and offered two lengths.
No choice of profile, no choice of steel.


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## Justinv

My reference was to the edgerton group buy which included 8 options. It was labeled a group buy, not a mass drop.


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## Barmoley

Justinv said:


> My reference was to the edgerton group buy which included 8 options. It was labeled a group buy, not a mass drop.


That was different and has nothing to do with this. Was a very good group buy in its own right, but irrelevant in this case.


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## Sdo

Justinv said:


> Correct, I do not need to participate. This is a custom design that is not finalized. Options with custom work are appreciated. Past drops included options. I’m particularly concerned about the proposed handle as it looks unsanitary and not suitable for commercial use.


If you do not need to participate why so concerned? Focus your energy on something you would like to participate as there's already enough people here interested in having an unsanitary handle.


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## Hockey3081

lemeneid said:


> Past drops included what options? A wooden box with golden pubes of a Swedish forge god?



I will buy this.


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## daddy yo yo

Sdo said:


> If you do not need to participate why so concerned? Focus your energy on something you would like to participate as there's already enough people here interested in having an unsanitary handle.


Well, that the handle is „unsanitary“ is to be proofed and can be discussed. As a guest of reataurants I am much more concerned about clean hands/fingernails, sweat, hair, bad/old ingredients, boards, etc. than this type of handle construction. And if someone considers that handle construction to be „unsanitary“, there is absolutely no obligation to use this knife in a restaurant kitchen…


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## M1k3

Sdo said:


> If you do not need to participate why so concerned? Focus your energy on something you would like to participate as there's already enough people here interested in having an unsanitary handle.


I'd be more concerned about the cutting surface and what they, or do not, wipe it off with.


----------



## RockyBasel

Koop said:


> I'll ask again - how do we enter the lottery? I want in if possible.


NKW (during waking hours) will get open orders soon, once we issue more pricing details. Then using a completely random generator the lucky 30 will be chosen, like previous mass-drops


----------



## daniel_il

Really like this knife…looking to buy my first europe made knife, the question is - can i afford this?


----------



## lemeneid

daniel_il said:


> Really like this knife…looking to buy my first europe made knife, the question is - can i afford this?


That’s what mr kidney is for


----------



## Rainman890

daniel_il said:


> Really like this knife…looking to buy my first europe made knife, the question is - can i afford this?


Just join the raffle and hope you don't get picked? 

Or join the raffle, and if you're picked, give your spot to the person who can offer you the next best knife?


----------



## LAB

alternatively you can wait a few months and get it off Buy/sell


----------



## riba

daddy yo yo said:


> Well, that the handle is „unsanitary“ is to be proofed and can be discussed. As a guest of reataurants I am much more concerned about clean hands/fingernails, sweat, hair, bad/old ingredients, boards, etc. than this type of handle construction. And if someone considers that handle construction to be „unsanitary“, there is absolutely no obligation to use this knife in a restaurant kitchen…


Most people here anyway only put their knives on display


----------



## ModRQC

I think most people around here use their knives.

Displaying them is a way to bank on the steep investment they represent.


----------



## rstcso

ModRQC said:


> I think most people around here use their knives.


I only use my "good" knives when my wife's watching.  

I'd like to join the reindeer games when the details are announced.


----------



## riba

ModRQC said:


> I think most people around here use their knives.
> 
> Displaying them is a way to bank on the steep investment they represent.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

something something TF something something pearls


----------



## ModRQC

Something something swine something something understand the quality...


----------



## lemeneid

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> something something TF something something pearls





ModRQC said:


> Something something swine something something understand the quality...


Is that Mazaki?


----------



## spaceconvoy

Godwin's Law but for KKF: all threads eventually devolve into TF bashing


----------



## Jville

Justinv said:


> I don’t want to be a downer, but I’m disappointed in a few aspects. Stainless cladding is much appreciated and I have no need for screw holes in my bolster. A nice looking hot glued handle is preferred. Handles get replaced when they they look bad or cheap. Put a good handle on it and use traditional construction.


You aren't downing anyone but, perhaps, yourself. People are trying to get a Kamon and want him to do his thing. Do you not have full carbon knives? If not, that's cool. But uuh, it is a really common construction. You could say it's a "traditonal construction." And one thing that is kind of interesting about his knives is that you can change the handles by unscrewing them.


----------



## WiriWiri

You can’t make everyone happy i guess. And, if the truth be told, it’s probably not the first handle choice I would have immediately opted for.

But the Kamon proposed looks damn fine, and all this focus on the handle business has made me focus on new qualities and associations I’d never considered before with a knife. A Kamon, and with the added bonus of unsanitary titanium penis multi-holed bog oak handle goodness to boot? Count me in if possible, with added bells on


----------



## Corradobrit1

Justinv said:


> looks unsanitary


Looks and reality are totally different. Are you familiar with the properties of ancient bog oak? Clearly not. Guess you recommend tossing out my burnt chestnut handles and endgrain Walnut chopping boards too once they get a little grubby. Just maintain the handle and you'll be fine. Its not rocket science or Ho wood which I do dislike intensely


----------



## Knivperson

Any guesses on price point? Are we talking 1600-1800 usd, as Ive seen online?


----------



## Corradobrit1

Knivperson said:


> Any guesses on price point? Are we talking 1600-1800 usd, as Ive seen online?


That sounds like Eating Tools pricing. I'm going to guess they'll be offered around $1K as a Massdrop


----------



## Hockey3081

Speaking of unsanitary… Full ooksik handle/end caps/blade or I’m out


----------



## Knivperson

Corradobrit1 said:


> That sounds like Eating Tools pricing. I'm going to guess they'll be offered around $1K as a Massdrop


Exactly what I was referring to.


----------



## tally-ho

Justinv said:


> I’m particularly concerned about the proposed handle as it looks unsanitary and not suitable for commercial use.


Wrap it with copper tape.
Copper is bactericide and fungicide so it will sanitize your hand. The copper tape will get a nice patina quickly...and will turn your hand green like a broccoli.


----------



## Jovidah

Don't know where the concern for sanitary handles suddenly comes from on a forum where the majority of knives discussed come with porous wooden wa handles... but if this is really your concern your best bet is this small Swiss maker that has the perfect solution. Comes in full stainless too.


----------



## tally-ho

Jovidah said:


> Don't know where the concern for sanitary handles suddenly comes from...


In french we say "qui veut tuer son chien l'accuse de la rage" (who wants to kill his dog accuses him of rabies) so when you want a blacksmith to offer options for different handles that were not originally planned, just pretend the one proposed might be unsanitary.


----------



## ModRQC

I can organize a Victo massdrop, no problemo.


----------



## Jville

ModRQC said:


> I can organize a Victo massdrop, no problemo.


I can help with that I have some connections. They will be stainless too.


----------



## Jovidah

You can even choose the handle color on the V'nox!


----------



## EM-L

I am interested in a 225 if I have any luck this time!


----------



## Knivperson

Can anyone say something about 1.2519 steel? I have a knife by Isasmedjan in swedish 26c3 "spicy white" which takes on a razor edge very easily, but how does 1.2519 compare? It's more akin to blue #1, right?


----------



## Jason183

Knivperson said:


> Can anyone say something about 1.2519 steel? I have a knife by Isasmedjan in swedish 26c3 "spicy white" which takes on a razor edge very easily, but how does 1.2519 compare? It's more akin to blue #1, right?


Yes, Very similar to Japanese version of blue steel. I remember someone from 2nd mass drop said 1.2519 is the best Carbon steel you can get.

NVM, I just looked up, it’s actually different, the one I’m taking about was 1.2562, so maby 1.2519 was similar liked blue 2?


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

Knivperson said:


> Can anyone say something about 1.2519 steel? I have a knife by Isasmedjan in swedish 26c3 "spicy white" which takes on a razor edge very easily, but how does 1.2519 compare? It's more akin to blue #1, right?



1.2519, B1, W1 Comparison Chart


----------



## ModRQC

EM-L said:


> I am interested in a 225 if I have any luck this time!



Victo? No problem will be at your door in a few days.


----------



## Knivperson

HumbleHomeCook said:


> 1.2519, B1, W1 Comparison Chart


Relatively high chrome content. Is it considered semi-stainless? And some vanadium as well, which should give some toughness?


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

Knivperson said:


> Relatively high chrome content. Is it considered semi-stainless? And some vanadium as well, which should give some toughness?



I have zero experience with it. Stainless is generally considered to have chromium percentages at least in the double digits so I don't think would be considered a "semi stainless steel". But, it no doubt has better resistance than either Blue 1 or White 1.


----------



## xsmx13

Chromium is far too low to be stainless, but in my experience it isn't too reactive and develops a nice stable patina very easily. In these regards it feels similar to 52100 imo.


----------



## Barmoley

1.2519 is an excellent low alloy steel the way Ben does it. Good edge holding, not too reactive for a low alloy steel and stable edges. Similar to the best of blue 2, with a more stable edge in my experience with Kamon knives.


----------



## EM-L

ModRQC said:


> Victo? No problem will be at your door in a few days.


Ohh... I thought it was IKEA? I am Swedish


----------



## ModRQC

Ikeda is a good maker...

Aaaaah... sorry... misread that!


----------



## Justinv

Jovidah said:


> Don't know where the concern for sanitary handles suddenly comes from on a forum where the majority of knives discussed come with porous wooden wa handles...



The comment was about the handle having 4 screw holes that collect food debris. Has anyone ever told a maker “I love unfilled tang holes, please put 4 of them on the handle”?

Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both. A handle finish is easy to apply by the end user if they like. Other threads discuss these matters.

Options can be given or not, but the Edgerton group buy had a number of options yet still had a significant discount for the group order. Thats up to whoever is planning this but we are talking about a completely custom order here.


----------



## Migraine

Knivperson said:


> Any guesses on price point? Are we talking 1600-1800 usd, as Ive seen online?



My full custom Kamon (below) cost SIGNIFICANTLY less than that.







I think the one you've seen online might have been that Shichi Mai one which is super fancy.

I have also never got any food in the screws.

Ben is a great guy to buy a knife from; endlessly patient going back and forth with me even when we had some issues with a lost package containing handle material (not his fault). The knife is an absolute dream as well, by far my most used now.


----------



## ian

Justinv said:


> The comment was about the handle having 4 screw holes that collect food debris. Has anyone ever told a maker “I love unfilled tang holes, please put 4 of them on the handle”?
> 
> Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both. A handle finish is easy to apply by the end user if they like. Other threads discuss these matters.



Wash the knife? I think you’re overreacting, but whatever, just don’t buy one as everyone else has said.



Justinv said:


> Options can be given or not, but the Edgerton group buy had a number of options yet still had a significant discount for the group order. Thats up to whoever is planning this but we are talking about a completely custom order here.



The two group buys are not comparable. AFAIK, Taylor just recently started out as a knife maker, graduating from being a sharpener, and I assume he organized a group buy partly for the publicity. (Maybe I’m wrong here.) In any case, he was the one that suggested the group buy, so he can dictate whatever terms he wants. (His knives look super good, btw! Go buy one! I got to try one of his Westerns and was impressed.)

Kamon is a well established maker, no matter what the fools at knivpodden may think . He doesn’t need to do a massdrop, and he and the organizers chose to have just a length option, for simplicity, like in the other two Massdrops. So, it is what it is and we can drop it now.


----------



## Migraine

I think expecting a knifemaker to offer the option between clad and monosteel knives as part of a Massdrop/Groupbuy is insane. The whole point of them is that everyone gets basically the same thing with maybe some slight alterations; if you're expecting the option of clad or monosteel then you're expecting the choice between two completely different knives.


----------



## Delat

Justinv said:


> The comment was about the handle having 4 screw holes that collect food debris. Has anyone ever told a maker “I love unfilled tang holes, please put 4 of them on the handle”?
> 
> Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both. A handle finish is easy to apply by the end user if they like. Other threads discuss these matters.
> 
> Options can be given or not, but the Edgerton group buy had a number of options yet still had a significant discount for the group order. Thats up to whoever is planning this but we are talking about a completely custom order here.



I mean this in a completely serious way: you should organize a group buy with a custom maker that includes a significant discount and buyer-selected options. It would be a fantastic service to the community, as this one is.

These three Masketeers are running massdrops according to criteria they’ve decided, as a service to the community. Anyone else deciding to run additional group buys would certainly be welcomed enthusiastically.


----------



## Migraine

Justinv said:


> Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both.



Not a good reason, though, given both are demonstrably food safe.


----------



## Barmoley

Justinv said:


> The comment was about the handle having 4 screw holes that collect food debris. Has anyone ever told a maker “I love unfilled tang holes, please put 4 of them on the handle”?
> 
> Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both. A handle finish is easy to apply by the end user if they like. Other threads discuss these matters.
> 
> Options can be given or not, but the Edgerton group buy had a number of options yet still had a significant discount for the group order. Thats up to whoever is planning this but we are talking about a completely custom order here.



Seriously, you are the only one who thinks we are talking about "a completely custom order here."


----------



## Migraine

Also to the hopeful people on the first couple of pages of this thread, I reckon pigs will fly before Catcheside does a group buy 

He literally just makes what he wants. Doesn't even do his Forged Geometry orders any more.


----------



## Justinv

I’ll go back to lurking, no point in further discussion. As was said, if you don’t like it don’t join/buy. It is fantastic that people organize this and these threads are great to follow.


----------



## mc2442

I recently got one from Ben but would love the 225mm to go with it. My current is slightly under 250mm.

I have an early san mai from Catcheside and a couple other small ones from him. Would love to have a mass drop from him as well.


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> Relatively high chrome content. Is it considered semi-stainless? And some vanadium as well, which should give some toughness?


It's more like 52100 with some extra goodies added.


----------



## marc4pt0

Corradobrit1 said:


> That sounds like Eating Tools pricing. I'm going to guess they'll be offered around $1K as a Massdrop




I think the pricing/ affordability might come as a pleasant surprise. But I'm also just speculating


----------



## mc2442

I would have to look up what I paid for the knife but that estimate was sky high to what I would expect. Not cheap, but nothing that crazy.


----------



## marc4pt0

xsmx13 said:


> Chromium is far too low to be stainless, but in my experience it isn't too reactive and develops a nice stable patina very easily. In these regards it feels similar to 52100 imo.




My experience with Kamon 1.2519 has been pretty darn positive. Very good edge holding, quick to bring back to scary sharp, and easy to let sit on the board during use at work without fear of rust etc. Onions, raw protein, whatever, nothing really blasts it with unsightly "bad" patina. Except hot pineapple. After small dicing 20 fresh off the grill pineapple slices, and letting the knife sit in the juices for a while, the polished nashiji finish took on a wonderful darker etch like patina.


----------



## marc4pt0

Maybe for comparison, here's the same knife when it was new. 







Point being, it's not terribly reactive. Yes, it takes on a patina. But it's not crazy aggressive reactive like a shig or kato etc. Also worth mentioning that all those holes and screws in his "screwy" handles have yet to cause me any problems sanitation-wise. Or any problems at all. Period. I would be concerned in one's ability to clean anything if they were to tell me otherwise.


----------



## aaoueee

Here is another look at a Kamon. This is the same knife (made with 1.2519) that Kamon referenced in his post above after a couple of weeks of use (involving lots of juicy proteins). I think it's formed a beautiful, even patina and did not notice any aggressive reactivity when slicing onions, etc.

Now if only my pictures (and collection) could be as good as those of marc4pt0...




Edited to add another picture, catching the light at a different angle:


----------



## Hockey3081

Justinv said:


> The comment was about the handle having 4 screw holes that collect food debris. Has anyone ever told a maker “I love unfilled tang holes, please put 4 of them on the handle”?
> 
> Regarding porous wood, I choose not to use wood cutting boards and prefer handles with a finish. Food safety is one of the reasons for both. A handle finish is easy to apply by the end user if they like. Other threads discuss these matters.
> 
> Options can be given or not, but the Edgerton group buy had a number of options yet still had a significant discount for the group order. Thats up to whoever is planning this but we are talking about a completely custom order here.


FWIW, he actually has a handle design for pro chefs that still allows you to swap handles but doesn’t have the holes you reference. If you ever are interested or get on his list (clearly not through this buy), I’m sure he’d be happy to address your concerns. He’s been nothing short of fantastic in my conversations with him.


----------



## juice

Man, these threads really bring out the loonies.


----------



## KAMON Knives

I finally made a little video walking you guys through my shop. I wanted to do this for some time but I needed a little push from the mass drop guys @RockyBasel, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser to get it together and present you with my accent free flawless English speaking talent. 

Believe it or not... This is the fast version. I believe I easily could make a 3h long video just talking about all the details. No joke... Sadly . 

Here it is. If you got any questions, let me know.


----------



## RockyBasel

juice said:


> Man, these threads really bring out the loonies.


Right on!


----------



## RockyBasel

One comment - the knife we envisioned with Ben is going to be designed and constructed for one primary purpose - superb performance and fit and finish. Other things are secondary- custom handles, etc. 

We are also featuring smiths who are recognized as “masters of the craft” who have an insane dedication to their trade - Dalman, Jannis, and now Ben. And whose waiting lists are long, if you can get on the list.

We also give them full freedom to create what they are passionate about for the forum - so it’s not a mass “custom order” at all. It’s having them create an awesome cutting blade in a style that is their own, and by their own choosing. snd that”s why they like working with us - full artistic freedom to create.

they are definitely not doing this for publicity as they are already well known.

we have not yet approached new, emerging talent, but may do so. I think it’s a great idea.

but the other masters we are thinking about and in discussions with, if we can make it happen, it will blow your mind


----------



## Rainman890

KAMON Knives said:


> I finally made a little video walking you guys through my shop. I wanted to do this for some time but I needed a little push from the mass drop guys @RockyBasel, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser to get it together and present you with my accent free flawless English speaking talent.
> 
> Believe it or not... This is the fast version. I believe I easily could make a 3h long video just talking about all the details. No joke... Sadly .
> 
> Here it is. If you got any questions, let me know.




Thanks for this! It's cool to see all of this explained in a non-Japanese language. And your accent is fine (speaking as an American living in Europe). As a still-newbie to the world, I have no idea about the details, but it's really amazing to see how much thought/organization/passion goes into the process!


----------



## Geigs

Is this still open!! If we're making a list I've been nice, I promise!


----------



## RockyBasel

Geigs said:


> Is this still open!! If we're making a list I've been nice, I promise!


Wide open - orders not taken yet


----------



## Geigs

RockyBasel said:


> Wide open - orders not taken yet



+1 for me please.


----------



## drsmp

@KAMON Knives Man your shop is cleaner and more organized than my kitchen ! Sweet setup, thanks for the tour


----------



## cooktocut

KAMON Knives said:


> I finally made a little video walking you guys through my shop. I wanted to do this for some time but I needed a little push from the mass drop guys @RockyBasel, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser to get it together and present you with my accent free flawless English speaking talent.
> 
> Believe it or not... This is the fast version. I believe I easily could make a 3h long video just talking about all the details. No joke... Sadly .
> 
> Here it is. If you got any questions, let me know.



Loved the video Ben! It’s very obvious why your knives are of such a high caliber.


----------



## esoo




----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

esoo said:


> View attachment 138511


----------



## esoo

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> View attachment 138516


----------



## Delat

RockyBasel said:


> One comment - the knife we envisioned with Ben is going to be designed and constructed for one primary purpose - superb performance and fit and finish. Other things are secondary- custom handles, etc.
> 
> We are also featuring smiths who are recognized as “masters of the craft” who have an insane dedication to their trade - Dalman, Jannis, and now Ben. And whose waiting lists are long, if you can get on the list.
> 
> We also give them full freedom to create what they are passionate about for the forum - so it’s not a mass “custom order” at all. It’s having them create an awesome cutting blade in a style that is their own, and by their own choosing. snd that”s why they like working with us - full artistic freedom to create.



I haven’t managed to make the cut yet on one of these drops, but this is what I love about what you guys are doing - asking the maker for what they do best, and what they’re passionate about. On this forum the recommendation is always, “buy the smith, not the steel”. These massdrops are an opportunity to experience what the smith does best, their sweet-spot if you will. But most importantly, it’s eliciting that decision on what’s “best” directly from the smith, not arbitrarily defining parameters as consumers.

And honestly the collaboration is more than half the fun; where I might pass on a random Kamon on BST, here I’m crossing my fingers to make the list.


----------



## rstcso

Delat said:


> And honestly the collaboration is more than half the fun; where I might pass on a random Kamon on BST, here I’m crossing my fingers to make the list.


Agreed. My day job is suffering due to trying to type with my fingers crossed.


----------



## Corradobrit1

rstcso said:


> Agreed. My day job is suffering due to trying to type with my fingers crossed.


Try harder


----------



## xsmx13

rstcso said:


> Agreed. My day job is suffering due to trying to type with my fingers crossed.


Seriously... NKW, I know you said there's no need to F5, but my 12 daily checks for Kamon newsletter openings for custom orders now also includes about 80 checks a day on this thread. Kinda like waiting to see if you got what you wanted for Christmas as a kid.


----------



## rstcso

xsmx13 said:


> Kinda like waiting to see if you got what you wanted for Christmas as a kid.


The internet version of dog-earing pages in the Sears Wishbook and circling the specific item(s) on the page(s) you want in hopes your parents might get the hint.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

I’ve made this thread the default page of my Chrome so that I don’t have to press F5 all the time.


----------



## captaincaed

Looking forward very much. Continue to be grateful to the Three Massketeers for organizing the fun and keeping the forum lively.


----------



## Justablacktee




----------



## Giovanny Torres

Amazing that another massdrop is happening, thanks to the Massketeers for organising this for the community and to Kamon for agreeing.


----------



## RockyBasel

We will have prices after weekend for everyone!


----------



## Jville

If you are starting to accumulate the list of want ins. Put me on please.


----------



## Barashka

Dope af .. though I'd pay extra for the s-grind ..


----------



## MoabDave

In for a 225, staying tuned


----------



## MowgFace

Count me in!


----------



## ian

I too want in before any solicitation for names has been posted, and before any price has been set! However, if it is less than $2000 I may reconsider. I only buy really expensive knives nowadays. $$$$$=quality. 



Joking aside, I bet they’ll turn out great.


----------



## rstcso

I'm trying to decide whether to continue trying my luck for an opportunity to potentially buy a Kamon, or just spend the money on lottery tickets. Without any Massdrop details, I wouldn't know how many lottery tickets to buy , so I shall wait... with the rest of the world.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

rstcso said:


> I'm trying to decide whether to continue trying my luck for an opportunity to potentially buy a Kamon, or just spend the money on lottery tickets. Without any Massdrop details, I wouldn't know how many lottery tickets to buy , so I shall wait... with the rest of the world.


I'm still finalizing the announcement with pricing and further details, but for the sake of stopping any rumors you don't need to pay money to enter. 

Folks, please look through the past massdrop with Jannis to see how sign-ups were done, it will be very similar.


----------



## RevJoe

I ll admit I am curious.


----------



## Jason183

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> Folks, please look through the past massdrop with Jannis to see how sign-ups were done, it will be very similar.


For anyone whose wondering, it’s at page 13 of 2nd Massdrop.





KKF Massdrop II - Xerxes


Hi guys, now I can post something here again. Many thanks to the KKF team. I am pleased to read that the planned knives are well received. In the coming weeks I will post some videos here, which should give you an impression of my work and how the knives are made. Still, I'm curious where the...




www.kitchenknifeforums.com


----------



## KAMON Knives

I want to give you guys some technical insights and details of those mass drop knives and my knives in general. 

The big objective for me as a knife maker is to build knives that are fun to use, to build knives that perform. So everything I do is either to reach that aim or at least to not compromise it. 

I fully forge my blades with a heavy distal taper starting at ~6mm thickness of the tang near the handle. The taper is important for several reasons. For one it centers the mass close to the hand making for a very agile knife. It also makes for a lot of comfort where the hand sits in the choil and on the spine due to its thickness. Last but not least I accomplish to have a laser like front part of the blade combined with a workhorse in the back. So those are the main reasons for why I forge my blades. I'd otherwise have to grind them out from 6mm stock material if I was to make the same taper happen in stock removal technique. 
Forging is not a romantic thing to me just to be able to say I'm a blacksmith, but more the most efficient way to accomplish those characteristics of the blade. 

For blades that size I start out with a rectangular piece of steel. I use 1.2519 tungsten alloyed high carbon steel with the dimensions of 5mm thickness, 157mm lenght and about 42mm (for the smaller) and 45mm (for the bigger) of width. 

First I forge out the tang with the help of a little slot I cut into the blank. I've made a first person video that shows that process using the hand hammer and the powerhammer. 



After that I forge out the blade. For that I mainly use half round dies of the power hammer to draw the steel in the desired direction. This process is best shown in this video. 



After that process I apply the denty texture to the surface which makes for improved food release and a lighter blade. 

My heat treatment is done using an atmospheric temperature controlled kiln for normalizing and soft annealing and a fluidized Sand bed for austenitizing. I quench in a special martempering oil at 200°C and then put the blades into an aluminum clamp reaching 65hrc +-1hrc tempered. Right after the quench I let my blades sit in dry ice to make sure any retained austenite is converted to martensite. That makes for less burr building while sharpening and more wear resistance. 

After heat treatment my blades are ground fully water cooled to make sure the steel isn't damaged by any grinding heat and accidentally tempered/softened. I grind convex bevels to 0 with very thin edges sharpened by hand on a shapton pro 5k. 

My handles are take down meaning they can be taken off of the blades. The main reason for that is that all the important info is stamped into the tang. Therefore such details as production date, steel grade, hardness and details about the heat treatment will always stay on the knife and never be forgotten. Even in decades one will know what he's dealing with. 

Hope you guys liked the technical stuff too and let me know if I need to explain anything a little deeper.


----------



## RockyBasel

Awesome! Really great description Ben, I had not considered that grinding could itself temper the steel accidentally, but you are correct of course, and the water cooling (like an old Porsche engine) is the antidote

I am really looking forward to seeing the output


----------



## Giovanny Torres

Very informative video, thank you for posting it.


----------



## captaincaed

That's some impressive material management, drawing the heel down efficiently like you do. Two heats?! Come one, get out of here...


----------



## tchan001

Looking forward to this.


----------



## KAMON Knives

I've got some mails regarding my latest post here and I thought my answer to especially one mail could be quite interesting and I'll even expand on that a little because I didn't mention some stuff in the answer to the guy writing me the mail but he'll see . 

So the mail was along the lines that one can now better see how my forging is efficient compared to stock removal. 

I just need to explain that this is true under the specs I set out to have on my knives. For example it probably won't make much sense if my knives were only 3mm thick at the thickest part (nothing wrong with that).
I want that heavy taper though so I'd need use 6mm blanks in stock removal technique and grind the whole blank down and a lot of material and belts along the way. Just to visualize that for you - I'd have to use about 3 times the steel with the stock removal process compared to what I'm using now and about 2/3rds of that would end up beeing steel wool. Carbon steel is nothing that drives the costs higher by an significant amount but stock removal would come with a lot of time spent on the grinder and also using up lots of belts and those two parts are very cost inefficient. 
The belts are expensive on their own but my time is even more expensive so forging at the end of the day saves me time and you as a customer therefore costs to get to what I'd like you to have. 

Also I want to expand a little on the forging process itself so you may get a better picture of that. It's easy for me by now and I guess it looks easy in the videos as I hear that quite often but what's happening is rather complicated and needs some practice to do. 
No need to actually do the following at home but just to imagine: The plastic properties can be simulated at home with some play dough to get a feel for the difficulties. Now everyone knows how easy that stuff is to move to a certain shape but what you've got to do to really get a feel of the difficulties of forging is to try to move that stuff to a certain shape using only blacksmith style tools. 
The steel obviously is harder to move too even when red hot but that's not where your problems come from, but only a time issue. So that makes no difference to the parts that are hard to do at forging but just increases time. The thing that makes forging hard is that you can't hold the blank with your hands and also just move the material with some very rudimentary shaped tools like hammers and dies. So a lot of thinking is involved but once you've got the process and steps figured out its quite easy.
As a side note also bear in mind that the different forging steps can't be executed in a random progression. There is a totally different and irreversible outcome if you, for example, draw the heel at a different time in relation to drawing out the blade and so on. So that's very important too. 

Hope that draws a clearer picture for you and as always. Any questions welcome.


----------



## big_adventure

Go on holiday for a couple of months and you risk missing out. Just logged on today and saw this thread. Panic ensued at the thought of missing out. So much joy in realizing that entries haven't been finalized. It's like gambling but better.


----------



## RockyBasel

big_adventure said:


> Go on holiday for a couple of months and you risk missing out. Just logged on today and saw this thread. Panic ensued at the thought of missing out. So much joy in realizing that entries haven't been finalized. It's like gambling but better.



Your timing is good - enjoy Ben’s videos and @nakiriknaifuwaifu will open up the order taking this week, after posting pricing - we will keep it open for several days so no one misses out

it’s end of August, and people should be getting back from holiday here in EU


----------



## dough

Ya know I wish there was more opportunity to hear makers talk a bit about their process. That might be the best part of these “mass drops” bc whether I get picked or even if I don’t put my name in it’s a unique glimpse into the makers process.


----------



## FishmanDE

Ooooo zaddy! I am most certainly trying to get in on this!


----------



## Knivperson

Anticipation is enormous!!


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> Anticipation is enormous!!


Soon your wallet will be empty
And you soon find you can’t make rent
You end up homeless
Your wife divorces you for being a bum and can’t afford milk for the kids
You sleep in the rear of your car while some young punks steal your wheels in the middle of the knight.
But it’s ok, you have the most kickass knife on the planet 

This is just a joke btw, well maybe not the first line.


----------



## Corradobrit1

lemeneid said:


> Soon your wallet will be empty
> And you soon find you can’t make rent
> You end up homeless
> Your wife divorces you for being a bum and can’t afford milk for the kids
> You sleep in the rear of your car while some young punks steal your wheels in the middle of the knight.
> But it’s ok, you have the most kickass knife on the planet
> 
> This is just a joke btw, well maybe not the first line.


Sounds like business as usual for the Kiyoshi Kato aficionado.


----------



## Knivperson

Corradobrit1 said:


> Sounds like business as usual for the Kiyoshi Kato aficionado.


Do they usually have wives? And kids? Isn't the Katos enough?


----------



## Corradobrit1

Knivperson said:


> Do they usually have wives? And kids? Isn't the Katos enough?


I'm sure some say they do, but WE know the truth.....,


----------



## outofgamut

KAMON Knives said:


> It's easy for me by now and I guess it looks easy in the videos as I hear that quite often but what's happening is rather complicated and needs some practice to do.



That’s the thing. 

Even highly complex accomplishments can look easy when performed by an expert. Look at ball room dancing, for instance. Doesn’t look that hard, does it? Or to stay with something most of us can relate to: cooking. Try making omu rice yourself and see how those first attempts turn out. 



I know from my own field that things can look super easy and like all that is required are a few minutes, when seen from the outside. But this comes on the background of a lot of work to being able to do it. And, yes, once there it’s indeed easy (well - sometimes).


----------



## big_adventure

outofgamut said:


> That’s the thing.
> 
> Even highly complex accomplishments can look easy when performed by an expert. Look at ball room dancing, for instance. Doesn’t look that hard, does it? Or to stay with something most of us can relate to: cooking. Try making omu rice yourself and see how those first attempts turn out.
> 
> 
> 
> I know from my own field that things can look super easy and like all that is required are a few minutes, when seen from the outside. But this comes on the background of a lot of work to being able to do it. And, yes, once there it’s indeed easy (well - sometimes).




Exactly - this is how it is in every field or activity ever. Things generally look really easy when the person performing the activity is already good at it. Take, oh, surfing: watch John John Florence paddling into big Pipe: he lines up, takes what looks like 3 paddles, drops, stands, turns, gets barreled, shoots out. It looks like anyone could do it. Trust me, they cannot. Not even close. Watch an NFL kicker nail a 40 yard field goal. Looks like your handicapped kid sister could go 8/10. Now go try it yourself. 

@KAMON Knives is a pro and it shows in how easy it looks when he does this stuff.


----------



## Ruso

Any update on dates and price?


----------



## MoabDave

Probably "soon and expensive"

I'm sure there could be lots of debate around "expensive", but in this case you get what you pay for.

If you are allowed to pay for it. (ie. winning the lottery)


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

MoabDave said:


> Probably "soon and expensive"
> 
> I'm sure there could be lots of debate around "expensive", but in this case you get what you pay for.
> 
> If you are allowed to pay for it. (ie. winning the lottery)


I'm ready to sell a Kato for this should I win the lottery.


----------



## TSF415

Knives that he releases thru his newsletter are expensive but are much cheaper than the prices you see from online retailers.


----------



## RockyBasel

Ruso said:


> Any update on dates and price?


NKW will be posting in a few hours - I am holding him up but I I’ll happen today


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> NKW will be posting in a few hours - I am holding him up☺ but I I’ll happen today


Ive been checking all week, finally. Great news!


----------



## xsmx13

TSF415 said:


> Knives that he releases thru his newsletter are expensive but are much cheaper than the prices you see from online retailers.


Definitely, the example he posted that recently sold via his newsletter was €592, roughly $700.00 USD. Not a denty finish, but same handle style and drastically less than the resale prices for some other retailers. 

After finally obtaining a Kamon gyuto from BST, I was blown away by it. It made everything else I own seem diminished by comparison. For the right Kamon, I'd gladly pay more than twice this price because nothing else I've tried feels as comfortable or nimble in the hand for a 260mm gyuto. That said, if this it out of your price range, go buy one of Andrei Markin's knives. They're amazing in their own right.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*Alright ladies and germs, *
*It’s finally time to open the sign-ups. *
*Firstly, a massive thank you to @KAMON Knives for this massdrop. We’re incredibly excited to work with him. *


*HERE IS IMPORTANT INFO ON SHIPPING/PRICE DETAILS AND HOW TO SIGN UP FOR ORDERS:*
*please read this and then read it again *

*I’m serious, read it again!

Here is a recap of the knife specifications:*​

*Knife: Kamon Kurouchi Denty Wa Gyuto*

*Size: 225mm x 56mm <or> 260mm x 58mm
Steel: 1.2519 monosteel construction taken to 65 HRC
Grind: Convexed to zero (with a thin beveled edge) and a strong distal taper – workhorse in the back, skeleton thin in the front*
*Handle: removable rokkaku hanmaru construction in bog oak with heirloom aluminum fixtures

PE Saya will be included


Pricing:*


*Size (mm)**Price (Euros)*225 x 56*595*260 x 58*630*
* 
PLEASE NOTE – THESE ARE PRICES FROM KAMON AND DO NOT INCLUDE SHIPPING, VAT, OR CUSTOMS*

*THEY DO NOT INCLUDE VAT (where it applies) SHIPPING OR CUSTOMS!!!!!!!!!!*

*please please please calculate accordingly*


*Shipping:

Part of the advantage of these massdrop projects is streamlining things for the smith so they can focus on making the greatest knives they can. Partly for this reason, we will have a maximum of 3 invoices for each of 3 regions: The Americas, Europe, and APAC. *

*Approximate (READ: APPROXIMATE) duty and S&H fees will be: ~10 - 12% to EU distributor, ~11% to US distributor, and ~10% to APAC distributor. This does not include shipping from distributor to you. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when packages are ready for shipment.

Europe Distributor: **@RockyBasel*

*American Distributor: **@nakiriknaifuwaifu*

*Asia/Pacific Distributor: **@lemeneid*

*Not sure about Brexit, we will dump that tea cross that bridge when we get there. 

Payment:*

*As stated above there will be a total of three invoices – one for each of the distributors – because we need the customs paperwork to align with the invoice as they are shipped out.

For this reason, we need one person fulfill each of the invoices - Rocky has agreed to take on this role for us.

We will send an update with further payment instructions closer to the date of completion.*






*With that, I’d like to open the signups!*

*Here's how they will work:*

*Please message me (**@nakiriknaifuwaifu**) your information in this*
*~ E X A C T ~*
*format:*





*Title of message: "ORDER - Kamon Massdrop"*​

*Region (NA/EU/APAC):*
*Country:*
*Size: "225mm" or "260mm" (there's no cap on sizes, these knives will be made for you)*






*INFO ON SELECTION: Participants will be randomly chosen (everyone is assigned a number and selected using random.org)

If you are selected, please treat this as ordering a custom knife (because that’s what this is!). We understand if there are circumstances forcing you to withdraw your order - it's still COVID time and that's what the waitlist is for - but for all other cases please try your best to adhere to the honor system.

We will confirm payment when the orders are close to done. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when payment time comes near. 

Thanks,
NKW
*




*~IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT~

SIGN-UPS WILL CLOSE FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 3RD 11:59 PM CET (Central European Standard Time - GMT +1)*


*Results will be made available shortly thereafter!

Please continue to follow this thread for further updates and cool videos! 


My posts are the colorful ones - easy to find and easy to read!*

*Thank you all for your support so far! *​


----------



## lemeneid

To the guys PM-ing me. Please send your requests to @nakiriknaifuwaifu he’s the one to PM if you want to get in on this drop. Sending a PM to me won’t put your name in the draw.


----------



## WiriWiri

Nice one NKN et all the Massdrop peeps, I salute your primaty coloured email and have hereby sent a prosaic, formatted email in hope as requested.

As a Brit, I should be an expert at queuing respectfully. But I am also a chupsty caribbean Londoner bum, of the rushing variety. Protect that pineapple,,,


----------



## mc2442

I am sure @nakiriknaifuwaifu inbox is blowing up right about now. I just shot a PM for a 225MM, fingers crossed.

As the others have stated, thank you all for doing this....I know it ends up being a PITA!

Matt


----------



## tostadas

I'd recommend making a link to the sign up info in the original post at the beginning of the thread. For when this thread inevitably hits like 20+ pages long.


----------



## julestools

Ohhhhh baby. Just discovered this via Ben’s insta. What a gift from the gods!

Pm sent @nakiriknaifuwaifu


----------



## Migraine

Good luck everyone putting their names in the hat. Ben's knives are stunning. You won't be disappointed.


----------



## sansho

apologies in advance if this info isn't helpful...

when i organize group buys on forums etc, what i do is have people fill out a google form (no google account needed).
i collect all the participants' contact and shipping info, product selection, etc. then at the end, i optionally direct them to paypal or whatever.

one thing that's nice about using a form is data validation. if they don't enter something that looks like a valid zip code for example or don't read the directions, errors in data entry can be automatically caught. with strong validation, you can mostly "idiot proof" the data collection process for people who don't read.  optional feature: they can also update their info later via a link that gets emailed to them. say if their shipping address changes. there is also flow logic where the downstream form options change depending on options they pick earlier. say USA vs EU participants may get some different questions. easy to do that.

i have this form info automatically go into google sheets (their web-based version of excel). makes it easy to grab lists for sending emails, drawing raffles if demand exceeds supply, financial accounting, and so on.

for accounting, i manually import CSV from paypal usually. then i key the transactions to the form data via the email address column and do a pivot table for insights. even if there are multiple transactions for some users, it makes it easy to see that everyone's at zero-balance at the end of the event.

when it comes time to ship to participants, it's possible to export the shipping info and put that into your shipping service of choice. in my case, i buy discounted (commercial base rate) USPS shipping labels online and don't have to manually enter the addresses. i just buy and print them in a batch.

if the organizers are curious, i can share past example(s) for consideration in a future event. i think this kind of approach makes organization a lot easier.


----------



## KAMON Knives

I just wanted to link my IG post here to show the sketch of the gyutos in both sized planned so you get a better idea. 



As always - questions? I'm here.


----------



## Gruenburger

How do I participate?


----------



## Simple27

Awesome!


----------



## big_adventure

Gruenburger said:


> How do I participate?



