# TF now 20% more expensive



## Corradobrit1 (Nov 17, 2018)

Just noticed TF has increased the price of his knives 20% through his website. Thats quite a hefty jump.


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

Oh that’s hilarious.


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## valgard (Nov 18, 2018)

LMAO


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## Matus (Nov 18, 2018)

I thought that he was already 20% too expensive


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## F-Flash (Nov 18, 2018)

In The Same ballpark as katos, shigs, honyakis. And readily available. Some people might still preferences TFTFTF i know some does. I wouldnt try them with The gamble involved.


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## ynot1985 (Nov 18, 2018)

I visited tf last month.. I don’t think I would ever buy anything from them


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## Migraine (Nov 18, 2018)

TF?


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## Gregmega (Nov 18, 2018)

Does that 20% also come with 20% better fit and finish?


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## Nemo (Nov 18, 2018)

Migraine said:


> TF?


Terayasu Fujiwarra.

Renowned as having a great HT of white steel (and probably AS as well). Repeuted very hard HT. The knives are ground to a very acute edge. Renowned as very sharp.

There are many reports of variable F&F including overgrinds.

A good one is said to be very good.

Some seem to love them. Some not so much.

You get the picture.

Disclaimer: No firsthand knowledge myself.


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## ynot1985 (Nov 18, 2018)

Nemo said:


> Terayasu Fujiwarra.
> 
> Renowned as havinng a great HT of white steel (and probably AS as well). Repeuted very hard HT. The knives are ground to a very acute edge. Renowned as very sharp.
> 
> ...



I have first hand knowledge.. problems galore .. maybe every 12-15 is one ok one .. still with issues, just less


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## Iggy (Nov 18, 2018)

ynot1985 said:


> I have first hand knowledge.. problems galore .. maybe every 12-15 is one ok one .. still with issues, just less



You're absolutely correct. Had and have quite a few knives from them for comparison and visited them twice (2015 and 2 month ago).

IMHO you can forget about the white steel knives, what TF is really about are the Denka ones. And there is only one way to buy a Denka... go there... look at all the blades they have from the profile/size that you want and select the best one.

(and if possible just get an unsharpened blade... without edge... without handle)

Ordering one online is just a gamble...

But if you find a good one, there are really just a few other japanese Gyutos that can keep up in terms of cutting and steel performance.

Regards, Iggy


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

Guess I've been lucky. Bought 5 direct (2x 210 Nashiji, 120 Maboroshi Ku petty, 180 Denka and 210 Denka). Only the 180 Denka had a very slight issue that was easily fixed. F&F can be a problem but TF remedied a lot of the problems eg rough choil and spine, when asked.


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## Chicagohawkie (Nov 18, 2018)

Lol! Circle slash TF!


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## ashy2classy (Nov 18, 2018)

****! I wanted to order one and break my boycott of buying from them.  Guess the resale market just went up by 20% too.


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> Guess the resale market just went up by 20% too.



Can't sell mine because I watched TF scratch my name in them!

Prices are still over 25% less than Epic or Bernal so I'll probably stop by when I'm in Tokyo.
Also not sure how much he raised the prices at the shop, which always had slightly different prices than online.
The store is around 10% less than online because he deducts VAT, if you're a foreigner.

I always thought the Denka were too pricey but I really like my Maboroshi & Nashiji TFs...both cut like demons...


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

parbaked said:


> Can't sell mine because I watched TF scratch my name in them!
> 
> Prices are still over 25% less than Epic or Bernal so I'll probably stop by when I'm in Tokyo.
> Also not sure how much he raised the prices at the shop, which always had slightly different prices than online.
> ...


I’m unsure how you figure Bernal to be 25% more than direct. I purchased my Maboroshi wh1 from Bernal for $450...now direct it’s $478. That being said Bernal currently has the 240mm gyuto out of stock but we may have to wait to see what the new restock price is.


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## jacko9 (Nov 18, 2018)

I like my 150 Nashiji Petty and my 240 Nashiji Gyuto with ebony handles. I did get them a few years ago at a much more reasonable cost.


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I’m unsure how you figure Bernal to be 25% more than direct.



I was referring to Denka prices but the 240 Maboroshi at Epic is $679 which is almost 30% difference.
http://epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=87913

Note exchange rate is Y112 to $1.00 https://www.xe.com/currencyconverter/convert/?Amount=86400&From=JPY&To=USD

Bernal 240 Denka $1118: http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/fujiwara-aogami-super-240mm-gyuto-western.html
TF 240 Denka Y86,400 ($780): https://www.teruyasu.net/products/gyuto.html

$765/$1188 = 69% or 31% cheaper to buy a 240 Denka direct from TF than at Bernal.
Price is even 10% cheaper if you buy at TF shop instead of online.

My point is only that if one is in Tokyo it is worthwhile to stop by TF and try to find something that's your jam...


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

For a TF 240 Denka the best deal around is Knifewear in Canada @$698 shipped to USA. Seriously undercutting even direct pricing now. Gettem while you can


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> For a TF 240 Denka the best deal around is Knifewear in Canada @$698 shipped to USA. Seriously undercutting even direct pricing now. Gettem while you can



He used to have 195mm Nashiji for $150, which was less than direct...might be old stock because his other TF aren't priced as low...or some exchange rate nonsense. Canadian $ is weak...


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## Anton (Nov 18, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> For a TF 240 Denka the best deal around is Knifewear in Canada @$698 shipped to USA. Seriously undercutting even direct pricing now. Gettem while you can


i think they just raised their prices.. did they?


