# Fredrik Spåre Impressions



## timebard

It's here...







Haven't had a chance to use it yet, but since there's been a lot of discussion as people get their orders from his Modern Cooking collab, I thought I'd put up a thread with first impressions. In no particular order:

- It's quite light and nimble feeling in hand but still has a good solidity to it.
- The tip is wicked thin and pointy. Definitely looking forward to horizontal onion swipes with this guy.
- I'm digging the handle shape and weight. I like dense, solid handles but also prefer a forward balance AND dramatic distal taper; this feels like a great compromise between those competing priorities. Feels good in hand and I don't think the shorter neck will be an issue for me.
- The hamon pops more than I expected from photos, which is great!
- I was a little worried the sweep back of the heel would be too dramatic and liable to catch on everything, but I don't think that'll be the case.

Can't wait to put it to use.


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## birdsfan

Thank you for starting the thread. I will post some additional reactions after a full shift of cutting tomorrow.


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## esoo

I'm down for batch 2 of these, so will be watching this thread.


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## Rainman890

Is this thread only for the modern cooking knives, or can anyone with a Spåre make comments?


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## timebard

Rainman890 said:


> Is this thread only for the modern cooking knives, or can anyone with a Spåre make comments?



All Spåre observations are welcome! I'd be especially interested in hearing from anyone who can compare the MCX batch to his customs.


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## tomsch

Thanks for the initial review and look forward to updates. I'll be on the look-out for the next batch but it may be a challenge to pick one up.


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## timebard

So I'm working from home today and was way too impatient to wait all day to try it out... 






Made a quick cucumber tomato salad with shallots. This thing can ***** cut! I had heard Spare's knives tend to come with poor initial edges but I can say that is definitely not the case with this one. Over ripe tomatoes were no problem, murdered the shallot, great feel in use. I had tried to rein in my expectations for performance on this purchase but that clearly wasn't necessary.


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## Delat

I’m expecting one from batch 2 in January as well so very excited to hear about both the MCX and his regular work.


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## tostadas

I have one of the 230mm ones from the MCX. Here's my initial observations

*Dimensions*
234x53, 185g. 3.5mm/2.6mm/0.7mm spine. Grind behind edge at midpoint 0.25mm/0.7mm/1.1mm/1.7mm (@1mm/5mm/10mm/20mm), fully convex on both sides, and tapering from heel to tip. The grind is pretty similar to my Watanabe SS. The profile is slightly flatter than average. The flat spot in the back is approx 40-50% of the blade length, and a very slight rise toward the tip.

*Fit and Finish*
F&F on this guy is one of the best I've seen. There are no rough edges on the blade, and the finish on the blade is simple horizontal sanding. Handle feels really nice. Dense bog oak, a spacer of some sort, and a brass ferrule, all perfectly transitioned. The handle is only 121mm long, compared to 135-145mm which I normally see on this length of blade, but it works perfectly to balance the knife about 25mm forward of the choil notch. That brings me to my one main gripe about the knife, which is the distance between the handle and the choil notch. It's really short, which makes the grip feel kinda cramped. I think a little bit of adjustment to the notch by grinding it another couple mm would make this perfect.

*Overall*
My expectations were high, and this exceeded them. This is really a complete package that can easily stand toe to toe with knives I've had in the $500 range. Grind is perfect for me, dimensions are excellent, and the fit and finish are well above average. A couple minor tweaks such as on the choil clearance, and maybe some polishing to bring out the hamon will make this even better. I have another custom already lined up with Fredrik, and I can't wait to see what other stuff he puts out in the future.


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## Rainman890

Man, I really am sorry I missed out on this drop. I have two customs from him:

180 bunka in 2092 Steel. I asked for a more workhorse grind, and I got it. I love this thing. It's a bit taller than the other bunka I have (Yoshimi Kato AS), but this thing cuts so nice. Out of the box edge was a bit odd, but I touched it up on a Roma 3k, and it just flew through whatever I put on my cutting board. The 2092 steel is crazy reactive, but I have a nice patina now. I'm still new at this game, but cutting with it just makes me happy, so I guess that's a good thing.

Cleaver (180?) In 1.2419. It's my first cleaver, and I love it too. It's a Chinese style cleaver, so it's thin. I used it to make cole slaw, and it flew through the cabbage. I really like cleavers now...

Overall, I am super happy with them, and am thinking of ordering another one from him because of all the excitement. But I really want to try some other western makers. The upside of Spåre is that his books are still open, and you can actually get knives from him. It seems impossible everywhere else...


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## tomsch

Thanks for sharing the progress! I'll be on the hunt when the next batch is released. I'm a little soothed since my Yoshi 210mm SDK arrived today to keep me busy for the near term until I can pick up a Fredrik Spare.


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## Corradobrit1

How's the stiction and food release?


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## timebard

Corradobrit1 said:


> How's the stiction and food release?



Honestly I don't pay that much attention to release as a home user unless it's particularly bad, which this one is not. If I had to evaluate I'd say "about the same as other convex midweight gyutos" e.g. Toyama or Kipp WP.


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## Jovidah

Makes sense to get 2; that way you always have a Spåre knife...


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## birdsfan

Great review from @tostadas! I used my MCX 230 today for a full shift. Made 2 soups, so cut about 10 lbs of onion, 5 hefty carrots, a head of celery, 3 lbs of bell pepper and some raw beef, and 5 lbs of mushrooms. Also made some slaw so I got to take the Spare to some fairly dense cabbage (though I used my Zwilling to cut the chunk off the head)

Some reactions:

I LOVED the handle. I am partial to heart shaped handles to begin, so there is bias. I thought it might be a little small, but it was very comfortable through a morning of intense cutting. It has a fairly textured finsh that made me thing of a finer grained burnt chestnut. Even when my hand was wet or greasy, the grip was solid. I replace the handle on just about every knife I buy (cuz I like to make cool handles for them) but I will not be swapping out this one. The F&F, and the general asthetics, coupled with great performance, makes this a keeper. The short neck didnt really bother me, the spine and choil are nicely eased so there was no biting edge, but I can get how that short neck could disrupt a grip.

The tip is very pointy and nice and thin. Horizontal onion cuts were effortless and the shallow tip made it easy to draw though my beef cuts. It has good distal taper. I would put it in the middleweight range in terms of how sturdy it feels, It felt authoritative on the big ol' carrots that I intentionally selected, and on the fairly dense quarter head of cabbage. Overall, it exceeded my expectations as a cutter, after my test cuts from yesterday. @Corradobrit1 asked about food release and stiction. Stiction didnt impede cutting, even through the wet beef. Food release was middling. It is a wide bevel knife with little or no convexity. Food tends to cling to the blade until it reaches the top of the grind. It doesnt have the food release issues of a Sakai laser, but it doesnt shed cuts like Heiji. Food release issues did not impede my cutting, except for a little when I rocked. Which brings me to my only criticism of the knife. The gentle curve at the tip of the profile allows for a rock cut, but the heel gave a yoshikanesque thunk at the bottom of the rock. Not as bad as a Yoshi, mind you, should one lapse into an ill advised rock, but it was there. It didnt affect any of my cutting. Things I usually rock through, celery and carrot stalks, I continued to rock through, but if I could define my ideal profile, I might want the heel to sweep a bit, if that makes sense. For push cuts, and draws, it was freaking awesome!

Obviously I had no need to freshen the edge, since it was only one day, so I can't speak to edge retention or sharpening characteristics, but the steel was not super reactive. It developed an attractive patina, with blue and orange hues.

On the whole, I am very pleased. It punches waaaaay above its weight! Part of me wants to insert it into my regular rotation, yet another part of me just wants to polish it so I can enjoy it's beauty on my rack.


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## tostadas

A short update after using it to prep almost 10lbs of root veggies for soup.

Food release is similar to any thin midweight grind knife. There were no stiction issues. When I checked with a straightedge, my example seems to have a gentle convex along the entire blade face. It goes through regular size carrots with ease, but on the larger ones, there's an ever so slight cracking throughout the cut. No wedging though. Balance is great, sort of neutral right at the pinch grip. Overall performance is excellent. I think it will only improve as the knife develops some patina.

The handle is a little bit narrower than normal at 18mm (compared to 20-22mm that I typically prefer), but makes up for it in some extra height, giving it a similar overall circumference. I found the handle to be very comfortable in use in terms of dimensions and material. The bog oak provides a nice amount of grip due to the texture. I found that the initial handle coating came off after the first wash, so I think it was a simple wax and buff. With the wax gone, I think the handle feels a bit dry, so I will probably apply some sort of oil on it, maybe smooth out some of the splinters with a scotch brite pad and apply a few thin coats of Tru Oil.

My main gripe is still the short grip clearance at the choil. I can adjust my grip to make it work, but I may have to eventually grind it down a tad in order to correct it. I don't know if this was standard from the maker, or if this was a special design choice by the vendor. I can compare when I get my custom from Fredrik, where I left most of these kind of design decisions up to him.


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## JayS20

Totally get you @birdsfan regarding profile and heel, seems we have similar preferences.
Would like to see some photos of the short grip clearance and how you hold it @tostadas 
I have been following Spare's work since the days he only posted in Swedish. I was intrigued and ordered a custom from him. He asked me several times about dimensions and profile alterations and I also told him how I would like the handle regarding shape and materials. Great custom experience, great guy.
This is one of his earlier knives





The fit and finish was already really good back then and I recommended his knives to some guys. Happy he grew his customer list. I also ordered another one from him. Curious how much he evolved.


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## Dgilks

Does anyone have experience with his thin cleavers? They look good.


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## Jville

So is it convex or wide bevel? I was under the impression it was convened.


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## tcmx3

Jville said:


> So is it convex or wide bevel? I was under the impression it was convened.



technically both.

the shinogi is VERY high though, think Shi.Han.


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## timebard

tcmx3 said:


> technically both.
> 
> the shinogi is VERY high though, think Shi.Han.



Seems about right. There is some convexity in the back ~60% of mine, mostly in the last cm above the edge, then more or less flat past the hamon up to the last cm or so before the spine. As you get towards the tip the convexity more or less disappears. So yes, it's convex, but not really fully convex up the whole grind (or if it is it's really subtle).


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## birdsfan

I just took a straight edge out to look at mine. On mine there is subtle convexity up the whole length of the grind. I could really see it looking down the choil, but the straight edge shows its there.


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## Dull_Apex

For those with the MCX version, could you please measure the neck length. I'm curious as to how short it is with all the comments. 

Thanks.


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## birdsfan

I just measured my 230mm version. Looks to be about 12mm. I eyeballed it using a ruler, so +/- 1mm


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## Barmoley

My 250‘s neck is 11.4 mm. It is not just that the neck is a bit short, but it feels shorter because the choil curves back to the handle making it feel even shorter. It is fine unless you like deep pinch grip where your middle finger is against the choil. Other than this the knife looks to be very well made, definitely very impressive for the price.


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## tostadas

My 230 neck is 10.8mm from ferrule to furthest point of the choil.


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## Jville

tostadas said:


> My 230 neck is 10.8mm from ferrule to furthest point of the choil.View attachment 154615


Yeah that looks pretty tight. I wonder if @moderncooking might fix that for the next batch.


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## xsmx13

My observation falls very much in line with what others have posted, though perhaps the neck is even a bit shorter checking in at a 10.5mm neck length (250mm version). I'll see how it feels after a larger meal prep, but initially it still feels comfortable and I really like the profile.

As for the grind, it appears to have a mild convex across the majority of the profile until it really tapers down towards the tip.

Overall, this feels very nimble and much shorter than the actual length very much like a similarly sized Kamon. That said, this cost less than 1/3 the price (which I would pay again in a heart beat!).


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## timebard

Regarding neck measurements, mine is about 11.5mm ferrule to heel. I checked five other wa gyutos to compare and measured 13mm-21mm, with all but one at least 15mm. I haven't found it a problem in use (and I do use a choked up pinch grip), but it's an odd choice in an otherwise really thoughtfully designed knife. I do think it makes for a more nimble feel but a neck that extends the full width of the handle on the bottom might make it more ergonomic... though then that moves the balance backwards a hair. Tradeoffs!


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## tcmx3

I didnt even think about this with mine, but then I have absolute skelly fingers


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## Barmoley

timebard said:


> Regarding neck measurements, mine is about 11.5mm ferrule to heel. I checked five other wa gyutos to compare and measured 13mm-21mm, with all but one at least 15mm. I haven't found it a problem in use (and I do use a choked up pinch grip), but it's an odd choice in an otherwise really thoughtfully designed knife. I do think it makes for a more nimble feel but a neck that extends the full width of the handle on the bottom might make it more ergonomic... though then that moves the balance backwards a hair. Tradeoffs!


I've seen this happen when people who usually build western handles make wa handles. Not saying this is the case here as I know absolutely nothing about this maker, just an observation.


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## moderncooking

Hello everyone,

Apologies for not chiming in earlier here. Since the initial release it’s been utter madness with the Christmas rush. I actually even went up to Austria to meet with Tobias Hangler for a knife making course, and got to check out the Goldvein Kamon edition, a $40k piece of crazy kitchen art.

Anyway, about the MCX. Big thanks to @timebard @birdsfan @tostadas and @xsmx13 and to everyone else for all the feedback.

I am with you all on the short neck and we will certainly be making some changes to the overall handle fit and design in the next batch. I am thinking about a more exaggerated finger rest, but It has been the plan to design a more unique handle for this second edition also. In any case there will be more space on the next edition.

About the overall profile, the large flat and the convexing. The flat has been an interesting experience for me too, on my 230. I have found it to be pretty nice generally speaking but winding it back ever so slightly, a 10% reduction feels like it would be perfect.

The convexing on my knife is also very shallow, performance wise I don’t really have any complaints, but perhaps a little more aggressive convexing could pay off.

I am sure that I have mentioned, but we are aiming for a late January release of the second MCX Fredrik Spåre edition, which will be a similar knife to this one with the major changes coming to the handle.

There are also plans for MCX Lew Griffin, MCX Neil Ayling and a slightly more premium integral handle MCX Fredrik Spare. Many more to come I am sure, but those are the current editions on the books.

Thanks again and please let me know if there are any requests for knife types?

I have in mind a Nakiri, a Honesuke and Fredrik is pretty excited about doing a Bunka down the track.



Cheers,

Peter


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## Jville

moderncooking said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Apologies for not chiming in earlier here. Since the initial release it’s been utter madness with the Christmas rush. I actually even went up to Austria to meet with Tobias Hangler for a knife making course, and got to check out the Goldvein Kamon edition, a $40k piece of crazy kitchen art.
> 
> Anyway, about the MCX. Big thanks to @timebard @birdsfan @tostadas and @xsmx13 and to everyone else for all the feedback.
> 
> I am with you all on the short neck and we will certainly be making some changes to the overall handle fit and design in the next batch. I am thinking about a more exaggerated finger rest, but It has been the plan to design a more unique handle for this second edition also. In any case there will be more space on the next edition.
> 
> About the overall profile, the large flat and the convexing. The flat has been an interesting experience for me too, on my 230. I have found it to be pretty nice generally speaking but winding it back ever so slightly, a 10% reduction feels like it would be perfect.
> 
> The convexing on my knife is also very shallow, performance wise I don’t really have any complaints, but perhaps a little more aggressive convexing could pay off.
> 
> I am sure that I have mentioned, but we are aiming for a late January release of the second MCX Fredrik Spåre edition, which will be a similar knife to this one with the major changes coming to the handle.
> 
> There are also plans for MCX Lew Griffin, MCX Neil Ayling and a slightly more premium integral handle MCX Fredrik Spare. Many more to come I am sure, but those are the current editions on the books.
> 
> Thanks again and please let me know if there are any requests for knife types?
> 
> I have in mind a Nakiri, a Honesuke and Fredrik is pretty excited about doing a Bunka down the track.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Peter


Those 3 tweaks sound great!


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## Delat

moderncooking said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Apologies for not chiming in earlier here. Since the initial release it’s been utter madness with the Christmas rush. I actually even went up to Austria to meet with Tobias Hangler for a knife making course, and got to check out the Goldvein Kamon edition, a $40k piece of crazy kitchen art.
> 
> Anyway, about the MCX. Big thanks to @timebard @birdsfan @tostadas and @xsmx13 and to everyone else for all the feedback.
> 
> I am with you all on the short neck and we will certainly be making some changes to the overall handle fit and design in the next batch. I am thinking about a more exaggerated finger rest, but It has been the plan to design a more unique handle for this second edition also. In any case there will be more space on the next edition.
> 
> About the overall profile, the large flat and the convexing. The flat has been an interesting experience for me too, on my 230. I have found it to be pretty nice generally speaking but winding it back ever so slightly, a 10% reduction feels like it would be perfect.
> 
> The convexing on my knife is also very shallow, performance wise I don’t really have any complaints, but perhaps a little more aggressive convexing could pay off.
> 
> I am sure that I have mentioned, but we are aiming for a late January release of the second MCX Fredrik Spåre edition, which will be a similar knife to this one with the major changes coming to the handle.
> 
> There are also plans for MCX Lew Griffin, MCX Neil Ayling and a slightly more premium integral handle MCX Fredrik Spare. Many more to come I am sure, but those are the current editions on the books.
> 
> Thanks again and please let me know if there are any requests for knife types?
> 
> I have in mind a Nakiri, a Honesuke and Fredrik is pretty excited about doing a Bunka down the track.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Peter



I didn’t think I could get even more excited but there you go! The changes sound perfect.


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## birdsfan

+1 on above! Those little alterations address any performance/usage critique that I noted. Looks like I better start watching your site to see when the new ones go up!


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## moderncooking

birdsfan said:


> +1 on above! Those little alterations address any performance/usage critique that I noted. Looks like I better start watching your site to see when the new ones go up!




I am hoping that we can make this next batch happen towards the end of January


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## Jville

Thank you to everyone who took the time to review these and give me input.


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## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> I am hoping that we can make this next batch happen towards the end of January


Am I misunderstanding, or are these in the next batch already spoken for?


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## Delat

xsmx13 said:


> Am I misunderstanding, or are these in the next batch already spoken for?



They were sold out before the official release due to a website snafu. "Regular" Spares over on Modern Cooking run a range of prices but some aren't much more than the MCX batches.


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## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> Am I misunderstanding, or are these in the next batch already spoken for?



So, the *first edition* we did two batches of 10 and they are all sold. 

We are working on a *second edition* with Fredrik. The second edition will feature a different handle design and we will take the feedback from this thread in hand as we design that knife.

The second edition will hopefully be live at the end of January. I will notify everyone of its release via my Newsletter first and then via Instagram. So, best is to jump onto my Newsletter if you are interested in these knives. There will be only 10 knives each MCX edition going forward. We are attempting to release a new edition each month.


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## esoo

moderncooking said:


> So, the *first edition* we did two batches of 10 and they are all sold.
> 
> We are working on a *second edition* with Fredrik. The second edition will feature a different handle design and we will take the feedback from this thread in hand as we design that knife.
> 
> The second edition will hopefully be live at the end of January. I will notify everyone of its release via my Newsletter first and then via Instagram. So, best is to jump onto my Newsletter if you are interested in these knives. There will be only 10 knives each MCX edition going forward. We are attempting to release a new edition each month.



So those of us that snuck in on the newsletter link will get a knife identical to the ones that are in the wild now? And those that order in January will get the new version that is being discussed in the thread?

Just trying to be clear. I'm cool waiting for the first edition - regardless of which one I get it's a damn cool knife for the price.


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## moderncooking

esoo said:


> So those of us that snuck in on the newsletter link will get a knife identical to the ones that are in the wild now? And those that order in January will get the new version that is being discussed in the thread?
> 
> Just trying to be clear. I'm cool waiting for the first edition - regardless of which one I get it's a damn cool knife for the price.



Yes that is correct


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## Sdo

moderncooking said:


> So, the *first edition* we did two batches of 10 and they are all sold.
> 
> We are working on a *second edition* with Fredrik. The second edition will feature a different handle design and we will take the feedback from this thread in hand as we design that knife.
> 
> The second edition will hopefully be live at the end of January. I will notify everyone of its release via my Newsletter first and then via Instagram. So, best is to jump onto my Newsletter if you are interested in these knives. There will be only 10 knives each MCX edition going forward. We are attempting to release a new edition each month.


Now this is getting confusing. Those who already paid for the second batch are going to get these? Unless there are still slots for the second batch ( looked sold out ) not sure how can more be available?.

Cheers!


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## tcmx3

Sdo said:


> Now this is getting confusing. Those who already paid for the second batch are going to get these? Unless there are still slots for the second batch ( looked sold out ) not sure how can more be available?.
> 
> Cheers!



batch != edition

you can be in 3 groups:

1. edition 1 batch 1 (we have our knives)
2. edition 1 batch 2 (yet to receive knives)
3. edition 2 (yet to go on sale)


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## Sdo

tcmx3 said:


> batch != edition
> 
> you can be in 3 groups:
> 
> 1. edition 1 batch 1 (we have our knives)
> 2. edition 1 batch 2 (yet to receive knives)
> 3. edition 2 (yet to go on sale)


Thanks for that but still not making much sense as the edition 1 batch 2 is set up for delivery at the same time... Well, I am happy with any but it got confusing now.

Cheers!


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## esoo

Sdo said:


> Thanks for that but still not making much sense as the edition 1 batch 2 is set up for delivery at the same time... Well, I am happy with any but it got confusing now.
> 
> Cheers!



If you bought the knife the first round on the Modern Cooking website, that's edition 1, batch 1 (already delivered). If you ordered one from the newsletter of Modern Cooking (or got passed the "hidden link") then you will be getting an edition 1, batch 2. Modern Cooking is coming out with an edition 2 of the knife making some design changes based on the edition 1 feedback so far (estimated to be for sale in January)


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## Sdo

That enlightens the thing. 

Many thanks.


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## moderncooking

I think its all clear now. Thanks for clarifying everything @esoo and @tcmx3. 

Sorry if I have been communicating poorly


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## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> So, the *first edition* we did two batches of 10 and they are all sold.
> 
> We are working on a *second edition* with Fredrik. The second edition will feature a different handle design and we will take the feedback from this thread in hand as we design that knife.
> 
> The second edition will hopefully be live at the end of January. I will notify everyone of its release via my Newsletter first and then via Instagram. So, best is to jump onto my Newsletter if you are interested in these knives. There will be only 10 knives each MCX edition going forward. We are attempting to release a new edition each month.



You should definitely reserve some for folks who purchased from the first batch so they can share impressions on the comparison of the two. Clearly no bias here. 

Oh, and love the each month part!


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## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> You should definitely reserve some for folks who purchased from the first batch so they can share impressions on the comparison of the two. Clearly no bias here.
> 
> Oh, and love the each month part!



That's a nice idea and we will do that for sure. We usually make a few extras in case of failures anyway. Ill keep a reserve and we can organise a pass around for this group


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## timebard

moderncooking said:


> That's a nice idea and we will do that for sure. We usually make a few extras in case of failures anyway. Ill keep a reserve and we can organise a pass around for this group



Love this idea. It's fun to be a (very small) part of the design process with a talented up and coming maker and even better to get the chance to see how the feedback here was interpreted and applied.


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## Barmoley

Finally used my 250 yesterday. The neck shortness wasn't an issue for me. Because of how the handle is and possibly the shape of it the neck didn't bother me. I still think the proposed changes, one of which is making the neck longer are a good idea, but even with this version it is OK. The knife came sharp, which is a nice touch. The knife feels very nimble and the profile worked well for me. The knife is lighter than what I usually prefer, but because of the blade forward balance in pinch it still feels good and the overall weight makes it feel very nimble and fast. Haven't cut anything where food release would be important, so can't comment on that yet. So far seems like a very nice knife.


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## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> That's a nice idea and we will do that for sure. We usually make a few extras in case of failures anyway. Ill keep a reserve and we can organise a pass around for this group


I was kidding, but a pass around will be awesome!


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## Midsummer

I think it would be a nice option if those who have bought the originals be given first shot at buying the next knives in the series.

Modern cooking could send a link to those who previously purchased MCX knives before they open the link to the public.

I think this would allow really thoughtful review of the knife series. It might be a good move for business; as the collectors would likely try to get a full set.


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## timebard

Midsummer said:


> I think it would be a nice option if those who have bought the originals be given first shot at buying the next knives in the series.
> 
> Modern cooking could send a link to those who previously purchased MCX knives before they open the link to the public.
> 
> I think this would allow really thoughtful review of the knife series. It might be a good move for business; as the collectors would likely try to get a full set.



From a selfish perspective this would be nice, but as a rule I've never been a fan of early access for prior customers. As makers become more sought-after, it rubs me the wrong way that people who already have one or several of their knives get to cut the line while people who want to try the maker for the first time have to stay up til 3am hitting F5, or hunt around on the secondary market. (I guess this isn't so relevant for Spare since his books are still open, but I imagine that won't always be the case.) Not a big deal but just my two cents.


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## tostadas

Yea even though I also was fortunate enough to get in on the first batch, I'd also support allowing others the chance to try his work without a "priority list". And of course, anyone can always reach out to Fredrik directly via IG and order a custom for a reasonable price without having to fight for a spot from a vendor.


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## tcmx3

Midsummer said:


> I think it would be a nice option if those who have bought the originals be given first shot at buying the next knives in the series.
> 
> Modern cooking could send a link to those who previously purchased MCX knives before they open the link to the public.
> 
> I think this would allow really thoughtful review of the knife series. It might be a good move for business; as the collectors would likely try to get a full set.



the issue is there will probably be as many knives in the second edition as the first and we'd all just buy them right?

if there were going to be like, 30, and more people were going to get them who hadnt gotten the first batch then maybe OK. but it would probably be what, between 7 and 10 of us just reordering?


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## tostadas

tcmx3 said:


> the issue is there will probably be as many knives in the second edition as the first and we'd all just buy them right?
> 
> if there were going to be like, 30, and more people were going to get them who hadnt gotten the first batch then maybe OK. but it would probably be what, between 7 and 10 of us just reordering?


But what if I went and ordered all 10 of them?


----------



## tcmx3

tostadas said:


> But what if I went and ordered all 10 of them?



if you were going to you shouldnt have said anything.

Im closer to the MC server than you are by a couple thousand kilometers so I have the microsecond advantage


----------



## Jville

Midsummer said:


> I think it would be a nice option if those who have bought the originals be given first shot at buying the next knives in the series.
> 
> Modern cooking could send a link to those who previously purchased MCX knives before they open the link to the public.
> 
> I think this would allow really thoughtful review of the knife series. It might be a good move for business; as the collectors would likely try to get a full set.


Well you know, most of them are already sold. They will probably have a few extras they said, unless the extras is what you were referring to.


----------



## moderncooking

Its really nice that everyone here is so excited about this project. Personally, I would like to see as many individuals as possible get a chance to work with these knives and so I don't think there will be any early adopter privileges, but I do really appreciate your support.

There will be a few extra knives beyond the 10 that we make for the second edition release and I will try to organize a PA with one of those and use any remaining pieces to hook up those from the early adopter group who miss out. 

Had some initial chats with Fredrik last night about the second edition and we are both excited to see how this next design goes. Without giving away too much, the new knife will share a lot of the elements that made the first edition great including the Forge/Hamon finish. Edge profile will be similar, but the overall profile will be different and as previously mentioned so will the handle design.

Anyway, I will remain tight lipped about the rest!


----------



## tostadas

I made a few modifications to mine that I mentioned previously. Expanded the choil area to allow better fit for my finger, put a few coats of Tru oil on the handle, and polished/etched the blade. It's a really fun knife now.


----------



## moderncooking

tostadas said:


> I made a few modifications to mine that I mentioned previously. Expanded the choil area to allow better fit for my finger, put a few coats of Tru oil on the handle, and polished/etched the blade. It's a really fun knife now.



Looks good!


----------



## DrEriksson

moderncooking said:


> So, the *first edition* we did two batches of 10 and they are all sold.
> 
> We are working on a *second edition* with Fredrik. The second edition will feature a different handle design and we will take the feedback from this thread in hand as we design that knife.
> 
> The second edition will hopefully be live at the end of January. I will notify everyone of its release via my Newsletter first and then via Instagram. So, best is to jump onto my Newsletter if you are interested in these knives. There will be only 10 knives each MCX edition going forward. We are attempting to release a new edition each month.



I’ve seen a few Spåre knives and have to say that both his gyutos and bunkas are very nice. As you probably know, he really likes the bunka himself. Not sure about what is generally in demand, but his new stainless steel really impressed me.

I’ll throw in a pic or two from the PA bunka I’m hosting among instagram foodies in my hometown (sorry for IG links, hadn’t saved the pics).





Some bonus pics of his knives:


https://imgur.com/a/ky3bNtq
https://imgur.com/a/odZqKnk
https://imgur.com/a/5sR4ipY


----------



## timebard

DrEriksson said:


> I’ve seen a few Spåre knives and have to say that both his gyutos and bunkas are very nice. As you probably know, he really likes the bunka himself. Not sure about what is generally in demand, but his new stainless steel really impressed me.
> 
> I’ll throw in a pic or two from the PA bunka I’m hosting among instagram foodies in my hometown (sorry for IG links, hadn’t saved the pics).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some bonus pics of his knives:
> 
> 
> https://imgur.com/a/ky3bNtq
> https://imgur.com/a/odZqKnk
> https://imgur.com/a/5sR4ipY




Looks like your IG foodie friends could use a lesson in caring for reactive knives... 

Nice set, thanks for sharing!


----------



## moderncooking

Hey folks,

Just wanted to give a quick update. 

*First Edition, Batch 2*

Fredrik is working on the knives at the moment. They are all on schedule for January shipping. Hopefully around the 20th of this month.

We have actually decided to give the knives in the second batch a little more space around the neck. 

*Second Edition*

I have been working hard on the designs for the new handle and it is coming along nicely, but after some discussion with Fredrik we have decided to deliver the second edition knife with the same handle as the first edition. We are just not totally happy with the design and we believe it is better to roll out one or two more editions with the first handle than rush a design that we are not completely happy with. 

So, the second edition will be a pretty different knife, but will retain the same "Shield" profile as the first edition.


