# Blade Cleaning with Acetone FAIL



## aboynamedsuita (Jul 18, 2015)

I use it to clean my blades (non KU) sometimes when I cut stuff like turmeric root that leaves a gummy residue that just won't come off with regular cleaning, a quick splash of it on a paper towel and it wipes right off.

I've heard not to use on KU finishes as it can remove or damage them. I recently found out it can also remove screened/embossed logos from knives such as Miyabi (and I suppose others such as Hattori FH)





Oops


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## Pensacola Tiger (Jul 18, 2015)

Yes, it will remove screened logos and lettering. 

No, it won't affect a kuro-uchi finish.


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## DamageInc (Jul 18, 2015)

My Miyabi logos come off just with regular washing. I've used the knife for three years and never rinsed with anything other hot water, and I can only see the outline of where the logo used to be.


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## limpet (Jul 18, 2015)

It will remove any clear lacquer coating on the knife. Some kurouchi knives have that lacquer and if the kurouchi is "weak" it may flake off easier during use, attracting rust. But this is only hear-say and I've only heard it when talking about the rough kurouchi on Takeda knives.

Personally, I despise that lacquer on my carbon steel knives (I want natural patina and don't like "plastic look" on kurouchi) so I always clean my new knives with acetone, removing any lacquer if present.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 18, 2015)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> No, it won't affect a kuro-uchi finish.





limpet said:


> It will remove any clear lacquer coating on the knife. Some kurouchi knives have that lacquer...



Good to know for future reference. I must have heard in dribs and drabs



DamageInc said:


> My Miyabi logos come off just with regular washing. I've used the knife for three years and never rinsed with anything other hot water, and I can only see the outline of where the logo used to be.



That's about where mine are at right now, depending on the angle you look at it, it almost looks unmarked.

Overall it hasn't really impacted anything aside aesthetics (not that the screened logos are anything to brag about). These ones have blades that are angled (not arced as in crescent shaped) to the right ever so slightly starting where the blade and tang are welded for some reason, Henckels says this is normal apparently.


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## JBroida (Jul 18, 2015)

i honestly prefer most of the blades without the painted on logos  Bring on the acetone


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

DamageInc said:


> My Miyabi logos come off just with regular washing. I've used the knife for three years and never rinsed with anything other hot water, and I can only see the outline of where the logo used to be.



I don't want to be a dick and go offtopic but this is disgusting. You are aware hot water is not sufficient to kill bacteria?


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## havox07 (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> I don't want to be a dick and go offtopic but this is disgusting. You are aware hot water is not sufficient to kill bacteria?



Eh he's just building up his immune system, there's a reason we can't drink Mexican water and they can.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

A little paranoia can go a long ways...all I use is hot water unless I've cut something that is not water soluble...


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

Paranoia? No no my friend, it's just kind of unsanitary. I guess if you don't work with alot of raw protein it's no big worry. Seriously though, soap isn't going to hurt your knife. I'd be really worried about the handles of these knives and what is living in them... I have heard of huge huge outbreaks of food poisoning (bad enough to shut military barracks down, so we're not talking about a little squirting on the throne) which were traced back to something inbetween the tang and scales of an old wooden handled chefs knife. It's not paranoia friend, he's taking unnecessary risks!!

Keep in mind I work in the hospitality industry and **** a brick if I see dirty dishes stacked with clean ones, water spots on cutlery etcetera


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## Tall Dark and Swarfy (Jul 18, 2015)

chinacats said:


> A little paranoia can go a long ways...all I use is hot water unless I've cut something that is not water soluble...


