# knives most likely to appreciate



## menzaremba (Jul 29, 2014)

I was looking at the Kramers that were on the bay last week, and thinking about how dramatic his price increase has been over the last decade. I'm sure I wasn't the other one that wished they'd bought a few back in the day (some to sell, some to keep). 

My question is: What are the knives/makers that we'll be wishing we had bought a decade from now. If you feel like it, post current and appreciated pricing for the amusement of future forum readers.


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## vai777 (Jul 29, 2014)

Probably the Doi's I just sold...lol. But in all seriousness.... it will be whoever gets some sort of media attention that goes viral, kind of like what happened with Kramer.


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## CoqaVin (Jul 29, 2014)

I say RANDY at HHH, he make some bad ass knives


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## vai777 (Jul 29, 2014)

Phil Wilson is very underrated


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## XooMG (Jul 30, 2014)

My vote is for Opinel.


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## WildBoar (Jul 30, 2014)

XooMG said:


> My vote is for Opinel.


Ha! I was gonna say Rachael Ray or Guy Fieri. Think about it -- no where for a $15 knife to go but up, right?


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## zoze (Jul 30, 2014)

Considering their current price point: Tilman Leder, Marko Tsourkan and Mario (if he still was doing knifes).


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## ecchef (Jul 30, 2014)

vai777 said:


> .... it will be whoever gets some sort of media attention that goes viral, kind of like what happened with Kramer.



Yup. Look at Cut Brooklyn. So-so knife with a bunch of hype.


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## chefcomesback (Jul 30, 2014)

I have not handled one but judging from pics I would hang on to any Bill
Burke knives 


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## Mrmnms (Jul 30, 2014)

DT , Catchside maybe too. Like Radar , Burke and HHH, they make their knives start to finish. Low production of the customs.


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## chefcomesback (Jul 30, 2014)

Mrmnms said:


> DT , Catchside maybe too. Like Radar , Burke and HHH, they make their knives start to finish. Low production of the customs.



A big +1



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## 29palms (Jul 30, 2014)

I'd add Murray Carter to the list as well.


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## vai777 (Jul 30, 2014)

chefcomesback said:


> I have not handled one but judging from pics I would hang on to any Bill
> Burke knives
> 
> 
> YES!!!!


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## Zwiefel (Jul 30, 2014)

I'd look at Don Nguyen: Low production, changed his maker's mark (which strongly dates the knives with the first mark), amazing quality, highly distinct style (slightly less since he stopped doing the k-tips (as often?)).


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## Pachowder (Jul 31, 2014)

I appreciate all my knives!


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## Mute-on (Jul 31, 2014)

Shigs made by Tokifusa Iizuka, with their own unique kanji. Once the sons take over, these will be nla


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## menzaremba (Jul 31, 2014)

The Shigs are on my list for sure.


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## jared08 (Jul 31, 2014)

Not to be a debby downer, but I feel like it will take extreme circumstances for average people to appreciate an appreciated value other than us select knife heads..that being said, best luck in the market place goes to Burke and dt I think.


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## easy13 (Jul 31, 2014)

Bloodroot, Kazuyuki Tanaka stuff


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## osakajoe (Aug 1, 2014)

29palms said:


> I'd add Murray Carter to the list as well.



I'd say he's still young and has plenty of years left. Met him last year when he was in Japan and plan on saying hello when I'm stateside in his area next month. So wouldn't count him out as disappearing anytime soon and suddenly his knives becoming rare and something to hang on to.

Plenty of knife makers here in Japan that are getting old with no successor to take over. Those are the guys I would look for.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Aug 1, 2014)

Any of the 6 mastersmiths that make kitchenknives, Burke, Kramer, DT, Rader, Carter, Wilburn. Also Randy, Will, Peirre and Marko for sure. I think Cris Anderson, Luke Snyder, David Lisch, Maumasi, and Jones are all people to keep your eye on. I own knives from every one but Jones and they are all quality products. PS sorry to any makers I left out. Oh and I'm waiting on a Tillman. I've heard nothing but good things


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## Keith Sinclair (Aug 4, 2014)

osakajoe said:


> I'd say he's still young and has plenty of years left. Met him last year when he was in Japan and plan on saying hello when I'm stateside in his area next month. So wouldn't count him out as disappearing anytime soon and suddenly his knives becoming rare and something to hang on to.
> 
> Plenty of knife makers here in Japan that are getting old with no successor to take over. Those are the guys I would look for.