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> Hey folks,
> 
> Just wanted to give a quick update.
> 
> *First Edition, Batch 2*
> 
> Fredrik is working on the knives at the moment. They are all on schedule for January shipping. Hopefully around the 20th of this month.
> 
> We have actually decided to give the knives in the second batch a little more space around the neck.
> 
> *Second Edition*
> 
> I have been working hard on the designs for the new handle and it is coming along nicely, but after some discussion with Fredrik we have decided to deliver the second edition knife with the same handle as the first edition. We are just not totally happy with the design and we believe it is better to roll out one or two more editions with the first handle than rush a design that we are not completely happy with.
> 
> So, the second edition will be a pretty different knife, but will retain the same "Shield" profile as the first edition.


Don't threaten me with a crazy comfy handle.


----------



## KilgoreTrout

Thank you for posting this. I’m impatiently waiting on a demascus tall bunka with a high contrast etch from him. So excited.


----------



## moderncooking

Hey MCX fans,

The second batch are just about ready to ship. 






Fredrik has told me he will be shipping the knives to me in the next day or two, which means they will be shipped to you early next week.


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> Hey MCX fans,
> 
> The second batch are just about ready to ship.
> 
> View attachment 161299
> 
> 
> Fredrik has told me he will be shipping the knives to me in the next day or two, which means they will be shipped to you early next week.


Beautiful knives, will them show up one the website tomorrow?


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Beautiful knives, will them show up one the website tomorrow?



Hey @blokey,

This batch is already sold out, but if you are interested in getting one we will be releasing more throughout the year. The best is to signup to our newsletter and follow us on Instagram. That's usually how we announce the releases.

You can signup to the newsletter here


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> Hey @blokey,
> 
> This batch is already sold out, but if you are interested in getting one we will be releasing more throughout the year. The best is to signup to our newsletter and follow us on Instagram. That's usually how we announce the releases.
> 
> You can signup to the newsletter here


Thank you! Looking forward to the next batch


----------



## moderncooking

MCX Fredrik Spåre UPDATE






Doing my best to get these all packed and shipped today, but it maybe Monday. Fredrik has done an amazing job, they all look fantastic.

A couple of adjustments have been made. An increased gap at the choil, a more substantial coat of tru oil on the handle and a more defined forged finish on the blade.

Kinda wish I had waited for this batch to keep one for myself, but never the less I am still loving my batch 1 230mm. Congratulations to those who will be receiving one of these in the next week or so, I can't wait to read your feedback.

The design for MCX edition two is locked in now and we are looking at a mid February release on those, but I will send an announcement via my Newsletter when they are available on the site.

Thanks again to everyone who has supported this little project of ours. As you can see we are taking your feedback seriously and it is very much appreciated.

Best regards and happy cooking,
Peter


----------



## JASinIL2006

Those are some handsome knives!


----------



## Delat

Love the increased tsuchime/ku area! I know tastes vary but I thought it was way too small on the first batch.

I just love looking at tsuchime knives and knowing/picturing the blacksmith pounding on them with a hammer. Kind of a proxy release of pent up frustrations after sitting in front of a computer all day


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> MCX Fredrik Spåre UPDATE
> 
> View attachment 161842



Just showed this pic to my wife and told her this was my next knife. Her first comment: “The Austrian guy (@KAMON Knives) gave me candy. Am I getting Swedish candy?”


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> MCX Fredrik Spåre UPDATE
> 
> View attachment 161842
> 
> 
> Doing my best to get these all packed and shipped today, but it maybe Monday. Fredrik has done an amazing job, they all look fantastic.
> 
> A couple of adjustments have been made. An increased gap at the choil, a more substantial coat of tru oil on the handle and a more defined forged finish on the blade.
> 
> Kinda wish I had waited for this batch to keep one for myself, but never the less I am still loving my batch 1 230mm. Congratulations to those who will be receiving one of these in the next week or so, I can't wait to read your feedback.
> 
> The design for MCX edition two is locked in now and we are looking at a mid February release on those, but I will send an announcement via my Newsletter when they are available on the site.
> 
> Thanks again to everyone who has supported this little project of ours. As you can see we are taking your feedback seriously and it is very much appreciated.
> 
> Best regards and happy cooking,
> Peter


Damn, I almost bought one from the second batch and now I wish I had!


----------



## Jville

Delat said:


> Just showed this pic to my wife and told her this was my next knife. Her first comment: “The Austrian guy (@KAMON Knives) gave me candy. Am I getting Swedish candy?”


Just buy some different candies and every time you get a new knife just throw a couple of “signature” candies in the box.


----------



## timebard

moderncooking said:


> MCX Fredrik Spåre UPDATE
> 
> View attachment 161842
> 
> 
> Doing my best to get these all packed and shipped today, but it maybe Monday. Fredrik has done an amazing job, they all look fantastic.
> 
> A couple of adjustments have been made. An increased gap at the choil, a more substantial coat of tru oil on the handle and a more defined forged finish on the blade.
> 
> Kinda wish I had waited for this batch to keep one for myself, but never the less I am still loving my batch 1 230mm. Congratulations to those who will be receiving one of these in the next week or so, I can't wait to read your feedback.
> 
> The design for MCX edition two is locked in now and we are looking at a mid February release on those, but I will send an announcement via my Newsletter when they are available on the site.
> 
> Thanks again to everyone who has supported this little project of ours. As you can see we are taking your feedback seriously and it is very much appreciated.
> 
> Best regards and happy cooking,
> Peter



I believe there had been rumors of a passaround of one of the second edition knives so those who bought the first could see how the hive mind's input got implemented... any chance we might be lucky enough to see that become reality?


----------



## gaijin

Delat said:


> Just showed this pic to my wife and told her this was my next knife. Her first comment: “The Austrian guy (@KAMON Knives) gave me candy. Am I getting Swedish candy?”





Jville said:


> Just buy some different candies and every time you get a new knife just throw a couple of “signature” candies in the box.



I'd be happy to throw some Swedish candy in an envelope to anyone who needs it to convince their spouse of a new purchase...  

On a more serious note: 

Have anyone here tried a honyaki from Fredrik? I'm thinking of something like the sold one at Modern Cooking website. How does it cut? How does it feel on stones? 

The reason for asking is that I've put myself on the list for a custom from Fredrik along those lines, but the ones shown by Modern Cooking above looks really really appealling too.


----------



## Jville

Anyone got anymore insight to the steel on these, sharpening, edge retention etc.?


----------



## moderncooking

timebard said:


> I believe there had been rumors of a passaround of one of the second edition knives so those who bought the first could see how the hive mind's input got implemented... any chance we might be lucky enough to see that become reality?



These are actually the batch two first edition knives at the moment. I will make sure that a second edition PA is organized for sure though.
That knife will ship in early February


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> Just showed this pic to my wife and told her this was my next knife. Her first comment: “The Austrian guy (@KAMON Knives) gave me candy. Am I getting Swedish candy?”


 


I do love the candy Ben ships with his knives. It’s a nice touch


----------



## Jville

@moderncooking , have these shipped out yet? I haven’t received any type of notification.


----------



## Delat

Jville said:


> @moderncooking , have these shipped out yet? I haven’t received any type of notification.



Mine shipped last Friday.


----------



## esoo

I got notice on Friday and it started moving Monday.


----------



## Jville

Delat said:


> Mine shipped last Friday.





esoo said:


> I got notice on Friday and it started moving Monday.


I just double checked my email and I don’t see any email.


----------



## jonnachang

I received my 240 mm gyuto in 26c3 coreless damascus from Fredrik last week. Sooo Awesome!


----------



## moderncooking

Jville said:


> @moderncooking , have these shipped out yet? I haven’t received any type of notification.



Hit you up with a DM


----------



## esoo

esoo said:


> I got notice on Friday and it started moving Monday.



I guess I shouldn't have said anything - started moving meant moving from one UPS depot to another. It's been sitting in the same spot according to tracking since Monday night.


----------



## Delat

esoo said:


> I guess I shouldn't have said anything - started moving meant moving from one UPS depot to another. It's been sitting in the same spot according to tracking since Monday night.



Yup, mine was supposed to be delivered yesterday but status switched to “Houston we have a problem and will update the delivery date at some unspecified point in the future meanwhile we’re going to crush your soul by showing your knife still sitting in Germany. Have a nice day”. 

I may have embellished that last sentence. UPS isn’t really that polite.


----------



## Delat

Anybody in the US get theirs from the 2nd batch yet? After four days UPS is still showing unknown delivery date due to “transit delays” and my package last seen in Germany.


----------



## Jville

Yeah mine hasn’t shown any movement still stuck in Germany. I thought I was the only one. Mine never showed any type of expected delivery or any type of update since two Fridays ago.


----------



## Midsummer

Delat said:


> Anybody in the US get theirs from the 2nd batch yet? After four days UPS is still showing unknown delivery date due to “transit delays” and my package last seen in Germany.



You are not alone...




Jville said:


> Yeah mine hasn’t shown any movement still stuck in Germany. I thought I was the only one. Mine never showed any type of expected delivery or any type of update since two Fridays ago.



Also have the "transit delays".... I plan to sit tight.


----------



## moderncooking

Hey everyone, 

Sorry that there seems to be some issues at UPS at the moment. It always seems that when you really want something, like the delivery of 12 knives across the globe, to run smoothly it just doesn't.

We are constantly looking to improve our relations with logistic partners, we have had terrible experiences with almost all the providers, but at the moment we are negotiating with FedEX, DHL and UPS for better services.

@KAMON Knives told me some nightmare stories about UPS losing several of his knives and providing zero customer service. Ben now uses FedEx and seems to be pretty happy with them.

Fredrik Spåre apparently lost a large insured shipment with FedEx and never managed to get any money from the FedEx Insurance. He now ships with DHL.

We have never lost a knife, but we did have a very late delivery with DHL, it took close to 3 months!!! We currently use UPS and they have not lost anything, we have had some damaged items, but they paid the insurance. The worst thing with UPS is the occasional delay like this and they usually still manage to deliver within a couple of weeks. At least this is our experience.

My take away from this is that all of the logistics companies could improve their services. At Modern Cooking we are constantly trying to improve this area of our business. We aim to provide the best service we can and so it is always an annoying element as it is mostly out of our control, yet still reflects on us as a business.

To those who have not received their MCX knives yet I am sure they will get moving soon and I apologise for the frustration. Either way I am monitoring the situation and if anyone needs to contact me on this topic, or any other for that matter, I am standing by.

Best regards,
Peter


----------



## Sdo

Mine is already in Ireland and delivery expected for today in the end of the day. However, now it shows a " Reschedule Delivery requested" on the UPS tracker. I am afraid it won't get here today as previously indicated.

I agree with Peter - They are all the same. Sometimes it goes just fine. Other times it goes just as usual ( delays, lack of info, etc. ). Hopefully we'll all have our knives shortly.

Cheers.


----------



## Delat

Not your fault @moderncooking , we’ve all experienced shipping frustrations and know it’s not the vendor’s fault.

I was more curious if I was a one-off or the whole batch got held up in Germany by customs check or crashed truck or something. This is actually the first time for me with UPS that it’s had this weird indeterminate status for so long after initially providing a delivery date.


----------



## esoo

Mine had been stuck in Germany as well since Wednesday. Maybe some issue with capacity to North America


----------



## timebard

IIRC I saw similar hold-up at a 'customs processing' step or similar for about a week when mine from the first batch went out, then lo and behold it showed up in New Jersey and then on my front door a day or two later. Seemed like it was more about packages not getting scanned/updated in the system at intermediate stops than actually being stuck somewhere.


----------



## Sdo

Received my knife 1 hour ago and could not resist to slice a couple of red onions for pickling. 

First impressions - Light at 183 gr but feels more substantial in hand. Cut the onions like butter and much better than it looked on the paper test. Slightly forward balanced and a true joy to use.
- F&F is excellent and the looks are great. 

Will post a couple of pictures later. Patina already developing!

A lot of knife for the price. 

Very happy with this one. More from Fredrik are on their way 

Cheers!


----------



## Sdo

A few photos after some work. It cuts and develops a wonderful patina.

Very happy with this one. Hope you are all enjoying yours soon.


----------



## moderncooking

Sdo said:


> A few photos after some work. It cuts and develops a wonderful patina.
> 
> Very happy with this one. Hope you are all enjoying yours soon.



Easily one of my favourite steels in terms of patina and it takes a very sharp edge. Glad you are happy @Sdo


----------



## Sdo

moderncooking said:


> Easily one of my favourite steels in terms of patina and it takes a very sharp edge. Glad you are happy @Sdo


Thanks Peter. Keep up these projects. Great work!

Cheers!


----------



## Jville

Has anyone in the US gotten any shipment updates? Mine still hasn’t updated.


----------



## esoo

Mine to Canada is saying the same thing. The wording did change it went from " We are experiencing transit delays. We will deliver your package as soon as possible" to "On the way" for the last two days.


----------



## Delat

Hmmm, might possibly have departed Germany? But I sorta vaguely remember that’s what it said every day before switching to the transit delay message? Will check again tomorrow.


----------



## esoo

The departed from facility message is new - and that is what mine now says as well. The UPS page for tracking removed the delay note that was on it earlier.


----------



## Jville

esoo said:


> The departed from facility message is new - and that is what mine now says as well. The UPS page for tracking removed the delay note that was on it earlier.


Mine says in its way too, so I guess that is progress. Still no expected delivery date. Anyone else got one of the new ones and have any impressions?


----------



## Midsummer

"On the way" with the "delay sign" still present.


----------



## Delat

Tracking shows mine is now in Kentucky!


----------



## esoo

Delat said:


> Tracking shows mine is now in Kentucky!



Apparently they way to Canada is via Kentucky as well...


----------



## Midsummer

E-mail recieved yesterday


----------



## Jville

Maybe today is the day. Mine says loaded on delivery vehicle and expected delivery today.


----------



## esoo

Mine's out for delivery, so today seems like the day.


----------



## Jville

Ups has delivered. On first impressions Frederick and Modern Cooking seem


to have also. Interesting, finish at the top. It’s almost like gratons but at the top. Curious how it will do on food release. I’m assuming the other ones were like that also. The finger notch and neck area seem well done, very comfortable. Blade is slightly forward of my pinch grip balanced. Haven’t cut with it, but seems quite nice.


----------



## timebard

Jville said:


> Ups has delivered. On first impressions Frederick and Modern Cooking seemView attachment 164567
> to have also. Interesting, finish at the top. It’s almost like gratons but at the top. Curious how it will do on food release. I’m assuming the other ones were like that also. The finger notch and neck area seem well done, very comfortable. Blade is slightly forward of my pinch grip balanced. Haven’t cut with it, but seems quite nice.



The first batch did not have the granton-ish hammering up top. Curious to hear if it helps with release.


----------



## Jville

timebard said:


> The first batch did not have the granton-ish hammering up top. Curious to hear if it helps with release.


Oh, ok, I assumed I just missed that aspect. It can be a little tricky to tell texture from pics. At first, for a moment I wondered if with the spine coming in and out due to the “gratons” that it might have a little discomfort, but it feels very comfortable.


----------



## esoo

Light in my house is sucking today for photographs.






Initial impression is that fit and finish is very nice. A touch forward balanced for what I like, but I'll have to give it a test drive and see how it does.


----------



## Delat

Mine finally arrived as well. Looks like I dodged a bullet as one corner of the box was squashed and the paperwork was wet - how that happened when it was inside a plastic pouch is a mystery. Thank goodness the knife was shrink wrapped.

I agree the balance is a bit more forward than typical, but nothing off-putting. F&F looks really good at first glance. The edge is a bit inconsistent, so I’ll strop before using. The tsuchime is definitely unusual but I like the uniqueness; in fact the whole knife has a lovely Swedish aesthetic going on. The pointy tip reminds me of a Kamon and should be wicked on shallots and onions. 

Looking forward to trying it out this weekend!


----------



## moderncooking

Hey folks, 

Happy to see these are finally arriving and thanks for the initial feedback. I am glad to hear that the vacuum bags have saved at least one disaster.

About the balance point, noted and thank you for that info. I am guessing our adjustments to the choil spacing may have resulted in this.

Will feature a slightly thicker and more aggressively tapered spine. I suspect that this will resolve this.

Looking forward to hearing more as you guys get to play with them.

Also, interested in how you guys are finding the 26c3 steel?

Personally, I gave mine a sharpen and a polish recently and the patina is developing beautifully. It's easy to sharpen and takes an amazingly sharp edge. Next to some amazing German tool steels and a selection of awesome Japanese stuff the 26c3 is quickly becoming one of my favourites.


----------



## esoo

For my 225, the balance point is just in front of the makers mark. My pinch grip is at the back/just behind the mark, which is where I like the balance, but I'll be the first to admit this is just a preference.

My knife came sharp enough that I'm not going to sharpen it until I feel it needs it, so no comments on that so far.

Last night I only needed to mince some garlic and parsley - the profile was a winner for the two handed rock chop.

Just because, another knife shot. I do love how much hamon is on this knife:


----------



## Barmoley

Where is the balance? The neck/choil area looks very good now and balance sounds good being in front of pinch somewhat. Or is it far forward from the pinch?


----------



## Barmoley

esoo said:


> For my 225, the balance point is just in front of the makers mark. My pinch grip is at the back/just behind the mark, which is where I like the balance, but I'll be the first to admit this is just a preference.
> 
> My knife came sharp enough that I'm not going to sharpen it until I feel it needs it, so no comments on that so far.
> 
> Last night I only needed to mince some garlic and parsley - the profile was a winner for the two handed rock chop.
> 
> Just because, another knife shot. I do love how much hamon is on this knife:
> View attachment 164719


Sounds like perfect balance to me.


----------



## Delat

Rainman890 said:


> Man, I really am sorry I missed out on this drop. I have two customs from him:
> 
> 180 bunka in 2092 Steel. I asked for a more workhorse grind, and I got it. I love this thing. It's a bit taller than the other bunka I have (Yoshimi Kato AS), but this thing cuts so nice. Out of the box edge was a bit odd, but I touched it up on a Roma 3k, and it just flew through whatever I put on my cutting board. The 2092 steel is crazy reactive, but I have a nice patina now. I'm still new at this game, but cutting with it just makes me happy, so I guess that's a good thing.
> 
> Cleaver (180?) In 1.2419. It's my first cleaver, and I love it too. It's a Chinese style cleaver, so it's thin. I used it to make cole slaw, and it flew through the cabbage. I really like cleavers now...
> 
> Overall, I am super happy with them, and am thinking of ordering another one from him because of all the excitement. But I really want to try some other western makers. The upside of Spåre is that his books are still open, and you can actually get knives from him. It seems impossible everywhere else...



@Rainman890 would you mind sharing pics and specs of your bunka? I’m on Spare’s list for a custom bunka and curious what you got.


----------



## Delat

I won’t get a chance to use this guy until the weekend, but I took a good look at it during the light of day. Have to say that f&f is impressive, but especially so at this price point.

Very snug fit from the blade through the brass ferrule. Love the extra detail of the hammered finish on the forward portion of the ferrule. Nobody but an excessively uptight knife lover would ever notice but I am and I do and I love it. Everything in the handle is absolutely flush, which is a good trick given relative humidity differences between Sweden and Phoenix. Maybe the bog oak is more stable, but regardless ridges on the handle are always a pet peeve of mine and in this case the fit is impressive.






Look at that hamon, the ku, the tsuchime, the beautiful curved and rounded choil…. ‘nuff said.







Much flush. Many impressive. 






I wouldn’t object to more aggressive distal taper, but since I haven’t even used it yet that’s more of an aesthetic and academic observation at this point. The tip does look very thin.





Your browser is not able to display this video.


----------



## moderncooking

@Delat that hammered finish on the bolster is a Fredrik Spåre trade mark. I am a big fan of that little detail also. 

Really glad that you are happy with it. Thanks for the initial review

Regarding the distal taper, aggressive distal taper is a planed feature on the next knife, which Fredrik is gearing up to start forging soon.


----------



## Rainman890

Delat said:


> @Rainman890 would you mind sharing pics and specs of your bunka? I’m on Spare’s list for a custom bunka and curious what you got.




Hi there, 

I love the bunka from him - it's my go-to knife and probably my favorite to cut with.... I'm working right now, so I only have old pictures (2092 steel takes a patina fast, so cut lots of meat first), but it looks the same with a bit more blue..  

Here are specs:
185mm length, 97mm height, 2mm spine (although I don't have calipers or any real measuring tool for that) 

and here are some pictures:


----------



## blokey

Rainman890 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I love the bunka from him - it's my go-to knife and probably my favorite to cut with.... I'm working right now, so I only have old pictures (2092 steel takes a patina fast, so cut lots of meat first), but it looks the same with a bit more blue..
> 
> Here are specs:
> 185mm length, 97mm height, 2mm spine (although I don't have calipers or any real measuring tool for that)
> 
> and here are some pictures:View attachment 164982
> View attachment 164983
> View attachment 164984


That's beautiful, I also ordered a small cleaver from him, hopefully can get it in this year. Could you also take a choil shot of the cleaver from the front, please?
Thank you!


----------



## Rainman890

blokey said:


> That's beautiful, I also ordered a small cleaver from him, hopefully can get it in this year. Could you also take a choil shot of the cleaver from the front, please?
> Thank you!



Best I can do in a coffee break. I love the cleaver as well. Never had much experience with them, but it cuts really easily. I like the weight and thinness behind the edge...


----------



## Bear

I won't be getting mine for awhile, I'm just curious how the steel is doing, anyone put it on the stones yet?


----------



## blokey

Rainman890 said:


> Best I can do in a coffee break. I love the cleaver as well. Never had much experience with them, but it cuts really easily. I like the weight and thinness behind the edge...


Thank you!


----------



## DF18

Delat said:


> @Rainman890 would you mind sharing pics and specs of your bunka? I’m on Spare’s list for a custom bunka and curious what you got.


Not who you were asking, but I have a bunka from him that I love:


----------



## Delat

Rainman890 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I love the bunka from him - it's my go-to knife and probably my favorite to cut with.... I'm working right now, so I only have old pictures (2092 steel takes a patina fast, so cut lots of meat first), but it looks the same with a bit more blue..
> 
> Here are specs:
> 185mm length, 97mm height, 2mm spine (although I don't have calipers or any real measuring tool for that)
> 
> and here are some pictures:View attachment 164982
> View attachment 164983
> View attachment 164984



Those handles


----------



## Delat

DF18 said:


> Not who you were asking, but I have a bunka from him that I love:




I like it! What steel is it?


----------



## marc4pt0

Patiently waiting on ups. Tracking seems to be stalled out in Germany for the past couple weeks with mine. Fingers crossed..


----------



## Jville

Rainman890 said:


> Best I can do in a coffee break. I love the cleaver as well. Never had much experience with them, but it cuts really easily. I like the weight and thinness behind the edge...


What’s the specs on the cleaver?


----------



## pavhav

marc4pt0 said:


> Patiently waiting on ups. Tracking seems to be stalled out in Germany for the past couple weeks with mine. Fingers crossed..


You must've angered the shipping gods somehow, I got mine (V1,B2) delivered in Hawaii on Monday.
I probably angered them as well though - this is what my box looked like:


----------



## tostadas

pavhav said:


> You must've angered the shipping gods somehow, I got mine (V1,B2) delivered in Hawaii on Monday.
> I probably angered them as well though - this is what my box looked like:


The box from my order from Modern Cooking previously was also pretty poor. Luckily no damage on the knife itself though.


----------



## pavhav

tostadas said:


> The box from my order from Modern Cooking previously was also pretty poor. Luckily no damage on the knife itself though.


Yeah, I'm not sure if they're trying to cut down on weight, but some additional stiffening/padding elements may have helped. The vacuum sealed bag did manage to prevent water damage though; the box was wet, yet carefully placed into a plastic bag .
The blade had a mild, (2-3mm), bend to it, but nothing that couldn't be fixed with some gentle pressure - otherwise my initial impressions are aligned with everyone else's.


----------



## DF18

Delat said:


> I like it! What steel is it?


It’s his signature damascus, unfortunately I don’t remember what’s in it.


----------



## moderncooking

pavhav said:


> Yeah, I'm not sure if they're trying to cut down on weight, but some additional stiffening/padding elements may have helped. The vacuum sealed bag did manage to prevent water damage though; the box was wet, yet carefully placed into a plastic bag .
> The blade had a mild, (2-3mm), bend to it, but nothing that couldn't be fixed with some gentle pressure - otherwise my initial impressions are aligned with everyone else's.



Thats very disappoint. Sorry to hear that you had this experience and that your blade was damaged in transit. I will certainly look into more heavy duty packaging.


----------



## daniel_il

I was unboxing mine 250 an hour ago. First impressions, its a beautiful blade, well made and handle is very comparable. Sharpness is decent but i can fix that. unfortunately tip came slightly bent, probably happened during shipping, I would say it should came with a better blade protection.


----------



## Delat

Awwww damn that sucks!

Agree, some additional protection inside the outer box would be a good idea. I think this whole batch had a rough go in shipping - I seriously suspect the truck crashed in a storm or something since more than one box (mine included) was squashed and wet and shipping was delayed.


----------



## tostadas

It seems like modern cooking needs to step up their game in the shipping department which is seriously lacking. Here was my box from the original batch back in November. I took some photos because I expected to have to file a claim. The box was not designed for shipping and there were maybe 2 pieces of crumpled up paper for padding. Luckily the blade was not damaged.


----------



## daniel_il

When i ship a knife it’s always constructed from a box inside a box, adding cushioning inside for zero movement. Also can make some kind of saya made out from cardboard. Never saving on packing ..

Kind of disappointing for me cause this situation could have been prevented quite easily.


----------



## moderncooking

Hey guys,

message received loud and clear on the packaging 

Its disappointing from our side, but I am sure many of you are also feeling a little sad after waiting for you knives to arrive, with the delays in shipping and now some damaged blades.

We haven't had this experience before with our packaging, and we pride ourselves on this element of our service. 

We actually worked with @kamonknives to develop the vacuum bag - knife sheaf combination as a proactive step in protecting carbon knives during transit.

While I believe we shouldn't have to take on extra expenses to protect our products from poor logistics services we are actively looking into more premium and robust packaging options and should have a new solution within a few weeks.

Apologies to anyone who received a damaged knife and please feel free to reach out if you need to discuss issues with your knives. You all deserve to receive what you paid for in perfect condition and to have that exciting unboxing moment. 

Best regards,
Peter


----------



## Jason183

The Kamon knife packaging have some kind of wrapping material outside of the vacuum bag, the vacuum seal only protects the knife from rusting IMO, The rolling material outside of the knife it’s actually protecting it from any kind of bending. The Kamon knife packaging is probably the most solid way I’ve experienced.
There’s a Kamon unbox video from @Delat


----------



## M1k3

Passaround: Kippington Chevron Hook Grind


It goes to the old graveyard of all old passarounds. Like the elephants graveyard! I must find this mythical place of knives!




www.kitchenknifeforums.com


----------



## esoo

So today's episodes with the MCX Spåre:

I tried to etch it, which came out with a finish I didn't like. Then just did used some stone powder to polish the blade (and removed some for the forge scale)

Doing that dulled the edge so I took the knife through SG500-Naniwa Diamond 3K followed by 1u diamond on leather. Really nice and sharp. While prepping dinner I noticed a few times how wicked sharp the tip was. 

I left raw chicken on the knife covering both sides during dinner prep. Got some wicked blues on it that unfortunately I can't manage to photograph at the moment. 
.


----------



## Delat

esoo said:


> So today's episodes with the MCX Spåre:
> 
> I tried to etch it, which came out with a finish I didn't like. Then just did used some stone powder to polish the blade (and removed some for the forge scale)
> 
> Doing that dulled the edge so I took the knife through SG500-Naniwa Diamond 3K followed by 1u diamond on leather. Really nice and sharp. While prepping dinner I noticed a few times how wicked sharp the tip was.
> 
> I left raw chicken on the knife covering both sides during dinner prep. Got some wicked blues on it that unfortunately I can't manage to photograph at the moment.
> .



What did you use for etching? I was thinking about doing a coffee soak on mine.


----------



## blokey

Seems like the new batch of MCX is coming next week, can't wait


----------



## esoo

Delat said:


> What did you use for etching? I was thinking about doing a coffee soak on mine.



I tried to hack together an acid solution using Bar Keepers friend in hot water. BKF is pretty acidic as I've found out in the past. It did an ok job of an etch but I've done better before using hot vinegar. However today I was short on vinegar.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> What did you use for etching? I was thinking about doing a coffee soak on mine.









I posted this on a thread from @marc4pt0 but I just thought I would re-post this here for reference. This is hot OJ for those that want an easy, at home option, but Marc also got a great result using a ferric/water solution. The key thing is that you don't want it to be too harsh, hence the OJ could be the best option as you would need to get the ferric dilution correct to get the desired result.

Also make sure to remove any oil from the blade before you etch and if you have used your knife a bit make sure to give the knife a good polish before also.


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> View attachment 167775
> 
> 
> I posted this on a thread from @marc4pt0 but I just thought I would re-post this here for reference. This is hot OJ for those that want an easy, at home option, but Marc also got a great result using a ferric/water solution. The key thing is that you don't want it to be too harsh, hence the OJ could be the best option as you would need to get the ferric dilution correct to get the desired result.
> 
> Also make sure to remove any oil from the blade before you etch and if you have used your knife a bit make sure to give the knife a good polish before also.


Any date on the new batch? Looking forward to the changes.


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Any date on the new batch? Looking forward to the changes.



This week if all goes to plan. Fredrik is shipping me the knives today and I hope to have them released before the end of the week. This time round I will send a newsletter with a release date and time. That way everyone will have a chance to get one of the knives.


----------



## e30Birdy

Looks like Fredrik shared the new design.


----------



## Bensonhai

e30Birdy said:


> Looks like Fredrik shared the new design.
> View attachment 167778


Looks great!


----------



## tylerleach

moderncooking said:


> Hey folks,
> 
> Happy to see these are finally arriving and thanks for the initial feedback. I am glad to hear that the vacuum bags have saved at least one disaster.
> 
> About the balance point, noted and thank you for that info. I am guessing our adjustments to the choil spacing may have resulted in this.
> 
> Will feature a slightly thicker and more aggressively tapered spine. I suspect that this will resolve this.
> 
> Looking forward to hearing more as you guys get to play with them.
> 
> Also, interested in how you guys are finding the 26c3 steel?
> 
> Personally, I gave mine a sharpen and a polish recently and the patina is developing beautifully. It's easy to sharpen and takes an amazingly sharp edge. Next to some amazing German tool steels and a selection of awesome Japanese stuff the 26c3 is quickly becoming one of my favourites.