If you go up one page, you'll find a post by @nakiriknaifuwaifu that gives all the information you need.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Thanks @big_adventure Here it is again for folks just joining.



nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Alright ladies and germs, *
> *It’s finally time to open the sign-ups. *
> *Firstly, a massive thank you to @KAMON Knives for this massdrop. We’re incredibly excited to work with him. *
> 
> 
> *HERE IS IMPORTANT INFO ON SHIPPING/PRICE DETAILS AND HOW TO SIGN UP FOR ORDERS:*
> *please read this and then read it again *
> 
> *I’m serious, read it again!
> 
> Here is a recap of the knife specifications:*​
> 
> *Knife: Kamon Kurouchi Denty Wa Gyuto*
> 
> *Size: 225mm x 56mm <or> 260mm x 58mm
> Steel: 1.2519 monosteel construction taken to 65 HRC
> Grind: Convexed to zero (with a thin beveled edge) and a strong distal taper – workhorse in the back, skeleton thin in the front*
> *Handle: removable rokkaku hanmaru construction in bog oak with heirloom aluminum fixtures
> 
> PE Saya will be included
> 
> 
> Pricing:*
> 
> 
> *Size (mm)**Price (Euros)*225 x 56*595*260 x 58*630*
> *
> PLEASE NOTE – THESE ARE PRICES FROM KAMON AND DO NOT INCLUDE SHIPPING, VAT, OR CUSTOMS*
> 
> *THEY DO NOT INCLUDE VAT (where it applies) SHIPPING OR CUSTOMS!!!!!!!!!!*
> 
> *please please please calculate accordingly*
> 
> 
> *Shipping:
> 
> Part of the advantage of these massdrop projects is streamlining things for the smith so they can focus on making the greatest knives they can. Partly for this reason, we will have a maximum of 3 invoices for each of 3 regions: The Americas, Europe, and APAC. *
> 
> *Approximate (READ: APPROXIMATE) duty and S&H fees will be: ~10 - 12% to EU distributor, ~11% to US distributor, and ~10% to APAC distributor. This does not include shipping from distributor to you. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when packages are ready for shipment.
> 
> Europe Distributor: **@RockyBasel*
> 
> *American Distributor: **@nakiriknaifuwaifu*
> 
> *Asia/Pacific Distributor: **@lemeneid*
> 
> *Not sure about Brexit, we will dump that tea cross that bridge when we get there.
> 
> Payment:*
> 
> *As stated above there will be a total of three invoices – one for each of the distributors – because we need the customs paperwork to align with the invoice as they are shipped out.
> 
> For this reason, we need one person fulfill each of the invoices - Rocky has agreed to take on this role for us.
> 
> We will send an update with further payment instructions closer to the date of completion.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *With that, I’d like to open the signups!*
> 
> *Here's how they will work:*
> 
> *Please message me (**@nakiriknaifuwaifu**) your information in this*
> *~ E X A C T ~*
> *format:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Title of message: "ORDER - Kamon Massdrop"*​
> 
> *Region (NA/EU/APAC):*
> *Country:*
> *Size: "225mm" or "260mm" (there's no cap on sizes, these knives will be made for you)*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *INFO ON SELECTION: Participants will be randomly chosen (everyone is assigned a number and selected using random.org)
> 
> If you are selected, please treat this as ordering a custom knife (because that’s what this is!). We understand if there are circumstances forcing you to withdraw your order - it's still COVID time and that's what the waitlist is for - but for all other cases please try your best to adhere to the honor system.
> 
> We will confirm payment when the orders are close to done. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when payment time comes near.
> 
> Thanks,
> NKW
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *~IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT~
> 
> SIGN-UPS WILL CLOSE FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 3RD 11:59 PM CET (Central European Standard Time - GMT +1)*
> 
> 
> *Results will be made available shortly thereafter!
> 
> Please continue to follow this thread for further updates and cool videos!
> 
> 
> My posts are the colorful ones - easy to find and easy to read!*
> 
> *Thank you all for your support so far! *​


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Ok, some people are not following the very clear rules I set out for signing up and it is difficult for me to keep sending PMs asking for resends. Plus, resends clog my inbox. 

I'm very particular about formatting because I need things to be uniform when I sift through 60+ PM's in my inbox and need to make sure I've gotten to everyone. 

Here's how it should look in your inbox before you send the message (but obviously with your information). 







Titles are especially important. Yes I want the caps on the ORDER, yes I want the hyphen between ORDER and Kamon. 

If you've already sent me something different before this message goes up, I will let you know if you need to resend. If you plan on sending me a PM, please please please follow the EXACT formatting instructions. 

Help me help you not lose your place in the massdrop. 

Thank you,
NKW


----------



## sansho

couldn't hurt to link to a few key posts in the OP

namely:

the "how to participate" post
the posts that describe what the knives are and what they'll look like
*edit: i linked what i consider to be the highlights.  *


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

sansho said:


> couldn't hurt to link to a few key posts in the OP
> 
> namely:
> 
> the "how to participate" post
> the posts that describe what the knives are and what they'll look like


*Focus on the journey, not the destination. Joy is found not in finishing an activity but in finding the right page in the thread to sign up for it. 



*


----------



## spyken

KAMON Knives said:


> I've got some mails regarding my latest post here and I thought my answer to especially one mail could be quite interesting and I'll even expand on that a little because I didn't mention some stuff in the answer to the guy writing me the mail but he'll see .
> 
> So the mail was along the lines that one can now better see how my forging is efficient compared to stock removal.
> 
> I just need to explain that this is true under the specs I set out to have on my knives. For example it probably won't make much sense if my knives were only 3mm thick at the thickest part (nothing wrong with that).
> I want that heavy taper though so I'd need use 6mm blanks in stock removal technique and grind the whole blank down and a lot of material and belts along the way. Just to visualize that for you - I'd have to use about 3 times the steel with the stock removal process compared to what I'm using now and about 2/3rds of that would end up beeing steel wool. Carbon steel is nothing that drives the costs higher by an significant amount but stock removal would come with a lot of time spent on the grinder and also using up lots of belts and those two parts are very cost inefficient.
> The belts are expensive on their own but my time is even more expensive so forging at the end of the day saves me time and you as a customer therefore costs to get to what I'd like you to have.
> 
> Also I want to expand a little on the forging process itself so you may get a better picture of that. It's easy for me by now and I guess it looks easy in the videos as I hear that quite often but what's happening is rather complicated and needs some practice to do.
> No need to actually do the following at home but just to imagine: The plastic properties can be simulated at home with some play dough to get a feel for the difficulties. Now everyone knows how easy that stuff is to move to a certain shape but what you've got to do to really get a feel of the difficulties of forging is to try to move that stuff to a certain shape using only blacksmith style tools.
> The steel obviously is harder to move too even when red hot but that's not where your problems come from, but only a time issue. So that makes no difference to the parts that are hard to do at forging but just increases time. The thing that makes forging hard is that you can't hold the blank with your hands and also just move the material with some very rudimentary shaped tools like hammers and dies. So a lot of thinking is involved but once you've got the process and steps figured out its quite easy.
> As a side note also bear in mind that the different forging steps can't be executed in a random progression. There is a totally different and irreversible outcome if you, for example, draw the heel at a different time in relation to drawing out the blade and so on. So that's very important too.
> 
> Hope that draws a clearer picture for you and as always. Any questions welcome.



Ben
Would the knife have the distinct hammer finish (the dimples) like I see in some of your knives? And do you have a reference pic of the saya? thank you


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

spyken said:


> Ben
> Would the knife have the distinct hammer finish (the dimples) like I see in some of your knives? And do you have a reference pic of the saya? thank you


Yes they will be denty finished.

The reference pic of the saya was shared earlier this thread. Check page 3. @sansho did a good job compiling every post please check that too


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

KAMON Knives said:


> I just wanted to link my IG post here to show the sketch of the gyutos in both sized planned so you get a better idea.
> 
> 
> 
> As always - questions? I'm here.




Holy crap! You should sell your sketches!


----------



## KAMON Knives

Like @nakiriknaifuwaifu said you can see that all on page three @spyken. Hope that answered your question. If not pls let me know. 

@HumbleHomeCook: at least two knife makers come spontaneously to mind that do a better job on the sketches/drawings. I'll stick with knife making ;p.


----------



## RockyBasel

For the EU people - I will be shipping the knife from Germany


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Alright ladies and germs, *
> *It’s finally time to open the sign-ups. *
> *Firstly, a massive thank you to @KAMON Knives for this massdrop. We’re incredibly excited to work with him. *
> 
> 
> *HERE IS IMPORTANT INFO ON SHIPPING/PRICE DETAILS AND HOW TO SIGN UP FOR ORDERS:*
> *please read this and then read it again *
> 
> *I’m serious, read it again!
> 
> Here is a recap of the knife specifications:*​
> 
> *Knife: Kamon Kurouchi Denty Wa Gyuto*
> 
> *Size: 225mm x 56mm <or> 260mm x 58mm
> Steel: 1.2519 monosteel construction taken to 65 HRC
> Grind: Convexed to zero (with a thin beveled edge) and a strong distal taper – workhorse in the back, skeleton thin in the front*
> *Handle: removable rokkaku hanmaru construction in bog oak with heirloom aluminum fixtures
> 
> PE Saya will be included
> 
> 
> Pricing:*
> 
> 
> *Size (mm)**Price (Euros)*225 x 56*595*260 x 58*630*
> *
> PLEASE NOTE – THESE ARE PRICES FROM KAMON AND DO NOT INCLUDE SHIPPING, VAT, OR CUSTOMS*
> 
> *THEY DO NOT INCLUDE VAT (where it applies) SHIPPING OR CUSTOMS!!!!!!!!!!*
> 
> *please please please calculate accordingly*
> 
> 
> *Shipping:
> 
> Part of the advantage of these massdrop projects is streamlining things for the smith so they can focus on making the greatest knives they can. Partly for this reason, we will have a maximum of 3 invoices for each of 3 regions: The Americas, Europe, and APAC. *
> 
> *Approximate (READ: APPROXIMATE) duty and S&H fees will be: ~10 - 12% to EU distributor, ~11% to US distributor, and ~10% to APAC distributor. This does not include shipping from distributor to you. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when packages are ready for shipment.
> 
> Europe Distributor: **@RockyBasel*
> 
> *American Distributor: **@nakiriknaifuwaifu*
> 
> *Asia/Pacific Distributor: **@lemeneid*
> 
> *Not sure about Brexit, we will dump that tea cross that bridge when we get there.
> 
> Payment:*
> 
> *As stated above there will be a total of three invoices – one for each of the distributors – because we need the customs paperwork to align with the invoice as they are shipped out.
> 
> For this reason, we need one person fulfill each of the invoices - Rocky has agreed to take on this role for us.
> 
> We will send an update with further payment instructions closer to the date of completion.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *With that, I’d like to open the signups!*
> 
> *Here's how they will work:*
> 
> *Please message me (**@nakiriknaifuwaifu**) your information in this*
> *~ E X A C T ~*
> *format:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Title of message: "ORDER - Kamon Massdrop"*​
> 
> *Region (NA/EU/APAC):*
> *Country:*
> *Size: "225mm" or "260mm" (there's no cap on sizes, these knives will be made for you)*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *INFO ON SELECTION: Participants will be randomly chosen (everyone is assigned a number and selected using random.org)
> 
> If you are selected, please treat this as ordering a custom knife (because that’s what this is!). We understand if there are circumstances forcing you to withdraw your order - it's still COVID time and that's what the waitlist is for - but for all other cases please try your best to adhere to the honor system.
> 
> We will confirm payment when the orders are close to done. Specific shipping costs will be calculated when payment time comes near.
> 
> Thanks,
> NKW
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *~IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT~
> 
> SIGN-UPS WILL CLOSE FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 3RD 11:59 PM CET (Central European Standard Time - GMT +1)*
> 
> 
> *Results will be made available shortly thereafter!
> 
> Please continue to follow this thread for further updates and cool videos!
> 
> 
> My posts are the colorful ones - easy to find and easy to read!*
> 
> *Thank you all for your support so far! *​



*~REMINDER~*

*SIGN-UPS WILL CLOSE FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 3RD 11:59 PM CET (Central European Standard Time - GMT +1)*​

*SIGNUP INFO IS QUOTED ABOVE. Thanks to all who have messaged so far! *









Central European Time - exact time now - Time.is


Exact time now, time zone, time difference, sunrise/sunset time and key facts for Central European Time (CET).




time.is


----------



## TSF415

@coffeelover191919 last chance!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## xsmx13

TSF415 said:


> @coffeelover191919 last chance!!!!!!!!!!



Shhhhh, we don't need more names in the hat!


----------



## Knivperson

Sooon!


----------



## Knivperson

Everybody sees the notification, just to find this message. Sorry guys.


----------



## Delat




----------



## sansho

wow, just from the way it comes out of the bottle, you can tell it's not the same ketchup anymore.
look at the grainy texture of the old stuff. you can see it in the sheen.

the stuff i'm used to is more smooth and syrupy looking.

i wish i could try a bottle of OG heinz to compare. speaking as a ketchup junkie.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*Alright:
Here's Genkai OkiShibe to announce that we're closed for this round!

 ~ HUGE THANKS TO EVERYONE WHO SENT ME A PM ~  

After this time, you are all more than welcome to send me PMs, and you will be added to the end of the waitlist in the order that I receive your messages. *






*Next steps:** 

I will post a list tagging all of those who have signed up sometime soon. If I missed your PM, please respond to me **within 24 hours of my posting** and I will get you on the list.*

*After the list is confirmed, I will use the power of the universe (random.org) to place everyone in order. (I don't like computer algorithm RNGs)*

*The first 35 people will **receive* *a knife, and the **waitlist order will be people 36th place and onwards** (so 36th place = #1 waitlist, and so on)*

*Stay tuned!*



@KAMON Knives
@RockyBasel
@alterwisser
@lemeneid

​


----------



## Nagakin

Good luck to everyone!


----------



## drsmp

@nakiriknaifuwaifu How many KKF members signed up for the lottery?


----------



## toddnmd

TSF415 said:


> @coffeelover191919 last chance!!!!!!!!!!



Nah, he has until next week to


----------



## BillHanna

I mean, why sell thirtyFIVE knives when you can sell thirtySIX?!?

(I think that was his logic last time)


----------



## alterwisser

drsmp said:


> @nakiriknaifuwaifu How many KKF members signed up for the lottery?


 
1 Million!


----------



## lemeneid

alterwisser said:


> 1 Million!


----------



## Knivperson

So the final list is due to after 1.19 am? Should I stay up that late, well knowing my daughter will wake me up at 6 am, insisting we get out of bed? Questions, questions...


----------



## WiriWiri

After 1.19pm? I‘m not convinced by these strict sounding timings. Last time I seem to remember trying to stay up until some ungodly hour, but gave up when NKW disappeared with that fruity pineapple for an indecent amount of time

And besides, ain’t you shooting your massdrop load a bit early anyhoo? Aren‘t they just going to post up the list of entrants first? Think you’ll have a day or so to grumble/pretend/comfirm that you’ve sent a message to NKW and that you’re in for the draw

I’d go to bed if I were you. You may be getting (understandably) excited


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*THIS LIST IS IN ALPHABETICAL ORDER - NO RELATION TO WHO GETS A KNIFE *​
Hello all: 

Here are all the sign-ups I received before the deadline yesterday. 

*IF YOU PM'D ME BEFORE AND I DO NOT HAVE YOU HERE: *please reply to your original PM sent before the deadline and I will add you. 

*IF THERE IS AN ERROR WITH YOUR REGION, COUNTRY, OR SIZE: *please reply to your original PM and I will correct the master sheet.

I will leave this up for 24 hours from posting before beginning to randomize participants. 

Thanks again to everyone who signed up! 

Best,
NKW



UsernameRegionCountrySize@0x0xEUAustria260@AcidwashNAUSA260@Bico DoceNAUSA225@big_adventureEUFrance260@bingoNAUSA225@BodineNAUSA225@CA_cookNAUSA225@CampbellNAUSA225@captaincaedNAUSA225@chuck239NAUSA225@climbclimbNAUSA260@cooktocutNAUSA260@cstratNAUSA260@Dan EAPACHK260@DefinegoodNAUSA225@DelatNAUSA225@demcavNAUSA225@DgilksAPACAus225@drsmpNAUSA260@DurgeNAUSA260@EM-LEUSweden225@esooNACanada225@FishmanDENAUSA225@FroztitanzAPACSG225@GeigsAPACAus225@Giovanny TorresEUUK225@gogogo545EUSweden225@hendrixNAUSA225@Hz_zzzzzzNAUSA225@IkonakaNAUSA225@IupwebbNAUSA225@Jason183NAUSA260@jeff_hK7APACAus225@JoshNACanada225@JoshmonopNAUSA260@julestoolsNAUSA260@julius777APACMalaysia225@JvilleNAUSA260@KeatNAUSA260@killerloopNAUSA225@KnivpersonEUDenmark225@LABAPACHK260@LakeshowNAUSA225@LostHighwayNAUSA225@mc2442NAUSA225@MortenEUDenmark260@MOTigerNAUSA225@msumNAUSA225@new2brewNAUSA225@Nuts63NAUSA225@outofgamutAPACAUS260@PeterLEUFrance225@pleueNAUSA260@pow_powEUGermany225@RepjapsteelNAUSA225@robAPACAus260@rstcsoNAUSA260@Ryan AdkinsNAUSA225@sanshoNAUSA260@SdoEUIreland225@SmiddertonEUGermany225@tally-hoEUFrance225@tchan001APACHK225@thpNAUSA225@Todd762NAUSA225@toddnmdNAUSA225@TonyZNAUSA225@TristanAPACSG260@TSF415NAUSA260@WildBoarNAUSA225@WiriWiriEUUK225@xsmx13NAUSA260@xuryNAUSA225@xxxclxNAUSA225@zeaderanNAUSA225


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Knivperson said:


> So the final list is due to after 1.19 am? Should I stay up that late, well knowing my daughter will wake me up at 6 am, insisting we get out of bed? Questions, questions...


go sleep man, this is just to make sure you're on the list (which you are)


----------



## Knivperson

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> go sleep man, this is just to make sure you're on the list (which you are)




Good night


----------



## WiriWiri

Knivperson said:


> Good night



Good plan to have some beauty sleep today. Tomorrow I suspect you’ll be adding a generous tot of aquavit to your daughter’s bedtime beverage and that you will be staying up into the early hours.


----------



## sansho

for those curious...

75 participants

2/3 wanted 225mm
2/3 NA, 1/3 EU, 1/3 APAC


----------



## Knivperson

WiriWiri said:


> Good plan to have some beauty sleep today. Tomorrow I suspect you’ll be adding a generous tot of aquavit to your daughter’s bedtime beverage and that you will be staying up into the early hours.


Yeah, but everybody from scandinavia adds aquavit to their childrens beverages. And their own. Sleep tight.


----------



## TSF415

I think everyone wanting a 225 should automatically be waitlisted.


----------



## drsmp

@TSF415 Agreed ! Why spend $1000 on a paring knife


----------



## Corradobrit1

The anticipation is killing me and I don't even have a dog in the fight.


----------



## captaincaed

drsmp said:


> @TSF415 Agreed ! Why spend $1000 on a paring knife


Get out!


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

TSF415 said:


> I think everyone wanting a 225 should automatically be waitlisted.


I wanted 260 but 58 feels too tall to me, so eventually signed up for the 225. Can’t have them all.


----------



## spaceconvoy

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> I wanted 260 but 58 feels too tall to me, so eventually signed up for the 225. Can’t have them all.


Your bloodline is weak and you won't survive the winter


----------



## Knivperson

Has anybody else thought of preparing a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list? A sort of palliative purchase, to numb the pain of disappointment?


----------



## Jville

Knivperson said:


> Has anybody else prepared a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list?


Gotta have a plan, right?


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> Has anybody else thought of preparing a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list? A sort of palliative purchase, to numb the pain of disappointment?


I would just cry and purchase more tiramisu, desert or otherwise


----------



## TSF415

Knivperson said:


> Has anybody else thought of preparing a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list? A sort of palliative purchase, to numb the pain of disappointment?


BST will have some deals


----------



## Knivperson

Haha, I've also caugth myself in logical fallacies for the last couple of days, like: "I didn't make it to the Xerxes list, that means I have a bigger chance of making it this time." Like there's a finite amount of bad luck, and I have used up more of it than the ones who made the other massdrop, giving me an advantage this time. 

Clearly this mass drop is slowly pushing me into lunacy.


----------



## Knivperson

Along with the lack of sleep, constant ruminations and all the aquavit.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

sansho said:


> for those curious...
> *2/3* NA, *1/3* EU, *1/3* APAC


More a 5:1:1 ratio of NA to EU to APAC.

@Knivperson stop drinking and go back to sleep


----------



## sansho

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> More a 5:1:1 ratio of NA to EU to APAC.
> 
> @Knivperson stop drinking and go back to sleep



what, you don't like how it totaled to 4/3? lmao

was in a rush out the door when i typed that.


----------



## marc4pt0

I’d say that of the Kamon knives I have, my 230mm one is what gets the most use and travels with me the most. That said, I do love the 255’s I have. And when I was doing larger amounts of prep they would see a bit more use. 
Either size, you’re winning. 
Congrats to those on the list. Especially those who haven’t yet experienced a Kamon blade. His knives are a force to be reckoned with.


----------



## esoo

Knivperson said:


> Has anybody else thought of preparing a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list? A sort of palliative purchase, to numb the pain of disappointment?



I signed up for the Massdrop and then bought two knives - does that count?


----------



## Delat

Knivperson said:


> Has anybody else thought of preparing a rebound knife buy for all the extra money saved, in case one shouldn't be on the list? A sort of palliative purchase, to numb the pain of disappointment?



When I didn’t make the Xerxes drop I spent the thousand bucks on a Yoshikane SKD, a Kurosaki AS, a Hatsukokoro AS, and a Y Kato AS petty instead. I think that one worked out in my favor in the end since I’m really at the start of my knife journey.

If I don’t make this drop I have my eye on a Tanaka Yohei.


----------



## Jville

esoo said:


> I signed up for the Massdrop and then bought two knives - does that count?


Yes


----------



## xsmx13

esoo said:


> I signed up for the Massdrop and then bought two knives - does that count?


Me too, and two bottles of whisky!


----------



## MoabDave

TSF415 said:


> BST will have some deals



Keeping my eye out...


----------



## RockyBasel

Delat said:


> When I didn’t make the Xerxes drop I spent the thousand bucks on a Yoshikane SKD, a Kurosaki AS, a Hatsukokoro AS, and a Y Kato AS petty instead. I think that one worked out in my favor in the end since I’m really at the start of my knife journey.
> 
> If I don’t make this drop I have my eye on a Tanaka Yohei.


The Tanaka yohei in blue 1 is a whole different level- great choice!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

list is being made, will be up <48h *fingers crossed knock on wood 

go to sleep my European friends


----------



## WiriWiri

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> go to sleep my European friends



Yes, mum. Night all!

I’ll be sleeping with absolutely everything tightly crossed tonight. I don’t need any more children (but a Kamon would be nice)


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*MASSDROP SELECTION RESULTS *​
*Hello all: *

*Thank you once again for participating in this third massdrop and for the overwhelming level of interest and support. 

To quickly recap the randomization process, participants were assigned an index, and these indices were ordered using Random.org - a truly random number generator using cosmic background radiation noise. *

*Congratulations to the first 35 who were selected in bold - 36 and onwards is the order of the waitlist!*​
*Username**Region**Country**Size **@lemeneid**APAC**SG**260**@RockyBasel**EU**CHE**260**@nakiriknaifuwaifu**NA**USA**260**@Josh**NA**Canada**225**@cooktocut**NA**USA**260**@killerloop**NA**USA**225**@Froztitanz**APAC**SG**225**@Jville**NA**USA**260**@toddnmd**NA**USA**225**@LostHighway**NA**USA**225**@Hz_zzzzzz**NA**USA**225**@Lakeshow**NA**USA**225**@Nuts63**NA**USA**225**@WildBoar**NA**USA**225**@Tristan**APAC**SG**260**@tchan001**APAC**HK**225**@Morten**EU**Denmark**260**@Jason183**NA**USA**260**@rstcso**NA**USA**260**@gogogo545**EU**Sweden**225**@drsmp**NA**USA**260**@Acidwash**NA**USA**260**@julius777**APAC**Malaysia**225**@Delat**NA**USA**225**@Smidderton**EU**Germany**225**@Knivperson**EU**Denmark**225**@Ikonaka**NA**USA**225**@0x0x**EU**Austria**260**@Sdo**EU**Ireland**225**@Geigs**APAC**Aus**225**@Todd762**NA**USA**225**@rob**APAC**Aus**260**@captaincaed**NA**USA**225**@Dgilks**APAC**Aus**225**@zeaderan**NA**USA**225*@KeatNAUSA260@pow_powEUGermany225@DefinegoodNAUSA225@demcavNAUSA225@BodineNAUSA225@climbclimbNAUSA260@hendrixNAUSA225@WiriWiriEUUK225@Giovanny TorresEUUK225@outofgamutAPACAUS260@chuck239NAUSA225@EM-LEUSweden225@esooNACanada225@Bico DoceNAUSA225@PeterLEUFrance225@DurgeNAUSA260@xsmx13NAUSA260@sanshoNAUSA260@xuryNAUSA225@Ryan AdkinsNAUSA225@big_adventureEUFrance260@Dan EAPACHK260@CampbellNAUSA225@jeff_hK7APACAus225@TSF415NAUSA260@julestoolsNAUSA260@cstratNAUSA260@TonyZNAUSA225@CA_cookNAUSA225@xxxclxNAUSA225@mc2442NAUSA225@LABAPACHK260@IupwebbNAUSA225@bingoNAUSA225@JoshmonopNAUSA260@RepjapsteelNAUSA225@tally-hoEUFrance225@pleueNAUSA260@thpNAUSA225@new2brewNAUSA225@msumNAUSA225@FishmanDE NAUSA225@Slim278NAUSA225@kvstasNAUSA225


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

how should I celebrate tonight.


----------



## FishmanDE

Dang nabbit


----------



## esoo

Well, at least I've got two other knives coming ....


----------



## xxxclx

Alright people let's talk about consolation knives... that Konosuke sumiiro SLD gyuto on sale at Tosho looks pretty sweet


----------



## esoo

xxxclx said:


> Alright people let's talk about consolation knives... that Konosuke sumiiro SLD gyuto on sale at Tosho looks pretty sweet



The Sumiiro line is pretty nice. Going to be putting my Bunka from that line up for sale shortly.


----------



## Knivperson

Woooo!!!!!


----------



## esoo

Now @bryan03 needs to put up for sale the 275 he just showed on Instagram so I can furiously try and drown my knife sorrows in that.


----------



## Jason183

This knife completes my collection, Thank you guys again for organizing this awesome Massdrop.


----------



## TSF415

I’m going to join the voter fraud group now


----------



## EM-L

Congratulations to all the winners!
I hope on better luck next time!?


----------



## WildBoar




----------



## julestools

Congrats to all the winners!


----------



## Bodine

congrats to the winners, I was last on the previous mass drop, although losing I am MOVING UP, LOL.


----------



## McMan

esoo said:


> Now @bryan03 needs to put up for sale the 275 he just showed on Instagram so I can furiously try and drown my knife sorrows in that do the next massdrop.


FTFY


----------



## xsmx13

Today was not my day... Lost the drawing, busted the big screen, had to take my 2 year old in for covid testing, have to keep her home pending results and my air conditioning went out with tomorrow slated to be 104°...


----------



## esoo

McMan said:


> FTFY



All 340 brisket killers ..


----------



## M1k3

TSF415 said:


> I’m going to join the voter fraud group now


----------



## ian

Spacesaver for when I think of something hilarious to say.


----------



## msum

Hooray, I was close to the bottom again. Next time I might make it all the way! Something to aspire to.


----------



## hendrix

Thanks again guys for the efforts of putting on another great mass drop and congratulations to the winners!
Looks like I bombed out again but hey, doesn’t this mean I’ll be successful in the Bloodroot lottery - I mean what are my chances of losing twice in a row? Glad I still remember what learned in my college statistics courses


----------



## Giovanny Torres

Congratulations to the selected ones, I'll be following the process with interest. Now to wait for massdrop no4 lol


----------



## big_adventure

Congrats to the selected. One of these will work for me...


----------



## TonyZ

congrats to the winners, my wallet breathed a sigh of relief.


----------



## DrEriksson

Jason183 said:


> This knife completes my collection,


The lies we tell ourselves.


----------



## Jason183

DrEriksson said:


> The lies we tell ourselves.


LOL, but TBH, this really the last knife I’m looking for, it has the characteristics that I don’t have in my current collection.
1.Monosteel 
2.Workhorse grind at the back
3.High performance pointing tip with killer distal taper


----------



## esoo

esoo said:


> Now @bryan03 needs to put up for sale the 275 he just showed on Instagram so I can furiously try and drown my knife sorrows in that.



Welp that didn't work as I couldn't type in my own credit card number... now onto plan <#>....


----------



## Campbell

Congrats to all the winners! I have a 240 from Benjamin and it is a really fun knife.


----------



## LAB

Dibs on anyone putting this back in market!


----------



## xsmx13

LAB said:


> Dibs on anyone putting this back in market!


I call next in line for any 260s!


----------



## KnightKnightForever

I don't understand these massdrops at all... What are they?


----------



## tostadas

KnightKnightForever said:


> I don't understand these massdrops at all... What are they?







__





Massdrop III: Kamon


Awesome! Really great description Ben, I had not considered that grinding could itself temper the steel accidentally, but you are correct of course, and the water cooling (like an old Porsche engine) is the antidote I am really looking forward to seeing the output🙏🙏🙏




www.kitchenknifeforums.com


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

KnightKnightForever said:


> I don't understand these massdrops at all... What are they?


----------



## Smidderton

Good job explaning. LMAO


----------



## Carl Kotte

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> View attachment 141366


Dear knife Jesus, could you please turn bread into stainless honyaki-san mai?


----------



## spaceconvoy

Open your eyes people!


----------



## toddnmd

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> View attachment 141366


NKW, I really hope you aren’t struck by lightning until AFTER you ship my knife!


----------



## DrEriksson

Jason183 said:


> LOL, but TBH, this really the last knife I’m looking for, it has the characteristics that I don’t have in my current collection.
> 1.Monosteel
> 2.Workhorse grind at the back
> 3.High performance pointing tip with killer distal taper


Take a step back, and consider how an addict would respond. Then look at your answer. 

I just started discussing a custom order with a maker, and I'm considering what knife lengths I have with wa handles. Apparently, I now need a more complete range of wa-gyutos. So the planned order will fit perfectly above my Birgersson wa, and I have a shorter wa planned for the future when another maker has time. Once I have those knives, my collection will be complete... Unless I need integrals in any other length than 270. ;D

*Edit* I might already have a wa longer than my Birgersson, but I'm looking for something a bit lighter. *smh*


----------



## Keat

I'm the first loser/waitlisted. Sorry if this is stated elsewhere, but roughly when will we know about the waitlist? I assume people would drop when it comes time to transfer money...


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Keat said:


> I'm the first loser/waitlisted. Sorry if this is stated elsewhere, but roughly when will we know about the waitlist? I assume people would drop when it comes time to transfer money...


If there is any movement of the waitlist I will reach out to the relevant parties.


----------



## Knivperson

Not to Rush, but out of curiosity, how long does this process take before we have the knife in our hands? Are we talking 6 months? A year?


----------



## LostHighway

Knivperson said:


> Not to Rush, but out of curiosity, how long does this process take before we have the knife in our hands? Are we talking 6 months? A year?



If you have completed 10,000 prostrations and/or one or more of the Camino routes it goes faster.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

LostHighway said:


> If you have completed 10,000 prostrations and/or one or more of the Camino routes it goes faster.


ok yea sure let's go with this


----------



## WildBoar

When I get my knife the game plan is to perform 10,000 castrations


----------



## LostHighway

WildBoar said:


> When I get my knife the game plan is to perform 10,000 castrations



Did you miss the castration bander drop?


----------



## esoo

WildBoar said:


> When I get my knife the game plan is to perform 10,000 castrations



Something Something Mike Rowe Something Something Sheep Something Teeth....


----------



## captaincaed

anagnorisis and peripeteia
That's what I'm going to name my pair of Kamon


----------



## RockyBasel

Keat said:


> I'm the first loser/waitlisted. Sorry if this is stated elsewhere, but roughly when will we know about the waitlist? I assume people would drop when it comes time to transfer money...


You are not a loser, you have deferred success


----------



## esoo

RockyBasel said:


> You are not a loser, you have deferred success



With 12 people on the the waitlist in front of me, that means I need 24 people to give up before I get a knife. That is not deferred success.


----------



## BillHanna




----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

esoo said:


> With 12 people on the the waitlist in front of me, that means I need 24 people to give up before I get a knife. That is not deferred success.


I think you just need 13 to give up?


----------



## esoo

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> I think you just need 13 to give up?



Maybe if it was a Monday, but today is Friday, so I need more....


----------



## CA_cook

Why am I always at the back of the waitlist . Oh, right, it’s a random draw


----------



## WildBoar

Because you are in CA, and you guys are always behind?


----------



## TSF415

WildBoar said:


> Because you are in CA, and you guys are always behind?



We’re actually at the forefront of doing really dumb things and giving up our freedoms.


----------



## TSF415

Oh and that whole technology thing we’re pretty good at too.


----------



## WildBoar

TSF415 said:


> Oh and that whole technology thing we’re pretty good at too.


hey now, we're getting our own Amazon, and we already have a 'tech corridor' that's a whole mile or two long  I think we are only trailing the Bay area in shear number of Teslas. Plus we got politicians! Lots and lots of politicians! And lots of people who work for them! (yeah, that part sucks -- it messes up a nice place to live )


----------



## RockyBasel

spaceconvoy said:


> View attachment 141370
> 
> 
> Open your eyes people!


You nailed it,


----------



## Delat

Anyone know if Kamon sells handles separately? I poked around on his website and didn’t see it mentioned, but it seems like he goes to so much effort to make the handles swappable that it would be a wasted opportunity (assuming the profit margin is at least equal to his complete knives). I would love to get a handle “the Dark Lord himself would use” but would never want to swap in a non-OEM handle given it’s part of the signature unique look.


----------



## Hockey3081

Delat said:


> Anyone know if Kamon sells handles separately? I poked around on his website and didn’t see it mentioned, but it seems like he goes to so much effort to make the handles swappable that it would be a wasted opportunity (assuming the profit margin is at least equal to his complete knives). I would love to get a handle “the Dark Lord himself would use” but would never want to swap in a non-OEM handle given it’s part of the signature unique look.



No dice - at least not if he isn’t making the second handle at the same time he’s making the blade and first handle. For this mass drop I don’t believe he’s making second handles.


----------



## Delat

Hockey3081 said:


> No dice - at least not if he isn’t making the second handle at the same time he’s making the blade and first handle. For this mass drop I don’t believe he’s making second handles.



I wasn’t really asking as part of this massdrop, but in general. I was wondering/hoping if I could buy a 2nd handle afterwards. 

I expect the answer is no since he doesn’t mention it on his website, but hope springs eternal.


----------



## Hockey3081

Delat said:


> I wasn’t really asking as part of this massdrop, but in general. I was wondering/hoping if I could buy a 2nd handle afterwards.
> 
> I expect the answer is no since he doesn’t mention it on his website, but hope springs eternal.


Totally get it and maybe I didn’t articulate it properly. Ben may correct me but I think [logistically] he would have to have your blade in hand to make the second handle to ensure a precise fit as no 2 blades are the same. Whether or not he offers the option after the fact, he would have to clarify.


----------



## KAMON Knives

That's correct @Hockey3081. For the handle fit up I need the knife with me. It's still precise but made by hand and therefore fitted individually to a certain blade.

The organization of this mass drop will make it too confusing to deliver the knives with a second handle I fear @Delat. That is really for several reasons regarding the organization around the making and packing of the knives but also the distribution which I don't do in this case. 
However in general for a custom knife, a second handle is an option I offer. The reason for why I don't mention it on my website is because the changing handle part is not really the intended use of my handles beeing a take down construction but since they can be taken down anyways, it's an option.


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives do you plan to post pictures now and then of the knives in different stages of the process?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Definitely @Knivperson! I'll share different important and/or interesting stages on my Instagram and then link them here. I think that should work?

As I said I'm very excited about that project. My reasons for excitement are probably different than those of prospect customers though. The customer will get a finished knife and mostly look forward to that instead of the process behind the making. 
However my main focus lies on how to plan the different stages out and when to do what. Not only will it need a lot of discipline to pull off, as at times making so many of the same knives can be challenging due to repetition, but also will need a well thought through plot to be efficient and not loose too much time because of a lack of organization. 

But I don't worry too much. In fact technically speaking I've already started with the mass drop knives. I've been partly sourcing the materials necessary 2 weeks ago so I'm good in time . I'll finish the batch which is on my workbench right now and then start with the mass drop knives as long as everything I need arrives in time.


----------



## WiriWiri

Ah well, I can‘t pretend not to be slightly envious - I took NKW‘s ’go to sleep’ advice to heart, necked a load of vallies and woke up 3 days later with no Kamon joy - but best wishes to the lucky winners who made the cut this time around. Sounds a cracking knife in prospect and Mr Ben K seems well engaged with the whole process.

I guess I can be afford to be magnanimous, as London‘s leading psychic* assured me that my Massdrop perfect knife would be on the way pronto - my destiny was set with the Xerxes misfortune, but fate cannot be denied (she said amongst cackles)

I’ve taken that to mean that some sort of Final Destination thing may well happen here, that the time line of fate will brutally correct in my favour. I am eighth on the waitlist after all, which may just be doable - the people on here do tend to have a lot of sharp hazards at home, so the Grim Reaper is unlikely to have to be too inventive on this mission. 

Still, in the very unlikely event that the hand of fate is denied here, I can always console myself with the knowledge that I wouldn’t have been truly satisfied until I tried a Kamon S-Grind anyhow



*Mad Brenda from the pub


----------



## xsmx13

So Massdrop reveal day was a sad one. My little one got sick (now much better and running around like her usual crazy person self), my HVAC system died (goodbye $11,000.00) with 104-105° temps in the forecast, and... I ended up way down the list for the knife I want more than any other... a 260mm Kamon denty finish gyuto. So when faced with such circumstances, what is a knife addict to do? Be thankful I wasn't on the hook for a knife with a big expense looming? Nah... I went the self-medicating route! Actually, this was partially customs that came at the right time, but I have to say, this Markin wx-15 (52100 equivalent) came out amazing. If you haven't check out his work, do it, it's well worth the wait and amazing in its own right.

For those of you who won the lottery, enjoy! Kamon's work is nothing short of amazing. I'll probably begin anew my search for a denty gyuto come next payday.


----------



## RockyBasel

I think somebody needs to write a country song - “on the list again” or “the day I lost my denty”

I am sure we can willie Nelson to sing them and drown our blues


----------



## M1k3

RockyBasel said:


> I think somebody needs to write a country song - “on the list again” or “the day I lost my denty”
> 
> I am sure we can willie Nelson to sing them and drown our blues


Man in Black was written for this moment.


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives I must know: will the mass drop knives come with your beautiful, signature blueish tang?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Very good question @Knivperson. The answer is yes, they'll have the tempering colors at the tang in front of the handle.

I totally forgot to mention that as I by default I leave those tempering colors on the knife. Just if I get asked for them to be removed for a custom or a knife I feel they don't look as good, I polish them off. That's probably why I didn't mention them in the first place. Thanks for reminding me.


----------



## Knivperson

This is very exciting. Thanks.


----------



## Migraine

Anyone who has them polished off is a maniac.


----------



## Delat

I really like the colors at the tang from tempering, but I’m hoping someone can explain it to me? Like why they’re only in that particular area? I had assumed they were discoloration from welding the tang, but now I’m wondering about it since Kamon says it’s from tempering.


----------



## xsmx13

Delat said:


> I really like the colors at the tang from tempering, but I’m hoping someone can explain it to me? Like why they’re only in that particular area? I had assumed they were discoloration from welding the tang, but now I’m wondering about it since Kamon says it’s from tempering.



I believe the tang is tempered to reduce the hardness and tension of the steel there at the juncture with the handle. No advantage to hardened steel that I can think of at this part of the knife.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Delat said:


> I really like the colors at the tang from tempering, but I’m hoping someone can explain it to me? Like why they’re only in that particular area? I had assumed they were discoloration from welding the tang, but now I’m wondering about it since Kamon says it’s from tempering.




@xsmx13 is pretty much right about that. To make sure I get the most toughness and least hardness out of that part, I just temper the tang very high with a gas torch in a separate operation after heat treatment. That way I can assure that the tang would bend instead of break in case of abuse. Additionally I don't quench the tang region during hardening but the 1.2519 will still harden to a certain amount on air due to its high alloying contents of chrome. 
I've never had any problems with a bent or broken tang yet, but still you never know and in case that ever happens for whatever reason a bend is safer than a break.

