# What stones for maintaining kasumi?



## tostadas (Jul 1, 2020)

What budget stones do you guys recommend for creating/maintaining kasumi finishes? Right now, I have very coarse stones for thinning and reprofiling, and also Shapton Pro 1/2/5k. None of these seem able to generate that hazy finish. I also have a lot of sandpaper in grits from 220 to 3000.

I'm trying not to get started into the other rabbit hole of JNats, but I might be willing to pick up maybe 1 stone if I can get a really nice result for not a lot of coin (<$70). I've read some good things about the King 800. Any tips you can share?


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## MowgFace (Jul 1, 2020)

King 800 with light pressure gives a good, albeit coarse, kasumi finish. I usually follow up my King 800 with the JNS Synthetic Red Aoto, or the Khao Men Natural. Ive also used the JKI Jinzo aoto in the store, and liked it slightly better than the JNS Synthetic Red.


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## Carl Kotte (Jul 1, 2020)

There’s a lot of info here on KKF. Use the search function (it Will tell you that the soft King stones are the answer )!
But for now: With the right technique most stones can be used to make a kasumi finish. Some synthetics make it easier than others. I found this post illuminating: 
You could probably use the stones you have for kasumi - but getting there (in terms of technique) might take some time. Go for it!


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## reagan (Jul 1, 2020)

He does finish with a Kitayama in the video which has natural stone particles I believe.


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## Carl Kotte (Jul 1, 2020)

reagan said:


> He does finish with a Kitayama in the video which has natural stone particles I believe.


True, he finishes with the kitayama, but all the steps taken toward that finish are made with Shapton glass stones (and they’re often considered hard and difficult for this kind of polishing). And things start to look kasumi polished well before the kitayama, right?


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## reagan (Jul 1, 2020)

Carl Kotte said:


> True, he finishes with the kitayama, but all the steps taken toward that finish are made with Shapton glass stones (and they’re often considered hard and difficult for this kind of polishing). And things start to look kasumi polished well before the kitayama, right?



Oh I totally agree with you. I practiced with a Rika before diving into Jnats


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## Carl Kotte (Jul 1, 2020)

reagan said:


> Oh I totally agree with you. I practiced with a Rika before diving into Jnats


Yeah Rika is nice


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## Knife2meatu (Jul 1, 2020)

reagan said:


> He does finish with a Kitayama in the video which has natural stone particles I believe.



Natural stone particles is something I read before getting a Kitayama as one of my first, and most hyped stones -- and in retrospect, after noticing it said about several other stones since, I feel like maybe it's nonsense. As far as I know, most if not all synthetic stones have binders, if not fillers, and "natural stone particles" could mean just about anything. Or so it seems to me.

I don't mean to direct this at you in particular; it's just something that gets tossed around, and I'm afraid it may be a lot like 'ceramic' stones...


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## Unstoppabo (Jul 1, 2020)

Load up 3k sandpaper with some mud from the Rika and just rub. King 800 mud makes things super hazy but it's like taping sand paper to the sides of your knife. A mix of mud from the SP stones you already have could do the trick too but I don't have any experience with them. Rub in one direction, stay away from the edge!


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## tostadas (Jul 1, 2020)

For producing a polished finish, I know that all existing scratches need to be removed before moving up to the next stone. When trying to do a kasumi finish, am I supposed to leave some of the coarser scratches so that scratches from different grits "blend" together?


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## Xenif (Jul 1, 2020)

+1 on the king 800, but its a rather rough finish. If you have a shapton pro 2k, try running a very thick slurry on it, I can get a rather decent kasumi


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## Robert Lavacca (Jul 1, 2020)

Learning how to work the mud and also learning how to use and control pressure etc matters most for me. I’ve used the shapton pro 2k and even the glass 2k in a progression. I think the king 800 is great but like said above, it’s a very rough finish. The JNS 6k i really enjoy for a kasumi progression as well. I also get a nice kasumi from the JKI 1k. Just about learning when to apply pressure and when to slow down and work the mud.


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## Matt Zilliox (Jul 1, 2020)

I dont use synths at all any more except for edge fixing. For kasumi, what do you want? hazy, lots of contrast, clean?

here are stones i recommend that you can find online fairly easily and not too expensive:
Uchigumori
Ao Suita
Many softer Marouyama stones
my preference is for 3-6k grit usually, and semi soft, but not too muddy.

nuance is rare on the cheaper stones, thus the prices of the expensive stones. 

thats why they say its a rabbit hole. you have stones which do a good job, stones which do a very good job, and stones which do incredible jobs. 

ease of use is another factor, as you begin, soft stones are a bit more forgiving, but as your skill increases, harder stones unlock new doors.


