# Saya Pin and Hole



## Don Nguyen (Jul 12, 2012)

How should it be done properly?

What size is the hole normally drilled? Does the pin taper? What else is there to know?

Thanks. Sincerely,

-Don


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## [email protected] (Jul 12, 2012)

Japanese saya pin sizes differ depending on the maker. A lot of them do taper a little bit... I think. Some makers use the same sized pin for everything, and cut the length of a pin to adjust. Others have 2 to 3 sizes for different sayas. It's probably safe to wait to drill a hole till you know the size of the pin.


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## Don Nguyen (Jul 12, 2012)

Thanks for the quick answer!

Seems like a lot of them use ebony for the wood. I will be making my own, but I wonder if the type of wood is of crucial importance?


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## Andrew H (Jul 12, 2012)

Don Nguyen said:


> Thanks for the quick answer!
> 
> Seems like a lot of them use ebony for the wood. I will be making my own, but I wonder if the type of wood is of crucial importance?



As long as the wood is stable / stabilized you should be fine.


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## 99Limited (Jul 12, 2012)

I think tapering the pin is a good idea. One reason is you will always have a snug fit. Also, over time, as the pin hole gets enlarged from use, the taper will accommodate the larger hole. You just need to allow for a little extra length in the pin.


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## Seth (Jul 12, 2012)

Most of the original pins for mine are tapered.


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## SpikeC (Jul 12, 2012)

If you don't use ebony the saya will collapse in upon itself.


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## Eamon Burke (Jul 13, 2012)

I use guitar bridge pins. I find them cheaper, easier to replace, and way more reliable than saya pins. Not traditional at all though.


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## bieniek (Jul 13, 2012)

SpikeC said:


> If you don't use ebony the saya will collapse in upon itself.



+1 
But is it stil a "saya" then?


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## Twistington (Jul 13, 2012)

I make my saya pins a bit tapered and longer to compensate for the anistropic features of the wood i find around my parents house.


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## Customfan (Jul 13, 2012)

I have a question that has been looming in my mind.... One of my first serious knives I purchassed was a masamoto KA 270mm yanagiba from Korin and the Saya came with had a very small hole in place where the "normal" pin hole would go... Why do they do this? Is is so that you create your own pin?

Thanks!


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## Don Nguyen (Jul 13, 2012)

BurkeCutlery said:


> I use guitar bridge pins. I find them cheaper, easier to replace, and way more reliable than saya pins. Not traditional at all though.



That's a good idea!


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## bieniek (Jul 13, 2012)

or you can just grab a leftover piece of hardwood and a pocket knife and make your own.


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## Marko Tsourkan (Jul 13, 2012)

Don Nguyen said:


> How should it be done properly?
> 
> What size is the hole normally drilled? Does the pin taper? What else is there to know?
> 
> ...



Put your knife on top of the saya, so that the handle is flush against saya side's edge. Mark where you want your pin hole. I typically drill it flush against the heel, but you might want to give yourself a little room for error. 

If you make your own sayas, it makes sense to drill a pin hole on the cavity side before gluing, and then transfer it to the other side.

Most Japanese sayas are without distal taper, so you don't need to worry leveling it when drilling a hole.

Holes on Japanese sayas vary, Masamoto can ship with a tiny pin hole, while Nenohi are close to 4.5-5mm. 

I find best hole size for me to be about 4mm, not too big and not too small. Bamboo skewers are about 4.5mm, so should you need a source of cheap pins, those could be had in abundance. 

I make pins myself, so I normally shape them to fit 4mm hole. I do taper my pins.

M


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## Don Nguyen (Jul 17, 2012)

Thanks for all the help everyone!

The bridge pins work fantastic. I shortened them just slightly, but enough to account for the taper.











I think it looks pretty good too. Certainly better than one I would make.


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## bieniek (Jul 18, 2012)

Looks very nice. 

It certainly is a quick fix!


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## Eamon Burke (Jul 18, 2012)

Nice! You can thank Son for bringing me the enlightened idea. Can't believe it was under my right hand for years and I had to find it on a phone call from across the country!

You can really squeeze them in there too, if the knife is going to get jostled around, like for travel--just push it in until you have to press it against the counter to get it to pop out.


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## coffeelover191919 (May 13, 2020)

To add to this, just got a Yoshihiro gyuto with Saya. The pin goes in just enough to block the knife from falling out, but the "ball" part of the pin sticks out a good amount and the other end is barely flush with the other end of the Saya. Normal? 
I tried to force the Saya pin in more, so that it won't look so awkward sticking out so much, but then i almost needed pliers to get it out.


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## Dendrobatez (May 14, 2020)

And that's an 8yo thread...

Anyway, the pin will wear with use and be easier to put in and out, its tapered too (the ones I've had) so it'll stick in further with time. Also don't force it, you can Crack the wood.
Or if you're like me you'll lose it a week after getting it


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## daveb (May 14, 2020)

Shake the cobwebs off and it's still timely.

I ask for saya pins to be same size as cribbage pins. If original pin is lost, Amazon has a gillion of them.

Cribbage - if you don't know, don't ask. But you don't need a controller or box for it.


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## Bert2368 (May 14, 2020)

daveb said:


> you don't need a controller or box for it.



What size batteries does it take?

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Thanks for bringing this thread back to life. I have just misplaced my first (non attached) saya pin... Probably won't be the last.


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## ChefShramrock (May 14, 2020)

daveb said:


> Shake the cobwebs off and it's still timely.
> 
> I ask for saya pins to be same size as cribbage pins. If original pin is lost, Amazon has a gillion of them.
> 
> Cribbage - if you don't know, don't ask. But you don't need a controller or box for it.


I have been using cribbage pegs myself. Just cut & finish to size. They work perfect.


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## M1k3 (May 14, 2020)

Golf tees, cut down and lightly sanded down work also.


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