# Some Stones...



## cotedupy (Nov 13, 2021)

Over the last 10 or so months I've been periodically buying various interesting-looking things on UK ebay, and getting them sent to my family there for when I was able to come back for a visit. Here's what I came back to; there are probably about 25-ish stones in here. some mysteries, some not. And boy was it fun unwrapping them...







---

Here's a couple of Charnleys to kick off with. A small one at 115 x 42:






And a big un at 210 x 40:


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## cotedupy (Nov 13, 2021)

Here are some purple stones. Purple stones for god-knows-what reason often have green bits in them. I don't exactly know what these are, possible candidates include Llyn Melynllyn, La Lune, and Vosgienne, but definitely keen to hear any thoughts or opinions from any experts out there...

This first one is very soft, and should be pretty good for polishing. Also has a cool cat's eye type bit in the middle of one side:











This second is *huge*, slightly harder and finer, but still not particularly fast:






And the third is much harder, very fine, and quite quick. This is a very high quality stone:


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## cotedupy (Nov 13, 2021)

This is a slightly niche, rare stone called a Goldfisch Wetzstein. Majority consensus seems to have them as a kind of Rouge du Salm / La Lorraine layer:






For comparison here's a more normal Belgian Blue Whetstone:


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## cotedupy (Nov 13, 2021)

And a Coticule / BBW combo. This is a very nice coti; very fast and erring on the coarser side of medium, just wish it was a bit bigger as it'd be a fantastic knife stone. (I have filled that little gap since taking this picture):


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## birdsfan (Nov 13, 2021)

Quite an enormous cache! Excited to hear your thoughts on them once you get a chance to properly try them out


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## KingShapton (Nov 14, 2021)

A thought about the first purple stone - in terms of color (but that may also be due to the exposure of the picture) it seems to be more reddish, my purple Llyn Melynllyn looks a little less reddish. But unfortunately I can't bend down for a few more days to get my stone out of the closet and take pictures. The "Cats Eye" also looks different than the green spot I know from the stones, but here too, this can also be due to the exposure of the picture.

What I can say with 100% certainty is that at least 1 other stone comes from the mine in which the Purple Llyn is mined. This stone looks similar, also has a few green spots, but compared to the Purple Llyn it is extremely hard, almost like glass, produces almost no slurry and makes an extremely fine, but still aggressive, cutting edge. However, the feeling of sharpening really takes a lot of getting used to.

The third stone, the one with the greenish end, which you call high quality stone, looks familiar to me, I think I've seen something like this before. Perhaps I will come up with something else in the next few days ... Does the green part have the same properties as the rest of the stone? or is there the possibility that there are two different veins that have grown together and have different properties?


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

This rather fetching sea-green-blue number is definitely one of my favourites of the lot. Initially I thought it was a Charnley but when lapping it's clearly not novaculite, it's a very fine and hard slate. Possibly a Glanrafon, though it doesn't look exactly like them either, so who knows!


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

Speaking of which - these next four all fall under the banner of 'Misc. Grey Slate'. I perhaps didn't need four examples almost identical apart from shape, but at the very least they will deepen my knowledge and understanding of slate. Which can never be a bad thing!


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

This little 5.5 x 2 one however is a special kind of slate. It's a Thuringian stone, darling of the straight razor community, and often rather expensive. A very good, very fine, and glorious-feeling stone:


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

Alas it wasn't all slate-y sunlit uplands here on the cote*. Among the hoard were two stones I knew to be old 8x2 Washitas, as they're sometimes quite easy to spot in pictures. But unfortunately both of them got broken in the post.

This break is quite messy:






This on a labelled Norton No.1 is cleaner:






I got in touch with the sellers and they were happy to re-imburse half of the respective prices. Because both of these stones are rescuable, but I'm going to do it in different ways. More on this later...


* The soils of the Cote du Py are not in fact slate based. Nor are they granitic like many areas of the Beaujolais crus, but rather a type of decomposed schist called 'roche pourrie'.


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

First though some other quite pretty stones, that weren't UK ebay finds. This first is a Rozsutec from Slovakia, and a very generous gift from another member here, whose blushes I will spare. It's a hard stone, and nobody would accuse it of being fast, which might often have the potential of making something quite difficult to use, and lean toward overly refined or burnished edges. But the Rozsutec manages to avoid this, and leaves rather a nice edge on a kitchen knife.






I'm particularly looking forward to trying it with coticule slurry, because coticule slurry is _amazing_, and also included were a selection of BBW and coti slurry stones / nagura.


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

And second a stone swapped with another member, who's adept at in-hand sharpening, for a selection of stones that were a little too small for me. This very pretty old Turkish Oilstone is a little different from some of my others; it's certainly at the hard and fine end of the scale, with a more homogenous grit to the surface than most of the ones I've found:
















It's also the only one I have that's been found in America (I believe), and cut to a very neat 8x2 benchstone. These various factors make me suspect this is probably an example of an old Pike Turkey Oil Stone:


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

Let's have a look at how those two Washitas came out. I degreased them for a day or so to clean them up, then thought about what to do...