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

parbaked said:


> I was referring to Denka prices but the 240 Maboroshi at Epic is $679 which is almost 30% difference.
> http://epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=87913
> 
> Note exchange rate is Y112 to $1.00 https://www.xe.com/currencyconverter/convert/?Amount=86400&From=JPY&To=USD
> ...


Well yes, denka prices have always only seem justified when ordering direct. I couldn’t imagine paying ittetsu/mizuno/ikeda honyaki prices for a denka.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

Not according to their website.
https://knifewear.com/products/fujiwara-denka-gyuto-240mm?variant=5667888836


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

they were already overpriced, now it's not even worth it. i was going to get one but now i'm getting a heiji semi-stainless instead as a beater project knife because of awesome steel.


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

Anton said:


> i think they just raised their prices.. did they?





Corradobrit1 said:


> Not according to their website.



It seems the older stock is at old prices and newer stock is at higher prices...the 240 Denka is one of the few TF at Knifewear that is cheaper than direct from TF...get it or regret it...LOL


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

panda said:


> they were already overpriced, now it's not even worth it. i was going to get one but now i'm getting a heiji semi-stainless instead as a beater project knife because of awesome steel.


Why no 210 Kaeru for you???
(sorry to be OT but that's such a good Panda beater)


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

parbaked said:


> Why no 210 Kaeru for you???
> (sorry to be OT but that's such a good Panda beater)


That’s what I told him! Haha!
Panda and I are both steel snobs-that’s the answer.
I like kearu so much I overlook the steel.


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

man kaeru is so solid, i think it's so much better than tanaka. but a las like labor says i am a steel snob. i want sexy steel.


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I like kearu so much I overlook the steel.


I picked up a 210 KAeru...such a good knife after you sand off the fauxongi.
To go back on topic another good choice was Knifewear's 195mm Pakkawood TF Nashiji @$150 but sold out now...
I still might go back to TF shop to get a Pakkawood 195 Nashiji . The F&F is junk but I have a re-handled and thinned Nashiji petty and it's is the best cutter I have so I know the steel is great.


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## Gjackson98 (Nov 18, 2018)

Does anyone know if they did any improvement on their knives since they increased the price?


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## Barmoley (Nov 18, 2018)

panda said:


> man kaeru is so solid, i think it's so much better than tanaka. but a las like labor says i am a steel snob. i want sexy steel.



Isn’t SLD much more interesting than white. You guys self identify as steel snobs, but don’t really like cool steels just different iterations of the same steel. I would say you are feel on the stones, ease of sharpening snobs maybe heat treat snobs, but jury is steel out on that


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

Gjackson98 said:


> Does anyone know if they did any improvement on their knives since they increased the price?


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## Gjackson98 (Nov 18, 2018)

Dead serious, from a lively way


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> Isn’t SLD much more interesting than white. You guys self identify as steel snobs, but don’t really like cool steels just different iterations of the same steel. I would say you are feel on the stones, ease of sharpening snobs maybe heat treat snobs, but jury is steel out on that


...I haven’t handled enough sld to generalize it. Masashi SLD sharpened easier than kearu...Kearu steel is just more durable and tougher than I prefer. It’s really not awful just not what I prefer. And for $173 it’s pretty easy to overlook.
If there’s nicer SLD (Yoshikane?) id like to try it st some point.
Also, there’s quite a spectrum of white steel. 
BTW the coolest steels for 2018 are heiji, Marko A2 and 52100, and whatever tilman and Kippington touches plus thin ground ginsanko knives.


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## parbaked (Nov 18, 2018)

@Gjackson98 
Price increase could be any number of reasons including the fact that Yen is soft and steel and shipping costs are increasing but, having met TF, I doubt it has to do with any changes in how they do business...


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

In that case, serious answer is probably not. To get an example with better F&F you have to buy from Epicedge. In the past I heard they paid a premium to get the inconsistencies eliminated/reduced and thats reflected in the higher prices on their site. Not sure if thats still the case these days


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## Barmoley (Nov 18, 2018)

The one denka I saw at epic edge when I visited Seattle was very good from fit and finish and grind stand point, so I believe them that they get better stock. The price is very high though at over $1100 for 240, at least you know what you are getting, but that’s a lot of money. I was seriously considering getting denka from the source but didn’t want to play the lottery for that much money, definitely not doing it now.


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> The one denka I saw at epic edge when I visited Seattle was very good from fit and finish and grind stand point, so I believe them that they get better stock. The price is very high though at over $1100 for 240, at least you know what you are getting, but that’s a lot of money. I was seriously considering getting denka from the source but didn’t want to play the lottery for that much money, definitely not doing it now.


TBH I’d rather save $300-400 and order direct. If I get a one that has an off grind or whatever just send it to out to Bernal/JKI/whoever for specific thinning,polishing and rounding of spine and choil w saya and still come out saving quite a bit.


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## refcast (Nov 18, 2018)

labor of love said:


> BTW the coolest steels for 2018 are heiji, Marko A2 and 52100, and whatever tilman and Kippington touches plus thin ground ginsanko knives.



What about shihan a2 and 52100? At least the 52100, since you said you tried it. I was only able to feel the edge at JKI . . . and it's really really bitey. The only other knives that felt like it were Jin and carbon Heiji. I felt the white Hide honyaki edges and they were a lot less toothy and waaay more refined and stiff feeling.


