# how do you treat your handles...



## spoiledbroth (Jan 5, 2016)

Obviously I know oil/wax woodworking finish products (tung oil etc) or just plain old board butter...

I'm more curious about the technique people use to treat such handles.

I tend to work the board butter into the handle for at least 15-20 minutes with my hands (or until I can see the excess wax takes on a grayish colour, presumably from my sweaty/greasy hands though I scrub the handles and my hands with antibacterial soap before to keep from 'contaminating' the handle or sealing in a previous nasty).

Then I will try to let the wax sit on the handle or saya for at least a few hours, overnight if possible. After that I wipe off the excess with paper towel and kinda buff it with a microfibre cloth. Usually this will last a day or two before I notice the hou wood is quite thirsty (in the winter here it is very, very dry).

Was wondering if most people just apply the board butter, work it in and then wipe it off all in one sitting or what?

Also curious to know other (FOODSAFE) alternatives that might work better. I saw one guy online (may have been here) who would knock new handles off and vacuum seal them in a bag with some type of wood finishing oil. I guess he had the vacuum set up so that it penetrated really deep into the wood. That was cool but I'm currently without access to something that could pull a decent vacuum in such a manner.

Thanks folks.


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## SuperSharp (Jan 5, 2016)

I have basically the same ritual. I use board butter, massage into handle until content, then usually let sit overnight before wiping off the excess with a paper towel.


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## The Edge (Jan 5, 2016)

I tend to use renaissance wax on my handles, though most of mine are stabilized wood, so I don't have to worry quite so much about the wood drying out.


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## chinacats (Jan 6, 2016)

Before applying the board butter, I stand the knife on it's handle in a tall glass of mineral oil overnight--for new or overly dry handles. Let that absorb completely through the handle and then after that dries you can apply the board butter however you like.


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 6, 2016)

the edge, thanks for the tip about renaissance wax. Like what I'm reading online about it.



chinacats said:


> Before applying the board butter, I stand the knife on it's handle in a tall glass of mineral oil overnight--for new or overly dry handles. Let that absorb completely through the handle and then after that dries you can apply the board butter however you like.


ah I like this idea too! I hadn't thought about that. I could probably get a fancy slim cocktail glass to limit the amount of mineral oil I'd have to buy.


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## TurboScooter (Jan 6, 2016)

If I have something old and/or dry, I put cling film down on the counter, apply a liberal amount of mineral oil, then wrap it in the cling film. Let sit for a while (overnight, few days, whatever), unwrap, repeat if it's mostly been absorbed.


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## ecchef (Jan 6, 2016)

I use a combination of several of these techniques. Warm the handle with a hair dryer, liberal application of board butter (Dave's formula), wrap in cling film. I'll leave them stored that way too. Haven't had any issues even with the extreme variations in humidity that we get here.


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## KitchenCommander (Jan 6, 2016)

I have a large jar that I filled with Mineral Oil, then I do as Chinacats does and submerge the handle in the jar of oil. The jar is easy because I just put the lid on for next time. My longest soak time so far has been a couple of hours. I will try overnight next time to allow for maximum absorption. For me it is easy and allows for the handle to absorb as much oil as it needs. Also the jar is super convenient.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jan 6, 2016)

What kind of wood handles are we talking about here? Unstabilized I assuming. You guys soak your Ho wood handles in mineral oil? Doesn't it make them greasy? I do put board butter or mineral oil on my Boccote, ebony but Ho wood, even pakka wood. I thought the whole benefit of Ho wood was that is naturally grippy (abundant and cheap too), not sure why you'd want to make the handles oily?

The handles on my knives almost never get messy anyway. If both hands are required in the middle of prep, I'll usually wash them before resuming cutting.What am I missing?


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## Asteger (Jan 6, 2016)

I think far too much is made of handles in the KKF-zone. When it comes to wa handles I dislike almost all of the flashy burl-wood handles, any with those pointless spacers or rhinestone things, etc, as to me they always make the knife look more about the handle than the blade. Too much. So, I wouldn't know or care about taking care of this type of handle if that's what you mean. If handles are western, some variation looks okay to me, but I like wa. My handles are all plainer and 'Japanese' wa in ho, walnut, Japanese cherry, ebony, ichii/yew or keyaki, with buffalo. 