The first stone is broken and splintered into many pieces, which is going to make it very difficult (impossible) to glue neatly. Though the breaks are at the end of the stone, so instead I'm going to lap it flat with a Norton Coarse India to create a 6.5 x 2 stone, and glue the two large pieces from the end together to make a rubbing stone:






This is an absolute cracker of a stone. At the coarser end of the spectrum, and fast as hell. You can see some of the pink/orange areas on the surface and sides that gave Rosy Reds their name:






---

The break on the second is cleaner, but it's in the middle of the stone so I use superglue, which I understand goes by the name CA glue across the pond. This is quite easy to do and works well. I also steamed the remnants of the label off the box, sanded it back a bit to 240 grit, finished with Tung oil, and then sealed the label back onto the box using transparent wood lacquer.

This around the middle ground for Washitas, maybe leaning slightly coarse, and a really good stone as well.


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

And lastly one that's a bit special (for me)...

I've long been envious of the various people who own beautiful old Arkansas/Washitas/etc. belonging to their forebears and handed down through the generations, as I knew I'd never have anything similar.

My grandfather died almost 25 years ago, though my grandmother is still alive, and his workshop area in cellar has remained basically untouched since then. Through laziness rather than sentimentality I expect; my grandfather was a 'difficult' man by all accounts. If it wasn't for the fact that everything's rusted, covered in spider webs, and the lights no longer work, it would appear as though he was in the middle of some project and had just popped out for a quick bowl.

Some investigating and rummaging around down there by my father a couple of months ago had turned up a single 6x2 sharpening stone:











A slate, of course .


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## KingShapton (Nov 14, 2021)

What a great find. A piece of family history and I think your grandfather would be happy that the stone is in good hands and will continue to be used.


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

Oops! There was one other stone and a very interesting one too...

I got this from someone in Devon whose father used to use it for razors. Though I'm not quite sure how, as it's heavily dished on one side, and the other has a large gauge in it, presumably done for some kind of woodworking tool. Also I'd put this stone topping out at around 4k, though it could probably be worked finer with lighter pressure.










The surface of the stone has a distinctly 'bubbly' appearance, to the extent that it actually feels like sharpening on bubbles, as well as some flinty-cherty-novaculitey character:






It's an _excellent _knife stone, and very fast. I suspect perhaps some kind of funky Idwal, though I'm not entirely sure...


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## cotedupy (Nov 14, 2021)

KingShapton said:


> A thought about the first purple stone - in terms of color (but that may also be due to the exposure of the picture) it seems to be more reddish, my purple Llyn Melynllyn looks a little less reddish. But unfortunately I can't bend down for a few more days to get my stone out of the closet and take pictures. The "Cats Eye" also looks different than the green spot I know from the stones, but here too, this can also be due to the exposure of the picture.
> 
> What I can say with 100% certainty is that at least 1 other stone comes from the mine in which the Purple Llyn is mined. This stone looks similar, also has a few green spots, but compared to the Purple Llyn it is extremely hard, almost like glass, produces almost no slurry and makes an extremely fine, but still aggressive, cutting edge. However, the feeling of sharpening really takes a lot of getting used to.
> 
> The third stone, the one with the greenish end, which you call high quality stone, looks familiar to me, I think I've seen something like this before. Perhaps I will come up with something else in the next few days ... Does the green part have the same properties as the rest of the stone? or is there the possibility that there are two different veins that have grown together and have different properties?



You're absolutely correct - the first stone is certainly more red than the other two, and softer. It could I suppose be a Belgian stone, but came from an old woodworking teacher in the UK, so I suspect it's British.

The third stone certainly sounds like your description of the 'other' kind of LM, so might possibly be that. Or maybe a French stone (I need to read up about these more!), it will I think be better suited to razors. I will try again and pay attention to whether the two parts feel different, I didn't notice it first time round, but I was probably not really using the very ends.

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I was very happy indeed to have my grandfather's stone, also that he was a natural stone person! And didn't just use some dirty and dished old SiC.


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## inferno (Nov 16, 2021)

cotedupy said:


> This is a slightly niche, rare stone called a Goldfisch Wetzstein. Majority consensus seems to have them as a kind of Rouge du Salm / La Lorraine layer:
> 
> View attachment 151781
> 
> ...



is the la lorraine good for razors in your opinion? thinking about getting the newly mined "la lune" afaik these are the same? www.1stone.fr
talking stone - straight leather - shave. no mumbo jumbo.


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## cotedupy (Nov 17, 2021)

inferno said:


> is the la lorraine good for razors in your opinion? thinking about getting the newly mined "la lune" afaik these are the same? www.1stone.fr
> talking stone - straight leather - shave. no mumbo jumbo.



I've got a razor I need to touch up, so will give it a proper go later and report back. (And yeah that's my approach to razors too - I don't go in for any of that diamond pasted balsa stuff &c.)


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## cotedupy (Dec 8, 2021)

A few more pretty UK stones...

This is a dark blue Tam O'Shanter with almost a cloud like pattern on it:







Something rather niche and rare as hen's teeth, that was very kindly given to me. Not a huge amount is known about the Moughton Whetstone, including if and when it was ever commercially quarried. It's a kind of very hard, fine-grained siltstone / shale. From the feel of it this is going to be around 8k.







And a lucky find last week in a town market. A big, thick piece of Charnley Forest.