As for the colors, that's just like all tempering colors, some kind of oxidation. The higher the temperature, the thicker the oxide layer becomes and therefore changes color in relation to the heat that was applied. Therefore you can estimate the temperature a certain material was tempered if you know what material it is. Essentially the same happens to stainless steel at way higher temperatures or titanium for example when it is heat anodized. 
Here you can see a handle made from timascus. That's pattern welded titanium consisting of three different titanium alloys that oxidize differently at a certain temperature due to its different alloying contents - therefore the different colors of the layers. 

Regarding my knives I just decided to leave the colors on the material by default, but even if you not see them as I polished them off, the tang is always tempered. And I think some knives really look better without the colors. For the mass drop knives I prefer colors as the knife would get to be too black and white otherwise. But here is an example of two knives I wouldn't like the colors as much.


----------



## Delat

KAMON Knives said:


> @xsmx13 is pretty much right about that. To make sure I get the most toughness and least hardness out of that part, I just temper the tang very high with a gas torch in a separate operation after heat treatment. That way I can assure that the tang would bend instead of break in case of abuse. Additionally I don't quench the tang region during hardening but the 1.2519 will still harden to a certain amount on air due to its high alloying contents of chrome.
> I've never had any problems with a bent or broken tang yet, but still you never know and in case that ever happens for whatever reason a bend is safer than a break.
> 
> As for the colors, that's just like all tempering colors, some kind of oxidation. The higher the temperature, the thicker the oxide layer becomes and therefore changes color in relation to the heat that was applied. Therefore you can estimate the temperature a certain material was tempered if you know what material it is. Essentially the same happens to stainless steel at way higher temperatures or titanium for example when it is heat anodized.
> Here you can see a handle made from timascus. That's pattern welded titanium consisting of three different titanium alloys that oxidize differently at a certain temperature due to its different alloying contents - therefore the different colors of the layers.
> 
> Regarding my knives I just decided to leave the colors on the material by default, but even if you not see them as I polished them off, the tang is always tempered. And I think some knives really look better without the colors. For the mass drop knives I prefer colors as the knife would get to be too black and white otherwise. But here is an example of two knives I wouldn't like the colors as much.




Thank you so much for the explanation! I love the thought that custom makers like yourself put into your work. Learning about all these little details is why I love this hobby.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Thanks @Delat. And truly I love talking about it . 
I have a website for the basic Infos and look to make at least some posts on my social media informative too but of course often times what is basic to me just passes me as beeing interesting to someone else. Also probably there is way too much info in general to cover on social media or probably even a website. 

So I appreciate your question and can only encourage others to ask too if they are unclear about anything as I think one can never know enough about a topic that interests them.

As a general rule I try to talk as much technical stuff about my work as possible. Even though I don't expect everyone to understand what goes into my knives I think the appreciation for the product overall just raises once people recognize how much thought and work I put into it. So I'm very aware of the importance of communicating all that, yet sometimes I need to be pushed in the right direction so thx again .


----------



## Delat

Grabbed this off @KAMON Knives instagram. Congratulations on getting the cover!


----------



## captaincaed

Congrats @RicardoVilar!


----------



## KAMON Knives

Let the games begin.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

@KAMON Knives

*r u done yet plz*


----------



## pow_pow

40 knives  Maybe good for the people on the waiting list


----------



## KAMON Knives

pow_pow said:


> 40 knives  Maybe good for the people on the waiting list


----------



## rstcso

Woo Hoo! I got a first glimpse of my new KAMON!


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives I'm all excited now, once again, which makes me wonder.

1. What does "rokkaku hanmaru" mean? Never heard this before.

2. What do you think make 1.2519 steel a good choice? People compared it to blue 2 earlier in this thread - how did you end up using this out of all the steels available for knife making? Curious to your thought process and considerations.

3. It's a monosteal - does that mean differentially hardened or "equally hardened" - if it's taken to that high a hardness as prescribed and equally hardened, what does that mean with regard to brittleness/fragileness?


----------



## drsmp

rokkaku hanmaru = shield shape / octagonal top with rounded bottom


----------



## lemeneid

KAMON Knives said:


> Let the games begin.



Don’t you mean “let the (squid) games begin”? 
With the survivor getting all 40 knives


----------



## Jason183

Knivperson said:


> @KAMON Knives I'm all excited now, once again, which makes me wonder.
> 
> 1. What does "rokkaku hanmaru" mean? Never heard this before.
> 
> 2. What do you think make 1.2519 steel a good choice? People compared it to blue 2 earlier in this thread - how did you end up using this out of all the steels available for knife making? Curious to your thought process and considerations.
> 
> 3. It's a monosteal - does that mean differentially hardened or "equally hardened" - if it's taken to that high a hardness as prescribed and equally hardened, what does that mean with regard to brittleness/fragileness?



Monosteel doesn’t bent easily, if you try to bent a Monosteel blade, it will bounce back, if you try to bent sanmai blade, it will stay bent.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> @KAMON Knives I'm all excited now, once again, which makes me wonder.
> 
> 1. What does "rokkaku hanmaru" mean? Never heard this before.
> 
> 2. What do you think make 1.2519 steel a good choice? People compared it to blue 2 earlier in this thread - how did you end up using this out of all the steels available for knife making? Curious to your thought process and considerations.
> 
> 3. It's a monosteal - does that mean differentially hardened or "equally hardened" - if it's taken to that high a hardness as prescribed and equally hardened, what does that mean with regard to brittleness/fragileness?



1. To my knowledge rokkaku hanmaru means something like squared top, rounded bottom. That shape refers to the cross section of the handle as the upper part of the handle has 5 faceted surfaces and the bottom part has a round or oval shape. 
I'm by far no Japanese expert so that's only what I've learned from several knife related sources and translated it from its German description to English. I'm no English expert either so that could be a bad mix xD. 
@drsmp isn't necessarily wrong either as you get the idea from his description, although octagonal means 8 surfaces which a rokkaku hanmaru handles doesn't really have. But I could be very nitpicky right now and also I have no clue if the English translation isn't really exactly what he said ;p. 

2. First of all availability plays a huge role. There are steels out there that would potentially be very interesting to the audience here, yet barely anybody here ever heard of them. The reasons for that can be several. For example it could be that they aren't produced anymore, or were ever just product as a small prototype batch and never produced again, or are just not or hardly available in the given market (like some Russian or Japanese steels). 
1.2519 at the time was available to me. 
The reason for why it was interesting to me in the first place is due to its alloying contents. The analysis of my batch of 1.2519 says it has got C 1.10%, W 1,25%, Cr 1,19%, Mn 0,27%, Si 0,20%, V 0,19%. The biggest advantage opposed to the Japanese aogami is in my opinion that 1.2519 is an oil hardening tool steel instead of water like aogami is. So you can reach full hardness with reasonable slow quenching methods not risking too many fails, yet using full potential of the steel without having to quench in water. 
With P 0,012% and S 0,004% it's also reasonably clean which is important for its properties too. 
Then of course there are the other reasons like the fine and hard carbides tungsten forms and the advantages tungsten brings in the heat treatment like keeping the grain structure small. Chrome also makes for some carbides and is the main reason in this alloy combo for the steel to be a oil hardening steel. 
All those factors make up for me beeing able to harden this steel to ~65hrc tempered for good wear resistance, yet not risking it to be brittle (which many of my customers confirmed). 

3. Good question. Since I don't quench the tang and about 1cm of the tang before/outside the handle, technically speaking it's differentially hardened. The whole cutting section of the blade, with the exception of a little spot at the tang is equally hardened though. 
What that means @Jason183 described very good. The blade will be flexible to some extent, but it won't plastically deform. 
What I like about the mono steels aspect is that corrosion isn't that big of a problem as it is with mild steel or wrought iron. Some customers even asked me if I accidentally used stainless steel for their knives. But of course a patina will Form on them and all the other precautions necessary for carbon steel in general, are necessary for my knives too. 
Long story short - you as a customer won't have any disadvantages from the fact that my knives are mono steel. If anything, in my very opinion, it only has advantages. If you don't perform an ABS 90° bend test with my blade, you won't ever be able to break it in half or anything like that. 
But let me state clear that this shouldn't be a diss to a San Mai construction. I know many knife makers that use the San Mai process to reach some quality benefits of their own which they wouldn't be able to produce in mono steel. Want to state very clear that I always just talk about my knives with my methods and processes. 



lemeneid said:


> Don’t you mean “let the (squid) games begin”?
> With the survivor getting all 40 knives



I mean... We can do that but know that I'm going into this with 40 knives. What've you got?


----------



## WildBoar

KAMON Knives said:


> I mean... We can do that but know that I'm going into this with 40 knives. What've you got?


40 knives? That's cute.

I remember when I only had 40 knives.

Scratch that -- it was so long ago I actually don't remember it that well


----------



## KAMON Knives




----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> What I like about the mono steels aspect is that corrosion isn't that big of a problem as it is with mild steel or wrought iron. Some customers even asked me if I accidentally used stainless steel for their knives. But of course a patina will Form on them and all the other precautions necessary for carbon steel in general, are necessary for my knives too.
> Long story short - you as a customer won't have any disadvantages from the fact that my knives are mono steel. If anything, in my very opinion, it only has advantages. If you don't perform an ABS 90° bend test with my blade, you won't ever be able to break it in half or anything like that.
> But let me state clear that this shouldn't be a diss to a San Mai construction. I know many knife makers that use the San Mai process to reach some quality benefits of their own which they wouldn't be able to produce in mono steel. Want to state very clear that I always just talk about my knives with my methods and processes



If I could replace all my blades with exact monosteel versions, it would be done in a heartbeat. I've only ever seen corrosion on the cladding, so it would be so much nicer. And for some reason I just.love monosteel better. I know it is harder to thin, but I can always pay someone else to do that


----------



## Acidwash

I hope these are denty denty. Like really really denty.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Not much else to say here.


----------



## Knivperson

At this rate, they'll be finished before the end of the month.

I'm curious, does one use a bigger blade blank for the 260 than the 255mm? On the original bench photo, they looked kinda similar in size.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Haha I fear not @Knivperson. I always say that, even though my knives are fully forged, not just textured, the forging only takes up about 10% of the time spent in making them.

For example - making the handle fit including engraving in the tang takes up about an equal amount I'd say. But you won't even see much of that in a before/after picture. There are many other steps that raise the quality but barely change the looks.

Regarding your question: the 225mm blanks have 42mm width and the 260mm blanks have 44mm width. So there is a difference but I guess from the pics one can't tell. With the forged blanks it should be visible I think.


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives One of the side benefits from this mass drop is how much I learn about the process of hand making a knife. Not only will we end up with a fantastic product, well also know a lot about how it came to be. I really like this aspect - so much more than just ordering a knife.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update. 

This is after forging the blank to its overall size but before I forge in the texture. Next post with more info.


----------



## TSF415

I’m developing a large case of FOMO


----------



## Knivperson

Being handforged, they are so similar, testifying to your skills. On MD4, there seems to be some numbers? Why? Sorry for asking so much.

Very exciting this!


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

It feels so good seeing my knife being made step by step. I love this massdrop!! Super grateful for the organizers and Kamon!!


----------



## xsmx13

TSF415 said:


> I’m developing a large case of FOMO


Right?! Still super cool to follow along. Thanks for sharing @KAMON Knives !


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> Being handforged, they are so similar, testifying to your skills. On MD4, there seems to be some numbers? Why? Sorry for asking so much.
> 
> Very exciting this!



Haha nothing gets missed here . 

I've had a colleague of mine, Mr. Tobias Hangler, ask for some distal taper measurements as forged for a little project we're having. 
Btw If you don't know him - check him out. He's got a degree in metallurgy and makes knives. Great ambitions and really someone I appreciate to talk about all stuff knife making.

If you're curious about the measurements I took, I could upload the picture. I don't need to upload to a foreign website and link here but directly upload here, is that Correct?


----------



## captaincaed

Yes you can directly upload to the forum


----------



## KAMON Knives

Here are the measurements as forged in mm.


----------



## Delat

Very cool to see the distal taper forged right in to such a fine degree. I would’ve expected it to be much more rough.


----------



## Jovidah

KAMON Knives said:


> 2. First of all availability plays a huge role. There are steels out there that would potentially be very interesting to the audience here, yet barely anybody here ever heard of them. The reasons for that can be several. For example it could be that they aren't produced anymore, or were ever just product as a small prototype batch and never produced again, or are just not or hardly available in the given market (like some Russian or Japanese steels).
> 1.2519 at the time was available to me.
> The reason for why it was interesting to me in the first place is due to its alloying contents. The analysis of my batch of 1.2519 says it has got C 1.10%, W 1,25%, Cr 1,19%, Mn 0,27%, Si 0,20%, V 0,19%. The biggest advantage opposed to the Japanese aogami is in my opinion that 1.2519 is an oil hardening tool steel instead of water like aogami is. So you can reach full hardness with reasonable slow quenching methods not risking too many fails, yet using full potential of the steel without having to quench in water.
> With P 0,012% and S 0,004% it's also reasonably clean which is important for its properties too.
> Then of course there are the other reasons like the fine and hard carbides tungsten forms and the advantages tungsten brings in the heat treatment like keeping the grain structure small. Chrome also makes for some carbides and is the main reason in this alloy combo for the steel to be a oil hardening steel.
> All those factors make up for me beeing able to harden this steel to ~65hrc tempered for good wear resistance, yet not risking it to be brittle (which many of my customers confirmed).
> 
> 3. Good question. Since I don't quench the tang and about 1cm of the tang before/outside the handle, technically speaking it's differentially hardened. The whole cutting section of the blade, with the exception of a little spot at the tang is equally hardened though.
> What that means @Jason183 described very good. The blade will be flexible to some extent, but it won't plastically deform.
> What I like about the mono steels aspect is that corrosion isn't that big of a problem as it is with mild steel or wrought iron. Some customers even asked me if I accidentally used stainless steel for their knives. But of course a patina will Form on them and all the other precautions necessary for carbon steel in general, are necessary for my knives too.
> Long story short - you as a customer won't have any disadvantages from the fact that my knives are mono steel. If anything, in my very opinion, it only has advantages. If you don't perform an ABS 90° bend test with my blade, you won't ever be able to break it in half or anything like that.
> But let me state clear that this shouldn't be a diss to a San Mai construction. I know many knife makers that use the San Mai process to reach some quality benefits of their own which they wouldn't be able to produce in mono steel. Want to state very clear that I always just talk about my knives with my methods and processes.


Hah... this sounds familiar. I have a Robert Herder K5 that's also a monosteel in 1.2519 and I had a similar 'is it really carbon?' experience. Ended up deliberately slacking on the cleaning just so it would take a patina.  I have some gripes with the knife, but I would happily have every single knife in my house made out of that steel! 
Monosteel IMO is a massive advantage. It just has better cutting feedback, and with that steel I never had the remotest worry about it being fragile or brittle. On top of that there's no issues with hyperreactive cladding.

Thanks for giving me lack-of-buying-remorse... 



esoo said:


> If I could replace all my blades with exact monosteel versions, it would be done in a heartbeat. I've only ever seen corrosion on the cladding, so it would be so much nicer. And for some reason I just.love monosteel better. I know it is harder to thin, but I can always pay someone else to do that


Ditto; I vastly prefer the cutting feedback of monosteels. I actually wished the Japanese would stop bothering with all the sanmai and make more of the fancy knives in monosteel.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update including a little nerd talk


----------



## Bodine

I note there are 40 blanks, I would assume this is in case you need extra blanks to make sure you have enough. What are the "odds" you get 40 knives out of 40 blanks?


----------



## KAMON Knives

You're absolutely right about that @Bodine and I can tell in a few days after hardening


----------



## Lakeshow

thx for the great updates and education, makes a lotta sense. hope the hardening process goes flawlessly.


----------



## marc4pt0

Anybody saying "oh I can see mine!" yet?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Don't confuse the ppl @marc4pt0 ;p.

Actually... I don't know if I've said that before - the knives will be marked with a number and the letters MD. So for example the first knife will be MD01 and so on. However I'll pack them up just saying 225 or 260 for the massketeers so there will be no choice for the individual meaning that MD01 won't be for the first person on the list.

Nevertheless I chose to mark them as the mass drop knives not to devalue them or anything like that. They have the same quality as if you'd order the same design as a custom knife. I've rather decided to do so as I think the knives "deserve" to be remembered as beeing part of that mass drop. I may be a little romantic here but I love the thought of one of those knives, in some decades, ending up in someone's hand which maybe then can research what it is and how it came about. Not marking them as mass drop knives would feel like I won't do them justice.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

KAMON Knives said:


> Don't confuse the ppl @marc4pt0 ;p.
> Nevertheless I chose to mark them as the mass drop knives not to devalue them or anything like that.


This is now a limited edition with an ID on it. I can only see it increase its collection value. Really appreciate that!


----------



## Knivperson

Will it also have your usual makers mark stamp? @KAMON Knives


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> Will it also have your usual makers mark stamp? @KAMON Knives



Of course! Double sided as usual. I'd rather die than not brand my blades xD.

The MDXX will be engraved to the tang alongside the hardness, production date, steel grade and FSB (fluidized Sand bed) and CRYO.


----------



## Knivperson

The information on the tang will be interesting for the archaeologists excavating my viking styled grave 500 years from now.


----------



## daddy yo yo

Knivperson said:


> The information on the tang will be interesting for the archaeologists excavating my viking styled grave 500 years from now.


I am the Dark Lord of Kamon and it will be me opening your Viking grave in 500 years, Highlander-style. With every Kamon I gather from this massdrop, I’ll gain more power!!!


----------



## Knivperson

daddy yo yo said:


> I am the Dark Lord of Kamon and it will be me opening your Viking grave in 500 years, Highlander-style. With every Kamon I gather from this massdrop, I’ll gain more power!!!


In my grave you will also find my custom Isasmedjan blade, enchanted with magic viking runes, intended to protect my grave from thieves and put a curse on all other users of the blade than it's rightful owner!!


----------



## daddy yo yo

Knivperson said:


> In my grave you will also find my custom Isasmedjan blade, enchanted with magic viking runes, intended to protect my grave from thieves and put a course on all other users of the blade than it's rightful owner!!


I don’t care, I am THE DARK LORD OF KAMON!!!


----------



## Knivperson

daddy yo yo said:


> I don’t care, I am THE DARK LORD OF KAMON!!!


I see the curse is already taking effect


----------



## marc4pt0

KAMON Knives said:


> Don't confuse the ppl @marc4pt0 ;p.
> 
> Actually... I don't know if I've said that before - the knives will be marked with a number and the letters MD. So for example the first knife will be MD01 and so on. However I'll pack them up just saying 225 or 260 for the massketeers so there will be no choice for the individual meaning that MD01 won't be for the first person on the list.
> 
> Nevertheless I chose to mark them as the mass drop knives not to devalue them or anything like that. They have the same quality as if you'd order the same design as a custom knife. I've rather decided to do so as I think the knives "deserve" to be remembered as beeing part of that mass drop. I may be a little romantic here but I love the thought of one of those knives, in some decades, ending up in someone's hand which maybe then can research what it is and how it came about. Not marking them as mass drop knives would feel like I won't do them justice.



oh. My initials are MD, and I live in MD. So I just thought these were all for me. And now you’re saying they’re NOT? 
What the Fudge Ben


----------



## WildBoar

I thought MD was for "Marc, don't!", as in "Marc, don't buy more knives!"


----------



## BillHanna

"Marc, DO!"


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

MD36: Marc, Don’t buy 36 more knives! It’s ok to buy 35 though.


----------



## gregfisk

And I thought MD was for “More Dents”


----------



## captaincaed

KAMON Knives said:


> Of course! Double sided as usual. I'd rather die than not brand my blades xD.
> 
> The MDXX will be engraved to the tang alongside the hardness, production date, steel grade and FSB (fluidized Sand bed) and CRYO.



What about the steel's element percentages, and a small periodic table showing the location of the elements? I thought you Austrians were detail oriented, geez...


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> What about the steel's element percentages, and a small periodic table showing the location of the elements? I thought you Austrians were detail oriented, geez...



Actually we're all just pretending and corrupt AF. Didn't you know? ;p


----------



## captaincaed

KAMON Knives said:


> Actually we're all just pretending and corrupt AF. Didn't you know? ;p



I've been duped!


----------



## Knivperson

What is FSB? Sounds dangerous.


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> What is FSB? Sounds dangerous.


Front Side Bus
/nerd


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> What is FSB? Sounds dangerous.





Although I just use it for hardening


----------



## Geigs

KAMON Knives said:


> Although I just use it for hardening



I also just used it for hardening...


----------



## Knivperson

M1k3 said:


> Front Side Bus
> /nerd


I don't like public transportation at all.


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> I don't like public transportation at all.


It's all integrated now.*




*The Front side bus/memory controller.... Bad CPU run on joke...


----------



## Knivperson

M1k3 said:


> *The Front side bus/memory controller.... Bad CPU run on joke...


I know, just playing along. Universal serial bus, right?


----------



## daddy yo yo

M1k3 said:


> It's all integrated now.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Front side bus/memory controller.... Bad CPU run on joke...


How 'bout COVID? I hear it's quite dangerous to get infected with a virus there... One needs protection!


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> The information on the tang will be interesting for the archaeologists excavating my viking styled grave 500 years from now.


I’m getting cremated with my knives, that way they get a second round of HT and become honyaki, even the stainless ones


----------



## WildBoar

daddy yo yo said:


> One needs protection!


That's what the knives are for...


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> I know, just playing along. Universal serial bus, right?


DIP switches. DIP switches as far as the COM Port can see.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update


----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> Update ✌




the more I see of these posts, the more sad I am that I'm in the 13th spot down on the wait list.


----------



## Knivperson

esoo said:


> the more I see of these posts, the more sad I am that I'm in the 13th spot down on the wait list.


Self torture i think


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update


----------



## Knivperson

Wooo been waiting for an update


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives For us noobs. Could you expand on what soft anneal and normalizing is and what it does? If you have the time. And why do you do it the way you do compared to other methods?


----------



## daddy yo yo

KAMON Knives said:


> Update



„_underwear changing heavy_“


----------



## Smidderton

Yeah, that knife rig looks crazy heavy.
on another note: @KAMON I read somewhere you like using honing rods with 1.2519. Would you recommend the dick micro?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> @KAMON Knives For us noobs. Could you expand on what soft anneal and normalizing is and what it does? If you have the time. And why do you do it the way you do compared to other methods?



Not quite sure what you mean by other methods as normalizing and soft annealing is pretty much always the same I'd say ^^. Now you need to help me out pls ;p. 

With the normalizing one just accomplishes a good quality baseline of the steel. In the process the grain structure usually gets refined but another important factor is that the steel is brought to an consistent overall state throughout all blades. That's important as the forging is done on eye sight. With the inconsistent amounts of heat applied to the steel for inconsistent amounts of time and inconsistent forging, every knife out of the forged state has another baseline. You want to equal them all so you end up with overall equally good results and not a range of results. 
Let me say though... The forging is all done by eye sight yet it's relatively consistent given that fact. But we want the temperature controlled +-2°C furnace and time taken to a few seconds kind of consistent. 

The soft annealing is just so the steel can be machined in various ways. It makes it soft again. I'll get into how exactly it is important to me and my process in later posts but that's the general idea. 



Smidderton said:


> Yeah, that knife rig looks crazy heavy.
> on another note: @KAMON I read somewhere you like using honing rods with 1.2519. Would you recommend the dick micro?



Yes! I've got that advice from Marco Guldimann so all credit to him for that! 
The F. Dick Dickoron Micro works wonders with my knives. Afaik it's hard chrome plated with a surface hardness of 70hrc so that's why it works at all at 65hrc steels.
Why it works so good is because this thing in incredibly fine and barely abrasive. If you go with your finger nails over it, it will just feel like a smooth steel surface so fine is it. Nothing like the steel's one usually knows.
The big advantage in my opinion is exactly that. It's barely abrasive yet will make your knife kitchen towel cutting sharp again. I'm using my knives at home cooking 3-5 big meals a week for a good year before I go to the stones. 

I know those steels got a very bad reputation in the US but they really work great for carbon steels. Higher alloyed steels barely or not at all due to the bigger amount of carbides in those steels but for carbon steels it's a dream and imho the best overall option. Not very time consuming to do. Not bad for the knife. No maintenance of the steel (opposed to a strop). Very good results. And no... I'd don't get anything from them. 
The only bad thing is the name although... Micro dick... I mean it's so bad it's almost good again. I love my micro dick. Had to be said.


----------



## M1k3

KAMON Knives said:


> Not quite sure what you mean by other methods as normalizing and soft annealing is pretty much always the same I'd say ^^. Now you need to help me out pls ;p.
> 
> With the normalizing one just accomplishes a good quality baseline of the steel. In the process the grain structure usually gets refined but another important factor is that the steel is brought to an consistent overall state throughout all blades. That's important as the forging is done on eye sight. With the inconsistent amounts of heat applied to the steel for inconsistent amounts of time and inconsistent forging, every knife out of the forged state has another baseline. You want to equal them all so you end up with overall equally good results and not a range of results.
> Let me say though... The forging is all done by eye sight yet it's relatively consistent given that fact. But we want the temperature controlled +-2°C furnace and time taken to a few seconds kind of consistent.
> 
> The soft annealing is just so the steel can be machined in various ways. It makes it soft again. I'll get into how exactly it is important to me and my process in later posts but that's the general idea.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes! I've got that advice from Marco Guldimann so all credit to him for that!
> The F. Dick Dickoron Micro works wonders with my knives. Afaik it's hard chrome plated with a surface hardness of 70hrc so that's why it works at all at 65hrc steels.
> Why it works so good is because this thing in incredibly fine and barely abrasive. If you go with your finger nails over it, it will just feel like a smooth steel surface so fine is it. Nothing like the steel's one usually knows.
> The big advantage in my opinion is exactly that. It's barely abrasive yet will make your knife kitchen towel cutting sharp again. I'm using my knives at home cooking 3-5 big meals a week for a good year before I go to the stones.
> 
> I know those steels got a very bad reputation in the US but they really work great for carbon steels. Higher alloyed steels barely or not at all due to the bigger amount of carbides in those steels but for carbon steels it's a dream and imho the best overall option. Not very time consuming to do. Not bad for the knife. No maintenance of the steel (opposed to a strop). Very good results. And no... I'd don't get anything from them.
> The only bad thing is the name although... Micro dick... I mean it's so bad it's almost good again. I love my micro dick. Had to be said.








Amazon.com: Dick Titan Sharpening Steel Length: 30cm (12"). Oval: Knife Sharpeners: Home & Kitchen


Online shopping for Kitchen Knives & Accessories from a great selection of Cutlery Sets, Specialty Knives, Sharpeners, Cutting Boards, & more at everyday low prices.



www.amazon.com


----------



## KAMON Knives

M1k3 said:


> Amazon.com: Dick Titan Sharpening Steel Length: 30cm (12"). Oval: Knife Sharpeners: Home & Kitchen
> 
> 
> Online shopping for Kitchen Knives & Accessories from a great selection of Cutlery Sets, Specialty Knives, Sharpeners, Cutting Boards, & more at everyday low prices.
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com



I personally don't know that one. Seems it might be good for higher alloyed steel due to its higher hardness but I just need to make clear that this is not the one I'd recommend for my knives. Just so no one gets confused .

This is the one I'd recommend to anybody interested in trying:






F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300 : Amazon.de: Küche, Haushalt & Wohnen


Amazon.de: Küchen- und Haushaltsartikel online - F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300. F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300.



www.amazon.de


----------



## M1k3

KAMON Knives said:


> I personally don't know that one. Seems it might be good for higher alloyed steel due to its higher hardness but I just need to make clear that this is not the one I'd recommend for my knives. Just so no one gets confused .
> 
> This is the one I'd recommend to anybody interested in trying:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300 : Amazon.de: Küche, Haushalt & Wohnen
> 
> 
> Amazon.de: Küchen- und Haushaltsartikel online - F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300. F. DICK Wetzstahl DICKORON Micro (Superfeinzug mit Klingenlänge 30 cm, Oval, 65 HRC) 75003300.
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.de


That option feels weird to say though. My option is bigger


----------



## KAMON Knives

M1k3 said:


> That option feels weird to say though. My option is bigger



Which option are we talking about now?


----------



## TSF415

M1k3 said:


> That option feels weird to say though. My option is bigger



But is yours as hard?


----------



## M1k3

KAMON Knives said:


> Which option are we talking about now?









TSF415 said:


> But is yours as hard?


Harder than @KAMON Knives


----------



## KAMON Knives

M1k3 said:


> View attachment 147741
> 
> 
> Harder than @KAMON Knives



I harden it to 65hrc and made many ppl happy with it... Wait what?


Filthy forum


----------



## RDalman

KAMON Knives said:


> I harden it to 65hrc and made many ppl happy with it... Wait what?
> 
> 
> Filthy forum


I have my hardness tester located in the bedroom. Just felt it was my time to chime in here


----------



## KAMON Knives

RDalman said:


> I have my hardness tester located in the bedroom. Just felt it was my time to chime in here



You say that as if that was your choice though


----------



## RDalman

KAMON Knives said:


> You say that as if that was your choice though


I wanted to keep it in the livingroom, but gf forced it into the bedroom


----------



## LostHighway

RDalman said:


> I wanted to keep it in the livingroom, but gf forced it into the bedroom



Does this mean we should be referring to you as "Denty" Dalman?


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Not quite sure what you mean by other methods as normalizing and soft annealing is pretty much always the same I'd say ^^




I was thinking about FSB as I learned earlier in this thread. But thank you for the explanation


----------



## gregfisk

You knife makers sure are proud of your tools.


----------



## Knivperson

RDalman said:


> I wanted to keep it in the livingroom, but gf forced it into the bedroom


Do you ever experience spontaneous "soft annealing" and do your gf also use force in that case?


----------



## captaincaed

gregfisk said:


> You knife makers sure are proud of your tools.


Only a poor workman blames his tools


----------



## ian

captaincaed said:


> Only a poor workman blames his tools



It’s not the tool or the technique, actually, but the connection you have with your product that matters.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update



Just because I've been asked about it by some anonymous and totally random guy on IG () - the nakiri shaped thing on the bottom middle of my work bench is my master template for my tangs and choils. Not a nakiri blank or a broken blade .


----------



## TSF415

So who wants to give me their spot?


----------



## Knivperson

Will be very interesting to see the next transformation on the grinder


----------



## xsmx13

KAMON Knives said:


> Update
> 
> 
> 
> Just because I've been asked about it by some anonymous and totally random guy on IG () - the nakiri shaped thing on the bottom middle of my work bench is my master template for my tangs and choils. Not a nakiri blank or a broken blade ✌.




I think that person needs a denty nakiri.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

xsmx13 said:


> I think that person needs a denty nakiri.


yeah, that person needs a denty nakiri for sure


----------



## M1k3

TSF415 said:


> So who wants to give me their spot?


At least you're not trying to add on an additional one


----------



## lemeneid

TSF415 said:


> So who wants to give me their spot?


@coffeelover191919 ???


----------



## climbclimb

Wondering if the waitlist has a shot - 40 is a few more than originally planned?


----------



## spaceconvoy

gregfisk said:


> You knife makers sure are proud of your tools.


I was just thinking, why is it that all the Massdrop threads eventually take this phallological turn?


----------



## captaincaed

Because you're all sickos


----------



## Ruso

spaceconvoy said:


> I was just thinking, why is it that all the Massdrop threads eventually take this phallological turn?


Knifes are hard, pointy and make people happy! I am surprised more threads don't end like that.


----------



## esoo

Ruso said:


> Knifes are hard, pointy and make people happy! I am surprised more threads don't end like that.



So where does that leave @nakiriknaifuwaifu and the nakiri crew? No point there....


----------



## Jovidah

Also explains the Japanese obsession with san-mai blades.... Thrusting something hard between two soft layers...


----------



## KAMON Knives

I see. It doesn't take much to trigger you guys into pervert talk either. So it's not just us crazy knife makers right @RDalman? 



climbclimb said:


> Wondering if the waitlist has a shot - 40 is a few more than originally planned?



35 blades were planned so I'm making sure I'll deliver 35 in any case. That includes potential fails during the making. So I made 40 to get to 35 no matter what. Chances are I'll get all 40 through, then there will be 5 for the list.


----------



## Jovidah

Why not just flip them on BST? I'm sure Kamon007 could get a pretty penny for them...


----------



## KAMON Knives

Jovidah said:


> Why not just flip them on BST? I'm sure Kamon007 could get a pretty penny for them...



Who's Kamon007? My fake account ?


----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> 35 blades were planned so I'm making sure I'll deliver 35 in any case. That includes potential fails during the making. So I made 40 to get to 35 no matter what. Chances are I'll get all 40 through, then there will be 5 for the list.



Still 7 places out....


----------



## Bodine

5 places out, be very careful please Mr. Kamon


----------



## drsmp

@KAMON Knives 007 - Bond, James Bond . 
Your secret agent alter ego or a dig at a recently infamous flipper of one of your knives


----------



## WiriWiri

Bodine said:


> 5 places out, be very careful please Mr. Kamon



Only three places behind you (43) and beginning to dream. Not to stereotype, but that clean workshop, through organisation and Austrian efficiency bode well for those 40 blades (and you)

Still, I’m regretting mentioning that fate/final destination stuff earlier on. I have no hotline through to the Reaper, but someone should have a word if they can. I’d hate for him to overshoot.



PS; Sorry about any misfortune in advance
PPS: I’d be happy with either a 225 or 260


----------



## Ruso

esoo said:


> So where does that leave @nakiriknaifuwaifu and the nakiri crew? No point there....


I feel sorry for them. No point, no direction…


----------



## demcav

If one's name were to come up on the waitlist and only one size is available, would (s)he be offered the size available regardless of the size originally requested? Or would the next person requesting the size available be given preference?


----------



## esoo

At this point, I would take either length...


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

demcav said:


> If one's name were to come up on the waitlist and only one size is available, *would (s)he be offered the size available regardless of the size originally requested?*



Yes. This is so that choosing the less common size does not give an increased probability of waitlist success.

If there are multiple knives we will go in order of waitlist, and you can choose to accept or decline. If only one size is available and it's not the size you chose, you will still get a choice to accept the slot.


----------



## demcav

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> If there are multiple knives we will go in order of waitlist, and you can choose to accept or decline. If only one size is available and it's not the size you chose, you will still get a choice to accept the slot.



Thank you -- #4 on the waitlist!


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

KAMON Knives said:


> Update:




so many knaifu waifus


----------



## RockyBasel

They look great Ben - plan is coming together!


----------



## captaincaed

OK, Ben, I have to ask. Most knifemakers I know use a 2x72 inch belt grinder (that's freedom units, I think it translates to a 180x5cm in non-freedom units). You are one of the only makers I've seen that uses a wide belt for the rough grind. Using a belt wider than the work piece makes sense to me in terms of precision. Do you have any idea why it's less commonly used? Are you able to get a full variety of belts for the larger belt sander you use?

Just thought of this since you're doing handle/tang work, I presume on the 2x72 grinder.


----------



## gregfisk

I have a similar question as well. I would be very interested in seeing how you use your large belt sander with water cooling. I’m a rookie kitchen knife maker who uses a custom self made 2x72 and I’m very curious how you use your sander and how it works.


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> OK, Ben, I have to ask. Most knifemakers I know use a 2x72 inch belt grinder (that's freedom units, I think it translates to a 180x5cm in non-freedom units). You are one of the only makers I've seen that uses a wide belt for the rough grind. Using a belt wider than the work piece makes sense to me in terms of precision. Do you have any idea why it's less commonly used? Are you able to get a full variety of belts for the larger belt sander you use?
> 
> Just thought of this since you're doing handle/tang work, I presume on the 2x72 grinder.



Very good question and I'll try to answer from top to bottom. 

So first off - you're right 2x72" is pretty much the standard with knife makers and the metric measurements translate to about what you've said. In Europe the standard belt size for knife makers belt grinders is 2000x50mm which is more something like 2x79".

A knife makers belt grinder is that commonly used as it's very adaptable/flexible with all its attachments and the not so wide belts enhance this. One could run into problems sculpting handles with the 120mm (~5") wide belts I use for my water cooled blade grinding. So in that context those common knife makers belt grinders make total sense and I use one for handle grinding too. 

However if one can afford another grinder it makes sense in my opinion to have a dedicated one for the blade grinding which then uses wider belts. The surface gets more evenly plain. On that note I have to say though that I don't quite understand the decisions many knife makers make, as I would also recommend water cooled grinding. Not only for quality reasons which are obvious, but also for their own financial good. I understand it's a somewhat high monetary and time consuming investment to build such a machine but from an economical point of view it pays off quite fast. 
I guess there are many misconceptions about water cooled grinding and many don't seem to see the potential. As I said, not only for the quality of one's product, but also the potential as a business. So I can't answer that question for you fully as I don't quite understand it either. 

An explanation for why I have this machine could be that I ruined many blades in the very beginning of my knife making. That was with a grinder that was always running at 40m/s (very fast... no way to run it slow) and I had no clue about good and sharp belts either. 
However that experience was so depressing for me that I knew very early on that I never wanted to deal with the option of overheating a blade, that is ground to essentially zero at the edge, again. And I accomplished that objective. I can now grind up to 400 grit all day long applying pressure to the blade until it's gone without the danger of overheating the steel. I guess other knife makers have more talent in that regards not ruining so many blades with the wrong grinders and worn out belts . 

For my big grinder I can get any belts and quality I want. Only restriction is that I have to buy 20 pieces of one quality. But I mean they don't get bad so it's just an investment and not lost money to buy more. Btw you can buy those belts in any ridiculous size. The company's that produce them, like VSM where I buy, are so used to producing any measurements that they don't even charge anything for "uncommon" measurements. If you buy the minimum order quantity you're good. 



gregfisk said:


> I have a similar question as well. I would be very interested in seeing how you use your large belt sander with water cooling. I’m a rookie kitchen knife maker who uses a custom self made 2x72 and I’m very curious how you use your sander and how it works.



Since this post I updated this Grinder with a VFD and a 2,5kw motor. The max speed it 20m/s now. You'll get the idea though.


----------



## captaincaed

Very cool, thank you! I've been wood working for a few years, and I agree that heat is the enemy. I can burn through more saw and planer blades from soft, sticky pine than from harder woods like maple, purely because of the heat build-up from the pine resin. I wish I could use my tools water cooled! Somehow, I think that would end poorly... Have you found that water cooled belts last any longer than non-water cooled, or is their failure-mode independent of heat?

Glad to hear the belts are a non-issue.


----------



## ian

KAMON Knives said:


> Very good question and I'll try to answer from top to bottom.
> 
> So first off - you're right 2x72" is pretty much the standard with knife makers and the metric measurements translate to about what you've said. In Europe the standard belt size for knife makers belt grinders is 2000x50mm which is more something like 2x79".
> 
> A knife makers belt grinder is that commonly used as it's very adaptable/flexible with all its attachments and the not so wide belts enhance this. One could run into problems sculpting handles with the 120mm (~5") wide belts I use for my water cooled blade grinding. So in that context those common knife makers belt grinders make total sense and I use one for handle grinding too.
> 
> However if one can afford another grinder it makes sense in my opinion to have a dedicated one for the blade grinding which then uses wider belts. The surface gets more evenly plain. On that note I have to say though that I don't quite understand the decisions many knife makers make, as I would also recommend water cooled grinding. Not only for quality reasons which are obvious, but also for their own financial good. I understand it's a somewhat high monetary and time consuming investment to build such a machine but from an economical point of view it pays off quite fast.
> I guess there are many misconceptions about water cooled grinding and many don't seem to see the potential. As I said, not only for the quality of one's product, but also the potential as a business. So I can't answer that question for you fully as I don't quite understand it either.
> 
> An explanation for why I have this machine could be that I ruined many blades in the very beginning of my knife making. That was with a grinder that was always running at 40m/s (very fast... no way to run it slow) and I had no clue about good and sharp belts either.
> However that experience was so depressing for me that I knew very early on that I never wanted to deal with the option of overheating a blade, that is ground to essentially zero at the edge, again. And I accomplished that objective. I can now grind up to 400 grit all day long applying pressure to the blade until it's gone without the danger of overheating the steel. I guess other knife makers have more talent in that regards not ruining so many blades with the wrong grinders and worn out belts .
> 
> For my big grinder I can get any belts and quality I want. Only restriction is that I have to buy 20 pieces of one quality. But I mean they don't get bad so it's just an investment and not lost money to buy more. Btw you can buy those belts in any ridiculous size. The company's that produce them, like VSM where I buy, are so used to producing any measurements that they don't even charge anything for "uncommon" measurements. If you buy the minimum order quantity you're good.
> 
> 
> 
> Since this post I updated this Grinder with a VFD and a 2,5kw motor. The max speed it 20m/s now. You'll get the idea though.




