# Yoshihiro whetstones.



## jwthaparc (Dec 1, 2020)

Has anyone tried the yoshihiro brand whetstones? I see them from time to time, and always wonder about how well they actually work. I have only seen information come from the company themselves about them. Does anyone own these, or heard anything about them?

At the very least they have a nice presentation. I think the clean minimalist look of them is what has me interested. Obviously performance is a lot more important though.


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## mpier (Dec 3, 2020)

I would like to know the answer to that question as well!!


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## jwthaparc (Dec 3, 2020)

mpier said:


> I would like to know the answer to that question as well!!


I'm starting to think the lack of answers is an answer in itself.


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## Benuser (Dec 3, 2020)

As there are only a few stone manufacturers, I guess those are rebranded ones. Once you know who is the original manufacturer it's much more likely to get reactions from members who have used them. 
In general, rebranded ones are much more expensive than the same stone sold under the manufacturer's own name. That explains why rebranded ones aren't that popular amongst members here.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 4, 2020)

Benuser said:


> As there are only a few stone manufacturers, I guess those are rebranded ones. Once you know who is the original manufacturer it's much more likely to get reactions from members who have used them.
> In general, rebranded ones are much more expensive than the same stone sold under the manufacturer's own name. That explains why rebranded ones aren't that popular amongst members here.


I couldn't find any info on who actually makes them. The nagura stone they offer looks just like the one that came with my kitayama though, and their stone fixer looks just like togiharu's pink 100 grit stone fixer. Really I have no idea though.


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## Benuser (Dec 4, 2020)

Let us just see if someone recognises them.


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## Jovidah (Dec 4, 2020)

The stone in the center looks a LOT like my Arashiyama 6k. The stand, color of the stone and naguara all matches; only the print on the top is different.
It's not a guarantee that those are the same though.
Also reminds me of the rebranded stones from JCK.

Otherwise I second what Benuser said; usually buying stones from a knife manufacturer just tends to give you a rebranded stone at a higher price. Doesn't mean they're bad stones though - just not necessarily the best deal. Though there's some exceptions; for example Watanabe has a pretty good price on his stones.


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## adam92 (Dec 4, 2020)

Jovidah said:


> The stone in the center looks a LOT like my Arashiyama 6k. The stand, color of the stone and naguara all matches; only the print on the top is different.
> It's not a guarantee that those are the same though.
> Also reminds me of the rebranded stones from JCK.
> 
> Otherwise I second what Benuser said; usually buying stones from a knife manufacturer just tends to give you a rebranded stone at a higher price. Doesn't mean they're bad stones though - just not necessarily the best deal. Though there's some exceptions; for example Watanabe has a pretty good price on his stones.


Agree, the center stone looks like my Arashiyama6k as well. everything matches.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 4, 2020)

adam92 said:


> Agree, the center stone looks like my Arashiyama6k as well. everything matches.


I think that stone is supposed to be 3k or something though.


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## mpier (Dec 4, 2020)

The only stone I’m really interested in is the 10000 grit, these are on sale now for under a hundred USD not a bad price for that grit and it would fill a void in my collection. I also can’t seem to find out if these are splash n go’s or soakers


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## jwthaparc (Dec 4, 2020)

mpier said:


> The only stone I’m really interested in is the 10000 grit, these are on sale now for under a hundred USD not a bad price for that grit and it would fill a void in my collection. I also can’t seem to find out if these are splash n go’s or soakers


I think they require a soak at lower grits. However the 6000 and higher are likely effectively splash and go even if they aren't intended to be. That's just a guess though, taken from my experience with other high grit soaking stones.


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## adam92 (Dec 4, 2020)

mpier said:


> The only stone I’m really interested in is the 10000 grit, these are on sale now for under a hundred USD not a bad price for that grit and it would fill a void in my collection. I also can’t seem to find out if these are splash n go’s or soakers


For high grit stone, maybe you can try kitayama 8k, Naniwa Snow white 8k, or shapton glass 16k, depand on how you want to finish, what steel & what purpose. 

Based on my experience, I had try JCK brand stone before, cutting was too slow for SG2. Liked 3 times slower than my cerax & shapton glass. I assume some rebrand stone is not very good.


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## mpier (Dec 4, 2020)

adam92 said:


> For high grit stone, maybe you can try kitayama 8k, Naniwa Snow white 8k, or shapton glass 16k, depand on how you want to finish, what steel & what purpose.
> 
> Based on my experience, I had try JCK brand stone before, cutting was too slow for SG2. Liked 3 times slower than my cerax & shapton glass. I assume some rebrand stone is not very good.