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## cotedupy (Dec 8, 2021)

Tidied the Moughton up a bit and sawed the nub off the end to create a slurry stone. Looking pretty smart I think 







And just after that another cheap roll-of-the-dice turned up. Little bit of cleaning and lapping, and... it's a little Idwal! This *could* be a Charnley but I think it's an Idwal, at the coarser end of the ones I’ve tried, and feels like it's going to be a _very _good knife stone. Stuck firmly into its box so I'll leave like this.


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## cotedupy (Dec 11, 2021)

Another salvage / reclamation place today delivering up the goods. What’s been most remarkable in the last couple of weeks is that I haven’t had to trawl through masses of old SiC stones to find a gem - each place that I’ve been to has only had one or two stones, and they’ve all been winners. These two for a tenner today.

The first is a big un, in excess of 9 x 2, and I’m relatively certain is an old Turkish:






Second is about 7 x 1.5 and could be another Turkish, or maybe Idwal / Charnley / other novaculite:






Pics to follow when cleaned up...


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## KingShapton (Dec 11, 2021)

cotedupy said:


> Another salvage / reclamation place today delivering up the goods. What’s been most remarkable in the last couple of weeks is that I haven’t had to trawl through masses of old SiC stones to find a gem - each place that I’ve been to has only had one or two stones, and they’ve all been winners. These two for a tenner today.
> 
> The first is a big un, in excess of 9 x 2, and I’m relatively certain is an old Turkish:
> 
> ...


It doesn't stop .... I'm happy for you about every stone you find! But your hit rate is almost a bit scary  ... anyway I keep my fingers crossed that it will last a long time !! And I am curious what more discoveries will come from you ... it’s really fun to watch!


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## cotedupy (Dec 11, 2021)

KingShapton said:


> It doesn't stop .... I'm happy for you about every stone you find! But your hit rate is almost a bit scary  ... anyway I keep my fingers crossed that it will last a long time !! And I am curious what more discoveries will come from you ... it’s really fun to watch!



Weird isn’t it! In Aus there are a massive number of SiC and AlOx stones and relatively few naturals - I have to look around a fair bit. Here so far has seemed to be completely the other way round.

—-

I didn’t get the first one right though; I was fairly sure it was a Turkish, but was clearly thrown off by the pretty surface patterns (which I could see some of under the grime):






Second also an Idwal, tho finer than the one above:






I’m rather pleased about this tbh... of all the UK stones I’ve tried the Idwal seems to me most well-suited for knife sharpening. They abrade more quickly than the Charnleys I have, so can be worked to leave very fine finishes but with a bit more bite. Whereas my CFs lean more toward polishing an edge, especially if used without slurry. The first, larger stone here I think is going to be particularly good for kitchen knives .

Plus I think Idwals look feckin cool!


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## cotedupy (Dec 11, 2021)

Here’s why I like them...

I’m currently staying with a very dear friend in Belfast, who I’d made up a knife for last Christmas. She’s used it a fair bit, never sharpened it, and it’d got a bit rusty (the other side was quite a lot worse than the side in the pic):






I actually only used the top, coarser stone, but it got it back to the edge below. Which is pretty keen, as you can see, but still has some nice teeth to it.

I’d compare it to the finish from a very fine Washita, perhaps a bit higher, though they’re nothing like as fast as a Washita. Nevertheless I can still use one stone to do a full sharpening progression, rust removal &c. and I couldn’t do that on a Charnley.






Your browser is not able to display this video.


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## cotedupy (Dec 12, 2021)

KingShapton said:


> I keep my fingers crossed that it will last a long time



Thank you... it appears to be working! Went to a kinda Christmas market thing with my friend today, one guy was selling old tools and stuff, and again had just one stone. Not sure what it is yet but feels novaculite-y, and at £8 for an 8x2 I’m happy to roll some dice. We’ll see if the lucky run continues...







May well be another Idwal, which would be nice. Here’s a daytime pic of the two from yesterday, the big one is rather pretty I think , almost Dalmore like patterns...


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## KingShapton (Dec 12, 2021)

This really looks like a Dalmore like pattern.

By the way, I've been waiting for you to find a Dalmore the whole time ...


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## cotedupy (Dec 12, 2021)

Today’s turned out to be a very hard, fine, and fairly translucent old Washita. Needs a proper degrease, and fair bit of lapping as both sides are used / dished, which will take a while on this one I think.

But otherwise looking like a very nice stone in good condition.


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## cotedupy (Dec 12, 2021)

KingShapton said:


> This really looks like a Dalmore like pattern.
> 
> By the way, I've been waiting for you to find a Dalmore the whole time ...



Haha... I did actually specifically lap that side of the Idwal, because I could see it was going to be pretty 

No Dalmores here yet, though I did find one a while back in Aus, might have shown you a pic before possibly (?) For a while I thought it was a Hindostan as you could see layering on the sides, but as I cleaned it up the surface pattern became more visible, and someone on B&B pointed out it was actually clearly a DB, and that they go brownish when used with oil, as this had been:






---

BTW - the Idwal finish that I described yesterday as being like 'a very fine Washita, maybe higher'... it struck me later that what it was perhaps more comparable to was a good coticule kitchen knife finish. Mega-sharp, but with lots of very fine teeth .


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## pentryumf (Feb 4, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> This rather fetching sea-green-blue number is definitely one of my favourites of the lot. Initially I thought it was a Charnley but when lapping it's clearly not novaculite, it's a very fine and hard slate. Possibly a Glanrafon, though it doesn't look exactly like them either, so who knows!
> 
> View attachment 151837
> 
> ...