Yeh the brothers that made my Tamahagane are late 80's & 90. Rare that build Tatara oven to forge kitchen knives. A-Frames had a few, but they are all sold out.


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## Keith Sinclair (Aug 4, 2014)

I take that back A-Frames brought in a couple more Tamahagane/Watetsu Yoshimitsu 210mm Gyuto


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## Salty dog (Aug 4, 2014)

A full set of Hattori KDs.


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## mhlee (Aug 4, 2014)

Salty dog said:


> A full set of Hattori KDs.



+1

I'm surprised the KD line wasn't brought up earlier. Prices have easily tripled in the last 5 years.

Also, Carter knives have significantly appreciated, even though he's still making a good amount of knives. Most of his knives, especially the larger sizes, have increased, by at least 50%, in the past few years based on used and new knife prices.


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## labor of love (Aug 4, 2014)

If your looking at knife purchasing from an investment standpoint I would probably pass on the Carters. They have jumped in price in recent years but I think Carter is pretty near his ceiling. He doesnt do customs anymore and he pumps out a crazy amount of knives considering the scale of his operation. Other makers have less supply and more demand. I would consider the hattori KDs just because the demand is huge and has been growing for years and theyre extremely difficult to obtain.


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## cheflarge (Aug 4, 2014)

HHH..... (off the hook) san mai damascus


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## Matus (Aug 4, 2014)

Well - I am not that optimistic. Knives that will appreciate a lot (relative to purchase price today) will be those made by makers that are not well known today. Sure - an *unused* $1000+ Rader or western Shig may actually be worth some 20-30% more in few years, but I would not be too sure about that. For me it would be a torture to have such an amazing knife at home, but not use it


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## Lizzardborn (Aug 4, 2014)

I think you are looking at that slightly wrong - from the enthusiast point of you. For the majority of posters here a knife has an intrinsic value of its own. The problem (only for value appreciation) with that is a knife from a great maker makes good enough substitute for a knife from another great maker, that has gone up in price, which just doesn't allow the makers to jack up the prices. 

In one of the previous topics about Kramer, one of the makers here told about visit to his physician, where they talked about Kramer's blades. The maker tried to interest the doctor with some of his knives (and I have yet to hear bad word performance or finish wise for any of the artisan knives made here) and was politely ignored. The person just wanted a Kramer.

So the knives that will shoot up in price probably won't be the best, the prettiest or whatever-est, but will be the ones whose maker manages to jump into pop culture. Sadly from my observation of pop culture this is unpredictable and based on luck.

This is about order of magnitude appreciation.


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## Salty dog (Aug 4, 2014)

Will you be able to buy this knife 10 years from now?
If so, will it be the same quality?

http://shoei-do.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=677


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## Castalia (Aug 4, 2014)

Just because a knife is hard to get does not mean it will significantly appreciate in the future. I agree with Lizzardborn, that what will be popular in 10 or 20 years is entirely unpredictable. Who ever can get a giant knife company to make one of their designs and sell it at WS or SLT ala Kramer may (or may not) appreciate in the market, but don't buy knives as investments. You will be dissapointed if you hope to make a lot of money by buying knives. Buy them and enjoy using them.


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## Salty dog (Aug 4, 2014)

For the most part that is very true. Especially the last part.


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## labor of love (Aug 4, 2014)

Castalia said:


> Just because a knife is hard to get does not mean it will significantly appreciate in the future.