Omg, that’s incredible.


----------



## captaincaed

You gotta get one @ian, your collection isn't complete yet!


----------



## gregfisk

Thanks Ben! That is a very different grinding experience than grinding on a 2”x72” dry belt. I suppose you get used to having water pouring over your blade as you’re shaping it? I would think that having a wider belt would lend itself to a more even grind. I have to say that I do find the constant burning of my fingers and having to dip the blade in water a bit annoying while doing my work. Thanks again for taking the time to explain what you do. -Greg


----------



## ian

captaincaed said:


> You gotta get one @ian, your collection isn't complete yet!



No using the c word!


----------



## captaincaed

Collection? Complete? Captain? Caed? .... Cursive? (I know how you math teachers are)


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> Have you found that water cooled belts last any longer than non-water cooled, or is their failure-mode independent of heat?
> 
> Glad to hear the belts are a non-issue.



Hard to tell for me as I don't have much to compare to. What I can say though is that I can use dull belts too if I want to. For one I can simply use a belt longer with somewhat reasonable life in it, which would pretty surely be already too dull for dry grinding. 
Also I use the old "dull" belts to grind out the rough shape of my end caps (sry for the messed up sound). I can't tell if the belts actually hold up for longer though. 




gregfisk said:


> Thanks Ben! That is a very different grinding experience than grinding on a 2”x72” dry belt. I suppose you get used to having water pouring over your blade as you’re shaping it? I would think that having a wider belt would lend itself to a more even grind. I have to say that I do find the constant burning of my fingers and having to dip the blade in water a bit annoying while doing my work. Thanks again for taking the time to explain what you do. -Greg



Yeah the water flowing over the blade can be irritating at first. For better vision I have 3 led spots with 2k lumen each installed above my head. Also I make sure the edge part of the thick (yet to grind) blade blank is freshly ground and therefore reflecting the light good. Btw... It's also important to grind the edge part of the blade after heat treatment to get rid of any potential decarb from the hardening. 
Also I grind guided so holding an angle isn't an issue for me. I just have to see the thickness of the blade which you can see through the water quite good under those circumstances. Plus I have absolutely no talent whatsoever grinding free hand. I appreciate the consistency of my guided jig grinding but I admire the craftsmanship of knife makers making incredible looking s-grinds or chisel grinds free hand (Oatley for example comes to mind). 
Let me point out though that free hand grinding isn't really an option with a fully water cooled grinder. The water, moving at 20m/s as it gets catched up by the belt, has a lot of kinetic energy and without a work rest, will simply tear any part out of your hands immediately. I learned the hard way back when I first tested this setup a few years back thinking I could simply hold the blade like the Japanese on their rotating stones .
With mist grinding it's different.


----------



## daddy yo yo

Guys, if you stop asking Ben so many questions your knives will be finished earlier because he doesn’t have to spend hours answering all these questions…


----------



## KAMON Knives

daddy yo yo said:


> Guys, if you stop asking Ben so many questions your knives will be finished earlier because he doesn’t have to spend hours answering all these questions…



Do you really think I would work instead? I'd probably make much more senseless things. You know me .


----------



## daddy yo yo

KAMON Knives said:


> Do you really think I would work instead? I'd probably make much more senseless things. You know me .


Yeah, like writing messages or having a beer with me...  Oh, by the way, it is 08:23 (a.m.), almost time for the first (?) beer of the day!


----------



## Knivperson

If we hurry through this, desire will just reset faster. This must be drawn out.


----------



## RockyBasel

Ahhh…I love these mass-drops


----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> Do you really think I would work instead? I'd probably make much more senseless things. You know me .



I wish you said pointless as I have a joke for that.....


----------



## Delat

daddy yo yo said:


> Guys, if you stop asking Ben so many questions your knives will be finished earlier because he doesn’t have to spend hours answering all these questions…



These massdrops remind us that knifemakers aren’t working at a factory making widgets then going home to the wife and kids. They’re actually crazy people even more knife-obsessed than us making knives all day and then going home to browse knife forums while the wife complains they forgot to take out the trash again


----------



## gregfisk

Ben, thanks again for being so informative about what you do. I’m certain that everyone here appreciates it, perhaps for different reasons Being a newish knife maker I really appreciate the processes that you use. I’m especially intrigued by your out of the box approach with your water cooled grinder and how you grind your knives the way you do. Now you have me thinking about a new design for a grinder with cooling abilities. I really get tired of having burnt fingers.


----------



## RockyBasel

With each Massdrop, I am learning so much …


----------



## xsmx13

RockyBasel said:


> With each Massdrop, I am learning so much …


Seriously, I would pay for the info shared in this chain if I had to. When is the mass drop book of knife knowledge coming out?


----------



## WildBoar

xsmx13 said:


> When is the mass drop book of knife knowledge coming out?


You are late to the party -- it's already fully subscribed. But you can join the waiting list. You are #1,438.


----------



## RockyBasel

LMAO - perfect!


----------



## xsmx13

WildBoar said:


> You are late to the party -- it's already fully subscribed. But you can join the waiting list. You are #1,438.


Damn, I got demoted from #17 on the wait list?!


----------



## Knivperson

Kamon just wrote me. The reason why we haven't seen a new update yet is that his dog unfortunately ate all the mass drop blanks. He has to start all over now. Be patient yall. Best wishes.


----------



## killerloop

Knivperson said:


> Kamon just wrote me. The reason why we haven't seen a new update yet is that his dog unfortunately ate all the mass drop blanks. He has to start all over now. Be patient yall. Best wishes.



Here's a pic of benji and his dog going on an evening walk..


----------



## Knivperson

killerloop said:


> Here's a pic of benji and his dog going on an evening walk..


While that is Bens habitual appearance, the dog turned into that thing after consuming the knives. Sad, sad story.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Haha sry guys. Too many holidays in Austria and me beeing a lazy .

Update:


----------



## demcav

Question regarding payment for massdrop:
Is PayPal the preferred form of payment for a massdrop? My understanding is that there is a PayPal fee that KKF B/S/T sellers normally pay. In the case of the massdrop, as a buyer, should we plan to pay a PayPal fee in addition to the cost of knife/shipping/customs? If so, can someone please tell me what to expect in the way of a fee -- is it a percentage?

Want to get funds in place for when the time comes.

Thanks!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

demcav said:


> Question regarding payment for massdrop:
> Is PayPal the preferred form of payment for a massdrop? My understanding is that there is a PayPal fee that KKF B/S/T sellers normally pay. In the case of the massdrop, as a buyer, should we plan to pay a PayPal fee in addition to the cost of knife/shipping/customs? If so, can someone please tell me what to expect in the way of a fee -- is it a percentage?
> 
> Want to get funds in place for when the time comes.
> 
> Thanks!


We're still working on the details, more info to come closer to completion


----------



## tally-ho

I have always admired the profession of blacksmith, more particularly bladesmithing, probably because it has a very long history with a transfer of knowledges from generation to generation with many improvements along its history.
This thread is a treasure and a torture when you didn't make into the list.


----------



## gregfisk

I agree this thread is a treasure. When you have makers like Ben providing such valuable information about how he approaches his craft you can’t help but be taken in. I didn’t sign up for a knife but as a hobbyist knife maker I’m enthusiastically following along.


----------



## RockyBasel

Half the fun is actually hearing the philosophy of the smith and seeing the knives come together step by step


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives I'm very disappointed that you are not actually making your own knives, but a bladesmith called chefknives11 are.


----------



## Knivperson

I was surprized as well, @nakiriknaifuwaifu. Just have a look:

Chef Knives på Instagram: “Handmade forged Damascus chef knife, wood handle comes with Leather sheath.. Top Quality Products World wide shipping by DHL express For…”


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> @KAMON Knives I'm very disappointed that you are not actually making your own knives, but a bladesmith called chefknives11 are.



Could you please stop making public that I buy my knives in Pakistan? 

Seriously though... I'm sure 30+ people reported this dude and he's still on. It's quite depressing.

What's interesting and somewhat worrying is the fact that this kind of folks will offer you finished knives or blanks for sale and they persistent even when I tell them I'm not interested. I wonder what their success rate is as they target knife makers as it seems and it happens often (once a month or so). 
Also I hear that from other knife makers too and if all of them would always say no, they wouldn't target us I'd think so they have to have some success with it. 
On the other hand... If any knife maker would say yes and sell this garbage the scene would immediately see and recognize. So I don't get how they operate at all.


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Could you please stop making public that I buy my knives in Pakistan?
> 
> Seriously though... I'm sure 30+ people reported this dude and he's still on. It's quite depressing.
> 
> What's interesting and somewhat worrying is the fact that this kind of folks will offer you finished knives or blanks for sale and they persistent even when I tell them I'm not interested. I wonder what their success rate is as they target knife makers as it seems and it happens often (once a month or so).
> Also I hear that from other knife makers too and if all of them would always say no, they wouldn't target us I'd think so they have to have some success with it.
> On the other hand... If any knife maker would say yes and sell this garbage the scene would immediately see and recognize. So I don't get how they operate at all.


Interesting. But, as you see, me (trintorsel) and others, probably from here (comments exploded after I posted here), are calling him out. The scene/community will recognize - and stand up.


----------



## brimmergj

So what you're all really trying to say is... I should buy this?
I promise to only cut some paper, leave my thumb print stamp of approval as a superb cutter and then sell (not flip, practically give it away) for $900 or trade for a different Kamon that matches my socks better?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Was late yesterday and it's not really any new info. Just a picture showing the taper a little better.

Mr. Funny Taper Face incoming.


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Was late yesterday and it's not really any new info. Just a picture showing the taper a little better.
> 
> Mr. Funny Taper Face incoming.



Any idea how hard they turned out? Crazy consistency btw. Looking good. Whats the next step?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> Any idea how hard they turned out? Crazy consistency btw. Looking good. Whats the next step?



They're not hardened in this picture yet but they'll have 65hrc +-1hrc. 

I don't test every single blade but since my processes are all controlled (temperature controlled kiln, temperature controlled quenching oil, taking the time in all processes to a few seconds, same batch of steel for all knives, temperature controlled air convection tempering oven to +-1°C (very special and very important as I learned from Tobias Hangler)), I only occasionally test batches and confirm the process. Didn't have any variations there so far so I think the process is dialed in quite good.


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> They're not hardened in this picture yet but they'll have 65hrc +-1hrc.
> 
> I don't test every single blade but since my processes are all controlled (temperature controlled kiln, temperature controlled quenching oil, taking the time in all processes to a few seconds, same batch of steel for all knives, temperature controlled air convection tempering oven to +-1°C (very special and very important as I learned from Tobias Hangler)), I only occasionally test batches and confirm the process. Didn't have any variations there so far so I think the process is dialed in quite good.


This amount of control really speaks to me. My wife is going nuts when I make coffee, weighing off 16 grams of beans and grinding, pouring 30 grams of water at 100 degrees on waiting 30 second, timed, and pouring 220 grams more over 90 seconds.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update: hardening done. Pretty sure 40 will be available.


----------



## RockyBasel

Thanks Ben, illuminating as always. And what an effort you put in for the hardening phase - look forward to the next phase

This mass-drop is one for the ages. Best news is more people will get knives

As they used to say in an old beer advert for Old Milwaukee beer (which I have had plenty of in my college days and can verify)

“It don’t get better than this”


----------



## big_adventure

KAMON Knives said:


> Update: hardening done. Pretty sure 40 will be available.




Ben, this is an incredible journey that you're bringing everyone through. I wish I were getting one.


----------



## TSF415

So who wants to give me their spot


----------



## RockyBasel

Hi guys, as an organizer, please give up your spot immediately to @TSF415 

hey, never hurts to ask


----------



## M1k3

TSF415 said:


> So who wants to give me their spot


@coffeelover191919


----------



## sansho

i'll trade with him. would probably move me up the list.


----------



## big_adventure

I mean, Ben only needs to make like 27 more and I'm getting one!


----------



## captaincaed

If I hate mine, I'll be sure to write


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*~Roll Call~*​
Firstly, happy happy news there are* now a total of 40 knives! 
Thank you @KAMON Knives!!!*
*The following are the people from the original list who will be receiving a knife: *


*@nakiriknaifuwaifu*NAUSA2601*@RockyBasel*EUCHE2602*@lemeneid*APACSG2603*@Josh*NACanada2254*@cooktocut*NAUSA2605*@killerloop*NAUSA2256*@Froztitanz*APACSG2257*@Jville*NAUSA2608*@toddnmd*NAUSA2259*@LostHighway*NAUSA22510*@Hz_zzzzzz*NAUSA22511*@Lakeshow*NAUSA22512*@Nuts63*NAUSA22513*@WildBoar*NAUSA22514*@Tristan*APACSG26015*@tchan001*APACHK22516*@Morten*EUDenmark26017*@Jason183*NAUSA26018*@gogogo545*EUSweden22519*@drsmp*NAUSA26020*@Acidwash*NAUSA26021*@julius777*APACMalaysia22522*@Delat*NAUSA22523*@Smidderton*EUGermany22524*@Knivperson*EUDenmark22525*@Ikonaka*NAUSA22526*@0x0x*EUAustria26027*@Sdo*EUIreland22528*@Geigs*APACAus22529*@Todd762*NAUSA22530*@rob*APACAus26031*@captaincaed*NAUSA26032*@Dgilks*APACAus22533*@zeaderan*NAUSA22534

*The following users from the waitlist are eligible for a knife: *
*Waitlist folks - 
PM ME (@nakiriknaifuwaifu) TO ACCEPT OR DECLINE YOUR SPOT ASAP!*

*[DEADLINE TO ACCEPT/DECLINE IS FRIDAY NOV. 19TH]*

*please and thank you ^^*


*@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow C*EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav*NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine C *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb*NAUSA*260*40

*To all users: If for any reason you would no longer like to remain on this list - no worries at all - please PM me ASAP so I can contact the next spot on the waitlist. *

*Further **time-sensitive** announcements regarding payment and shipping coming sooooooon!*


Thanks,
NKW


----------



## Bodine

Sheds a tear, someone enjoy that 260 too long for me.


----------



## captaincaed

Moved to PM


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

* ~ Breaking News ~ 

Estimated Time of Completion will be DECEMBER 
woooooooooooooooooooooooo @KAMON Knives @RockyBasel @lemeneid @alterwisser 
Further information on payment will be sent out this week

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE*
*keep an eye on this thread for further announcements *
*watch for the large font and fun colors and cows - easy to pick out, easy to read *​
*Waitlist stuff: *


*@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow - confirmed *EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood - confirmed*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav - confirmed *NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine - confirmed *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb - confirmed*NAUSA*260*40

*@Keat and @Definegood, please reply before Friday to accept/decline your spot. 

That's all for now folks, see you later this week with payment info. *

Best,
NKW


----------



## RockyBasel

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> * ~ Breaking News ~
> 
> Estimated Time of Completion will be DECEMBER
> woooooooooooooooooooooooo @KAMON Knives @RockyBasel @lemeneid @alterwisser
> Further information on payment will be sent out this week
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE*
> *keep an eye on this thread for further announcements *
> *watch for the large font and fun colors and cows - easy to pick out, easy to read *​
> *Waitlist stuff: *
> 
> 
> *@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow - confirmed *EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav - confirmed *NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine - confirmed *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb - confirmed*NAUSA*260*40
> 
> *@Keat and @Definegood, please reply before Friday to accept/decline your spot.
> 
> That's all for now folks, see you later this week with payment info. *
> 
> Best,
> NKW


If anyone knows, @Keat ams @Definegood, please give them a heads up (or not)


----------



## Jville

I’ll speak for #41, “not.”


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## captaincaed

This dude drills.

Are these all heat treated to 65 HRC as well? It doesn't feel like it's a real Kamon knife without a Rockwell divot on the handle end cap, after all.


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> This dude drills.
> 
> Are these all heat treated to 65 HRC as well? It doesn't feel like it's a real Kamon knife without a Rockwell divot on the handle end cap, after all.



You know homeopathy? It works like that. Take a soft end cap, put it near hardened steel, punch it 3 times on a leather pad and viola... End cap has 65hrc and is marked as such.

Kidding aside though - it's just simple stainless steel. Essentially the same stuff you butter knives and forks are made of.


----------



## Jovidah

Damascus butter knife massdrop when?


----------



## Definegood

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> * ~ Breaking News ~
> 
> Estimated Time of Completion will be DECEMBER
> woooooooooooooooooooooooo @KAMON Knives @RockyBasel @lemeneid @alterwisser
> Further information on payment will be sent out this week
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE*
> *keep an eye on this thread for further announcements *
> *watch for the large font and fun colors and cows - easy to pick out, easy to read *​
> *Waitlist stuff: *
> 
> 
> *@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow - confirmed *EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav - confirmed *NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine - confirmed *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb - confirmed*NAUSA*260*40
> 
> *@Keat and @Definegood, please reply before Friday to accept/decline your spot.
> 
> That's all for now folks, see you later this week with payment info. *
> 
> Best,
> NKW





nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> * ~ Breaking News ~
> 
> Estimated Time of Completion will be DECEMBER
> woooooooooooooooooooooooo @KAMON Knives @RockyBasel @lemeneid @alterwisser
> Further information on payment will be sent out this week
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE*
> *keep an eye on this thread for further announcements *
> *watch for the large font and fun colors and cows - easy to pick out, easy to read *​
> *Waitlist stuff: *
> 
> 
> *@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow - confirmed *EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav - confirmed *NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine - confirmed *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb - confirmed*NAUSA*260*40
> 
> *@Keat and @Definegood, please reply before Friday to accept/decline your spot.
> 
> That's all for now folks, see you later this week with payment info. *
> 
> Best,
> NKW


I accept my stop with pleasure. Thank you! Can you please confirm that you do not need anything else from me at this point


nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> * ~ Breaking News ~
> 
> Estimated Time of Completion will be DECEMBER
> woooooooooooooooooooooooo @KAMON Knives @RockyBasel @lemeneid @alterwisser
> Further information on payment will be sent out this week
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE*
> *keep an eye on this thread for further announcements *
> *watch for the large font and fun colors and cows - easy to pick out, easy to read *​
> *Waitlist stuff: *
> 
> 
> *@Keat*NAUSA*260*35*@pow_pow - confirmed *EUGermany*225*36*@Definegood*NAUSA*225*37*@demcav - confirmed *NAUSA*225*38*@Bodine - confirmed *NAUSA22539*@climbclimb - confirmed*NAUSA*260*40
> 
> *@Keat and @Definegood, please reply before Friday to accept/decline your spot.
> 
> That's all for now folks, see you later this week with payment info. *
> 
> Best,
> NKW


I accept my spot with pleasure. Thanks!


----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> Kidding aside though - it's just simple stainless steel. Essentially the same stuff you butter knives and forks are made of.



I think you under/over-estimate us as a group. Half of us cutlery hardened to 90HRC in the blood of our enemies. The other half are using plastic as we stare at our stunning kitchen knife collection.


----------



## Lars

I'm enjoying following this very much, thanks guys..


----------



## AT5760

I agree. Even though I'm not in on this massdrop and have zero knifemaking skills, I still really appreciate all of the knowledge that Ben has shared throughout this process. His attention to detail and the deliberateness of his craft is amazing. Someday I'll have to try one!


----------



## tomsch

Great thread!!! I may need to chat about a custom Kamon.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Much appreciate that you guys enjoy following along .

Update:


----------



## xsmx13

The FOMO is getting real. Looks awesome!


----------



## Lakeshow

those are looking reaaally good. very cool to see the progression from ur first post till now. can't wait for the final product, thanks a lot @KAMON Knives


----------



## captaincaed

Is there one on the end that isn't bog oak? Also, what a machine. Dang.


----------



## Knivperson

captaincaed said:


> Is there one on the end that isn't bog oak? Also, what a machine. Dang.


Uhh, a lucky, extremely rare mass drop handle... Probably for the one numbered 1 on the tang!


----------



## xsmx13

captaincaed said:


> Is there one on the end that isn't bog oak? Also, what a machine. Dang.


Seriously, the other day I felt pretty good profiling 4 blades, finishing a basic saya (still need to shape a pin) and gluing up a western handle after getting ~2 uninterrupted hours to play in the shed. Looking at this, @KAMON Knives would probably would have heat treated, tempered, ground the blades and gotten started on the handles in the same amount of time.


----------



## captaincaed

xsmx13 said:


> Seriously, the other day I felt pretty good profiling 4 blades, finishing a basic saya (still need to shape a pin) and gluing up a western handle after getting ~2 uninterrupted hours to play in the shed. Looking at this, @KAMON Knives would probably would have heat treated, tempered, ground the blades and gotten started on the handles in the same amount of time.


He also would have converted the new oak to bog oak. I'm just saying, he's _that good._


----------



## tostadas

Im seriously amazed by the consistency, despite this being all handmade. But after seeing the high level of organization through every step of the process, I can certainly see why.


----------



## xsmx13

captaincaed said:


> He also would have converted the new oak to bog oak. I'm just saying, he's _that good._


And if it was his style, he'd turn the decarb into DLC coating.


----------



## Dhoff

The profile of these knives really reminds me of a shark for some reason


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> Is there one on the end that isn't bog oak? Also, what a machine. Dang.



Haha here really nothing gets missed. I like it. I'm slowly getting worried you guys could recognize in some reflection that I'm Actually making those pics naked .
So there are two additional handles that are different. They'll be a gift for two of the three Massketeers for their work organizing this as a little thank you. The third Massketeer will get a surprise you won't see in any pics. I'll let you alone with your fantasy on that one.

BTW... Update:


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Haha here really nothing gets missed. I like it. I'm slowly getting worried you guys could recognize in some reflection that I'm Actually making those pics naked .
> So there are two additional handles that are different. They'll be a gift for two of the three Massketeers for their work organizing this as a little thank you. The third Massketeer will get a surprise you won't see in any pics. I'll let you alone with your fantasy on that one.
> 
> BTW... Update:



After final assembly, are there any more steps?


----------



## xsmx13

KAMON Knives said:


> The third Massketeer will get a surprise you won't see in any pics. I'll let you alone with your fantasy on that one.


A nakiriknaifuwaifu!?


----------



## M1k3

Wonder if the 3rd mystery was inspired by the Dalman-Ian handle?


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> After final assembly, are there any more steps?


Shipping.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> After final assembly, are there any more steps?



With the handles only the hard wax oil coat and then letting them dry/cure. 
I finish the handles directly after hardening the blades even though I could proceed with the blades too at this point. But it makes more sense to finish the handles and let them sit a little. Also after hardening there are barely any fails anymore so there isn't much risk either of having a finished handle for a broken blade or such.


----------



## KAMON Knives

M1k3 said:


> Wonder if the 3rd mystery is was inspired by the Dalman-Ian handle?



I need an explanation


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

xsmx13 said:


> A nakiriknaifuwaifu!?


would be cool but nahh...unless,....??









KAMON Knives said:


> I need an explanation


there was a handle shaped in the form of the male organ of penetration that was gifted to a particularly desirous participant


----------



## tostadas

KAMON Knives said:


> With the handles only the hard wax oil coat and then letting them dry/cure.
> I finish the handles directly after hardening the blades even though I could proceed with the blades too at this point. But it makes more sense to finish the handles and let them sit a little. Also after hardening there are barely any fails anymore so there isn't much risk either of having a finished handle for a broken blade or such.


What kind of hard wax oil do you like to use? Or is that a trade secret?


----------



## KAMON Knives

tostadas said:


> What kind of hard wax oil do you like to use? Or is that a trade secret?



No trade secret. Tried a lot but couldn't identify too much difference once finished, but a lot during working with it. Currently I'm using this one for several batches already. 









OSMO Hartwachs-Öl Original


Speziell auf die Bedürfnisse von Holzfußböden abgestimmt – für eine pflegeleichte und wohngesunde Oberfläche!…




www.osmoshop.com


----------



## Knivperson

tostadas said:


> What kind of hard wax oil do you like to use? Or is that a trade secret?


Qustion is if a "softer", more "lubricant" , "oil" will be "used" for a potential "dalman-Ian" "handle"?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*Payment and Shipping Logistics: *​
*Hello all - below are critical details regarding shipping and payment. Please read it thoroughly as there are TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES!!!*

*ATTENTION - TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES *
*please read thoroughly 
plz read it 

pretty please*​

*Payment Overview: *

Our agreement with @KAMON Knives is the following:
Ben issues 3 invoices – one for each region
Ben gets paid for each of 3 invoices
Ben ships 3 packages – one for each region

*There is no direct payment to Ben from KKF members.*
*@RockyBasel pays Ben and KKF members pay @RockyBasel – but in reverse order*
*Distributors will take each package in each region and then distribute to individual*


*Distributors: *
NA - @nakiriknaifuwaifu in USA
EU - @RockyBasel in Switzerland
APAC - @lemeneid in Singapore

For EU knives, @RockyBasel will ship from Germany

*We will calculate a single price per knife in each of the regions inclusive of shipping and customs

This price will include:*
Cost of the knife (225 or 260)
International shipping cost allocation per knife
Local duties (if any) allocation per knife
Local/in-region shipping cost allocation per knife

We are using UPS/DHL shipping calculators to estimate costs

*Payment Format: 

Payment will be accepted via either bank transfer or PayPal F&F – you can choose ONLY ONE method of payment *

*You MUST pay in EUROS ONLY*
You will be responsible for any transaction fees (currency etc.) that you are all painfully aware of.
@RockyBasel will then make payments for the 3 invoices for @Kamon

TL;DR: Money comes in from KKF to @RockyBasel who then pays out to @Kamon
It's an honor and trust based system.



*DEADLINE *
*MONDAY NOV. 22ND - BY END OF DAY (11:59PM Central Standard Time)*

For those selected:
*A SINGLE PM to BOTH @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @RockyBasel in this EXACT FORMAT 
(Add BOTH me and RockyBasel to the recipients line, like an email)* 
(also, you can exclude non-essential formatting such as quotations and the yellow bits)


*Message Title: "User Info - Kamon Drop"*

*KKF Username: 

Payment preference: "Bank Transfer" **<or>** "Paypal F&F"*

*(for tracking payment by KKF username) *
*Name on Bank Transfer:*
*<or> *
*Paypal Address:*

*International Shipping Address:*​


*As a reminder, the knives will be completed within the next few weeks. *

*Upon completion of the knives, we will post final prices and issue @rockybasel’s PayPal address and banking information (BOA or UBS routing information)*

*You may then transfer funds using preferred method.*

*There will be a formal announcement, after which you will have 2 business days to transfer funds. 
We are giving you this heads up now because it is CRITICAL to adhere to this timeline; failure to do so will result in forfeiting your slot. *

We will post payment status (paid or not paid) prior to the end of the 2 business day cut-off

After the funds are collected, @RockyBasel will pay @Kamon who will then post on this Massdrop III thread confirming payment received *and ship those beautiessssssss* 


Lot of information here.* If you have any questions please PM me (@nakiriknaifuwaifu)! *

Thanks,
RockyBasel and NKW


----------



## toddnmd

KAMON Knives said:


> I need an explanation


----------



## Delat

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Payment and Shipping Logistics: *​
> *Hello all - below are critical details regarding shipping and payment. Please read it thoroughly as there are TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES!!!*
> 
> *ATTENTION - TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES *
> *please read thoroughly
> plz read it
> 
> pretty please*​
> 
> *Payment Overview: *
> 
> Our agreement with @KAMON Knives is the following:
> Ben issues 3 invoices – one for each region
> Ben gets paid for each of 3 invoices
> Ben ships 3 packages – one for each region
> 
> *There is no direct payment to Ben from KKF members.*
> *@RockyBasel pays Ben and KKF members pay @RockyBasel – but in reverse order*
> *Distributors will take each package in each region and then distribute to individual*
> 
> 
> *Distributors: *
> NA - @nakiriknaifuwaifu in USA
> EU - @RockyBasel in Switzerland
> APAC - @lemeneid in Singapore
> 
> For EU knives, @RockyBasel will ship from Germany
> 
> *We will calculate a single price per knife in each of the regions inclusive of shipping and customs
> 
> This price will include:*
> Cost of the knife (225 or 260)
> International shipping cost allocation per knife
> Local duties (if any) allocation per knife
> Local/in-region shipping cost allocation per knife
> 
> We are using UPS/DHL shipping calculators to estimate costs
> 
> *Payment Format:
> 
> Payment will be accepted via either bank transfer or PayPal F&F – you can choose ONLY ONE method of payment *
> 
> *You MUST pay in EUROS ONLY*
> You will be responsible for any transaction fees (currency etc.) that you are all painfully aware of.
> @RockyBasel will then make payments for the 3 invoices for @Kamon
> 
> TL;DR: Money comes in from KKF to @RockyBasel who then pays out to @Kamon
> It's an honor and trust based system.
> 
> 
> 
> *DEADLINE *
> *MONDAY NOV. 22ND - BY END OF DAY (11:59PM Central Standard Time)*
> 
> 
> *A SINGLE PM to BOTH @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @RockyBasel in this EXACT FORMAT
> (Add BOTH me and RockyBasel to the recipients line, like an email)*
> (also, you can exclude non-essential formatting such as quotations and the yellow bits)
> 
> 
> *Message Title: User Info - Kamon Drop *
> 
> *KKF Username:
> 
> Payment preference: "Bank Transfer" **<or>** "Paypal F&F"*
> 
> *(for tracking payment by KKF username) *
> *Name on Bank Transfer:*
> *<or> *
> *Paypal Address:*
> 
> *International Shipping Address:*​
> 
> 
> *As a reminder, the knives will be completed within the next few weeks. *
> 
> *Upon completion of the knives, we will post final prices and issue @rockybasel’s PayPal address and banking information (BOA or UBS routing information)*
> 
> *You may then transfer funds using preferred method.*
> 
> *There will be a formal announcement, after which you will have 2 business days to transfer funds.
> We are giving you this heads up now because it is CRITICAL to adhere to this timeline; failure to do so will result in forfeiting your slot. *
> 
> We will post payment status (paid or not paid) prior to the end of the 2 business day cut-off
> 
> After the funds are collected, @RockyBasel will pay @Kamon who will then post on this Massdrop III thread confirming payment received *and ship those beautiessssssss*
> 
> 
> Lot of information here.* If you have any questions please PM me (@nakiriknaifuwaifu)! *
> 
> Thanks,
> RockyBasel and NKW



Small tip for those lucky enough to make the list and newish to KKF, and a little bit OCD about getting everything right for payment so planning on referring back to NKW’s instructions:

There is a bookmark function you can use to save a post for later reference, which is what I just did for this one. Click the icon next to the post number, add a label if you want for easy searching, and hit save. You can find your bookmarks by clicking your name/icon in the top right of the forum screen - they’ll be on a tab to the right of the “your account” tab.

This is a massive PITA of management so please follow NKW’s crystal clear instructions to the letter to make things easier for our massketeers so they don’t decide a Massdrop IV is too much work! [I hope this last bit doesn’t sound snarky, it’s not intended as such and is really just a genuine plea so we can have more massdrops.]


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Thank you @Delat for the de-lat-fuly informative post ok shoot me now

Clarification about the above:

*Message Title: "User Info - Kamon Drop" means the title is "User Info - Kamon Drop"*
Please do not add your username where it says "user" just send it exactly as it says between the quotes.


----------



## M1k3

"@RockyBasel pays Ben and KKF members pay @RockyBasel – but in reverse order"

Wait, what?  So KKF members get paid from RockyBasel? I should of signed up!


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update: teaser


----------



## daddy yo yo

@KAMON Knives This is super-nice, wow!!!


----------



## RockyBasel

That Massdrop knife has a gorgeous profile and I can’t wait to see the final product I am super looking forward to this one!!


----------



## drsmp

@nakiriknaifuwaifu @RockyBasel 
Will you guys reply to payment info confirmation pm’s or post list of confirmed members here?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

drsmp said:


> @nakiriknaifuwaifu @RockyBasel
> Will you guys reply to payment info confirmation pm’s or post list of confirmed members here?


We will be posting a list on this thread for everyone.

If you'd like us to confirm and say "payment sent, please confirm" via PM we will do our best to reply to you directly as well. It will take a considerable amount of time for us to check back each time one of the 40 participants sends a payment so please do keep that in mind.

I'll give more specific details on this when we open up the drop for payment.


----------



## RockyBasel

drsmp said:


> @nakiriknaifuwaifu @RockyBasel
> Will you guys reply to payment info confirmation pm’s or post list of confirmed members here?


We will list who has provided us with payment information and who out of the 40
Is missing - if I understood your question correctly- you are wanting to know if we have received your payment preferences. Not the payment itself. But we will need to do both - 1. Confirm that we got your payment preferences. 2. Confirm that we got the money before we transfer to Kamon


----------



## spaceconvoy

@Delat good observation


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:



Next one will be more interesting to most I think.


----------



## SirCutAlot

This guy is so funny 

A comedian with knife making skill... Whoozaaaa

SirCutALot


----------



## Dhoff

KAMON Knives said:


> Update:
> 
> 
> 
> Next one will be more interesting to most I think.




I resent the 3 knives that do not understand order!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Payment and Shipping Logistics: *​
> *Hello all - below are critical details regarding shipping and payment. Please read it thoroughly as there are TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES!!!*
> 
> *ATTENTION - TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES *
> *please read thoroughly
> plz read it
> 
> pretty please*​
> 
> *Payment Overview: *
> 
> Our agreement with @KAMON Knives is the following:
> Ben issues 3 invoices – one for each region
> Ben gets paid for each of 3 invoices
> Ben ships 3 packages – one for each region
> 
> *There is no direct payment to Ben from KKF members.*
> *@RockyBasel pays Ben and KKF members pay @RockyBasel – but in reverse order*
> *Distributors will take each package in each region and then distribute to individual*
> 
> 
> *Distributors: *
> NA - @nakiriknaifuwaifu in USA
> EU - @RockyBasel in Switzerland
> APAC - @lemeneid in Singapore
> 
> For EU knives, @RockyBasel will ship from Germany
> 
> *We will calculate a single price per knife in each of the regions inclusive of shipping and customs
> 
> This price will include:*
> Cost of the knife (225 or 260)
> International shipping cost allocation per knife
> Local duties (if any) allocation per knife
> Local/in-region shipping cost allocation per knife
> 
> We are using UPS/DHL shipping calculators to estimate costs
> 
> *Payment Format:
> 
> Payment will be accepted via either bank transfer or PayPal F&F – you can choose ONLY ONE method of payment *
> 
> *You MUST pay in EUROS ONLY*
> You will be responsible for any transaction fees (currency etc.) that you are all painfully aware of.
> @RockyBasel will then make payments for the 3 invoices for @Kamon
> 
> TL;DR: Money comes in from KKF to @RockyBasel who then pays out to @Kamon
> It's an honor and trust based system.
> 
> 
> 
> *DEADLINE *
> *MONDAY NOV. 22ND - BY END OF DAY (11:59PM Central Standard Time)*
> 
> For those selected:
> *A SINGLE PM to BOTH @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @RockyBasel in this EXACT FORMAT
> (Add BOTH me and RockyBasel to the recipients line, like an email)*
> (also, you can exclude non-essential formatting such as quotations and the yellow bits)
> 
> 
> *Message Title: "User Info - Kamon Drop"*
> 
> *KKF Username:
> 
> Payment preference: "Bank Transfer" **<or>** "Paypal F&F"*
> 
> *(for tracking payment by KKF username) *
> *Name on Bank Transfer:*
> *<or> *
> *Paypal Address:*
> 
> *International Shipping Address:*​
> 
> 
> *As a reminder, the knives will be completed within the next few weeks. *
> 
> *Upon completion of the knives, we will post final prices and issue @rockybasel’s PayPal address and banking information (BOA or UBS routing information)*
> 
> *You may then transfer funds using preferred method.*
> 
> *There will be a formal announcement, after which you will have 2 business days to transfer funds.
> We are giving you this heads up now because it is CRITICAL to adhere to this timeline; failure to do so will result in forfeiting your slot. *
> 
> We will post payment status (paid or not paid) prior to the end of the 2 business day cut-off
> 
> After the funds are collected, @RockyBasel will pay @Kamon who will then post on this Massdrop III thread confirming payment received *and ship those beautiessssssss*
> 
> 
> Lot of information here.* If you have any questions please PM me (@nakiriknaifuwaifu)! *
> 
> Thanks,
> RockyBasel and NKW



*REMINDER: DEADLINE 
MONDAY NOV. 22ND - BY END OF DAY (11:59PM Central Standard Time)*​
*Hello all: *

*As of the time of posting here are the users who have and have not sent in their information. *

*Please read the above post if you have not done so already and please send in your information *DEEP INHALE**
*IN THE PRECISE FORMAT REQUESTED *​*by the end of today.

Thanks,
NKW *


UserRegionCountrySizeIndexInfo Sent (Y=1/N=0)@nakiriknaifuwaifuNAUSA26011D@RockyBaselEUCHE26021D@lemeneidAPACSG26031D@JoshNACanada22541@cooktocutNAUSA26050@killerloopNAUSA22560@FroztitanzAPACSG22571@JvilleNAUSA26081@toddnmdNAUSA22590@LostHighwayNAUSA225100@Hz_zzzzzzNAUSA225111@LakeshowNAUSA225120@Nuts63NAUSA225130@WildBoarNAUSA225141@TristanAPACSG260151@tchan001APACHK225161@MortenEUDenmark260170@Jason183NAUSA260181@gogogo545EUSweden225190@drsmpNAUSA260201@AcidwashNAUSA260211@julius777APACMalaysia225221@DelatNAUSA225231@SmiddertonEUGermany225241@KnivpersonEUDenmark225251@IkonakaNAUSA225260@0x0xEUAustria260270@SdoEUIreland225281@GeigsAPACAus225291@Todd762NAUSA225300@robAPACAus260311@captaincaedNAUSA260321@DgilksAPACAus225331@zeaderanNAUSA225341@pow_powEUGermany225351@DefinegoodNAUSA225361@demcavNAUSA225371@BodineNAUSA225381@climbclimbNAUSA260390@WiriWiriEUUK225401


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update: 

I hope you see it like I do in that this is the interesting stuff.


----------



## climbclimb

Have attempted to email @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @RockyBasel - when I use the exact format required I receive this notice from the website:

"Your content can not be submitted. This is likely because your content is spam-like or contains inappropriate elements. Please change your content or try again later. If you still have problems, please contact an administrator."

I've deleted all formatting - suspect maybe it's the use of the word "paypal", but I tried "paypa1" and that didn't go through either.


----------



## Morten

Hi Massketeers, (@RockyBasel and @nakiriknaifuwaifu )and next on waitlist. Morten from Denmark is out and I ferfeit my slot. Reasons are primarily that other priorities have come ahead of knives (, the horror!).

Hope that it will not be too much trouble managing this and i hope all will be extremely satisfied with their upcoming Kamons - they look awesome.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Morten said:


> Hi Massketeers, (@RockyBasel and @nakiriknaifuwaifu )and next on waitlist. Morten from Denmark is out and I ferfeit my slot. Reasons are primarily that other priorities have come ahead of knives (, the horror!).
> 
> Hope that it will not be too much trouble managing this and i hope all will be extremely satisfied with their upcoming Kamons - they look awesome.


@Morten No worries at all thank you for letting us know. Hope all is well on your end. Could you PM me so I can access this in my inbox later?
Thanks again,
NKW


----------



## gregfisk

Someone is jumping up and down with joy.


----------



## esoo

Slowly, I get closer....


----------



## RockyBasel

Who is the lucky one next in line?