Possibly jade which I have heard can be used well for honing. Very cool thread you started.


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## cotedupy (Feb 4, 2022)

pentryumf said:


> Possibly jade which I have heard can be used well for honing. Very cool thread you started.



The surface does look slightly like Jade can do sometimes, but it's very definitely a slate of some kind. (I've never used a Jade hone, but heard good things). For a while I suspected it was a type of Glanrafon, but looking at them together under a scope it's slightly different, similar but different. 

And weirdly when I got back to Aus I discovered that I actually already had one - a stone that I found here in the middle of last year was very clearly the same thing. Especially odd as this is not a very common stone - I only know of one other person who has what I'd say for sure is the same.

Top stone was found in Aus, middle in the UK, bottom is a Glanrafon:












Very good razor stones, but too hard and fine to be much use on knives.


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## pentryumf (Feb 5, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> The surface does look slightly like Jade can do sometimes, but it's very definitely a slate of some kind. (I've never used a Jade hone, but heard good things). For a while I suspected it was a type of Glanrafon, but looking at them together under a scope it's slightly different, similar but different.
> 
> And weirdly when I got back to Aus I discovered that I actually already had one - a stone that I found here in the middle of last year was very clearly the same thing. Especially odd as this is not a very common stone - I only know of one other person who has what I'd say for sure is the same.
> 
> ...



amazing deep green colour in that top stone. Very nice clean looking, many impurities? Do you use a slurry with these?


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## Grayswandir (Feb 5, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Haha... I did actually specifically lap that side of the Idwal, because I could see it was going to be pretty
> 
> No Dalmores here yet, though I did find one a while back in Aus, might have shown you a pic before possibly (?) For a while I thought it was a Hindostan as you could see layering on the sides, but as I cleaned it up the surface pattern became more visible, and someone on B&B pointed out it was actually clearly a DB, and that they go brownish when used with oil, as this had been:
> 
> ...


I saw the photo before I saw your famous avatar and knew it was you. I literally know you by your hands at this point. Doesn't matter which forum, if I see those hands, I know it's you. How many damn stones do you own cotedupy? I'm more interested in razors stones myself, but I do appreciate the beauty of all stones, and this one is particularly nice, as you don't see many stones with horizontal lines like that.


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## Skylar303 (Feb 25, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Here are some purple stones. Purple stones for god-knows-what reason often have green bits in them. I don't exactly know what these are, possible candidates include Llyn Melynllyn, La Lune, and Vosgienne, but definitely keen to hear any thoughts or opinions from any experts out there...
> 
> This first one is very soft, and should be pretty good for polishing. Also has a cool cat's eye type bit in the middle of one side:
> 
> ...


The cats eye one maybe a Vossigene?(sp)


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## bsfsu (Mar 6, 2022)

I've got a new mystery stone. I'm thinking a Turkish?





















After cleaning

















Then I started lapping...........


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## bsfsu (Mar 6, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> I've got a new mystery stone. I'm thinking a Turkish?
> 
> View attachment 168809
> View attachment 168810
> ...


It looks like it has been broken in half at some stage of its life, well used.




Lapped some more....it smells like sulphur (farts) and old oil.




Then some more......




And I finally got it flat on one side!








It sharpened up a W2 knife and I took off the patina with it. Gave a nice haze. It felt nice, smooth but hard maybe around 5000-8000(could be harder as I'm just guessing )


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## cotedupy (Mar 6, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> It looks like it has been broken in half at some stage of its life, well used.
> View attachment 168820
> 
> Lapped some more....it smells like sulphur (farts) and old oil.
> ...



Spot on - it's a Turkish, nice find! .

5-8k is probably what they finish at. Though if you use with oil and use some pressure to generate a bit of mud, you can usually get them to work a fair bit coarser and faster than that.


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## cotedupy (Mar 6, 2022)

Extraordinary shape it was when you got, I've not seen dishing like that before.

'S-Grind' whetstone!


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## bsfsu (Mar 6, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Extraordinary shape it was when you got, I've not seen dishing like that before.
> 
> 'S-Grind' whetstone!


I'll see if I can get some better pictures of the super dished side. It looks like it had scratches on it in all directions almost like some curves were on purpose.


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## KingShapton (Mar 6, 2022)

Nice Turkish


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## Skylar303 (Mar 6, 2022)

Nice find! Hah that is some crazy dishing, at least it's not as hard as an ark! Looks like it may have been for things like mower blades.

Ha I've still been trying to figure this mysterious white stone out... 6x2x1, weighing in at 709g. Feels glass like/ceramic. (Which I thought first) Very fine and fast, maybe because it's a white-ish stone and can see swarf more easily but one pass light pressure makes a line.




The grey is old swarf. It's like a sort of off white, not 'snow' white. 


Sorry for the bad lighting, snowing and not too sunny. One corner with a crack. Looks like very fine sugar, also sort of sparkly.


Close up of one of the edges. Has small black pit marks. Almost looks like where gas would escape during formation? So that threw guess 1 ceramic out the window. Unless it was a dirty batch hah?


Semi translucent...


Then when talking with another member I didn't notice before, but in certain lighting there are faint whiter vertical lines. (Horizontal in the photo) that we thought maybe saw marks but they're very straight and in the stone. I can't feel them with a needle... 