Same here.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> Paranoia? No no my friend, it's just kind of unsanitary. I guess if you don't work with alot of raw protein it's no big worry. Seriously though, soap isn't going to hurt your knife. I'd be really worried about the handles of these knives and what is living in them... I have heard of huge huge outbreaks of food poisoning (bad enough to shut military barracks down, so we're not talking about a little squirting on the throne) which were traced back to something inbetween the tang and scales of an old wooden handled chefs knife. It's not paranoia friend, he's taking unnecessary risks!!
> 
> Keep in mind I work in the hospitality industry and **** a brick if I see dirty dishes stacked with clean ones, water spots on cutlery etcetera



You're now talking about unsanitary handles...that is a different situation...you shouldn't have gaps in your handles...and no water spots (aka rust) on your gyutos. Anyway the really nasty bacteria (Clostridium botulinum) are anaerobes and won't do anything but have a few spores sitting around waiting to grow at worst...as to the rest, what doesn't kill you will make you stronger

And since you do seem a bit paranoid, it should be fun to know that you likely consume some of those nasty spores with everything you eat...and drink provided you drink water and eat fresh fruits and veggies


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

I'm not going to argue about sanitary practices! I also would consider the "knife" to consist of blade and handle, so when a person says they don't wash the "knife" with soap I assume the whole thing is being referred to.

It is not true that hot water (even water at 212*F) is enough to sanitize your knives after working with food (for the same reasons that cooking rotted food will not make it safe to eat). Maybe if you have an autoclave at home, you could get away with it and be risk free.

What's more it's not just the particulate matter from the vegetables that worries me, it's the decomposition of those particles and the changes caused by that decomposition that pose health risks.

Are you going to die? No. But you're probably being harder on your digestive tract than necessary. Just don't complain to me when you have the runs!


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## havox07 (Jul 18, 2015)

Washing with soap marginally cuts down on bacteria, but mainy washing at all even with jusg water does a lot. Normal soap only really removes oils and other nonpolar molecules though having a polar and nonpolar binding site. So it works well with dirt and whatnot but with knives which usually don't end up too dirty water works just the same.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> It is not true that hot water (even water at 212*F) is enough to sanitize your knives after working with food. Maybe if you have an autoclave at home, you could get away with it and be risk free.
> 
> What's more it's not just the particulate matter from the vegetables that worries me, it's the decomposition of those particles and the changes caused by that decomposition that pose health risks.



Autoclave is used for sterilization, not to sanitize...

I don't leave any vegetative matter decomposing or not on my knives and doubt that others do either. Water will remove this just fine. 

Just having fun, but realistically there is not much risk of catching anything nasty from your knife. I do agree that cracks in handles or old falling apart handles do freak me out a bit.


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

Realistically you are incorrect. Do you wash your dishes with just water too? Sterilization is the removal of all microorganisms, while sanitation is an attempt to minimize them. Don't play semantics with me :nunchucks:  By the by fats are not soluble in water and all fats autoxidize in the presence of oxygen (ie. rancidity), one great reason to use soap on your knives.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> Realistically you are incorrect. Do you wash your dishes with just water too?



No, Got Science? 

Right, that is what autoclave is for (sterilize)...remember?

As to the fats, like I said, if not water soluble then yes to clean with soapy water.


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## havox07 (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> I'm not going to argue about sanitary practices! I also would consider the "knife" to consist of blade and handle, so when a person says they don't wash the "knife" with soap I assume the whole thing is being referred to.
> 
> It is not true that hot water (even water at 212*F) is enough to sanitize your knives after working with food (for the same reasons that cooking rotted food will not make it safe to eat). Maybe if you have an autoclave at home, you could get away with it and be risk free.
> 
> ...



Really if you want to perfectly sanitise your knife you need to use a sanitising chemical, whether it be bleach, or the others which I completely forget.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

havox07 said:


> Really if you want to perfectly sanitise your knife you need to use a sanitising chemical, whether it be bleach, or the others which I completely forget.



Yes chlorine, quats, iodine, or steam:clown:


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

Right for the sake of discussion let's pretend I'm advocating for a minimization of microorganisms on your knife, not complete sterilization. Water, IMO, is not going to cut it. 

Your friends wouldn't want to eat over at your house if you told them you washed your dishes with just water. I wouldn't want to eat over at your house if you told me you washed your knife with just water, and you'd be fired from my kitchen without warning or your last paycheque if you ever told anyone you hadn't washed your knife today with anything other than water.