----------



## climbclimb

message seems to have gotten through now - thanks forum admin!


climbclimb said:


> Have attempted to email @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @RockyBasel - when I use the exact format required I receive this notice from the website:
> 
> "Your content can not be submitted. This is likely because your content is spam-like or contains inappropriate elements. Please change your content or try again later. If you still have problems, please contact an administrator."
> 
> I've deleted all formatting - suspect maybe it's the use of the word "paypal", but I tried "paypa1" and that didn't go through either.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Hello:

Thanks to all who submitted their info on time and adhered to the format requested. List for confirmation coming soon (I've PM'd everyone too).

I have not received communication from:

@Todd762
@killerloop

PMs have been sent. If you see this, check your inbox please 

Thanks again everyone,
NKW


----------



## outofgamut

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Payment and Shipping Logistics: *​
> *Hello all - below are critical details regarding shipping and payment. Please read it thoroughly as there are TIME SENSITIVE DEADLINES!!!*



While I unfortunately wasn't one of the lucky ones who got in this time I still wanted to give a big Thank You to the musketeers for conceiving, organising and seeing through this drop.

I know from experience that often the thanks behind things like that can be rather small, while the potential for complaints - particularly when dealing with not unsubstantial amounts of money - can be significant. Truly, hats off to the three of you!

In addition, it is truly fascinating to see Ben's approach. Not at all trying to belittle what you do Ben - your work is clearly sublime. But I can't help wondering if your skillset isn't somewhat under utilised in what you currently do. You're a perfectionist, someone with an inquisitive engineering mind and organisational skills that border on the prodigy level. Not wanting to sound like a parent, dissatisfied that the child 'only' became vice-president: but should you maybe be thinking about setting yourself goals beyond your one man boutique forge?


----------



## KAMON Knives

I don't take it as belittling @outofgamut. I more take it as a compliment. I was approached with the idea, of somehow expanding the business, several times which is why I often thought about this topic.

I don't know where this will take me in the future even though I have some hopes and ideas where it could take me. I know however what I don't want to do, at least in a somewhat foreseeable future. 
I won't get employees. For one thing it's ridiculously expensive over here in Austria. An employee working full time getting paid at the bare minimum by law costs me as an employer ~3000€+ a month. All that not 12 times a year, but 14 times (summer and winter double salary). Plus 5 weeks paid vacation and eventually sick days off. This shouldn't be a hit on worker rights. I find it good that workers here by law get to be paid a certain amount and have some security. I was on the other side of this for the longest time and I completely understand that those 3000€+ I'd spend, of which the employee only gets about half (rest is taxes, insurence,... He and I have to pay from the 3k€), aren't even a high enough salary one would seek out. That's not much really. Especially not for such a demanding job. 

So that's one thing and the other is that I'd be a bad employer. I fear I'd ask too much and that's not meaning in the sense that I'd knew better. That's more meaning in the way that I wouldn't leave my employee the freedom he would need, the freedom I myself had with my last employer (he was a good boss). 


Additionally - I'm in a real good position right now. My books are closed, except for existing customers, and just from those putting orders in and the mass drop the lead time, that I didn't want to let grow over ~6 months, is at about 1 year now. 
I don't want to sound too whiney but the worse I have to deal with these days is constantly explaining to people why it is that I can't take their orders currently and how sorry I am for that. And even though that's really not funny to do, and I actually want to provide all who would spend the trust and money to order with me, it's just not worth compromising what I've got for more output. 
I'm doing a good job now alone. I enjoy beeing alone and beeing my own boss not having to look out for someone (got enough of that at home), and I make a good living from that. 
Short put it just works out great as it is I think so there is no reason for me to change it. 

PS: I can only underline what you've said about the Massketeers! They're doing a great job and I'm incredibly thankful for their hard work so pls make their lives as easy as possible when dealing with them.


----------



## captaincaed

Hiring employees is a big fat hairy deal. It's hard! Good for sticking to your instincts!


----------



## daddy yo yo

captaincaed said:


> Hiring employees is a big fat hairy deal. It's hard! Good for sticking to your instincts!


Hiring is only one small part of it. Keeping is the more difficult part!


----------



## KAMON Knives

daddy yo yo said:


> Hiring is only one small part of it. Keeping is the more difficult part!



THAT'S another issue. Especially in this business. I'm not greedy with my knowledge. Quite obviously I guess looking at this thread. Even though I have certain lines I won't cross to not encourage copy cats too much . But it's quite common in knife making that "apprentices" get self employed after a while. And that's not a bad thing in general. I know some guys that did this, but if I am the employer in this constellation, I'm pissed .

Another reason I didn't mention is that such a small structure I'm having is very flexible, and therefore financially safer I think. In a crisis, like with the pandemic now, you get in a tight spot very fast if you have salary expenses of 3000, 6000, 9000 Euro or more a month. And at the first about half year an employee costs you double. The salary he's getting and your time educating him.

I fear it's just not for me. 

However Martin Huber for example does a great job so it's possible to pull off. He has 2 employees by now afaik and he grew his business to three main pillars beeing knife making, knife making courses and selling knife making materials. I find that quite impressive.


----------



## Jovidah

I have a great idea for a compromise. I'll happily offer my services as your personal 'product tester' for free!


----------



## WildBoar

Jovidah said:


> I have a great idea for a compromise. I'll happily offer my services as your personal 'product tester' for free!


That's noble of you, but from a liability standpoint he is probably better off testing on onions, carrots, potatoes, etc.


----------



## gregfisk

Ben, I think you are doing exactly what you should be after reading your thoughts on your situation. 35 years ago I started my business here in the US. I had a partner and we grew extremely fast. At one point we had 17 people working for us and all I ended up being was a baby sitter. I split with my partner about 15 years in and decided to only use subcontractors and only have 2 of them. I sold the building down town and started working from home. Best decisions I ever made. Keeping the business small allowed for so much more freedom and much less stress. And the funny thing is that I ended up making way more money being small. It sounds to me like you’re doing it exactly the right way.


----------



## drsmp

WildBoar said:


> That's noble of you, but from a liability standpoint he is probably better off testing on onions, carrots, potatoes, etc.


Warm blood usually results in some cool rainbow patina


----------



## KAMON Knives

gregfisk said:


> Ben, I think you are doing exactly what you should be after reading your thoughts on your situation. 35 years ago I started my business here in the US. I had a partner and we grew extremely fast. At one point we had 17 people working for us and all I ended up being was a baby sitter. I split with my partner about 15 years in and decided to only use subcontractors and only have 2 of them. I sold the building down town and started working from home. Best decisions I ever made. Keeping the business small allowed for so much more freedom and much less stress. And the funny thing is that I ended up making way more money being small. It sounds to me like you’re doing it exactly the right way.



Haha yet another reason. But it makes sense. Of course your company makes more money when it's bigger. Ideally at least. But naturally the money gets split through more people. And that the boss of this Company could end up just switching the kind of work he does, but not necessarily earning more, is a possibility. 
I'm just not made for office work no matter what .

Update:


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Hello all:

Thanks to all who submitted their info in time. Here is the confirmation chart. Everyone save for @Todd762 has sent in their info.

@Todd762 if you're reading this please check your inbox as you are in acute danger of forfeiting your slot.

If anyone has any questions please shoot me a message. Otherwise, please check back shortly for more updates.

All best,
NKW


UserRegionCountrySizeIndexInfo Sent (Y/N)@nakiriknaifuwaifuNAUSA2601N/A@RockyBaselEUCHE2602N/A@lemeneidAPACSG2603N/A@cooktocutNAUSA26051@JvilleNAUSA26081@TristanAPACSG260151@KeatNAUSA260171@Jason183NAUSA260181@drsmpNAUSA260201@AcidwashNAUSA260211@0x0xEUAustria260271@robAPACAus260311@captaincaedNAUSA260321@climbclimbNAUSA260391@WiriWiriEUUK260401@JoshNACanada22541@killerloopNAUSA22561@FroztitanzAPACSG22571@toddnmdNAUSA22591@LostHighwayNAUSA225101@Hz_zzzzzzNAUSA225111@LakeshowNAUSA225121@Nuts63NAUSA225131@WildBoarNAUSA225141@tchan001APACHK225161@gogogo545EUSweden225191@julius777APACMalaysia225221@DelatNAUSA225231@SmiddertonEUGermany225241@KnivpersonEUDenmark225251@IkonakaNAUSA225261@SdoEUIreland225281@GeigsAPACAus225291@Todd762NAUSA225300@DgilksAPACAus225331@zeaderanNAUSA225341@pow_powEUGermany225351@DefinegoodNAUSA225361@demcavNAUSA225371@BodineNAUSA225381


----------



## Knivperson

@KAMON Knives while I really appreciate your grinding post update and your lovely water cooled grinder, Im curious about your thoughts on the grind itself. Next to the whole forging process, grinding is maybe the most important part of how the knife performes, imo. As they say, geometry cuts. What are your considerations concerning grinding and performance? What are you balancing, so to say?


----------



## Todd762

I must of missed a message about payment and shipping address. I have responded.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Todd762 said:


> I must of missed a message about payment and shipping address. I have responded.


Hi @Todd762, please check your PMs.


----------



## Todd762

Lesson learned here, monitor the thread daily if you can. Congrats to whoever got my slot, you’ll love it I am sure. 

I sincerely appreciate those who go through the effort to make this possible. Can I make a suggestion for future massdrop offerings? Can we have a pay it now option when the price is determined? For those of us traveling or in rural areas, it might avoid a communication Issue or payment timeline crunch.

Todd


----------



## RockyBasel

Todd you earned that spot fair and square


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> @KAMON Knives while I really appreciate your grinding post update and your lovely water cooled grinder, Im curious about your thoughts on the grind itself. Next to the whole forging process, grinding is maybe the most important part of how the knife performes, imo. As they say, geometry cuts. What are your considerations concerning grinding and performance? What are you balancing, so to say?



In general I aim to have the edge as thin as reasonably possible. Measured it's about 0,08mm (0,003") thick. That just reduces wedging. But also after the edge the blade has to be thin. I've often seen too convex grinds in the edge region. This is when the primary bevel goes down to the edge in a wider angle instead of a relatively flat one. On pics the edge looks thin then, but really sometimes it's not and the knife won't perform how you'd expect it to be by the looks of it as the secondary bevel, the edge, looks thin, but really isn't. My knives will be able to perform the brass rod test easily. 

Above the edge, for the primary bevel, I use a convex grind for good food release purposes. Not much to say about that. I think everyone here can imagine what it is . 

A specialty of my knives may be the fact that they are pretty laser like thin towards the tip, and thicker workhorse like towards the heel. It's a combination of laser and workhorse if you will. I've often got problems with that as many people will ask for specific kinds of knives. Like make it a laser, make it a workhorse, make it... No, sry. Doesn't work like that with me. It's a Kamon. I'm doing my own thing. Not meant to be rude but I can't work like other knife makers do. I have my own head . 

Also I like thin tips. They're ground in an completely separate step where I establish a dedicated geometry just for the tip. Actually the tip has what my walkschliff finished knives have, throughout the whole blade in that they are not the thickest at the spine, but slightly beneath. Means the primary bevel at the tip region is rounded thin towards the spine and the thickest part is a few mm below the spine. The reason for that is that you can slide in and out of onions, for example, easier without catching up on it since there is no sharp edge at the spine in the tip region.


----------



## RockyBasel

This is going to be an awesome
Knife I love the detail thinking I’m each element of the design


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Todd762 said:


> Lesson learned here, monitor the thread daily if you can.


I just want to clarify that there has been a week and a half of communication about specifically about info and payment collection.

//

On Monday Nov. 15th Post #575 I tagged everyone and said: "Further time-sensitive announcements regarding payment and shipping coming sooooooon!"

On Tuesday Nov. 16th post #578 I specified, saying "Further information on payment will be sent out this week" and stated the ETA of completion would be December.

On Friday Nov. 19th post #611 (Friday afternoon if you're in TX) as stated I opened up the thread for *payment and shipping info *with a deadline of 11:95PM on Monday, Nov. 22nd

On Monday Nov. 22nd post #626 I posted a reminder deadline for that day.

After the deadline, I gave a grace period and on Tuesday Nov. 23rd I sent you a PM at 11AM CST giving you an additional day to respond and another one later in the day checking in.

//

I've been heads-upping, tagging, and PM'ing as much as I can to get everyone's attention.

Keep in mind that I generally give 24h for each waitlist person to accept/decline their spot, and it takes me approximately 2 spots (48h) to fill a slot, plus the amount of time it takes that user to reply with their information.

In this case we need a confirmed list of 40 to decide the number of knives going to each region and calculate price (hence no prepay option), so *unfortunately we have to draw deadlines somewhere or risk postponing the drop for everyone.*

@RockyBasel is a more compassionate man than me (perhaps because I'm the one timing/scheduling posts, writing PMs, filling out the spreadsheets, etc.) so we are working on it.

*But please guys - deadlines. They actually mean something, please try your best to follow them. 

If you will be traveling, in a rural area, or unable to respond when you should, please shoot me a PM and I will accommodate you (as I did with @WiriWiri, though he got his info to me on time).*


----------



## coffeelover191919

just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.


----------



## TSF415

coffeelover191919 said:


> just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.



You should have had multiple notifications.


----------



## julius777

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> I just want to clarify that there has been a week and a half of communication about specifically about info and payment collection.
> 
> //
> 
> On Monday Nov. 15th Post #575 I tagged everyone and said: "Further time-sensitive announcements regarding payment and shipping coming sooooooon!"
> 
> On Tuesday Nov. 16th post #578 I specified, saying "Further information on payment will be sent out this week" and stated the ETA of completion would be December.
> 
> On Friday Nov. 19th post #611 (Friday afternoon if you're in TX) as stated I opened up the thread for *payment and shipping info *with a deadline of 11:95PM on Monday, Nov. 22nd
> 
> On Monday Nov. 22nd post #626 I posted a reminder deadline for that day.
> 
> After the deadline, I gave a grace period and on Tuesday Nov. 23rd I sent you a PM at 11AM CST giving you an additional day to respond and another one later in the day checking in.
> 
> //
> 
> I've been heads-upping, tagging, and PM'ing as much as I can to get everyone's attention.
> 
> Keep in mind that I generally give 24h for each waitlist person to accept/decline their spot, and it takes me approximately 2 spots (48h) to fill a slot, plus the amount of time it takes that user to reply with their information.
> 
> In this case we need a confirmed list of 40 to decide the number of knives going to each region and calculate price (hence no prepay option), so *unfortunately we have to draw deadlines somewhere or risk postponing the drop for everyone.*
> 
> @RockyBasel is a more compassionate man than me (perhaps because I'm the one timing/scheduling posts, writing PMs, filling out the spreadsheets, etc.) so we are working on it.
> 
> *But please guys - deadlines. They actually mean something, please try your best to follow them.
> 
> If you will be traveling, in a rural area, or unable to respond when you should, please shoot me a PM and I will accommodate you (as I did with @WiriWiri, though he got his info to me on time).*


To be fair. Sometimes the notification doesn't appear even if you're watching the thread. Was wondering why there wasn't any updates and when I checked I almost missed the deadline as well.


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## toddnmd

coffeelover191919 said:


> just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.



It’s still a little early, I think. Try waiting a couple more weeks, then you’ll be virtually guaranteed to win a spot!


----------



## BillHanna

coffeelover191919 said:


> just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.


Good Sport Award 2021


----------



## Delat

]


coffeelover191919 said:


> just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.



If you’re serious then a few will no doubt hit BST in the weeks and months following. Certain people might charge more for the used BST tax though


----------



## RockyBasel

coffeelover191919 said:


> just got a notification and looking to get in on this. Have money to blow and willing to overpay this time around.



Hope springs eternal! May the knife gods be with you


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## Delat

KAMON Knives said:


> Update:





Super excited! That looks like the sharpest OOTB I’ve seen personally and much sharper than I was expecting.

One question on the 36 degree inclusive microbevel. Is there a particular reason you use this angle? Are you looking to reduce OOTB issues with less than careful users, or do you recommend it for this steel/grind combo perhaps due to the zero bevel main grind? Most here sharpen their knives anywhere from zero to 30 inclusive, with 30 degrees considered pretty conservative. 

I really want to express my appreciation for this rare opportunity to get insight straight from the bladesmith on sharpening angles for his work.


----------



## pow_pow

What a beauty


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## RockyBasel

Looks stunning


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## Eloh

Congrats to all participants, Ben's knives are truely great value for the money


----------



## gregfisk

That’s a beautiful knife Ben, just wow! Could you explain the flexibility you were showing of the edge with your thumbnail? I’ve mentioned this before but I’m a hobbyist knife maker and when I first made a knife with that type of flex on the edge, I thought I had made a mistake in heat treat of the 25n20. My first knives were made with 1095 and the edge didn’t do that at all. I also have been using much thinner steel to begin with and my edges are about 15 to 20 degrees. Thank you again for showing us in such detail what you do. I find it extremely interesting. -Greg


----------



## gregfisk

gregfisk said:


> That’s a beautiful knife Ben, just wow! Could you explain the flexibility you were showing of the edge with your thumbnail? I’ve mentioned this before but I’m a hobbyist knife maker and when I first made a knife with that type of flex on the edge, I thought I had made a mistake in heat treat of the 25n20. My first knives were made with 1095 and the edge didn’t do that at all. I also have been using much thinner steel to begin with and my edges are about 15 to 20 degrees. Thank you again for showing us in such detail what you do. I find it extremely interesting. -Greg


This should say 15n20, didn’t catch the typo until it was too late to change it.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Delat said:


> Super excited! That looks like the sharpest OOTB I’ve seen personally and much sharper than I was expecting.
> 
> One question on the 36 degree inclusive microbevel. Is there a particular reason you use this angle? Are you looking to reduce OOTB issues with less than careful users, or do you recommend it for this steel/grind combo perhaps due to the zero bevel main grind? Most here sharpen their knives anywhere from zero to 30 inclusive, with 30 degrees considered pretty conservative.
> 
> I really want to express my appreciation for this rare opportunity to get insight straight from the bladesmith on sharpening angles for his work.



I'm definitely not looking to mitigate any issues with less careful users . 
My knives have a thin edge so there are certain things they are very good at, and others for which they can't be used at all. They are tools specialized for certain tasks, which makes them very good at those. Opposed to the allround knives the industry offers. Those are usable for pretty much every task, but good at none . 
I deliver a DOS & DON'TS sheet with my knives which explains what can and can't be done with my knives. If one damages them, that's pretty much always due to abuse or inappropriate use. I haven't had a single case yet where the customer didn't directly and honestly approach me with "I made a mistake" or similar when something happened. 
Or let me put it this way... You don't drive up a mountain through the mud with a sports car and if you do, that's on you . So I don't see any reason to build uneducated customer proof knives. I'm building knives that perform great in certain tasks and I expect the customer to educate himself on how to proper use the tool he buys for a lot of money. 

Sry... That needed to be said. Don't mean to be rude to you and nothing against you. Just a general insight into my philosophy. You triggered me 

Regarding the actual angle and your question. The 36° (18° per side) seemed to be the recommendation of many people within the German kochmalscharf forum. I didn't ever really question if 33° or even 30° would make more sense. In that I didn't ever fine tune it. I took the 36° degrees total and had good results with it right from the start so I sticked with it. 
However I have my unscientific theory about very flat angles like below 20° total (10° or lower per side). 
Roman Landes described in his book how lower angles stay sharp for a longer time period and there is logical reasoning and test results behind this. But I think this reasoning resulted mainly from tests with guided machines like CATRA. What they lack is cutting board impact and angle changes (kind of jamming) during cutting. 
Think about Rock chopping for example and how much side forces have to beared by the edge when doing that. Or chopping and the impact forces on the edge. Very often not at perfectly 90° to the board which also means side forces. 
I want to say - this lower angle stays sharper for longer theory makes sense for guided blades used in machines, not so much for hand used tools and all the variables that apply in this scenario.

As I said - I can't scientifically proof it, yet my experience with very low angle sharpened edges was always bad. Either they failed very fast through chipping or they folded at a micro level. Never had I the feeling that they would really stay sharper for longer like the data from Landes suggested. 
And I'm not suggesting his data would be wrong, I just think it can't be applied to real life applications as the test setup isn't suitable to make real life conclusions. The data is right, the interpretation of it imho not so much. 

I would be curious about you guys that read here what your experience with higher vs lower edge angles is? 

PS: That might be a hot take right there . 



gregfisk said:


> That’s a beautiful knife Ben, just wow! Could you explain the flexibility you were showing of the edge with your thumbnail? I’ve mentioned this before but I’m a hobbyist knife maker and when I first made a knife with that type of flex on the edge, I thought I had made a mistake in heat treat of the 25n20. My first knives were made with 1095 and the edge didn’t do that at all. I also have been using much thinner steel to begin with and my edges are about 15 to 20 degrees. Thank you again for showing us in such detail what you do. I find it extremely interesting. -Greg



Flex is more a function of geometry than steel I'd say. Mild steel will flex to certain amount ground to this geometry. However it won't flex back if bent too far.
My knives will flex and flex even when very high forces are applied however, in opposition to the mild steel, when the force is too high, they will fail and break and not plastically deform like the mild steel would.

Showing that flex just gives an impression on how thin the knives are behind the edge. Therefore one can estimate the geometry a little. That's the only reason I showed that. Just because steel is very hard, doesn't mean it won't flex though.


----------



## RockyBasel

For me, this is an unbelievable education

Thank you . Kamon-San


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

KAMON Knives said:


> I deliver a DOS & DON'TS sheet with my knives which explains what can and can't be done with my knives.
> 
> Or let me put it this way... You don't drive up a mountain through the mud with a sports car and if you do, that's on you .



can't stop won't stop
shucking oysters
cracking lobster shells
chopping chocolate
opening cans
cutting stonefruit w/pits







edit for different meme


----------



## Jville

KAMON Knives said:


> I'm definitely not looking to mitigate any issues with less careful users .
> My knives have a thin edge so there are certain things they are very good at, and others for which they can't be used at all. They are tools specialized for certain tasks, which makes them very good at those. Opposed to the allround knives the industry offers. Those are usable for pretty much every task, but good at none .
> I deliver a DOS & DON'TS sheet with my knives which explains what can and can't be done with my knives. If one damages them, that's pretty much always due to abuse or inappropriate use. I haven't had a single case yet where the customer didn't directly and honestly approach me with "I made a mistake" or similar when something happened.
> Or let me put it this way... You don't drive up a mountain through the mud with a sports car and if you do, that's on you . So I don't see any reason to build uneducated customer proof knives. I'm building knives that perform great in certain tasks and I expect the customer to educate himself on how to proper use the tool he buys for a lot of money.
> 
> Sry... That needed to be said. Don't mean to be rude to you and nothing against you. Just a general insight into my philosophy. You triggered me ✌
> 
> Regarding the actual angle and your question. The 36° (18° per side) seemed to be the recommendation of many people within the German kochmalscharf forum. I didn't ever really question if 33° or even 30° would make more sense. In that I didn't ever fine tune it. I took the 36° degrees total and had good results with it right from the start so I sticked with it.
> However I have my unscientific theory about very flat angles like below 20° total (10° or lower per side).
> Roman Landes described in his book how lower angles stay sharp for a longer time period and there is logical reasoning and test results behind this. But I think this reasoning resulted mainly from tests with guided machines like CATRA. What they lack is cutting board impact and angle changes (kind of jamming) during cutting.
> Think about Rock chopping for example and how much side forces have to beared by the edge when doing that. Or chopping and the impact forces on the edge. Very often not at perfectly 90° to the board which also means side forces.
> I want to say - this lower angle stays sharper for longer theory makes sense for guided blades used in machines, not so much for hand used tools and all the variables that apply in this scenario.
> 
> As I said - I can't scientifically proof it, yet my experience with very low angle sharpened edges was always bad. Either they failed very fast through chipping or they folded at a micro level. Never had I the feeling that they would really stay sharper for longer like the data from Landes suggested.
> And I'm not suggesting his data would be wrong, I just think it can't be applied to real life applications as the test setup isn't suitable to make real life conclusions. The data is right, the interpretation of it imho not so much.
> 
> I would be curious about you guys that read here what your experience with higher vs lower edge angles is?
> 
> PS: That might be a hot take right there .
> 
> 
> 
> Flex is more a function of geometry than steel I'd say. Mild steel will flex to certain amount ground to this geometry. However it won't flex back if bent too far.
> My knives will flex and flex even when very high forces are applied however, in opposition to the mild steel, when the force is too high, they will fail and break and not plastically deform like the mild steel would.
> 
> Showing that flex just gives an impression on how thin the knives are behind the edge. Therefore one can estimate the geometry a little. That's the only reason I showed that. Just because steel is very hard, doesn't mean it won't flex though.


Yeah, I’ve noticed certain knives that are thin and sharpened at steep angles or can even be very hard steel and steep angles can sort of “ting” when you come it at angles that aren’t straight perpendicular to the board, meaning hitting at an angle. I kind of thought yours might be like that during the beginning of your reply, but it seems you’ve sharpened them to be a little tougher. Can you rock chop with your without being very careful to stay straight up and down? Not that I really rock chop, but that is one of those motions that a lot of thin hard steel knives don’t really do well at. Those are knives that you have to pay more attention to technique. I actually like being able to come in at different angles and not have to be so gentle going into the board.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Jville said:


> Yeah, I’ve noticed certain knives that are thin and sharpened at steep angles or can even be very hard steel and steep angles can sort of “ting” when you come it at angles that aren’t straight perpendicular to the board, meaning hitting at an angle. I kind of thought yours might be like that during the beginning of your reply, but it seems you’ve sharpened them to be a little tougher. Can you rock chop with your without being very careful to stay straight up and down? Not that I really rock chop, but that is one of those motions that a lot of thin hard steel knives don’t really do well at. Those are knives that you have to pay more attention to technique. I actually being able to come in at different angles and not have to be so gentle going into the board.



I've heard mine can sing too ^^.

No but truly... I didn't want to spread confusion or make someone unsure. My do's & don'ts can be seen on my website (High Performance Custom Kitchen Knives | Benjamin Kamon | Korneuburg). It's nothing super special I think. Just the usual "don't cut on hard surfaces" stuff.

To give some examples: I don't recommend bone contact with my knives. I wouldn't recommend cutting a lobster in half. I don't recommend cutting really fresh hard crust dark sour dough bread with one of them (you know... The kind of crust you loose teeth to. I don't recommend for the knifes, and your safety in this case btw ).

But of course Rock chopping and all kinds of other cutting techniques work fine. I don't have a dedicated special knife for anything in my kitchen. Means... I myself use it even for stuff I wouldn't recommend using it for and usually it stands up to the task. 

Trying to say - use this thing! It's tool built to be used. But use it with some thought and feel because after all it's also a thin edge and very hard steel.

To stay in the car analogy: your Porsche manual won't tell you at which speed and curve angle the car will slide out of the curve. You have to get a feel for the thing and you'll know what lines not to cross. (I hope so much this is true... I've never read a Porsche manual )


----------



## WildBoar

KAMON Knives said:


> To stay in the car analogy: your Porsche manual won't tell you at which speed and curve angle the car will slide out of the curve. You have to get a feel for the thing and you'll know what lines not to cross. (I hope so much this is true... I've never read a Porsche manual )


The way you learn the limits is to cross them


----------



## captaincaed

KAMON Knives said:


> But I think this reasoning resulted mainly from tests with guided machines like CATRA. What they lack is cutting board impact and angle changes (kind of jamming) during cutting.


Larrin is listening. And judging.


----------



## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


> Larrin is listening. And judging.



I don't know his opinion on the topic but judging by both their books, Roman Landes researched this topic a little deeper. And it's no hit on either of them. I just come to experience Roman's results in real life with those very low sharpening angles always failed faster with me. Buuut... He also writes that a huge factor is how the knife is used so this may as well be specific to me or in other words, my fault. 

Just in general to explain my approach to ship out sharpened knives - for some time I considered even sending them out without any edge at all. The reason for that is, that I know many of my customers don't even test my edge. They go and sharpen the knife guided to their angle on their stones establishing their edge before even testing my edge. It makes sense for them too. But it tells me that my OOTB edge won't satisfy everyone anyways so I came to the conclusion to just put a solid good edge on it and then the customer can still adapt it since it's small or use as is. 

Update:


----------



## Jville

KAMON Knives said:


> I don't know his opinion on the topic but judging by both their books, Roman Landes researched this topic a little deeper. And it's no hit on either of them. I just come to experience Roman's results in real life with those very low sharpening angles always failed faster with me. Buuut... He also writes that a huge factor is how the knife is used so this may as well be specific to me or in other words, my fault.
> 
> Just in general to explain my approach to ship out sharpened knives - for some time I considered even sending them out without any edge at all. The reason for that is, that I know many of my customers don't even test my edge. They go and sharpen the knife guided to their angle on their stones establishing their edge before even testing my edge. It makes sense for them too. But it tells me that my OOTB edge won't satisfy everyone anyways so I came to the conclusion to just put a solid good edge on it and then the customer can still adapt it since it's small or use as is.
> 
> Update:



I always test ootb edges. If they are good, I use them. Never seemed right to me to waste them. Heck, even if they aren’t that great I usually use them a little bit, just sharpen much sooner. A great ootb edge helps give you a great first impression of the knife too. Not that you can’t see past a not so great ootb edge. You just sharpen it and get your first impression then. But it makes easier to be able to instantly use it.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Jville said:


> I always test ootb edges. If they are good, I use them. Never seemed right to me to waste them. Heck, even if they aren’t that great I usually use them a little bit, just sharpen much sooner. A great ootb edge helps give you a great first impression of the knife too. Not that you can’t see past a not so great ootb edge. You just sharpen it and get your first impression then. But it makes easier to be able to instantly use it.



@alterwisser convinced me of exactly that some time ago. First impression. Hope it holds up . It's important and I can see how, even though some people "waste" it.

To have said something about the guys putting their own edges on right off the bat: they have guided systems and have the same angle on all their knives. As I understand it, they therefore spend way less strokes to reestablish a used edge again. And in general an edge that is sharpened guided seems to hold up longer so they don't risk fails from very low angle edges like some Japanese knives come with for example. So they just go ahead and make all the knives they receive just their edge angle and that's that. I could see me doing that too if I was a customer just to establish a baseline and be also able to compare the steels and all that ^^.


----------



## Eloh

KAMON Knives said:


> . He also writes that a huge factor is how the knife is used so this may as well be specific to me or in other words, my fault.



From my own experience thats true for the vast majority of users. Unless you are very experienced and all you do are delicate push cuts (see usuba) you are probably better off with a conservative micro bevel.


----------



## Delat

I always test ootb edges and if they’re decent then I’ll do a little light stropping on leather and put them to use. Every once in a while I get an edge that’s not great, and those I just touch up on a 4k stone. My standard 15 dps seems to always be higher than every japanese-knife ootb edge so basically I’m just putting a tiny little microbevel on top of the OOTB edge bevel.

Some guys on this forum will go with progressively lower angles (sometimes with thinning) until they get chipping, then back off. I doubt they do this straight away though. Edge retention discussions usually center around steel type rather than bevel angle, possibly because most here are comfortable sharpening and are happy to trade a sharper-feeling lower angle for slightly more frequent touchups (outside of a pro environment).

For my Kamon massdrop I plan to maintain the original 36 degrees until my strop and 4k no longer work (i.e. the original bevel is worn away) then when I need to do a full progression I’ll switch to my usual 30 degrees for consistency due to my muscle memory at that angle. With my light usage that’s probably a year away though.


----------



## demcav

KAMON Knives said:


> I don't know his opinion on the topic but judging by both their books, Roman Landes researched this topic a little deeper. And it's no hit on either of them. I just come to experience Roman's results in real life with those very low sharpening angles always failed faster with me. Buuut... He also writes that a huge factor is how the knife is used so this may as well be specific to me or in other words, my fault.
> 
> Just in general to explain my approach to ship out sharpened knives - for some time I considered even sending them out without any edge at all. The reason for that is, that I know many of my customers don't even test my edge. They go and sharpen the knife guided to their angle on their stones establishing their edge before even testing my edge. It makes sense for them too. But it tells me that my OOTB edge won't satisfy everyone anyways so I came to the conclusion to just put a solid good edge on it and then the customer can still adapt it since it's small or use as is.
> 
> Update:




Incredible distal taper of the blade in that photo -- can hardly wait!!

Just curious, is that a 225mm or a 260mm blade in the photo?


----------



## KAMON Knives

demcav said:


> Incredible distal taper of the blade in that photo -- can hardly wait!!
> 
> Just curious, is that a 225mm or a 260mm blade in the photo?



Happy you like it! That's the 225mm.


----------



## Jville

Agree, that is some nice smoooth distal taper.


----------



## demcav

KAMON Knives said:


> Happy you like it! That's the 225mm.



Can I get THAT one?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

demcav said:


> Can I get THAT one?


no @demcav bad! bad!

if people actually seriously start hounding me with "I want thaaaaaat one" stuff I will sashimi my wrists all the knives are equally good please have pity for the organizer


----------



## drsmp

@nakiriknaifuwaifu 
Does this mean you wouldn’t be willing to take detailed high resolution pics of all the knives from multiple angles in natural and kitchen lighting so I can pick out my favorite ?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu




----------



## Knivperson

Please take my money soon!


----------



## captaincaed

KAMON Knives said:


> I don't know his opinion on the topic but judging by both their books, Roman Landes researched this topic a little deeper. And it's no hit on either of them. I just come to experience Roman's results in real life with those very low sharpening angles always failed faster with me. Buuut... He also writes that a huge factor is how the knife is used so this may as well be specific to me or in other words, my fault.


I hope my comment came across as tongue-in-cheek! 

In my experience I totally agree, there is a somewhat intimate relationship with the knife when cooking food. That sensation isn't always well-described by CATRA testing, although it's very useful in general. In many cases I really am happy to sacrifice "ultimate edge retention" for a good cutting feel and ease of tuning-up the edge quickly.


----------



## captaincaed

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> View attachment 154231


I thought NKW was going to autograph all our tangs with a personalized note in calligraphy using a tungsten-carbide needle. You know, right next to the HRC rating. Is that not happening anymore? Well, at least all the US buyers, not sure what the Euros are getting...


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## captaincaed

When this is over, you can breathe a saya relief


----------



## gregfisk

Saya it isn’t so


----------



## gregfisk

Saya there, got any more of them m3 screws? 

this one’s for Bill


----------



## tcmx3

listen those people with guided systems may have consistency in their knives, more durable edges and fine control over edge/grind steering and correction, but I have spent 5 figures on rocks dug out of a vaguely volcanic mountain to get a mostly sharp knife so jokes on them really.


----------



## JayS20

tcmx3 said:


> listen those people with guided systems may have consistency in their knives, more durable edges and fine control over edge/grind steering and correction, but I have spent 5 figures on rocks dug out of a vaguely volcanic mountain to get a mostly sharp knife so jokes on them really.


Joke is on you. They can do both since you use these guided systems with proper stones. They can spend 5 figures on systems and another 5 figures on stones


----------



## captaincaed

gregfisk said:


> Saya there, got any more of them m3 screws?
> 
> this one’s for Bill


I have to admit...so was mine


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*Hello all: *

*Quick announcement: please check back this Saturday Dec. 4th for the Payment Information release. *

*@RockyBasel, @lemeneid and myself have been working hard to calculate the many costs that go into bringing the knives from @KAMON Knives's hands to yours. *

*We're taking care to ensure the safest, smoothest, and most cost-effective experience for you all. *​

*Thanks,
NKW*


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update to encourage in time payment :


----------



## xsmx13

KAMON Knives said:


> Update to encourage in time payment :



*Cold sweats and shaking*


----------



## daddy yo yo

These turn out so much better than anticipated… Wow!!! Congrats, Ben, and also to everyone snagging one of these! I am jealous!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*KAMON MASSDROP PAYMENT INSTRUCTIONS:
Payment is now open!*
@KAMON Knives
@RockyBasel
@alterwisser
@lemeneid

*Please read the below information carefully. 
You must follow these instructions EXACTLY or you will FORFEIT YOUR SPOT*

*PAYMENT DUE MONDAY, DECEMBER 6TH AT 11:59 PM CENTRAL STANDARD TIME*

*Knives will ship AS SOON AS EVERYONE HAS PAID*​
*Steps: *


*Find your price by region and size *
 *These prices are inclusive of shipping, customs, and all other expenses. If actual costs are less than stated we will refund the remainder; in the slim chance we underestimated prices we will send out an ancillary cost.*

*International commerce is tricky business; we’ve done our best to make things as safe and cost-efficient as we can and we thank you in advance for your understanding.

Note: please disregard the earlier post on currency. THE PAYMENT WILL BE IN SWISS FRANCS and** ONLY SWISS FRANCS.*



*ROCKY NEEDS THE RECEIVE THE FOLLOWING AMOUNTS (NOT WHAT YOU SEND, BUT WHAT RECIPIENT RECEIVES)*


*Region *​*225mm*​*260mm*​*APAC*​*CHF824.36*​*CHF864.09*​*NA*​*CHF770.50*​*CHF810.97*​*EU*​*CHF711.60*​*CHF751.59*​
* 

The prices above are inclusive of: International Fedex Shipment to each region (7%), local duties (8-10%) regional UPS/FEDEX/DHL shipment (3%-5%), currency transaction fees, and any broker/custom fees. We are only using trackable, reliable shipment services and not local postal service. *

*PAYMENT INFORMATION*

*BANK: 
Rocky Bank Routing Info: *
*Holder: Herr Rakesh Kishan u/o
Account no.: 233 -117379.40Z
IBAN: CH89 0023 3233 1173 7940 Z*
*BIC: UBSWCHZH80A


PAYPAL (F&F):*
*Rocky PayPal Address: [email protected]*​


*Deposit that EXACT value to RockyBasel’s bank or Paypal F&F by Monday 11:59PM CST*
*PLEASE PAY IN **SWISS FRANCS** (CHF) Equivalent*
*Because we are NOT retailers, Payment via **Paypal Goods & Services = instant disqualification *


*PLEASE NOTE: The table above shows the EXACT AMOUNT that Rocky NEEDS TO RECEIVE – and NOT the amount you send. 


For example:*

*An EU 225mm gyuto costs CHF 711.60*

*If you are paying via bank transfer such as Wise/Transferwise – here is what you may see for a 225mm going to the EU.*







*If you are paying via PayPal F&F – here is what you may see for a 225mm going to the EU.*





*CRITICAL: If you are paying with PayPal, you MUST pay via “Friends & Family” and NOT “Goods & Services.”

Users who pay via PayPal “Goods & Services” as opposed to “Friends & Family” will be instantly disqualified and their spot will be forfeited to the next user in line. *

*Re-read the above. Absolutely no exceptions will be made.*


*We will post a list confirming who has and has not paid on Sunday before the deadline. *​* 

We will be verifying who has paid using your previous responses on your USER INFO message. You MUST use the method of payment and account (Paypal or Bank transfer) that you selected last week.*

*For Example:

If Mr. Nakiri Knife selected “Paypal” with an address of [email protected]
We will confirm payment when we receive paypal funds from **[email protected]*

*CRITICAL: You CANNOT switch accounts or payment methods. Unknown payments not listed in PMs will result in an immediate refund and disqualification. *



*If for some reason a spot is not filled by the deadline, the spot will be forfeited to the user next on the waitlist. That (waitlist) user will receive a PM with **18h to confirm or decline the slot**. *

*Rinse and repeat till all knives are paid for. 



Thank you,
A very excited NKW, RockyBasel, and Lemeneid
*


----------



## lemeneid

So gonna be worth it man can’t wait!!! Knife is gonna be awesome!!!

If people need to sell a kidney, I know a guy.


----------



## ian

KAMON Knives said:


> Update:




I don’t really understand the guided system followed by hand polishing progression. Guess it just seems like it’s going to negate the benefits of a guided edge to then work on it freehand after. What’s the philosophy here?

The knives look absolutely spectacular. Inspirational.


----------



## Knivperson

Paid! Cant wait. Great price!


----------



## Jason183




----------



## WildBoar

Paid -- thanks!


----------



## cooktocut

Paid - can’t wait


----------



## Tristan

My bank is asking for the recipients full address oddly
Regardless, payment has been made from my end


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Tristan said:


> My bank is asking for the recipients full address oddly
> Regardless, payment has been made from my end


Same here. RockyBasel sent me his address last night though.