Maybe it is just a hard ark?


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## cotedupy (Mar 7, 2022)

Skylar303 said:


> Nice find! Hah that is some crazy dishing, at least it's not as hard as an ark! Looks like it may have been for things like mower blades.
> 
> Ha I've still been trying to figure this mysterious white stone out... 6x2x1, weighing in at 709g. Feels glass like/ceramic. (Which I thought first) Very fine and fast, maybe because it's a white-ish stone and can see swarf more easily but one pass light pressure makes a line.
> View attachment 168841
> ...



You may have shown me this one before, but I'd be 95% sure it's an ark. Either a 'hard', but maybe more likely the harder kinds of white 'Soft Arkansas' with quite high SGs that Norton used to sell (perhaps still do?).

I can't think of any other types whetstone that looks like that, and passes light.


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## cotedupy (Mar 7, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> It looks like it has been broken in half at some stage of its life, well used.
> View attachment 168820
> 
> Lapped some more....it smells like sulphur (farts) and old oil.
> ...



And yep - as you’ve seen - the fineness and friability of Turkish stones means that, pretty much uniquely among novaculite stones, they can polish really quite nicely when worked with slurry.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 7, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> You may have shown me this one before, but I'd be 95% sure it's an ark. Either a 'hard', but maybe more likely the harder kinds of white 'Soft Arkansas' with quite high SGs that Norton used to sell (perhaps still do?).
> 
> I can't think of any other types whetstone that looks like that, and passes light.


Yeah, showed you this one before. Yeah I'm almost positive it's an ark of sorts just not 100%. The SG throws me off. I'll have to look into old soft arks with high SGs.


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## cotedupy (Mar 7, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> I'll see if I can get some better pictures of the super dished side. It looks like it had scratches on it in all directions almost like some curves were on purpose.



This wouldn't surprise me. The more old stones I come across the more I believe that they were often intentionally kept dished in quite specific ways. And I certainly have one old stone that had clearly been convexed on one side, and concaved on the other.

Maybe someone who knows a bit more about woodworking than I do might be able to shed some light...


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## captaincaed (Mar 8, 2022)

Mystery Stone
Picked up from a used tool shop, out of the simple green. No clue what this guy is, feel even grained, grippy, maybe gritty/sandy even. Flecks of reflection. Any ideas out there?









Mystery Stone







youtube.com


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## cotedupy (Mar 8, 2022)

captaincaed said:


> Mystery Stone
> Picked up from a used tool shop, out of the simple green. No clue what this guy is, feel even grained, grippy, maybe gritty/sandy even. Flecks of reflection. Any ideas out there?
> 
> 
> ...



Hmm... not sure.

It's a sandstone, pretty much without a doubt. Maybe something like; Ohio Blue / Deerlick / Queer Creek...?

Give it a lap and snap some more pics. @stringer and @Desert Rat might be the people who'll know about this kind of thing...


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## captaincaed (Mar 8, 2022)

Yeah tomorrow I'm going to the Cubitron. First impressions from edges are "unimpressive". Maybe bushcrafting in a moment of drunken weakness when your friends aren't watching, but I'll give it an honest go tomorrow.


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## stringer (Mar 8, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Hmm... not sure.
> 
> It's a sandstone, pretty much without a doubt. Maybe something like; Ohio Blue / Deerlick / Queer Creek...?
> 
> Give it a lap and snap some more pics. @stringer and @Desert Rat might be the people who'll know about this kind of thing...



I would say it's the Ohio Blue version of the Queer Creek. Those sandstones are interesting. You can lap them coarser or finer for different affects.


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## Desert Rat (Mar 8, 2022)

They act finer than the first impression would suggest.

I mostly peddle them Ohio stones.


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## bsfsu (Mar 8, 2022)

New stone arrived today, I think it's a Coticule















After a bit of a clean up. I don't have pics but it was covered in oil so I still might soak it.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 8, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> New stone arrived today, I think it's a Coticule
> 
> View attachment 169139
> View attachment 169140
> ...


 Looks like a coti with a glued BBW. Maybe rogue, not BBW. Hard to tell, first few it looks more like it than BBW, but with better lighting looks more BBW.

FWIW - At some point, I want to say (50's-60's?) they switched to slate as the 'norm'. It maybe a type of hybrid layer of sorts, or it may just be old grime. I'll be interested to see what the face looks like. It's definitely an older one though, it doesn't look like the cement they use now. Before it was a sort of glue like adhesive, which they later found out wasn't very stable in the long run...

Might consider dropping some CA in the cracks along the side. That BBW especially if it's the same side and top with the crack, may just pop off if knocked etc. Also you may not even need to soak it or not long at least. But since it was used with oil I'd still do a quick soak and lap and see, but after that it should be pretty clean.


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## bsfsu (Mar 9, 2022)

Skylar303 said:


> Looks like a coti with a glued BBW. Maybe rogue, not BBW. Hard to tell, first few it looks more like it than BBW, but with better lighting looks more BBW.
> 
> FWIW - At some point, I want to say (50's-60's?) they switched to slate as the 'norm'. It maybe a type of hybrid layer of sorts, or it may just be old grime. I'll be interested to see what the face looks like. It's definitely an older one though, it doesn't look like the cement they use now. Before it was a sort of glue like adhesive, which they later found out wasn't very stable in the long run...
> 
> Might consider dropping some CA in the cracks along the side. That BBW especially if it's the same side and top with the crack, may just pop off if knocked etc. Also you may not even need to soak it or not long at least. But since it was used with oil I'd still do a quick soak and lap and see, but after that it should be pretty clean.