I have mixed feelings about treating handles, because for example in the case of ho, when the wood is unsealed with oil the grains rise and really give an excellent grip. The handle on my newish Toyama is like this; some people might think about immediately replacing it, but what a practial handle and secure to hold when wet. However, sometimes if I think I don't care about getting a smoother feel and if it'll make the handles look more sleek without being showy then I'll use some mineral oil/beeswax and polish.

But I'm often more concerned about what's inside than the handle and the installation. I might worry more about the tang than the wood, and so I'll use beeswax to fill the handle hole or coat the tang when installing a handle, to waterproof and add some strength. However, there's the argument that a somewhat rusted tang is quite natural and will provide more strength and stability to the handle in time, as it'll expand a bit inside there. Why be afraid of this? 

Basically, I have lots of extra handles - maybe 20 in different sizes and woods - and my attitude is that I can always switch and change any if needed in the future, and that's the practical side to the traditional wa design. They're made to complement the knife and be practical, easily installed or removed, without great lose if they get worn, and they're not the focus of attention when compared to the blades.



Mucho Bocho said:


> What kind of wood handles are we talking about here? You guys soak your Ho wood handles in mineral oil? Doesn't it make them greasy? I do put board butter or mineral oil on my Boccote, ebony but Ho wood, even pakka wood. I thought the whole benefit of Ho wood was that is naturally grippy (abundant and cheap too), not sure why you'd want to make the handles oily?



MB just got in 3 minutes ahead of me. Exactly.


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## chinacats (Jan 6, 2016)

Mucho Bocho said:


> What kind of wood handles are we talking about here? Unstabilized I assuming. You guys soak your Ho wood handles in mineral oil? Doesn't it make them greasy? I do put board butter or mineral oil on my Boccote, ebony but Ho wood, even pakka wood. I thought the whole benefit of Ho wood was that is naturally grippy (abundant and cheap too), not sure why you'd want to make the handles oily?
> 
> The handles on my knives almost never get messy anyway. If both hands are required in the middle of prep, I'll usually wash them before resuming cutting.What am I missing?




I just use the oil on ho wood...use butter on stabilized handles. I find that it just makes them "less dry" and not oily at all (once dry that is). Basically just a way to protect the wood in my mind...and it usually will add up to five grams to a very dry handle.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jan 6, 2016)

Thanks Jim, Maybe I'll give mine an overnight dunk see if I like them any better.


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## Pensacola Tiger (Jan 6, 2016)

When I started my journey I was very much concerned with the condition of the ho wood handles of my knives that had them. I oiled them, I waxed them, soaked them in mineral oil - all the techniques that have been mentioned in other posts. Over time, I came to appreciate that the handles needed no attention, and that untreated ho wood gave the best grip.


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## Asteger (Jan 6, 2016)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> I came to appreciate that the handles needed no attention, and that untreated ho wood gave the best grip.



 Very funny, isn't it. Lots of fuss (and expensive upgrades) for naught.


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## Mucho Bocho (Jan 6, 2016)

Pensacola Tiger said:


> When I started my journey I was very much concerned with the condition of the ho wood handles of my knives that had them. I oiled them, I waxed them, soaked them in mineral oil - all the techniques that have been mentioned in other posts. Over time, I came to appreciate that the handles needed no attention, and that untreated ho wood gave the best grip.



That's what I thought Too Rick. Thanks for affirming.


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 6, 2016)

personally my primary concern is that the handles do not discolor, take on odours or worst of all become colonized by pathogenic bacteria. I have not noticed much of a difference between unwaxed and waxed hou wood in terms of grip. 

Oh, I forgot to note I was talking mostly about the stock hou/buffalo horn, but I'd think there's benefit with any unstabilized wood.

I understand that at home or "in a perfect world" at work you've got time to sanitize everything on your own schedule, however from time to time situations arise where a knife handle is going to be subjected to unsanitary conditions for at least an hour or two. It's those situations where I'd prefer to have some kind of barrier to keep the wood from taking on colours or smells at the very least (I recognize the bacteria thing is probably unlikely and from what I read here most harmful bacteria dies as wood dries out - cutting board in the article but I figure the same applies to unstabilized wood handles)


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

As a long time woodworker I just would like to suggest that wax offers almost nothing in terms of moisture protection. Most furniture makers only use it as a top coat to add shine to their product.