Really want to pick one up on the next drop! Do we have a date? I am told it was this week? Sorry I just found this thread…


----------



## blokey

tylerleach said:


> Really want to pick one up on the next drop! Do we have a date? I am told it was this week? Sorry I just found this thread…


It was delayed, DHL is running late, probably next week.


----------



## tylerleach

blokey said:


> It was delayed, DHL is running late, probably next week.


Next week as in this following week? Or the week after that? Sorry I just want to be prepared!


----------



## blokey

tylerleach said:


> Next week as in this following week? Or the week after that? Sorry I just want to be prepared!


This following week, modern cooking on instagram post a lot of updates.


----------



## moderncooking

MCX 2nd edition - 8pm CET tomorrow night 08/03/2022 

Hope you guys like it


----------



## Sdo

moderncooking said:


> MCX 2nd edition - 8pm CET tomorrow night 08/03/2022
> 
> Hope you guys like it


Although K-tip is not my favorite this one looks beautiful. Handle and hamon look absolutely amazing.

Fantastic job!


----------



## blokey

Almost there... Seems like it is lighter and the hardness is tuned down a little bit.








MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking


The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.




moderncooking.com


----------



## timebard

blokey said:


> Almost there... Seems like it is lighter and the hardness is tuned down a little bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com



Dialing down the hardness is probably a good idea, the original batch's steel feels pretty at the limit. A couple other changes as well, if the stats shown are accurate: about 3-4mm taller at the heel, less taper to the tip (1.7 vs 1mm 2cm out), and perhaps a little more curve in the profile.


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Almost there... Seems like it is lighter and the hardness is tuned down a little bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com



@blokey UPDATE the HRC is 66 actually. Its the same as last time


----------



## hukdizzle

@moderncooking will the latest MCX 2nd edition be shipping with your improved shipping box/packaging?


----------



## Perzua

@moderncooking 









MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking


The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.




moderncooking.com





Is this knife available ?


----------



## xsmx13

Perzua said:


> @moderncooking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is this knife available ?



About to be


----------



## moderncooking

hukdizzle said:


> @moderncooking will the latest MCX 2nd edition be shipping with your improved shipping box/packaging?



Certainly will be improving the packaging this round.


----------



## moderncooking

Perzua said:


> @moderncooking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MCX | K-Tip Gyuto 230mm 26c3 Limited Release by - 2nd Edition | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> The second edition of our exclusive collaboration series, once again we teamed up with Fredrik Spåre to create this limited release Honyaki K-tip Gyuto.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is this knife available ?




Just went live!


----------



## xsmx13

Gimme!


----------



## Luxusborg

Snatched a 230mm! Thank you Peter, the newsletter and heads-up was of great help. Looking forward to trying it out.


----------



## blokey

30 minutes late and it’s all gone…


----------



## Delat

blokey said:


> 30 minutes late and it’s all gone…



It would’ve been all gone if you were 5 mins late.

I checked out of curiosity at 12:04 (went live noon my time) and there were only two 250’s left. Two minutes later those were gone too.


----------



## tylerleach

I thought it was 8pm central time in the US. Super bummed 
Does anyone know if they are planning to do another round of gyutos? Dyin for a 250! But I would not turn my nose up to a 230…


----------



## moderncooking

@Luxusborg and everyone else who managed to snatch one of the 2nd edition blades, thank you very much for your on going support. Unbelievable how fast this batch sold, Fredrik and I are very humbled and proud of the series. 

Next MCX Fredrik Spåre drop will be in April, it won't be a Gyuto, but we will certainly follow that drop with more Gyutos in May. 

Also, while you bunka down and wait for that drop you may see an MCX Martin Huber Gyuto. For those that don't know Martins work, he is the unofficial San Mai king of Europe (a title I have given him). Check this out for reference


----------



## Jovidah

Why so tall? Will we ever see a return of a 50mm-ish KS profile?


----------



## Bear

Jovidah said:


> Why so tall? Will we ever see a return of a 50mm-ish KS profile?


There’s plenty of 50mm profiles around, not enough taller ones


----------



## moderncooking

Jovidah said:


> Why so tall? Will we ever see a return of a 50mm-ish KS profile?



Have to agree with @Bear on this. 

We have the Masamoto KS 240mm Gyuto. It's there, It's great value and in a great steel.

We could naturally copy it and dress it up with our MCX Honyaki, forged finish, but honestly I wouldn't feel like I am contributing something unique there. 

The MCX Gyuto already borrows features from the KS, but in addition adds a more aggressive distal taper and the taller blade height. I think this makes MCX a pretty unique knife in its own right and l find the taller blade height means that it is possible to deliver a far more high performance geometry as we can thin the blade substantially more towards the edge, while maintaining the thicker more ridged spine above the heel. The height also adds more knuckle clearance and really overall it doesn't subtract from the ergonomics of the knife imho.

@Jovidah out of interest is it just a personally preference for you or do you think there is a practical benefit to the lower profile?

One option we could consider is a shorter blade (200mm) with a 50+/- blade height. This would allow us to maintain our geometry. I am not sure if this would be of interest?


----------



## Jovidah

I think in general blade size / height / profile is _very much _personal preference. For me going above 50mm I find the experience less pleasing. Others might say the extreme opposite. But personally I prefer the blades with less blade height in my lineup. After a while you get used to anything though.
It's a bit hard for me to describe _why_ I prefer 50mm-ish, I just know I do.
Never had any issues with knuckle clearance... but I'm not even bothered by a 210 petty in that regard. 
For me personally shorter wouldn't be my jam, but ask 10 people and you'll probably have 10 different opinions. 

_Personally _I would actually welcome a 'pimped up KS'. I have a KS and it's my favorite knife (due to combination of profile + monosteel), but it looks a bit on the dull side and it could do with a fancier steel (edge retention is not breathtaking). Make it out of 1.2519 mono... give it a bit more ass + taper... mmmmm. 
But I understand it's hard to cater to everyone since a lot of people have completely opposing preferences.


----------



## moderncooking

Jovidah said:


> I think in general blade size / height / profile is _very much _personal preference. For me going above 50mm I find the experience less pleasing. Others might say the extreme opposite. But personally I prefer the blades with less blade height in my lineup. After a while you get used to anything though.
> It's a bit hard for me to describe _why_ I prefer 50mm-ish, I just know I do.
> Never had any issues with knuckle clearance... but I'm not even bothered by a 210 petty in that regard.
> For me personally shorter wouldn't be my jam, but ask 10 people and you'll probably have 10 different opinions.
> 
> _Personally _I would actually welcome a 'pimped up KS'. I have a KS and it's my favorite knife (due to combination of profile + monosteel), but it looks a bit on the dull side and it could do with a fancier steel (edge retention is not breathtaking). Make it out of 1.2519 mono... give it a bit more ass + taper... mmmmm.
> But I understand it's hard to cater to everyone since a lot of people have completely opposing preferences.




Thanks for sharing your perspective and you are 100% of course. Ill keep that in mind as we move forward with new designs. The current Gyuto has been so popular I can't imagine making such broad changes, but I'll discuss this with Fredrik and perhaps we will come up with something, "MCX Gyuto Low Pro".


----------



## timebard

Very much personal preference indeed. I'm glad I got one of the first batch at 230x53, which is just about my ideal for that length. 56-57mm on the current batch is a little taller than I like, 50mm is fine for a 210 but a little shorter than I'd want in a 230. 

If I had to articulate why I don't love really tall heels: above about 54mm, the cutting edge starts to feel more distant from where I'm pinching the blade face, and therefore like I have less precise control of where it's going. (Obviously someone with bigger hands or a more/less choked up pinch grip would experience that feeling with different heel heights). I don't know if this perception actually makes any difference in the end result, but it feels that way. I do use some tall blades (BB+D at 58mm, CCK at like 90mm) and they're fun but not what I grab by default.


----------



## Delat

200x50mm sounds like a long bunka?

Personally I only appreciate >50mm when I’m double rock chopping, so I specifically reach for a taller blade when I know I need extra fine garlic. Lower blades like Yoshikane, Kurosaki (around 47mm) do feel a little more intimate as @timebard points out - closer to the cutting action with a better sense of control. 

For my 210 and larger gyutos honestly I don’t really much care about the height in general. I recently got a 225x59 that I thought would be way too tall but I quite like it especially for bigger jobs.

When I know I need to do finer cuts or just a quick small prep I reach for a bunka or 180mm gyuto. I’m actually on Frederick’s list for a bunka as I seem to be using that size a lot these days.


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> @Luxusborg and everyone else who managed to snatch one of the 2nd edition blades, thank you very much for your on going support. Unbelievable how fast this batch sold, Fredrik and I are very humbled and proud of the series.
> 
> Next MCX Fredrik Spåre drop will be in April, it won't be a Gyuto, but we will certainly follow that drop with more Gyutos in May.
> 
> Also, while you bunka down and wait for that drop you may see an MCX Martin Huber Gyuto. For those that don't know Martins work, he is the unofficial San Mai king of Europe (a title I have given him). Check this out for reference



I vaguely recall seeing a list of planned MCX collabs somewhere - was Neil Ayling on that list or is that wishful thinking?


----------



## moderncooking

timebard said:


> Very much personal preference indeed. I'm glad I got one of the first batch at 230x53, which is just about my ideal for that length. 56-57mm on the current batch is a little taller than I like, 50mm is fine for a 210 but a little shorter than I'd want in a 230.
> 
> If I had to articulate why I don't love really tall heels: above about 54mm, the cutting edge starts to feel more distant from where I'm pinching the blade face, and therefore like I have less precise control of where it's going. (Obviously someone with bigger hands or a more/less choked up pinch grip would experience that feeling with different heel heights). I don't know if this perception actually makes any difference in the end result, but it feels that way. I do use some tall blades (BB+D at 58mm, CCK at like 90mm) and they're fun but not what I grab by default.



Thanks @timebard, very helpful! Its certainly that "grab by default" thing we are striving for. I have to say, with a sense of satisfaction, that I have been reaching for my MCX 230mm all the time. I don't have a million knives, but I can't think of a better way to judge a good one.

Having a sense of the blade edge is certainly something that you loose as the blade gets taller and longer. For me, I am with you 230x53-54 is just about perfect. I do have a 250 and even a 270 and while I do enjoy using them a lot I tend towards the 230/240 length a little more naturally. Short of making MCX a custom fit product its not easy to please everyone, as perviously mentioned, but we will do our best to keep making these for the masses and hopefully get something for everyone along the way.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> I vaguely recall seeing a list of planned MCX collabs somewhere - was Neil Ayling on that list or is that wishful thinking?



Neil was keen to do an MCX, but he currently does not have a power hammer and can't manage the numbers. We are however working on some more premium, integral exclusives. They should land on the site over the next month or so. Expect a unique handle design coupled with his classic profile with "S" grind


----------



## moderncooking

I believe Martin Huber will be the next MCX release. Likely a San Mai Gyuto, literally working on profile at the moment


----------



## tylerleach

I would be ALLLL about a “pimped out” KS. I have one and I wish it were taller, had more distal taper (much fatter out of the handle) and would certainly not say no to a different steel. (Actually contemplating selling…if anyone is interested DM me…) I know that several companies have made a copy of the profile but all of them are clad. So a mono steel but a bit taller would be clutch.


----------



## Chicagohawkie

tylerleach said:


> I would be ALLLL about a “pimped out” KS. I have one and I wish it were taller, had more distal taper (much fatter out of the handle) and would certainly not say no to a different steel. (Actually contemplating selling…if anyone is interested DM me…) I know that several companies have made a copy of the profile but all of them are clad. So a mono steel but a bit taller would be clutch.


Sounds like ya need a Kamon 250. Checks all your boxes and literally blows the KS right out the water performance wise.


----------



## tylerleach

Chicagohawkie said:


> Sounds like ya need a Kamon 250. Checks all your boxes and literally blows the KS right out the water performance wise.


Oh trust me I KNOW that I need a Kamon 250  
Top of my list sir…
I do have a Kamon 210 Santoku and it’s easily one of my top knives.


----------



## Jeff

esoo said:


> I tried to hack together an acid solution using Bar Keepers friend in hot water. BKF is pretty acidic as I've found out in the past. It did an ok job of an etch but I've done better before using hot vinegar. However today I was short on vinegar.




I use BKF o. my copper. The oxalic acid in it combined with the mild abrasive cleans it well without scratching the soft copper.

How do you do a hot vinegar or coffee etch?

Am I correct in understanding they can be undone with no harm to the knife?


----------



## Delat

Jeff said:


> I use BKF o. my copper. The oxalic acid in it combined with the mild abrasive cleans it well without scratching the soft copper.
> 
> How do you do a hot vinegar or coffee etch?
> 
> Am I correct in understanding they can be undone with no harm to the knife?



For a coffee etch you just mix up instant coffee really strong and soak it up to 24 hours. This instant coffee in particular is recommended blacksmith Neil Kamimura. It should be reversible with flitz or BKF, but I haven’t tried removing it yet.






Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food


Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food



www.amazon.com


----------



## tylerleach

Delat said:


> For a coffee etch you just mix up instant coffee really strong and soak it up to 24 hours. This instant coffee in particular is recommended my blacksmith Neil Kamimura. It should be reversible with flitz or BKF, but I haven’t tried removing it yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food
> 
> 
> Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com


The one thing I will say from first hand experience with the coffee is that it will darken the blade substantially, like very substantially. So just know that going in if you choose to try it. It works super well with Damascus.


----------



## Delat

tylerleach said:


> The one thing I will say from first hand experience with the coffee is that it will darken the blade substantially, like very substantially. So just know that going in if you choose to try it. It works super well with Damascus.



The level of darkness depends on the steel. In this photo you can see the Kamon in 1.2519 turned battleship grey (dunked in Folgers, not Nescafé), while the Steele just below in 15n20 and 80crv2 turned jet black (dunked by Steele, not sure what coffee he used).

I was debating about dunking the Spare but ended up selling it to cover the bunka he’s making for me.

Interestingly that patina on the Kamon was removed with flitz before the dunk, but the etching brought it back.


----------



## tylerleach

Gaaaaaad I want that Spare! And the Kamon 250! Some damn good looking knives sir. Those 2 are top of my list rn.


----------



## blokey

Delat said:


> The level of darkness depends on the steel. In this photo you can see the Kamon in 1.2519 turned battleship grey (dunked in Folgers, not Nescafé), while the Steele just below in 15n20 and 80crv2 turned jet black (dunked by Steele, not sure what coffee he used).
> 
> I was debating about dunking the Spare but ended up selling it to cover the bunka he’s making for me.
> 
> Interestingly that patina on the Kamon was removed with flitz before the dunk, but the etching brought it back.
> 
> View attachment 169283


I am so jealous right now...


----------



## tylerleach

Marc4pt0 did an awesome etch with Ferric chloride on the Spare and that banding reeeally came out.


----------



## Hockey3081

tylerleach said:


> Marc4pt0 did an awesome etch with Ferric chloride on the Spare and that banding reeeally came out.



Ferric is pretty impractical for most people to tool around with at home. Even the great @KAMON Knives recommends instant coffee to help bring out the banding.


----------



## Jovidah

I've used instant coffee in the past for forcing a patina and it worked quite well - if you're into a plain dark patina. Wasn't a damascus though so no clue what it does there.


----------



## esoo

Delat said:


> For a coffee etch you just mix up instant coffee really strong and soak it up to 24 hours. This instant coffee in particular is recommended blacksmith Neil Kamimura. It should be reversible with flitz or BKF, but I haven’t tried removing it yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food
> 
> 
> Amazon.com : Nescafe Clasico, 10.5 Ounce Jar : Grocery & Gourmet Food
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com



Don't use BKF to try and remove a patina, unless you have baking soda readily available to neutralize it. Learned this the hard way.


----------



## moderncooking

Ive used coffee and hot orange juice several times. The one thing to keep in mind, and I suspect this is why cheaper coffee or instant coffee is recommended, is that any oils will reduce or cause a blotchy result. Coffee naturally has oil in it and so I believe that is why instant coffee or cheaper coffee tends to get a better results as it likely has less oils. 

For me the result with the hot OJ was pretty decent and it certainly does not have any substantial oils.


----------



## M1k3

A tiny drop of soap goes a long way to reducing surface tension and creating an emulsion.


----------



## tylerleach

esoo said:


> Don't use BKF to try and remove a patina, unless you have baking soda readily available to neutralize it. Learned this the hard way.


What do you like to use to remove patina? I have used just baking soda/water paste.


----------



## esoo

tylerleach said:


> What do you like to use to remove patina? I have used just baking soda/water paste.



I've used a Flitz like polish (Autosol) and then kasumi powder or powder I've ground myself off a cheap King stone with a worn out micromesh pad


----------



## tylerleach

Even with a migaki finish? Kasumi powder? 
ps. King stones may be cheap but dammit I love my King 1000… first stone I ever bought and it is still kickin.


----------



## esoo

tylerleach said:


> Even with a migaki finish? Kasumi powder?
> ps. King stones may be cheap but dammit I love my King 1000… first stone I ever bought and it is still kickin.



Most knives I've had have been clad, so a kasumi type finish always works.

And by cheap King stone, I'm talking the KD-80 250/1000 combi stone. Grind it off dry with a 140 grit plate. I've used the powder from both the 250 and 1000 sides. Or you could buy it - Tosho Knife Arts Kasumi Powder (3M Sponge Included) (40g).

I basically follow this:


----------



## tylerleach

esoo said:


> Most knives I've had have been clad, so a kasumi type finish always works.
> 
> And by cheap King stone, I'm talking the KD-80 250/1000 combi stone. Grind it off dry with a 140 grit plate. I've used the powder from both the 250 and 1000 sides. Or you could buy it - Tosho Knife Arts Kasumi Powder (3M Sponge Included) (40g).
> 
> I basically follow this:



Ahhh I gotcha. I’ve never tried getting powder off of a stone like that, that’s a great idea. Definitely have some projects to do now… Thank you for the advice!


----------



## moderncooking

Requests where made for a more low profile KS style blade. Well this is what we have come up with. Available from 6pm CET 26/04/2022 tonight. Enjoy!

MCX


----------



## xsmx13

Now that's a great way to start my Taco Tuesday!


----------



## Bensonhai

moderncooking said:


> Requests where made for a more low profile KS style blade. Well this is what we have come up with. Available from 6pm CET 26/04/2022 tonight. Enjoy!
> 
> MCX
> 
> View attachment 176753



Got one! 
Thank you!


----------



## Jeff

Very interesting that there is so much emphasis on blade height in this thread. Yes it certainly is an important “comfort factor.” 

However, IMHO, comfort with a taller blade height has a lot to do with the height of the cutting surface and the height of the person doing the cutting.

I have several Takeda knives which are notoriously tall. I find them uncomfortable for long sessions when using them on a thick board which is on top of a standard counter. But … when I use them on my 20”x 20” butcher block table which I lowered they are sweet!

I suppose a lot has to do with the arm motion, similar to how ones leg is supposed to extend when peddling a bike. (almost full extension but not quite “locked”)

As an experiment, try standing on some type of riser when ising a knife - WOW! You will be amazed at how different the height of the knife feels to you.

Yea, I know that is not a possibility in a kitchen setting but it is an interesting experiment at home. I’m about to get going on a kitchen remodel and we are considering a lowered section of countertop where we can put boards and cut at a lower height.

What I did not see much of in this thread is much discussion about blade geometry, i.e. how much belly there is for rocking vs push cutting: again a very personal issue. But, I bet most of use both rocking and push cutting at different rimes for different things.


----------



## Jeff

Delat said:


> The level of darkness depends on the steel. In this photo you can see the Kamon in 1.2519 turned battleship grey (dunked in Folgers, not Nescafé), while the Steele just below in 15n20 and 80crv2 turned jet black (dunked by Steele, not sure what coffee he used).
> 
> I was debating about dunking the Spare but ended up selling it to cover the bunka he’s making for me.
> 
> Interestingly that patina on the Kamon was removed with flitz before the dunk, but the etching brought it back.
> 
> View attachment 169283


What is that stunning middle knife? …please


----------



## jedy617

Yoinked one


----------



## tylerleach

Jealous of everyone. I knew about them and I dropped the ball! I’ll try to scoop one up from one of y’all…


----------



## Delat

Jeff said:


> What is that stunning middle knife? …please



It's from Britton Steele at Steelworks, Steeleworks66 on instagram. The billet is raindrop cumai from Baker Forge.


----------



## Delat

Jeff said:


> Very interesting that there is so much emphasis on blade height in this thread. Yes it certainly is an important “comfort factor.”
> 
> However, IMHO, comfort with a taller blade height has a lot to do with the height of the cutting surface and the height of the person doing the cutting.
> 
> I have several Takeda knives which are notoriously tall. I find them uncomfortable for long sessions when using them on a thick board which is on top of a standard counter. But … when I use them on my 20”x 20” butcher block table which I lowered they are sweet!
> 
> I suppose a lot has to do with the arm motion, similar to how ones leg is supposed to extend when peddling a bike. (almost full extension but not quite “locked”)
> 
> As an experiment, try standing on some type of riser when ising a knife - WOW! You will be amazed at how different the height of the knife feels to you.
> 
> Yea, I know that is not a possibility in a kitchen setting but it is an interesting experiment at home. I’m about to get going on a kitchen remodel and we are considering a lowered section of countertop where we can put boards and cut at a lower height.
> 
> What I did not see much of in this thread is much discussion about blade geometry, i.e. how much belly there is for rocking vs push cutting: again a very personal issue. But, I bet most of use both rocking and push cutting at different rimes for different things.



Very true. My island counter where I prep is pretty high (custom cabinets), so I tend favor flatter profiles since my arm isn't angled down much to meet the board. I can see how tall folks with standard height counters would prefer a little more belly due to their arm angle.

When I really need to bear down and apply force I either take the task to my perimeter counter which is 2" lower, or to my dining table.


----------



## PeterL

Missed out on this too. Picked the best time to be at work and unable to look at my phone. If it doesn’t jibe with anyone in the UK/EU I’d love to pick one up.


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> Now that's a great way to start my Taco Tuesday!


----------



## moderncooking

PeterL said:


> Missed out on this too. Picked the best time to be at work and unable to look at my phone. If it doesn’t jibe with anyone in the UK/EU I’d love to pick one up.



Next month we are doing a refresh on the classic first edition


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> Next month we are doing a refresh on the classic first edition


Why do you do this to me?!


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> Why do you do this to me?!



I get pleasure from other peoples misery


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> Next month we are doing a refresh on the classic first edition


Love the clean aesthetics of the new drop, the first edition is really nice too. Will there be any changes?


----------



## timebard

moderncooking said:


> Next month we are doing a refresh on the classic first edition



Great to see the first edition coming around for a second go, it's a winner in my book.

Have you and Fredrik considered a non-honyaki batch, maybe 52100 or Damascus?


----------



## esoo

moderncooking said:


> Requests where made for a more low profile KS style blade. Well this is what we have come up with. Available from 6pm CET 26/04/2022 tonight. Enjoy!
> 
> MCX
> 
> View attachment 176753



These are beautiful, but adding taper to the tang would have sent these to an utterly next level.


----------



## xsmx13

blokey said:


> Love the clean aesthetics of the new drop, the first edition is really nice too. Will there be any changes?





moderncooking said:


> I get pleasure from other peoples misery


I had to go to BST to complete my collection with a version 1 batch 2 MCX. So long as you keep incrementally changing something with each batch, this knife addict will keep buying.


----------



## blokey

xsmx13 said:


> We've
> I had to go to BST to complete my collection with a version 1 batch 2 MCX. So long as you keep incrementally changing something with each batch, this knife addict will keep buying.


We’ve?


----------



## xsmx13

blokey said:


> We’ve?


I dunno, between 70 hour work weeks and a 2 1/2 year old, I can't tell my head from my ass most of the time. It's like my work emails... I start the email, something else comes up and once I circle back to the original message I have no idea where I was going.


----------



## blokey

xsmx13 said:


> I dunno, between 70 hour work weeks and a 2 1/2 year old, I can't tell my head from my ass most of the time. It's like my work emails... I start the email, something else comes up and once I circle back to the original message I have no idea where I was going.


Lol no worries.


----------



## Hockey3081

moderncooking said:


> Ive used coffee and hot orange juice several times. The one thing to keep in mind, and I suspect this is why cheaper coffee or instant coffee is recommended, is that any oils will reduce or cause a blotchy result. Coffee naturally has oil in it and so I believe that is why instant coffee or cheaper coffee tends to get a better results as it likely has less oils.
> 
> For me the result with the hot OJ was pretty decent and it certainly does not have any substantial oils.


Got a knife from Adonis Forged (Brazilian Art Deco on his website). He used the OJ method in lieu of the instant coffee and it turned out great.


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Love the clean aesthetics of the new drop, the first edition is really nice too. Will there be any changes?



So, the blade will be exactly the same as 1st edition second batch. The one with the deeper hammer marks in the forged finish. The main changes will be in the handle, which will be a similar profile to the one on this edition.


----------



## moderncooking

timebard said:


> Great to see the first edition coming around for a second go, it's a winner in my book.
> 
> Have you and Fredrik considered a non-honyaki batch, maybe 52100 or Damascus?



We have toyed with the idea and we are looking at doing something in the new Apex Ultra steel later this year. I am not sure if that will be Honyaki or just the forged finish or....???

Any suggestions?


----------



## moderncooking

esoo said:


> These are beautiful, but adding taper to the tang would have sent these to an utterly next level.


 thinner tangs would have been nice, but we would have run into balance issues so


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> I had to go to BST to complete my collection with a version 1 batch 2 MCX. So long as you keep incrementally changing something with each batch, this knife addict will keep buying.



 Its appreciated and we will certainly try to keep it interesting


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> We have toyed with the idea and we are looking at doing something in the new Apex Ultra steel later this year. I am not sure if that will be Honyaki or just the forged finish or....???
> 
> Any suggestions?


ApexUltra would be a instant hit, now I will start to saving up for that…


----------



## moderncooking

Hockey3081 said:


> Got a knife from Adonis Forged (Brazilian Art Deco on his website). He used the OJ method in lieu of the instant coffee and it turned out great.



Yeah, Antoine is a legend and really knows his stuff. Eyes peeled we are getting something from him soon and its going to be something very unique. He tells me he is trying something completely new!


----------



## esoo

moderncooking said:


> thinner tangs would have been nice, but we would have run into balance issues so



Then more taper is the answer.

Every Zwilling Kramer I've held (8" carbon, 10" carbon and 10" stainless) had a tapered tang and balanced perfectly at the pinch. I have heard this is not the case for everyone though.


----------



## moderncooking

esoo said:


> Then more taper is the answer.
> 
> Every Zwilling Kramer I've held (8" carbon, 10" carbon and 10" stainless) had a tapered tang and balanced perfectly at the pinch. I have heard this is not the case for everyone though.
> 
> View attachment 176857



Oooo, I haven't seen one done like that before, but it makes a lot of sense and looks very cool. Is it mainly the visual element that you like or is there some other performance related reason for this?


----------



## esoo

It looks cool. Nothing more or less to my eyes. 





If that balance stays the same between a flat tang and tapered tang, then it's all about the looks, as far as I know. But I think it looks cooler to have the tang thinning out.


----------



## JayS20

moderncooking said:


> Oooo, I haven't seen one done like that before, but it makes a lot of sense and looks very cool. Is it mainly the visual element that you like or is there some other performance related reason for this?


Also it will of course make the blade less heavy. But you might have to play with taper to balance it properly. Also shows handiness of the maker to make it as even as possible.
Jonas Isasmedjan also does it.


----------



## moderncooking

I would only comment that these full tang knives actually pushed us to the limit on our budget and we won't likely do such a large batch or the same price if we do full tang again. The handles just took too much time to produce for a project that has "low cost knives" as a defining factor. We try to squeeze as much value as possible into this and work on very slim margins, but we can't do everything sadly. 

With that said we are planing to do some more premium stuff in the MCX brand with integrals and more full tangs, but those knives will likely be closer to 500-600EUR. I would certainly push for features like this on those pieces.


----------



## timebard

moderncooking said:


> We have toyed with the idea and we are looking at doing something in the new Apex Ultra steel later this year. I am not sure if that will be Honyaki or just the forged finish or....???
> 
> Any suggestions?



Apex Ultra would be awesome. No idea if that can be / makes sense to differentially harden. The main reason I asked is that while Spare's honyaki is gorgeous, spicy white at 65-66hrc isn't the toughest steel and needs a little extra care in use. Something with similar specs and geometry but a tougher steel would be much easier to use as a daily driver IMO... I haven't tried ApexUltra yet but it sounds like it fits the bill perfectly.


----------



## Barmoley

Tapered full tangs look good and can help to balance the blade when the materials used in the handle make the handles heavy. They require more work though, so naturally would increase the cost of the knife. The balance benefits could be achieved other ways, drilling holes into the tang for example. In general, specifically for kitchen knives full tang construction is mostly for looks anyway or for ease of production when we talk about mass produced stamped or similarly produced knives.

In the outdoor knife circles there are arguments for full tang construction, but even there it is not clear if the benefits are real or imagined for most use cases.


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> So, the blade will be exactly the same as 1st edition second batch. The one with the deeper hammer marks in the forged finish. The main changes will be in the handle, which will be a similar profile to the one on this edition.



I would be in for another one if he did this batch just a bit thinner behind the edge (i.e. spine thickness the same). Totally personal preference though. Loved everything else about my MCX v1.1.


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> I would only comment that these full tang knives actually pushed us to the limit on our budget and we won't likely do such a large batch or the same price if we do full tang again. The handles just took too much time to produce for a project that has "low cost knives" as a defining factor. We try to squeeze as much value as possible into this and work on very slim margins, but we can't do everything sadly.
> 
> With that said we are planing to do some more premium stuff in the MCX brand with integrals and more full tangs, but those knives will likely be closer to 500-600EUR. I would certainly push for features like this on those pieces.