We use quat 400 on all our knives and work surfaces at work.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> Right for the sake of discussion let's pretend I'm advocating for a minimization of microorganisms on your knife, not complete sterilization. Water, IMO, is not going to cut it.
> 
> Your friends wouldn't want to eat over at your house if you told them you washed your dishes with just water. I wouldn't want to eat over at your house if you told me you washed your knife with just water, and you'd be fired from my kitchen without warning or your last paycheque if you ever told anyone you hadn't washed your knife today with anything other than water.



Glad I don't work in a kitchen (especially yours); but do have a pretty good understanding of the microbiology of the little guys that make you sick...and still just use (hot) water 9/10 times while cleaning my knives (I don't cut a lot of meat).


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## havox07 (Jul 18, 2015)

Well I mean if you are this anal about it why would you use only soap which doesn't change very much? And firing someone and not giving them their last paycheck doesn't seem very sound to me.


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## chinacats (Jul 18, 2015)

havox07 said:


> Well I mean if you are this anal about it why would you use only soap which doesn't change very much? And firing someone and not giving them their last paycheck doesn't seem very sound to me.



:rofl2:


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 18, 2015)

Sorry, we use quat 400 which contains ammonia I believe at work, at home I just use soap. And yep, I'm this anal. Water spots on the plate? Back to the dishpit-- I don't think you'd be happy to pay 50 dollars for a plate and have water spots or finger prints all over it hehe. Yes I am anal retentive, absolutely. Most dedicated chef/cooks can be described as obsessive compulsive. I end my shift by resanitizing my already clean knives.

Also apologies for going semi-offtopic. I mean technically we're still on about cleaning knives (You guys think I'm anal, TJangula uses acetone??? :razz: kidding TJ)


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 19, 2015)

As a health conscious home cook, I am concerned about trihalomethanes and other toxic compounds. Overuse AB soap and triclosan can result in "super bugs" resistant to conventional treatment.

I can appreciate the Health & Safety (and possible liability) aspect for a commercial setting makes it different than cooking at home (do they sill make you "wash" your CI pans?).


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 19, 2015)

Aye liability is it. There is another forum I'm on where they were talking about how in some kitchens full laundry is provided as you are not allowed to introduce foreign matter by way of your uniform (cat hair lint etc coming from dryer) into the work place. In commercial food ops it is even cleanlier, clean rooms etc.

Not sure about our cast irons, though I have heard many stories from across the pond about scrubbing the oxidation from copper pots until they shine. I'm not the be all end all of sanitation, hell I've forgotten most of what's on my food handlers. But it would piss me off if someone had been wiping their knife off with water all day long, and while withholding paycheques is illegal I believe sometimes people need a little more than a pink slip to set them straight. Old school I guess.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 19, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> TJangula uses acetone??? :razz: kidding TJ)



All good, I just can't find anything else to remove that gummy crap from turmeric root, it also helps with that orange residue. I don't use it all the time, just as needed


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## chinacats (Jul 19, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> I end my shift by resanitizing my already clean knives.



Just to be clear about this, you should rinse, wash, and rinse your stuff. For food preparation it would be wiser (since you are anal about this) to sanitize right before use as opposed to before you go home at night...kind of kidding about most stuff but serious about this.

There better not be any water spots on my knives either...wash with water and dry completely



tjangula said:


> All good, I just can't find anything else to remove that gummy crap from turmeric root, it also helps with that orange residue. I don't use it all the time, just as needed


 
Won't dawn detergent work with a scrubbie?


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 19, 2015)

chinacats said:


> Just to be clear about this, you should rinse, wash, and rinse your stuff. For food preparation it would be wiser (since you are anal about this) to sanitize right before use as opposed to before you go home at night...kind of kidding about most stuff but serious about this.
> 
> There better not be any water spots on my knives either...wash with water and dry completely


that's the idea with the unnecessary wash at the end of the night, that way the knife are assuredly clean when they come out of the case for work the next day, but you're right there could be something lurking in my case... Either way. I wasn't really trying to dump on anyone just sayin'... I don't believe water is sufficient to clean an entire knife. Blade you may get away with, I suppose. USDA seems to recommend only 120*f+ water, no additives necessary. I don't believe this addresses fat and having processed about 300lb of locally raised Berkie pork this weekend lemme tell ya about fat... :O