On my knives I only use pure oil or pure resin varnish. For oil I would use tung oil or teak oil and let it cure for 24 hours and then apply another coat. Soaking your dense oily wood handles in oil/wax solutions doesn't penetrate beyond the surface pores and even with woods like cherry, walnut, chestnut the oil penetration is very slight. You would be better off removing any wax and applying multiple thin coats of pure tung oil left to fully dry at least 24 hours.

Jack


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 7, 2016)

hmm interesting jacko... thanks for the tip I will have to look into getting some tung oil and giving it a try.


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## aboynamedsuita (Jan 7, 2016)

I guess custom handles made with stabilized woods and treated with tung oil shouldn't need too much other than a quick touch up from time to time? I can't see the oil soaking in otherwise.

As for the wax/oil thing, I've rubbed in board butter and let it sit overnight and repeat when I've seen look like it needs it. Also have a product called Clapmans salad bowl finish from Lee Valley which is mostly beeswax with some mineral oil that I have used after the oil or board butter.

On a related note I still have that Toyama handle if you want it spoiledbroth. It was the untreated h&#333; and had a mothball smell when wet (perhaps it was one of the antibacterial treated handles?). I put a bit of board butter on it and it darkened it up, still looks thirsty but I'll leave that up to you to decide how to proceed with.


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

I just viewed a few videos on stabilizing woods for knife handles and if the wood has an open pore structure you can indeed get resins into that open structure and seal the wood with resins. The resins on the outside surface will wear with use and I would suggest that you use a wipe on resin like General Finishes Arm-R-Seal to get back to the original protective layer (used per directions). Woods that have not been resin saturated and/or coated can be treated with pure tung oil in several layers with the appropriate cure time between layers. Wood handles that have never been waxed or had the wax removed (difficult) can be treated with Arm-R-Seal for a very durable finish. Wax only inhibits the penetration of pure oils or resins so while the application of an oil/wax mixture will make your handle look new at first it won't give you a lot of long term protection.


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## Asteger (Jan 7, 2016)

jacko9 said:


> ... wax offers almost nothing in terms of moisture protection. ... use it as a top coat to add shine to their product.
> 
> On my knives I only use pure oil or pure resin varnish. For oil I would use tung oil or teak oil and let it cure for 24 hours and then apply another coat. Soaking your dense oily wood handles in oil/wax solutions doesn't penetrate beyond the surface pores and even with woods like cherry, walnut, chestnut the oil penetration is very slight. You would be better off removing any wax and applying multiple thin coats of pure tung oil left to fully dry at least 24 hours.



Interesting as it flies in the face of the conventional wisdom here about using wax as part of 'board butter' on handles as well as boards. So, then wax just makes things look shiny and doesn't have any other effect? And what about mineral oil and why would 'pure oil' (not sure what exactly this is) or resin varnish and tung and teak oil work better?

I remember asking in Japan about how people protect their wooden boards and (I'm still not sure what they do if anything, but) the idea of using mineral oil was completely alien to them 



tjangula said:


> On a related note Toyama handle ... untreated h&#333; and had a mothball smell when wet (perhaps it was one of the antibacterial treated handles?) I put a bit of board butter on it and it darkened it up, still looks thirsty



The second time I've noticed some comments on the Toyama handle smell. Watanbe's handles come from the same maker, too. 

For what it's worth I've got 3 Watanabe and 2 Toyama, and no stinky handle syndrome. I'd also say that on my Toyama gyuto the handle has a really thirsty rough-grained feel, but I think this is pretty ideal if you want a good grip on your knife and so I wouldn't change it.


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

Asteger - Here is a link to of a video given the wood finish 101 explanation.

[video=youtube;pCzblO0f8P8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCzblO0f8P8[/video]

If you want more detailed information I can point you to other finishing resources.

Jack


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## Asteger (Jan 7, 2016)

jacko9 said:


> Asteger - Here is a link to of a video given the wood finish 101 explanation.



Cool. Thanks, Jack. I'll have a look


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 7, 2016)

I'm hesitant with those kind of sealing products because general finishes makes other products for salad bowls, and then they recommend using their butchers block oil on heavily used boards and blocks...


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

Go to Marc Spagnolo's web site for additional information he has published a ton of free videos - the Wood Whisperer. I also have several other references on finishing wood from professional furniture finishers if you want more information.

Jack


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## Mucho Bocho (Jan 7, 2016)

I'm going to need a tong oil bath after watching that video. Talk about a dry handle...