Honestly, when I first saw the photos I was expecting the price to be at least 100EUR higher than you listed them at. Those were really an impressive value, no wonder they sold out in <1min.


----------



## jedy617

Very happy to get one at the current prices. I say apex ultra and honyaki. I did see fredrick trying some elmax with a hand satin that would also be amazing. I personally prefer the clean aesthetic of this last batch without the black finish and hammer marks.


----------



## moderncooking

timebard said:


> Apex Ultra would be awesome. No idea if that can be / makes sense to differentially harden. The main reason I asked is that while Spare's honyaki is gorgeous, spicy white at 65-66hrc isn't the toughest steel and needs a little extra care in use. Something with similar specs and geometry but a tougher steel would be much easier to use as a daily driver IMO... I haven't tried ApexUltra yet but it sounds like it fits the bill perfectly.



Not sure yet about the variable hardening on this, but it has been compared to Aogami Super or actually could be a little tougher than Aogami Super. In any case I believe that we will see that batch of knives around August at this stage.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> Honestly, when I first saw the photos I was expecting the price to be at least 100EUR higher than you listed them at. Those were really an impressive value, no wonder they sold out in <1min.


 The irony here is that we wanted to create something that could potentially be sold a little cheaper than the original model. Hahaha, you win some you loose some. Anyway, we still have a plan to do a clean honyaki knife with a basic wa handle at a lower price at some point if we can.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> I would be in for another one if he did this batch just a bit thinner behind the edge (i.e. spine thickness the same). Totally personal preference though. Loved everything else about my MCX v1.1.



I will add this feedback in and see if we can accommodate you on that


----------



## xsmx13

@moderncooking How do you get this from Germany to the US west coast in 3 days?! Can't wait to give this thing a try!


----------



## Jovidah

Yeah so that was really the Spåre I wanted... but of course it was already sold out before I even saw the e-mail.


----------



## blokey

Jovidah said:


> Yeah so that was really the Spåre I wanted... but of course it was already sold out before I even saw the e-mail.


Same, the simple and clean aesthetics and the handle really speak to me, hope they redo this drop sometime in the future.


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> @moderncooking How do you get this from Germany to the US west coast in 3 days?! Can't wait to give this thing a try!



To be honest it is a 3 day service by UPS, but its not always 3 days. It should be with you very soon though


----------



## moderncooking

Jovidah said:


> Yeah so that was really the Spåre I wanted... but of course it was already sold out before I even saw the e-mail.



I can't guarantee a full tang will ever happen again at that price, but we will certainly do a wa handle in the clean honyaki style.


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> To be honest it is a 3 day service by UPS, but its not always 3 days. It should be with you very soon though


I was complementing the speed. It got here in 2 days!


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> I was complementing the speed. It got here in 2 days!



Haha crazy! I guess they are making up for last time. Actually, on my end it shows as "In Transit". That's great!


----------



## jedy617

Mine will be here tomorrow! (Today) lol


----------



## jedy617

It has arrived! Looks nice but I'm going to try some finger stones and maybe some flitz to try and get some more contrast from the hamon!


----------



## jedy617

I have literally a dozen hours left but I'm too excited not to share, this is my first fingerstone project really and I'm getting the hamon to a bright polish! Yes still very rough elsewhere but excited to see how it ends up!!


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> I have literally a dozen hours left but I'm too excited not to share, this is my first fingerstone project really and I'm getting the hamon to a bright polish! Yes still very rough elsewhere but excited to see how it ends up!!
> 
> View attachment 177549



Looks epic! Very cool!


----------



## jedy617

I have ZERO clue what I'm doing. But I kinda like it? Semi mirror? Still lots of work and different random techniques I'm trying.


----------



## jedy617

Done! Hard to see the hamon unless at an angle (second pic) and it's much more apparent in person but I think it came out pretty decent!


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> Done! Hard to see the hamon unless at an angle (second pic) and it's much more apparent in person but I think it came out pretty decent!
> 
> View attachment 177812
> 
> 
> View attachment 177811



Very clean and some lovely banding in that steel. Do you plan on etching it?


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Very clean and some lovely banding in that steel. Do you plan on etching it?


This was with etching! What I did was etch and polish over again about 3 times. This gave a little bit more contrast to the hamon and kept the rest of the knife polished. Don't plan on doing a forced etch/patina on the whole knife and leaving it. Basically I tried to replicate the amazing work done here: My first Honyaki mirror polishing

I assume I could have gotten similar amazing results but I did not start back on low grit sandpaper and work my way to a true mirror, I just started with fingerstones and metal polish. It's more like a hazy mirror...still probably 7-8 hours of work into it.


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> This was with etching! What I did was etch and polish over again about 3 times. This gave a little bit more contrast to the hamon and kept the rest of the knife polished. Don't plan on doing a forced etch/patina on the whole knife and leaving it. Basically I tried to replicate the amazing work done here: My first Honyaki mirror polishing
> 
> I assume I could have gotten similar amazing results but I did not start back on low grit sandpaper and work my way to a true mirror, I just started with fingerstones and metal polish. It's more like a hazy mirror...still probably 7-8 hours of work into it.



Amazing! Its so cool to see the MCX blades getting customised like this.


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Amazing! Its so cool to see the MCX blades getting customised like this.


thanks for providing them! Huge huge fan of the handle on this. Like the profile a lot too


----------



## DrEriksson

There is always this option. Another Swede and I visited Fredrik this weekend and this was the other guy's punishment for joking too much about Serbian cleavers. We added the "Huusk hole" and put a radius on the handle for symmetry. 52100, if anyone is interested.






Real lesson from this though. Fredrik is awesome!


----------



## jedy617

Final polish vid outside:


----------



## LewRob80

Finally getting to play with a Spare (just purchased used from the k-tip drop). First impressions are great cutting feel, good release and nice fine precision tip. Joy to use in a busy restaurant


----------



## Jville

jedy617 said:


> Final polish vid outside:



Looks great!


----------



## moderncooking

Jville said:


> Looks great!




Haha, nice! Those handles came out so nicely if I do say so myself. 

Now that a few of you have had the chance to play with these, can I ask what your thoughts are on the general shape of the handle?


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Haha, nice! Those handles came out so nicely if I do say so myself.
> 
> Now that a few of you have had the chance to play with these, can I ask what your thoughts are on the general shape of the handle?


Handle is unreal. More please. And I like the clean- non KU finish. Maybe another batch of these with k tip or different profiles for fun varieties. Different woods too? I know fredrick also makes sayas....


----------



## moderncooking

Just found one more 250mm from our last drop if anyone is keen  

Gyuto 250mm 26C3 Honyaki Full Tang Limited Release by Fredrik Spåre


----------



## demcav

moderncooking said:


> Just found one more 250mm from our last drop if anyone is keen
> 
> Gyuto 250mm 26C3 Honyaki Full Tang Limited Release by Fredrik Spåre


I just used the link but don't see a "buy" or "add to cart" option. Does this mean the knife is sold?


----------



## daniel_il

demcav said:


> I just used the link but don't see a "buy" or "add to cart" option. Does this mean the knife is sold?


its gone


----------



## tag98

moderncooking said:


> Just found one more 250mm from our last drop if anyone is keen
> 
> Gyuto 250mm 26C3 Honyaki Full Tang Limited Release by Fredrik Spåre


Man u gotta be quick to get one from you guys!


----------



## moderncooking

Yeah, sorry folks. Its gone already. There will be another Gyuto drop this month though


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> Yeah, sorry folks. Its gone already. There will be another Gyuto drop this month though


A Spåre gyuto, or another maker?


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> A Spåre gyuto, or another maker?



It was an MCX Spare Gyuto from the most recent drop


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> It was an MCX Spare Gyuto from the most recent drop


Thanks, fortunately I got my 250mm from the last batch. I'm wondering about the additional gyuto drop this month.


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> Thanks, fortunately I got my 250mm from the last batch. I'm wondering about the additional gyuto drop this month.



I believe that we are likely looking at the end of the month on that one


----------



## moderncooking

We got our mark on this batch and finally made some changes to the handle. Looking forward to reading your impressions


----------



## e30Birdy

moderncooking said:


> View attachment 182385
> 
> 
> We got our mark on this batch and finally made some changes to the handle. Looking forward to reading your impressions



Finally I got one.. cannot wait for it.. If I lived closer I would just come pick it up


----------



## Tler

when did these go for sale? I must have missed the newsletter


----------



## e30Birdy

Tler said:


> when did these go for sale? I must have missed the newsletter


Today at 2130 CET. @Sdo also said he didn't get the newsletter when we chatted on Whatsapp. Weird, did you check your spam folder? I know I had some things from Kamon drop in mine.


----------



## rmrf

Tler said:


> when did these go for sale? I must have missed the newsletter


I received the newsletter like 2 hours before the drop.


----------



## Tler

ah well. guess I'll have to wait for the next one. maybe bad news on this drop means good news on massdrop? haha


----------



## e30Birdy

rmrf said:


> I received the newsletter like 2 hours before the drop.


Yeah me too.


----------



## Jovidah

@nakiriknaifuwaifu @RockyBasel 
*cough*


----------



## xsmx13

NOOOOOOOOOOOO... I didn't get the newsletter either and just saw it on Instagram. My MCX collection will now be incomplete. First world knife problems.


----------



## tylerleach

I’m sad I missed this one too!! The hamon looks soooo good on these!!! And that extra stamp looks sick.


----------



## moderncooking

May has been crazy for both Fredrik and I and we didn't even get these knives out until the month was over. In fact they only arrived at my shop yesterday. So, I would have and will endeavour to send the newsletter a day or two in advance in the future. Sorry to those who missed out.

I believe the next Classic Gyuto will likely be forged in Apex Ultra, which I am pretty excited about. Only downside of this is that they will not have a Hamon, but they will be a little harder and tougher with better edge retention. So, on balance a win for those who receive one of those. Something to look forward to 

The Apex Classic Gyuto will likely come in August or September. In the meantime we have some exciting stuff in store 

Thanks again for all your support and feedback,
Peter


----------



## tally-ho

I received the new Spåre MCX 250mm classic...with a couple goodies (stickers).











Handles of three different Spare honyaki (210mm bought direct to Fredrik, 250mm MCX (1st round - Nov. 2021), 250mm MCX (June 2022))
Like described, it's thinner near the tang but also the taller of the 3.










There's more clearance between the handle and the coil, not much but it makes an appreciable difference.






1st MCX (11.2021) and 2nd MCX (06.2022). When pitching the blade with 2 fingers right above the edge, the 1st one feels thicker not by much but I didn't like it when I received it, the 2nd one feels exactly how I would have liked the 1st one. The point of the 2nd one is also thinner (very thin) and more flexible. Overall I'm very satisfied with their different aspects.









Hamon.











Bonus shot, a clear view of the blurry background for the choil shots.
I. This is called "Dent de Crolles" (teeth of crolles) because it looks like a molar.
II. Is where the "Coupe Icare" takes place each year.
III. is le massif des Bauges, right above Chambery where is based the headquarters of Opinel, not far away of Albertville where the XVIe winter olympics took place in 1992. I'm living right beneath Chamrousse (ski resort) where Jean-Claude Killy won 3 gold medals during the 1968 winter olympics.


----------



## hukdizzle

Stoked, my 230 comes in later today. Thanks for the pics and impressions!


----------



## Jovidah

tally-ho said:


> III. is le massif des Bauges, right above Chambery where is based the headquarters of Opinel, not far away of Albertville where the XVIe winter olympics took place in 1992. I'm living right beneath Chamrousse (ski resort) where Jean-Claude Killy won 3 gold medals during the 1968 winter olympics.


Could you walk over to their factory and tell them to start grinding their kitchen knives the same way they grind their folding knives? It's such a shame... the kitchen stuff is all fat behind the edge, whereas the folders are just about perfect.

Also: stop hogging all the Spåre. We already have daddy yo yo hogging all the Kamons... no need to follow his tracks.


----------



## timebard

Jovidah said:


> Could you walk over to their factory and tell them to start grinding their kitchen knives the same way they grind their folding knives? It's such a shame... the kitchen stuff is all fat behind the edge, whereas the folders are just about perfect.
> 
> Also: stop hogging all the Spåre. We already have daddy yo yo hogging all the Kamons... no need to follow his tracks.


Compared to yoyo's collection, three of a kind are still rookie numbers...


----------



## moderncooking

tally-ho said:


> I received the new Spåre MCX 250mm classic...with a couple goodies (stickers).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Handles of three different Spare honyaki (210mm bought direct to Fredrik, 250mm MCX (1st round - Nov. 2021), 250mm MCX (June 2022))
> Like described, it's thinner near the tang but also the taller of the 3.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's more clearance between the handle and the coil, not much but it makes an appreciable difference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1st MCX (11.2021) and 2nd MCX (06.2022). When pitching the blade with 2 fingers right above the edge, the 1st one feels thicker not by much but I didn't like it when I received it, the 2nd one feels exactly how I would have liked the 1st one. The point of the 2nd one is also thinner (very thin) and more flexible. Overall I'm very satisfied with their different aspects.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hamon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bonus shot, a clear view of the blurry background for the choil shots.
> I. This is called "Dent de Crolles" (teeth of crolles) because it looks like a molar.
> II. Is where the "Coupe Icare" takes place each year.
> III. is le massif des Bauges, right above Chambery where is based the headquarters of Opinel, not far away of Albertville where the XVIe winter olympics took place in 1992. I'm living right beneath Chamrousse (ski resort) where Jean-Claude Killy won 3 gold medals during the 1968 winter olympics.



Nice share and thank you for the positive feedback. Also, congratulation! Looks like an absolutely stunning place to live


----------



## hukdizzle

Was told to mention this here if anyone missed the recent drop. Apologies to the mods if this is not allowed and I can delete this comment.

WTS - Fredrik Spare MCX 230

Selling this at my cost to pass it onto another enthusiast.


----------



## tally-ho

I really enjoy the latest classic version and it starts to take a nice patina.


----------



## moderncooking

tally-ho said:


> I really enjoy the latest classic version and it starts to take a nice patina.



Very nice, I noticed that the alloy banding on this batch was particularly impressive. Very interested to see how the Apex Ultra drop, coming later this month, fairs with regard to patina and banding.


----------



## tylerleach

moderncooking said:


> Very nice, I noticed that the alloy banding on this batch was particularly impressive. Very interested to see how the Apex Ultra drop, coming later this month, fairs with regard to patina and banding.


I own both an MCX (from the first gen I think? You might be able to help me on which release it was…) and an Apex Ultra (Joel Black) and I assure all of you, they are both incredible!!

Some Patina pics for ya


----------



## moderncooking

tylerleach said:


> I own both an MCX (from the first gen I think? You might be able to help me on which release it was…) and an Apex Ultra (Joel Black) and I assure all of you, they are both incredible!!
> 
> Some Patina pics for ya View attachment 188947
> View attachment 188948


That's a first gen, second batch. Wow! That Apex blade looks incredible, both are looking great! What's the cladding on the Apex?


----------



## tylerleach

moderncooking said:


> That's a first gen, second batch. Wow! That Apex blade looks incredible, both are looking great! What's the cladding on the Apex?


Wrought
I’m a sucker for some wrought clad carbon


----------



## moderncooking

tylerleach said:


> Wrought
> I’m a sucker for some wrought clad carbon


Hahaha who isn't!


----------



## DrD23

tylerleach said:


> I own both an MCX (from the first gen I think? You might be able to help me on which release it was…) and an Apex Ultra (Joel Black) and I assure all of you, they are both incredible!!
> 
> Some Patina pics for ya View attachment 188947
> View attachment 188948


Thoughts on Apex Ultra? Live up to the hype?


----------



## NotAddictedYet

Think Spare also shipped a batch of ApexUltra to modern cooking recently.


----------



## e30Birdy

NotAddictedYet said:


> Think Spare also shipped a batch of ApexUltra to modern cooking recently.


Yes he did


----------



## e30Birdy

MCX Apex Ultra drop tonight at 20:30 CET, just got the email. Wanted to share as a few missed the email last time.


----------



## DrEriksson

e30Birdy said:


> MCX Apex Ultra drop tonight at 20:30 CET, just got the email. Wanted to share as a few missed the email last time.



Did you see what material the white bolster is?


----------



## e30Birdy

DrEriksson said:


> Did you see what material the white bolster is?


I just asked and it is Imitation ivory with bog oak and brass bolster.


----------



## DrEriksson

Ah. Perhaps elforyn.


----------



## e30Birdy

DrEriksson said:


> Ah. Perhaps elforyn.


Yeah thats the name of it, i was asking about it as usually i am not a fan of bog oak but Fredrik did awesome with this one.


----------



## xsmx13

Yay! Snagged my 250mm! Gogogo!


----------



## DrEriksson

230 sold out in two minutes and 250 in less than five. Congrats @moderncooking on these cool collabs and to the buyers.


----------



## blokey

Wait the email said the the sale start at 8:30 pm cet right? Right now it is still 7:45 pm cet, at least on the site I checked

Edit: just noticed the summer saving time.....


----------



## e30Birdy

Crazy how fast these went but Apex Ultra made this drop super hot. Congrats all that got lucky


----------



## timebard

What happened to the email announcements for MCX drops?


----------



## e30Birdy

timebard said:


> What happened to the email announcements for MCX drops?


I got an email on both of my emails at 16:41 and posted in here shortly after. Maybe spam folder?


----------



## xsmx13

timebard said:


> What happened to the email announcements for MCX drops?


I received mine, but they often go to spam. I missed the previous round due to this so I added another email account to have multiple accounts receiving notifications.


----------



## e30Birdy

xsmx13 said:


> I received mine, but they often go to spam. I missed the previous round due to this so I added another email account to have multiple accounts receiving notifications.


Yeah i think it was because of you that i thought to post here to help folks out. 

One just needs to make sure one correctly sets up their email so it doesn't go to spam. I have had Kamon emails go to spam as well.


----------



## xsmx13

Thank you @e30Birdy ! I saw your post and set an alarm. Missing a Kamon newsletter if he re-opens his books... that is the stuff of nightmares.


----------



## e30Birdy

xsmx13 said:


> Thank you @e30Birdy ! I saw your post and set an alarm. Missing a Kamon newsletter if he re-opens his books... that is the stuff of nightmares.


Yeah that is very true but i also really dig these new classics from MCX and Fredrik


----------



## NotAddictedYet

whoever got one of these please post a review


----------



## moderncooking

DrEriksson said:


> 230 sold out in two minutes and 250 in less than five. Congrats @moderncooking on these cool collabs and to the buyers.


Thanks Doc


----------



## moderncooking

Packed and shipped! Enjoy folks, thanks for your on going support!

Would love your feedback on these? There has been micro changes from the first edition until know and it would be great to get feedback on the Geometry and profile so that we can continue to improve it


----------



## PeterL

Just a heads up to those that missed one yesterday. There seems to be a 230mm available still on MC's website now.

Edit: Gone now. That was quick


----------



## timebard

e30Birdy said:


> I got an email on both of my emails at 16:41 and posted in here shortly after. Maybe spam folder?



Yup, went to spam. Bummer. Really had been looking forward to trying the Apex Ultra drop.



PeterL said:


> Just a heads up to those that missed one yesterday. There seems to be a 230mm available still on MC's website now.
> 
> Edit: Gone now. That was quick



Haha now the universe is just taunting me.


----------



## e30Birdy

timebard said:


> Yup, went to spam. Bummer. Really had been looking forward to trying the Apex Ultra drop.
> 
> 
> 
> Haha now the universe is just taunting me.


Might want to tell your email that it is not spam and then it should never happened again.

I check my spam like a hawk because things like this


----------



## blokey

moderncooking said:


> Packed and shipped! Enjoy folks, thanks for your on going support!
> 
> Would love your feedback on these? There has been micro changes from the first edition until know and it would be great to get feedback on the Geometry and profile so that we can continue to improve it


Sadly missed on these, would there be another run?


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> Packed and shipped! Enjoy folks, thanks for your on going support!
> 
> Would love your feedback on these? There has been micro changes from the first edition until know and it would be great to get feedback on the Geometry and profile so that we can continue to improve it


I had one from the 2nd MCX batch. F&F were excellent and I loved the overall feel and look of the knife, however it was a touch thicker behind the edge than I prefer. It’s purely personal preference though as I lean towards lasers and I think those who prefer midweights would like it just fine. I liked it enough to get on Frederick’s list for a custom laser grind, and passed my MCX along on BST.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> I had one from the 2nd MCX batch. F&F were excellent and I loved the overall feel and look of the knife, however it was a touch thicker behind the edge than I prefer. It’s purely personal preference though as I lean towards lasers and I think those who prefer midweights would like it just fine. I liked it enough to get on Frederick’s list for a custom laser grind, and passed my MCX along on BST.


I have to say I was super impressed with the edge on these. Still not a laser grind and more allrounder leaning, but I was able to cut S curves in tissue paper. That Apex steel is pretty incredible stuff


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Sadly missed on these, would there be another run?


Its a maybe at this stage, but next on the schedule is a Bunka 180mm


----------



## e30Birdy

moderncooking said:


> Its a maybe at this stage, but next on the schedule is a Bunka 180mm


Don't say that, I love Bunkas (think Fredrik does as well and his are nice) and just got a Shibata Kotetsu.

Hmm wonder if my girls will notice if i replace the Kyohei on my strip and replace with a Spåre. Haha


----------



## Delat

e30Birdy said:


> Don't say that, I love Bunkas (think Fredrik does as well and his are nice) and just got a Shibata Kotetsu.
> 
> Hmm wonder if my girls will notice if i replace the Kyohei on my strip and replace with a Spåre. Haha



Ha, my custom request for Frederick was basically a better-looking laser bunka to replace my Shibata. Now I'm kinda tempted to pick up an MCX bunka if they release a batch, since Frederick's running waaaay behind on his customs the last I heard.


----------



## moderncooking

e30Birdy said:


> Don't say that, I love Bunkas (think Fredrik does as well and his are nice) and just got a Shibata Kotetsu.
> 
> Hmm wonder if my girls will notice if i replace the Kyohei on my strip and replace with a Spåre. Haha



Ive said it before and Ill say it again, no replacement, just more magnets  









Magnetic Knife Holders | Secure your knives in style | Modern Cooking


Magnetic knife holders are one of the best options to secure your kitchen knives. They can be mounted high off the ground away from children and can be place in an ergonomic position within convenient reach of your workspace, they are also well designed in terms of hygiene and do not have gaps...




moderncooking.com


----------



## e30Birdy

Delat said:


> Ha, my custom request for Frederick was basically a better-looking laser bunka to replace my Shibata. Now I'm kinda tempted to pick up an MCX bunka if they release a batch, since Frederick's running waaaay behind on his customs the last I heard.



I love the Shibata from the grind but R2 will never be my favorite. So i could see getting a second actual sexy looking Bunka.



moderncooking said:


> Ive said it before and Ill say it again, no replacement, just more magnets
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Magnetic Knife Holders | Secure your knives in style | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> Magnetic knife holders are one of the best options to secure your kitchen knives. They can be mounted high off the ground away from children and can be place in an ergonomic position within convenient reach of your workspace, they are also well designed in terms of hygiene and do not have gaps...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com



Yeah i mean GF is a fan of wood so should won't mind a bunch of magnetic strips on the wall, they are in my area of the kitchen anyway where my ECM espresso machine lives.


----------



## M1k3

moderncooking said:


> Its a maybe at this stage, but next on the schedule is a Bunka 180mm


@HumbleHomeCook


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

M1k3 said:


> @HumbleHomeCook



Thanks for looking out for me buddy.

But, gotta dip my toes back into the 210 world for a bit.


----------



## tally-ho




----------



## hukdizzle

Solid, is that a 230 or 250?


----------



## hukdizzle

Got a 230 in today. Fit and finish is pretty solid and I like this iteration a lot. Kind of a bummer about the real deep forging marks near the choil but would probably thin/sharpen out if this knife ever even got to that point. UPS box showed up like this...



I feared for the worst, but it was all good and the knife was fine.


----------



## superworrier

Haha my box was ****ed up but the knife turned out okay too. I really like the tip on this


----------



## xsmx13

superworrier said:


> Haha my box was ****ed up but the knife turned out okay too. I really like the tip on this


Weird, my box looked fine, but internally the packaging and tip we're bent. I should note, it was well packaged by the vendor, I just don't know about some of these package handlers. I recently saw one chuck a package about 8 feet onto my neighbors porch.


----------



## NotAddictedYet

hukdizzle said:


> Got a 230 in today. Fit and finish is pretty solid and I like this iteration a lot. Kind of a bummer about the real deep forging marks near the choil but would probably thin/sharpen out if this knife ever even got to that point. UPS box showed up like this...
> 
> 
> 
> I feared for the worst, but it was all good and the knife was fine.



Stunning knife, thanks for posting. keep us posted on your use impression

Coincidentally, my 2 MCX orders also arrived in badly damaged boxes. The first time was just a big dent but the last time, one side was basically missing. The knife could literally just fall out of it. It looked like someone teared the box open and didn't even make an attempt to mend. Both times though, the knife arrived safe and sound.


----------



## hukdizzle

Not going to write a huge review on this yet after a single use. I will say though, so far this thing is genuinely a treat to use. Made a salad with it and cut some grilled chicken thighs and was quite happy with the performance and food release. I very recently had one of the latest MCX releases and I feel like Fredrik turned up the performance on this particular release. It's thinner behind the edge and honestly I feel it's thinner as a whole compared to the previous knife I purchased. I have yet to do some onion work with it but I feel like the tip is going to be a winner on this model, seems very KS like. Balance point is perfect for me with my pinch right on. Other than the deep forging mark on one side the fit and finish is quite good and the OOTB edge was good enough that I don't see myself sharpening it any time soon. To give you an idea, think utility razor blade out of the package sharp. That's more or less what he put on this example with the tip edge apex being slightly polished/rounded off. I do look forward to putting my edge on it and seeing how much effort that takes and how long it lasts.

I would encourage all of you lucky enough to have purchased one to cut some hot proteins with it. It's a patina queen, and builds a rich blue patina really quickly.


----------



## DrEriksson

xsmx13 said:


> Weird, my box looked fine, but internally the packaging and tip we're bent. I should note, it was well packaged by the vendor, I just don't know about some of these package handlers. I recently saw one chuck a package about 8 feet onto my neighbors porch.


A bit of an FYI regarding packing from someone who spent three(?) summers repairing packages at one of Sweden's hubs/distribution centers. I have seen some crazy things packed, ranging from a parcel full of cherries and a few cans of beer, to a frozen lobster (package damaged on Friday, repaired on Monday).

When it comes to throwing a package, I'd not recommend shipping anything you're not comfortable with throwing 8 feet, or TBH 5 meter. Similarly, if you're not prepared to hold it at head height and drop it, don't ship it. What you don't see is how packages are sorted. One machine we used to have took a 2 m rolling cage full of packages and turned it upside down, dumping all the contents onto a conveyer belt for sorting. As you surely understand, this can add a lot of force on packages. Some packages were also stored without cages on trailers. These packages were placed on the flor and the sorter built higher and higher. After a while half of the trailer is full, and perhaps you get a package that you don't find a good place for. That package can get chucked over the other to the front of the trailer.

I'd say that there are three ways to protect a package in a good way.

1: Good outer box. I think this is the biggest issue TBH. Long boxes are weak to forces that bend them. A good way to avoid this problem is to ship knives in tubes. Similarly, a large surface area of a box can make it weak. If you have a big box, consider doubling it up. I often wrap my goods in cardboard which I then place in a box.

2: Stabilize what you're shipping. The main goal is to not have your goods banging around inside the box. I think this one is self-explanatory. I'd add that packaging can also be used to absorb forces on the box, but keep in mind that you don't want your packaging to put lateral pressure on a blade, as it can bend the knife. For tubes I used whatever I have at home, since my main goal is to stabilize the knife inside the tube.

3: Make sure to tape sufficiently. I get that companies need to save time and they can't be using excessive tape (you should see the speeds at which distribution centers are packing and shipping), but you can afford a bit of extra tape.

Perhaps this is helpful for someone.

Edit: This is mainly for consumers. Companies need to consider trade off in the time it takes to pack and how many knives are damaged in shipping.


----------



## hukdizzle

All great points from @DrEriksson. I think the biggest issue with the packaging is the single wall cardboard outer box that is easily compromised by the typical shipping conditions. It seems several customers have had issues with the outer box being compromised during the shipping. I find no fault with the interior knife box and packaging as it's quite adequate to protect the product. These knives are often not able to be replaced as they sell out immediately and are limited runs. I think it would be wise to look into a more substantial outer box even if the cost is slightly more. I for one would be completely alright with paying an extra couple of dollars for more substantial packaging for these types of purchases.

@moderncooking


----------



## JanSubrt

My two cents on the current apex ultra batch:

I have the 250 version and for an all-rounder it performs above its price range. I do own older mcx 230 and its not as nimble as the current 250. The weight distribution is so much better now. 

I also tried to sharpened it, and found it rather easy for its hardness. 

Im a big fan of deep forge marks, texture and contrast. So current fit and finish is also an upgrade for me. And the faux ivory was a nice surprise


----------



## moderncooking

Thank you ver much for all the feedback here. Very valuable. I’m certainly going to continue working away on better packaging.

Those who have been supporting MCX and Modern Cooking for a while will know that we have been engaged in an on going war with logistics companies in terms of getting our knives safely shipped around the globe. Our current packaging is not the first interaction and we are already thinking about improvements.

At this stage it seems that securing and protecting the tip in a better way is the main issue and we have some ideas that will hopefully solve this.

Also very happy to read the positive remarks on fit and finish as well as performance. We are pushing on and have some super exciting releases coming towards the end of the month/early next month.

As always Fredrik and I thank you for your support and your valuable feedback


----------



## Delat

The bunka is available.









MCX | Bunka 190mm Forged by Fredrik Spåre | Modern Cooking


This MCX Bunka 190mm has once again been design in collaboration with Swedish Bladesmith Fredrik Spåre. The knife design takes a little inspiration from HADO Knives, but Fredrik is also a major fan of the Bunka and has imbue the knife with his own classic look and feel.




moderncooking.com


----------



## Delat

Delat said:


> The bunka is available.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MCX | Bunka 190mm Forged by Fredrik Spåre | Modern Cooking
> 
> 
> This MCX Bunka 190mm has once again been design in collaboration with Swedish Bladesmith Fredrik Spåre. The knife design takes a little inspiration from HADO Knives, but Fredrik is also a major fan of the Bunka and has imbue the knife with his own classic look and feel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> moderncooking.com



I’m surprised these haven’t sold out yet. Me on my conference call the day of release “Sorry guys I have a hard stop at noon”. Unsaid: “Gotta make sure I score an MCX bunka!”.