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

Gjackson98 said:


> Does anyone know if they did any improvement on their knives since they increased the price?


lol


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

refcast said:


> What about shihan a2 and 52100? At least the 52100, since you said you tried it. I was only able to feel the edge at JKI . . . and it's really really bitey. The only other knives that felt like it were Jin and carbon Heiji. I felt the white Hide honyaki edges and they were a lot less toothy and waaay more refined and stiff feeling.


Never tried shihan a2, yes ginrei can get an honorable mention in 52100. I’ll allow it.


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> Isn’t SLD much more interesting than white. You guys self identify as steel snobs, but don’t really like cool steels just different iterations of the same steel. I would say you are feel on the stones, ease of sharpening snobs maybe heat treat snobs, but jury is steel out on that


you right, we are totally stickler for heat treat (heiji carbon is top of my list for reference). i really need to try shihan, jon tells me it feels more like white/blue steel.


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## Barmoley (Nov 18, 2018)

labor of love said:


> TBH I’d rather save $300-400 and order direct. If I get a one that has an off grind or whatever just send it to out to Bernal/JKI/whoever for specific thinning,polishing and rounding of spine and choil w saya and still come out saving quite a bit.



Very true, I was going to do just that, before the price hike, not now though. Direct is also the only place to get WA denka and that’s what I wanted.


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## labor of love (Nov 18, 2018)

There’s other fish in the sea, I wouldn’t get too bummed out about missing out on an $800 blade made of AS.


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

just save up 3 grand for a ku kato, best bang for buck for a donkey


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

ouch


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## Marek07 (Nov 18, 2018)

For the record, 20% is a very conservative estimate of the increase.

These numbers are not definitive but are based on the knives I bought directly from teruyasu.net in 2017. By my reckoning, the increases range from 29 to 50%. Specifics:
gyuto (Maboroshi 210mm) - bought ¥23,760, now ¥34,560 - up 45%
nakiri (nashiji 165mm) - bought ¥10,800 now ¥16,200 - up 50%
petty (nashiji 150mm)bought ¥7,560, now ¥9,720 - up 29%

Sadly, a 240mm Denka gyuto is currently out of my reach - ¥86,400. TF have always had a rather big jump in price between 210mm and 240mm knives. In this case it is 65% more - ~¥30k. This works out at $10/mm.


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## Godslayer (Nov 18, 2018)

panda said:


> just save up 3 grand for a ku kato, best bang for buck for a donkey


Better off sharpening a hammer from costco


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 18, 2018)

Back in May 2018 I bought the following
210 Denka gyuto for 46,440 yen; price now is 56,160 ie +20%
120 Mab petty for 16,200; price now is 19,440 ie +20%

In Feb 2018 I bought a 180 Denka gyuto for 42,120; price now is 48,600 ie +15%.

Maybe there have been a couple of increases since 2017. Not sure why you're seeing a 50% price rise. Are you doing any conversions with Aussie $?

In 2015 I bought two 210 Nashiji gyutos for 36,500 yen. Cost now is 47,520 yen = +30% increase? (not sure because I think I got a discount buying the 2 knives). These were great deals because the exchange rate was about 125 yen/usd


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## Marek07 (Nov 18, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> Back in May 2018 I bought the following
> 210 Denka gyuto for 46,440 yen; price now is 56,160 ie +20%
> 120 Mab petty for 16,200; price now is 19,440 ie +20%
> 
> ...


I guess my figures reflect more than one price rise - I haven't watched them closely. My knives were bought in January and December 2017 but the petty was in February this year - apologies for the oversight. 
The 50% increase is on the nakiri which was purchased 12/2017 - I've checked my arithmetic. In quoting percentage increases, I used the Japanese Yen prices I paid and the prices currently shown on the website. 
The $10/mm from 210mm to 240mm Denka gyuto was in USD.


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## MrHiggins (Nov 18, 2018)

refcast said:


> What about shihan a2 and 52100? At least the 52100, since you said you tried it. I was only able to feel the edge at JKI . . . and it's really really bitey. The only other knives that felt like it were Jin and carbon Heiji. I felt the white Hide honyaki edges and they were a lot less toothy and waaay more refined and stiff feeling.


Shi.Han's A2 is spectacular.


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## Barmoley (Nov 18, 2018)

Which one do you have?


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## panda (Nov 18, 2018)

what's held me back from trying a shihan aka ginrei is the profile. i just can't jive with that shape.


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## Barmoley (Nov 18, 2018)

Didn't Craig say it was too rounded?


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## panda (Nov 19, 2018)

jon said he might be able to do custom profile but i'm not prepared to shell out that much coin for an experiment. if i were, i'd probably get kaeru shape as it's a modified ks to be more all arounder.


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## Barmoley (Nov 19, 2018)

If we could get a group discount I’d be in. OK with the profile you guys think is good.


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## Wdestate (Nov 19, 2018)

panda said:


> jon said he might be able to do custom profile but i'm not prepared to shell out that much coin for an experiment. if i were, i'd probably get kaeru shape as it's a modified ks to be more all arounder.



Hit up shehan directly. He custom made me one because I wanted length different then what he was offering without any sort of additional fee. Granted I don’t get the nuances with steel that you seem to but I will say it sharpens just as easy as any of my white steel knives and I really enjoy the edge on it.


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## panda (Nov 19, 2018)

meh, i'm pretty happy with marko 5210. i am intrigued about custom shihan though for sure his grind looks fantastic and really like what has been said about the steel.
not too interested in a2 as i consider 52100 near semi-stainless anyway.
for semi-stainless already in the process of ordering a heiji.


