# Learning to speak Saya



## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

Much like @ChefShramrock I've decided to give saya making (another) go during these glorious times. I have made a handful in the past, but kids, work and lack of space changed my ability drastically.
I even bought some koa, walnut and ringed gidgee (from Mert himself) about 5 years ago. Now I'm finally trying to use them.

First though came practice sayas, with lesser expensive wood like poplar. Some came out ok, and gave me a bit more confidence to plug fwd and plunge into this.

To start off with here's one I made about 6 years ago for a western Kato and a Harner. The one for the Harner was my first one I ever made. And that knife was one serious badass cutter!


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

And here’s another I made about 5yrs ago for an Ealy western Damascus. Del supplied the zebra wood. I was pleased at the time with how it came out. It’s hard to fine pics of this one. I had to google image search and lucked out with these:


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## birdsfan (Apr 19, 2020)

Nice work! Are you using a 2 piece technique? I can't even see a seem on the first one.


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

The first one is a 2 piece. The Ealy is a 3 piece, as the zebra wood pieces were very thin.
I just finished a koa saya for my Rader. Those pieces were also very small, so I used poplar as the middle piece. This actually worked out well because it kind of mirrors the inlays Michael does for the handle. It’s also felt lined as well.


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

And here's one made from the ringed gidgee for my Tansu. After bad planning and removing some wood I found some cracks and imperfections in this one. I'll get some super glue and mix with some saw dust to create a filler.
This one is felt lined too. 

I learned that ringed gidgee is a very hard wood...


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

And here are some polar ones I did the past couple weeks. I'm digging the torched look.


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

And more...


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## birdsfan (Apr 19, 2020)

Very Cool! In each of the saya, you do a great job of picking up the handle styling. Looks like you have been doing it for years!


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

Thank you!!

The Kamon was fun as I was trying to mimic his homemade bog oak handle colors. It came out just ok, but fun nonetheless


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## birdsfan (Apr 19, 2020)

I am just starting to make them for my knives as well, but haven't tried the scorched look yet. I kind of remember reading in another thread that heat causes the glue to let loose. Not sure what kind of glue they were using, but I have been using titebond I, which seems to me could be poorly tolerant of heat.


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

This one for a Halcyon Forge gyuto is felt lined and torched poplar


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

birdsfan said:


> I am just starting to make them for my knives as well, but haven't tried the scorched look yet. I kind of remember reading in another thread that heat causes the glue to let loose. Not sure what kind of glue they were using, but I have been using titebond I, which seems to me could be poorly tolerant of heat.




I’m currently using a quick setting variant of gorilla glue for now. I have G/flex 650 which I should probably use more often. Did some testing and it stood up pretty well, even to direct torching. Just takes forever to dry/set, and I lack patience.

But with gorilla glue, yes the glue softens again at times. But I have clamps at the ready and just reclamp once I’m done torching. Wait another 10 minutes and then good to go.


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## WildBoar (Apr 19, 2020)

marc4pt0 said:


> And here are some polar ones I did the past couple weeks. I'm digging the torched look.



They may be torched, but those polar ones are pretty chill...


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## valdim (Apr 19, 2020)

@marc4pt0 There is such attention to the detail in your sayas! I notice 2 things, which are lovely: 1.Picking up the handle styling (which the other fellow above mentioned, too); 2. The "cape" (sorry, I dont know the term, if there is one) at the handle end. Does the latter have any particular purpose or it is your design mark?
Your sayas add beauty to the knives, definitely.


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## ChefShramrock (Apr 19, 2020)

Outstanding work. I love the style. On the torched ones, did you have any issues with seams separating? Also, how are you carving out the interior?


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 19, 2020)

@valdim thank you! In reference to the ”cape”, this is more for looks. I‘ve seen other saya makers use same/similar style as well. And I’ll be happily honest that my influence and inspiration has come from Marko Tsourkan’s work as well as Cody Paul (aka ginger ninja), Graydon Decollibus, Lefty and Ming custom sayas, to mention a few.


@ChefShramrock, Thank you! And yes there were a couple smaller spots where I noticed the glue going soft right after torching. I just immediately clamped it back and let it reset. As for the cavity of the saya, I’m using a mix of chisel, hand sanding (lots), and trying out a few routers. I really need to get my hands on a Saya Nomi, but they ain’t cheap!