----------



## moderncooking

Delat said:


> I’m surprised these haven’t sold out yet. Me on my conference call the day of release “Sorry guys I have a hard stop at noon”. Unsaid: “Gotta make sure I score an MCX bunka!”.



 Thanks Delat

I think a few people had hoped these would be Apex Ultra. We will be releasing more MCX Apex blades for sure, but honestly 1.2419 is a very good quality steel, certainly nothing to poke a stick at.

Any other thoughts on why these have not sold at the rate our previous releases have are totally welcome?


----------



## Jovidah

Me personally I just don't care about bunkas. All I really want is another run of that 'westernized KS'.


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Thanks Delat
> 
> I think a few people had hoped these would be Apex Ultra. We will be releasing more MCX Apex blades for sure, but honestly 1.2419 is a very good quality steel, certainly nothing to poke a stick at.
> 
> Any other thoughts on why these have not sold at the rate our previous releases have are totally welcome?


I think I can help with that from at least a collectors standpoint. Gyutos are just way more popular and seem to sell way better for us nerds/collectors (although your data may say otherwise, you run a shop haha). Also, I'd say the most alluring thing about getting a spare is getting something special in regards to the steel for the price offered. Usually by that I mean the great value of his honyaki. But also I would say dama from him, and very new/premium stuff like apex ultra as well.

Again like you mentioned, I am sure 1.2419 is great....but I like the exotic stuff. I think most people have so much "plain" carbon steels, that the spicy stuff is just much more alluring.

I would love a honyaki/dama/apex ultra bunka/santoku personally.


----------



## jedy617

Also a couple requests if you take them @moderncooking 

I have the western honyaki. Really like the clean polish. If you do more of the blacksmith finish going forward however, I really do like how it came out on the bunka vs the vertical striations on the older collabs...I really dislike those. But that's just me. Would love a clean polished apex ultra up next....or something better. Could we do a damascus san mai apex ultra? (I know it's possible, but wondering for the collab).

And a shoot for the moon. What about an apex ultra honyaki? I don't think it has been done before, and I understand it would not necessarily change the performance of the knife since it can already reach 67 hrc with a conventional heat treat...but it sounds like it would just be really cool. Since it's (kinda) similar to hitachi blue I assume it could be done?


----------



## moderncooking

Thanks a lot guys, fair and honest feedback. Our next couple of releases will make your happy for sure


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> Also a couple requests if you take them @moderncooking
> 
> I have the western honyaki. Really like the clean polish. If you do more of the blacksmith finish going forward however, I really do like how it came out on the bunka vs the vertical striations on the older collabs...I really dislike those. But that's just me. Would love a clean polished apex ultra up next....or something better. Could we do a damascus san mai apex ultra? (I know it's possible, but wondering for the collab).
> 
> And a shoot for the moon. What about an apex ultra honyaki? I don't think it has been done before, and I understand it would not necessarily change the performance of the knife since it can already reach 67 hrc with a conventional heat treat...but it sounds like it would just be really cool. Since it's (kinda) similar to hitachi blue I assume it could be done?



So, lets just say that a texture free blacksmith finish or full polish is something we can do. Eyes open on that one.

On the honyaki Apex. This is not really possible. Apex Ultra is a fast hardening steel. End result, Honyaki is not possible.


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> So, lets just say that a texture free blacksmith finish or full polish is something we can do. Eyes open on that one.
> 
> On the honyaki Apex. This is not really possible. Apex Ultra is a fast hardening steel. End result, Honyaki is not possible.


Gotcha, will keep an eye out. Might as well cancel my custom order, 3 months turned to 1 year and still no knife in sight. Damn your collabs taking all of fredriks time haha. At least you cook up good stuff though


----------



## superworrier

Yeah I personally dig the vertical marks. Agreed on more exotic stuff


----------



## e30Birdy

I personally believe Bunka are not a very sought after form. I personally love my Bunkas but others really hate them. I also feel i could have hundreds of Gyuto but do not need that many Bunka as they aren't as versatile as my Gyuto. If i hadn't just gotten a different Bunka i would have probably snagged one if these for sure. Just my 2 cents


----------



## blokey

Like other said it's not really the steel but the Bunka format. Bunka is a really weird situation, it appeal to a lot of people who are into Japanese knives but not THAT into them, people who likes Santoku but feels like it is becoming too mainstream, too "housewified" and want something different, for this reason more accessible and cheaper bunka from popular brand sells like hot cakes. Spåre certainly have a lot of following in enthusiast communities, but the community itself is very small, and people here and in other forums tend to get gyuto in the first place, not that it is the most reasonable choice since everyone here probably have like 10 240mm gyutos in rotation.


----------



## moderncooking

blokey said:


> Like other said it's not really the steel but the Bunka format. Bunka is a really weird situation, it appeal to a lot of people who are into Japanese knives but not THAT into them, people who likes Santoku but feels like it is becoming too mainstream, too "housewified" and want something different, for this reason more accessible and cheaper bunka from popular brand sells like hot cakes. Spåre certainly have a lot of following in enthusiast communities, but the community itself is very small, and people here and in other forums tend to get gyuto in the first place, not that it is the most reasonable choice since everyone here probably have like 10 240mm gyutos in rotation.



Haha, very true. That's pretty much what happened to the Santoku. It became too cool to be cool. Gyuto's are always going to be the easy choice, that's for sure, but we just wanna try to offer something else occasionally.

Thanks for all the feedback on this, it really is always appreciated. No guarantees on the requests, but I am always open to hearing from you guys and will do my best


----------



## jedy617

I love santokus/bunkas. I don't know why but I have 2, and I don't really feel the need for more...yet I keep buying gyutos when I definitely don't need more haha. Can't explain it better than that. One of these days I will have more though I am sure.


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> I love santokus/bunkas. I don't know why but I have 2, and I don't really feel the need for more...yet I keep buying gyutos when I definitely don't need more haha. Can't explain it better than that. One of these days I will have more though I am sure.


There can be a lot of variability in a Gyuto. I have too many also, but I do feel that from task to task I reach for a different one. So, from that perspective I see value in having multiple Gyutos. 

I am not sure that I can say the same for Bunka/Santoku, they are great for easy light work though.


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> There can be a lot of variability in a Gyuto. I have too many also, but I do feel that from task to task I reach for a different one. So, from that perspective I see value in having multiple Gyutos.
> 
> I am not sure that I can say the same for Bunka/Santoku, they are great for easy light work though.



I do amaze myself sometimes, I have some of the best gyutos ever created in my opinion...but so many times I just say meh and grab my trusty santoku, way more times than I can admit haha


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> I do amaze myself sometimes, I have some of the best gyutos ever created in my opinion...but so many times I just say meh and grab my trusty santoku, way more times than I can admit haha


For sure! When I was a chef there where plenty of guys around the kitchen with 180mm blades. Its undeniable that they are easier to handle. So for the simple tasks why make the extra effort


----------



## Bear

I just have one bunka, that's all I need, but gyutos are dependant on steel and the product I'm cutting, I still need more


----------



## moderncooking

Bear said:


> I just have one bunka, that's all I need, but gyutos are dependant on steel and the product I'm cutting, I still need more



That's the truth, they are a little like bread knives. Once you got one, you got one.


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

moderncooking said:


> ...
> 
> Any other thoughts on why these have not sold at the rate our previous releases have are totally welcome?



I can only give you my dead honest feedback as an individual consumer and I acknowledge right up front I may be wrong in my view.

I saw those knives and thought (think) they are gorgeous and my wallet started sweating. I was even tagged in this thread to look out for them, and while at the time I said I was focused on something else, when I actually saw the pictures, it had me re-thinking.

But, I have seen more than one person say that their custom order request has been unfulfilled while these collab-batch knives are being produced. In the end, I decided I can't support that. There's so many options out there that a factor like that, as small as many folks might feel it to be, is enough at the ~$400 range to get me to look elsewhere.

Now, I may be off base and if so, I'm open to having my view changed but as it stands it just doesn't feel right to me.

I know that's an individual case and not the broader market answer you are probably looking for but maybe there are others who feel the same.

Please know, I mean no disrespect and really like the stuff you put out there. I just thought I would give you my honest opinion on why I'm not keen on this particular maker any more and offer a perspective you may not have ever considered.


----------



## esoo

it is quite clear that Fredrik is now prioritizing things like the MCX knives over customs that are on his books.

When I placed my order in May February, Apex Ultra was not given as an option for carbon. In the meantime Apex Ultra gets released and MCX gets a drop of blades. You cannot tell me that those blades were booked before my custom went in.

It's only going to be a matter of time before I take my business elsewhere. I've got a blade in the mail right now, and once I've had a chance to play with that (which is a variation of what I ordered from Fredrik), I'm going to be focused on getting what I ordered. Either Fredrik delivers or I go to one of many other makers whose books are open and deliver as promised. 

And to be up front, I have no problems waiting for a custom. But when you tell me a timeline, you should meet that timeline. The estimated timeline for the blade had made it a perfect birthday present to myself (and that was mentioned). My birthday past with no blade and no update. That was uncool.

Edit: review my emails and updated the order date


----------



## Delat

moderncooking said:


> Thanks Delat
> 
> I think a few people had hoped these would be Apex Ultra. We will be releasing more MCX Apex blades for sure, but honestly 1.2419 is a very good quality steel, certainly nothing to poke a stick at.
> 
> Any other thoughts on why these have not sold at the rate our previous releases have are totally welcome?



Bunkas are just not nearly as popular as gyutos. If I had to guess it’s really the length - anything less than 210mm tends to be a hard sell. Personally I like bunkas, k-tips, and shorter knives but recognize they’re not for everyone.

I do tend to prefer laser performance in a bunka vs a thicker midweight grind; since I grab short knives when my prep is small, I just want to easily ghost through the prep vs using a bigger, heavier knife for larger jobs.

edited to add: What I was implying with my last paragraph above is that Frederick isn't known for laser grinds - he's more of a midweight guy. So where you might see Shibata bunkas flying off the shelf, Frederick's standard grind maybe isn't the best fit for that category. I actually ordered the MCX bunka more as a lark to see if his grind has changed since my last MCX (and to home in what I want to ask him for if my custom slot ever comes up), not really expecting to replace my Shibata bunka or Myojin 180 both of which are pretty laserish in a small package.


----------



## tostadas

HumbleHomeCook said:


> I can only give you my dead honest feedback as an individual consumer and I acknowledge right up front I may be wrong in my view.
> 
> I saw those knives and thought (think) they are gorgeous and my wallet started sweating. I was even tagged in this thread to look out for them, and while at the time I said I was focused on something else, when I actually saw the pictures, it had me re-thinking.
> 
> But, I have seen more than one person say that their custom order request has been unfulfilled while these collab-batch knives are being produced. In the end, I decided I can't support that. There's so many options out there that a factor like that, as small as many folks might feel it to be, is enough at the ~$400 range to get me to look elsewhere.
> 
> Now, I may be off base and if so, I'm open to having my view changed but as it stands it just doesn't feel right to me.
> 
> I know that's an individual case and not the broader market answer you are probably looking for but maybe there are others who feel the same.
> 
> Please know, I mean no disrespect and really like the stuff you put out there. I just thought I would give you my honest opinion on why I'm not keen on this particular maker any more and offer a perspective you may not have ever considered.


Agreed. I've been on his books for over a year now, before his popularity skyrocketted. But there have been no updates or communication. Though I do keep seeing on his IG feed all these great new large batches of knives getting shipped off to certain vendors. And that does irk me some. Good for him though, and I do wish all these makers the very best. But at this point, I am not expecting my order to ever get fulfilled.

In the end, it's all about money. Vendors have larger bankroll, and the makers get higher overall profit. But it's not all bad, since I've had a chance to work with many other makers who are happy to take on custom projects with me.


----------



## jedy617

I'm also part of the one year club after my quote of 3 months with no communication. I keep going back and forth if I want to support him by buying stuff like MCX. 

Understood modern wants to bring cool knives to the market and make money, as does Fredrick, but there does begin to become a point where the waiting is unacceptable. 

1 month delay no worries... 3, alright whatever... But soon rather then later it will be a year later. And you're right @tostadas , there are so many makers out there today that would jump at the opportunity to make you a sweet custom without having to wait so long with no communication


----------



## DrEriksson

@moderncooking Already lots of comments about the slower bunka. But for real, having tried his bunka, people should not sleep on it. Think it’s Fredrik’s favorite model for personal use.


----------



## NotAddictedYet

I'm glad to see that I am not the only one feeling ambivalent about how custom orders is handled. I am at the 7.5 months mark, all communication has been initiated by me and sometimes not even answered. It's crazy to see people waiting 1 years when the order book is supposed to be half year long. It's hard not to think the batches and batches of knives being produced for vendors has something to do with the delay.

MCX collabs knives are great, make no mistake. The MCX honyaki was what introduced me to Mr. Spare's work and made me a fan. Personally bought a couple even. I understand vendor work is where the money is at and Mr. Spare certainly can make whatever he wishes. It's not a great look however to see custom work de-prioritized in this fashion.

This may just be the state of the market, releasing limited number of knives through vendors is certinaly the MO of the knife world today. I do wish him the very best and he certainly deserves all this success.


----------



## esoo

So @tostadas and @jedy617 - are you guys a year behind your promised dates or a year since you had your name put on this list?

Just curious how long my wait my actually be.


----------



## jedy617

esoo said:


> So @tostadas and @jedy617 - are you guys a year behind your promised dates or a year since you had your name put on this list?
> 
> Just curious how long my wait my actually be.


I placed an order early October of last year, with an estimated delivery time from Fredrick to be 3 months at time of order. Frankly, I feel like I was forgotten about and I will never see it. I wouldn't have high hopes of seeing anything anytime remotely soon if you ordered in May


----------



## superworrier

jedy617 said:


> I placed an order early October of last year, with an estimated delivery time from Fredrick to be 3 months at time of order. Frankly, I feel like I was forgotten about and I will never see it. I wouldn't have high hopes of seeing anything anytime remotely soon if you ordered in May


Did you put anything down or just get on his list? I got on his list in November and nothing as well. What irks me is I asked a few months ago if there was a new estimate and didn't get a response (this is a pet peeve in general. I DMed someone who said "DM for customs" in bio and got no response. Someone else told me their books were not open. Even Yanick took the time to respond to my annoying email)


----------



## JayS20

@esoo So you ordered in May this year?
Didn't he close his books around January? I talked with him last year already about closing his books, so he can catch up and doesn't give timelines he can't deliver. 3 months was his universal answer to waiting time for custom orders last year. When he closed his books his backlog was 6 to 8 months and with MC it gets postponed even further.
Either take no new orders or give a timeline of 1 year plus. Communication is important with custom orders, for some more than others.
Kamon also wanted his waitlist to be just 6 months but it got closer towards a year and he doesn't take custom orders or at least just does it semi for quite some time.


----------



## esoo

@JayS20 - I just went back and reviewed my emails with Fredrik - I got on his list in the middle of February and made it just as he closed the list. He said 6-7 months at that point. The May date was my last contact with him (I've updated that post)


----------



## Strozzi

Thank you all for the information. I sent an email a while back trying to get on his list and received no response. I was about to send another but I think I’ll bag it. Hopefully one of the MCX drops will go my way, I want to try his work before prices go crazy.


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## JayS20

In February/March he still fulfilled orders from around August/September, so would be closer around December+ for you to even come up.
He took too much to chew and it bites him. Should have said as general announcement will at least take 10 months and right now I'm in this and that time for fullfilling custom orders for this period e.g. "I'm working on orders from Oktober to December last year right now."


----------



## tostadas

esoo said:


> So @tostadas and @jedy617 - are you guys a year behind your promised dates or a year since you had your name put on this list?
> 
> Just curious how long my wait my actually be.


I was in contact with him since last summer, and got on the list sometime around Sept last year I believe. He sent out an update early this year that things were delayed for another 3-6mo and he had too many things to do and stressed about meeting deadlines. I totally understand that trying to meet customer expectations for custom orders can require a lot of time. I actually sent him a message saying not to worry and take whatever time is needed, since he seemed overwhelmed. Maybe he still has it on his list and will get to it eventually, who knows.

Dealing with overwhelming production demand is one thing, but if on the other hand, a vendor comes along showing off a dozen or so new "exclusive" custom collaboration knives every month, then that kinda sends a different message.


----------



## Matt Jacobs

I am picking one of the bunka's up and I am pretty excited about it. I mainly have large gyutos but sometimes want something smaller, right now I have a nakiri or a petty for the that. I dont really like short knives so that leaves the nakiri but then I dont have a tip. Personally I also love the steel choice. Apex would have been cool but most of the others have been 26c3. Spicy white doesnt do much for me. Its just like Shirogami, great to sharpen but edge retention isnt there for me. My experience with 1.2419 has been fantastic so far. I have high expectations for this one and I will let you know my thoughts.


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## Delat

I got on his books in Jan and at the time he said 6-7 months. I appreciate hearing from others that it’s stretched over a year. 

I’m not actually upset - it would’ve been nice to get a heads-up from Frederick so I could reallocate my knife budget, but meh. If my slot comes up next year I’ll be happy but meanwhile I’ve just mentally filed it under “Things to completely forget about so they can be a pleasant surprise if they ever happen”.


----------



## Matt Jacobs

Delat said:


> I got on his books in Jan and at the time he said 6-7 months. I appreciate hearing from others that it’s stretched over a year.
> 
> I’m not actually upset - it would’ve been nice to get a heads-up from Frederick so I could reallocate my knife budget, but meh. If my slot comes up next year I’ll be happy but meanwhile I’ve just mentally filed it under “Things to completely forget about so they can be a pleasant surprise if they ever happen”.


I had that happen with my Skye Eilers, when all of the sudden I got progress pictures it was like Christmas.


----------



## Delat

Matt Jacobs said:


> I had that happen with my Skye Eilers, when all of the sudden I got progress pictures it was like Christmas.



Getting on Skye’s list at all would like Christmas for me, nvm the wait


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## tcmx3

Yeah add me to the list of people who've been on his list since last year who hasn't heard from him. I was on it far enough back that in theory I could have come up before the first MCX one though it would have been tight.

It's true I didn't give him any money, but it's because he doesn't ask for pre-payment. I would have if he asked me.

I got one of the very first batch of the MCX knives and it's the only Spare I expect to ever get, unfortunately. I really would like a beefier 26c3 honyaki, especially around the tip, and with a bigger handle, which is what I had discussed him. Not because I hate the guy or anything, I just dont expect my spot on his list to ever materialize.


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## Hockey3081

I just checked my dates and we confirmed on 11/2. I expected early 2022. Checked in with him in March to confirm I still had a slot since I started seeing the MCX drops. He confirmed and said I should have a spot in a few weeks. Nothing after that. 

It seems the general consensus here is that people are happy to see him doing well as a maker collaborating with a great vendor but the complete lack of communication isn’t sitting well. 



Delat said:


> Getting on Skye’s list at all would like Christmas for me, nvm the wait



Sign up for his newsletter!


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## xsmx13

blokey said:


> Like other said it's not really the steel but the Bunka format. Bunka is a really weird situation, it appeal to a lot of people who are into Japanese knives but not THAT into them, people who likes Santoku but feels like it is becoming too mainstream, too "housewified" and want something different, for this reason more accessible and cheaper bunka from popular brand sells like hot cakes. Spåre certainly have a lot of following in enthusiast communities, but the community itself is very small, and people here and in other forums tend to get gyuto in the first place, not that it is the most reasonable choice since everyone here probably have like 10 240mm gyutos in rotation.



Totally agree with this along with the other poster who noted that it seems like folks tend to do 1 bunka vs 173ish gyuto variations. If I hadn't just bought an Isasmedjan bunka I would have snagged one. Instead, I'm deciding if I want to keep the new bunka or my old Takeda.


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## moderncooking

Hey Folks,

Firstly, I just want to say that your continued support and always constructive feedback is totally appreciated. That also includes the somewhat challenging topic of the Modern Cooking MCX partnership with Fredrik and its impact on his custom orders.

I won't argue that this partnership has had an impact on delivery of custom orders and for my part I am sorry. I want to give you a little background on our partnership and assure you that Fredrik has not once ever expressed anything other than gratitude for the support this community and those on his books have given him.

Late last year I developed the plan to find a knife maker or several knife makers that I could develop a collaborative set of products with. The goal was always to develop something unique, high performance and as reasonable as possible in price. From the moment Fredrik and I began our correspondence it was clear that we had like-minded views on what we wanted to achieve. Both of us are former chefs and quickly found that we worked well together. Fredrik made it clear to me, back in October or November, that he wanted to do more batch style knife making. He felt that this allowed him to focus on the processes of making knives rather than the details of each custom order. For example, perfecting Honyaki.

We understood that this could impact delivery of his custom orders and we both felt that it was important to ensure these customers would get looked after. We agreed to deliver an MCX batch every month throughout 2022 with Fredrik producing 10-14 knives per batch over 2 weeks of each month and dedicating the remainder of each month to his custom orders.

However, the pressures of this have taken its toll and clearly communication for one thing has not been ideal. There are some extenuating circumstances on Fredrik’s side, personal matters, and clearly producing so many knives in a month is a huge challenge as is.

We have big plans for the coming months and year, and we hope to bring some very exciting knives to the market, but we have also discussed, as a priority, keeping Fredrik’s custom order customers happy.

With this said Fredrik has written the below message for you. He was unable to post as he does not have an approved account here. Fredrik is working hard to deliver the knives and making knives has been the priority over communication, this has been done with the best intentions, but clearly left you all a little in the dark. Hopefully, this will address that and won't leave you feeling neglected or un-appreciated.

I assure you it is quite the opposite, this community and the support and feedback you provide to both Fredrik and I is valued more than you know.

Best regards,

Peter


---------------------------------------------------------------

Hey all, this is Fredrik Spåre.

I was notified of this discussion and felt I really wanted to address some issues people are having with me and my custom order list. Please try and read this with an open mind.

So I started thinking of closing my books for quite a while before it eventually happened. The main reason I didn't do it is because of the insecurity in workflow I felt it would mean (perhaps wrong) because having a queue lined up gave me a feeling of stability.
Perhaps I should have closed much earlier, but I didn't.

So eventually Peter at Modern Cooking (plus other retailers that I turned down) approached me and suggested we did some collaborations. Even though it would take time away from the custom list, it felt like a great opportunity and I gladly agreed.

I combined the custom orders with the work from Modern Cooking and I quickly noticed how much smoother the work was when working on larger batches instead of doing one-ofs with sometimes extremely detailed requests. Not a big surprise, but unfortunately this realization came at a very sensitive time in my personal life.

So me and my wife of 14 years decided to split and with that came a much larger demand of financial security for me and my daughter. As many of you might know, no one gets into knifemaking to make lots of money, but I do feel that if I work 6-7 days a week I at least should be able to support myself and my daughter.

Well, sometimes a custom order that I charge €280 incl VAT for can fail because of the previously mentioned very specific details and suddenly the money I make that week gets drastically reduced. Not the customers fault, not my fault (or well, kinda my fault but whatever) but it's a very sensitive economical situation.

So doing more work with retailers meant more stability and I could still produce a healthy amount of customs every month. Of course, this meant that the waiting time increased quite alot and I tried communicating it through instagram and actually got an overwhelming amount of positive messages. So that makes me feel a bit sad to see people now ganging up and, politely, taking a stand against the stuff Modern Cooking are offering instead of supporting one of the few businesses that are actually dedicated to taking care of their contracted blacksmiths/makers. It is absolutely not how I would have reacted to the situation, but to each their own.

Some makers raise their prices to compensate for the risks, some deny taking very specific orders and I should perhaps have done the latter.

So what I have actually planned on doing for some time now is to offer everyone on the custom order list an alternative to get a knife faster than waiting for their spot in the queue. I will send out an email to everyone waiting for it.

I understand the frustration with not getting replies when trying to contact me, but please understand that I dont ignore anyone out of spite, its simply just very time consuming and combined with the last 6 months of turbulence in my private life, I simply have not managed to keep up.

With all that said, much love to all of you. You have made my dream come true by working as a knife maker. <3

Fredrik Spåre


----------



## superworrier

I feel kinda sad if he felt pressured to overshare. I hope he’s doing well. 

I really don’t hold it against MC or him (I think it’s true for most of us People are probably just kinda disappointed and venting) I kinda bought the Apex thinking my “custom” won’t come in and I’m happy with it. (Honestly probably happier than I would’ve been with my original idea)
It does seem most makers are moving to the non custom model. (Honestly one thing I dislike about this in general is that sometimes you can’t get the size you want. I’m not talking exact but ballpark. What Yanick does seems like a good compromise).

I figured the constant order flow is probably better for makers and it may have been an agreed upon long term deal with MCX. 

Anyway, thanks for posting this.


----------



## jedy617

@moderncooking That was well said by Fredrik... Besides for one thing, I don't think anyone here is taking a stand against Modern Cooking in the least. We all get you have a business to run and it wouldn't make sense for you to just say "Hey Fredrik, pause on those MCX knives and work on your customs" even though we as customers might prefer that. I have bought from you/the MCX line and will continue to even though I have not been satisfied with my experience waiting for my custom. 

I empathize with his situation, and the delays make sense. I do remember him posting on instagram one time that book orders would be delayed a bit...and that was good of him for sure, it just would have been nice if he was really frank and said hey, there are going to be big delays due to large lifestyle changes or something along those lines. We would all understand...it's just that one insta post saying hey custom orders are going to be delayed, don't really paint the picture of an extra year or more you know?

Also when someone like me, sees posts of collabs with other knife makers, and group buys for members of different communities spring up that you know were organized way after your order was placed and are finished before your order is even started does kind of tick you off a bit in the moment and you wish he would have declined some of those special projects.

Like @superworrier here said, we are venting. It is a knife at the end of the day and Fredriks life is more than pleasing us. I hope he is able to get some stable ground underneath him and things start to go better for him.

Thanks for the communication


----------



## esoo

As a divorced dad, I get the issues that Fredrik is talking about. When I split with my ex-wife I moved in with my dad. At 40 years old. It was humbling as when I looked at my budget I could.live with him or barely be able to feed myself and my daughter. 

@moderncooking - the biggest thing that I would say to Fredrik to help him is to communicate. A simple email to those of us on the list saying "I having some personal issues, and I'm behind on my list, please bear with me" would have quelled things a lot. Maybe every two months giving an update where on his list he was worked would help us as customers as well. 

The other item - I'd gladly pay 10-15% more if it would give Fredrik an extra day a week with his daughter. He is busy as he s the budget Smith that knocks it out of the park. He could easily charge more. And having just sent my daughter to university, I'm very melancholy and reminiscent of all the time I got to spend with her. He shouldn't have to work 7 days a week to live.


----------



## Duukt

I was excited to see knives in stock till I noticed they were bunkas. Personally the small knife arena in my house is dominated by a Takamura gyuto and a yo handled HAP40 Santoku which all my guests love. A reactive bunka would never get used by anyone.

I already own the 250 from the first release and at this point would only be collecting larger blades so I passed on it.


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## Matt Jacobs

Peter, Fredrik, thank you for the letter and opening up like that. 
When I first started buying knives a couple of years ago, $200.00 was a ridiculous price to pay for a knife. Now I have plenty of knives pushing 1k but for any of my "non-knife-nerd" friends anything over $100.00 can still seem ridiculous. In my mind what Modern Cooking and MCX is doing for the knife industry can not get enough praise. I think anyone who is being honest would say that paying the cost for the level knives that are being put out is outstanding. Yes you can get the same or better performance from Japanese knives at these prices but honestly not with the level of fit and finish. I would say most western makers are at least 50% more expensive then these are for similar quality. In my mind Modern Cooking is doing a great thing for our industry in letting people who dont have crazy knife budgets get into our addiction. I can only see it helping us as other makers have to be seeing these prices and quality and how quickly they sell out. There are a select few makers who can put out $1000.00 knives and have them sell like say Kamon. Go look at how many knives Alex Horn has on his website. He makes possibly the best knife I have ever used but its hard to sell expensive knives. The guys in the lower range can move them much faster and keep income rolling in. This was a very smart business move and hope it continues. That being said, I do feel for the guys waiting on knives, it is not fun and there is never enough communication for you to feel good about the wait.


----------



## moderncooking

Matt Jacobs said:


> Peter, Fredrik, thank you for the letter and opening up like that.
> When I first started buying knives a couple of years ago, $200.00 was a ridiculous price to pay for a knife. Now I have plenty of knives pushing 1k but for any of my "non-knife-nerd" friends anything over $100.00 can still seem ridiculous. In my mind what Modern Cooking and MCX is doing for the knife industry can not get enough praise. I think anyone who is being honest would say that paying the cost for the level knives that are being put out is outstanding. Yes you can get the same or better performance from Japanese knives at these prices but honestly not with the level of fit and finish. I would say most western makers are at least 50% more expensive then these are for similar quality. In my mind Modern Cooking is doing a great thing for our industry in letting people who dont have crazy knife budgets get into our addiction. I can only see it helping us as other makers have to be seeing these prices and quality and how quickly they sell out. There are a select few makers who can put out $1000.00 knives and have them sell like say Kamon. Go look at how many knives Alex Horn has on his website. He makes possibly the best knife I have ever used but its hard to sell expensive knives. The guys in the lower range can move them much faster and keep income rolling in. This was a very smart business move and hope it continues. That being said, I do feel for the guys waiting on knives, it is not fun and there is never enough communication for you to feel good about the wait.



Matt that is very nice of you to say. You are certainly not the first to give us positive feedback on this, but its always nice to get a pat on the back like this. I only hope that it develops into a more widely adopted way of doing things.


----------



## HumbleHomeCook

moderncooking said:


> ...
> 
> ...So that makes me feel a bit sad to see people now ganging up and, politely, taking a stand against the stuff Modern Cooking are offering instead of supporting one of the few businesses that are actually dedicated to taking care of their contracted blacksmiths/makers. It is absolutely not how I would have reacted to the situation, but to each their own.
> 
> ...