Already have both the Snow White and the kitayama, although my Snow White just denigrated me with cracks everywhere not sure why I take care of it just like my chosera’s with very very much care and I do love that stone, so sad. The kitayama is a great stone for a smokier finish I just wanted to try something with a brighter finer finish.


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## adam92 (Dec 4, 2020)

mpier said:


> Already have both the Snow White and the kitayama, although my Snow White just denigrated me with cracks everywhere not sure why I take care of it just like my chosera’s with very very much care and I do love that stone, so sad. The kitayama is a great stone for a smokier finish I just wanted to try something with a brighter finer finish.


For SW, I have the same problem, the clear nail polish can solve the problem. Seal bottom & side. 
Now my SW don't have the spider web cracking anymore.


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## mpier (Dec 4, 2020)

adam92 said:


> For SW, I have the same problem, the clear nail polish can solve the problem. Seal bottom & side.
> Now my SW don't have the spider web cracking anymore.


mine is glued to a stand so the bottom I can’t get to. Did you end up buying a new one and then sealing it.


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## adam92 (Dec 4, 2020)

M


mpier said:


> mine is glued to a stand so the bottom I can’t get to. Did you end up buying a new one and then sealing it.


My SW didn't have the stand, I thought SW suppose without stand? 

But you can remove stand, not hard.


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## Jovidah (Dec 4, 2020)

Wasn't glueing on a stand / backing a way to prevent it from breaking? I'd be inclined to keep it on the stand.


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## mpier (Dec 4, 2020)

There is one with the stand and one without the IF1001 is on the stand but it’s the same stone from what I understand. It’s so cracked now that I don’t think it would survive a base removal. I’m thinking about replacing it but with what? And that brings me back to my interest in the 10000k yoshihiro.


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## inferno (Dec 5, 2020)

mpier said:


> Already have both the Snow White and the kitayama, although my Snow White just denigrated me with cracks everywhere not sure why I take care of it just like my chosera’s with very very much care and I do love that stone, so sad. The kitayama is a great stone for a smokier finish I just wanted to try something with a brighter finer finish.



supeerstone 12k and shapton pro 8 and 12k will give you an almost mirror silver finish. no contrast at all.
cerax 8k a bright hazy kasumi. imanishi 10k low contrast bright but with some contrast depending on steel type.


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## inferno (Dec 5, 2020)

personally i wouldn't roll the dice on the yoshihiros. i see on their site that almost all the stone gits are also available in white.
so it could be anything. its just color anyway. the 10k white looks like an imanishi 10k. but its still just a white stone stamped with 10000 so it could be anything.

get something known to be good instead. its better to know what you get before.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 5, 2020)

inferno said:


> personally i wouldn't roll the dice on the yoshihiros. i see on their site that almost all the stone gits are also available in white.
> so it could be anything. its just color anyway. the 10k white looks like an imanishi 10k. but its still just a white stone stamped with 10000 so it could be anything.
> 
> get something known to be good instead. its better to know what you get before.


The site could always use a geauni pig. I mean, there is a chance that they were made by a quality manufacturer for them.


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## adam92 (Dec 5, 2020)

Jovidah said:


> Wasn't glueing on a stand / backing a way to prevent it from breaking? I'd be inclined to keep it on the stand.


I've been using SW without stand for R years, For the stone like SW, I think with/without is fine... 

There's no way SW will finish in short period. Maybe with stand is better, but i never try or actually need it.


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## inferno (Dec 5, 2020)

jwthaparc said:


> The site could always use a geauni pig. I mean, there is a chance that they were made by a quality manufacturer for them.



of course they are made by one of the more known factories. thats not the problem. the problem is that 1 you dont know which, and 2 you dont know what series of stones, or even if its some custom formula (highly unlikely).

and that results in you not knowing if they are splash and go or soakers. soft or hard. muddy or not. fast or slow. etc etc etc. basically everything one would want to know before buying a stone.

and even if you know all that. they can still be crap stones in the end

but hey its not my money.


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## adam92 (Dec 5, 2020)

inferno said:


> of course they are made by one of the more known factories. thats not the problem. the problem is that 1 you dont know which, and 2 you dont know what series of stones, or even if its some custom formula (highly unlikely).
> 
> and that results in you not knowing if they are splash and go or soakers. soft or hard. muddy or not. fast or slow. etc etc etc. basically everything one would want to know before buying a stone.
> 
> ...