Thanks so much for the info. It has cleaned up nicely and I don't think it needs to soak. I'm not sure what you mean by CA but when I do, I'll do it straight away.


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## cotedupy (Mar 9, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> Thanks so much for the info. It has cleaned up nicely and I don't think it needs to soak. I'm not sure what you mean by CA but when I do, I'll do it straight away.



Haha... where are you from? It's called 'superglue' in other parts of the world, they call it CA glue in the states. Took me a while to realise what people were on about!

Sweet coti btw... you're on a roll . How big is it?


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## Skylar303 (Mar 9, 2022)

Starbond has a good variety of viscosity and dries clear. For example the 'thin' is the same as water. Medium like light oil. Heavy idk, maybe just regular viscosity as any tubed brand.


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## bsfsu (Mar 9, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Haha... where are you from? It's called 'superglue' in other parts of the world, they call it CA glue in the states. Took me a while to realise what people were on about!
> 
> Sweet coti btw... you're on a roll . How big is it?



I come from a land of super glue and gladwrap and fush n chups.

150x50x20

I need to see if I have some super glue somewhere, all I can find is contact adhesive...


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## cotedupy (Mar 9, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> I come from a land of super glue and gladwrap and fush n chups.
> 
> 150x50x20
> 
> I need to see if I have some super glue somewhere, all I can find is contact adhesive...



Ah of course, I'm being dim... even if I didn't follow you on instagram, the name alone is a bit of a giveaway!

Nice stone - you could fill it if you want, but you may not need to. BBW is particularly good for polishing work, and I don't know how superglue would work on soft steel.

(What did you think of that Charnley you picked up a while back btw...?)


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## Skylar303 (Mar 9, 2022)

If he decides to I would just fill from the side to stabilize. As I'm not sure how regular super glue would act against steel.


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## captaincaed (Mar 10, 2022)

Mystery Stone lapped and tidy. Gives a soft tan mud. Seems a bit hard for a sandstone, could be a nice mid grit stone that stays pretty flat for erasing low-grit scratches.

It's still dark from the oil on the surface, true color is underneath.


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## KingShapton (Mar 10, 2022)

captaincaed said:


> Mystery Stone lapped and tidy. Gives a soft tan mud. Seems a bit hard for a sandstone, could be a nice mid grit stone that stays pretty flat for erasing low-grit scratches.
> 
> It's still dark from the oil on the surface, true color is underneath.
> View attachment 169289
> View attachment 169290


I just took a closer look at the two pictures. And had a really crazy inspiration...

Is it possible that the exposure of the camera distorted/alienated the colors of the pictures? In the first picture, if you enlarge it, the structure of the surface looks a lot like a Belgian Blue, only the color of the stone on the pictures doesn't match... maybe it's also the oil in the stone?

Maybe you should put the stone in a Simple Green bath for a week?! It would be really interesting how the color of the stone changes.


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## cotedupy (Mar 10, 2022)

captaincaed said:


> Mystery Stone lapped and tidy. Gives a soft tan mud. Seems a bit hard for a sandstone, could be a nice mid grit stone that stays pretty flat for erasing low-grit scratches.
> 
> It's still dark from the oil on the surface, true color is underneath.
> View attachment 169289
> View attachment 169290



Sandstone sharpening stones tend to be very hard indeed. As if they weren’t then they’d just release a load of sand all the time and be useless. They’re also almost always a by-product of building stone quarries, so you need hard and wear-resistant for that too!

(Def a sandstone btw from those later pics.)


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## stringer (Mar 10, 2022)

captaincaed said:


> Mystery Stone lapped and tidy. Gives a soft tan mud. Seems a bit hard for a sandstone, could be a nice mid grit stone that stays pretty flat for erasing low-grit scratches.
> 
> It's still dark from the oil on the surface, true color is underneath.
> View attachment 169289
> View attachment 169290



Looks a lot like mine. 


Coarse side






Fine side


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## captaincaed (Mar 10, 2022)

It's not bad for a $6 thrift find!


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## stringer (Mar 10, 2022)

captaincaed said:


> It's not bad for a $6 thrift find!



Labelled bench size ones go for $50 all day long on the bay. They are a cool interesting stone to have around. Very useful for quick tool sharpening especially. Good shop stone.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 10, 2022)

stringer said:


> Looks a lot like mine.
> 
> 
> Coarse side
> ...


Does yours have little mica or quartzite flecks pretty evenly distributed across the surfaces? I have 2 mystery stones that came in that are kind of similar looking, just a bit darker. I'm pretty sure the 2 stones of mine are the same type at least. I tried one last night and it was like trying to sharpen on a peice of glass... Blade just sort of slid across the surface, tried water and glycerin/water mixture.

These are my 3 I'm pretty sure sandstone. The far left may or may not be a hino. (The shiny one, had extra sealer and that one just happened to come in.) 