----------



## Bodine

Sent


----------



## RockyBasel

We hope to ship these out to each region next week! Once all is collected


----------



## Froztitanz

Paid. Thanks for the opportunity!


----------



## climbclimb

Thank you all for facilitating!
paid.


----------



## Geigs

Paid.


----------



## drsmp

Paid !


----------



## Jville

Is the handle blue or black?


----------



## drsmp

Bog Oak


----------



## Jville

drsmp said:


> Bog Oak


Ok, the first pic posted about the handle seemed to look blue to me. I should of read better.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

thanks everyone
payment confirmation list coming in ~12h (work providing)


----------



## rob

Paid and excited!


----------



## KAMON Knives

ian said:


> I don’t really understand the guided system followed by hand polishing progression. Guess it just seems like it’s going to negate the benefits of a guided edge to then work on it freehand after. What’s the philosophy here?
> 
> The knives look absolutely spectacular. Inspirational.



No you're right. That doesn't make sense if you've got other better options. The problem is that the shinko doesn't have a fine enough stone I guess. It says it's 6k and on paper therefore even finer than the 5k shapton pro, but it doesn't feel finer. The shapton produces a way better edge at least the way I'm doing it.
So I set the edge on shinko 6k and the 5k shapton pro by hand can be understood more like a strop if that makes sense? Not saying I use it like a strop but it's just used to finish a set edge. Hope that makes sense. 

At the end of the day I'm just looking for a nice ootb edge. Not concentrating too much on particular angles as everyone will eventually set their own edges and angles no matter if they sharpen guided or free hand.


----------



## Dgilks

Paid up and stoked. Thanks for all the effort so far.


----------



## WiriWiri

Phew, Think I just made it in the nick of time, Payment just sent to that Basel fellow, so hoping to be still in with a shout

I have been trapped in a aryuvedic health retreat for a little too long, At first it was pretty bearable. Someone well meaning had paid for this and frankly it was nice to have somewhere quiet away from the kids to sleep for once, plus a couple of the fruitarians were hot. And it wasn‘t too hard to get around the digital detox BS - I had a mobile phone and, strangely enough, the ’digital disruption field’ apparently put in place by the resort‘s resident team of Reiki Grandmasters seemed not to affect it one jot

But it became increasingly clear that they were trying to mount some kind of intervention as the stay dragged on.. By the time mention of the Kamon filtered through to me I had already resolved to leave this ludicrous hippy cult. They did try to stop me, sending the aforementioned Reiki grandmasters to intervene

I still don’t know what Reiki grandmasters are good at. It is not fighting for sure

Anyway, I think I’m back. I would still like a Kamon if at all possible, pretty please.


----------



## IsoJ

WiriWiri said:


> Phew, Think I just made it in the nick of time, Payment just sent to that Basel fellow, so hoping to be still in with a shout
> 
> I have been trapped in a aryuvedic health retreat for a little too long, At first it was pretty bearable. Someone well meaning had paid for this and frankly it was nice to have somewhere quiet away from the kids to sleep for once, plus a couple of the fruitarians were hot. And it wasn‘t too hard to get around the digital detox BS - I had a mobile phone and, strangely enough, the ’digital disruption field’ apparently put in place by the resort‘s resident team of Reiki Grandmasters seemed not to affect it one jot
> 
> But it became increasingly clear that they were trying to mount some kind of intervention as the stay dragged on.. By the time mention of the Kamon filtered through to me I had already resolved to leave this ludicrous hippy cult. They did try to stop me, sending the aforementioned Reiki grandmasters to intervene
> 
> I still don’t know what Reiki grandmasters are good at. It is not fighting for sure
> 
> Anyway, I think I’m back. I would still like a Kamon if at all possible, pretty please.


Nice too see you back and hopefuly you get the Kamon, it beats any Reiki grandmaster 6-0 and some zombies too if needed


----------



## Knivperson

WiriWiri said:


> Phew, Think I just made it in the nick of time, Payment just sent to that Basel fellow, so hoping to be still in with a shout
> 
> I have been trapped in a aryuvedic health retreat for a little too long, At first it was pretty bearable. Someone well meaning had paid for this and frankly it was nice to have somewhere quiet away from the kids to sleep for once, plus a couple of the fruitarians were hot. And it wasn‘t too hard to get around the digital detox BS - I had a mobile phone and, strangely enough, the ’digital disruption field’ apparently put in place by the resort‘s resident team of Reiki Grandmasters seemed not to affect it one jot
> 
> But it became increasingly clear that they were trying to mount some kind of intervention as the stay dragged on.. By the time mention of the Kamon filtered through to me I had already resolved to leave this ludicrous hippy cult. They did try to stop me, sending the aforementioned Reiki grandmasters to intervene
> 
> I still don’t know what Reiki grandmasters are good at. It is not fighting for sure
> 
> Anyway, I think I’m back. I would still like a Kamon if at all possible, pretty please.


Question is: do you have photos of the fruitarians? Asking for a friend.


----------



## demcav

Payment sent -- thank you!


----------



## RockyBasel

WiriWiri said:


> Phew, Think I just made it in the nick of time, Payment just sent to that Basel fellow, so hoping to be still in with a shout
> 
> I have been trapped in a aryuvedic health retreat for a little too long, At first it was pretty bearable. Someone well meaning had paid for this and frankly it was nice to have somewhere quiet away from the kids to sleep for once, plus a couple of the fruitarians were hot. And it wasn‘t too hard to get around the digital detox BS - I had a mobile phone and, strangely enough, the ’digital disruption field’ apparently put in place by the resort‘s resident team of Reiki Grandmasters seemed not to affect it one jot
> 
> But it became increasingly clear that they were trying to mount some kind of intervention as the stay dragged on.. By the time mention of the Kamon filtered through to me I had already resolved to leave this ludicrous hippy cult. They did try to stop me, sending the aforementioned Reiki grandmasters to intervene
> 
> I still don’t know what Reiki grandmasters are good at. It is not fighting for sure
> 
> Anyway, I think I’m back. I would still like a Kamon if at all possible, pretty please.


Never let reiki grandmasters stop your Austrian Kamon Gyuto


----------



## RockyBasel

Almost there - if there are any outstanding folks (I mean, you are all outstanding in a different sense) please get the payments in. We want to start shipping before crazy holiday shipping begins


----------



## Nuts63

Payment sent


----------



## Delat

RockyBasel said:


> Almost there - if there are any outstanding folks (I mean, you are all outstanding in a different sense) please get the payments in. We want to start shipping before crazy holiday shipping begins



Are you guys going to post a list confirming payment? I paid yesterday but sending money off into the ether always leaves me with a suspicion that it either disappeared en route or arrived somewhere unintended.


----------



## captaincaed

Delat said:


> Are you guys going to post a list confirming payment? I paid yesterday but sending money off into the ether always leaves me with a suspicion that it either disappeared en route or arrived somewhere unintended.


Here here


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Delat said:


> Are you guys going to post a list confirming payment? I paid yesterday but sending money off into the ether always leaves me with a suspicion that it either disappeared en route or arrived somewhere unintended.


Still waiting on the bank transfers to hit @RockyBasel's account before posting.

For those paying with PayPal, I've sent a PM to those who still haven't sent funds over.

If you paid with Paypal but you haven't received a PM from me you are good most likely

Thanks for your patience folks, please keep your eyes on this thread for a few more days.


----------



## WildBoar

I love this so much I just paid again!


----------



## Jville

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> Still waiting on the bank transfers to hit @RockyBasel's account before posting.
> 
> For those paying with PayPal, I've sent a PM to those who still haven't sent funds over.
> 
> If you paid with Paypal but you haven't received a PM from me you are good most likely
> 
> Thanks for your patience folks, please keep your eyes on this thread for a few more days.


I haven’t received an PM, so I’m assuming I’m good. I paid.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Don’t know if this is a proper place to talk about it but what is the best way to send money in foreign currency? I used Wise which costed me 845.52 USD to send 770.50 CHF, but how about other options?


----------



## lemeneid

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Don’t know if this is a proper place to talk about it but what is the best way to send money in foreign currency? I used Wise which costed me 845.52 USD to send 770.50 CHF, but how about other options?


Wise would be the cheapest option, cheaper than banks too.
I compared with another transfer using bank and it was lower.
All I can say now is I’m giving the middle finger to PayPal.


----------



## Delat

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Don’t know if this is a proper place to talk about it but what is the best way to send money in foreign currency? I used Wise which costed me 845.52 USD to send 770.50 CHF, but how about other options?



Paypal hit me with a $31 fee, about $875 total. How does Wise work?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Delat said:


> How does Wise work?


wisely aha


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

I have HSBC global money account which charge about 1.3% spread but it can only send fund to another HSBC account. My other banks are indeed much expensive than Wise.


----------



## Knivperson

PP only charged me 2,2 usd fee


----------



## Smidderton

I paid €3,99 ... Weird.


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> PP only charged me 2,2 usd fee


And what’s the overall transaction cost? Because I know PayPal’s FX markup isn’t low either.


----------



## lemeneid

Delat said:


> Paypal hit me with a $31 fee, about $875 total. How does Wise work?


Don’t take my quotation as truth.
Btw, I am double converting here as I am in SG and my currency is SGD.
so its SGD > USD > CHF and its still cheaper


----------



## daddy yo yo

Welcome all to the wonders of F/X and (hidden) fees…


----------



## lemeneid




----------



## daddy yo yo

lemeneid said:


> View attachment 155141


True that. But one thing is for sure: PayPal rips you off - both. Whether it is official or hidden fees/cost (unfavorable conversion rates), PayPal is a rip-off.


----------



## lemeneid

daddy yo yo said:


> True that. But one thing is for sure: PayPal rips you off - both. Whether it is official or hidden fees/cost (unfavorable conversion rates), PayPal is a rip-off.


PayPal as a user in SG is even worse, we don’t have access to FnF, plus we have to convert at an exorbitant rate plus fees. I’ve calculated it once, they take up to a 10% cut for overseas transfers regardless where you are sending the cash to.
So to those getting the Kamon, you will probably have to pay another 10% more just to PayPal cash to Rocky. And that isn’t a small amount for such a large purchase.


----------



## Knivperson

PayPal - not the kinda pal I'd want to drink a beer with!


----------



## tchan001

PayPal takes about a 10% cut for this transaction from Hong Kong too.


----------



## daddy yo yo

tchan001 said:


> PayPal takes about a 10% cut for this transaction from Hong Kong too.


Yeah, right. But don't forget that you have insurance included with PayPal... insurance that is included in your postal service cost most likely, insurance that PayPal will claim back from Postal Service... So, you're paying double insurance, Postal Service and PayPal! What a rip-off! And everybody still loves PayPal!

EDIT: I am now back to envying everyone getting one of these gorgeous knives from Ben despite all the F/X-fuss.


----------



## RockyBasel

Its
“Pay” and then “pal” - I think that says it all


----------



## tchan001

What insurance? It is just a payment to a friend or family.


----------



## daddy yo yo

tchan001 said:


> What insurance? It is just a payment to a friend or family.


I stand corrected. Sorry, my fault.


----------



## tchan001

What I am unsure of is whether it is because payment was made during the weekend rather than the weekday. I would guess that weekend exchange rates may have higher costs.


----------



## WildBoar

yeah, PP was an eye-opener. I wasn't in a position to do a bank transfer though (I need to go in person to a bank branch).


----------



## Corradobrit1

I use Wise now for Fx transactions. Fast and the cheapest option at the moment. PP are the last company I'd use.


----------



## Jville

It cost me $921 for the 260 mm. When I googled it I thought it was going to be like $881.


----------



## captaincaed

The PP exchange rate was much worse, plus a fee.



RockyBasel said:


> “Pay” and then “pal” - I think that says it all



"Pay, Pal" - oh I see, they were missing the comma! It's like "helping your uncle Jack, off his horse". What a difference a comma can make.


----------



## Nuts63

What kills me is the shipping and fees for a 595 euro knife to 770.50 swiss franc shipping and fees


----------



## Delat

Jville said:


> It cost me $921 for the 260 mm. When I googled it I thought it was going to be like $881.



Ouch just double-checked and my total was $906 for the 230. $875 with currency conversion plus the $31 fee.


----------



## Delat

Just to be clear - this is in no way any sort of complaint aimed at or implied to our 3 massketeers. It’s just general whinging at The Man who imposes fees and taxes and whatnot. Anybody who buys a $700 knife can afford to pay The Man.


----------



## Jaszer13

I'm late to the game but if there are any "no shows" add me in to the waiting list please.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update to raise the spirit .


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Update to raise the spirit .



The satisfaction it must be to lay them all out like that, neat and tidy.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> The satisfaction it must be to lay them all out like that, neat and tidy.



It's satisfying but also nerve wrecking as I'm always scared to drop one . Never happened so far, but I know it will some day .


----------



## demcav

Ben, do you have a weight range for each of the two sizes that you could share while we wait (and drool)? 

And congratulations on your charity auctions -- great cause and responses!!


----------



## Jason183

Jville said:


> It cost me $921 for the 260 mm. When I googled it I thought it was going to be like $881.



Same here

I never buy any knife for over $500 USD before, but I think this Kamon knife worth it as time goes on. It’s going to be my best All-Rounder knife for sure.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*PAID/NOT PAID LIST: *​
*Update: *All paypal payments are in. Due to the 2 day timing of bank transfers, we are waiting until tomorrow for funds to arrive in @RockyBasel's account. We will confirm paid when the funds arrive.

*BANK TRANSFER PEOPLE:* Please (re) send a screenshot of your transaction so we know if/when to expect it. Some have sent it to me already, please reply back to the message so I can keep track.

Thanks all.
NKW


*Paid (Y=1/N=0)**User **Region**Country **Size**Index**Info Sent (Y/N)**Payment (Bank/PP)*1@cooktocutNAUSA26051PP1@JvilleNAUSA26081PP1@KeatNAUSA260171PP1@Jason183NAUSA260181PP1@drsmpNAUSA260201PP1@AcidwashNAUSA260211PP1@captaincaedNAUSA260321PP1@climbclimbNAUSA260391PP1@WiriWiriEUUK260401PP1@robAPACAus260311PP1@0x0xEUAustria260271PP1@JoshNACanada22541PP1@DelatNAUSA225231PP1@IkonakaNAUSA225261PP1@hendrixNAUSA225301PP1@zeaderanNAUSA225341PP1@DefinegoodNAUSA225361PP1@demcavNAUSA225371PP1@BodineNAUSA225381PP1@SmiddertonEUGermany225241PP1@KnivpersonEUDenmark225251PP1@pow_powEUGermany225351PP1@tchan001APACHK225161PP1@GeigsAPACAus225291PP1@WildBoarNAUSA225141PP1@Nuts63NAUSA225131PP1@Bico DoceNAUSA22561PP1@toddnmdNAUSA22591PP1@LostHighwayNAUSA225101PP1@esooNACanada225121PP1@nakiriknaifuwaifuNAUSA26011Bank1@RockyBaselEUCHE26021N/A1@lemeneidAPACSG26031Banks@gogogo545EUSweden225191Banks@julius777APACMalaysia/SG225221Banks@TristanAPACSG260151Banks@Hz_zzzzzzNAUSA225111Banks@SdoEUIreland225281Banks@FroztitanzAPACSG22571Banks@DgilksAPACAus225331Bank


----------



## RockyBasel

Can I get some more pics from @KAMON Knives from Vienna please. These Austrian knives (not to be confused with Germany) are so purdy


----------



## KAMON Knives

demcav said:


> Ben, do you have a weight range for each of the two sizes that you could share while we wait (and drool)?
> 
> And congratulations on your charity auctions -- great cause and responses!!



Damn. I always forget to weigh my knives . Should have something between 200-240g I'd say. 

And thx a lot about the charity. I'm very happy with it so far. Didn't expect that amount and it still goes on.


----------



## Tristan

The lack of a 1 next to my name is causing me anxiety given how many days ago the bank happily took my money


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Tristan said:


> The lack of a 1 next to my name is causing me anxiety given how many days ago the bank happily took my money


still waiting to confirm funds but I hear you. 
I've added an "s" next to the users who have sent in screenshots of their payment to me so far. 

anyway, here is a cute cat pic to soothe your anxiety


----------



## Sdo

Screenshot sent.

Cheers!


----------



## Geigs

When do we get to pick the number of hammer indentations and is it too late to ask for mine to make the shape of a phallus?


----------



## Froztitanz

Screenshot submitted.


----------



## Jville

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> still waiting to confirm funds but I hear you.
> I've added an "s" next to the users who have sent in screenshots of their payment to me so far.
> 
> anyway, here is a cute cat pic to soothe your anxiety
> 
> View attachment 155215


That makes me feel better.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Geigs said:


> When do we get to pick the number of hammer indentations and is it too late to ask for mine to make the shape of a phallus?



I like challenges


----------



## Bico Doce

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> *Update: *All paypal payments are in. Due to the 2 day timing of bank transfers, we are waiting until tomorrow for funds to arrive in @RockyBasel's account. We will confirm paid when the funds arrive.


Did all of this get sorted out or is it still pending?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*PAID/NOT PAID LIST: *​
*Update: All payments are in. *@RockyBasel has sent funds via bank transfer to @KAMON Knives - which will take 1 to 2 business days. Upon confirmation of funds by @KAMON Knives the knives will be shipped. 

Thank you, 
NKW



*Paid (Y=1/N=0)**User**Region**Country**Size**Index**Info Sent (Y/N)**Payment (Bank/PP)*1@cooktocutNAUSA26051PP1@JvilleNAUSA26081PP1@KeatNAUSA260171PP1@Jason183NAUSA260181PP1@drsmpNAUSA260201PP1@AcidwashNAUSA260211PP1@captaincaedNAUSA260321PP1@climbclimbNAUSA260391PP1@WiriWiriEUUK260401PP1@robAPACAus260311PP1@0x0xEUAustria260271PP1@JoshNACanada22541PP1@DelatNAUSA225231PP1@IkonakaNAUSA225261PP1@hendrixNAUSA225301PP1@zeaderanNAUSA225341PP1@DefinegoodNAUSA225361PP1@demcavNAUSA225371PP1@BodineNAUSA225381PP1@SmiddertonEUGermany225241PP1@KnivpersonEUDenmark225251PP1@pow_powEUGermany225351PP1@tchan001APACHK225161PP1@GeigsAPACAus225291PP1@WildBoarNAUSA225141PP1@Nuts63NAUSA225131PP1@Bico DoceNAUSA22561PP1@toddnmdNAUSA22591PP1@LostHighwayNAUSA225101PP1@esooNACanada225121PP1@nakiriknaifuwaifuNAUSA26011Bank1@RockyBaselEUCHE26021N/A1@lemeneidAPACSG26031Bank1@gogogo545EUSweden225191Bank1@julius777APACMalaysia/SG225221Bank1@TristanAPACSG260151Bank1@Hz_zzzzzzNAUSA225111Bank1@SdoEUIreland225281Bank1@FroztitanzAPACSG22571Bank1@DgilksAPACAus225331Bank


----------



## Bico Doce

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> Upon confirmation of funds by @KAMON Knives the knives will be shipped


I apologize if this is obvious to everyone else (I admittedly tuned out when I didn't make the cut initially). Will there be additional shipping cost to cover the knives going from the distributor to the individual?


----------



## drsmp

Pretty sure they factored in all costs to get the knives to us


----------



## Knivperson

So, for people in EU, @KAMON Knives will ship to @RockyBasel, who will then ship to the EU-countries? Rocky is in Switzerland, right? If so, it means that it's shipped from a non-EU country, to EU, meaning tax. I know that this is factored in the price we paid, but, just didn't think about it before now. All the time I just somehow thought of Switzerland as an EU country.


----------



## M1k3

Knivperson said:


> So, for people in EU, @KAMON Knives will ship to @RockyBasel, who will then ship to the EU-countries? Rocky is in Switzerland, right? If so, it means that it's shipped from a non-EU country, to EU, meaning tax. I know that this is factored in the price we paid, but, just didn't think about it before now. All the time I just somehow thought of Switzerland as an EU country.


Unless he makes a drop off in Germany?


----------



## SirCutAlot

I guess he will get knives in EU and send it from EU... all other options are plain stupid.

I worked in switzerland and many other countrys, the customs there are the hardest in my opinion. 

SirCutALot


----------



## Knivperson

M1k3 said:


> Unless he makes a drop off in Germany?


Don't have time to search the whole thread, but wasn't there something about, Rocky going to Austria to collect the knives, because it was only a short drive, and then shipping from there? Dunno.. Maybe it's just something I made up unwillingly.


----------



## Sdo

Knivperson said:


> Don't have time to search the whole thread, but wasn't there something about, Rocky going to Austria to collect the knives, because it was only a short drive, and then shipping from there? Dunno.. Maybe it's just something I made up unwillingly.


Rocky is going to ship from Germany. It is on this thread but not sure where anymore.

Cheers.


----------



## Knivperson

Sdo said:


> Rocky is going to ship from Germany. It is on this thread but not sure where anymore.
> 
> Cheers.


Thanks, just searched a lot of the pages, didn't find it, but then I remembered almost correctly. Cleaver solution that is.


----------



## Geigs

KAMON Knives said:


> I like challenges



This is apparently a 'Half Kamon" according to the ebay listing, seems about right. This is what I wanted hammered into my blade


----------



## RockyBasel

Shipping from Germany


----------



## KAMON Knives

Geigs said:


> This is apparently a 'Half Kamon" according to the ebay listing, seems about right. This is what I wanted hammered into my blade



I'd totally make me a similar touchmark with a cucumber on it for a special edition knife but I've heard the cucumber stamp is already in use by Dan Prendergast. He uses a different term to describe cucumber though . Must be a British thing .


----------



## KAMON Knives

Update:


----------



## gregfisk

Could I have the one that’s 8 over from the left in the top row? I like the dent pattern in that one.

Oh, never mind. I forgot, I’m not part of the mass drop.


----------



## MarcelNL

I snoozed for too long too...what a feast for the eye!


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Update:



Im curious - have you gained anything from this? Besides a shitload of money. Anything learned you can use in the future?


----------



## Lars

Well done @KAMON Knives


----------



## AT5760

Awesome work @KAMON Knives. I've really enjoyed following this thread.


----------



## gregfisk

Ben, I’m very impressed with your dedication to your business and your craft. The end product is stunning! It takes a special type of person to thrive at self employment because you always, or nearly always have to be motivated. I think if it were me who just made a huge order of knives, I’d be inclined to take a break, reflect, take pride in what I accomplished and then relax a bit.


----------



## RockyBasel

Knives have been shipped to @nakiriknaifuwaifu, @lemeneid and me of course

Next week, after we receive, we will do a quick turnaround and get it out to everyone

These knives are absolutely stunning in the pictures, I can only imagine what they will be like once we hold them in hands and use them on boards

Thank you Ben, for sharing your thinking and techniques as a bladesmith with us along the journey of this truly incredible KKF massdrop

And thanks to all KKF members for your support and trust in making this happen

We are a really cool global community!


----------



## WiriWiri

Thoroughly looking forward to this now - those knives look delicious.

And oh so consistent too, blimey.


----------



## Jovidah

Too late for this massdrop, but for the future: don't let paypal convert currencies for you. Their rates are abysmal; for me letting my creditcard agency or bank convert it always came out way better.


----------



## RockyBasel

Jovidah said:


> Too late for this massdrop, but for the future: don't let paypal convert currencies for you. Their rates are abysmal; for me letting my creditcard agency or bank convert it always came out way better.


Oh, we are painfully aware of PayPal fees


----------



## lemeneid

Jovidah said:


> Too late for this massdrop, but for the future: don't let paypal convert currencies for you. Their rates are abysmal; for me letting my creditcard agency or bank convert it always came out way better.


Card is actually a good option. You can clock miles and rebates to offset the PayPal fees too


----------



## sansho

Jovidah said:


> Too late for this massdrop, but for the future: don't let paypal convert currencies for you. Their rates are abysmal; for me letting my creditcard agency or bank convert it always came out way better.



yep. pay in native currency and let visa or your bank exchange for you.

for visa usa, you can use this tool to get the xr:


https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html



also, watch out for foreign transaction fees (~3%). unfortunately, i don't know of a way to truly know ahead of time if one will be assessed. so.. if you even suspect a foreign bank could be involved in the transaction, it's best to use a card that doesn't charge one. if you don't already have a card like that, maybe get the amazon credit card. no annual fee, and you get 5% cash back from amazon purchases if you have prime. i pretty much just use mine for amazon and intl purchases.

still, for this buy, i suspect transferwise was the cheapest option for most people.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

With PayPal F&F, I don’t know how to let my bank or visa convert currency. If I choose to send in CHF, PP simply charge me USD after its own expensive conversion plus a fee. With PayPal G&S there are ways to save as mentioned above though.


----------



## sansho

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> With PayPal F&F, I don’t know how to let my bank or visa convert currency.



the options you get are context-dependent.

but at the very least, you can typically pay natively with credit cards. example screenshot showing the feature:


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> Im curious - have you gained anything from this? Besides a shitload of money. Anything learned you can use in the future?



Haha I wouldn't say a **** load of money. Everyone can calculate what I've made in that mass drop, so it's no secret, but bear in mind that this amount is for 2 months of work. The other thing one can't forget are running costs like shop rent (12k€/year), material costs (grinding belts, steel, end caps and handle materials,...), what I personally need to live for my family and me, a little buffer you want to gather on your business account to compensate for machine fails (or 2 months of no income ;p) and last but not least - income tax... In Austria ~20% to almost ~50% (!) of the money I make above 11k€/year just gets taken (it's a progressive system and a little complicated). 
Not Complaining. I'm self employed by my choice and I wouldn't want to change that, but I need to set it into perspective for you guys to understand that I'm not rich now. You can't imagine how fast that amount of money gets spent once you're self employed . 

What I've gained is the experience mainly. I had lots of fun making those knives. The work itself I knew, but the organization part was exciting and I'm happy how it turned out. 
I only made one major mistake I didn't yet tell anyone. 
Originally I ordered everything in advance and then started the batch once everything was here. By accident I didn't order enough washers for the sayas. Just thought somehow 500pcs would be ebough. That only lasts for 35 sayas though . The shop I normally order them at, didn't have them at the time I wanted to order more, in the middle of Saya making, so I had to order somewhere else where I had no clue about shipping times. I called them and they were kind enough to hurry up and compensate for my mistake. 

What I also gained is some coverage within this forum and explaining to you guys what I do. So thanks to this community for the opportunity and for listening . 



gregfisk said:


> Ben, I’m very impressed with your dedication to your business and your craft. The end product is stunning! It takes a special type of person to thrive at self employment because you always, or nearly always have to be motivated. I think if it were me who just made a huge order of knives, I’d be inclined to take a break, reflect, take pride in what I accomplished and then relax a bit.



That's a good point. As friends often tell me they'd just lazy sit around and watch YouTube all day which is a problem . 
For one beeing able to provide for my family is a huge motivation. Sounds corny but it's a fact that I provided with my "newly" founded company for the last 2 years alone for my family as my wife was home with my second son. That's not an easy thing to do so soon after founding it but it worked out good. Was hard work though. 
The other motivation is that I draw clear lines in the sand. Many knife makers want to get away from custom orders as they can be really exhausting. The back and forth with the customer takes a lot of time and often you'll get pushed out of your comfort zone. I try to stay true to some principles to avoid that. 
For one how I make customs is like a building block system. Stainless end caps or paper micarta ones... That doesn't matter much to me. The other thing is that I'll take special requests, BUT only if I can stand behind them and think they're a good idea. I did stuff back then I couldn't stand behind and that **** is just exhausting. You're not motivated. You don't enjoy it. Worse if you actually hate it. And when you're alone in your shop and need to get stuff done then that's hell. 
All that is why I don't offer my stainless shichi mai to order for example (way too much fails. Way too depressing). 
Another motivation is that I like to try new stuff like my forged mono integrals. One fun project just for me to try out is in every batch. That keeps me motivated too and kinda innovating as well. Could be a new handle shape too or whatever. Just examples. 



RockyBasel said:


> Knives have been shipped to @nakiriknaifuwaifu, @lemeneid and me of course
> 
> Next week, after we receive, we will do a quick turnaround and get it out to everyone
> 
> These knives are absolutely stunning in the pictures, I can only imagine what they will be like once we hold them in hands and use them on boards
> 
> Thank you Ben, for sharing your thinking and techniques as a bladesmith with us along the journey of this truly incredible KKF massdrop
> 
> And thanks to all KKF members for your support and trust in making this happen
> 
> We are a really cool global community!



Big THANKS to you Massketeers for inviting me! It is an honor and it was a lot of fun! 

Maybe make the next batch 80 knives and start right away? 

Seriously though. Curious who will participate in the next mass drop. Great job for the community ! 




PS: **** automatically gets censored here? I don't want to open up a topic but are we little kids here or something?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

KAMON Knives said:


> Big THANKS to you Massketeers for inviting me! It is an honor and it was a lot of fun!
> Maybe make the next batch 80 knives and start right away?



The honour was ours Ben 
I will save the remaining kisses for my sappy oscar's thank you speech of an ending post after everyone gets their knife, until then it is distribution time!

just kidding here is one more kiss dear benjamin


----------



## sansho

KAMON Knives said:


> PS: **** automatically gets censored here? I don't want to open up a topic but are we little kids here or something? ✌



i guess so.


----------



## Knivperson

KAMON Knives said:


> Haha I wouldn't say a **** load of money.


Haha I understand, I live in Denmark, I pay almost 50 % tax. Just meant that it was a big load, like, all at once. Some people like big loads others more drip wise.... At the end of the day, end state is the same, I guess.

Thanks for all, Ive asked a shi... a lot of questions and youve answered all of them.

Btw - agree on the weird censorship, like *** is the point? ****ing hell.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

sansho said:


> the options you get are context-dependent.
> 
> but at the very least, you can typically pay natively with credit cards. example screenshot showing the feature:
> 
> View attachment 155570


Thanks. I’ve never went to that step so it is better than I thought. Basically about a 3.9% fee. Assuming a 1.5% cash back from the card and no foreign exchange fee, the net cost is about 2.4%. Not too bad.


----------



## sansho

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Thanks. I’ve never went to that step so it is better than I thought. Basically about a 3.9% fee. Assuming a 1.5% cash back from the card and no foreign exchange fee, the net cost is about 2.4%. Not too bad.



first, that 3.9% fee is not the foreign transaction fee i'm talking about. that is a fee that paypal (not your card) is charging you. they typically charge something like this when you pay F&F with CC. it is partially to offset the CC merchant fees they incur. and partially for profit. it also depends on the country when you're doing an intl payment. it's pretty much like paying the "G&S" fee, but the sender experiences it on his end. if you did G&S instead of F&F, you wouldn't see it, but that same fee (probably identical amount) then comes out of the recipient's take.

1.5% cash back? do you mean chase freedom unlimited? (_"Chase gives YOU the Freedom to get yourself into unlimited debt!"®_)

if so, fyi that card does charge a 3% foreign transaction fee. and i'm almost certain that this transaction would incur one since you're probably sending it to a non-US PP account. even if you get +1.5% cash back, with the -3% fee, you're still at -1.5%.
so you're better off using a card that doesn't have a foreign fee. typically the best you can do then is 1% cash back.

also btw, paying in foreign currency is not a good predictor of if you get hit with this foreign transaction fee. likewise, paying in USD instead will not save you from it. it's not that simple. you get hit with that fee pretty much if a foreign bank is somewhere in the transaction. like i said, you basically can't know it for sure ahead of time. they don't give us peon consumers tools to simulate or trace a transaction.  so when in doubt, don't get greedy with those CC points, especially on a big transaction. use your basic-ass, no-foreign-transaction-fee card and settle for 1% cash back.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

sansho said:


> first, that 3.9% fee is not the foreign transaction fee i'm talking about. that is a fee that paypal (not your card) is charging you. they typically charge something like this when you pay F&F with CC. it is partially to offset the CC merchant fees they incur. and partially for profit. it also depends on the country when you're doing an intl payment. it's pretty much like paying the "G&S" fee, but the sender experiences it on his end. if you did G&S instead of F&F, you wouldn't see it, but that same fee (probably identical amount) then comes out of the recipient's take.
> 
> 1.5% cash back? do you mean chase freedom unlimited? (_"Chase gives YOU the Freedom to get yourself into unlimited debt!"®_)
> 
> if so, fyi that card does charge a 3% foreign transaction fee. and i'm almost certain that this transaction would incur one since you're probably sending it to a non-US PP account. even if you get +1.5% cash back, with the -3% fee, you're still at -1.5%.
> so you're better off using a card that doesn't have a foreign fee. typically the best you can do then is 1% cash back.
> 
> also btw, paying in foreign currency is not a good predictor of if you get hit with this foreign transaction fee. likewise, paying in USD instead will not save you from it. it's not that simple. you get hit with that fee pretty much if a foreign bank is somewhere in the transaction. like i said, you basically can't know it for sure ahead of time. they don't give us peon consumers tools to simulate or trace a transaction.  so when in doubt, don't get greedy with those CC points, especially on a big transaction. use your basic-ass, no-foreign-transaction-fee card and settle for 1% cash back.


I’m talking about BofA travel rewards card. That card charges no foreign transaction fee and gives 1.5% cash back on everything. I have multiple cards that don’t foreign transaction fee but this one and discover are the only 2 that don’t charge an annual fee. The discover it miles card is supposed to charge no annual fee, no foreign transaction fee and gives 1.5 % cash back as well but I’ve never used it for foreign transaction so not sure about its foreign exchange rate spread.


----------



## esoo

sansho said:


> the options you get are context-dependent.
> 
> but at the very least, you can typically pay natively with credit cards. example screenshot showing the feature:
> 
> View attachment 155570



For Canada, I don’t get that option. If I pay from my bank, PayPal does the conversion, but if I pay by card, it automatically lets the card do the conversion. Thing is, if I let PayPal do the conversion using their ****** rates, their fee is $3CAD. If I run the conversion back to my card, the fee increases to the point that I’m still paying the same amount as if I used PayPal’s conversion. When doing F&F, PayPal screws you no matter what


----------



## Delat

How do you pronounce Kamon? ka-MOAN, COME-on, KA-mun?


----------



## big_adventure

Delat said:


> How do you pronounce Kamon? ka-MOAN, COME-on, KA-mun?



You pronounce it WAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH (tears because I don't get one of these masterpieces).


----------



## esoo

I'm just hoping for a Christmas arrival...


----------



## big_adventure

esoo said:


> I'm just hoping for a Christmas arrival...



Hopefully you will want to sell this one too.  

I say that, but I got KILLED on import duties on your Dalman.


----------



## esoo

big_adventure said:


> Hopefully you will want to sell this one too.
> 
> I say that, but I got KILLED on import duties on your Dalman.



Next time, if it happens, we chose a different carrier. I feel bad about how much of a nightmare that turned out to be. It really did suck.


----------



## big_adventure

esoo said:


> Next time, if it happens, we chose a different carrier. I feel bad about how much of a nightmare that turned out to be. It really did suck.



Hey, no big deal, it's a cost of doing business, as it were. You were (and presumably still are  ) a perfect seller. And I have a lefty-bias Dalman, complete with hamon at no extra charge.


----------



## SirCutAlot

Delat said:


> How do you pronounce Kamon? ka-MOAN, COME-on, KA-mun?


*** on  (C U M on)


----------



## Delat

SirCutAlot said:


> *** on  (C U M on)



I was expecting a lot of p*nis jokes but it’s actually a serious question!


----------



## esoo

Delat said:


> I was expecting a lot of p*nis jokes but it’s actually a serious question!



I personally go with K-mon or Kah-mon.

I think you need to summon him - @KAMON Knives


----------



## SirCutAlot

Delat said:


> I was expecting a lot of p*nis jokes but it’s actually a serious question!


And this was a serious answer. 

SirCutALot.


----------



## JayS20

Delat said:


> How do you pronounce Kamon? ka-MOAN, COME-on, KA-mun?


What comes pretty close: Ka-mon
Ka: car, but you don't pronounce the r
mon, like in monster


----------



## M1k3

JayS20 said:


> What comes pretty close: Ka-mon
> Ka: car, but you don't pronounce the r
> mon, like in monster


Like you're from Bahston! Monsta cah! Cah-mon!


----------



## gregfisk

This is a great question. I assumed it was 
Ka mone but that’s just a guess.


----------



## lemeneid

Guess I’m first?


----------



## esoo

lemeneid said:


> Guess I’m first?
> View attachment 156008



Now that is a box!!!!!!!


----------



## captaincaed




----------



## esoo




----------



## Delat

lemeneid said:


> Guess I’m first?
> View attachment 156008



Yeah that belongs on the box thread


----------



## lemeneid

esoo said:


> Now that is a box!!!!!!!


You should check out @nakiriknaifuwaifu box, he has 3 of these!


----------



## lemeneid

captaincaed said:


> View attachment 156010


Sharp pointed object with hammer marks obviously.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

lemeneid said:


> You should check out @nakiriknaifuwaifu box, he has 3 of these!


not yet at least  
packages still in the air for me and @RockyBasel
how @lemeneid in Singapore got his first I have no idea lol


----------



## KAMON Knives

Delat said:


> How do you pronounce Kamon? ka-MOAN, COME-on, KA-mun?



@SirCutAlot sounded like he was joking but it's actually true . 
@JayS20 and @M1k3 are correct too with their expectations.

It's not Cayman. That is what I've heard most from English speaking guys. But even then I don't really mind. Call me Benjamin, Ben, Cayman, Schnucki... As long as I know you're talking to me we're good .


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

KAMON Knives said:


> @SirCutAlot sounded like he was joking but it's actually true .
> @JayS20 and @M1k3 are correct too with their expectations.
> 
> It's not Cayman. That is what I've heard most from English speaking guys. But even then I don't really mind. Call me Benjamin, Ben, Cayman, Schnucki... As long as I know you're talking to me we're good .


"a rose Kamon by any other name would smell just as sweet forge just as well"
-Shakespeare NKW


----------



## lemeneid

Just got home






Medium Rare or well done?


----------



## KAMON Knives

So happy they arrived safely @lemeneid. Unpackaged yours already? 


A thing to be said that I almost forgot: 

The the knife sits inside those boxes wrapped in a cardboard sheet. The knife is within my black paper wrap but the Saya is delivered separately within this cardboard wrap, but outside of the black paper wrap. I'm just saying so no one is confused on where the Saya is hiding and maybe accidentally throws it into the trash with the packaging. 

The Saya itself works best if you shove your knife in there sliding with the spine on the upper/spine rubber spacers. I think that's somewhat standard procedure same as with wooden sayas too because the edge could jam into wood also but yeah... Just saying ^^.


----------



## lemeneid

KAMON Knives said:


> So happy they arrived safely @lemeneid. Unpackaged yours already?
> 
> 
> A thing to be said that I almost forgot:
> 
> The the knife sits inside those boxes wrapped in a cardboard sheet. The knife is within my black paper wrap but the Saya is delivered separately within this cardboard wrap, but outside of the black paper wrap. I'm just saying so no one is confused on where the Saya is hiding and maybe accidentally throws it into the trash with the packaging.
> 
> The Saya itself works best if you shove your knife in there sliding with the spine on the upper/spine rubber spacers. I think that's somewhat standard procedure same as with wooden sayas too because the edge could jam into wood also but yeah... Just saying ^^.


It’s received well man. Handling is nice so far. Will be sending out the ones I have tomorrow, while the guys local here come and pick theirs up tonight.

And the packing box is overkill 
Mines about 237g, is that on the high end or low end?


----------



## KAMON Knives

Better safe than sorry I guess


----------



## Knivperson

Fact that it got faster to Singapore than Switzerland is strange. Shipping times has little to do with distance, I guess. Actually I once received a knife from Knifewear in 2 days, Canada to Denmark. By comparison shipping from Sweden, our dear neighbourg, has taken 10+ days before. Somehow packages from Sweden end up in this sorting facility where it's being "sorted" for days and days. I imagine a kinda Charlie and The Chocolate Factory-like place, the package going round and up and down on colorful conveyor belts. Probably just lying in a big pile while the staff are smoking cigarettes and watching youtube-videos though.


----------



## lemeneid

Sent off other knives to @Tristan and @Froztitanz.

The two 260mm knives we have here are same in dimensions. And only 4g apart in weight!