Totally agree, if I'm purchase a stone, before i need to know all details, for mirror or kasumi, splash & go or soaker, hard or soft, etc... 
That's very important, otherwise just like gambling...


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## Kawa (Dec 5, 2020)

Someone was the first to buy and try a Shapton pro 1000,
He spread the word and now we all know what / how it is.

It can be fun the try a new stone. If you are looking to fill a specific gap you have, I wouldn't suggest it, because of what inferno said.

If you are looking for a 'high gritt stone' and you are up for an experiment, I don't think the stone will fail.
You will find out what it does and how it is different from your other stones. It will be of use to you, whatever it turns out to be. It might feel like a 6000 you allready have, but different. Maybe it feels more towards a 12k, but different. Accept how it feels and use it accordingly. Like i've learned from here, the grittnumber is just a number which only says 'coarse/medium/fine'. The number isnt science.


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## mpier (Dec 5, 2020)

Well as I did when I bought my first stone and my last one I am not one to through good money out the window I will generally always look for some reviews or feedback. I see there website has plenty of sharpening videos and advice so I think there reputable, but still odd there is so little info on them which does suggest they may not be great. Anyhow I’ll stick my head back down the rabbit hole and see what’s best for my next stone.


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## kayman67 (Dec 6, 2020)

mpier said:


> Already have both the Snow White and the kitayama, although my Snow White just denigrated me with cracks everywhere not sure why I take care of it just like my chosera’s with very very much care and I do love that stone, so sad. The kitayama is a great stone for a smokier finish I just wanted to try something with a brighter finer finish.



Naniwa Super Stone 10000 or Sigma 13k. Anything else I found sub in one area or another.


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## mpier (Dec 6, 2020)

kayman67 said:


> Naniwa Super Stone 10000 or Sigma 13k. Anything else I found sub in one area or another.


Would you suggest getting both of them or just one will do?


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## jwthaparc (Dec 6, 2020)

mpier said:


> Would you suggest getting both of them or just one will do?


Are you using it for knives or razors? If its just for knives you will be fine with just one of them I'm sure. 

As for the yoshihiro stones. I'm almost looking at it like jnats, except the risk isn't as big. Basically it could be amazing, or it could be mediocre. As far as brands go I would trust yoshihiro more than someone like Shaun (who also have there own line of stones I believe).

I know if I get some extra cash I might pick one up for myself, just to do a review for posterity. Maybe I can talk someone into grabbing it for me as a Christmas present.


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## kayman67 (Dec 7, 2020)

mpier said:


> Would you suggest getting both of them or just one will do?



Super Stone should be cheap enough to buy at some point, but I would start just with Sigma and see if it's enough.


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## shinyunggyun (Dec 7, 2020)

I've tried the yoshihiro 1000 stone before. It loads up like crazy. Made me mad. Cerax 1000 all the way.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 7, 2020)

shinyunggyun said:


> I've tried the yoshihiro 1000 stone before. It loads up like crazy. Made me mad. Cerax 1000 all the way.


What steel were you using?


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## shinyunggyun (Dec 7, 2020)

I've sharpened my sukenari zdp 189, akazawa aogami super, yoshihiro hap 40, and yoshihiro vg 10 on it. loads up with every one of them. I use mostly white steel now, and have not sharpened any of my white steel knives on it however. But I wouldn't be surprised if it loads up with that steel also.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 8, 2020)

shinyunggyun said:


> I've sharpened my sukenari zdp 189, akazawa aogami super, yoshihiro hap 40, and yoshihiro vg 10 on it. loads up with every one of them. I use mostly white steel now, and have not sharpened any of my white steel knives on it however. But I wouldn't be surprised if it loads up with that steel also.


Hmm. Ok. Were some better than others? Or were they more or less all the same?


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## shinyunggyun (Dec 8, 2020)

Same. It's not a good performing stone. I started using the Masahiro 1000 stone from knifemerchant next. The Masahiro completely outclassed that stone.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 8, 2020)

shinyunggyun said:


> Same. It's not a good performing stone. I started using the Masahiro 1000 stone from knifemerchant next. The Masahiro completely outclassed that stone.


Good to know. What would you compare the masahiro to?


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## shinyunggyun (Dec 8, 2020)

jwthaparc said:


> Good to know. What would you compare the masahiro to?