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## Anton (Nov 19, 2018)

panda said:


> meh, i'm pretty happy with marko 5210. i am intrigued about custom shihan though for sure his grind looks fantastic and really like what has been said about the steel.
> not too interested in a2 as i consider 52100 near semi-stainless anyway.
> for semi-stainless already in the process of ordering a heiji.


Def better off with 52100 than A2


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## JBroida (Nov 19, 2018)

his A2 is a bit more reactive than some... i still like it a lot, but its worth noting that it gears a bit more towards reactive than what you might expect (still firmly semi-stainless in my book though)


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## ThinMan (Nov 19, 2018)

labor of love said:


> BTW the coolest steels for 2018 are heiji, Marko A2 and 52100, and whatever tilman and Kippington touches plus thin ground ginsanko knives.


 
Which Heiji, carbon or semi stainless?


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## panda (Nov 19, 2018)

both


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## labor of love (Nov 19, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> Which Heiji, carbon or semi stainless?


Yes. Both. I’m clowning around here but sharpening either steel brings me immense happiness.


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## Barmoley (Nov 19, 2018)

JBroida said:


> his A2 is a bit more reactive than some... i still like it a lot, but its worth noting that it gears a bit more towards reactive than what you might expect (still firmly semi-stainless in my book though)



How does the edge holding compare between his 52100 and A2?


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## Barmoley (Nov 19, 2018)

Anton said:


> Def better off with 52100 than A2


Are you specifically referring to shihan versions of A2 and 52100 or just in general. If former, could you elaborate. Thanks.


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## MrHiggins (Nov 19, 2018)

JBroida said:


> his A2 is a bit more reactive than some... i still like it a lot, but its worth noting that it gears a bit more towards reactive than what you might expect (still firmly semi-stainless in my book though)



I've been using an A2 gyuto for about a year now and it hasn't picked up much patina at all (indeed, because I like patinas, I'd say it's my only negative I have of the knife). I'd consider it very-stain-resistant. 

As for the A2 vs. 52100, I can't comment, but I can tell you that the A2 sharpens insanely easily and is very tough. Certainly not the hardest steel, though. I feel very comfortable treating my Shi.Han a little rough, knowing that it can handle it.


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## JBroida (Nov 19, 2018)

yeah... the cross sectional geometry helps with that a lot too


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## Barmoley (Nov 20, 2018)

JBroida said:


> yeah... the cross sectional geometry helps with that a lot too


Is the geometry different between the two steel versions? His A2 heat treat sounds pretty different from the norm, Jon do you know how the edge holding is on the A2?


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## JBroida (Nov 20, 2018)

no... they are pretty much the same style... he just happens to have a cross-sectional geometry that works well for toughness. I've found the a2 to have slightly better edge retention, but both are nice.


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## MrHiggins (Nov 20, 2018)

JBroida said:


> no... they are pretty much the same style... he just happens to have a cross-sectional geometry that works well for toughness. I've found the a2 to have slightly better edge retention, but both are nice.


Choil shots my my a2:


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## JBroida (Nov 20, 2018)

Yup... looks like mine.... the are very thin at the edge, but the mid section gets thicker quickly. I really enjoy how they cut. It’s not a laser for sure, but I think it strikes a good balance in a lot of ways.


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## nevin (Nov 20, 2018)

MrHiggins said:


> Choil shots my my a2:
> View attachment 44932
> View attachment 44933
> View attachment 44934


These shots actually make me want to buy the knife more...


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## MrHiggins (Nov 22, 2018)

In an earlier post, I wrote about my Shi-Han A2's virtually stainless quality. I'm going to retract that a bit. I did all my T-day prep with it yesterday (about 12 hours total kitchen time) and it definitely picked up a patina that's matte grey and faded blue (no rainbow colors like you see on the patina thread, but definitely there). This is the first time I've noticed any substantive discoloration on this knife. 

Edge retention was good (it's a softer, tougher steel) and I touched it up on a loaded microfiber strop periodically to great results. 

Food release is a 7 or 8 out of 10, with some sticking along the blade road (which is ground pretty high up), and then no sticking at all after the blade road.

The entire experience was great.


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## tgfencer (Nov 22, 2018)

MrHiggins said:


> In an earlier post, I wrote about my Shi-Han A2's virtually stainless quality. I'm going to retract that a bit. I did all my T-day prep with it yesterday (about 12 hours total kitchen time) and it definitely picked up a patina that's matte grey and faded blue (no rainbow colors like you see on the patina thread, but definitely there).




I bet if you let it develop a stable patina it would be pretty bulletproof from there on in. I have an A2 knife I use on the farm and it deals with water like a champ for a non-stainless blade.


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## MrHiggins (Nov 22, 2018)

tgfencer said:


> I bet if you let it develop a stable patina it would be pretty bulletproof from there on in. I have an A2 knife I use on the farm and it deals with water like a champ for a non-stainless blade.


That's definitely the plan. Can't wait to see what it looks like by next Thanksgiving.


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## labor of love (Nov 22, 2018)

I’m very happy with my A2 Marko. It has just enough carbon like sharpening ability on the stones. I haven’t had it long enough to see if a real patina will form or not. Also I keep thinning it.


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## DanDan (Nov 22, 2018)

I'm not gonna lie, I check up here for the TF drama (insert popcorn emoji, p.s. what happened to the cool knife emojis and whatnot?) 

Is the nashiji line still worth it? Wanted a petty but never got around to ordering. Any better budget alternatives for a 135mm or under stainless-clad or stainless petty?