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 19, 2015)

I usually try to go gentle on my blades so avoid using the blue scotch brite scrubbie unless things are really stuck on. I did try that before (different brand soap though) and all it did was smear it around the blade (you could also really feel the drag from it sticking). Isopropyl alcohol didn't work either but acetone just takes it right off. I had something similar happen with this sticky sap like substance when cutting the stems on banana peels.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 19, 2015)

I like that Berkshire pork, I got some recently at the St. Norbert Farmers' Market


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## chinacats (Jul 19, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> that's the idea with the unnecessary wash at the end of the night, that way the knife are assuredly clean when they come out of the case for work the next day, but you're right there could be something lurking in my case... Either way. I wasn't really trying to dump on anyone just sayin'... I don't believe water is sufficient to clean an entire knife. Blade you may get away with, I suppose. USDA seems to recommend only 120*f+ water, no additives necessary. I don't believe this addresses fat and having processed about 300lb of locally raised Berkie pork this weekend lemme tell ya about fat... :O



Too late to edit my last comment, but did want to say that I hope all the people that prepare my food are this anal (conscientious).

Cheers!

I don't know anything about USDA (FDA yes)...but yes, sanitize your knife in the morning before use...


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 19, 2015)

tjangula said:


> I like that Berkshire pork, I got some recently at the St. Norbert Farmers' Market


Did they happen to mention where it came from? I suspect there's probably only one place that raises them but I'm not so familiar with the supply part of the chain... Zinn farms? Anyway yeah we love it! The bacon and belly is to die for. We have an indoor gas smoker on site :tease: lots of cracklins this weekend. and inappropriate tweaking of pig nipples. :eyebrow:


chinacats said:


> Too late to edit my last comment, but did want to say that I hope all the people that prepare my food are this anal (conscientious).
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> I don't know anything about USDA (FDA yes)...but yes, sanitize your knife in the morning before use...


Thank you. lus1:

sorry I meant FDA hehe it's saturday night and I don't live in America, so I'm not terribly familiar with the federal departments there! I just happened to see that researching a few moments ago on google.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jul 19, 2015)

spoiledbroth said:


> Did they happen to mention where it came from?



I got the organically raised pastured Berkshire pork from Ferme Jobin Ltee., I think they're out of the St. Claude area. They're supposed to have grass fed beef later in the season too, probably gonna stock up the freezer as I am always hearing how meat prices keep rising


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## spoiledbroth (Jul 19, 2015)

Interesting I had not heard of them... their website hurts my head though hehe.


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## DamageInc (Jul 19, 2015)

Neither me nor any of my guests have ever been sick after eating anything I've cut and cooked. I see no reason to use anything other than boiling water after cutting two carrots and an onion.
Of course if I've cut protein the knife goes through a more rigorous cleaning.

And if you're cutting vegetables with a boiled knife, there is going to be far more bacteria on the produce than the blade under any circumstances.

But sure, if you think that is completely disgusting, you are entitled to it.


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## deanb (Jul 19, 2015)

I took a microbiology course in college about 40 years ago. As a demonstration of the importance of washing with detergent the Prof. had all of the people in class perform a simple experiment. We had to wash cooking utensils and dishes with and without detergent. My memory of the next step is murky (hey, it was 40 years ago) but we may have swabbed the test items then transferred the swabs to agar Petri dishes and grew cultures. I do remember one of the results was that we all got significant cultures from the things that weren't washed with detergent and almost no culture growth from the things that were washed with detergent. I'm sure that we identified the bacteria but I don't remember what they were. I also clearly remember that the conclusion of the experiment was that washing with detergent killed or removed almost all bacteria.


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## MAS4T0 (Jul 22, 2015)

I may have missed something in the thread, but I don't understand *why* some members seemingly prefer to rinse their knives with boiling water rather than using warm soapy water. I understand that it's probably sufficient to sanitise the blade, but it seems a lot more time consuming, accident prone and likely to leave residue than washing it with soap and water.


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