# In need of a quality workhorse stone (or two)



## btbyrd (Apr 13, 2018)

I started out sharpening with a cheap combo stone, a 2k synthetic, and a 6k King Ice Bear finishing stone. Needless to say, these aren't great. Then I picked up a set of extra coarse/coarse and medium/fine DMT duo plates. These cut well, but aren't stones. I also picked up an Edge Pro with 3 Shapton Glass stones. I like this setup for getting consistent angles on my longer blades, but it's not the same as having decent stones. And I have the Takeda handheld thing. Okay. But not stones.

So I'd like to pick up a medium grit stone and a decent finishing stone that will be my everyday sharpeners/polishers. I am still a novice sharpener, but I know enough to have an idea of what I don't know. I don't have strong preferences in terms of material, but I don't want to spend hundreds of dollars on a single stone. (Well, I _want _to...) And I also would like to avoid stones that are overly fussy about how they're dried or stored. This narrows it down a bit. I've been thinking about getting a pair of Shapton glass "stones" simply because of their durability and ease of care. But they don't dish up mud, and might not provide The Real Sharpening Experience. But if they cut and polish just fine, I kind of don't care.

The knives I'll be sharpening are mostly medium hardness superblue or blue 2. Suggestions for some better-than-budget stones that won't break and won't break the bank?


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## Marcelo Amaral (Apr 13, 2018)

Where are you located and how much are you spending of this stone? From what you said, it sounds like you'd favor a splash and go stone over a soaker. Also, what are you looking for in a new stone that you current setup doesn't offer (faster, better feedback, toothier edge etc)?


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## Jovidah (Apr 13, 2018)

Actually I wouldn't necesarily go splash & go for 'no fuss'. They're no fuss in that they are the quickest to start sharpening with a dry stone (no soak time), but they are usually the most picky when it comes to drying / storage after use - especially magnesia stones (like the chosera). A soaker might actually be the easier option there, especially if you have the ability to permasoak.


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## labor of love (Apr 13, 2018)

Jovidah said:


> Actually I wouldn't necesarily go splash & go for 'no fuss'. They're no fuss in that they are the quickest to start sharpening with a dry stone (no soak time), but they are usually the most picky when it comes to drying / storage after use - especially magnesia stones (like the chosera). A soaker might actually be the easier option there, especially if you have the ability to permasoak.



+1 I agree with this. A splash and go stone has to be pretty special if Im going to own it. Id rather own all soakers. But theres so many good splash and go stones out there so its hard to avoid them. Ironically my next stone purchase will likely be a no soak splash and go (gesshin 320grit)


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## K813zra (Apr 13, 2018)

Meh, I am lazy with synthetics stones and have never had an issue with splash and goes so long as they were shaptons.  Pro, glass, M series it really doesn't matter. If I want good feedback I go for a natural, which is also splash and go.


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## btbyrd (Apr 13, 2018)

I'm located in the US. I don't have a firm budget, but I'd say that anything over $150 is right out (unless I can get something special for a few dollars more). My current setup is essentially the bottom of the barrel, unless I'm using the Edge Pro. The DMTs are mostly for reprofiling. My combo stone is very soft, dishes a lot, and doesn't cut. I'm not averse to soakers so long as they're not too fussy about drying and storage (and don't dish too much).


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## Marcelo Amaral (Apr 13, 2018)

If i had to start over again with synths, i would get a AI#1000 from Watanabe and a JKI 4k. First should be splash and go, the second a soaker. Never used the AI#1000, and i'm willing to try it one day, but if speed is your priority, those should be among the fastest of their grit. I also like JNS 1k (Matukusuyama) as it shouldn't be as fast as AI#1000, but it doesn't dish a lot and it is still fast. Also, the new model is splash and go.

As for a no fuss stone, my experience is that the soakers once they get the amount of water they need, they take considerably more time to dry than a splash and go. My JKI 4k takes from 3 days to a week to dry to a point when i'm ok to putting it back in its cartoon box while the JNS 1k, JNS Aoto or Takenoko 8k takes maximum 2 days.


