# Porsches



## Cipcich (Oct 29, 2011)

I've always wanted a Porsche, but only now have actually seriously considered buying one (used). My Hondas are no fun.
If anyone owns one, or used to own one, I'd like to hear about it.


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## Salty dog (Oct 29, 2011)

Save yourself 30K and consider a John Cooper Works Mini Cooper S Coupe.


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## mainaman (Oct 29, 2011)

Get your self Toyota Supra


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## mhenry (Oct 29, 2011)

Lancer Evolution 8, 9, or 10


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## Keith Neal (Oct 29, 2011)

The Porsche Boxter is, in my opinion, the best looking car available, as well as being the best handling. It is a dream to drive. Do it once and you will never go back.


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## MadMel (Oct 29, 2011)

Salty dog said:


> Save yourself 30K and consider a John Cooper Works Mini Cooper S Coupe.


 
+1 on that

Or get a Nissan GTR


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## ecchef (Oct 29, 2011)

Not quite the same mystique though. If you always wanted a P-wagon, then why not?


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## l r harner (Oct 29, 2011)

find a flat nose whale tale i also liek the boxed fendered ones 
as much the bastard child as it is i am a fan of the 944 look


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## ecchef (Oct 29, 2011)

Nuthin' wrong with that Butch!

When I was young I used to get a chubby at the mere mention of a 914. :laughat:

Wound up with a couple of Karmann Ghias. Not quite the same.


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## 9mmbhp (Oct 29, 2011)

If you want one buy one! You only live once. 

The P-car bug hit me hard back in the late 90s and I owned both a '88 3.2L Carrera and a '89 928 S4 for a couple of years. The total investment for both cars was about US$40k. Other than washing/waxing, tires and regular oil and brake fluid changes I had no maintenance issues with them. For 10-15 year old cars (at the time) they were comfortable, reliable, solid (built like tanks) and extremely fun to drive. 

The 928 was the ultimate 2 person touring car, built to cruise at 120mph+ - the 5L V8 32v motor was a torque-y thing (315hp/330ft-lbs) and acceleration was never an issue. At any speed in any gear, push the pedal and it GOES. At the time I don't think there were any contemporary production cars that could match the 928's acceleration from 70-120. 

The 911 was much more of a "sports" car -- really not all that fast but small, quick and tossable, just plain fun to drive because of how it involved all the senses with the feedback it provided through the suspension, steering and pedals. And nothing sounds like that flat-6 motor chuffing loudly behind you.

Both cars were what I would describe as requiring high-effort: steering was on the heavy side and pedal effort as well (the 911 had a racing clutch which didn't help). The cars encouraged you to put some work into driving and getting the most out of them. I've never gotten the same feeling from say an Audi or BMW though I don't have that much experience with either. 

One of the best quotes I ever read about driving a 911 goes something along the lines of needing to treat it like a rambunctious labrador puppy who loves to play rough and tumble and get a little dirty. Every once in a while you just need to grab him by the scruff of the neck, give him a good shake and show him who's boss.

One of these days I'd like to own another Porsche. A 993 is what I lust for since it is the last of the air-cooled flat-6s but a Cayman would be fine too.


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## The hekler (Oct 29, 2011)

If your looking for fun go with the Nissan GT-R. Better in every measurable way then most 911 models and priced closer to the caymen. More practical, safer, closer to your Hondas in reliability, and a less common sight a clear winner. If your looking for "the look" and a much nicer badge, cleaner look, more prestige Porsche is the answer. Boxster is too much a girls car, Caymen or "coxster" as Jermey Clarkson calls it is "underengineered, a great car but you get the feeling it could have been better if they weren't worried about pushing into 911 territory," the 911 well it's a constantly improving icon. For transparency I have never driven any of these cars but they are a passion and I have read many reviews, and enjoy rehashing the knowledge as my own. The Porsche/GTR choice has been something the I have been imagining mulling over since the GT-R was reintroduced, I doubt I am of much help but I cannot resist talking cars at every opportunity.


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## SpikeC (Oct 29, 2011)

For me, there is a very real difference in feel between the German and Japanese cars. If you are of northern European descent, the German cars are designed for you, and the fit and feel are unique. I find this true in motorcycles as well, I have had Japanese, Italian, English and German bikes and the German ones just work best for mu body.
YMMV, really!


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## Pensacola Tiger (Oct 29, 2011)

Everyone should own a Porsche, once.


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## cnochef (Oct 29, 2011)

I really love the classic 911, but I'm a big guy so I have a Mercedes E320 instead. 

If I had an extra bag of cash maybe I'd buy a Panamera for road trips, though.


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## 9mmbhp (Oct 29, 2011)

SpikeC said:


> For me, there is a very real difference in feel between the German and Japanese cars.



Quite right. 

I had a Supra turbo for a while and it was a fun car but zero personality. A friend's Mitsubishi 3000GT twin turbo was similarly bland. 

For a daily driver on public roads with traffic, what is important is not the ultimate performance of the vehicle but the driving experience that it provides. IMO, Japanese cars intentionally insulate you from that experience while German cars intentionally involve all your senses.