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## labor of love (Nov 22, 2018)

DanDan said:


> I'm not gonna lie, I check up here for the TF drama (insert popcorn emoji, p.s. what happened to the cool knife emojis and whatnot?)
> 
> Is the nashiji line still worth it? Wanted a petty but never got around to ordering. Any better budget alternatives for a 135mm or under stainless-clad or stainless petty?


Wakui 135mm Petty is a bargain. And they’re likely on sale at epic edge or somewhere else.


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## Anton (Nov 22, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I’m very happy with my A2 Marko. It has just enough carbon like sharpening ability on the stones. I haven’t had it long enough to see if a real patina will form or not. Also I keep thinning it.


Marko and Rader - best A2 treatment ever


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## panda (Nov 22, 2018)

Tf nashiji petty is a bargain, but it absolutely needs post work and rehandle.


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## Barmoley (Nov 22, 2018)

Ha


Anton said:


> Marko and Rader - best A2 treatment ever



Have you tried other A2 kitchen knives? Didn't realize Rader even used A2. I've had great experience with Marko A2.


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## parbaked (Nov 22, 2018)

panda said:


> Tf nashiji petty is a bargain, but it absolutely needs post work and rehandle.



Thinned & re-handled 137mm x 32mm Nashiji...great knife!


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 22, 2018)

Nice work. Who rehandled the TF?


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## parbaked (Nov 22, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> Nice work. Who rehandled the TF?


Tim Johnson (Taz575) but he's no longer working with wood....


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## panda (Nov 22, 2018)

Taz did my first 3 rehandles starting with a Tanaka nashiji, I miss that knife!!


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## parbaked (Nov 22, 2018)

Yeah...won't be selling this one...


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## DanDan (Nov 23, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Wakui 135mm Petty is a bargain. And they’re likely on sale at epic edge or somewhere else.



Wakui is on my gyuto list though! I think Jon's EN line would make for some great lil petties 



panda said:


> Tf nashiji petty is a bargain, but it absolutely needs post work and rehandle.



Even if you opt for the octagonal? What fun is a knife that comes perfect out of the box?!


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 23, 2018)

DanDan said:


> Even if you opt for the octagonal? What fun is a knife that comes perfect out of the box?!



He's referring to the Yo handle version which on the Nashiji line is 'agricultural' to put it nicely. Nothing wrong with the Wa handle versions but on a petty my personal preference is western handle.


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## ashy2classy (Nov 25, 2018)

Knifewear has a 10% off cyber Monday sale (code cyber10). Grabbed a Denka for the hell of it.

My wallet has been crying since Friday.


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## Barmoley (Nov 25, 2018)

Dibs on when you are done with it, that is if I have any money left when this insanity is over.


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## labor of love (Nov 25, 2018)

What knives are you guys looking at that are sale?


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## Barmoley (Nov 25, 2018)

Just use the code cyber10 that ashi provided. Prices are in cad need to change to usd at the top, or click on the knife and it should show in usd.


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## lemeneid (Nov 25, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> Knifewear has a 10% off cyber Monday sale (code cyber10). Grabbed a Denka for the hell of it.
> 
> My wallet has been crying since Friday.


Tempted to get a denka myself. What are the chances of getting a dud from knifewear??


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 26, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> Tempted to get a denka myself. What are the chances of getting a dud from knifewear??



No harm in asking them to inspect before shipping. Tell them to check for overgrinds which I'm sure they're able to do. Get a few photos. 

There is a return policy but there are some costs and fees involved.


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## ashy2classy (Nov 26, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> Tempted to get a denka myself. What are the chances of getting a dud from knifewear??



Who knows. I asked them to pick the best sample available. I've heard mixed reviews about Knifewear so I'm not confident they'll even look at the blade before shipping it to me.


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## Pensacola Tiger (Nov 26, 2018)

240 Western Denka @ Epicurean Edge for $892.50. http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=87904


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

I have 9 TF (5 Mabo, 3 Nashiji, 1 Denka) pieces and I dont have anything to complain for.
He even sends complimentary stuff inc stones, towels, etc
I really do not get how so many people happened to have issues.


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## panda (Nov 26, 2018)

because noobs


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

panda said:


> because noobs


Another we are upset thread incoming. Cheers bro


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

And, you have the opportunity on g getting knife straight from the maker for a pretty decent price, much lower than the retail one, chat with the manufacter, change handles in a better price, free engraving, worldwide shipping. Why in gods green earth do you keep spending more for less


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## ashy2classy (Nov 26, 2018)

Alexec said:


> And, you have the opportunity on g getting knife straight from the maker for a pretty decent price, much lower than the retail one, chat with the manufacter, change handles in a better price, free engraving, worldwide shipping. Why in gods green earth do you keep spending more for less



I paid $627 for my 240 Denka from Knifewear yesterday. Not sure what you're talking about. And yes, I was one of the folks who started a thread whining about TF. I'm fully aware I might get one that's not perfect. But given the savings versus direct I'm willing to take the chance.


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> I paid $623 for my 240 Denka. Not sure what you're talking about...


I am not talking for your person mate nor for any reasonable trade. Check around, you will see many people buying same knife for 1k or around that.


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## ashy2classy (Nov 26, 2018)

Alexec said:


> I am not talking for your person mate nor for any reasonable trade. Check around, you will see many people buying same knife for 1k or around that.



Ok. So you're just saying that even with the increase, direct is still a better choice than buying from US retailers? I'm confused.