 The fact remains that for every knife Kramer makes theres a 1000 buyers lined up to buy it. Making it both scarce and in high demand. It isnt just the scarcity, its the demand. Buying knives in hopes that the value may appreciate over time is for the birds, though. And I agree that trying to figure out a way to profit from collecting knives is completely impossible.


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## Von blewitt (Aug 4, 2014)

If you want to make a small fortune from kitchen knives, start with a large fortune.


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## Zwiefel (Aug 4, 2014)

Von blewitt said:


> If you want to make a small fortune from kitchen knives, start with a large fortune.



I see you have followed the career of Donald Trump.


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## zerafa (Aug 4, 2014)

Salty dog said:


> A full set of Hattori KDs.



i am missing one...


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## dmccurtis (Aug 7, 2014)

A little different than what others are thinking, but I'm going to suggest Chinese knives. With rising income, higher expected wages, government encouragement for people to consume, and increasing awareness of overseas popularity, I think Chinese cleavers might get a fair bit more expensive in the future. A CCK 1102 already costs 50% more today than it did when I bought one two years ago.


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## Keith Sinclair (Aug 7, 2014)

I can still get the same cleavers cheaper here in Chinatown than Chinese chef mall. Besides if a collector blade is used much it decreases in value. Something is only worth as much as the price it is sold for, I do not think I ever sold a knife for more than I paid for it.


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## rami_m (Aug 7, 2014)

keithsaltydog said:


> I can still get the same cleavers cheaper here in Chinatown than Chinese chef mall. Besides if a collector blade is used much it decreases in value. Something is only worth as much as the price it is sold for, I do not think I ever sold a knife for more than I paid for it.



Thumbs up. I want to use the little beauties. Was not so sure at the beginning but now I do.


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## MikeHL (Aug 8, 2014)

I'm not sure if Chinese cleavers are the way to go. From what I can see the mid-highend cleaver market is a nich market and restricted to the west. To the Chinese a $50 CCK is expensive, there isn't a culture of blade worship like in Japan or in the west. 

But if you want to make money in the Chinese market I'd go to Germany and purchase the best that Wusthof and Henckels has to offer (but only made in Germany, no zKramers) buy a container load and set up shop. As in China and other markets its all about marketing and brand. Your buddies will know jack about Ashi Hamono but they will sure know about Henckels as they seen it on TV. My advice is to just enjoy your knives, but if you want to make money as well I'd say get the most flashy,super specialized (so it doesn't get used) and technically hard to make knife you can from a well known maker. 

For example a 80 HRC 330mm Meteor Feather Damascus Honyaki Sakimaru by Doi. With a narwhal horn bolster, aheirloom (give your first son to) grade Koa handle. Finished with a matching koa saya, inlayed with gold and diamonds (preferably from your wife's wedding ring, she will understand)

To the makers here, the above line was a joke and not a challenge


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## rami_m (Aug 8, 2014)

MikeHL said:


> To the makers here, the above line was a joke and not a challenge


Are you sure?


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## dmccurtis (Aug 8, 2014)

MikeHL said:


> I'm not sure if Chinese cleavers are the way to go. From what I can see the mid-highend cleaver market is a nich market and restricted to the west. To the Chinese a $50 CCK is expensive, there isn't a culture of blade worship like in Japan or in the west.



To be clear, I wasn't suggesting Chinese cleavers are going to become the next Kramers. Rather, they're inexpensive knives with the potential to increase in price relatively significantly. As you say, $50 is expensive in China, but that's changing.


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## MikeHL (Aug 8, 2014)

Oh in that case of cck your absolutely right. The reg cck slicer is around $30 usd in HK, Once it reaches North America the prices jump. I like your business case to hoard cleavers.


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## Casaluz (Nov 7, 2014)

Does anybody know if Tilman Leder has a website for his cutlery?


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## dough (Nov 8, 2014)

i dont think he has a website but he also goes by rottman on this forum.


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## Dave Martell (Nov 8, 2014)

Casaluz said:


> Does anybody know if Tilman Leder has a website for his cutlery?





dough said:


> i dont think he has a website but he also goes by rottman on this forum.




Rottman


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