----------



## Migraine

Kamon's attention to detail with packaging is one of the things that really struck me when I got my (non-massdrop) one. Stuff like that matters a LOT both in terms the function it provides but also the perceptions of the customer. Really goes to show the level of care Ben has for what he produces.


----------



## demcav

lemeneid said:


> Mines about 237g, is that on the high end or low end?





KAMON Knives said:


> Damn. I always forget to weigh my knives . Should have something between 200-240g I'd say.



Ben's response above was his "guesstimate" for the weight range that included the knives in both sizes -- 225mm and 260mm.


----------



## lemeneid

First carrot done! I’m must say even though I don’t use knives over 250mm and still getting used to it, first impressions are good! The initial feeling I get is similar to what I had when I got my Denka. And its been a while since I had that.


----------



## demcav

I'd like to request that the 225mm that gets forwarded to me after arriving in the US remain sealed in its outer box. That way I can experience the entire Kamon knife unpackaging just as if receiving it directly from Ben.

Each knife has been packed so carefully by Ben, I'm willing to forego any need for an inspection before it gets forwarded to me. If this request will cause any issues for @nakiriknaifuwaifu, please let me know.

Thanks -- and can hardly wait!!


----------



## lemeneid

Official specs of mine, as measured with calipers 

237g
58.1mm heel height
6.1mm thickness at spine
2.07mm in the middle
0.74mm 1cm from the tip.


----------



## cooktocut

I second that, if only to take a little work off of the masskateers shoulders. I’m very familiar with Ben’s exemplary packing skills


----------



## lemeneid

cooktocut said:


> I second that, if only to take a little work off of the masskateers shoulders. I’m very familiar with Ben’s exemplary packing skills


Yup, the knife in the current packaging will survive a nuclear apocalypse. You need to experience it for yourself!


----------



## RockyBasel

Well, here is the situation in Switzerland….


----------



## RockyBasel

Package has arrived safe and sound. Packed so well that I knew only an Austrian could have packed that way


----------



## RockyBasel

Here are the knife pics,,,Giddy
226 gm, 270x60


----------



## RockyBasel

Ben packed the boxes, so all we will do is slap a shipping label to nuclear proof packaging so you can experience the full packaging experience


----------



## Smidderton

@RockyBasel ahhh, you got the weird looking "bog oak"


----------



## RockyBasel

Damn that saya is sweet - it’s the perfect knife package to receive. Fit finish is impeccable 

Ben, thank you so much

the knives are incredible

I will be shipping out this weekend so hope to somewhat beat the x-mas rush

some lucky people should start seeing their knives By the end of next week


----------



## RockyBasel

Smidderton said:


> @RockyBasel ahhh, you got the weird looking "bog oak"


Ben is too kind, threw in an extra handle


----------



## RockyBasel

The unpacking itself is an experience


----------



## KAMON Knives

Knivperson said:


> Fact that it got faster to Singapore than Switzerland is strange. Shipping times has little to do with distance, I guess. Actually I once received a knife from Knifewear in 2 days, Canada to Denmark. By comparison shipping from Sweden, our dear neighbourg, has taken 10+ days before. Somehow packages from Sweden end up in this sorting facility where it's being "sorted" for days and days. I imagine a kinda Charlie and The Chocolate Factory-like place, the package going round and up and down on colorful conveyor belts. Probably just lying in a big pile while the staff are smoking cigarettes and watching youtube-videos though.



Funny side fact. I recently learned from my fedex agent, on the topic why my national (within Austria) Tarif is about double to what I pay for the same shipment to the US, that it's actually more difficult for them to ship within Austria, than to ship internationally. It's just how their network is built. I guess that explains how it can take longer to ship to Switzerland than to Singapore. 

He gave me an even bigger % discount on my national shipments, than for all my international ones, but still it's more expensive so they don't even want to encourage that I have the feeling. I guess it's also because they can't compete with local services. Local services need 1 day... 2 sometimes, and are cheap so there's nothing to gain for them I think.


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> Here are the knife pics,,,Giddy
> 226 gm, 270x60
> 
> View attachment 156059
> View attachment 156060
> View attachment 156061
> View attachment 156062
> View attachment 156063
> View attachment 156064
> View attachment 156065
> View attachment 156066


Damn, picture number 5 - it seriously looks like something out of Predator or something. Absolutely leathal.

Doesn't this also have a different more greyish finish? Is it just the 260 or even longer?


----------



## Bico Doce

I know the massketeers earned the right to enjoy their knives first but this tease also feels like cruel and unusual punishment for the rest of us!


----------



## RockyBasel

Knivperson said:


> Damn, picture number 5 - it seriously looks like something out of Predator or something. Absolutely leathal.
> 
> Doesn't this also have a different more greyish finish? Is it just the 260 or even longer?


It is a slate grey/blue KU - it’s not KU in the traditional sense - it’s stunning in person


----------



## RockyBasel

Knivperson said:


> Damn, picture number 5 - it seriously looks like something out of Predator or something. Absolutely leathal.
> 
> Doesn't this also have a different more greyish finish? Is it just the 260 or even longer?


The length for my 260 is 270 heel to tip. For @lemeneid it was 267


----------



## WiriWiri

I am so looking forward to opening this present early. It would perhaps seem unfestive to spend Xmas morning lovingly unwrapping and brandishing a whopping lump of cold steel around the tree, as fetching as the blue-grey Ku sounds. A 260 is also probably overkill for casual present slashing duties and may be badly received.

But, by gum, those blades look smashing. Unlike some makers I have no earthly compulsion to request anything other than ’any of the big knives in that big Basel box,’ No secret channels will be need to be opened, pleading for one of the musketeers to chose one with a ‘good grind‘ or less shabby sabi than the other. These things look prime and I’d be stoked to receive any one of them. 

Bring it on postie. Taxman step back


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> The length for my 260 is 270 heel to tip. For @lemeneid it was 267


You can definately strap that to a long stick and make an awesome weapon if a zombie apocalypse ever is actualized.


----------



## Tristan

I have my 260 safely in hand and it's a beauty. Many thanks to the organisers and of course to Ben. Dude you're a machine.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

RockyBasel said:


> The length for my 260 is 270 heel to tip. For @lemeneid it was 267


So I guess our 225 would be 230? Perfect!


----------



## lemeneid

Massdrop 1 & 2

@RDalman @KAMON Knives


----------



## big_adventure

lemeneid said:


> Massdrop 1 & 2
> 
> @RDalman @KAMON Knives
> 
> View attachment 156289



Tiny correction: that's Massdrop 1 & 3.

I want a massdrop Kamon next to my Dalman.


----------



## Knivperson

big_adventure said:


> Tiny correction: that's Massdrop 1 & 3.
> 
> I want a massdrop Kamon next to my Dalman.


You mean Xerxes?


----------



## big_adventure

Knivperson said:


> You mean Xerxes?



I mean, yeah, sure, I'd love one of those too, but that man needs to heal and this probably isn't the thread to discuss it. I was just mentioning, in all humility, that this was MD3 and not MD2. Get your sequels right! 

To note: I missed the cut massively on both MD2 and MD3.


----------



## Knivperson

big_adventure said:


> I mean, yeah, sure, I'd love one of those too, but that man needs to heal and this probably isn't the thread to discuss it. I was just mentioning, in all humility, that this was MD3 and not MD2. Get your sequels right!
> 
> To note: I missed the cut massively on both MD2 and MD3.


I missed 1 and 2. Just thought you implied you would like to see md2 next to md1 to keep things in order and that you just accidentally wrote kamon


----------



## big_adventure

Knivperson said:


> I missed 1 and 2. Just thought you implied you would like to see md2 next to md1 to keep things in order and that you just accidentally wrote kamon



Nah, I got it! No worries, misunderstandings are what keeps the Internet moving!


----------



## daddy yo yo

big_adventure said:


> misunderstandings are what keeps the Internet moving!


…and cat videos, of course!


----------



## big_adventure

daddy yo yo said:


> …and cat videos, of course!



Well, yeah, that's class.


----------



## RockyBasel

big_adventure said:


> Tiny correction: that's Massdrop 1 & 3.
> 
> I want a massdrop Kamon next to my Dalman.


You are correct sir. It is indeed


----------



## Knivperson

What are the EU knives shipped with? Wanna download the app - if so, I would be able to see tracking info, right? @RockyBasel


----------



## RockyBasel

I will send all recipients via PM their tracking info. I will use Deutsche Post for trackable shipping


----------



## Smidderton

Thanks for your efforts.


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> I will send all recipients via PM their tracking info. I will use Deutsche Post for trackable shipping


Oh, how fine. Thanks!!!


----------



## MarcelNL

From one of the courier helpdesks I got the tip to use this site to track international shipments ALL-IN-ONE PACKAGE TRACKING | 17TRACK


----------



## daddy yo yo

MarcelNL said:


> From one of the courier helpdesks I got the tip to use this site to track international shipments ALL-IN-ONE PACKAGE TRACKING | 17TRACK


This tracking site frequently shows more updates than original shipping/carrier tracking sites…


----------



## RockyBasel

*Question for EU recipients*:

will you be home this holiday season or should I ship after Jan 1?

if you are concerned about delays or returns because you are not home during Christmas season, let me know and I will hold shipping till after holidays

I have already had a request to hold shipping after Dec 28


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> *Question for EU recipients*:
> 
> will you be home this holiday season or should I ship after Jan 1?
> 
> if you are concerned about delays or returns because you are not home during Christmas season, let me know and I will hold shipping till after holidays
> 
> I have already had a request to hold shipping after Dec 28


Im home all Christmas.


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> Im home all Christmas.


usually when important parcels are due to come I usually take a day off, or have them sent to my office. No excuse to let it slip


----------



## Knivperson

lemeneid said:


> usually when important parcels are due to come I usually take a day off, or have them sent to my office. No excuse to let it slip


"hi boss, yeah, Im sick today"


----------



## pow_pow

RockyBasel said:


> *Question for EU recipients*:
> 
> will you be home this holiday season or should I ship after Jan 1?
> 
> if you are concerned about delays or returns because you are not home during Christmas season, let me know and I will hold shipping till after holidays
> 
> I have already had a request to hold shipping after Dec 28



I am at home and I am waiting full of anticipation


----------



## big_adventure

If you want to send someone else's knife to Paris completely by accident, I'll be sure to pick it up for them.


----------



## RockyBasel

big_adventure said:


> If you want to send someone else's knife to Paris completely by accident, I'll be sure to pick it up for them.


----------



## Bico Doce

It’s been very quiet on the NA side of things.

Paging @nakiriknaifuwaifu. I suppose no news is good news?


----------



## Smidderton

@RockyBasel Well, I'll be home, too. Our Deutsche Post delivery guy was super p*ssed already a week ago due to the x-mas deliveries. But I guess one more package won't make his day considerable worse...


----------



## RockyBasel

Great - I will be shipping out on Tuesday at the latest and will enclose tracking numbers via PM


----------



## RockyBasel

Bico Doce said:


> It’s been very quiet on the NA side of things.
> 
> Paging @nakiriknaifuwaifu. I suppose no news is good news?


 Ben Kamon confirmed Packages arrived in the US. Brief delay due to FDA inspection (random, not because recipient was @nakiriknaifuwaifu)

But hopefully should be reaching him soon. Smooth sailing so far


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> Ben Kamon confirmed Packages arrived in the US. Brief delay due to FDA inspection (random, not because recipient was @nakiriknaifuwaifu)
> 
> But hopefully should be reaching him soon. Smooth sailing so far


Ha, FDA will never notice the cocaine dissolved in the tsubaki oil.


----------



## big_adventure

Knivperson said:


> Ha, FDA will never notice the cocaine dissolved in the tsubaki oil.



That's what you think!

Don't ask how I know.


----------



## daddy yo yo

I am not part of this mass drop. But if anyone wants to back out of this, I’m at home around Christmas.


----------



## captaincaed

daddy yo yo said:


> I am not part of this mass drop. But if anyone wants to back out of this, I’m at home around Christmas.


I would never guess you're a Kamon fan


----------



## daddy yo yo

captaincaed said:


> I would never guess you're a Kamon fan


I have never been a fan but maybe one day?!


----------



## captaincaed

daddy yo yo said:


> I have never been a fan but maybe one day?!


You're just late to the party


----------



## tchan001

Just got my 225.


----------



## KAMON Knives

"Update" :


----------



## lemeneid

KAMON Knives said:


> "Update" :



Thanks Ben for doing this massdrop. It’s very well executed and I throughly enjoy using your knife I have now


----------



## RockyBasel

Awesome!


----------



## Geigs

KAMON Knives said:


> "Update" :



It's been a thoroughly enjoyable process, the insights into the workflow have been great and really add to the connection to my blade. With the labour involved the cost seems reasonable.

It'll be sad to flip it on BST for 1 million dollars, but as noted I'll need a full custom with hammer marks in the shape of a Wang.


----------



## tchan001

Now I just need to inlay a gold vein on the massdrop Kamon and it will look 10x more expensive. Joking of course lol.


----------



## KAMON Knives

tchan001 said:


> Now I just need to inlay a gold vein on the massdrop Kamon and it will look 10x more expensive. Joking of course lol.



Inlay is "easy" . No diss but the fact remains - many ppl have done and do gold inlays. I personally lack the skills to do gold inlays so I'm not trying to play, that art of its own, down. 

However Forge welding gold in as a layer is the critical part. I don't want to get too serious about it here, and I recognize you're joking, but I have to say this: it has a reason that a gold go mai (or whatever gold layering forge weldet into steel) has never been done before. I'm not just talking kitchen knives here. I'm thinking of hunting knives and folders too which, in the Art knives scene, are decades in front of the kitchen knives scene. And still there, to my knowledge, this hasn't been done before. 
It's very hard to do from a technical point of view and immensely risky from an business point of view as the investment is crazy high and you can loose that investment at any point of the making due to the technical difficulties that occur. 

Just needed to put some perspective on that out there .


----------



## Delat

KAMON Knives said:


> "Update" :




I think Kamon has skewed my expectations on the level of information custom bladesmiths should share. Now whenever I look at a smith’s website or instagram I’m aghast that they don’t share detailed information about the heat treat, forging process, grinding process, handle making process, etc. I want to grill them on all these details before getting on their books, but don’t because I suspect they’d drop me for being a pain the behind. “No soup for you! Next!”


----------



## KAMON Knives

Delat said:


> I think Kamon has skewed my expectations on the level of information custom bladesmiths should share. Now whenever I look at a smith’s website or instagram I’m aghast that they don’t share detailed information about the heat treat, forging process, grinding process, handle making process, etc. I want to grill them on all these details before getting on their books, but don’t because I suspect they’d drop me for being a pain the behind. “No soup for you! Next!”



I believe I simply was asked those questions way too often so I decided to share as much as possible upfront . 

My website needs to be updated though. As good as my work ethic is in my shop, as bad is it in the digital realms .


----------



## RockyBasel

EU recipients - NEED ASAP

Please PM me your phone numbers - am shipping and for tracking service, they need a local phone number


----------



## Knivperson

RockyBasel said:


> EU recipients - NEED ASAP
> 
> Please PM me your phone numbers - am shipping and for tracking service, they need a local phone number


Done


----------



## 0x0x

RockyBasel said:


> EU recipients - NEED ASAP
> 
> Please PM me your phone numbers - am shipping and for tracking service, they need a local phone number


done


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

RockyBasel said:


> EU recipients - NEED ASAP
> 
> Please PM me your phone numbers - am shipping and for tracking service, they need a local phone number


here's a tag 


@WiriWiri@0x0x@Smidderton@Knivperson@pow_pow@RockyBasel@gogogo545@Sdo

Also yes, I have 24 knives coming my way so things are taking slightly longer. Good things come to those who wait though, eh lads?


----------



## pow_pow

RockyBasel said:


> EU recipients - NEED ASAP
> 
> Please PM me your phone numbers - am shipping and for tracking service, they need a local phone number



done


----------



## gogogo545

Done


----------



## Nuts63

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> here's a tag
> 
> 
> @WiriWiri@0x0x@Smidderton@Knivperson@pow_pow@RockyBasel@gogogo545@Sdo
> 
> Also yes, I have 24 knives coming my way so things are taking slightly longer. Good things come to those who wait though, eh lads?


----------



## Nuts63

It sounds like after Christmas delivery


----------



## RockyBasel

EU - PLEASE SEND PHONE NUMBERS

Hoping to ship tomorrow!!!


----------



## Dgilks

The man can make a knife. Safely arrived at home in Australia this morning and will be getting some use in Christmas prep this week.


----------



## Smidderton

Haaawwt. Can't wait.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Dgilks said:


> The man can make a knife. Safely arrived at home in Australia this morning and will be getting some use in Christmas prep this week.
> 
> View attachment 157121
> 
> View attachment 157122


Congrats! It’s suffering waiting for this. What’s the length and height of yours if I may ask? Where is it balanced?


----------



## Dgilks

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Congrats! It’s suffering waiting for this. What’s the length and height of yours if I may ask? Where is it balanced?



230mm on the edge
55mm high
Balance 10mm in front of the heel (basically between the heel and makers mark)


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Dgilks said:


> 230mm on the edge
> 55mm high
> Balance 10mm in front of the heel (basically between the heel and makers mark)


Thank you! This is perfect. I was thinking 260 would be too long but 225 would be a little short. 230*55 is sweet! Can’t wait to receive mine!


----------



## Geigs

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Thank you! This is perfect. I was thinking 260 would be too long but 225 would be a little short. 230*55 is sweet! Can’t wait to receive mine!


Right in my sweet spot too. Stoked to get it.


----------



## Knivperson

Will definately only arrive after Christmas here in EU. Told the family we'll have the postpone Christmas dinner until it's here.


----------



## lemeneid

Knivperson said:


> Will definately only arrive after Christmas here in EU. Told the family we'll have the postpone Christmas dinner until it's here.


I’ll be cutting up my roast beef with it.
The 260 is more like 270, and thin and long, just like a suji


----------



## Knivperson

Are you okay, @RockyBasel? Haven't heard anything yet..


----------



## RockyBasel

EU KNIVES SHIPPED!!!!


----------



## Bodine

taps foot, waiting on US customs


----------



## lemeneid

Meanwhile everyone in APAC has gotten theirs 

Honestly I thought I would have been last


----------



## demcav

Come on, Kamon!


----------



## KAMON Knives

demcav said:


> Come on, Kamon!



If I could control that part, I would. Sadly it's out of my hands at this point.


----------



## Smidderton

Sure, but It's fun to say "come on, Kamon".


----------



## Smidderton

I might even go ahead and write a song.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Smidderton said:


> Sure, but It's fun to say "come on, Kamon".


ESPECIALLY when I don't get it


----------



## Knivperson

Any tracking info? So we know what to do for the next couple days


----------



## RockyBasel

Knivperson said:


> Any tracking info? So we know what to do for the next couple days



Yes. Will be posting that shortly- tracking numbers


----------



## captaincaed

US customs. Thanks Obama


----------



## Dgilks

lemeneid said:


> Meanwhile everyone in APAC has gotten theirs
> 
> Honestly I thought I would have been last



Well, we did pay the most so only right that it came with premium service.


----------



## rob

Hi all,
mine has arrived and the knife is everything i expected and more.
Great distal taper, finish and super comfortable.
Factory edge is as good as any knife i have purchased new, Japanese or Western.
Spec for my 260 are.
Length 270mm
Height 58mm
Weight 222.5 grams.
Thanks so much again @KAMON Knives @lemeneid @RockyBasel and @nakiriknaifuwaifu .
Merry Christmas to all and wishing happy holidays ahead.


----------



## Dominick Maone

KAMON Knives said:


> ESPECIALLY when I don't get it


He is pronouncing “Kamon” the same as “come on”.


----------



## pow_pow

The knife has arrived in Germany. 
Just in time for Christmas. A great gift that I give myself. 

Many thanks to the team, great job. 
Merry Christmas!


----------



## 0x0x

pow_pow said:


> The knife has arrived in Germany.
> Just in time for Christmas. A great gift that I give myself.
> 
> Many thanks to the team, great job.
> Merry Christmas!
> 
> View attachment 157445


225mm?

Mine will need another day or two to arrive in Austria :-(


----------



## pow_pow

Yes, it´s the 225mm. 
This will be a nice addition to my existing 275mm Gyuto. 
Perhaps you should have picked up the knife from Kamon yourself.


----------



## daddy yo yo

0x0x said:


> 225mm?
> 
> Mine will need another day or two to arrive in Austria :-(


I am suffering with you!


----------



## RockyBasel

Wow! So happy to see first knives being received in EU

I tried my 270 mm massdrop Kamon yesterday. This is a high-precision knife, feels more like a scalpel, despite coming in at close to 230gm. Great balance. The tip work was the best ever, and the grind is incredible on this knife. Amazing fit and finish.

Really brings out the performance and character of this knife. A true joy to use in the kitchen!

I can see why @lemeneid compared it to his Denka
delighted with it - will be using exclusively this holiday season

Thank you Ben


----------



## captaincaed

daddy yo yo said:


> I am suffering with you!


Didn't these knives come from Austria...?


----------



## Geigs

230 x 55. Balance feels great. Almost missed the saya hidden in the cardboard despite knowing it was there. Looking forwards to trying to not tip this thing it is thinnnnnnn.

Thanks again to the maskateers and @KAMON Knives for putting this together i haven't had so much fun on the interwebs since I closed my last incognito tab.


----------



## lemeneid

Geigs said:


> 230 x 55. Balance feels great. Almost missed the saya hidden in the cardboard despite knowing it was there. Looking forwards to trying to not tip this thing it is thinnnnnnn.
> 
> Thanks again to the maskateers and @KAMON Knives for putting this together i haven't had so much fun on the interwebs since I closed my last incognito tab.


Thats great!
Keep them reviews coming everyone!


----------



## Geigs

First cuts. Feels more substantial on the board than it looks like it would. Tip slides through brussel sprouts effortlessly. Mushrooms parted themselves like the red sea and I'm not sure the blade even touched them. Some garlic to test the tip and to be honest the tip went in and out and in and out and in and out and I don't remember much else but I might have a 2nd kamon in 9 months. 

TLDR: This is a fun knife.


----------



## Bico Doce

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know which customs location the NA knives are stuck in at the moment?


----------



## 0x0x

Finally it arrived 




Older brother


----------



## Delat

Bico Doce said:


> Just out of curiosity, does anyone know which customs location the NA knives are stuck in at the moment?



All of them.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

They're processing my paperwork (since it's a formal import due to being >2,000 USD)
+ christmas time rush
+ omicron

*stay strong emoji*


----------



## Bico Doce

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> View attachment 158057


So does that mean it hasn’t even registered as being processed at a facility?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Bico Doce said:


> So does that mean it hasn’t even registered as being processed at a facility?


They have, all 3 packages (8 knives each) are on US soil.


----------



## sansho

out of simple curiosity, how were they declared? did you indicate a HTS code? what tax rate will be assessed?
need US customs porn


----------



## WildBoar

US Customs is a black hole. It is almost impossible to get status information from them. They call you if there is an issue, but you really cannot call them.


----------



## daddy yo yo

WildBoar said:


> US Customs is a black hole. It is almost impossible to get status information from them. They call you if there is an issue, but you really cannot call them.


Same procedure as everywhere!

I recently had an issue with an import into EU. It took Austrian customs 14 (in words: fourteen) days to write me that they needed credible proof of payment for a block of wood I purchased. I replied within not even 24 hours, and they charged me 25€ just for requesting that from me. Twenty-five, that is!!! EDIT: and that is without customs duties and/or tax, both of which was still added to a block of wood. I ended up paying over 50% of the block‘s net worth!!!


----------



## captaincaed

Customs is one of the last vestiges of tyranny left over from 1930s state building. Why it persists we may never know. It's there a customs union?


----------



## Knivperson

It came. I tried it already. This is the best knife I have ever tried. Some how it's a laser but a workhorse and has great food release on the carrots length wise. We're having something from the freezer tonight but I chopped some carrot and onion anyway. Great job, @KAMON Knives


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

I've been thinking maybe next massdrop if it's still an EU maker we can ship all the NA knives to RockyBasel, and then he can send knives to NA persons individually. In this way the shipping cost is higher but we won't need to pay custom (if) for it being less than $800, and it would also be faster I guess.


----------



## gogogo545

It has arrived to Sweden and United with the rest of the fam


----------



## WildBoar

wow, that's a whole Kamily!


----------



## daddy yo yo

Oh boy, I remember these candies…


----------



## KAMON Knives

I'm very happy, the guys who received the knives so far, seem to like them. Thanks to y'all for your kind words . 

About the NA packages - there is now movement again so I'm hoping they'll be processed soon. We'll keep you updated. But really it's like some of you said... Customs is a black hole. They're separate from any carrier which is why FedEx (in this case) often doesn't have much info about what's going on either.


----------



## M1k3

For U.S. customs information, check the status on with the original shipper. Just a possibility. Based on a single package I had from an unrelated continent.


----------



## Bico Doce

Is it too early to start asking about the next mass drop?


----------



## xsmx13

Bico Doce said:


> Is it too early to start asking about the next mass drop?


Not if it's another Kamon mass drop.


----------



## RockyBasel

Open to all suggestions


----------



## McMan

RockyBasel said:


> Open to all suggestions


Catcheside?


----------



## IsoJ

McMan said:


> Catcheside?


+1


----------



## M1k3

RockyBasel said:


> Open to all suggestions


@Kippington @Isasmedjan @Björn Birgersson
@HSC /// Knives


----------



## IsoJ

M1k3 said:


> @Kippington @Isasmedjan @Björn Birgersson
> @HSC /// Knives


+1


----------



## tostadas

RockyBasel said:


> Open to all suggestions


Bazes


----------



## hendrix

Yanick Puig


----------



## Knivperson

Y. Tanaka + Myojin


----------



## Corradobrit1

Yanick or Catcheside. I'm not fussy.


----------



## Sdo

RockyBasel said:


> Open to all suggestions


Kippington, HSC or Huber.


----------



## Justinv

Any chance to convince DevinT to make a batch with Larrin Steel?


----------



## Eloh

I think Dan Pendergast would be a good fit since he works in bigger batches 
anyway
Other than that, some interesting ones:
Mert/HVB
Yannick
JJTritz
Catchside
Heiji
One of the many talented Swedish guys, Jonas, Axel, Simon, Mathias etc

But I'm sure it's not easy to find someone who's willing to do 20+ of the same knife hehe


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

How about TF Denka 230 with a price just a little higher than 210’s? Or Toyama iron clad workhorse with machi?


----------



## daddy yo yo

How about @Dave Martell ?


----------



## esoo

How about choosing an up and coming maker who's prices are not at the premium end, and we can expose that maker to more people?

Or, we do something like the KMS gyuto?


----------



## RockyBasel

All excellent suggestions - we are working on some ideas, will let you know more in March/April


----------



## Knivperson

I have a smedja aspen honyaki and it's killer. Every time i use it, i just feel like, man, this is a great knife.


----------



## BillHanna

esoo said:


> How about choosing an up and coming maker who's prices are not at the premium end, and we can expose that maker to more people?


Seconded


----------



## WildBoar

Try Henry Hyde -- he has a lot of people interested in his work.


----------



## ethompson

Can it be a nakiri next time?  (@nakiriknaifuwaifu)


----------



## Bico Doce

Keep it simple. Kippington workponies just like his last batch which were at a great price point.


----------



## BillHanna

180 and 210mm petties this time. *runs away*


----------



## Smidderton

Got to cook with my 225 Kamon a cuttple of times. Loving it tons. This thing ist effing amazing. Very well belanced not only concerning weight but every other aspect, too. I'm really scared to break the tip but onions are soooo much fun with it. I only use it when everything around the cutting board is well organized and i'm not stressed or in a hurry. Thanks to everyone involved and especially to Ben @KAMON Knives


----------



## Darktrader

Seconding the Nakiri suggestion.


----------



## Migraine

I'd be absolutely astounded if Catcheside agreed to do a mass drop.


----------



## WildBoar

He made all those blades for the Burke knives years ago. Would not be surprised if that soured him on group buys.


----------



## Migraine

He just seems to be happy making w/e the **** HE wants to make and has no issue selling it. He doesn't even take orders for his Forgies any more, he just knocks a batch out when he fancies and sells them.


----------



## LostHighway

Bico Doce said:


> Keep it simple. Kippington workponies just like his last batch which were at a great price point.



Personally, I'd be happy with a @Kippington drop, but unless things change dramatically I think it would be a hard pass from Jules.

For my own partisan tastes I'd like to see something in one of the new steels from @Larrin (MagnaCut or Apex Ultra) and from a North American maker. Bazes and Horn come to mind and I'd include @HSC /// Knives as an expat. I'd also like to see a <$750 US price point.
I think the largest problem is that not that many makers are set up to produce thirty plus knives in a relatively tight time frame. That number dwindles further because many makers that could do it won't see much advantage for them in taking on the task.
Outside North America Joel Black, Fredrik Spåre, and Radiona Breg come to mind but I think Spåre is the only one who might consider it. Perhaps one of the other Scandinavian makers? Eastern European makers?


----------



## Bico Doce

LostHighway said:


> I think the largest problem is that not that many makers are set up to produce thirty plus knives in a relatively tight time frame. That number dwindles further because many makers that could do it won't see much advantage for them in taking on the task.


I hadn’t really considered this point. It makes me wonder if for mass drops to be viable in the future there has to be a change in the parameters to make it more appealing - smaller batches, longer time frames, greater flexibility or whatever


----------



## WildBoar

LostHighway said:


> For my own partisan tastes I'd like to see something in one of the new steels from @Larrin (MagnaCut or Apex Ultra) and from a North American maker. Bazes and Horn come to mind and I'd include @HSC /// Knives as an expat. I'd also like to see a <$750 US price point.


Pretty sure the economics of these steels dictate san mai knives, which would make <$750 a tough target to hit.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Apex Ultra and Kippington sounds great. I’m in.
Any upcoming or reputed maker plus Apex Ultra steel I’m in. I want to try that steel badly.


----------



## sansho

LostHighway said:


> For my own partisan tastes I'd like to see something in one of the new steels from @Larrin (MagnaCut or Apex Ultra) and from a North American maker.



i'm in for new hotness. don't care about price.


----------



## LostHighway

WildBoar said:


> Pretty sure the economics of these steels dictate san mai knives, which would make <$750 a tough target to hit.


@HSC /// Knives made some mono steel MagnaCut gyutos @<$750 but his new Languedoc workshop is still a work in progress as far as I know.
Apex Ultra won't be released until March so I think the exact price point is mostly conjecture at this juncture. I may be wrong but I don't believe it is a PM steel.


----------



## crocca86

Any news on the xerxes mass drop?


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

happy new year folks 

2 of 3 packages are here - 16 knives in total 

as @KAMON Knives said, the final package was delayed but is now moving - will keep everyone updated 
the goal is to send all of the knives out at the same time

huge thank you to all my NA peeps for your patience thus far


----------



## toddnmd

LostHighway said:


> @HSC /// Knives made some mono steel MagnaCut gyutos @<$750 but his new Languedoc workshop is still a work in progress as far as I know.





WildBoar said:


> Pretty sure the economics of these steels dictate san mai knives, which would make <$750 a tough target to hit.





LostHighway said:


> For my own partisan tastes I'd like to see something in one of the new steels from @Larrin (MagnaCut or Apex Ultra) and from a North American maker. Bazes and Horn come to mind and I'd include @HSC /// Knives as an expat. I'd also like to see a <$750 US price point.
> I think the largest problem is that not that many makers are set up to produce thirty plus knives in a relatively tight time frame. That number dwindles further because many makers that could do it won't see much advantage for them in taking on the task.



I think MagnaCut would have some appeal, and hope it could be done for less than $750, as HSCIII did with a couple microbatches. For reference, the cost when MagnaCut was released in April was $132.48 for a sheet that was .103/.113" X 3" X 36". Not sure of availability. HSCIII used monosteel construction for those knives.

I think it's worth exploring doing smaller batches. Even 5-10 of something special (could be as simple as an uncommon length or height, upgraded handle, etc.) would be fun. Makers could do the work in smaller batches or over longer timeframes if they wanted.



nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> as @KAMON Knives said, the final package was delayed but is now moving - will keep everyone updated
> the goal is to send all of the knives out at the same time



Hope that third package shows up soon!


----------



## M1k3

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> happy new year folks
> 
> 2 of 3 packages are here - 16 knives in total
> 
> as @KAMON Knives said, the final package was delayed but is now moving - will keep everyone updated
> the goal is to send all of the knives out at the same time
> 
> huge thank you to all my NA peeps for your patience thus far
> 
> View attachment 158800


Slow poke! We've already forgotten and are suggesting names for the next one!


----------



## spaceconvoy

M1k3 said:


> Slow poke! We've already forgotten and are suggesting names for the next one!


Yeah, the Kamon massdrop was so last year


----------



## daddy yo yo

spaceconvoy said:


> Yeah, the Kamon massdrop was so last year


The FIRST Kamon massdrop was so last year. It’s time for A SECOND KAMON MASS DROP


----------



## M1k3

spaceconvoy said:


> Yeah, the Kamon massdrop was so last year


Kamon-who? One of them Australian knife makers? His he on your list @juice?


----------



## jeffr

daddy yo yo said:


> The FIRST Kamon massdrop was so last year. It’s time for A SECOND KAMON MASS DROP


Yes, the next thirty (or forty) ppl on the previous list


----------



## captaincaed

Magnacut won't be cheap. The cost is finishing time and belts consumed. No way to batch that expense.


----------



## Delat

Frederick Spare has been doing multiple batches of 10 at a time for Modern Cooking so seems like he’s amenable to that sort of thing. His prices are pretty reasonable for a Western maker.

Martin Huber I believe has a couple guys working for him so might have capacity for a production run.

Mert Tansu's HVB semi-production line might be another option.

And it looks like Jannis/Xerxes is back in the saddle but appears to be having so much fun making tamahagane he might not be interested in picking back up the mass drop.


----------



## Knivperson

Delat said:


> Frederick Spare has been doing multiple batches of 10 at a time for Modern Cooking so seems like he’s amenable to that sort of thing. His prices are pretty reasonable for a Western maker.
> 
> Martin Huber I believe has a couple guys working for him so might have capacity for a production run.
> 
> Mert Tansu's HVB semi-production line might be another option.
> 
> And it looks like Jannis/Xerxes is back in the saddle but appears to be having so much fun making tamahagane he might not be interested in picking back up the mass drop.


No problem, just make it a tamahagane mass drop


----------



## RockyBasel

Knivperson said:


> No problem, just make it a tamahagane mass drop


Love tamahagane!


----------



## WiriWiri

My whiskers are twitching here; the Kamon must be close. Or at least I got a feeling that it was worth checking the tracking today,

It sat in customs for the festive period, but finally cleared Tuesday, DHL processing it in their delivery depot yesterday. There seems a limit to how long those DHL barstewards can sit on their hands now, even allowing for glorious British incompetency and COVID.

Keenly anticipating now. The wife’s just about accepted the ‘need’ for a whopping 300mm Suji upgrade over the festive period - the thin slicing demos were quite impressive it had to be said - so I think the ground‘s set for me to sneak another one in just about now. Good thing too, as I suspect even she’ll notice the introduction of a similarly lengthy Denty Kamon to the knife rack, towering above the Tanaka and Sakai 240s. Oh, that and the small matters of the blue-grey Ku finish, the denty holes, and the double-penis-holed torpedo handle. 

I’ll never get away with this one. I‘m working on my justifications/excuses/prayers now


----------



## BrewsWayne

Meglio Knives is offering a 10" Western Chef Knife in Magnacut for $295.00
10" Western Chef in Magnacut

Perhaps he may create a custom for a Massdrop.


----------



## Bico Doce

BrewsWayne said:


> Meglio Knives is offering a 10" Western Chef Knife in Magnacut for $295.00
> 10" Western Chef in Magnacut
> 
> Perhaps he may create a custom for a Massdrop.


Not to down this makers work but my personal thought is that a mass drop should be aimed at a maker who’s work is difficult to obtain. If a maker has their books open and knives for sale on their website then anyone could just order exactly what they wanted and not be limited to the restrictions that accompany a mass order


----------



## gcsquared

+1 on Yannick, Bazes, Catcheside, Kippington


----------



## RockyBasel

Rare and hard to find knives are a key focus of massdrop for sure


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

it has begun 

by the way, i have *not yet* been invoiced for customs/duties - but I wanted to get these knives out to you all as soon as possible. 

Apparently the peepeepoopooheads at FedEx will be sending me the bill in the next few weeks, so I'll keep you all updated if anything significant happens (which I do not expect)


----------



## RockyBasel

Start shipping!!!  all across these here United States


----------



## esoo

RockyBasel said:


> Start shipping!!!  all across these here United States



Don't forget those of us in the True North!


----------



## M1k3

esoo said:


> Don't forget those of us in the True North!


Santa? Is that you? Or are you an elf?


----------



## esoo

M1k3 said:


> Santa? Is that you? Or are you an elf?



Beard isn't long enough so I guess I'm an elf....


----------



## WiriWiri

Ah well, impatience levels were rising and I was about to throw a mild tizzy at DHL who, according to tracking, have been processing my parcel for 3 days at a delivery depot. Just stick a label on it and post it out you tossers was loosely my thinking here.

Sadly further investigation has revealed that the Kamom seems to have been passed over to another courier company (Parcelforce) here, who are about to mail me a lovely letter detailing exactly how many bodily organs I’lll need to pay in additional duties. If I‘m lucky they’ll simply seagull/shitpost an open card through the letterbox, all too clearly detailing the full horror of the multi-hundred pound charges to anyone nearby. Including my, no doubt disbelieving, wife

I’ll be sleeping by the postbox tonight, just in case. I’m a little bit disappointed by that Basel chap not living up to the Swiss tax dodger stereotype to be honest.…


----------



## captaincaed

I think ChefDoom has been reincarnated. 
I like your particular brand of vitriol, sir, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.


----------



## WiriWiri

captaincaed said:


> I think ChefDoom has been reincarnated.
> I like your particular brand of vitriol, sir, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.



Sadly I suspect they‘ll even deliver it on one of those primary-coloured cards with sunny graphics of cheery postmen, accompanied with a trite ‘Sorry that your wife is going to kill we missed you’ message.

They know what they’re doing, those evil courier cads


----------



## RockyBasel

I do like how you write! A newsletter indeed


----------



## Acidwash

US cutters, my 260 arrived today, so I imagine the rest couldn’t be far out!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Acidwash said:


> US cutters, my 260 arrived today, so I imagine the rest couldn’t be far out!


YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
first US knaifu has landed

 post  post  post  post  post  post


----------



## Acidwash

Every bit the knife I thought it would be.


----------



## Acidwash

And yes, I need to take better care of my board. Lol


----------



## WildBoar

Acidwash said:


> US cutters, my 260 arrived today, so I imagine the rest couldn’t be far out!


UPS Ground to DA area, so I am likely 5 days out.


----------



## Delat

Acidwash said:


> US cutters, my 260 arrived today, so I imagine the rest couldn’t be far out!



Mine’s out for delivery, expecting it this afternoon!


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

* ~massdrop fun fact~*​
*did you know...*

*@KAMON Knives refused to dispose of his recycling for the 3 months he was working on the massdrop? *
*It's true - he sent it all to me  3 giant boxes worth 
that's why the packages were so goddamn heavy - it was 95% recyclable waste
customs was probably like why is this man importing trash from Austria what is going on???*


----------



## Jville

Delat said:


> Mine’s out for delivery, expecting it this afternoon!


Dang, mine isn’t scheduled till Thursday.


----------



## captaincaed

Acidwash said:


> Every bit the knife I thought it would be.
> 
> View attachment 159498


You mean, A LOT?

260 is pretty big for most of what I do, but I just think his knives look great at that size. Proportions are just ON.


----------



## Bodine

Thursday for me as well, I have 2 12# NY strip loins that will be 28 days aged and ready to cut into steaks that same day, patina time.


----------



## Delat

Made a quick unboxing video of my 220mm for those of you anxiously waiting. It’s at 2x speed.

My dog circled back later for the Kamon kandy treats


----------



## WiriWiri

So, the jaunty Parcelforce postwankers pushed the customs and duties breakdown forcefully through the letterbox today, as predicted. Thankfully it was in an envelope and I got there first, so I got the dubious pleasure of seeing the full amount alone, ears and testicles still intact. A new record charge for me- no effort was.spared at claiming the full 20% extra here for sure - leaving just enough to buy a fun size Snickers out of couple of tons. I’ll steel myself to pay online tomorrow and it’ll will be with me on Monday, or perhaps I’ll dial it in for Wednesday, when the missus is at the office, and me and the Kamon can spend a little more quality time together. 