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> Ok. Then I'm confused about how that's relavent to the recent posts. I was just telling everyone that they could get a Denka for a good price with the discount code. Not upset about your comments, just scratching my head about why they were written, except perhaps in response to the EE post from Rick.


It was written because of a complex of comments and threads about TF. Not saying it didnt happen. Saying that I dont get it and generally question how is it possible to have 9 decent knives while others speak about gambling their odds getting a good TF. I dont feel offended, I feel sad for the maker and suspicious for whats going on in case those words and conclusions arent true at all. 
And yes, afterall TFs on a good deal excist just not on the most retailers.


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> Ok. So you're just saying that even with the increase, direct is still a better choice than buying from US retailers? I'm confused.


Of course it is, in multiple points of view


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## labor of love (Nov 26, 2018)

I think most of the complaints have been about the other lines not Denka. So it’s not unreasonable to just order denka direct. $623 for a denka is a quite a savings from a vendor.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 26, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> I paid $627 for my 240 Denka from Knifewear yesterday.



Thats a deal right there. Current direct price is $760. And I would say buyer will have an easier job returning the knife to Knifewear than to TF if it doesn't live up to expectations.

The price differences depend very much on line ie Nashiji, Mab or Denka and length. The jumps in price going from 210 to 240 are not as steep with some vendors.


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I think most of the complaints have been about the other lines not Denka. So it’s not unreasonable to just order denka direct. $623 for a denka is a quite a savings from a vendor.


It is, I said I am not talking for that specific deal. I speak for the 1000dollar ones


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## labor of love (Nov 26, 2018)

yes, only people that pay $1200-1400 for Katos would entertain the idea of $1000 for a Denka.


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## Alexec (Nov 26, 2018)

labor of love said:


> yes, only people that pay $1200-1400 for Katos would entertain the idea of $1000 for a Denka.


Fact is that most people believe that Denka's price is 1000$. Thst is what i conclude to when taking it at work


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## JoBone (Nov 26, 2018)

I am a big fan of his knives. They are pricey but good, worth the 20% more? Guess it depends on the size of Your wallet.


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## Anton (Nov 26, 2018)

labor of love said:


> yes, only people that pay $1200-1400 for Katos would entertain the idea of $1000 for a Denka.


Yup = you can get quite some nice custom knives for that money


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## tgfencer (Nov 26, 2018)

Anton said:


> Yup = you can get quite some nice custom knives for that money



Or part of the nib of a $25k fountain pen...


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## Barmoley (Nov 26, 2018)

I think part of the complaining is due to the price. People expect more from a $700 knife, noobs or not. So even though most of the "issues" can be fixed, most people don't have the skill or desire to have to fix an expensive knife. I know we are jaded here and don't seem to think ~$700 for a 240 is that much, but seriously...


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## panda (Nov 26, 2018)

i view tf (maboroshi line) to be a really expensive beater/project knife, a very good one at that. never handled a denka before so cant comment on those, they look dope though.


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## ashy2classy (Nov 26, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> I think part of the complaining is due to the price. People expect more from a $700 knife, noobs or not. So even though most of the "issues" can be fixed, most people don't have the skill or desire to have to fix an expensive knife. I know we are jaded here and don't seem to think ~$700 for a 240 is that much, but seriously...



This. The same can be said for every line from TF. But folks seem to be willing to pay, regardless of what other options there are in each price bracket. There's no doubt they perform, but is it worth it? Only the buyer can determine that.

Personally, with all the other options available there aren't many models I'd be willing to buy. Just so happens I wanted to get a 240 Denka after selling my 210 so I took the chance with the sale. *SHRUG*


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## Barmoley (Nov 26, 2018)

I've only handled one denka and one maboroshi at Epicurean Edge which looked very good, but the price was high. I also only used one denka for about a week, which was excellent, but it was heavily improved. To get a regular denka to that point would probably be $200-$300 on top of the base price.


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## StonedEdge (Nov 26, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> Tempted to get a denka myself. What are the chances of getting a dud from knifewear??


On the upside, TF now with 20% windier grinds lol.......odd of a dud are high if you don't select it in person. With Knifewear you should also verify that the knife hasnt been used,tested out or otherwise (patina or rust anywhere).


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## parbaked (Nov 26, 2018)

ashy2classy said:


> I wanted to get a 240 Denka after selling my 210 so I took the chance with the sale. *SHRUG*



You got a screaming deal. The 240 Denka is the only TF at Knifewear that is cheaper than direct from TF.

For some reason, Knifewear didn't mark up the 240mm so much over the 210mm like TF does.
Forgetting the Cyber Sale Knifewear has less than 20% price difference between 210mm ($597) to 240mm ($693).
TF has more than 50% price between 210mm ($495) and 240mm ($760)


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 26, 2018)

StonedEdge said:


> On the upside, TF now with 20% windier grinds lol.......odd of a dud are high if you don't select it in person. With Knifewear you should also verify that the knife hasnt been used,tested out or otherwise (patina or rust anywhere).



This. The photos I saw of Denka's in stock @Knifewear were not the best examples I've come across. This is why is imperative to see what you'll be receiving. Have them check for over grinds under artificial lights and flat spots against a chopping board. Its hard to determine these issues solely from photos. Also given the wide specification, I'd also be asking about heel height and weight, especially if this is a consideration. For the 210 Yo Denka I bought weights ranged from 174g to 220g.


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## lemeneid (Nov 26, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> No harm in asking them to inspect before shipping. Tell them to check for overgrinds which I'm sure they're able to do. Get a few photos.
> 
> There is a return policy but there are some costs and fees involved.