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## K813zra (Apr 13, 2018)

Marcelo Amaral said:


> If i had to start over again with synths, i would get a AI#1000 from Watanabe and a JKI 4k. First should be splash and go, the second a soaker. Never used the AI#1000, and i'm willing to try it one day, but if speed is your priority, those should be among the fastest of their grit. I also like JNS 1k (Matukusuyama) as it shouldn't be as fast as AI#1000, but it doesn't dish a lot and it is still fast. Also, the new model is splash and go.
> 
> As for a no fuss stone, my experience is that the soakers once they get the amount of water they need, they take considerably more time to dry than a splash and go. My JKI 4k takes from 3 days to a week to dry to a point when i'm ok to putting it back in its cartoon box while the JNS 1k, JNS Aoto or Takenoko 8k takes maximum 2 days.



Hah, was about to say. You like fast stones, don't you!


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## daveb (Apr 13, 2018)

Me thinks you would be very well served with JKI's 1 and 6k diamond plates. You would have to reach a little deeper at first but you would be out of the stone shopping business forever with a nice pair of stones that will perform well on any knife. Many here, including myself, enjoy the sharpening process and have a few favorites to play with. But for pure utility you can't touch the plates. And that price tag only hurts for a little bit:cool2:


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## K813zra (Apr 13, 2018)

daveb said:


> Me thinks you would be very well served with JKI's 1 and 6k diamond plates. You would have to reach a little deeper at first but you would be out of the stone shopping business forever with a nice pair of stones that will perform well on any knife. Many here, including myself, enjoy the sharpening process and have a few favorites to play with. But for pure utility you can't touch the plates. And that price tag only hurts for a little bit:cool2:



That is a good point. Considering many of us, as you said, have our favorites I am sure we have much more than what those two stones cost into our 'collections'. Hell, I have more than that in some single stones.


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## btbyrd (Apr 13, 2018)

I appreciate hearing about options like the JKI diamond plates. Though they're a bit more expensive than I was looking to spend, they look like great values for the money. I wonder how they compare to the Shapton glass, which are a bit cheaper per stone. I'm sure they're more durable, being diamond. But would I be better served by getting a range of grits in glass versus the two in diamond?


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## daveb (Apr 13, 2018)

A Google search on the plates will find them described as "game changers". Sharpton has their fans but.....8


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## skewed (Apr 14, 2018)

I am jumping in to echo... the JKI diamond plates are well worth the investment. Splash and go, cut fairly quick, require hardly any maintenance and leave you with an excellent edge. Oh and they are not messy/muddy at all. Once I got this set I stopped perma soaking my other stones. I still use my soakers from time to time since they feel a bit nicer while grinding away but I don't think they leave as good of an edge.


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## Marcelo Amaral (Apr 14, 2018)

JKI diamond plates are awesome and work better than almost all the stones i tried on high quality, hard to sharpen steels.


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## Marcelo Amaral (Apr 15, 2018)

Just want to clarify that by "better" i mean faster.


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## btbyrd (Apr 16, 2018)

While I'm still taking a hard look at the JKI diamond stones, I ordered a 1K Shapton glass stone to test the waters and see how I like the feel of it. For only $65 or so, I couldn't resist an audition. I'm thinking of getting a range of lower grit shaptons (500, 1k, 3 or 4k) and maybe picking up a nicer mid-fine finishing stone (like perhaps the JKI 6k) to round things out. The Shaptons are inexpensive-ish at the lower end of the grit range, but they seem like less of a value at higher grits.


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## K813zra (Apr 16, 2018)

btbyrd said:


> While I'm still taking a hard look at the JKI diamond stones, I ordered a 1K Shapton glass stone to test the waters and see how I like the feel of it. For only $65 or so, I couldn't resist an audition. I'm thinking of getting a range of lower grit shaptons (500, 1k, 3 or 4k) and maybe picking up a nicer mid-fine finishing stone (like perhaps the JKI 6k) to round things out. The Shaptons are inexpensive-ish at the lower end of the grit range, but they seem like less of a value at higher grits.