Got it. Best of luck.


----------



## Delat

Arrived today - cute little bugger. Seems to have more distal taper than I remember from my v1.1 MCX gyuto.

Is the MCX stamp new as well?


----------



## tally-ho

Delat said:


> Is the MCX stamp new as well?


Kind of new but it dates back to the new edition of his classic honyaki sold in June 2022.


----------



## moderncooking

So, I know that this thread has somewhat become the "Fredrik Spåre Impressions" thread, but I believe it is also the only place that MCX is really discussed and so....

Tonight 8pm CEST we will be making available 4 new MCX knives. These 4 are forged by Jonas Johnsson aka isasmedjan. Details are on this IG post

 

Ill also do a quick shout out on the Newsletter to make sure that everyone gets a shot at them, but there will be only 4 pieces


----------



## timebard

Delat said:


> Arrived today - cute little bugger. Seems to have more distal taper than I remember from my v1.1 MCX gyuto.
> 
> Is the MCX stamp new as well?
> 
> View attachment 198943


How's the grind compare to your older gyuto?



moderncooking said:


> So, I know that this thread has somewhat become the "Fredrik Spåre Impressions" thread, but I believe it is also the only place that MCX is really discussed and so....
> 
> Tonight 8pm CEST we will be making available 4 new MCX knives. These 4 are forged by Jonas Johnsson aka isasmedjan. Details are on this IG post
> 
> 
> 
> Ill also do a quick shout out on the Newsletter to make sure that everyone gets a shot at them, but there will be only 4 pieces




Well that looks pretty sweet... is the price point going to be more like prior MCX releases, Isasmedjan's usual price range, somewhere in the middle?


----------



## xsmx13

Damn, sold out while I was dicking around going back to switch the currency. I should known better. Excited to see more of these in the future. Can you get Jonas to keep up with Fredrik's prolific output?


----------



## superworrier

Damn the price was right. Glad I sprung for the in-flight Wi-Fi


----------



## jedy617

Excited to try out some Alex ultra!


----------



## Delat

timebard said:


> How's the grind compare to your older gyuto?



It’s been around 6 months since I had that early MCX, but my initial impression is that the bunka is a touch thinner. It moves through produce a bit easier if memory serves. I captured some video of it just now. The other knife I’m using with the carrots is a Birgersson.





Your browser is not able to display this video.










Your browser is not able to display this video.


----------



## moderncooking

Well that was a blitz! So, I think most of the questions here are now already answered. There will be more in the future for those who missed this batch. Might even see some Honyaki if we are lucky


----------



## tcmx3

moderncooking said:


> Well that was a blitz! So, I think most of the questions here are now already answered. There will be more in the future for those who missed this batch. Might even see some Honyaki if we are lucky



Would you be willing to implement a lottery system for releases? Having timed releases is kind of **** from the buyer side, in all honesty. If you could post & let people sign up for a chance, that just feels a lot fairer.

If you are concerned about the implementation lift I am willing to help you evaluate it for free to see what it would really take. We have other SWEs around too, who I suspect would also be willing.


----------



## MSicardCutlery

Kamon has implemented a draw system like that with his knives. He seems to have gotten a lot of positive feedback and plans to continue.


----------



## KAMON Knives

MSicardCutlery said:


> Kamon has implemented a draw system like that with his knives. He seems to have gotten a lot of positive feedback and plans to continue.


Yes lots of positive feedback from the prospective customer side and I'm very happy with it from my end also.

Only negative feedback might be that a guy told me he would much rather put the effort in, make himself stand up at 3am in the night for the drop, and have a higher chance due to beeing fast and having some control about it. I'm supportive of that. I don't like pure luck beeing the best option. But sadly... Apparently... Newsletters aren't sent out simultaneously, but in a certain order more or less one after an other (at least I've been told). So that makes "first come, first serve" kind of unfair right from the get go.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

KAMON Knives said:


> Yes lots of positive feedback from the prospective customer side and I'm very happy with it from my end also.
> 
> Only negative feedback might be that a guy told me he would much rather put the effort in, make himself stand up at 3am in the night for the drop, and have a higher chance due to beeing fast and having some control about it. I'm supportive of that. I don't like pure luck beeing the best option. But sadly... Apparently... Newsletters aren't sent out simultaneously, but in a certain order more or less one after an other (at least I've been told). So that makes "first come, first serve" kind of unfair right from the get go.


Maybe a popular maker like you can open the registration for a draw at a scheduled time, so everyone on newsletters will know about it in advance and be prepared for it. But the registration open window should be super narrow like 1 minute, so only whoever wants it seriously enough to submit their information within 1 minute will be considered. 1 minute should be good enough for a prepared buyer no matter what. Then within this smaller group of buyers who registered, a draw will be performed to eliminate the network or how-fast-they-can-type factor.

To make it easier to do, maybe you can post a "ticket" for a draw on your online shop at a scheduled time, with a quantity of 10 or whatever appropriate, so only the fastest 10 buyers get a chance to win the draw.


----------



## Migraine

KAMON Knives said:


> Newsletters aren't sent out simultaneously, but in a certain order more or less one after an other (at least I've been told). So that makes "first come, first serve"


This is not a comment on which system I think is better, but I don't think that is true...


----------



## esoo

Migraine said:


> This is not a comment on which system I think is better, but I don't think that is true...



So list software would have two choices - send a mail/person, or a mail/batch. Mail/person would be send one by one. Mail/batch would be sent to the first hop mail as a batch, but then would be send person by person to the people in the batch. Batch sizes need to be limited or many mail servers will drop the traffic as well

So essentially true. Depending on the size of the list, some software would have to send slowly or risk being blacklisted, so a large list could take some time to get through.


----------



## Hockey3081

Migraine said:


> This is not a comment on which system I think is better, but I don't think that is true...



It’s absolutely true.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Maybe a popular maker like you can open the registration for a draw at a scheduled time, so everyone on newsletters will know about it in advance and be prepared for it. But the registration open window should be super narrow like 1 minute, so only whoever wants it seriously enough to submit their information within 1 minute will be considered. 1 minute should be good enough for a prepared buyer no matter what. Then within this smaller group of buyers who registered, a draw will be performed to eliminate the network or how-fast-they-can-type factor.
> 
> To make it easier to do, maybe you can post a "ticket" for a draw on your online shop at a scheduled time, with a quantity of 10 or whatever appropriate, so only the fastest 10 buyers get a chance to win the draw.


That would be a reasonable option for us knife freaks over here in forums and communities like that, but I fear it would be a disadvantage to the "normal" enthusiast. 
I don't mean that rude to either of those two groups, it's just how I try to describe different buyer types. Hope you know what I mean? Cause the "normal" enthusiast will get his name into the 24h bucket, but maybe won't set his timer to a very certain and narrow window of time. It might be just too much to get involved. Plus some guys have a major disadvantage due to their time zone which I found unfair for the longest time with my "first come, first serve" sales. 

I feel like the 24h draw checks most of the boxes that are important to me. But nevertheless I'm very happy for your input as I might change it up one day again. That draw thingy was recommended to me too by someone. I wish I remembered who it was. I'd give the person credit for it .


----------



## esoo

KAMON Knives said:


> That would be a reasonable option for us knife freaks over here in forums and communities like that, but I fear it would be a disadvantage to the "normal" enthusiast.
> I don't mean that rude to either of those two groups, it's just how I try to describe different buyer types. Hope you know what I mean? Cause the "normal" enthusiast will get his name into the 24h bucket, but maybe won't set his timer to a very certain and narrow window of time. It might be just too much to get involved. Plus some guys have a major disadvantage due to their time zone which I found unfair for the longest time with my "first come, first serve" sales.
> 
> I feel like the 24h draw checks most of the boxes that are important to me. But nevertheless I'm very happy for your input as I might change it up one day again. That draw thingy was recommended to me too by someone. I wish I remembered who it was. I'd give the person credit for it .



Bloodroot blades does something similar - at the beginning of the month they send out their newsletter, you get a change to put your name down for as many of the knives are you are interested and then they draw 24 hours later.

I personally think it's so much nicer than having stayed up, gotten the knife into the cart and then lost it to someone else as they enter their details faster.


----------



## Barmoley

KAMON Knives said:


> Yes lots of positive feedback from the prospective customer side and I'm very happy with it from my end also.
> 
> Only negative feedback might be that a guy told me he would much rather put the effort in, make himself stand up at 3am in the night for the drop, and have a higher chance due to beeing fast and having some control about it. I'm supportive of that. I don't like pure luck beeing the best option. But sadly... Apparently... Newsletters aren't sent out simultaneously, but in a certain order more or less one after an other (at least I've been told). So that makes "first come, first serve" kind of unfair right from the get go.


Lottery is the only truly fair way to do this, if that is the goal of course. The way you did it I think is best, giving people a 24h window to enter the drawing. This lowers the chances for each individual vs a shorter window, but making a very short window is unfair given different time zones and life outside of this hobby in general. Since I've been in this hobby for a while I've started to truly detest first come first serve systems. To such a degree that I basically stopped participating almost fully even when the maker and the knife are very interesting to me.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

KAMON Knives said:


> That would be a reasonable option for us knife freaks over here in forums and communities like that, but I fear it would be a disadvantage to the "normal" enthusiast.
> I don't mean that rude to either of those two groups, it's just how I try to describe different buyer types. Hope you know what I mean? Cause the "normal" enthusiast will get his name into the 24h bucket, but maybe won't set his timer to a very certain and narrow window of time. It might be just too much to get involved. Plus some guys have a major disadvantage due to their time zone which I found unfair for the longest time with my "first come, first serve" sales.
> 
> I feel like the 24h draw checks most of the boxes that are important to me. But nevertheless I'm very happy for your input as I might change it up one day again. That draw thingy was recommended to me too by someone. I wish I remembered who it was. I'd give the person credit for it .


Fair enough. It's comforting to see makers trying to make it fairer to everyone, given how often I lose the clicking battle.

Regarding time zone difference, I think you can kinda take care of that by posting maybe 5 tickets every 6 hours for 24 hours. I personally believe in market economy and I do think whoever pays it more deserves the knife, either via money or time/energy/attention. Having a 24-hour window is a good way to make sure everyone gets a chance, but I feel like given how popular your knife is, it is still too "easy" to some buyers who don't want it as badly as we do. I'm saying that probably because I think "fastest 10" gives me the best chance to win it. LOL


----------



## superworrier

Never participated in a lottery but the thing I dislike the most is random drops or drops not announced 24h before, mainly because of timezones. I got one of Isas by waking up at 4am. Maybe I would be saltier if I missed but I would’ve had 0 chance if it was not pre announced.


----------



## DrEriksson

KAMON Knives said:


> Yes lots of positive feedback from the prospective customer side and I'm very happy with it from my end also.
> 
> Only negative feedback might be that a guy told me he would much rather put the effort in, make himself stand up at 3am in the night for the drop, and have a higher chance due to beeing fast and having some control about it. I'm supportive of that. I don't like pure luck beeing the best option. But sadly... Apparently... Newsletters aren't sent out simultaneously, but in a certain order more or less one after an other (at least I've been told). So that makes "first come, first serve" kind of unfair right from the get go.



On one hand it sucks not being able to just buy any knife any time. However, I hope that enthusiasts can appreciate the fact that some knives are highly sought after and be happy for those makers. After all, as enthusiasts we win some and we lose some. In the grand scheme of things it’s not a big deal for us. And winning some should never come at the expense of causing stress for our makers.


----------



## tcmx3

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Fair enough. It's comforting to see makers trying to make it fairer to everyone, given how often I lose the clicking battle.
> 
> Regarding time zone difference, I think you can kinda take care of that by posting maybe 5 tickets every 6 hours for 24 hours. I personally believe in market economy and I do think whoever pays it more deserves the knife, either via money or time/energy/attention. Having a 24-hour window is a good way to make sure everyone gets a chance, but I feel like given how popular your knife is, it is still too "easy" to some buyers who don't want it as badly as we do. I'm saying that probably because I think "fastest 10" gives me the best chance to win it. LOL



well if we're on the subject of not wanting "the wrong people" to get knives, I just think it's too "easy" for Hz_zzzzzz. Personally I believe in the market economy, and that means if I want to refuse to let Hz_zzzzzz have knives because he's got a really janky perspective, that's just the breaks.

tragic.


----------



## Migraine

Fair enough, my mistake then.


----------



## Hockey3081

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Fair enough. It's comforting to see makers trying to make it fairer to everyone, given how often I lose the clicking battle.
> 
> Regarding time zone difference, I think you can kinda take care of that by posting maybe 5 tickets every 6 hours for 24 hours. I personally believe in market economy and I do think whoever pays it more deserves the knife, either via money or time/energy/attention. Having a 24-hour window is a good way to make sure everyone gets a chance, but I feel like given how popular your knife is, it is still too "easy" to some buyers who don't want it as badly as we do. I'm saying that probably because I think "fastest 10" gives me the best chance to win it. LOL



Respectfully I think you are coming up with solutions for problems that don’t exist. He wants the most people who are interested to get a fair shake at it and 24 hours seems more than fair. Why would he burden himself managing 5 tickets every 6 hours. These guys have families and lives. If you specifically want a Kamon, highly suggest you sign up for his newsletter. My wait ended up being a little over a year due to the Mass Drop, but in the end it was absolutely worth it.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

Hockey3081 said:


> Respectfully I think you are coming up with solutions for problems that don’t exist. He wants the most people who are interested to get a fair shake at it and 24 hours seems more than fair. Why would he burden himself managing 5 tickets every 6 hours. These guys have families and lives. If you specifically want a Kamon, highly suggest you sign up for his newsletter. My wait ended up being a little over a year due to the Mass Drop, but in the end it was absolutely worth it.


I think a seller can schedule some item pages all at once and those will become live at scheduled time automatically. Nobody should need to sit there all day to manage it.

Regarding Kamon, I have the massdrop one as well, so I will not join a clicking battle if any, but if it’s as easy as signing up for a draw in a 24-hour window, I’d still sign up because why not?

My point is I don’t think it’s fair to give everyone an equal chance. Someone might already have 30 Kamons and someone might have none. Someone might want it so badly that he will wake up at 4 am to buy it and someone might just randomly see it and think it’s nice to have. I feel happy for everyone who manages to get a Kamon, but I don’t think the satisfaction or utility a Kamon generates is equal to everyone. In other words, I don’t think the disappointment one gets from losing a Kamon draw is equal to everyone. And I think a pricing mechanism that differentiates buyers’ different level of enthusiasm is more efficient.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> Fair enough. It's comforting to see makers trying to make it fairer to everyone, given how often I lose the clicking battle.
> 
> Regarding time zone difference, I think you can kinda take care of that by posting maybe 5 tickets every 6 hours for 24 hours. I personally believe in market economy and I do think whoever pays it more deserves the knife, either via money or time/energy/attention. Having a 24-hour window is a good way to make sure everyone gets a chance, but I feel like given how popular your knife is, it is still too "easy" to some buyers who don't want it as badly as we do. I'm saying that probably because I think "fastest 10" gives me the best chance to win it. LOL


I'm kinda with you on that, but letting the market alone decide would mean I'd need to auction every knife, I guess? ;p



superworrier said:


> Never participated in a lottery but the thing I dislike the most is random drops or drops not announced 24h before, mainly because of timezones. I got one of Isas by waking up at 4am. Maybe I would be saltier if I missed but I would’ve had 0 chance if it was not pre announced.


I might be able to give a little insight there too as I did more or less random drops in the past. I say more or less because I often times announced that a drop will occur roughly in a certain time span but often wasn't able to announce the exact time. 

So there is a reason for that. I can announce a newsletter and have everything set for it to drop, days or even weeks it advance. When I then advertise for it on social media, the people that newly sign up for it won't get it. At least with my newsletter from WIX it's that way. It takes the mailing list from the time I prepare the newsletter and that's it. New sign ups until it drops won't be included. 
That means that I need to set the drop time manually like ~2h before the actual drop. So that way all new sign ups (except for those within that 2h time span ) will be included. 
Nooow... With little kids and stuff it's not always easy to take out the time in a day to make that newsletter drop happen at exactly a certain time which meant I postponed it to later that day. Let's say I get some time at 21:30 at night and droped it then and right there manually, that meant I need to stay up until I had a buyer. Or now with the 24h bucket system it means that I need to take out the time at 21:30 next day. But I don't really want to work the few minutes in a day I actually have some time for myself sooo... It's complicated .


----------



## xsmx13

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> I think a seller can schedule some item pages all at once and those will become live at scheduled time automatically. Nobody should need to sit there all day to manage it.
> 
> Regarding Kamon, I have the massdrop one as well, so I will not join a clicking battle if any, but if it’s as easy as signing up for a draw in a 24-hour window, I’d still sign up because why not?
> 
> My point is I don’t think it’s fair to give everyone an equal chance. Someone might already have 30 Kamons and someone might have none. Someone might want it so badly that he will wake up at 4 am to buy it and someone might just randomly see it and think it’s nice to have. I feel happy for everyone who manages to get a Kamon, but I don’t think the satisfaction or utility a Kamon generates is equal to everyone. In other words, I don’t think the disappointment one gets from losing a Kamon draw is equal to everyone. And I think a pricing mechanism that differentiates buyers’ different level of enthusiasm is more efficient.



No offense, this doesn't hold water for me. The Kamon knives and other similarly popular makers have knives hang around for seconds, not hours. No one is going to randomly happen across one of these highly sought after makers' work after it has gone unsold for a day or two. 

Also, I don't think pricing mechanism makes sense in differentiating enthusiasm. Just because I can afford a high end knife that equates to 1-2 days of take home pay doesn't mean that my enthusiasm for it is any greater than someone making $25.00 an hour who has to save up for it. 

At the end of the day these makers/artists get to choose how they sell their craft and at what price, but I applaud those who try and give everyone a chance at them rather than making price the only driver. In this case I think Spåre and Kamon are taking their own approaches to doing that (and I am one of those waiting for my custom since last year). I can miss out on massdrops, newsletter raffles again and again till I get my dream Kamon knife, but even if it makes me scream with the excitement of my three year old daughter, I don't merit one more than anyone else.


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

xsmx13 said:


> No offense, this doesn't hold water for me. The Kamon knives and other similarly popular makers have knives hang around for seconds, not hours. No one is going to randomly happen across one of these highly sought after makers' work after it has gone unsold for a day or two.


My comment was on the 24-hour draw, not on the regular first come first sell drop. 24-hour draw will give everyone who’s interested an equal chance to win no matter how big their interest is, no?



KAMON Knives said:


> I'm kinda with you on that, but letting the market alone decide would mean I'd need to auction every knife, I guess? ;p


To be honest, I’m not against the idea of auction no matter if I can afford it or not. There are a lot of good stuff in the world that I can’t afford and I hope you get most out of your work. Many makers do auctions on Instagram and Kramer even has his own club for it and no one is blaming them for doing it.

I think you are being generous by charging a lot less than the market perceived value of your work.


----------



## xsmx13

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> My comment was on the 24-hour draw, not on the regular first come first sell drop. 24-hour draw will give everyone who’s interested an equal chance to win no matter how big their interest is, no?



As was mine and the statement still holds true imo. The person getting off a shift at a restaurant late at night (or is around the globe) has just as much chance to get it as the person who has the luxury of easy access to their phone and computer all day too. People who aren't as interested probably aren't following the newsletter and social media like a hawk to get in on every short window offered, thereby giving greater chance to those who are. I don't think we're going to agree on this, but a world with opposing views is a good thing.


----------



## JanSubrt

I got a knife from kamon newsletter when it was first come first served based. And yes I did put the effort in. I also managed to get 2 MCX knives as well.

But I’m very glad kamon uses lottery/24h system now. It is more fair and far less demanding, for all parties involved. 

My wish is that more makers/retailers would use similar system.


----------



## Delat

Love the 24 hour lottery @KAMON Knives! And I should mention I always enjoy and appreciate your posts on Instagram as well.

And @moderncooking please pass my best wishes on to Frederick and let him know that I’m enjoying my MCX bunka (that was me with the unboxing reel on IG).


----------



## jedy617

Lottery makes sense for something like a konosuke Fujiyama Kaiju or vintage carbon which many more people go for, and are worth way more on the secondary. Sorry guys but just get a bit faster if you want an mcx. Compared to pocket knife drops and sneaker drops they really don't go all that fast. I thought I was slow on the apex ultra and still got it. @moderncooking does it right. He gives a heads up a few hours before the drop. I wouldn't like it if there was little to no notification, but there is plenty of time to get ready.


----------



## jedy617

For what it's worth, for really hot products I do like the way that one maker I know does it. He has book spots for example, and the first 5 spots are first come first serve, and the rest are a 24 hour lotto. Best of both worlds in my opinion.


----------



## Barmoley

jedy617 said:


> Lottery makes sense for something like a konosuke Fujiyama Kaiju or vintage carbon which many more people go for, and are worth way more on the secondary. Sorry guys but just get a bit faster if you want an mcx. Compared to pocket knife drops and sneaker drops they really don't go all that fast. I thought I was slow on the apex ultra and still got it. @moderncooking does it right. He gives a heads up a few hours before the drop. I wouldn't like it if there was little to no notification, but there is plenty of time to get ready.


How fast did Isasmedjan last 4 went? Minutes, seconds? They were gone 3 minutes into it. Given different time zones and people having lives lottery is the only fair option. Not saying it should be fair, but if the goal is to be fair than lottery is it. Otherwise we already have a perfect mechanism for luxury items, price. Increase the price to the point where items last hours not minutes and retailers and makers benefit the most assuming retailer is passing on some of the profit. Of course then it is not "fair" to most that can't afford it, but why should it be? So depends on what the seller's goals are, being fair to all buyers, maximizing profits, selling quickly, etc. With first come first serve the seller prioritizes buyers with more time vs buyers with more money that's all. I think Kamon and bloodroot blades do it right, they set the price and let anyone who wants participate. Doing it the way many popular makers do it where their stuff sells in seconds is an indication that either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their products. To me it feels like it is the first one, since it should be pretty clear to them after the first few sales that the prices are too low. In any case sellers can do what they want and buyers can choose which hoops to jump through to get the knives and how much they want to spend. Fortunately, these days there are many, many excellent options.


----------



## jedy617

Barmoley said:


> How fast did Isasmedjan last 4 went? Minutes, seconds? They were gone 3 minutes into it. Given different time zones and people having lives lottery is the only fair option. Not saying it should be fair, but of the goal is to be fair than lottery is it. Otherwise we already have a perfect mechanism for luxury items, price. Increase the price to the point where items last hours not minutes and retailers and makers benefit the most assuming retailer is passing on some of the profit. Of course then it is not "fair" to most that can't afford it, but why should it be? So depends on what the seller's goals are, being fair to all buyers, maximizing profits, selling quickly, etc. With first come first serve the seller prioritizes buyers with more time vs buyers with more money that's all. I think Kamon and bloodroot blades do it right, they set the price and let anyone who wants participate. Doing it the way many popular makers do it where their stuff sells in seconds is an indication that either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their products. To me it feels like it is the first one, since it should be pretty clear to them after the first few sales that the prices are too low. In any case sellers can do what they want and buyers can choose which hoops to jump through to get the knives and how much they want to spend. Fortunately, these days there are many, many excellent options.


Probably sold out in a minute? With hyped pocket knives they go in 5-10 seconds and that's not hyperbole. So that's why I laugh as a pocket knife collector here man. It's just like...get faster. This stuff is slow. You don't want it that bad if you didn't get one. Different time zones? Wake up early. Try and go on break during the drop time. Hell I was in the car when it happened this past drop. I wouldn't complain if I wasn't able to get it.

It was a Saturday afternoon. Best time when most are off. You want to get one but you are absolutely indisposed with no other options? Ask a friend. I've done that too. I've gotten in on a drop on airplane wifi like someone here.

First come first serve should be rewarded, they want it more. Lottery is also good though for those indisposed with no other choice. That's why I like a mix like I mentioned


----------



## jedy617

For the pandemic like I waited 2 years on lottery for a graphics card. Piss off with that. With a high end maker like kamon it would be the same. At least with a drop I can actively do something that rewards me wanting it more than someone else. Lottos are also popular with high end pocket knives. Half the time the people picked usually flip them for double when they win regardless, or really aren't super into the hobby but they get the best instead of me who is super into it. Like no. Reward the dedication and the effort.


----------



## Hockey3081

jedy617 said:


> For the pandemic like I waited 2 years on lottery for a graphics card. Piss off with that. With a high end maker like kamon it would be the same. At least with a drop I can actively do something that rewards me wanting it more than someone else. Lottos are also popular with high end pocket knives. Half the time the people picked usually flip them for double when they win regardless, or really aren't super into the hobby but they get the best instead of me who is super into it. Like no. Reward the dedication and the effort.



This is how I feel about sneakers with the flips, but the lottos at least least give me a chance against the bots (I know they’re still there) versus the quickness of the draw against the bots. The difference for a Kamon or MCX, at least in my mind, is that people who buy them don’t have a crazy margin for flipping. More likely a Kamon but he’s not saturating the market with newsletter drops so there’s not many to flip if that was the case.


----------



## jedy617

Hockey3081 said:


> This is how I feel about sneakers with the flips, but the lottos at least least give me a chance against the bots (I know they’re still there) versus the quickness of the draw against the bots. The difference for a Kamon or MCX, at least in my mind, is that people who buy them don’t have a crazy margin for flipping. More likely a Kamon but he’s not saturating the market with newsletter drops so there’s not many to flip if that was the case.


Yep. I know the crazy stuff like the Kaiju is definitely going to be botted. For that, lotto, no hesitation. But man that's not happening with MCX for a spare or an isas lol. Just get good.


----------



## jedy617

Like Mr. Barlomey, there was a pocket knife lotto a few days ago. I really REALLY wanted it, from a maker I have been collecting from for years. This was the best config I've seen. It was a lotto, and one guy who won at zero sign of being a collector from his instagram, and the other is a collector I know very well. He does not like this makers knives. He has a very large income and buys anything that's available, and just entered this for the fun of it because he can. Now it will sit in a collection case of 50 pieces never to see the light of day. Why is that more fair when I can do my all to try and win it by first come first serve, and I am pitted against others who have that same desire?

I wanted a Halcyon forge for awhile, and missed like 5 first come first serve drops in a row, tried hard but was not fast enough. I never complained after not snagging one. I finally did because I was quickest and now I'm happy. 

Another thing at least for newsletter stuff like Kamon....I know makers who draw makers choice only. Not sure if Kamon does that, but what if you are picked for a knife you don't like? Then I used all my luck and I get pulled for something that isn't what I wanted anyway, and gotta wait another couple of years if I'm lucky to get another shot at something I'm not sure I want?


----------



## esoo

So Fredrik has sent out his plan to help speed things up, which seems well thought out to allow him to group stuff together.

As I was asking him for a nakiri, which isn't one of the options, I will now need to decide what to do.


----------



## jedy617

esoo said:


> So Fredrik has sent out his plan to help speed things up, which seems well thought out to allow him to group stuff together.
> 
> As I was asking him for a nakiri, which isn't one of the options, I will now need to decide what to do.


I did not get anything...where did he send this out?


----------



## Smidderton

all true, but isn't this getting a little off-topic? could get a seperate thread....


----------



## esoo

jedy617 said:


> I did not get anything...where did he send this out?



The message arrived in my mailbox at 2:03pm today.


----------



## BillHanna

jedy617 said:


> I did not get anything...where did he send this out?


Same.


----------



## jedy617

Smidderton said:


> all true, but isn't this getting a little off-topic? could get a seperate thread....


Yep, we can move on.


----------



## jedy617

esoo said:


> The message arrived in my mailbox at 2:03pm today.


Instagram or email? I never signed up for an email listing, just been dming with Fredrik for the past year.


----------



## esoo

jedy617 said:


> Instagram or email? I never signed up for an email listing, just been dming with Fredrik for the past year.



Email - I'd always communicated with him that way.


----------



## Hockey3081

esoo said:


> Email - I'd always communicated with him that way.



Is it a pretty generic email that you’re able to post? I didn’t get anything either.


----------



## BillHanna

Maybe he's just emailing his waitlist?


----------



## DrEriksson

BillHanna said:


> Maybe he's just emailing his waitlist?



Yes. It went out to people who have already placed orders.

Edit: People that were in the books, might be more correct.


----------



## Hockey3081

BillHanna said:


> Maybe he's just emailing his waitlist?



I had sent him my email back in November when we finalized. Odd.


----------



## jedy617

I guess I'll message him


----------



## Delat

Hockey3081 said:


> I had sent him my email back in November when we finalized. Odd.



Here’s the email from Frederick: 

TLDR; I apologize for the wait and lack of communication. Please fill in the form below to help me speed up deliveries.

Hello!

You are receiving this email because you are currently in my order book for a custom knife.

You have waited for your knife longer than you expected and longer than I intended. I apologize for this delay. Several customers have reached out asking for an update and I have not been able to respond. I apologize for not being better at communicating. 

Recently I have had some big changes in my personal life, resulting in more obligations and also more expenses. This has resulted in me turning more and more towards working with retailers because there is some stability in that compared to custom orders. Whilst that is generally a good thing, the backside is that the custom order list has suffered. I work alone in all aspects of my business and emails and messages have unfortunately taken a back seat while I have been working in the forge. 

For the delays and shortcomings in communication you have my sincerest apology. 

I hope that the solution I am offering here is to your liking. It will reduce waiting times and help me create a more sustainable work situation.

I have put together a simplified order form where you can choose between my most commonly ordered models and materials. Models and materials are selected since they allow me to deliver the best product possible. While the options are somewhat limited they still overlap with the vast majority of the custom orders I make.

With the help of the order form I will be able to produce in small batches, increasing efficiency and reducing lead times. Payment will still be due once the knife is ready to ship.

If simplified order sounds like a good alternative, please fill out the form:

PLEASE FILL OUT THIS FORM [link deleted since it has my email preloaded]

If you don’t feel comfortable with the order form and wish to stay on the custom list that is also possible. For the reasons given above I will not be able to fulfill custom orders as quickly as I initially thought. For custom orders please expect 12-24 months waiting times, perhaps more.