Corradobrit1 said:


> This. The photos I saw of Denka's in stock @Knifewear were not the best examples I've come across. This is why is imperative to see what you'll be receiving. Have them check for over grinds under artificial lights and flat spots against a chopping board. Its hard to determine these issues solely from photos. Also given the wide specification, I'd also be asking about heel height and weight, especially if this is a consideration. For the 210 Yo Denka I bought weights ranged from 174g to 220g.


I decided not to take the risk. I’m ordering a 240 denka and at that price I’m taking no chances. I’m headed to Japan in February and will probably have my pick of Denkas if I do visit TF. Might as well spend a couple bucks more and meet the man himself.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 26, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> I decided not to take the risk. I’m ordering a 240 denka and at that price I’m taking no chances. I’m headed to Japan in February and will probably have my pick of Denkas if I do visit TF. Might as well spend a couple bucks more and meet the man himself.



Thats what i would do. Give them the headsup and if not busy they'll give you a tour of the workshop and let you hammer on some metal.


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## lemeneid (Nov 27, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> Thats what i would do. Give them the headsup and if not busy they'll give you a tour of the workshop and let you hammer on some metal.


I’d gladly pay double if they have a denka with a workhorse grind and distal taper.

That’s what I did with my maboroshi, I picked the thickest one there was and worked on it, many weeks of sandpaper and few destroyed stones later, I have a knife I can call my own.

It’s too much work but it’s my best cutter now. I’d sell it if I get the denka but no one’s gonna want it now that it’s been worked to death.


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## labor of love (Nov 27, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> I’d gladly pay double if they have a denka with a workhorse grind and distal taper.
> 
> That’s what I did with my maboroshi, I picked the thickest one there was and worked on it, many weeks of sandpaper and few destroyed stones later, I have a knife I can call my own.
> 
> It’s too much work but it’s my best cutter now. I’d sell it if I get the denka but no one’s gonna want it now that it’s been worked to death.


I think the opposite is true. You did the dirty work so someone else wouldn’t have to.
Also, have you experienced much distal taper w any of the TF lines? I haven’t noticed much myself.


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## lemeneid (Nov 27, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I think the opposite is true. You did the dirty work so someone else wouldn’t have to.
> Also, have you experienced much distal taper w any of the TF lines? I haven’t noticed much myself.


Nope, never seen any TF with distal taper ever, but I like my knives to have one. I know TF’s knives have straight spines but I’m ok with spending time to get the grind I want. But if I’m paying 1k for a denka, I’d much rather the knife come perfect to me.


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## WifeNotUnderstand (Nov 27, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> Nope, never seen any TF with distal taper ever, but I like my knives to have one. I know TF’s knives have straight spines but I’m ok with spending time to get the grind I want. But if I’m paying 1k for a denka, I’d much rather the knife come perfect to me.



My 210 denka has mild distal taper


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## lemeneid (Nov 27, 2018)

WifeNotUnderstand said:


> My 210 denka has mild distal taper


I’m liking what I see so far. Did you buy this online or from the TF shop itself???


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## WifeNotUnderstand (Nov 27, 2018)

lemeneid said:


> I’m liking what I see so far. Did you buy this online or from the TF shop itself???


Direct from TF online. I sent them an email asking for 210 x 50 wa. Gaku responded with photos of 3 knives that matched. Once I chose one that I liked asked for more photos of it before commiting to it.

Nothing wrong with shooting them an email asking for what you want.


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## panda (Nov 27, 2018)

1000 knife and spine still sharp


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## Chicagohawkie (Nov 27, 2018)

If a denka was 400 or 500 bucks I'd have some interest. But for a non existant level of finish and the inconsistency of the final product its way too pricey for me.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 27, 2018)

Sounds like you should look at the 210. Explanations as to why the massive jump in price from 210 to 240 were not convincing. Fortunately I prefer the lighter/shorter 210.


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## milkbaby (Nov 27, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> Sounds like you should look at the 210. Explanations as to why the massive jump in price from 210 to 240 were not convincing. Fortunately I prefer the lighter/shorter 210.



Just out of curiosity, can you elaborate on the explanation given for the steep increase in price between 210 and 240?


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## HRC_64 (Nov 27, 2018)

milkbaby said:


> Just out of curiosity, can you elaborate on the explanation given for the steep increase in price between 210 and 240?



IIRC Pros in japan use 270 or 240 gyuto almost exclusively, 
smaller sizes are simply 'household' or 'hosuewife' knife.
So, different markets its just 'market segmentation'.


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## parbaked (Nov 27, 2018)

TF's have subtle distal taper.
My western Maboroshi tapers from 2.2mm at the spine to 1.2mm 1" from the tip.
The handle tang is also tapered to move the balance forward to compensate for the weight of the western handle.


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## bruce8088 (Nov 27, 2018)

yeah tfs have very subtle taper.

this is my maboroshi yanagi.


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## Ivang (Nov 27, 2018)

I have a maboroshi yo. Is 200mm by 47mm. The taper is amazing from heel to tip, 3.5 mm at the heel, 1.8 by the middle, 1.1 where the grind starts at the tip on the spine. And is also great on the taper from spine to edge. The tang is also tapered as well.


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## Barmoley (Nov 27, 2018)

I think this is part of the problem, such huge variations you just don’t know what you will get.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 27, 2018)

Barmoley said:


> I think this is part of the problem, such huge variations you just don’t know what you will get.