The Masahiro 1000 is the muddiest and fastest dishing medium grit stone I have used. The closest thing to a stone like this would be the Gesshin 1000. But I use neither of them too much anymore. I do sushi, and I have to sharpen my yanagiba constantly. And I find that it is much easier to do that on the Cerax 1000 because the Cerax doesn't dish as fast as the Gesshin or Masahiro. I like my stone to be as flat as it can be when sharpening my yanagiba. I use the Cerax for all my gyutos as well. I freakin love that cerax. And for my finishing stone, I use the Masahiro 3000. Unlike the Masahiro 1000, the 3000 doesn't dish as fast, and it is also a super smooth and great feeling stone to sharpen on. It is also possibly the cheapest high quality 3000 stone you can get.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 8, 2020)

shinyunggyun said:


> The Masahiro 1000 is the muddiest and fastest dishing medium grit stone I have used. The closest thing to a stone like this would be the Gesshin 1000. But I use neither of them too much anymore. I do sushi, and I have to sharpen my yanagiba constantly. And I find that it is much easier to do that on the Cerax 1000 because the Cerax doesn't dish as fast as the Gesshin or Masahiro. I like my stone to be as flat as it can be when sharpening my yanagiba. I use the Cerax for all my gyutos as well. I freakin love that cerax. And for my finishing stone, I use the Masahiro 3000. Unlike the Masahiro 1000, the 3000 doesn't dish as fast, and it is also a super smooth and great feeling stone to sharpen on. It is also possibly the cheapest high quality 3000 stone you can get.


Have you tried the shapton 1000 or chosera 800? Those both stay flat for quite a while, even better than the cerax. If you you haven't you should definitely give them a chance.


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## shinyunggyun (Dec 8, 2020)

I tried them. I don't really like those ones. They are overly hard, and I don't like the way they feel. And their feedback is also not as great as everyone says.


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## mpier (Dec 8, 2020)

shinyunggyun said:


> I've tried the yoshihiro 1000 stone before. It loads up like crazy. Made me mad. Cerax 1000 all the way.


Thanks for the input.


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## Steel+Fire (Dec 8, 2020)

Hello. I have the exact set of stones in question. The set was a gift from my sister 3 years ago for Christmas and I have used them extensively since then. I also have other brands and a couple JNats as well.

I think this is a solid set of stones but you can do much better buying individual stones. I also have the 400 grit Yoshihiro stone which I purchased later.

The 400 grit is great as is the 1000 grit. I see some people who mentioned that the 1000 grit glazes or loads very quickly. I just refresh the face of the stone with a nagura when I notice this so it has not been a huge issue to me. The 400 grit doesn't have this issue only the 1000 grit in my experience. The 3000 and to a lesser degree the 9000 grit stones (likely because I rarely use it) seem very muddy and do not feel gritty at all. They definitely remove metal as they produce muddy swarf while using them. I just do not like the feedback they provide. I have bought other high grit stones to find ones I like. The Suehiro Rika 5K is my favorite synthetic finisher right now for kitchen knives and it gets used in my progression most of the time. The 3000 grit Yoshihiro gets used too but when I do I usually start looking at 3000 grit options to replace it. Not sure I need to since I do not have issues producing good edges, I just do not like the waxy no friction feel as compared to other stones.

Like I said, you can do better getting individual stones. This was a great set of stones to get me started especially since it was a gift.


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## Steel+Fire (Dec 8, 2020)

Follow up on my last. I soak my stones for 15-20 minutes and the finer the grit the longer it soaks. The literature that accompanied the set instructed the user to soak for at 10 minutes.

I have knives in Aogami 1, 2 and Super; Shirogami 1 and 2; VG-10; Chromax; and whatever Kono uses for the HD2.

The 3000 and I awanna say 9000 stones came with a silly 1000 grit nagura which makes not much sense. The wooden stands are fine. I dry my rocks on a book shelf standing upright so they get really good airflow. I do not have issues with mold but YMMV. I actually do like the mounted stones as no matter how worn they get I will always be able to use them in my stone holder. At some point my Rika and other stones will need to be glued to a wood block to ensure the backhalf of the stone can be used.

These stones are 3 years old and have held up great. Over priced, so like I said look around at other options.


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## coffeelover191919 (Dec 11, 2020)

kayman67 said:


> Naniwa Super Stone 10000 or Sigma 13k. Anything else I found sub in one area or another.