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## tostadas (Sep 4, 2020)

I've been reading some other threads on this topic and it seems that "Kasumi" and "Contrast" are often (incorrectly) used interchangably. Can someone explain the difference between the two, and also the processes to achieve each? Is it possible to have both?


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## inferno (Sep 4, 2020)

kasumi means haze. and it just means the hazy look. contrast is the difference in color between the edge steel and the cladding.
i want as dark as possible cladding and as bright and shiny as possible edge steel personally. 

some stones that works good for me:

king hyper 1k
naniwa pro 800 and 2k
shapton pro 1k (quite good actually)
imanishi bester 400
cleancut kitayama 4k (probably an imanishi 4k)
imanishi 10k 
suehiro ouka 3k (probably the same as cerax 3k)
suehiro cerax 8k


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## inferno (Sep 4, 2020)

forgot to mention: the lower in grit you go the daker the cladding will be generally. and the higher you go the shinier the cladding gets generally.
i think the best compromises so far is the naniwa pro 2k, ouka/cerax 3k, and kitayama 4k from cleancut (but it might be the same as the imanishi 4k).

those all give fairly dark cladding, and quite shiny and bright edge steel. and no silver streaks in the finish (like the king 1k hyper does).

the easiest ones to use and get a consistent finish from i think would be the suehiros, but all of the above are very very easy in comparison to other stones like shapton glass for instance.


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## tostadas (Sep 4, 2020)

inferno said:


> forgot to mention: the lower in grit you go the daker the cladding will be generally. and the higher you go the shinier the cladding gets generally.
> i think the best compromises so far is the naniwa pro 2k, ouka/cerax 3k, and kitayama 4k from cleancut (but it might be the same as the imanishi 4k).
> 
> those all give fairly dark cladding, and quite shiny and bright edge steel. and no silver streaks in the finish (like the king 1k hyper does).
> ...


Have you tried the medium grit Suehiro/Cerax, like in the 700-1k range?


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## inferno (Sep 4, 2020)

no but its probably good. i already have a few 1k stones that gives good contrast so i'm set there.

i just feel 1k is a bit too coarse looking. i like it at 2-4k, or even finer. 
the gray 6k glass hc is also good imo but not easy to use for that purpose.


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## naader (Sep 4, 2020)

tostadas said:


> What budget stones do you guys recommend for creating/maintaining kasumi finishes? Right now, I have very coarse stones for thinning and reprofiling, and also Shapton Pro 1/2/5k. None of these seem able to generate that hazy finish. I also have a lot of sandpaper in grits from 220 to 3000.
> 
> I'm trying not to get started into the other rabbit hole of JNats, but I might be willing to pick up maybe 1 stone if I can get a really nice result for not a lot of coin (<$70). I've read some good things about the King 800. Any tips you can share?


A good aizu is life changing and maruoyama shiro suita around 180x70x40 is about 200 bucks


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## inferno (Sep 5, 2020)

suehiro3k stainless clad


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 6, 2020)

+1 Aizu,,,


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## nakiriknaifuwaifu (Sep 6, 2020)

inferno said:


> suehiro3k stainless clad
> View attachment 93344



Probably in my top 3 favorite stones. Great finish @inferno What knife is that?


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## inferno (Sep 6, 2020)

a kurosaki nakiri.


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 7, 2020)

tostadas said:


> Is it possible to have both?



I'd say this is both. One of the best Kasumi finishes I've ever seen.


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## Barry's Knives (Sep 7, 2020)

Hanmak17 said:


> I'd say this is both. One of the best Kasumi finishes I've ever seen.


Was this done on bench stones though?


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 7, 2020)

Barry's Knives said:


> Was this done on bench stones though?


 Edit: @nutmeg I believe this was your work? Would you care to answer?


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 7, 2020)

Link to a great thread on the subject, if I remember correctly the photo above came from this thread:

Uchigumori show your work


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 7, 2020)

This was apparently done using synthetics


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## Hanmak17 (Sep 7, 2020)

I could go on, but I'll just post this last one cause this is the $hit in my book. Not technically "Kasumi" finish but impressive all the same

Damian Kordic work


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