I think anyone hoping for a successful purchase need to understand this and choose the right blade that meets the desired specs. i wanted a lighter blade, with balance point at pinch grip, <50mm at heel, thin behind edge and nice flat spot towards heel. Gaku suggested several possible blades, provided clear pics from different angles and measurements. Haven't been disappointed with any of the knives i've received as i got exactly what I was expecting


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## ThaFurnace (Nov 27, 2018)

Corradobrit1 said:


> I think anyone hoping for a successful purchase need to understand this and choose the right blade that meets the desired specs. i wanted a lighter blade, with balance point at pinch grip, <50mm at heel, thin behind edge and nice flat spot towards heel. Gaku suggested several possible blades, provided clear pics from different angles and measurements. Haven't been disappointed with any of the knives i've received as i got exactly what I was expecting




This. Or plan the budget to have someone like Jon at JKI work it to make it perfect. Which in my opinion and many other stated above... a $1000 knife shouldn’t need.


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## Corradobrit1 (Nov 27, 2018)

TF was only too happy to make some tweaks. Wanted thinner behind edge so TF himself did this. This was a NOS Ebony Yo handle 210 Denka with TF's 'tou kou' stamps. Nice to know he forged, reprofiled and sharpened this knife himself. Edge looks fragile but I've experienced no microchipping in 6 months use. IMO the Denka is worth its elevated price point.


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## panda (Jan 27, 2020)

has TF ever made an iron clad knife? i want a denka but with iron cladding and maboroshi core steel, lol.


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## CiderBear (Jan 27, 2020)

panda said:


> has TF ever made an iron clad knife? i want a denka but with iron cladding and maboroshi core steel, lol.



That would be the Morihei Hisamoto line

https://protooling.com.au/products/morihei-hisamoto-240mm-gyuto-knife-shirogami


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## panda (Jan 28, 2020)

it's a western only and blade is too thin at 2.7mm


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

No more free EMS shipping.


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## lemeneid (Jan 28, 2020)

Corradobrit1 said:


> No more free EMS shipping.


Still says free shipping from the website


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

lemeneid said:


> Still says free shipping from the website


Standard shipping, not EMS Express which was how they shipped all knives until recently. There may be insurance limits choosing the free option.


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## labor of love (Jan 28, 2020)

TF never returned my emails.


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## valgard (Jan 28, 2020)

panda said:


> has TF ever made an iron clad knife? i want a denka but with iron cladding and maboroshi core steel, lol.


There's a super dope ironclad Denka in Brazil


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

valgard said:


> There's a super dope ironclad Denka in Brazil


Pics?


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## valgard (Jan 28, 2020)

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlcfzwsnusQ/?igshid=5ajikl3ruykk


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## lemeneid (Jan 28, 2020)

valgard said:


> https://www.instagram.com/p/BlcfzwsnusQ/?igshid=5ajikl3ruykk


That’s the TF jackpot if I ever saw one!


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## panda (Jan 28, 2020)

valgard said:


> There's a super dope ironclad Denka in Brazil


so my quest might be possible after all!! if he will take custom order with my frankenstein specs, haha.


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## McMan (Jan 28, 2020)

panda said:


> so my quest might be possible after all!! if he will take custom order with my frankenstein specs, haha.


They exist in the wild... KU clad White#1.
https://www.thebladerunner.com.au/product/morihei-gyuto-chefs-knife-210mm-western-handle/


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

McMan said:


> They exist in the wild... KU clad White#1.
> https://www.thebladerunner.com.au/product/morihei-gyuto-chefs-knife-210mm-western-handle/


That one's got 'issues'. Avoid

And I think Panda wants a Wa handle


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## panda (Jan 28, 2020)

only interested in the real thing, not some half arsed offbreed that TF doesnt have any involvement in.


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

panda said:


> only interested in the real thing, not some half arsed offbreed that TF doesnt have any involvement in.


Only thing TF doesn't do is the blade road polish. Everything else is pure 100% TF, hand forged and heat treated by a 75 year old artisan.


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## labor of love (Jan 28, 2020)

Corradobrit1 said:


> Only thing TF doesn't do is the blade road polish. Everything else is pure 100% TF, hand forged and heat treated by a 75 year old artisan.


What do you mean by everything?


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

labor of love said:


> What do you mean by everything?


Forging the blade, heat treating, annealing, pickeling, grinding the blade road, handle installation (Yo handle), stamping the blade with the Morihei Kanji etc. In the case of the 165 Nakiri this is what Morihei receives from TF. A finished blade minus the Wa handle. Morihei customizes it with their stone polish.
.


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## Chicagohawkie (Jan 28, 2020)

labor of love said:


> What do you mean by everything?


Ya, he’s runs the entire business by himself! Lol!


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## Corradobrit1 (Jan 28, 2020)

Chicagohawkie said:


> Ya, he’s runs the entire business by himself! Lol!


TF as a company. We all know TF IV doesn't do anything in the factory anymore.


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## labor of love (Jan 28, 2020)

I thought the yo handle installation was outsourced to sweatshop laborers. Thanks for clearing that up.


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## kevin (Jan 28, 2020)

CiderBear said:


> That would be the Morihei Hisamoto line
> 
> https://protooling.com.au/products/morihei-hisamoto-240mm-gyuto-knife-shirogami



That one is Stainless Clad.
https://hitohira-japan.com/products/ama-130-01-fa240?_pos=1&_sid=2faf40921&_ss=r

The soft iron cladded ones would be the kurouchi
https://hitohira-japan.com/products/aaa-020-fa240?_pos=7&_sid=2faf40921&_ss=r&variant=6946416099381


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