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## EdipisReks (Oct 29, 2011)

if this is going to be a daily driver, i'd get an M3 instead. for a weekender, its hard to beat a GT3. i've never been behind the wheel of a 997 GT3, but the 996 was killer.


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## zitangy (Oct 29, 2011)

Cipcich said:


> I've always wanted a Porsche, but only now have actually seriously considered buying one (used). My Hondas are no fun.
> If anyone owns one, or used to own one, I'd like to hear about it.


 
Used to own a 911sc targa 1982 model and 944turbo model. Between the for comfort, i prefer the 944t.. For exhiliration when driving.. The 911. I wld steer clear of the convertibles or targa for 2 reasons.. Leak problem and wind noise above 120km. Quite intolerable. Ditto for the E320 convertibles. As for turbos i wld also stay clear as the consumption can be double when going full throttle all the way. Used to clock 400km each way at 190km consistantly..
Every week to my other office. Currently relegated to mitsubishi airtrek turbo and the petrol consumption is high. Managing it by driving below 120km

Whatever yr choice have fun.


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## Cipcich (Oct 29, 2011)

Wow. The mind reels.
Not of Northern European extraction, but I lived in Germany 1959-62, at an impressionable age.
I've bought Honda Civics like they were toaster ovens for the past 20 years, but they're about as much fun.
Last time I drove a Porsche was 35+ years ago, when a friend handed me the keys to a 1969 911S, and we spent the afternoon racing around the (short) mountains east of San Diego. It was like flying a jet.
Much to consider.


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## Salty dog (Oct 29, 2011)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> Everyone should own a Porsche, once.



Kinda like a Kramer.


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## jheis (Oct 30, 2011)

If you want one, buy one!

I've owned an '82 928 5sp for 17 years. It has been the most reliable, economical car I've ever owned - of course I do all my own wrenching - the first thing I did was drop $400 for the 9 volume factory shop manual - if you can't do your own work, look elsewhere, the stealership will bleed you dry _fast_. Your local dealer, Sonnen, charges $175/hr for labor last time I checked. 

I recently added an '89 S4 928 to my stable. Rare combination of 5sd, Sport suspension, and Limited slip dif. Basically a solid car in need of some TLC. It had been driven *1,600* miles since 2006!

The '82 is quick, the '89 is bloody *FAST*.

An unequaled source of Porsche knowledge and advice can be found on rennlist.com.

If you find a car that you are interested in, a pre-purchase inspection is mandatory (unless you know the cars _really_ well). I'd recommend Deven Wailes at HiTech Automotive in San Rafael - straight shooter.

James


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## mano (Nov 1, 2011)

Porsche... I love sitting on mine when the weather is nice smoking a cigar, drink in hand and chatting with friends.


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## Marko Tsourkan (Nov 1, 2011)

Always liked Porsche. I have spent a few years in Germany and got spoiled with good beer and good cars around (as an observer. I don't drive). 

M


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## chazmtb (Nov 1, 2011)

Yes, Porsches are nice, except when they go to the shop. If you have money to play, then they are great fun and practical for an "exotic".

If you don't have the money to spend and want some better reliability, get a Nissan 370Z Track edition. Very fun and tossable, with pretty darn good power.


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## zitangy (Nov 1, 2011)

They can be costly to maintain unless you can do minor installations and repairs yourself. Not many use it as a daily car though and service it once a year. I used to change the engine oil myself and keep a stock of engine oil filters as it is a daily car.It has been reported that the Engine can lasts.. 400,000km ( not the 70s engines) without an engine overhaul. I used to buy parts from US. I noticed that on the air-cooled engines ( till manufacture year 2000), a common problem was oil leak from the engine.. always. Just to "drop" the engine to fix it cost too much money. Perhaps also on the air-cooled engine it reached the potential power output as the Japanese turbos were matching closely; if not surpassing it. I used to have the Evos out running me as my old 911SC Targa(1982 3.0cc) had a power output 200 bhp and the 944T ( 1986, 2.4cc)(and the Evos were doing about 260bhp. Hell, I even had a modified Honda Accord ( modified one, I wld like to assume) going past me beyond 200km speed as I don't drive past beyond 200; perhaps the wind speed and being a lower car does make seem faster ( fear or too much adrenalin flowing). Technology in engines changes too much and I doubt that I would go for the mid 80s or 90s Porshe, unless I can drop a newer engine.

I have also sourced for reconditioned engines and parts ( upgraded brake system, gearbox and accessories and suspension) from the US.Been doing that since the 70s, visiting local wreck shops and salvaging re-usable and reconditioned parts for my 2002 then.

AS to convertibles.. it is fun when you are driving alone... wind in your hair and you against the elements. Hell you can also drive in the rain ( a light/moderate one though) as it creates a wind cushion till you stop! But when you have a passenger, you cant have a decent conversation as the wind noise does get to you above 120km. So basically, convertibles are fun when you are alone and cruising and with the family.