First one has a different feel that the other 2. Right after lapping pretty coarse, but burnished smooth and almost reflective really quick, a lot of auto slurry. The other 2 feel pretty glassy, didn't get far on a SS blade. Don't have much variety of steels...


Right to left surface.




Sides.


Ends.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 10, 2022)

stringer said:


> Labelled bench size ones go for $50 all day long on the bay. They are a cool interesting stone to have around. Very useful for quick tool sharpening especially. Good shop stone.


It seems like you know a bit about sandstone stones. Have you ever heard of Oak Leaf brand?


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## Skylar303 (Mar 10, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Sandstone sharpening stones tend to be very hard indeed. As if they weren’t then they’d just release a load of sand all the time and be useless. They’re also almost always a by-product of building stone quarries, so you need hard and wear-resistant for that too!
> 
> (Def a sandstone btw from those later pics.)


Ha that makes sense... I think even at one point in our condos I mentioned. It might be sandstone but definitely harder than any sandstone I've seen.


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## stringer (Mar 10, 2022)

I'm not an expert. I have seen a couple of labelled queer creeks and one of the modern clear creek ones. There are two main varieties of the old ones. Some more blue grey and some more yellow beige. I have a few more that I suspect including that big bench stone. And a different reddish one with similar properties. The two on the right look like Queer Creeks. The one on the left looks different. More glassy. Less sandy. If I had to guess from the pic alone I would say Ark family. Washita-ish.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 10, 2022)

stringer said:


> I'm not an expert. I have seen a couple of labelled queer creeks and one of the modern clear creek ones. There are two main varieties of the old ones. Some more blue grey and some more yellow beige. I have a few more that I suspect including that big bench stone. And a different reddish one with similar properties. The two on the right look like Queer Creeks. The one on the left looks different. More glassy. Less sandy. If I had to guess from the pic alone I would say Ark family. Washita-ish.


Ah thanks for the tid-bit. I have an old queer creek in pretty bad shape that came with some other stones (for a while I was buying some pocket and hunting knife stones and buying a lot of randoms, wasn't good at playing the Mystery Stone game yet.) and it was an oil soaked one so it got put away with some other synthetics. I'll have to pull that out and some almost NOS India stones, although if they do preform better with oil I might find them a new home. 

Hah funny you mention that about the 1st stone. It definitely was coarser then the other 2 after lapping but quickly burnished into that glossy appearance it has now, almost glass like. Very frail stone, at first had a lot of sandy slurry now not so much. That one with some help have narrowed down to a sandstone, possibly a hindo. 

Yeah sorry for the bad pics. I'm not a camera magician like some of the people on here.


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## stringer (Mar 10, 2022)

And all of the ones I have seen that are labeled or I suspect have very tiny mica flakes


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## cotedupy (Mar 10, 2022)

Skylar303 said:


> Does yours have little mica or quartzite flecks pretty evenly distributed across the surfaces? I have 2 mystery stones that came in that are kind of similar looking, just a bit darker. I'm pretty sure the 2 stones of mine are the same type at least. I tried one last night and it was like trying to sharpen on a peice of glass... Blade just sort of slid across the surface, tried water and glycerin/water mixture.
> 
> These are my 3 I'm pretty sure sandstone. The far left may or may not be a hino. (The shiny one, had extra sealer and that one just happened to come in.)
> 
> ...



I reckon the one on the right looks like a Hindo. (That was the one I said I thought looked either Dalmore or Hindo before I think?).

And judging by the colour I think the one on the left is probably a Hindo too. It could be a funky coloured arkansas stone, but it should be quite easy to tell the difference when you lap, or looking up close...


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## deltaplex (Mar 11, 2022)

The one on the left looks like it could be a Hindo to me, but it's hard to tell from the pics if it has the telltale layers on the sides. I'll run down stairs and take some pics of mine to show you.


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## deltaplex (Mar 11, 2022)

So these are all Hindos (99% sure) and you can see how the sides look easiest on the square yellow one middle top.


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## deltaplex (Mar 11, 2022)

Since I was already taking pics, I've got a handful of stones that I need some help identifying. 

These first 4 are all natural, the two on the right look like arks of some sort, the middle left is some slate-y looking thing and the greenish one on the far left I've got no idea about (it's slow and fine on knives).

The next 3 are all likely synthetic, I think the RH one is just a thin Sic stone, the middle one could be a fine Sic, but I'm not certain, and the brown/reddish one on the left throws off a ton of mud with course grit in it leaving an even, distinct, scratch pattern.

The last one slurries very quickly, dishes very easily. and is relatively soft; still trying to figure out how to best use it, tbh.


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## cotedupy (Mar 11, 2022)

deltaplex said:


> Since I was already taking pics, I've got a handful of stones that I need some help identifying.
> 
> These first 4 are all natural, the two on the right look like arks of some sort, the middle left is some slate-y looking thing and the greenish one on the far left I've got no idea about (it's slow and fine on knives).
> 
> ...



The small one, 3rd in the first pic, is a Washita. 100% certain on that. Quite an old one too I guess, and should be a good 'un - the best old Washitas I've had look _very _similar to that.

The 4th is some kind of Soft Ark I assume.

No. 2 is difficult to say for sure, but with the saw marks and patterning there's a chance it could be a Thuri I'd have thought. How fine is it...?