Should you find the options above unacceptable there is no obligation to remain on the waiting list. You still have my sincerest apology for not being able to deliver as I first expected. It would help the others on the waiting list, and me, if you could reply and let me know that you’re out.

Lastly, I would like to give you all a heartfelt thank you for supporting me and my knife making. I am very grateful for all the support you all have shown me.

Best wishes,
Fredrik


----------



## jedy617

Hey everyone, check your spam. I never signed up for an email list but I got an email in my spam.

Fredrik is not doing anything I like for the options. I will attach them below. Not exactly sure what I will do now. I'm fine with his solution to do some batches to get caught up as there is no other way...but my order was just very different.


----------



## KAMON Knives

Barmoley said:


> Otherwise we already have a perfect mechanism for luxury items, price. Increase the price to the point where items last hours not minutes and retailers and makers benefit the most assuming retailer is passing on some of the profit. Of course then it is not "fair" to most that can't afford it, but why should it be? So depends on what the seller's goals are, being fair to all buyers, maximizing profits, selling quickly, etc. With first come first serve the seller prioritizes buyers with more time vs buyers with more money that's all. I think Kamon and bloodroot blades do it right, they set the price and let anyone who wants participate. Doing it the way many popular makers do it where their stuff sells in seconds is an indication that either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their products. To me it feels like it is the first one, since it should be pretty clear to them after the first few sales that the prices are too low. In any case sellers can do what they want and buyers can choose which hoops to jump through to get the knives and how much they want to spend. Fortunately, these days there are many, many excellent options.



So I want to say a few words especially about that part "either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their product." 

It's true. I think I would be able to raise the price of my knives by a lot and still find buyers. I can't speak for others with certainty but at least I think that's true for many other knife makers as well. 
However I believe raising the prices is kind of a one way road which I'm not ready to risk going down at this point. 
The wet dream of every knife maker is probably to ask Kramer like prices for every single knife they sell. But imagine the market for that beeing saturated some day for whatever reason. Could be bad or no marketing, could be that people just lost their general interest or whatever. Just a thought experiment. It's a fact that you're not really competitive in such a price range, asking prices far above any competition. So what happens then? You can't just roll the prices back and sell your 25k knives for 2k again. It will look fishy. No one will understand how that is possible and either think you've been a fraud for asking the higher prices back then, or think that you're a fraud now, but anyways it won't be perceived as fitting up. 
I mean that's just a vastly overdrawn example but it's essentially the problem I have also. Raising the prices gets me into another section of potential buyers and I might not have enough of those. The truth is I don't know. But it's a conscious decision not to risk it. I'd much rather sustain a business on a "lower" level than my potential could possibly allow, but with less risk of failure than the other way around. 
I think about it a lot though, because the reality of things is that every cent I don't ask more for my knives, even though I potentially could, is a cent that's missing in my kids pockets, or for that matter time missing I could spend with them. "Time equals money" is a very true concept for small businesses like us knife makers. Sorry all you guys... I like all of you, the community, a lot but my kids come before you. 
So yeah... It's conscious decision to keep the prices low, competitive, attractive... However you want to put it, but I'm no charity. If I theoretically had the knowledge that asking Kramer prices would work out 100% until I'm an old man, I'd totally do it like yesterday. No offense you guys . 



jedy617 said:


> For the pandemic like I waited 2 years on lottery for a graphics card. Piss off with that. With a high end maker like kamon it would be the same. At least with a drop I can actively do something that rewards me wanting it more than someone else. Lottos are also popular with high end pocket knives. Half the time the people picked usually flip them for double when they win regardless, or really aren't super into the hobby but they get the best instead of me who is super into it. Like no. Reward the dedication and the effort.



As I said, I prefer taking things into my own hands and putting the effort in to raise my chances also. But since the emails don't arrive with everyone at the same time the game is rigged right at the beginning. 
If it was at least randomly rigged I wouldn't care but I don't know that. It might as well be, and actually I suspect it beeing, that the first person that ever signed up for my newsletter gets the first email and the last one gets the last email. 
It's not in your control at all then anymore, even if you put the effort in. You might have put the most effort in of every prospect customer participating but it won't help you if you get the email a minute later than the first few guys. That's one of the main reasons why I use the 24h draw now.


----------



## jedy617

KAMON Knives said:


> So I want to say a few words especially about that part "either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their product."
> 
> It's true. I think I would be able to raise the price of my knives by a lot and still find buyers. I can't speak for others with certainty but at least I think that's true for many other knife makers as well.
> However I believe raising the prices is kind of a one way road which I'm not ready to risk going down at this point.
> The wet dream of every knife maker is probably to ask Kramer like prices for every single knife they sell. But imagine the market for that beeing saturated some day for whatever reason. Could be bad or no marketing, could be that people just lost their general interest or whatever. Just a thought experiment. It's a fact that you're not really competitive in such a price range, asking prices far above any competition. So what happens then? You can't just roll the prices back and sell your 25k knives for 2k again. It will look fishy. No one will understand how that is possible and either think you've been a fraud for asking the higher prices back then, or think that you're a fraud now, but anyways it won't be perceived as fitting up.
> I mean that's just a vastly overdrawn example but it's essentially the problem I have also. Raising the prices gets me into another section of potential buyers and I might not have enough of those. The truth is I don't know. But it's a conscious decision not to risk it. I'd much rather sustain a business on a "lower" level than my potential could possibly allow, but with less risk of failure than the other way around.
> I think about it a lot though, because the reality of things is that every cent I don't ask more for my knives, even though I potentially could, is a cent that's missing in my kids pockets, or for that matter time missing I could spend with them. "Time equals money" is a very true concept for small businesses like us knife makers. Sorry all you guys... I like all of you, the community, a lot but my kids come before you.
> So yeah... It's conscious decision to keep the prices low, competitive, attractive... However you want to put it, but I'm no charity. If I theoretically had the knowledge that asking Kramer prices would work out 100% until I'm an old man, I'd totally do it like yesterday. No offense you guys .
> 
> 
> 
> As I said, I prefer taking things into my own hands and putting the effort in to raise my chances also. But since the emails don't arrive with everyone at the same time the game is rigged right at the beginning.
> If it was at least randomly rigged I wouldn't care but I don't know that. It might as well be, and actually I suspect it beeing, that the first person that ever signed up for my newsletter gets the first email and the last one gets the last email.
> It's not in your control at all then anymore, even if you put the effort in. You might have put the most effort in of every prospect customer participating but it won't help you if you get the email a minute later than the first few guys. That's one of the main reasons why I use the 24h draw now.


What do you personally think of lottery, and a mix of first come first serve like on your website? Just out of curiosity in general, I'm not into your stuff for the most part. Your stuff looks AMAZING by the way quality wise, just not my aesthetic taste, probably because I don't like KU finishes and dents...maybe one day I'd be lucky enough to get a full satin/polished/dama/kasumi of yours though!


----------



## DrEriksson

@KAMON Knives Have you considered differentiation? For some buyers you are certainly losing money, but increasing all prices will reduce the customer base (assuming the demand curve is not strange, as with some luxury products). What is commonly done in other businesses is to adopt price discrimination. For example, increased flight prices for late bookings or business class, or different rates to cross a bridge for cars vs trucks. 

In the knife world this can be seen with, for example, Tansu/HVB. So are there any crazy or premium ideas you’ve been considering? And would you be able to sell those at perhaps double the price? The ideas doesn’t even have to be crazy, could be to differentiate between drops and custom orders, where fully custom are 1.5-2x the price. With such options you’d never have to roll back prices if demand drops. You can just continue with the “regular” line.


----------



## jedy617

DrEriksson said:


> @KAMON Knives Have you considered differentiation? For some buyers you are certainly losing money, but increasing all prices will reduce the customer base (assuming the demand curve is not strange, as with some luxury products). What is commonly done in other businesses is to adopt price discrimination. For example, increased flight prices for late bookings or business class, or different rates to cross a bridge for cars vs trucks.
> 
> In the knife world this can be seen with, for example, Tansu/HVB. So are there any crazy or premium ideas you’ve been considering? And would you be able to sell those at perhaps double the price? The ideas doesn’t even have to be crazy, could be to differentiate between drops and custom orders, where fully custom are 1.5-2x the price. With such options you’d never have to roll back prices if demand drops. You can just continue with the “regular” line.


I love the idea of tansus HVB line.


----------



## Hockey3081

How did this thread devolve into telling knifemakers how to run their businesses?


----------



## jedy617

Hockey3081 said:


> How did this thread devolve into telling knifemakers how to run this businesses?


I can give you the TLDR. We've all been waiting on custom spare knives that were quoted 3 months and they have been more than a year.

After that, we were talking about the role of retailers like modern cooking in their hand with selling knives and it being great but they also increase or wait time.

So with that we got talking about mcx. And then people being upset how fast they sell out. And then we talked about makers should sell, lotto or first come first serve.


----------



## DrEriksson

jedy617 said:


> I can give you the TLDR…



How did this thread devolve into summarizing the thread for other users?


----------



## jedy617

DrEriksson said:


> How did this thread devolve into summarizing the thread for other users?


How did this thread devolve into summarizing the summarizing of the thread for other users


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

I’m not on Fredrik’s list and I feel sorry for those who have waited for way longer than expected, but the good side is his skills are getting better, so you are getting a better knife. I have the MCX Apex Ultra knife, and the thickness of grind behind the edge is much thinner than what Tostadas reported in November 2021. He reported 0.25mm/0.7mm/1.1mm at 1mm/5mm/10mm above the edge at midpoint. Mine from the recent drop measures more like 0.11mm/0.65mm/1.3mm at midpoint. From 0.25 to 0.11 is a huge improvement on cutting performance I would say. The wait is not worth nothing, so I hope that makes you feel better.

Regarding this knife, it is straight, reasonably tapered/ground and reasonably balanced between knife and handle. The tip is thin and useful. The profile is nice and natural to use. It also looks nice. I don’t necessarily like the white-ish ferrule but other than that it is flawless. For 300-400 euro this is such a better value than many popular knives out there.

By the way, the good things about Apex Ultra steel is real. It feels very creamy on stones, almost like my white2/white3 honyakis. People say it’s like 52100 but it doesn’t have the little stickiness of 52100 on stones. I tried Chosera 800/3000 and a Jnat and it reacts to them really well. And I feel like it holds its initial sharpness as well as Denka. Still cuts paper towel after 4 meals (various vegetables and meats). Not as smooth as initially but still enjoyable. It’s hard to tell exactly how good it is compared to aogami super as I don’t have tons of food to cut, but it definitely holds it edge noticeably better than white steels and 52100. I feel minimal change on the “refined yet toothy” edge after dicing a few tomatoes and green peppers. Denka edge is more like “toothy yet refined”.


----------



## Barmoley

Hockey3081 said:


> How did this thread devolve into telling knifemakers how to run their businesses?


You guys misunderstood. We didn’t and don’t tell makers how to sell their knives. It is totally up to them. We are enthusiasts and we are discussing our preferences and what we would like to see in our hobby. This includes our preferences on how hard to get knives are sold. @tcmx3 made a good suggestion that works for some companies and makers, but it is just a suggestion that no one has to follow. @KAMON Knives is already doing this and I am very glad he does, but if he decides to change how he sells, more power to him. Ben’s knives are great, speaking from experience with 5 of his knives, and however he decides to sell I hope it works for him and his family. Many western makers have said through out the years that they want anyone to have an equal chance to get their knives. The only fair way to do this is a lottery, this gives anyone who can afford the knives in the first place an equal chance to participate. Being fair doesn’t have to be the goal in the first place, but if it is then the solution is as stated.

Getting back to MCX Spare knives, I’ve had experience with 2 of them the original honyaki and apex ultra. You really get a lot for your money with these knives. The only slight negative for me is that the necks are a bit short, this is pure preference so not a big deal. I hope Fredrik digs himself out and continues to produce high quality, reasonably priced knives. At the end of the day he has to be able to support himself and his family and enjoy what he does. No one here will really suffer if we miss out on the knife we want, but for a maker a lot more is at stake, so let’s be reasonable.


----------



## e30Birdy

I think the release at a time and date system is super fair as other systems people have been severely abused by bots and having a ton of accounts.

I am in the higher end coffee game and i mean try getting a Monolith grinder, it's like you have to know someone in order to get a drop, i have friends been waiting years to finally get one. It's just part of the game to get up at 3 or 4am to play along. There are quite a few things in coffee that work that way. Usually it is the super high-end grinders though.. like i would kill for a nautilus but ain't ever gonna get lucky enough to snag one so I grabbed a Bentwood and I am happy.


----------



## jedy617

e30Birdy said:


> I think the release at a time and date system is super fair as other systems people have been severely abused by bots and having a ton of accounts.
> 
> I am in the higher end coffee game and i mean try getting a Monolith grinder, it's like you have to know someone in order to get a drop, i have friends been waiting years to finally get one. It's just part of the game to get up at 3 or 4am to play along. There are quite a few things in coffee that work that way. Usually it is the super high-end grinders though.. like i would kill for a nautilus but ain't ever gonna get lucky enough to snag one so I grabbed a Bentwood and I am happy.


Also a coffee boi, but I'm just here with my eureka specialita. Dang didn't know they did that for grinders thats crazy. Yep for a nautilus or for a sports rolex, you gotta know someone, or wait for 5 years, or buy tons of inventory to be considered. We have it GOOD here with drops haha


----------



## moderncooking

Ok, so I know I have been very quiet on this. I have been rolling this around in my mind for the past 24hrs or so. Most of you who know me know that I am always keen to find the fairest system for doing these drops, but I am just not convinced that the lottery is the best for a retail store. Knife makers, selling via a newsletter, sure. I think for the likes of @KAMON Knives its perfect, but he is addressing one pool of customers (His Newsletter).

For a retail store like Modern Cooking, we have IG, Newsletter and customers simply visiting the site. The lottery concept isolates the opportunity to buy to those on the Newsletter or perhaps, if we post it out on IG, those people there also.

From my perspective, I send out an email with a date and time for the release (Usually several hours before and sometime longer). This prior notice element addresses the issue of emails being delivered in staggered intervals. Then its first in best dressed or the fastest and luckiest wins. For me this is kinda equal to a lottery in that luck is what drives the win. We offer this early notice to our Newsletter subscribers as we see those people as the customers who support us the most and we want to show our gratitude for that support, but we do not wish to exclude our other potential customers. Usually, we will only announce the drop on IG at the exact release time. Newsletter subscribers will get several hours additional notice. Sometimes, I will also, as a tip of the hat to the KKF members, announce a release here.

There are a couple of issue with this system though. Time zones for example. To address this I think I will, in future, stagger the timing of my releases to hit a different time zone each time I do a release. This will not make every drop totally equal, but this way I can spread the love a little more evenly.

Not sure about the bots, but I haven’t seen any evidence from our side that this is happening with our releases. If someone who know more about this or knows that it is happening with Modern Cooking releases has some advise or info, please get in touch.

*Getting back to more interesting news. I have another batch of Jonas Johnsson MCX Knives coming this weekend and with a bit of luck a second MCX Fredrik Spåre Apex Gyuto drop coming next week.*


----------



## Delat

It’s funny, my wife still doesn’t quite understand why she can’t just buy me a knife for my birthday.

Wife: “Can I buy you a knife for your birthday?”
Me: “Yes, but not really. Kinda sorta. I can try to score one maybe this year or next. But yeah, I appreciate the thought.”
Wife: “Whatever, you weirdo.”
[Random knife arrives in the mail on some random day at any point]: Wife: “Happy birthday! What’d I get you?”


----------



## Whit3Nitro

Delat said:


> It’s funny, my wife still doesn’t quite understand why she can’t just buy me a knife for my birthday.
> 
> Wife: “Can I buy you a knife for your birthday?”
> Me: “Yes, but not really. Kinda sorta. I can try to score one maybe this year or next. But yeah, I appreciate the thought.”
> Wife: “Whatever, you weirdo.”
> [Random knife arrives in the mail on some random day at any point]: Wife: “Happy birthday! What’d I get you?”



I had a good chuckle at this. My wife has offered to buy me a knife for Christmas and we had a very similar conversation.


----------



## xsmx13

moderncooking said:


> *Getting back to more interesting news. I have another batch of Jonas Johnsson MCX Knives coming this weekend and with a bit of luck a second MCX Fredrik Spåre Apex Gyuto drop coming next week.*



Are these the same as the previous batches or will there be variations in profile or handles?


----------



## Greenbriel

Delat said:


> It’s funny, my wife still doesn’t quite understand why she can’t just buy me a knife for my birthday.
> 
> Wife: “Can I buy you a knife for your birthday?”
> Me: “Yes, but not really. Kinda sorta. I can try to score one maybe this year or next. But yeah, I appreciate the thought.”
> Wife: “Whatever, you weirdo.”
> [Random knife arrives in the mail on some random day at any point]: Wife: “Happy birthday! What’d I get you?”





Whit3Nitro said:


> I had a good chuckle at this. My wife has offered to buy me a knife for Christmas and we had a very similar conversation.


Me too. 

At this point, given my years of highly-focussed hobbies, my wife, bless her and her tolerance, doesn't bother asking any more.


----------



## Matt Jacobs

My MCX bunka showed up today. Quick first thoughts. Love the packaging, simple but safe and shipping was really fast. Fit and finish is really good. Rounded spine and choil, handle fit is perfect. Balance is about perfect although aesthetically speaking, I'd probably like the handle about a half inch shorter. The out of the box edge was really good. Very clearly cut through paper towel and had a nice bite. I am a big fan of the steel choice. The profile is really well done. Pretty much flat a little bit of a curve at the tip but doesn't come to a flat stop when rocking. The distal taper is really nice and the tip is very thin and flexible. If I was to do a custom knife I would wanted a little thinner behind the edge, but it's pretty good for a knife that could get sold to non-nife people. I only cut one onion so far. Not the best I've had on vertical slices, but more than adequate and the brute de forge finish kept the onions falling off the knife instead of rolling over it. My only questionable aspects to this, It's a touch smaller than 190. Not a big deal but I think I expected it to be a little bit larger. I find the birch spacer to be a little too small. If it was two or three times the size I think it would stand out and be gorgeous. As is it kind of looks like an afterthought. The handle itself though I think is fantastic. I really like how it's rounded and contours your hand nicely but still has a nice look on top with clean crisp lines. Overall, this was a very good purchase, I look forward to more MCX down the road. FYI, there's still two left if anyone's interested


----------



## Greenbriel

Matt Jacobs said:


> My MCX bunka showed up today. Quick first thoughts. Love the packaging, simple but safe and shipping was really fast. Fit and finish is really good. Rounded spine and choil, handle fit is perfect. Balance is about perfect although aesthetically speaking, I'd probably like the handle about a half inch shorter. The out of the box edge was really good. Very clearly cut through paper towel and had a nice bite. I am a big fan of the steel choice. The profile is really well done. Pretty much flat a little bit of a curve at the tip but doesn't come to a flat stop when rocking. The distal taper is really nice and the tip is very thin and flexible. If I was to do a custom knife I would wanted a little thinner behind the edge, but it's pretty good for a knife that could get sold to non-nife people. I only cut one onion so far. Not the best I've had on vertical slices, but more than adequate and the brute de forge finish kept the onions falling off the knife instead of rolling over it. My only questionable aspects to this, It's a touch smaller than 190. Not a big deal but I think I expected it to be a little bit larger. I find the birch spacer to be a little too small. If it was two or three times the size I think it would stand out and be gorgeous. As is it kind of looks like an afterthought. The handle itself though I think is fantastic. I really like how it's rounded and contours your hand nicely but still has a nice look on top with clean crisp lines. Overall, this was a very good purchase, I look forward to more MCX down the road. FYI, there's still two left if anyone's interested
> 
> View attachment 199648


Thanks for the great review Matt. I grabbed one the second they went live. @Fredrik Spåre is a master IMO. I love mine (can't believe how much less interest there is in the bunka!) but I might try thinning it a tad.  Also agree the handle is great. It's the only one I have with that profile but it'e very comfortable.

I'm guessing "birch" was an autocorrect for "brass"? I see your point but I think the spacer is part of Fredrik's aesthetic and I like it. I have a BST 220 mm honyaki gyuto from him (actually closer to 230) that immediately became—and has remained—my absolute favorite knife out of 50+ over about 5 years of interest in fancy knives (and 25+ years of interest in "regular" decent kitchen knives).


----------



## tally-ho

Look closer, there's a spacer between the handle and the brass end


----------



## superworrier

KAMON Knives said:


> So I want to say a few words especially about that part "either they want hype to drive sales or that they are grossly underestimating the value of their product."
> 
> It's true. I think I would be able to raise the price of my knives by a lot and still find buyers. I can't speak for others with certainty but at least I think that's true for many other knife makers as well.
> However I believe raising the prices is kind of a one way road which I'm not ready to risk going down at this point.
> The wet dream of every knife maker is probably to ask Kramer like prices for every single knife they sell. But imagine the market for that beeing saturated some day for whatever reason. Could be bad or no marketing, could be that people just lost their general interest or whatever. Just a thought experiment. It's a fact that you're not really competitive in such a price range, asking prices far above any competition. So what happens then? You can't just roll the prices back and sell your 25k knives for 2k again. It will look fishy. No one will understand how that is possible and either think you've been a fraud for asking the higher prices back then, or think that you're a fraud now, but anyways it won't be perceived as fitting up.
> I mean that's just a vastly overdrawn example but it's essentially the problem I have also. Raising the prices gets me into another section of potential buyers and I might not have enough of those. The truth is I don't know. But it's a conscious decision not to risk it. I'd much rather sustain a business on a "lower" level than my potential could possibly allow, but with less risk of failure than the other way around.
> I think about it a lot though, because the reality of things is that every cent I don't ask more for my knives, even though I potentially could, is a cent that's missing in my kids pockets, or for that matter time missing I could spend with them. "Time equals money" is a very true concept for small businesses like us knife makers. Sorry all you guys... I like all of you, the community, a lot but my kids come before you.
> So yeah... It's conscious decision to keep the prices low, competitive, attractive... However you want to put it, but I'm no charity. If I theoretically had the knowledge that asking Kramer prices would work out 100% until I'm an old man, I'd totally do it like yesterday. No offense you guys .
> 
> 
> 
> As I said, I prefer taking things into my own hands and putting the effort in to raise my chances also. But since the emails don't arrive with everyone at the same time the game is rigged right at the beginning.
> If it was at least randomly rigged I wouldn't care but I don't know that. It might as well be, and actually I suspect it beeing, that the first person that ever signed up for my newsletter gets the first email and the last one gets the last email.
> It's not in your control at all then anymore, even if you put the effort in. You might have put the most effort in of every prospect customer participating but it won't help you if you get the email a minute later than the first few guys. That's one of the main reasons why I use the 24h draw now.


Yeah I don’t think raising prices is always the best. There’s a reason why restaurants that have 2 hour waits around the clock keep it that way instead of doubling their prices


----------



## Greenbriel

tally-ho said:


> Look closer, there's a spacer between the handle and the brass end


Oho! Got me out of bed at 3:30 to look at the knife





Interesting, my FS honyaki doesn't have that. Thanks for the info!


----------



## moderncooking

xsmx13 said:


> Are these the same as the previous batches or will there be variations in profile or handles?


These will be the same profile "The Classic" we feel the profile is pretty good at this stage, but as always happy to received feedback on that topic.

Handles will be a new design that is similar to the MCX Jonas Johnsson blades we did last weekend, I hope you like this design. We have been working on this for a while and hopefully it will become somewhat of a standard for us.

The blade finishes will be slightly different, but I am going to keep that bit under my hat.


----------



## Jovidah

Classic being the 50mm height or the taller ones?
And I think you realized by now that people liked the western full tang version?


----------



## WilliamDallas

I’m gonna be the guy who jumps in here and asks.. where can I buy the Bunka?!


----------



## ZeeVee

WilliamDallas said:


> I’m gonna be the guy who jumps in here and asks.. where can I buy the Bunka?!


Here.


----------



## moderncooking

Jovidah said:


> Classic being the 50mm height or the taller ones?
> And I think you realized by now that people liked the western full tang version?



Same as these









MCX | Gyuto Apex Ultra Limited Edition | Modern Cooking


Forged in Sweden by Fredrik Spare and designed in collaboration with Modern Cooking. This design comes as the culmination of years of experience, both in the commercial kitchen as professional chefs and designing, crafting, and maintaining kitchen knives. The knife is light in weight and...




moderncooking.com





Just going to have a different handle and finish.

A full tang version is not on the books for the foreseeable future. We know it was a popular option, especially at that price point, but for Fredrik it was really too much work. Maybe it will come back in the future, but it will certainly be more expensive.


----------



## tcmx3

moderncooking said:


> Ok, so I know I have been very quiet on this. I have been rolling this around in my mind for the past 24hrs or so. Most of you who know me know that I am always keen to find the fairest system for doing these drops, but I am just not convinced that the lottery is the best for a retail store. Knife makers, selling via a newsletter, sure. I think for the likes of @KAMON Knives its perfect, but he is addressing one pool of customers (His Newsletter).
> 
> *For a retail store like Modern Cooking, we have IG, Newsletter and customers simply visiting the site. The lottery concept isolates the opportunity to buy to those on the Newsletter or perhaps, if we post it out on IG, those people there also.*
> 
> From my perspective, I send out an email with a date and time for the release (Usually several hours before and sometime longer). This prior notice element addresses the issue of emails being delivered in staggered intervals. Then its first in best dressed or the fastest and luckiest wins. For me this is kinda equal to a lottery in that luck is what drives the win. We offer this early notice to our Newsletter subscribers as we see those people as the customers who support us the most and we want to show our gratitude for that support, but we do not wish to exclude our other potential customers. Usually, we will only announce the drop on IG at the exact release time. Newsletter subscribers will get several hours additional notice. Sometimes, I will also, as a tip of the hat to the KKF members, announce a release here.
> 
> There are a couple of issue with this system though. Time zones for example. To address this I think I will, in future, stagger the timing of my releases to hit a different time zone each time I do a release. This will not make every drop totally equal, but this way I can spread the love a little more evenly.
> 
> Not sure about the bots, but I haven’t seen any evidence from our side that this is happening with our releases. If someone who know more about this or knows that it is happening with Modern Cooking releases has some advise or info, please get in touch.
> 
> *Getting back to more interesting news. I have another batch of Jonas Johnsson MCX Knives coming this weekend and with a bit of luck a second MCX Fredrik Spåre Apex Gyuto drop coming next week.*



I'm sorry but this is just untrue.

You can run the lottery through your webstore, on a product page. Then, anyone who gets the newsletter, sees it on IG, or just goes to the site, peruses to the product page can sign up. Loads of opportunity for everyone.

I can also assure you that your assertion re fairness of a lottery versus the current system being equivalent in terms of luck is also incorrect. In a lottery system you have very close to a 1/n chance to get to buy the knife, with some caveats. With the current system you have that, but chuck on:

does my timezone align with the drop
does the email get to me quickly, or does it hit my spam filter this one time (asking people to whitelist MC is fine but unrealistic)
does the payment processing system work for me?
do I use/have autocomplete?
does the release actually happen at the correct time
Look I deal with probabilities and time as a profession (ie my work centers around collecting this sort of data and it's ultimate consumption) and if you want my take (though I suppose no one does), it's that a lottery, while not perfect, represents a SIGNIFICANT improvement towards fairness, assuming you care about that.

If you prefer to run a simpler system whereby you don't have to implement and maintain additional site features I'm fine with that but if that's the motivator here I'd prefer you just say as much.


----------



## Jovidah

How much time could he save by simplifying the design a bit? For example a more 'standard' pattern with 2-3 equal sized pins and skipping on the spacers? Because I think you'd lose very little on aesthethics or utlity there while potentially simplifying the handle quite a bit. I can't imagine that just slapping 2 handle scales on a piece of metal is more work than a hidden tang design.


----------



## moderncooking

Jovidah said:


> How much time could he save by simplifying the design a bit? For example a more 'standard' pattern with 2-3 equal sized pins and skipping on the spacers? Because I think you'd lose very little on aesthethics or utlity there while potentially simplifying the handle quite a bit. I can't imagine that just slapping 2 handle scales on a piece of metal is more work than a hidden tang design.



As Fredrik explains it, it's a case of tooling. Naturally, making one or two full tang knives is possible, but his shop is simply not setup for batches of full tangs.

I know for example Tobias Hangler favours producing full tang knives though. So, maybe there is a possibility of a Full Tang MCX Hangler in the future.


----------



## moderncooking

tcmx3 said:


> I'm sorry but this is just untrue.
> 
> You can run the lottery through your webstore, on a product page. Then, anyone who gets the newsletter, sees it on IG, or just goes to the site, peruses to the product page can sign up. Loads of opportunity for everyone.
> 
> I can also assure you that your assertion re fairness of a lottery versus the current system being equivalent in terms of luck is also incorrect. In a lottery system you have very close to a 1/n chance to get to buy the knife, with some caveats. With the current system you have that, but chuck on:
> 
> does my timezone align with the drop
> does the email get to me quickly, or does it hit my spam filter this one time (asking people to whitelist MC is fine but unrealistic)
> does the payment processing system work for me?
> do I use/have autocomplete?
> does the release actually happen at the correct time
> Look I deal with probabilities and time as a profession (ie my work centers around collecting this sort of data and it's ultimate consumption) and if you want my take (though I suppose no one does), it's that a lottery, while not perfect, represents a SIGNIFICANT improvement towards fairness, assuming you care about that.
> 
> If you prefer to run a simpler system whereby you don't have to implement and maintain additional site features I'm fine with that but if that's the motivator here I'd prefer you just say as much.



I admit it, I was only making the comparison between my system and the system @KAMON uses. I had not considered implementing something directly on my site, but it would certainly represent quite a technical challenge for me. I have some pretty ok customisation skills when it comes to web development, but implementing a feature like that would certainly require me to outsource the work and I imagine it would be quite expensive.

I'll certainly keep this suggestion in mind, but you raise a good point in terms of how significant the improvement would be in terms of fairness, especially when weighed against to cost of implementation.

Modern Cooking is a small family owned business. I am the only in house web developer and contrary to popular belief we do not make a fortune doing this. 