IF I can afford it might go for an old one ( post yr 2000 manufacture a normal coupe, S series and non turbo) when I turn 60 in a few years time as the "itch" is still there and enjoying looking at junk yards ( on the net) for parts to upgrade and giving it a good week-end run over 400km stretch, visit friends and have a nice lunch... The days of polishing the car and ready to go out for a "Saturday Night Fever" are long gone..

Spouses/girlfriends do frown on their partner's ownership of Porche(s); unless you are just getting to know them. So in comparison to a passion/ hobby of collecting knives vs fast cars, I think that they would readily support the former. My spouse is secretly grateful that I am into kitchen knives and sharpening... at least it keeps me occupied and at home!

Have fun and good driving...
D


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## Eamon Burke (Nov 1, 2011)

mano said:


> Porsche... I love sitting on mine when the weather is nice smoking a cigar, drink in hand and chatting with friends.


 
+1
-The Cigar

My porsche has so much clutter, there's barely room to sit. I can't complain, I am lucky to have one at all!


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## Pabloz (Nov 25, 2011)

Currently have 2 of the 3 mid-engine Speedster variations...a '73 914 2.o and a 98 Boxster. Both have been very reliable and relative econo-style to maintain....even at the local dealership. Twice a year take the Boxster in for oil and filters etc. and get out of there, detailed, washed and vacuumed for under 2 bills.

PZ


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## WildBoar (Nov 26, 2011)

Dang, not sure how I missed this thread last month  I've had an '87 targa for ~14 years now. I got into the DE thing a couple years after buying the car, so my Porsche experience is mainly centered around going to the track these days. We have a really active BBS here in the DC area, and it's full of people who track their cars and DIY the repair/ upgrade work.

What price range are you looking in? 964s are going in mid-teens now, although many have not yet had motor rebuilds. 996s are evn less expensive, while the model in between (993) are holding in the low to mid 30s. The 997s are awesome machines. The Caymens are nice; the 'underengineered' comment above likely relates to the car needing some mods if driven regularly on the track.

Want to go even older? Carrera and SC prices are pretty depressed right now (10-15k for one with a rebuild and refreshed suspension). Targas tend to be cheaper, as they are not desirable for a car that will be tracked. But I really enjoy driving mine on the steet every now and then, especially when I can pop off the top during nicer weather.

It is commonly held that all mid-year, SC and Carreras are $20k cars. So if you buy one for $10k, expect to put in another $10k getting it fully up to snuff 

As others have stated, there are options for 944s, 951s and 928s.

If you have any specific questions, please feel free to send me a PM.


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## NO ChoP! (Nov 30, 2011)

A 914 was my first car back in 1989.... It burst into flames in 1990....I had no insurance, as I paid cash for the car I had earned as a grill cook at the local Sizzler.

It was surprisingly roomy for a big guy. I remember absolutely hating the transmission, and it sure wasn't quick; if I remember it had a 1.7L VW engine...

I hated the rims, and quickly replaced them with some cheap AR five stars. I junked the stock rims, and later found they were an upgraded rim worth some coin....


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## zitangy (Nov 30, 2011)

9mmbhp said:


> If you want one buy one! You only live once.
> 
> The P-car bug hit me hard back in the late 90s and I owned both a '88 3.2L Carrera and a '89 928 S4 for a couple of years. The total investment for both cars was about US$40k. Other than washing/waxing, tires and regular oil and brake fluid changes I had no maintenance issues with them. For 10-15 year old cars (at the time) they were comfortable, reliable, solid (built like tanks) and extremely fun to drive.
> 
> ...



Hi, 
The 993s stopped production in 1998...

YOu got to scope out the engine specs as some of the production year has only 300bhp. WHen compared to the power output of the EVo adn Subarus wch are pumping out 260 to 280 Bhp.. it doenst sound like fun... to be smoked.

I would consider the Turbos which has a power output of 400 bhp. THe later normal aspitared 993s would pump out 350bhp.. not too bad. That even, the S4 series would be my preferred choice.. Turbo look.. Worth keeping for a few more years....

http://www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/?man=5318 to list all the specs of porsches

Have FUn


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## Pabloz (Nov 30, 2011)

+1...seems like everybody wants to take a run at you.....even the Gremlin 401 croud.


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## WildBoar (Nov 30, 2011)

It all depends on what you want out of a car. Porsches are not drag racing cars, so many other cars will eat them up pulling away from a stop light. But not many can stay with them through corners, or keep up lap after lap after lap with heavy braking, etc. And the air-cooled cars hold their value pretty well vs most water-cooled cars. Like anything else, it really comes down to if the car is just a tool to get from point A to point B, or if you really want to enjoy the journey. An Evo or WRX would be fun to beat on at the track or an auto-x, but frankly when I drove an Evo I felt like a 17 year old because the interior was so chintzy and the exterior was kinda ricey. An S4 is a nice highway cruiser, but it's a heavy beast and isn't the best for regular track duty; if you look at an older one, I would avoid the twin turbo versions as they can be $$$$ to repair. And if you have the $ for a new one, please ignore anything I say as I do not play in that price range :O


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