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 22, 2020)

Here's a walnut saya for a 10" zkramer. Take one didn't really do it for me so I went back and made sone adjustments. I'm liking Take Two better. 

Take 1:














And Take 2:


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## VICTOR J CREAZZI (Apr 22, 2020)

Very nice work.


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## ChefShramrock (Apr 22, 2020)

Beautiful wood. Take 2, definitely.


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## kbright (Apr 24, 2020)

Do you add something to retain the blade in the saya? Some sayas use a peg on a string. Maybe some kind of "liner lock"?


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## VICTOR J CREAZZI (Apr 24, 2020)

marc4pt0 said:


> , I really need to get my hands on a Saya Nomi, but they ain’t cheap!


I've only made one saya









But I did forge a saya nomi out of an old file in order to do it.


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## banzai_burrito (Apr 24, 2020)

Beautiful work!


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## valdim (Apr 24, 2020)

marc4pt0 said:


> Here's a walnut saya for a 10" zkramer. Take one didn't really do it for me so I went back and made sone adjustments. I'm liking Take Two better.
> 
> Take 1:
> 
> ...


So lovely...One of my fev knifes, in 8' version, dressed in such a nice saya. If Maryland was not that far from me, I would ask you to make one for me.
But I dont own the Kramer yet....Still in the begining of this wonderful knife-journey


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## MoabDave (Apr 26, 2020)

Perfect timing. I've been thinking about making some Saya (how does grammar work in mixed languages?)
The photos are absolutely stunning and inspiring, thanks so much for posting! I'm away from my shop, but might try using some veneers to start playing around. There was a video on youtube using veneer technique. The results are not what I want, but for the sake of something to do, I don't think I can resist.


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## camperman (Apr 29, 2020)

You're making some grand sayas. Very nice work.


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 29, 2020)

Thank you!


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 29, 2020)

Here's a couple shots of one I did yesterday. Oblivion blades 235mm gyuto with koa 3 piece saya. The koa was too thin for a two piece construction, so a layer of poplar was used. I tapered it to get thinner towards the tip (distal taper), and thin at the bottom along the edge. 
Originally it came out to light in color (first set of pics) . It's already a challenge matching koa with non koa. And this is a great example. 




















.


I don't have any wood stain, and not really interested in dealing with the hardware stores. So with some thought I tried creating my own wood "stain". Using Danish oil as a base, I mixed in some of this synthetic black iron oxide micro powder:


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 29, 2020)

This actually worked to help take it a few shades darker. Koa is interesting with all its little oval shaped holes everywhere. These little holes collected the wood "stain" and helped create an overall darker look:


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## MontezumaBoy (Apr 29, 2020)

Beautiful work Marc ... really really stunning ... To be honest (IMO) it was great in the "light" pictures but now it is "stupid amazing" after the darker match ...

The saya force is strong with you .... maybe you could replace your deck with curly koa to match?


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## marc4pt0 (Apr 29, 2020)

Oh man, how cool would That be. Full blown koa deck??


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## MontezumaBoy (Apr 29, 2020)

Plus all the cut-offs could be used to make saya's .... 

After all I am an "ideas man" ... and can spend other peoples money better than most!


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## birdsfan (Apr 30, 2020)

Once again, beautiful work! You are setting the mark that I aspire to reach in my own work.


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## valdim (Apr 30, 2020)

@marc4pt0 You should think of posting some videos to show the newbies like mehow you do it.


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## marc4pt0 (May 3, 2021)

It has been a little while since I built a saya. Got a band saw which made this a Much easier task.
I think these are the last koa saya scales I have. They were all thin scales, which forced me to use a three piece method, poplar being the middle piece again. I gave the poplar frame a strong distal taper to follow the distal of the blade itself. I’m actually quite pleased with how this one turned out. I used felt to line the cavity and to help strengthen the friction fit. It’s now quite snug. The press above the handle is functional to help pulling the knife out.
Blade is a Kamon Gigantoku 230mm, and it’s mind blowing. The edge guards I have clearly don’t offer much coverage, so I decided to bang this saya out real quick.


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## marc4pt0 (May 3, 2021)

Here are some pics of the WIP.


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## childermass (May 3, 2021)

Just found this thread and holy that’s some nice woodwork


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