Why would anyone need a 10k or 13k stone for a kitchen knife? What do u slice with it and what does it feel like?


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## M1k3 (Dec 11, 2020)

coffeelover191919 said:


> Why would anyone need a 10k or 13k stone for a kitchen knife? What do u slice with it and what does it feel like?


If you're technique is good, like a scalpel. But disappearing fast against poly and other harder cutting boards.


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## mpier (Dec 11, 2020)

coffeelover191919 said:


> Why would anyone need a 10k or 13k stone for a kitchen knife? What do u slice with it and what does it feel like?


It has nothing to do with that, it’s more for project knives, refurbishing, straight razors and just plain fun. No it don’t want or need a high polished edge for cutting food. I will put my yanagiba on it once in awhile to polish it out but not the edge.


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## inferno (Dec 11, 2020)

coffeelover191919 said:


> Why would anyone need a 10k or 13k stone for a kitchen knife? What do u slice with it and what does it feel like?



because its cool


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## mpier (Dec 11, 2020)

There are times I put a high polished edge on a knife for friends or customers if I know that they primarily use it as a show piece or sometimes just for practice you know LOOK WHAT I CAN DO!!


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## kayman67 (Dec 12, 2020)

coffeelover191919 said:


> Why would anyone need a 10k or 13k stone for a kitchen knife? What do u slice with it and what does it feel like?



I cut anything with it, from obviously cooking ingredients to cloth and other stupid stuff. Knives are tools. 

There is a huge misconception about high grit stones.


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## Jovidah (Dec 12, 2020)

Wasn't the misconception that it's worth bothering going that high?


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## kayman67 (Dec 12, 2020)

That it does nothing or the edge will be lost in seconds or that razor sharp is not needed or that polished equals inability to cut most vegetable skin, meat and so on. 
I think this discussion happened already several times. Sides are well consistent. Might just be one of those situations where it is a different perspective for different guys. Fine grits, in my book, aren't related to razor sharp edges to start with. That can be obtained easily enough with very coarse grits (think ~100). What can't be done, that I want, is to obtain a closed edge with the added resilience. Won't do wonders for everything. But that's not the main issue. It's not that easy to do so. I think it's easier, to some extent, to obtain a usable edge, even shaving capable, from a (very) coarse grit, than the refinement to the point where the edge is not ruined by the sharpening process itself and will perform great for longer. So it's more of a principle thing. If it can be done, why not. Give it enough practice and it doesn't need much more extra effort either. Anyway, this made me have the best edge with ZDP, after Sigma 13k. But that's a different problem. Not every or any high grit (or any grit) will behave the same with any alloy. This making testing even more problematic.


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## jwthaparc (Dec 12, 2020)

kayman67 said:


> That it does nothing or the edge will be lost in seconds or that razor sharp is not needed or that polished equals inability to cut most vegetable skin, meat and so on.
> I think this discussion happened already several times. Sides are well consistent. Might just be one of those situations where it is a different perspective for different guys. Fine grits, in my book, aren't related to razor sharp edges to start with. That can be obtained easily enough with very coarse grits (think ~100). What can't be done, that I want, is to obtain a closed edge with the added resilience. Won't do wonders for everything. But that's not the main issue. It's not that easy to do so. I think it's easier, to some extent, to obtain a usable edge, even shaving capable, from a (very) coarse grit, than the refinement to the point where the edge is not ruined by the sharpening process itself and will perform great for longer. So it's more of a principle thing. If it can be done, why not. Give it enough practice and it doesn't need much more extra effort either. Anyway, this made me have the best edge with ZDP, after Sigma 13k. But that's a different problem. Not every or any high grit (or any grit) will behave the same with any alloy. This making testing even more problematic.


You hit the nail on the head at the end. I sharpen a lot of cheap knives with horrible steels for people, and if I go above 800 grit with some steels it basically turns into a butter knife. However with my aogami, shirogami, and vg10, I can go up to 8000+ and the edge will slice through anything like a breeze. It really makes a difference with the heat treatment, and if the type of steel is even meant to be used on a knife (in the case of some of the gas station knives people have me sharpen, I doubt it is.)


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## inferno (Dec 13, 2020)

i like the 12k shapton pro. it makes the blades feel truly scary sharp. so sharp that you have to concentrate pretty hard on never ever letting the edge touch your fingers. 
it just slides through everything like it wasn't even there basically.


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