Not sure about No.1, or the last yellow-ish stone, both sound quite interesting though. Maybe the yellow stone might be a soft Hindo? The surface of it looks like it'd be a possibility...


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## cotedupy (Mar 11, 2022)

deltaplex said:


> So these are all Hindos (99% sure) and you can see how the sides look easiest on the square yellow one middle top.



Pretty decent collection of Hindostans you've got there too! .


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## deltaplex (Mar 11, 2022)

I'll try to get some scratch patterns on a nakiri bevel to see if that sheds some light on things...


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## deltaplex (Mar 11, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> Pretty decent collection of Hindostans you've got there too! .


And I've got to mess around with them more because there's a decent amount of variation between the ones I've put some time in on.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 11, 2022)

deltaplex said:


> So these are all Hindos (99% sure) and you can see how the sides look easiest on the square yellow one middle top.


The left I have been on the fence about. Ah yeah I can definitely see the lines very clearly on a few. The left one is a strange one. Not actually trying a hindo I don't have a reference on things like hardness or feel. I have one tan that I whittled down to being an ark after thinking sandstone. But trying to lap it gave it away.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 11, 2022)

cotedupy said:


> I reckon the one on the right looks like a Hindo. (That was the one I said I thought looked either Dalmore or Hindo before I think?).
> 
> And judging by the colour I think the one on the left is probably a Hindo too. It could be a funky coloured arkansas stone, but it should be quite easy to tell the difference when you lap, or looking up close...


Yeah the right we thought dalmore or hindo. It had more distinctive features than the middle but the surfaces look very similar. If you can tell by lapping then the left definitely isn't an ark. So I guess I'll go with a hindo. And or a driveway stone someone sold me as a unknown.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 11, 2022)

deltaplex said:


> Since I was already taking pics, I've got a handful of stones that I need some help identifying.
> 
> These first 4 are all natural, the two on the right look like arks of some sort, the middle left is some slate-y looking thing and the greenish one on the far left I've got no idea about (it's slow and fine on knives).
> 
> ...


I want to put my guesses in before I look and see what some were ID. 

1st not sure but someone will with those streaky lines in the face. 

2. Slate, I think I've seen similar saw marks somewhere.

3. Looks like a melted washita.

4. Looks like a soft ark could be a Washita. One of my softs.



Next 3. First looks like a Franz swaty, 2nd maybe corundum, 3rd SiC?

The last one at first sort of gave me Jnat vibes with the saw marks on one end and the red splashes.


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## Desert Rat (Mar 11, 2022)

Skylar303 said:


> It seems like you know a bit about sandstone stones. Have you ever heard of Oak Leaf brand?


Simmons Hardware had a line of tools under the Oak Leaf brand.

Might take going through a number of vintage catalogs but it's probably in one of them.


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## Desert Rat (Mar 11, 2022)

stringer said:


> Looks a lot like mine.
> 
> 
> Coarse side
> ...


It might be an Ohio Blue oilstone.
Some think it's the same as the Queer creek but I have my doubts.
There is a town of Blue Stone around the Cleveland area. I think several grades of stones for sharpening came from the Cleveland quarries.


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## Skylar303 (Mar 11, 2022)

Desert Rat said:


> Simmons Hardware had a line of tools under the Oak Leaf brand.
> 
> Might take going through a number of vintage catalogs but it's probably in one of them.


Ah thanks I tried good ole' Google and was pretty slim on results. Interesting enough it's one that was branded for razor use.


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## bsfsu (May 18, 2022)

Picked up a new stone.













Any ideas


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## Desert Rat (May 18, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> Picked up a new stone.
> View attachment 180120
> View attachment 180121
> View attachment 180122
> ...


All kinds of ideas!

How big is that one? It doesn't look like the Clevland stones, what part of the world is it from if you don't mind me asking?

Did they use the side of it to sharpen picks or somthing?

I would mount it and put a water trough under it, even cut a tire suspended underneath it would work. Make my wife crank the handle.


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## bsfsu (May 18, 2022)

Desert Rat said:


> All kinds of ideas!
> 
> How big is that one? It doesn't look like the Clevland stones, what part of the world is it from if you don't mind me asking?
> 
> ...



It's this big compared to a Tri-ang.




It's maybe 50-60kg so it's not gonna be a travel stone....


If the Tri-ang didn't give it away, I'm in New Zealand. Dunedin, way down South.

The marks on the side are from when it was shaped? Maybe made in NZ, don't have a clue about age. It would have been on a farm for sharpening tools and sheep shears.


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## Desert Rat (May 25, 2022)

bsfsu said:


> It's this big compared to a Tri-ang.
> View attachment 180175
> 
> It's maybe 50-60kg so it's not gonna be a travel stone....
> ...


That's a big one for noncommercial use. Nice stone and a piece of history.

It might be BS but I have heard that leaving them in a water trough can cause the stones to sag out of round. I only have one that has a trough and I don't keep water in it. It's laying on it's side at the moment so the trough doesn't fill with rain water. Someone converted it to an electric motor. I have never tried it out because it needs a new belt and cord. I think I will get to it this summer. Despite being called grinding stones they don't remove much steel and work much finer than many would think.


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## natto (May 28, 2022)

Desert Rat said:


> It might be BS but I have heard that leaving them in a water trough can cause the stones to sag out of round.


Leaving a part of the stone under water will move the center of gravity.


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