When it comes to SG stones I think the 500 and 3k are the standouts. To me they are the two in the series that have the best feel in use and easiest to read feedback. ymmv


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## daveb (Apr 16, 2018)

Going in with a Sharpton is analogous to buying a Food Saver as your first vacuum sealer. Yes they work, and some work well but you're going to go for a mid range strip sealer soon and then end up with a chamber sealer. And then wonder why you didn't start there in the first place.


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## K813zra (Apr 16, 2018)

Idk, 34 natural stones in (yeah, I ordered another one) and dozens of synthetics and I still love my shapton pro 2k. Probably one of my favorite stones of all time. Maybe that makes me a masochist or something.


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## labor of love (Apr 16, 2018)

K813zra said:


> Idk, 34 natural stones in (yeah, I ordered another one) and dozens of synthetics and I still love my shapton pro 2k. Probably one of my favorite stones of all time. Maybe that makes me a masochist or something.



Which knives are you using all those stones for?


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## K813zra (Apr 16, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Which knives are you using all those stones for?



Tanaka G3 and B#2 210's
Masamoto KS 240
Konosuke HD2 240
Misono Dragon 270/240/180
Masakage Yuki 210
Gesshin Ginga 210 (white #2)
Fujiwara FKH 180 
Watanabe 165 santoku
Tojiro 165 santoku

Asorted Miyabi, shun etc as well. Petty knives and a few honesuki as well. 

I have had probably about a dozen catch and release as well. No single bevels other than the Tojiro Yani tester I had for awhile simply to check scratch patterns but I find a wide bevel works fine for that. 

19 naturals and 6 synthetics are currently on the rack in rotation and others have been catch and release.

Honestly, I really just love to sharpen and don't NEED to do it that often which is why I keep around 'testers' to dull out and sharpen also try in different natural progressions to see how the wide(ish) bevel polishes up. (Tojiro shirogami and Takana KU.)

Edit: If you count the knives that I keep sharpened for my wife, can be quite the chore, there is also the Misono UX-10 180, Suisin inox western 180, 150 and 90mm knives. I sharpen my mothers knives too. Also Suisin Inox western. (Those like a binsui finish most of the time.)


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## btbyrd (Apr 16, 2018)

daveb said:


> Going in with a Sharpton is analogous to buying a Food Saver as your first vacuum sealer. Yes they work, and some work well but you're going to go for a mid range strip sealer soon and then end up with a chamber sealer. And then wonder why you didn't start there in the first place.



As someone who started with a chamber vac, this makes sense. But with that said, theres still way more information about the Shaptons available online. Some really dont appear to like the feel/feedback of the JKI 1K diamond. Still, the set has quite the allure. I got the Shapton mostly because it was a third the price and seemed to be well enough regarded. Im sure its only a matter of time before I try thr JKI stones and see what Im missing.


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## Carey59 (Apr 17, 2018)

K813zra said:


> Idk, 34 natural stones in (yeah, I ordered another one) and dozens of synthetics and I still love my shapton pro 2k. Probably one of my favorite stones of all time. Maybe that makes me a masochist or something.



Agreed.


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## skewed (Apr 18, 2018)

btbyrd said:


> Some really dont appear to like the feel/feedback of the JKI 1K diamond. Still, the set has quite the allure.



They really don't feel bad at all. Nothing like a DMT diamond plate. I am just partial to the feedback of the 1.2k bester. I still use the JKI 1k vitrified more often. It doesn't clog up (bester does a little bit), just needs a splash, leaves a better edge and doesn't require flattening (for the most part). I think it is mostly out of nostalgia that I soak up the bester for a session from time to time.


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## Keith Sinclair (Apr 29, 2018)

Fan of the Gesshin soakers, keep ones I'm using permasoaked in plastic container with snap top lid. 1K X-large is a great deal at 100.00 can sharpen best to average blades on that stone. 

Like the Shapton Pro 2K as a touch up stone, just splash some water on it & hone your edge. Good for potable situations plastic case can be used as a base.

Advantage of the JKI diamond stones is they will last without dishing. Also you don't need to use as much finger pad pressure.


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## holdmyphone (Apr 29, 2018)

Maybe I'm the only one, but I use a King KDS 1000/6000 stone for all my regular sharpening and get great results, love it!


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