I kinda feel a little hurt by your comment. I have no agenda other than to provide a good service, reasonable prices, great products and to feed my family. 

No lying here, just an open discussion between a group of like minded individuals. I really don't see what I would have to gain by lying or attempting to mislead some of my best and most loyal customers. Its certainly not my intention. but I always appreciate the feedback and the suggestions for improvement whether I can make them happen or not


----------



## tcmx3

moderncooking said:


> I admit it, I was only making the comparison between my system and the system @KAMON uses. I had not considered implementing something directly on my site, but it would certainly represent quite a technical challenge for me. I have some pretty ok customisation skills when it comes to web development, but implementing a feature like that would certainly require me to outsource the work and I imagine it would be quite expensive.
> 
> I'll certainly keep this suggestion in mind, but you raise a good point in terms of how significant the improvement would be in terms of fairness, especially when weighed against to cost of implementation.
> 
> Modern Cooking is a small family owned business. I am the only in house web developer and contrary to popular belief we do not make a fortune doing this.
> 
> I kinda feel a little hurt by your comment. I have no agenda other than to provide a good service, reasonable prices, great products and to feed my family.
> 
> No lying here, just an open discussion between a group of like minded individuals. I really don't see what I would have to gain by lying or attempting to mislead some of my best and most loyal customers. Its certainly not my intention. but I always appreciate the feedback and the suggestions for improvement whether I can make them happen or not



Yeah I owe you a bit of an apology; my brain was in work mode and as such I was being pretty direct. You might imagine it often occurs that I have to be very direct when these subjects comes up. I didn't mean what I said as a criticism, but you're right re tone for a forum so sorry.

I had offered my own time before, and I wouldn't have if I weren't serious about that as an offer. I have a burning hatred for timed releases (I could have, for example, bought the second batch because the time happened to work out for me, but I already had a knife in the first batch and felt that would be unfair) so even just helping one retailer get on the right path would make this hobby better IMO.


----------



## moderncooking

tcmx3 said:


> Yeah I owe you a bit of an apology; my brain was in work mode and as such I was being pretty direct. You might imagine it often occurs that I have to be very direct when these subjects comes up. I didn't mean what I said as a criticism, but you're right re tone for a forum so sorry.
> 
> I had offered my own time before, and I wouldn't have if I weren't serious about that as an offer. I have a burning hatred for timed releases (I could have, for example, bought the second batch because the time happened to work out for me, but I already had a knife in the first batch and felt that would be unfair) so even just helping one retailer get on the right path would make this hobby better IMO.



All good, I know how it can be. My wife is in data science and yes its exactly like that for her at the office. 

I'll also mention that I had the news that a school friend on mine died today and so I probably shouldn't be here responding to this stuff. Feeling a little low 

Why don't we have a chat about it a little more in DM. Hit me up!


----------



## tally-ho

What the deal with this lottery debate ? Not being able to buy a kitchen knife shouldn't be a problem, it's not like missing an appointment for a heart transplant.


----------



## BillHanna

tally-ho said:


> What the deal with this lottery debate ? Not being able to buy a kitchen knife shouldn't be a problem, it's not like missing an appointment for a heart transplant.


----------



## Delat

tally-ho said:


> What the deal with this lottery debate ? Not being able to buy a kitchen knife shouldn't be a problem, it's not like missing an appointment for a heart transplant.



Some people are very focused on the end result - getting a knife they like. For me it's more like fishing, I enjoy the process and the hunt as much as the catch. So I'm ok with either refresh-refresh-refresh at the second of release then bitching and moaning when I miss out, or getting in on a lottery (and then bitching and moaning when I miss out). 

Inevitably when I do buy a knife, soon after I see something new and say "Damn I wish I had waited and got that instead". So that keeps me from being too disappointed when I miss something.


----------



## Matt Jacobs

My wife very much appreciates it it when I miss out on a knife


----------



## AT5760

@Matt Jacobs what's the heel height on your bunka? I've had one in my cart twice now. Looks tempting!


----------



## Matt Jacobs

AT5760 said:


> @Matt Jacobs what's the heel height on your bunka? I've had one in my cart twice now. Looks tempting!


I will measure when I get home.


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Ok, so I know I have been very quiet on this. I have been rolling this around in my mind for the past 24hrs or so. Most of you who know me know that I am always keen to find the fairest system for doing these drops, but I am just not convinced that the lottery is the best for a retail store. Knife makers, selling via a newsletter, sure. I think for the likes of @KAMON Knives its perfect, but he is addressing one pool of customers (His Newsletter).
> 
> For a retail store like Modern Cooking, we have IG, Newsletter and customers simply visiting the site. The lottery concept isolates the opportunity to buy to those on the Newsletter or perhaps, if we post it out on IG, those people there also.
> 
> From my perspective, I send out an email with a date and time for the release (Usually several hours before and sometime longer). This prior notice element addresses the issue of emails being delivered in staggered intervals. Then its first in best dressed or the fastest and luckiest wins. For me this is kinda equal to a lottery in that luck is what drives the win. We offer this early notice to our Newsletter subscribers as we see those people as the customers who support us the most and we want to show our gratitude for that support, but we do not wish to exclude our other potential customers. Usually, we will only announce the drop on IG at the exact release time. Newsletter subscribers will get several hours additional notice. Sometimes, I will also, as a tip of the hat to the KKF members, announce a release here.
> 
> There are a couple of issue with this system though. Time zones for example. To address this I think I will, in future, stagger the timing of my releases to hit a different time zone each time I do a release. This will not make every drop totally equal, but this way I can spread the love a little more evenly.
> 
> Not sure about the bots, but I haven’t seen any evidence from our side that this is happening with our releases. If someone who know more about this or knows that it is happening with Modern Cooking releases has some advise or info, please get in touch.
> 
> *Getting back to more interesting news. I have another batch of Jonas Johnsson MCX Knives coming this weekend and with a bit of luck a second MCX Fredrik Spåre Apex Gyuto drop coming next week.*


Sounds good to me!


----------



## Barmoley

tally-ho said:


> What the deal with this lottery debate ? Not being able to buy a kitchen knife shouldn't be a problem, it's not like missing an appointment for a heart transplant.


The debate comes purely from some makers and retailers stated goal of them trying to be fair. It doesn't need to be fair, but if they truly want to be fair then lottery is the most fair way to do it.

I like the fishing anology above since fishing can also be a lottery or an effort based timed event. Some get up in the middle of the night and click, click, click trying different lures and spots for a few "good" hours. Some just get their gear and go to a spot when convenient and just fish. From personal experience I am not convinced the former method brings me more fish. The later is definitely more relaxing and less end result oriented. So depends if you like super active knife fishing or a more relaxed one.

Once again it all comes from claimed goals of being fair. Without that any method works.


----------



## jedy617

By the way, on my Jonas apex ultra. I like the burnt oak. Love the birch. Love the brass. In person however the combo not so much. I think if doing 2 different materials like the birch and the wood some contrast would have been better, like a dark ebony and the lighter birch. Or full birch/full oak one piece handle. I'm going to be removing it quite sadly because it's a wonderful shape and quality though.


----------



## sansho

just having a bit of fun here.

to the lottery lovers out there, how would you implement it? details matter to nerds.

when i raffle things out, i use this algorithm. it attempts to be provably fair by drawing the winner(s) using a public source of entropy released at a pre-announced time in the future. anyone can verify the winner using the algorithm and the publicly-available entropy history.






Anonymous Github







anonymous.4open.science





the other important thing is how to fairly control entries. imo the most fair and secure system is to pay for each entry. users can then linearly increase their chances of winning by spending more money.

but for the knife model, maybe the best way is to validate entries based on some other scarce resource. shipping address is probably best. most people can probably only cheat up to a few times if they use extra addresses belonging to friends and family.


----------



## Greenbriel

AT5760 said:


> @Matt Jacobs what's the heel height on your bunka? I've had one in my cart twice now. Looks tempting!


I'm not Matt but my MCX Bunka is 53mm at the heel.  Very happy with it for the price.


----------



## jedy617

Also everyone in here talking about other MCX knives! To not crowd up the Fredrik specific thread about other MCX stuff I did make a general mcx thread:






The MCX Thread


Hey guys thought it would be best to discuss all things MCX (@moderncooking collab drops) in one thread. We were talking about Fredrik Spare, and then Isasmedjan and others in the Spare impression thread so I thought a thread for all the collabs would make more sense! This just arrived today...




www.kitchenknifeforums.com


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> By the way, on my Jonas apex ultra. I like the burnt oak. Love the birch. Love the brass. In person however the combo not so much. I think if doing 2 different materials like the birch and the wood some contrast would have been better, like a dark ebony and the lighter birch. Or full birch/full oak one piece handle. I'm going to be removing it quite sadly because it's a wonderful shape and quality though.



I’ll be keen to get your thoughts on the up coming Apex MCX Fredrik Spåre. I think it’s a little more contrast, but similar


----------



## Hz_zzzzzz

moderncooking said:


> I’ll be keen to get your thoughts on the up coming Apex MCX Fredrik Spåre. I think it’s a little more contrast, but similar


I think it would look better with just oak and brass like on the bunka.


----------



## Greenbriel

jedy617 said:


> Also everyone in here talking about other MCX knives! To not crowd up the Fredrik specific thread about other MCX stuff I did make a general mcx thread:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The MCX Thread
> 
> 
> Hey guys thought it would be best to discuss all things MCX (@moderncooking collab drops) in one thread. We were talking about Fredrik Spare, and then Isasmedjan and others in the Spare impression thread so I thought a thread for all the collabs would make more sense! This just arrived today...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kitchenknifeforums.com


I was talking about my Spåre MCX


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> I’ll be keen to get your thoughts on the up coming Apex MCX Fredrik Spåre. I think it’s a little more contrast, but similar


Will do! Can't stress enough that all of this stuff is just aesthetics preferences hope you know


----------



## superworrier

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> I think it would look better with just oak and brass like on the bunka.


+1. Not a fan of imitation ivory at all


----------



## Matt Jacobs

AT5760 said:


> @Matt Jacobs what's the heel height on your bunka? I've had one in my cart twice now. Looks tempting!


It's pretty tall at 53mm it makes for really nice finger clearance.


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> Also everyone in here talking about other MCX knives! To not crowd up the Fredrik specific thread about other MCX stuff I did make a general mcx thread:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The MCX Thread
> 
> 
> Hey guys thought it would be best to discuss all things MCX (@moderncooking collab drops) in one thread. We were talking about Fredrik Spare, and then Isasmedjan and others in the Spare impression thread so I thought a thread for all the collabs would make more sense! This just arrived today...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kitchenknifeforums.com



Thank you! Ill post releases there from now on


----------



## moderncooking

superworrier said:


> +1. Not a fan of imitation ivory at all



Personally, I thought it was pretty cool, but the next version will not have any. All things going to plan it should be an Oak, Birch and Brass handle. Similar to the last Isasmedjan MCX, but with darker Oak for more contrast.


----------



## JanSubrt

+1 on ivory being pretty cool


----------



## KAMON Knives

DrEriksson said:


> @KAMON Knives Have you considered differentiation? For some buyers you are certainly losing money, but increasing all prices will reduce the customer base (assuming the demand curve is not strange, as with some luxury products). What is commonly done in other businesses is to adopt price discrimination. For example, increased flight prices for late bookings or business class, or different rates to cross a bridge for cars vs trucks.
> 
> In the knife world this can be seen with, for example, Tansu/HVB. So are there any crazy or premium ideas you’ve been considering? And would you be able to sell those at perhaps double the price? The ideas doesn’t even have to be crazy, could be to differentiate between drops and custom orders, where fully custom are 1.5-2x the price. With such options you’d never have to roll back prices if demand drops. You can just continue with the “regular” line.



I was a little busy this weekend and then had to catch up with work and emails, hence my late reply. Sorry to bring it way back but I don't like to have questions unanswered. 

So yes that's one of the first things I established once I got self employed. It was just to reduce risk and always be able to fall back on different price sections. 
So I had my production line which was very affordable, then my take down handle mono steel knives made from 1.2519 and then I had the stainless clad shichi mai or now the monolith knives that are more high end. In the future or right now there'll be Apex ultra and stainless steel 14c28n knives. 
I also have some projects in between that are pretty special and will fall out of line regarding pricing. So yes I did that early and I'll do that in the future too.

Making customs more expensive is something I never really did, although economically seen, they should be more expensive. I don't compensate for the communication involved in them. That part is also very hard to calculate. I've done customs in 2-3 emails. I've done some with +80 emails. Some emails I write with guys in a very friendly manner. Almost more about private things rather than knife related. Not judging there at all. I wouldn't do that if I wouldn't enjoy it but the thing is... How to evaluate that monetarily? Where to draw the line? 



Delat said:


> It’s funny, my wife still doesn’t quite understand why she can’t just buy me a knife for my birthday.
> 
> Wife: “Can I buy you a knife for your birthday?”
> Me: “Yes, but not really. Kinda sorta. I can try to score one maybe this year or next. But yeah, I appreciate the thought.”
> Wife: “Whatever, you weirdo.”
> [Random knife arrives in the mail on some random day at any point]: Wife: “Happy birthday! What’d I get you?”



I can relate a lot. Had a good laugh on that as that could be my wife as well. Yet... In the name of all knife makers... I'm very sorry for that situation .


----------



## moderncooking

There is a couple Gyuto available from Fredrik on the site right now. They are part of the Oblivion Blades X Fredrik Spåre series. So, Modern Wrought with Aogami Super Cores combined with Fredrik's classic style.

Would love your feedback on the blades as we are planing to do more with this steel.


----------



## IMakeOnionsCry

moderncooking said:


> There is a couple Gyuto available from Fredrik on the site right now. They are part of the Oblivion Blades X Fredrik Spåre series. So, Modern Wrought with Aogami Super Cores combined with Fredrik's classic style.
> 
> Would love your feedback on the blades as we are planing to do more with this steel.
> 
> View attachment 200715



Thanks for letting us know, otherwise i don't think i would've had a shot. Was considering holding out for an Apex drop for my first Spare, but couldn't turn down this down. As most of my knives are 240's I put a premium on the 220 lengths as well. I need a larger knife less often tbh.

It's a beautiful knife, and I'm eager to put it though the ringer. As far as length goes, it feels like no one wants 210s and everyone wants 240s, but I really think there's a market somewhere in between. 

Thanks for the post!


----------



## moderncooking

IMakeOnionsCry said:


> Thanks for letting us know, otherwise i don't think i would've had a shot. Was considering holding out for an Apex drop for my first Spare, but couldn't turn down this down. As most of my knives are 240's I put a premium on the 220 lengths as well. I need a larger knife less often tbh.
> 
> It's a beautiful knife, and I'm eager to put it though the ringer. As far as length goes, it feels like no one wants 210s and everyone wants 240s, but I really think there's a market somewhere in between.
> 
> Thanks for the post!



No problems, I think Aogami Super is also very similar to Apex Ultra. Apex is certainly a little tougher, but considering both will easily attain hardness in the region of 66HRC+ you can't go wrong with an Aogami Super blade. I also really like what Jezz @oblivionblades has done with the Modern Wrought cladding.

I know I am cheering a little here and as a retailer I am not allowed, but I do really like this one


----------



## jedy617

Drop was too early for the modern wrought! Wish I grabbed one. But can't have every. I think the Jonas +apex ultra is as good as you can get. I'm tempted to remove some of the acid etch though and polish a little bit with my uchigomori to bring out some banding..who knows


----------



## moderncooking

jedy617 said:


> Drop was too early for the modern wrought! Wish I grabbed one. But can't have every. I think the Jonas +apex ultra is as good as you can get. I'm tempted to remove some of the acid etch though and polish a little bit with my uchigomori to bring out some banding..who knows


Don't stress we will certainly have more of those in the future. Jezz is already working on the steel for us.

Regarding the customisation of the MCX Jonas wrought Iron, I am on board with that. Sounds like it will be amazing. Certainly something I would play around with. Love alloy banding


----------



## jedy617

moderncooking said:


> Don't stress we will certainly have more of those in the future. Jezz is already working on the steel for us.
> 
> Regarding the customisation of the MCX Jonas wrought Iron, I am on board with that. Sounds like it will be amazing. Certainly something I would play around with. Love alloy banding


Thanks for always being so open to feedback on what we like!


----------



## blokey

Still some 230 available, I finally managed to grab one after all the summer time related f-ups.\








MCX | Gyuto Apex Ultra Limited Edition | Modern Cooking


Forged in Sweden by Fredrik Spare and designed in collaboration with Modern Cooking. This design comes as the culmination of years of experience, both in the commercial kitchen as professional chefs and designing, crafting, and maintaining kitchen knives. The knife is light in weight and...




moderncooking.com




BTW I like how it looks this time, personally I'm not a big fan of denty knives.


----------



## blokey

Just got mine, the taper is impressive.


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## blokey

The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.


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## jedy617

blokey said:


> The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.


In my experience (and I am saying this as personal experience, not as a global truth) what matters more for ease of sharpness is carbide volume and type of carbides. Like ZDP is surprisingly not bad for me to sharpen, mainly because the chromium carbides. Actually prefer it to SG2 to sharpen. M390/S90v are not the most pleasurable to sharpen even at around 58-62 hrc mainly because of the vanadium carbides I am assuming, and they have a lot of them, whereas SG2 also has vanadium carbides and is ran 60-63ish, but there are much much less of them compared to like m390/s90v so people arent as bothered by it in SG2.

Haven't tried sharpening my apex yet, but have done my honyakis in spicy white, and blue etc, along with tanakas 66+hrc AS and they havent felt bad at all.

Now what is going to be hell to sharpen probably is my Rex121 petty from Andrei, that is 67hrc, and tons of hard carbides. 67 is actually a bit on the soft end for Rex, Andrei told me he ran it a bit softer for better use in the kitchen so maybe it won't be as bad on diamond stones as I expected.


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## Hz_zzzzzz

blokey said:


> The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.





Hz_zzzzzz said:


> By the way, the good things about Apex Ultra steel is real. It feels very creamy on stones, almost like my white2/white3 honyakis. People say it’s like 52100 but it doesn’t have the little stickiness of 52100 on stones. I tried Chosera 800/3000 and a Jnat and it reacts to them really well. And I feel like it holds its initial sharpness as well as Denka. Still cuts paper towel after 4 meals (various vegetables and meats). Not as smooth as initially but still enjoyable. It’s hard to tell exactly how good it is compared to aogami super as I don’t have tons of food to cut, but it definitely holds it edge noticeably better than white steels and 52100. I feel minimal change on the “refined yet toothy” edge after dicing a few tomatoes and green peppers. Denka edge is more like “toothy yet refined”.



It's similar to my experience from the previous batch. It also reacts to leather strop and diamond paste extremely well. I love the steel.


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## blokey

Hz_zzzzzz said:


> It's similar to my experience from the previous batch. It also reacts to leather strop and diamond paste extremely well. I love the steel.


Very surprising to me, I almost thought they sent the wrong steel, the grind is good too, not the super cutter like some others, but it has very good balance between food separation and food release.


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## moderncooking

blokey said:


> The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.



That's been my experience also. I was pretty surprised because the makers are going through a lot more belts in the grinding phase of production on these.


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## Barmoley

moderncooking said:


> That's been my experience also. I was pretty surprised because the makers are going through a lot more belts in the grinding phase of production on these.


Difficulty in grinding doesn't always translate well to difficulty in sharpening because in pure sharpening very little material is removed. In sharpening, cleanly removing burr is the most difficult part, so if the heat treat is good, little retained austenite, for example and the sharpening medium is adequate then even higher wear resistance steels can be easy to sharpen. During major thinning you'd see more of a parity to what makers are going through. Also, ApexUltra is the most wear resistant low alloy steel, but it is not that wear resistant compared to high alloy steels.


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## moderncooking

Barmoley said:


> Difficulty in grinding doesn't always translate well to difficulty in sharpening because in pure sharpening very little material is removed. In sharpening, cleanly removing burr is the most difficult part, so if the heat treat is good, little retained austenite, for example and the sharpening medium is adequate then even higher wear resistance steels can be easy to sharpen. During major thinning you'd see more of a parity to what makers are going through. Also, ApexUltra is the most wear resistant low alloy steel, but it is not that wear resistant compared to high alloy steels.


Makes a lot of sense and I have to say I havent had the chance or need to do any thinning or finishing, only sharpening.


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## Karl

Those of you who were (are) on Fredriks custom waiting list, since he sent out the message of a more standardized knife option in September, has anyone received it? 

Does anyone know what the status is with that batch?

I am on that waiting list and I did answer to Fredriks message and accepted a more standard version but since then I have not heard anything from him. 

/Karl


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## jedy617

Especially with him joining another project like Birch and Bevel I am guessing we are all in for a very long wait


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## Karl

jedy617 said:


> Especially with him joining another project like Birch and Bevel I am guessing we are all in for a very long wait


That's what I fear as well. Hope not though, since the very purpose of his message and the poll he did was to be able to deliver faster to those on his waiting list. At least that's what I thought...


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## Sdo

Karl said:


> That's what I fear as well. Hope not though, since the very purpose of his message and the poll he did was to be able to deliver faster to those on his waiting list. At least that's what I thought...


Grab a chair.


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## moderncooking

Karl said:


> Those of you who were (are) on Fredriks custom waiting list, since he sent out the message of a more standardized knife option in September, has anyone received it?
> 
> Does anyone know what the status is with that batch?
> 
> I am on that waiting list and I did answer to Fredriks message and accepted a more standard version but since then I have not heard anything from him.
> 
> /Karl


I can offer some info here. Fredrik is currently working on customs and not doing any MCX for the next little while. 

We have two new makers that are developing MCX knives in his place. 

You should start to see a few customs rolling out. I believe he will be doing batches to work through the orders as fast as possible. It’s a priority and he hopes to clear the custom list as soon as he can. 

Speaking for Fredrik, I know he appreciates you all and is grateful for your patience and good will


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## tylerleach

blokey said:


> The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.


I have found my MCX super easy to sharpen… and I would agree that HRC is not necessarily the determining factor in ease of sharpening. I think a lot of it boils down to the treatment of steel in general. I have been surprised both in a good and bad way by certain knives/steels.


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## Fredrik Spåre

Hey all. 
In regards to the list I’m actually doing that now. 
I’m just completing a batch of 10 customs and after that I’m starting on the non damascus knives that were ordered though the email. 
After that, it’s time for the damascus ones (with a vast majority choose, thanks for that). 
My hope is to have all the email-knives sent out by end of January. 
Thanks for being so patient. I know I probably don’t communicate that as much as I should, but trust me I appreciate it a lot. 
Merry Christmas to you all!


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## xsmx13

Thank you for the update @Fredrik Spåre! I'm looking forward to getting my hands on that 250mm Damascus gyuto!


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## timebard

After letting the 230 honyaki that started the thread go a while back, I picked up the
Spåre / MCX 190 bunka from a few months back (thanks @Alder26 !). It's good to have a
Spåre in my drawer again and it has a lot of similarities to the original MCX gyuto. Beyond the obvious size/format/steel differences there are also several more subtle distinctions:

The handle - still nice material and love the signature hammered brass ferrule, and this one has a bit of taper towards the ferrule that's a nice ergonomic improvement. The birchbark spacer (maybe just due to being natural material) isn't quite as cleanly fit to the ferrule and wood as the G10 spacer on the previous version (which was one of the cleanest FnF handles I've tried). By no means bad, just not quite as top-tier.
Grind - hard to accurately compare without having both knives side by side, but I believe the bunka is the better cutter. It loses almost nothing to my best performing gyutos and I'd say it's the best cutter of the small (sub-200) knives I've tried. Like my Kono MM, it has a nice blend of lasery tip to more substantial and convex but still thin back half. Really pleased with it as a pure cutter.
Profile - okay, this is really apples to oranges, but I have found the bunka profile works really well for me. Quite flat (but not dead flat) with just a little curve to the tip. My old one was not my favorite gyuto profile, just a little too much curve up front.
Steel - the 1.2419 feels less fragile than the honyaki's harder 26c3 and better suited to use as a daily driver. Seems pretty calm reactivity wise. Time will tell how it holds an edge but so far so good.
Blade finish - while the honyaki had a bit of forge scale remaining above the hamon, it was smoothed/polished really nicely, and the overall level of finish was outstanding. By contrast, the nashiji-type finish on the bunka is rougher to the touch and lacks that extra level of polish and refinement. At this price point that's a luxury, not an expectation, but I do miss it a bit. The spine and choil are still nicely rounded (including all the way down the spine through the k-tip, which I thought was a nice touch) and the finger notch works well for me.
Overall, it's a lot of fun and I expect it'll have a long term slot in my drawer. While the level of finish is perhaps a touch below the OG MCX, that's a seriously high bar at this price point, and the step up in cutting performance is impressive. And... if all that piques your interest but you don't like bunkas, the Birch and Bevel "carbon gyuto" sure looks like the big brother of this guy at a pretty reasonable price: Carbon Gyuto | Professional performance for the Home | Birch and Bevel


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## Karl

Happy days, Fredrik sent an email saying he will try to send out a batch of carbon steel gyutos this week. Will probably not get it before Christmas but still very nice news!


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## gc0220

blokey said:


> The steel is surprisingly easy to sharpen, take me the same amount of time to raise a burr and deburr as some blue steel, don't feel super hard, a bit creamy actually. This is actually my first knife beyond 65 HRC so I'm not sure if that's what it suppose to feel or not.


Sharpening is MUCH more about abrasion resistance than it is about hardness. Steels like white paper have next to zero abrasion resistance. Blue steels only have a wee bit more. I demonstrate this to people to dulling a 61 rc white #2 knife on a brick and bringing the edge back on nothing but a polishing stone, 8k shapron pro, with 2 minutes of work. Try the same on a dollar store stainless knife that's 56 rc and you will be grinding on that stone till you arms fall off and make zero progress. Still dull.


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## blokey

gc0220 said:


> Sharpening is MUCH more about abrasion resistance than it is about hardness. Steels like white paper have next to zero abrasion resistance. Blue steels only have a wee bit more. I demonstrate this to people to dulling a 61 rc white #2 knife on a brick and bringing the edge back on nothing but a polishing stone, 8k shapron pro, with 2 minutes of work. Try the same on a dollar store stainless knife that's 56 rc and you will be grinding on that stone till you arms fall off and make zero progress. Still dull.


Yeah I know, but there is certain feel to harder steel like AS or 1.2519, which is not felt in AU, and AU at 66 HRC should have the wear resistence close to 440C or high hardness AEB-L, but sharpens like white 1.


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## gc0220

blokey said:


> Yeah I know, but there is certain feel to harder steel like AS or 1.2519, which is not felt in AU, and AU at 66 HRC should have the wear resistence close to 440C or high hardness AEB-L, but sharpens like white 1.


Fascinating. I have not tried AU yet but it's high on my list. Sounds very interesting and promising, I'm curious to see how and what kind of edge it takes. I figured it would be kinda like hard aebl or something like that to sharpen. The subjective feeling of harder steel I've noticed more in actual use in cutting more than I have on the stones. Super hard carbon steels still melt on the stones whereas the certain stainless or tool type stuff can feel like it's skating on ice or whatever, even stuff that isn't particularly hard like D2 tool steel at 60 rc or whatever.


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## Greenbriel

timebard said:


> After letting the 230 honyaki that started the thread go a while back, I picked up the
> Spåre / MCX 190 bunka from a few months back (thanks @Alder26 !). It's good to have a
> Spåre in my drawer again and it has a lot of similarities to the original MCX gyuto. Beyond the obvious size/format/steel differences there are also several more subtle distinctions:
> 
> The handle - still nice material and love the signature hammered brass ferrule, and this one has a bit of taper towards the ferrule that's a nice ergonomic improvement. The birchbark spacer (maybe just due to being natural material) isn't quite as cleanly fit to the ferrule and wood as the G10 spacer on the previous version (which was one of the cleanest FnF handles I've tried). By no means bad, just not quite as top-tier.
> Grind - hard to accurately compare without having both knives side by side, but I believe the bunka is the better cutter. It loses almost nothing to my best performing gyutos and I'd say it's the best cutter of the small (sub-200) knives I've tried. Like my Kono MM, it has a nice blend of lasery tip to more substantial and convex but still thin back half. Really pleased with it as a pure cutter.
> Profile - okay, this is really apples to oranges, but I have found the bunka profile works really well for me. Quite flat (but not dead flat) with just a little curve to the tip. My old one was not my favorite gyuto profile, just a little too much curve up front.
> Steel - the 1.2419 feels less fragile than the honyaki's harder 26c3 and better suited to use as a daily driver. Seems pretty calm reactivity wise. Time will tell how it holds an edge but so far so good.
> Blade finish - while the honyaki had a bit of forge scale remaining above the hamon, it was smoothed/polished really nicely, and the overall level of finish was outstanding. By contrast, the nashiji-type finish on the bunka is rougher to the touch and lacks that extra level of polish and refinement. At this price point that's a luxury, not an expectation, but I do miss it a bit. The spine and choil are still nicely rounded (including all the way down the spine through the k-tip, which I thought was a nice touch) and the finger notch works well for me.
> Overall, it's a lot of fun and I expect it'll have a long term slot in my drawer. While the level of finish is perhaps a touch below the OG MCX, that's a seriously high bar at this price point, and the step up in cutting performance is impressive. And... if all that piques your interest but you don't like bunkas, the Birch and Bevel "carbon gyuto" sure looks like the big brother of this guy at a pretty reasonable price: Carbon Gyuto | Professional performance for the Home | Birch and Bevel
> 
> View attachment 212594
> 
> View attachment 212595
> View attachment 212596
> 
> View attachment 212597


I absolutely love mine, I was hitting refresh and bought one the SECOND they went up. Then watched confused for days as the rest sat there. I really don't understand why bunkas get so little love. Truly a fun little knife. Fredrik and Bjorn are probably my two favorite makers right now. Or at least the makers whose knives I reach for with the most regularity.


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## BillHanna

Suji on the way. I really hope it doesn’t get here this year. I don’t need the heat.


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## BillHanna




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## M1k3

BillHanna said:


> View attachment 217717
> View attachment 217718


Sweet Gyuto!


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## tostadas

BillHanna said:


> View attachment 217717
> View attachment 217718


Nice nakiri


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