The blade will be worth it, I’m sure, but you can probably understand me cursing Brexit right about now in the most colourful language possble. Just a year ago Blighty was still part of the EU and all would have been sunny - this knife would have been with me at Chrimbo, customs and duties untroubled. Instead the Kamon‘s had its torpedo handle violated by customs before languishing in a Parcelforce compound for ages, couriers set free to taunt me with a torturously slow set of financially ridiculous demands to assure its release.

I blame Boris, And perhaps Basel for his lack of stereotyped Swiss shiftiness and timeliness here. And pretty much anyone I can think of, including fruitarians and particularly homeopaths that believe in Reiki. Sod all of you, with spiky broomsticks with bells on

This slightly grey mood won’t last for long mind. I have a Kamon on the way after all…


----------



## Bodine

Delat, no three finger test, would be my first move, enjoy


----------



## Acidwash

captaincaed said:


> You mean, A LOT?
> 
> 260 is pretty big for most of what I do, but I just think his knives look great at that size. Proportions are just ON.



I fully agree! But I once had an even bigger Kamon, 270, and it handled like a 240 it was so well balanced. So I am confident this will be well within my wheelhouse.


----------



## lemeneid

Seeing so few people use their knives so far makes me sad. Everyone waiting for an opportunity to put theirs up on BST huh?


----------



## Bico Doce

lemeneid said:


> Seeing so few people use their knives so far makes me sad. Everyone waiting for an opportunity to put theirs up on BST huh?


I like to think it’s a courtesy for the rest of us waiting to receive ours


----------



## Dgilks

lemeneid said:


> Seeing so few people use their knives so far makes me sad. Everyone waiting for an opportunity to put theirs up on BST huh?



Mine’s got prime position in the kitchen lineup alongside a couple of other recent pickups (laser-like Metal Monkey Gyuto and a beast Tansu HVB Gyuto). The Kamon is a great performer in the kitchen; lovely bit of power at the heel and as nimble a tip as you could ask for.


----------



## Delat

lemeneid said:


> Seeing so few people use their knives so far makes me sad. Everyone waiting for an opportunity to put theirs up on BST huh?



I think the majority are in the US and they’re just now trickling out after being stuck in customs. 

I’ll be doing some videos for sure but it’ll probably be a couple weeks.


----------



## Delat

Bodine said:


> Delat, no three finger test, would be my first move, enjoy



I cut a finger wiping off the oil, does that count?  

It’s very sharp OOTB, about as sharp as I normally shoot for with my own knives. This one and my Yoshikane will be the only knives I don’t immediately touch up or at least strop before use because they don’t need it and I couldn’t improve on the edge anyway. I did an HHT test and it’s HHT1.


----------



## lemeneid

Dgilks said:


> Mine’s got prime position in the kitchen lineup alongside a couple of other recent pickups (laser-like Metal Monkey Gyuto and a beast Tansu HVB Gyuto). The Kamon is a great performer in the kitchen; lovely bit of power at the heel and as nimble a tip as you could ask for.


Love mine as well, the tip is lovely.


----------



## nakiriknaifuwaifu

Delat said:


> I think the majority are in the US and they’re just now trickling out after being stuck in customs.


they're all in the mail as of two days ago
hauled ass to get it done asap

oh yes
and a picture
mine comes in at 265mm x 58mm, 230g
its nice hehe


----------



## Delat

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> they're all in the mail as of two days ago
> hauled ass to get it done asap



You totally did! Much love


----------



## Migraine

Makes me so happy seeing all these people get to experience KAMON


----------



## Jville

nakiriknaifuwaifu said:


> they're all in the mail as of two days ago
> hauled ass to get it done asap
> 
> oh yes
> and a picture
> mine comes in at 265mm x 58mm, 230g
> its nice hehe
> 
> View attachment 159582


Is the bevel concave or just the pic messing with me?


----------



## toddnmd

For Massdrop IV, how about a nakiri with the following characteristics?

180mm x 70mm with finger inset/notch (so 165mm of useable length)
200g - 230g
Tapered grind like shig, but not as thick (taller at same weight means good plow through with less cracking)
Stainless cladding with Shirogami 1, Swedish, 52100, or AS. 
Pointy-ish tip (like a moritaka, not like a Yaxell)


----------



## BillHanna

toddnmd said:


> For Massdrop IV, how about a nakiri with the following characteristics?
> 
> 180mm x 70mm
> 200g - 230g
> Tapered grind like shig, but not as thick (taller at same weight means good plow through with less cracking)
> Shirogami 1, Swedish, 52100, or AS.
> Pointy-ish tip (like a moritaka, not like a Yaxell)


Fixed


----------



## Bico Doce

When all the knives deliver could we identify who the last person to receive theirs is and give them a special title? Such as in the NFL (American football) the last person drafted each year is designated as Mr Irrelevant.


----------



## toddnmd

Bico Doce said:


> When all the knives deliver could we identify who the last person to receive theirs is and give them a special title? Such as in the NFL (American football) the last person drafted each year is designated as Mr Irrelevant.



It will be me.


----------



## demcav

Mine is currently scheduled for delivery on Wednesday!


----------



## big_adventure

toddnmd said:


> It will be me.



Eh, it'll probably be one of us unlucky bastards who didn't get one.


----------



## WiriWiri

My box is here. In the middle of meetings, but have unpacked excitedly, eaten a sweet and have made three early conclusions. More to follow - obviously itching to cut something later.

1) Mr Kamon‘s packaging is indeed impressive and worthy of note
2) Nagging concerns that this 260 may be a little too big for me have largely been dispelled. I was counting on the balance and taper of this blade bringing this into my comfort zone and that’s immediately how it feels in hand. Love the balance already and suspect the 225 would have actually seemed a little small. Win
3) My cat can’t bring herself to look at the customs declaration, but does seem highly interested in the knife itself. Who wouldn’t?


----------



## daddy yo yo

WiriWiri said:


> My box is here. In the middle of meetings, but have unpacked excitedly, eaten a sweet and have made three early conclusions. More to follow - obviously itching to cut something later.
> 
> 1) Mr Kamon‘s packaging is indeed impressive and worthy of note
> 2) Nagging concerns that this 260 may be a little too big for me have largely been dispelled. I was counting on the balance and taper of this blade bringing this into my comfort zone and that’s immediately how it feels in hand. Love the balance already and suspect the 225 would have actually seemed a little small. Win
> 3) My cat can’t bring herself to look at the customs declaration, but does seem highly interested in the knife itself. Who wouldn’t?
> View attachment 159991
> 
> View attachment 159994


Sweet cat with good taste!

My ~280 gyuto from Kamon was a pleasant surprise. I had similar concerns as you but the balance is spot on, perfectly balanced knife. I was and still am so impressed! I yield this ~280 like many 240s!!


----------



## WiriWiri

daddy yo yo said:


> Sweet cat with good taste!
> 
> My ~280 gyuto from Kamon was a pleasant surprise. I had similar concerns as you but the balance is spot on, perfectly balanced knife. I was and still am so impressed! I yield this ~280 like many 240s!!



Definitely. I agonised over the choice of length for some time when this massdrop first came around - I’ve generally had bad experiences with oversized 240s and beyond in recent years*, but had an inkling that the Kamon would buck the trend and that the profile would benefit from more length. In the end I bottled it and opted for the 225 - it seemed too much of a risky punt on an educated guess given the price of the knife, but I did wonder.

It wasn’t a huge hardship that fate saw me end up qualifying via the waitlist for a 260 with that in mind, but still grateful that it‘s turned out well. 

*basically an oversized Takeda with clumsy forward balance, porpoise profile and little heft, a half kilo western deba, and the kind of comedy oversized western chefs knives usually favoured by executive chef types for waggling rather than cutting purposes (see Marco Pierre White)


----------



## big_adventure

I'm joining the @KAMON Knives massdrop special crowd! Thanks BTS! I won't have it in hand for a while - it's a US blade, so I'm having it shipped to my parents' house in Florida where I can recover it on my next visit - but... yesssssss.


----------



## Delat

lemeneid said:


> Seeing so few people use their knives so far makes me sad. Everyone waiting for an opportunity to put theirs up on BST huh?



Here you go!









Neil on Instagram: "Cooking up my version of Jamaican ox tail. Knife by @kamon_knives #cookingvideo #cookingathome #foodvideo #foodiesofinstagram #delicious #oxtail #jamaicanfood #recipe #food #foodie #chefsknife #knivesofinstagram🔪"


Neil shared a post on Instagram: "Cooking up my version of Jamaican ox tail. Knife by @kamon_knives #cookingvideo #cookingathome #foodvideo #foodiesofinstagram #delicious #oxtail #jamaicanfood #recipe #food #foodie #chefsknife #knivesofinstagram🔪". Follow their account to see 42 posts.




www.instagram.com


----------



## Acidwash

For a minute, I thought you were going to open the wine with it.


----------



## Jville

Acidwash said:


> For a minute, I thought you were going to open the wine with it.


That’s @stringer ’s move


----------



## LostHighway

My 225 arrived this evening, a day ahead of what was initially scheduled, but I haven't put it to use yet.

Edit: quick measurements subject to daylight revision - 231mm x 53mm, 6.3mm wide neck at the handle, 5.4mm at the heel, 207g


----------



## Ikonaka

LostHighway said:


> My 225 arrived this evening, a day ahead of what was initially scheduled, but I haven't put it to use yet.


Same. I was out the door when it got dropped off. Looking forward to carving up my morning apple with it


----------



## Jville

Ikonaka said:


> Same. I was out the door when it got dropped off. Looking forward to carving up my morning apple with it


Definetely need a Kamon for that morning .


----------



## drsmp

My 260 arrived today. Gorgeous and very comfy feel in hand , will do a meal prep this weekend. Mine measures 266 x 59 and weighs 218gm.


----------



## lemeneid

Jville said:


> Definetely need a Kamon for that morning .


A Kamon a day keeps the knife nuts away.

Or have I got it wrong?


----------



## Jville

lemeneid said:


> A Kamon a day keeps the knife nuts away.
> 
> Or have I got it wrong?


No, you got it right.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Got mine today too. The packaging is creative and strong. The knife is beautiful.

229 mm*54.5 mm. 207 gram. 6.3 mm at the handle, 1.7 mm in the middle. Nice slightly convex grind on both sides. The last 5 cm from the tip is paper thin. The thinnest tip I’ve ever used. The distal taper is like my vintage sabatier but more solid. Tried cutting a big carrot and it was effortless. The triangle-ish profile looks a lot nicer in the hand than I imagined, and it is flat but has reasonable amount of tiny curvature so very efficient and natural. And I love the feature that the Kamon logo is engraved on both sides. Spine and choil rounded beautifully. Overall a lot care in it and a lot details I love.

I do hope I had opted for the 260 though as the balance could be a little more forward on the 260 I guess?


----------



## Knivperson

I still think back on the moment I pulled the knife out of it's cover to see it for the first time. After admiring the package and handling the candy to my girlfriend and daughter, I stood up, held the knife about 35 cm from my face, and slowly pulled it out, uncovering the heel of the knife... I simply had to pause my movement and look at the creation in front of me. The seriously rounded choil and spine, the deep hammer marks - I hadn't seen anything like it - ever. Pulling it all the way out, I marvelled over the distal taper and the nimble feeling of it in hand.

Having used it for some weeks now, Im still amazed by it's performance - it even has a food release only rivalled by s-grinds. Great, great knife so far, thanks to @KAMON Knives and the three KKF-members behind it.


----------



## KilgoreTrout

TSF415 said:


> View attachment 138246



You’re a man of culture. Of this I am sure


----------



## WildBoar

Knivperson said:


> I still think back on the moment I pulled the knife out of it's cover to see it for the first time. After admiring the package and handling the candy to my girlfriend and daughter, I stood up, held the knife about 35 cm from my face, and slowly pulled it out, uncovering the heel of the knife... I simply had to pause my movement and look at the creation in front of me. The seriously rounded choil and spine, the deep hammer marks - I hadn't seen anything like it - ever. Pulling it all the way out, I marvelled over the distal taper and the nimble feeling of it in hand.


You were also supposed to let it taste your blood...


----------



## Knivperson

WildBoar said:


> You were also supposed to let it taste your blood...


Did you let it taste your bodily fluids?


----------



## Luftmensch

WiriWiri said:


> My cat



"I will buy this"


----------



## drsmp

So was Ben trolling us with his candy choice? Ha! 


Wiener suckers?


----------



## drsmp

260


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

drsmp said:


> 260
> View attachment 160328
> View attachment 160329
> View attachment 160331
> View attachment 160332


May I ask how long the handle is and where the balance point is? My 225’s balance is about 5-10 mm ahead of the heel.


----------



## drsmp

The balance point is right at the makers mark. Wooden part of handle is 120


----------



## RockyBasel

drsmp said:


> 260
> View attachment 160328
> View attachment 160329
> View attachment 160331
> View attachment 160332


I got the 260 too- congrats - the tip work is phenomenal! It is such a fantastic knife - you will love it, and let us know your feedback


----------



## Jason183

Mine has arrived, looks so stunning in person, beautiful distal taper, extremely thin tip. Ever since I sold my Masamoto KS, I always missed it’s high performance tip. This Kamon does everything better performance wise and very nice heel height that’s more suitable for rocking. This is the dream profile I’m looking for, and for sure will be my best all-rounded knife. 
A length comparison with my 210 Takamura chromax.
Thanks to the 3 organizers again and @KAMON Knives, so lucky to be able to participate in this Massdrop.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

drsmp said:


> The balance point is right at the makers mark. Wooden part of handle is 120


Fantastic! Exactly what I thought and congrats!


----------



## Bodine

Final destination for my new daily driver The packaging was wonderful and thank you for the sweets Mr. Kamon


----------



## xsmx13

drsmp said:


> 260
> View attachment 160328
> View attachment 160329
> View attachment 160331
> View attachment 160332


So what you're saying is that dreams do come true?


----------



## KilgoreTrout

Can someone please explain what a massdrop “is” to me? I think I’m old and out of the loop.


----------



## WiriWiri

KilgoreTrout said:


> Can someone please explain what a massdrop “is” to me? I think I’m old and out of the loop.



It‘s like Squid Games, only for knives. The survivors got a Kamon on this occasion.


----------



## RockyBasel

KilgoreTrout said:


> Can someone please explain what a massdrop “is” to me? I think I’m old and out of the loop.



i can helexplain a bit

Massdrop is when a couple of KKF folks like me, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser, get together and somehow get a single person shop smith, who is dedicated to his craft, make a knife for us KKF sports fans - to the tune of 20-40 knives. We support the art of artisinal
Knife making, we get knives to KKF members globally, and we learn about the smith’s craft and approach and philosophy- like Kamon walked us through. It’s also about getting to know the smith- Dalman’s viking Farr quenching, etc. (you hand to be there)

Its a standard configuration knife, no customization, lower price, and with a hard to access smith - like a Dalman Honyaki, Xerses, and Kamon. It’s hard to get a knife from these smiths. 

@nakiriknaifuwaifu then sets up some mysterious numbering system, and people line for the knife.

that’s a Massdrop at a simple level - hope that helps


----------



## RockyBasel

WiriWiri said:


> It‘s like Squid Games, only for knives. The survivors got a Kamon on this occasion.


So true  - did you get yours?


----------



## Migraine

Usually it's organised by members of a community interested in a fairly niche product (they happen a lot for keycap sets in the mechanical keyboard community). A few community members will communicate directly with a manufacturer/maker and come to an agreement for them to make a certain number of a particular product; often significantly more of said product than would usually be available. In order to make it more achievable and keep price down, the items tend to be either all exactly the same or have very limited customisation options (Kamon offered two different sizes for example, but no other customisation, whereas with his usual custom orders the options are basically endless).

Once this is organised, spots are offered to the community. People sign up and if there are more than the maximum the maker plans to supply, an acceptable number will be picked by some means (often a random draw).

The lucky chosen people pay the organisers, they collate the money and pay the maker. The maker fulfils the order and generally then sends the finished products to the organisers who are responsible for shipping to the end customer.

They mostly exist as a way for more people to be able to get hold of a product which would not otherwise be produced or is in very limited supply (keycaps for example are only worth it for the manufacturer to produce if they can ensure a minimum number of sets will be sold).


----------



## Migraine

When I started that post I thought I'd have it explained in a couple of lines, but it's a harder concept to cover than you'd think.


----------



## WiriWiri

Migraine said:


> Usually it's organised by members of a community interested in a fairly niche product (they happen a lot for keycap sets in the mechanical keyboard community). A few community members will communicate directly with a manufacturer/maker and come to an agreement for them to make a certain number of a particular product; often significantly more of said product than would usually be available. In order to make it more achievable, the items tend to be either all exactly the same or have very limited customisation options.
> 
> Once this is organised, spots are offered to the community. People sign up and if there are more than the maximum the maker plans to supply, an acceptable number will be picked by some means (often a random draw).
> 
> The maker fulfils the order and generally then sends the finished products to the organisers who are responsible for shipping to the end customer.



Great explanation. In mitigation for my tritely uninformed tosh (above) I did actually consider linking to NKW’s explanation on the first Massdrop thread. But on rereading the original spec - $200-$300 apparently, with the distant initial hope of getting some handleless Denkas in and beating the wabi-sabi out of them - it would probably have confused things even more

I am loving my Kamon btw. Thanks to the organisers, who chose a good un there, and the Mr BK too, who clearly put some serious love and effort into this. I am still in the ‘whoo, this thing is effing good‘ stage of ownership, but will post a few more considered thoughts soon


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Do you guys know there’s a saya in the cardboard? I completely neglected it yesterday when I unpacked and only found it today after I saw a prior post mentioning it.


----------



## WiriWiri

Yes, I left it on the floor when I unpack


Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Do you guys know there’s a saya in the cardboard? I completely neglected it yesterday when I unpack and only found it today after I found a post a few pages ago mentioning it.
> 
> View attachment 160377



Yes, I left it on the floor when I unpacked and my missus spotted it later, suggesting that i had left my ’codpiece’ in the spare room. 

I did try to pass it off as a tribute to Larry Blackmon’s Cameo, but she has started to make jibes about fetishwear and gimp masks. I take these arrows, smug in the knowledge that i‘ve already snuck the Kamon on the knife rack without her commenting,


----------



## RockyBasel

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Do you guys know there’s a saya in the cardboard? I completely neglected it yesterday when I unpacked and only found it today after I saw a prior post mentioning it.
> 
> View attachment 160377


Yes, much overlooked fact - not only did we get a mind-knowingly well crafted steel, a very functional and well made saya came with it! And some candy - hope that was not thrown


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

RockyBasel said:


> Yes, much overlooked fact - not only did we get a mind-knowingly well crafted steel, a very functional and well made saya came with it! And some candy - hope that was not thrown


Yea the unique design of the saya makes a lot sense. We can clean the inside and keep it dry. Very convenient.


----------



## KilgoreTrout

RockyBasel said:


> i can helexplain a bit
> 
> Massdrop is when a couple of KKF folks like me, @nakiriknaifuwaifu and @alterwisser, get together and somehow get a single person shop smith, who is dedicated to his craft, make a knife for us KKF sports fans - to the tune of 20-40 knives. We support the art of artisinal
> Knife making, we get knives to KKF members globally, and we learn about the smith’s craft and approach and philosophy- like Kamon walked us through. It’s also about getting to know the smith- Dalman’s viking Farr quenching, etc. (you hand to be there)
> 
> Its a standard configuration knife, no customization, lower price, and with a hard to access smith - like a Dalman Honyaki, Xerses, and Kamon. It’s hard to get a knife from these smiths.
> 
> @nakiriknaifuwaifu then sets up some mysterious numbering system, and people line for the knife.
> 
> that’s a Massdrop at a simple level - hope that helps


It does thank you, what kind of knife, maker, price etc.? And most importantly any spots left?


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## RockyBasel

Sadly all spots are taken. But you may ask @WiriWiri if he is willing to part with his


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## zeaderan

After a couple weather delays it had arrived. 
~230mm, 54mm heel, 4.8mm spine at the heel, 204g
A sincere and happy thank you to the 3 organizers and @KAMON Knives!


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## captaincaed

WiriWiri said:


> Yes, I left it on the floor when I unpacked and my missus spotted it later, suggesting that i had left my ’codpiece’ in the spare room.



you have a 260mm codpiece? lucky girl.


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## M1k3

captaincaed said:


> you have a 260mm codpiece? lucky girl.


And is it made of kydex? If so, message me @WiriWiri


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## Dominick Maone

Can someone show how the knife sits in the saya please? Is it loose? I do not understand how this type of saya works.


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## WiriWiri

Dominick Maone said:


> Can someone show how the knife sits in the saya please? Is it loose? I do not understand how this type of saya works.



It’s basically a friction fit saya, so it slides in the middle between those covered rivets. It is a gratifyingly smooth and tight fit (baby)

Alternatively you can slip it on top and sport it in this fashion, allegedly


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## zeaderan

Dominick Maone said:


> Can someone show how the knife sits in the saya please? Is it loose? I do not understand how this type of saya works.


Like Wiri mentioned, it is friction fit at the spine near the handle. The bolts and rubber spacers outline the blade well with little looseness or give and the rubber spacers between also reduce down in width to match the blades taper.


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## Dominick Maone

WiriWiri said:


> It’s basically a friction fit saya, so it slides in the middle between those covered rivets. It is a gratifyingly smooth and tight fit (baby)
> 
> Alternatively you can slip it on top and sport it in this fashion, allegedly





zeaderan said:


> Like Wiri mentioned, it is friction fit at the spine near the handle. The bolts and rubber spacers outline the blade well with little looseness or give and the rubber spacers between also reduce down in width to match the blades taper.


I see now. Thanks! That’s pretty creative.


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## esoo

It arrived moments ago. Wow.






As one of ones who made it as others dropped out, I feel very lucky right now.

Thanks to @nakiriknaifuwaifu , @RockyBasel @lemeneid and especially @KAMON Knives for making this happen.

Only question - how often would that allen key be used for the handle?


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## Josh

Mine made it! Gave it a try at dinner, but it was a vegie meal - it is quite fantastic on herbs. Mine is measured to be 230 in length, but it feels so much different than my 240s. I agree with the sturdy laser comments I've heard - she's a beaut!

I recommend folks consider to gift the folks who spent their time organizing this a Supporting Membership!

Special thanks to @nakiriknaifuwaifu and of course - @RockyBasel & @lemeneid for their dedication to this forum!

@KAMON Knives - glad to have this knife - and thanks for putting up with my silly "the grind" (Raptors reference) comments on Instagram -- thanks again!


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## KAMON Knives

esoo said:


> It arrived moments ago. Wow.
> 
> View attachment 160541
> 
> 
> As one of ones who made it as others dropped out, I feel very lucky right now.
> 
> Thanks to @nakiriknaifuwaifu , @RockyBasel @lemeneid and especially @KAMON Knives for making this happen.
> 
> Only question - how often would that allen key be used for the handle?



You don't NEED to use that allen key at all. If you never take the handle off (for thinning out or just due to curiosity), then the handle will just stay fixed. 
I haven't yet had it reported to me that the nut at the end would loosen itself on its own nor has it ever happened to me with my own knives at home. 
I even delivered my knives without an allen key back then as I thought that's something everyone has at home anyways. However I think for one the US allen keys are probably different to the metric measurements of the nuts I use, and also I thought it's inconsequential to deliver the knife without a tool to take off the handle. So I just deliver the knives with it now. That's not meaning you need it, it's just meaning it's there if you do.


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## e30Birdy

Such gorgeous pieces of work, wish I had one after seeing them all. @KAMON Knives this thread has been awesome to follow with all the updates from you during the process. Maybe one day one will make its way across the border to me in Germany.


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## Sdo

Well Mr. Kamon, this beauty is just F****** amazing!

Cheers!


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## WiriWiri

It’s the weekend, I have a Kamon. I am happy. Seeing other lucky recipients of this Massdrop enjoying their new knives makes me even happier, a shared joyous experience.

Am I happy as Larry? Could I be happy enough to break out into a spontaneous dance? It is a distinct possibility.




PS: I will happily donate TEN English pounds to the server fund for footage of any Kamonite massdropper recreating Larry‘s hip swing with their new studded saya. (Limits apply, first three only, we don’t want to start a craze)
PPS. Larry didn‘t get a 260 by the looks of it, the flash git. Perhaps a Nakiri, or one of those extra height Togashi big bunkas.


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## WiriWiri

Joshing aside, I do want to escape this codpiece cul-de-sac to clearly acknowledge that this Kamon is a serious blade that I am most, most grateful to have received. I haven’t really been able to throw enough of a payload at it with three limited weeknight dinners to gain an elevated understanding, but I already know enough to know that this a very fine bit of work indeed. The OOTB edge lived up the warnings above, passing the rizla/ultrafine OCB and a range of veg tests effortlessly -horizontal cuts on onion an absolute pleasure in particular. Found myself dicing, and dicing, not wanting the the aliums to end, the excuse of needing finally chopped veg for meatballs running out of plausible ground too early. Looking forward to get to know the Kamon more.

It wasn’t Larry and Cameo that really sprung to mind when I put the Kamon into action either, Slightly ridiculously it got a little more cinematic that that, the soundtrack to Ghost Dog surging into mind as I made the first test cuts for some reason.

I absolutely appreciate, painfully, that making a comparison between a kitchen knife and a dated Jim Jarmusch/Forest Whitaker samurai-mobster film exposes me to a monstrously high risk of disappearing up my own derrière, but I can’t help but hum along mentally and want to rewatch the flick. This Kamon should be a bit of an intimidating monster, a big, dark pock-marked triangle of threat, Yet you can’t help but feel there’s far more sensitivity and warmth (rainbow prism tangs and softly rounded heels for a start) beyond the stereotype, plus a hugely surprising amount of grace and balance for a big boy. And there’s certainly no doubting the clinical, ruthlessly efficiency of this thing - it smoothly glides through product, showing elegance in the silent murderation of a pile of mushrooms. It is a compelling, slightly outworldly companion that demands respect.

Anyway, erm, good film/soundtrack, even better knife. I am going to have some good times with this blade


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## LostHighway

WiriWiri said:


> Joshing aside, I do want to escape this codpiece cul-de-sac to clearly acknowledge that this Kamon is a serious blade that I am most, most grateful to have received. I haven’t really been able to throw enough of a payload at it with three limited weeknight dinners to gain an elevated understanding, but I already know enough to know that this a very fine bit of work indeed. The OOTB edge lived up the warnings above, passing the rizla/ultrafine OCB and a range of veg tests effortlessly -horizontal cuts on onion an absolute pleasure in particular. Found myself dicing, and dicing, not wanting the the aliums to end, the excuse of needing finally chopped veg for meatballs running out of plausible ground too early. Looking forward to get to know the Kamon more.
> 
> It wasn’t Larry and Cameo that really sprung to mind when I put the Kamon into action either, Slightly ridiculously it got a little more cinematic that that, the soundtrack to Ghost Dog surging into mind as I made the first test cuts for some reason.
> 
> I absolutely appreciate, painfully, that making a comparison between a kitchen knife and a dated Jim Jarmusch/Forest Whitaker samurai-mobster film exposes me to a monstrously high risk of disappearing up my own derrière, but I can’t help but hum along mentally and want to rewatch the flick. This Kamon should be a bit of an intimidating monster, a big, dark pock-marked triangle of threat, Yet you can’t help but feel there’s far more sensitivity and warmth (rainbow prism tangs and softly rounded heels for a start) beyond the stereotype, plus a hugely surprising amount of grace and balance for a big boy. And there’s certainly no doubting the clinical, ruthlessly efficiency of this thing - it smoothly glides through product, showing elegance in the silent murderation of a pile of mushrooms. It is a compelling, slightly outworldly companion that demands respect.
> 
> Anyway, erm, good film/soundtrack, even better knife. I am going to have some good times with this blade



 Applause for the Ghost Dog reference. Maybe not one of Jarmusch's best films but I'd put in the top third of his output


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## Hz_zzzzzz

Are these paralleled wavy lines banding or something else? Today I found these lines when I was observing it after sharpening.


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## KAMON Knives

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Are these paralleled wavy lines banding or something else? Today I found these lines when I was observing it after sharpening.
> 
> View attachment 160737



Alloy banding - yes


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## Hz_zzzzzz

KAMON Knives said:


> Alloy banding - yes


So cool! It keeps giving us pleasant surprise!


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## WiriWiri

LostHighway said:


> Applause for the Ghost Dog reference. Maybe not one of Jarmusch's best films but I'd put in the top third of his output



Aw cheers, glad someone else has watched and the slightly tortured ref wasn‘t in vain. Haven‘t seen the film in years until now tbh - a sadder ending than I remembered - but it’s still a good un, despite me bring well past my 20s and less prone to Wu-Tang adoration now. Reckon the comparison still vaguely holds water fwiw, as deliberately shoehorned as it was. Frankly I just wanted to leave another memory of Kamon more cultured than codpieces, as fine as Larry’s uncarriage was.

The Jarmusch film that I really need to watch again is Mystery Train, which I’m fond, but have very partial (stoned) memories of. I just haven‘t bought a knife that‘s compelled me to replay that one yet…


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## LostHighway

WiriWiri said:


> Aw cheers, glad someone else has watched and the slightly tortured ref wasn‘t in vain. Haven‘t seen the film in years until now tbh - a sadder ending than I remembered - but it’s still a good un, despite me bring well past my 20s and less prone to Wu-Tang adoration now. Reckon the comparison still vaguely holds water fwiw, as deliberately shoehorned as it was. Frankly I just wanted to leave another memory of Kamon more cultured than codpieces, as fine as Larry’s uncarriage was.
> 
> The Jarmusch film that I really need to watch again is Mystery Train, which I’m fond, but have very partial (stoned) memories of. I just haven‘t bought a knife that‘s compelled me to replay that one yet…



I think I like his first two films (Stranger Than Paradise and Down by Law) the best but I also have a soft spot for Ghost Dog, Paterson, Mystery Train, and The Only Lovers Left Alive. The Dead Don't Die was his only complete misfire for me.
My twenties are so far in the rear view mirror that they barely register as a dot, nevertheless I do miss the late twentieth century.
Insert obligatory "nice knife!"


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## drsmp

Looking good after a couple meal preps


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## Jason183

Incredibly sharp OOTB edge


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## RockyBasel

thanks again to Ben for making these amazing knives. I have used mine extensively and this is an incredible knife. I absolutely love it. Nothing like this in my collection- unique


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## Jville

Yeah, definetely have a uniqueness and oozes craftsmanship.


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## Hz_zzzzzz

And the profile is like the improved Yoshikane profile that many have been hoping for —— flat, pointy but taller with little to none dead flat zone. It feels so natural and efficient in push cut and UpDownWithALittlePullingMotion cut. Love it!


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## captaincaed




----------



## Jville

captaincaed said:


>



Nice video. I love green papaya salad and hadn’t seen it cut like that, makes sense. I’ll have to try it.


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## KAMON Knives

captaincaed said:


>




"Amateur from Austria" . You must be one of those lovely swedes?


----------



## daddy yo yo

captaincaed said:


>



„I can’t remember who makes this“…


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## captaincaed

KAMON Knives said:


> "Amateur from Austria" . You must be one of those lovely swedes?


I’ve been known to indulge in Swenglish now and then


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## NotAddictedYet

I just finished reading the thread from the beginning and what a treat. Beautiful blades, deep insights into knife making, gambling, phallic references, this thread's got it all!

Seriously though, I learned so much here. Many thanks to the three Massketeers and Mr. Kamon. I think I am a fan.

Aaand I need one of these.


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## Jason183

The tip performance is insanely good


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## xsmx13

Jason183 said:


> The tip performance is insanely good
> View attachment 161744
> View attachment 161745


But can you really stop at just the tip? Sorry, couldn't help it. 

The tip thinness and geometry blow me away every time I use one of his knives, no matter how many times I come back to them. Between this and how nimble the knives feel it's as though you have a razor blade that's an extension of your hand.


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## NBrewster

As a filthy casual with a crushing work schedule I somehow manage to come in and out of this forum between knife drops and it kills me every time.


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## Jason183

Kamon VS tall piles of cucumbers







It does everything so well, slicing so smoothly even on Sashimi


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## toddnmd

With the arrival of my 225 yesterday, I believe Massdrop III: Kamon edition is complete!
Have only done minimal cutting so far, but was thoroughly impressed. 
Masterful craftsmanship by @KAMON Knives with a unique style and incredible attention to detail. Thanks for bringing us all along for the ride and all the great information and insights to help us better understand knifemaking and your processes. I'm really grateful to have the opportunity to participate. 
Sometimes after waiting months or more for a knife and hearing other people's positive impressions, my expectations become unreasonably high. They were quite high for this one, and I will say that the finished product has lived up to them. The dramatic distal taper (and knowledge of how the knives are made) is incredible, and seems to allow this knife to incorporate seemingly incompatible properties into a single blade. I expect to continue to find thoughtful characteristics as I continue to use it.
And of course a HUGE thanks to our Three Massketeers, @RockyBasel , @nakiriknaifuwaifu , and @lemeneid to go through the many, many steps of this project going from dream to reality for 40 happy new Kamon owners. While I'm sure this is a labor of love that yields immense satisfaction for the three of you, it relies on many hours the three of you contributed. I'm so happy to have been able to be a part of it. And sorry for those who were not fortunate enough to get a knife through this massdrop. I wish you luck if you decide to pursue a Kamon through other channels, and hope you have better luck in a future massdrop. 
I'm guessing there will be more amazing massdrop opportunities in the future, and I am eagerly looking forward to Massdrop IV, whenever it happens!


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

toddnmd said:


> With the arrival of my 225 yesterday, I believe Massdrop III: Kamon edition is complete!
> Have only done minimal cutting so far, but was thoroughly impressed.
> Masterful craftsmanship by @KAMON Knives with a unique style and incredible attention to detail. Thanks for bringing us all along for the ride and all the great information and insights to help us better understand knifemaking and your processes. I'm really grateful to have the opportunity to participate.
> Sometimes after waiting months or more for a knife and hearing other people's positive impressions, my expectations become unreasonably high. They were quite high for this one, and I will say that the finished product has lived up to them. The dramatic distal taper (and knowledge of how the knives are made) is incredible, and seems to allow this knife to incorporate seemingly incompatible properties into a single blade. I expect to continue to find thoughtful characteristics as I continue to use it.
> And of course a HUGE thanks to our Three Massketeers, @RockyBasel , @nakiriknaifuwaifu , and @lemeneid to go through the many, many steps of this project going from dream to reality for 40 happy new Kamon owners. While I'm sure this is a labor of love that yields immense satisfaction for the three of you, it relies on many hours the three of you contributed. I'm so happy to have been able to be a part of it. And sorry for those who were not fortunate enough to get a knife through this massdrop. I wish you luck if you decide to pursue a Kamon through other channels, and hope you have better luck in a future massdrop.
> I'm guessing there will be more amazing massdrop opportunities in the future, and I am eagerly looking forward to Massdrop IV, whenever it happens!


ah **** all knives are delivered all across the world woooooo
finally time to write my best person on the forum award  massdrop closing thank you speech post


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu

*With the conclusion of Massdrop III: Kamon...
@KAMON Knives 
@alterwisser @RockyBasel @lemeneid *​
*On behalf of the organisers, I'd like to thank the Austrian Godsmith himself: Benjamin Kamon. *

It’s an incredible feat of blacksmithing to produce as many knives as you did within just a couple months - and I’m sure I speak for everyone by saying that these are some of the most gorgeous, well-engineered, high performing knives I’ve had the pleasure of handling.

To everyone who participated in this thread - thank you for the interest and appreciation. I hope you all found this Massdrop an enjoyable and enlightening experience, and of course - if you received a knife I hope you are enjoying yours as much as I am mine 

Finally, I would like to thank my partners in crime - my fellow massketeers @RockyBasel and @alterwisser as well as our esteemed APAC distributor and professional sweetened citrus drink, @lemeneid. Thanks for making this massdrop a successful one 

It’s been an absolute pleasure lads ✌


nkw


----------



## tostadas

Can anyone share the spine thickness of their 225?
(handle, heel, mid, 1cm from tip?)


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## Delat

Measurements are approximate - the denty finish causes a bit of variation. 5.9mm at the ferrule, 5.1 above the choil, 2.4 halfway, 1.45 just after the last hammer mark, .6 about an inch from the tip


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## hendrix

I’m wondering also if it’s time to renew the conversation with Jannis.


crocca86 said:


> Any news on the xerxes mass drop?


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## Jason183

The Distal taper of Kamon knife is truly the work of Art. Wish I had a caliper.
Kamon(Left) Yoshikane(right)


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## KAMON Knives

Ok guys. Very sorry for the delay. I didn't intend to go dark on you but a lot of things happened over here recently. Stressful times to say the least. 
Also excuse my less glorious post compared to the one of @nakiriknaifuwaifu . 

Let's get to the important stuff:

I had an outstanding experience with this Massdrop! Beginning by the honor of beeing asked to do it, to the work itself, to you guys really showing interest and digging in on the details. I'm always very happy to share those but most of the time I don't actively get asked to do so. It was different here and I appreciated it a lot. Not only does it show me what is interesting to you, my fellow knife nuts, it also gives me direction to know what topics to go into more detailed. 

A huge thanks goes out to @alterwisser for introducing me to the organizers. And another huge thanks goes to the organizers @nakiriknaifuwaifu, @RockyBasel & @lemeneid for doing an outstanding job getting those knives to you guys and having the patience to work with me. Thanks! 

Also I'd like to state how much I appreciate this community overall! I'm not very active here in this forum, yet if ever any questions pop up just tag me and I'll get active. I occasionally read through stuff silently, like posts or get pointed to threads by others that I read through, but if I don't get asked, I usually don't involve myself. The threads I read through however are always entertaining and also show the high level of knowledge within this forum. 

I just want to make clear that I will answer questions if I'm asked to but otherwise tend to not get involved. I figure some folks just want to discuss some topics regarding my work without my opinion and that's fine and I'll respect that. However if any of you ever feel to discuss something openly or just want my opinion about it, just tag me and I'll get into it. 

Last but not least I want to thank all of you guys who got a KKF MD knife for your trust and I wish you lots of fun with it. I hope it serves you well for a long time!


----------



## Jville

@KAMON Knives it has been an absolute pleasure to have you do this massdrop and I feel very fortunate to have gotten one. The craftsmanship and attention to detail is absolutely amazing with performance to match!!


----------



## demcav

I've been slow to post a review regarding the 225mm I was lucky enough to get, as I wanted to have time with it before writing. I never expected to have a knife replace my 210mm TF Denka as my go-to prep knife, but as they say, "never say never!"

The 225mm edge is the perfect size for my home kitchen use. It's nimble but with enough length for all my prep needs, including prepping for a dinner party of 10 guests. Being sufficiently thin behind the edge makes wicked horizontal and vertical cuts through onions and garlic cloves! The profile and distal taper are everything I expected from the photos Mr. Kamon posted during the design and build phases. With regular use, light honing is all that is required to keep the edge as razor-sharp as when it arrived.

The balance point is at the logo -- right at the pinch grip. The bog oak handle is comfortable and is "blacker than a hundred midnights down in a cypress swamp." Mr. Kamon's care and craft amaze me each time I use this knife -- the fit and finish are top-notch, resulting in a tool to be used and enjoyed for many years to come.

My sincere thanks to all involved in coordinating and executing this project!!


----------



## Bodine

After a few months of daily use in my home kitchen, it is worthy of a review.
As demcav said, only light stropping, so far, and the edge is like new, it may take a year to put it on some stones, although I am itching to do so.
After continual use I must say this steel is not very reactive at all, just a hint of patina at this point, and I have cut lots of raw and cooked protein with it.
Fit and finish is superb, weight is enjoyable to say the least.
I think my search for my ultimate kitchen knife has ended. I don't look at BST near as much as I used to.
My sincere thanks to Mr. Kamon and the crew that put this huge endeavor together.
I feel blessed.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Huge thx @Bodine that you took the time to write a review! And of course thanks for your kind words .


----------