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## MAS4T0 (Jan 7, 2016)

Asteger said:


> Interesting as it flies in the face of the conventional wisdom here about using wax as part of 'board butter' on handles as well as boards. So, then wax just makes things look shiny and doesn't have any other effect? And what about mineral oil and why would 'pure oil' (not sure what exactly this is) or resin varnish and tung and teak oil work better?



I always felt that board butter is beneficial as it helps to prevent the mineral oil from being drawn out during washing. 
I would rather stick to mineral oil than mixing varnish and thinners and impregnating the board with that.


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

MAS4T0 said:


> I always felt that board butter is beneficial as it helps to prevent the mineral oil from being drawn out during washing.
> I would rather stick to mineral oil than mixing varnish and thinners and impregnating the board with that, the issue is just that it needs topping up from time to time.



Keep in mind that I'm only recommending varnish for knife handles not for cutting boards. A film finish is not recommended for an application like a cutting board.

Jack


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## MAS4T0 (Jan 7, 2016)

jacko9 said:


> Keep in mind that I'm only recommending varnish for knife handles not for cutting boards. A film finish is not recommended for an application like a cutting board.
> 
> Jack



Hi Jack,

Thank you for clarifying.
I was actually referencing the video where he mentioned thinning a varnish so that it can impregnate deeply into end-grain and cure inside.

How durable is a varnish finish for the sake of washing? 
I always figured that it was more time efficient to have a quickly applied oil or wax surface and refinish frequently rather than spend the time on a varnish finish.

I have a number of bokken (wooden training swords) which I have finished with tung oil, but even years after applying the finish I find them slightly nauseous when in an enclosed space. I've never dared to use this finish on knife handles as I don't think I could handle the smell. 
Is tung oil always like this or is more likely that I did something wrong when applying the finish?


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

MAS4T0 said:


> Hi Jack,
> 
> Thank you for clarifying.
> I was actually referencing the video where he mentioned thinning a varnish so that it can impregnate deeply into end-grain and cure inside.
> ...



The question of varnish first - there are several products that are being marketed as varnish like Wipe-On Poly, etc. (these products are oils with a little varnish in them and they don't cure like a pure varnish) The product I mentioned is a urethane resin in solvents that cures fully and is very durable. I have used this product on table tops that see family use daily and has lasted for years. I have also used it on Brazilian Rosewood Dining Room tables where it has also been extremely durable for several years now (and Rosewood is very difficult to finish). A fully cured varnish resin will leave a coating of less than 0.05mm so several coats of finish will give you a very durable finish on your knifer handle. The General Finishes Arm-R-Seal does not need to be thinned since it's formulated as a wiping varnish and the solvents will completely evaporate away. I wouldn't leave it sitting in the sink for hours at a time but, spilled wine left overnight wipes right off with a damp cloth.

Stores market a lot of products called Tung Oil Finish or something like that and they may only have a low concentration of tung oil in them and most won't cure fully. !00% pure tung oil will fully cure and you won't smell any thing coming off whatever you finish. Tung oil does age in then container after opening and starts to cure after several months but even then it just starts to go solid so it has to be used within a year or so after opening the container.

If you want a finish for your sword handles that will give you some protection but not water proof - use shellac mixed from non-waxed shellac flakes. I always use this for the inside of cabinets and drawers where you don't want someone opening it up and getting a whiff of chemical smell. You can use acetone to clean the old finish off and use alcohol to dissolve the shellac flakes.


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## MAS4T0 (Jan 7, 2016)

Thank you very much for the advice Jack!

I'll have to try out some other finishes.


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

Your welcome MAS4TO - I've been building furniture for over 40 years and have had my share of issues finishing that took a lot of work to fix. I have been learning as i go and only wish I had someone to ask on some projects. The Brazilian Rosewood dining room table took me four months to get it right (the winter temperatures didn't help with curing between coats).

Let me know if you have any other questions,

Jack


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## Asteger (Jan 7, 2016)

Top advice from someone who knows. Thanks, Jack


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## panda (Jan 7, 2016)

I treat mine with blood sweat & tears.


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## jacko9 (Jan 7, 2016)

panda said:


> I treat mine with blood sweat & tears.



I did some of that on the 25th should have gone to emergency but it was too late at night and Sunday is always too crowded - so on Monday the Doc says you should have gotten stitches but -it's too late. Another nice scar on my hands (to go along with many years of scars).

Actually no tears the wine was too good ;-)


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## mark76 (Jan 8, 2016)

That's a very informative film, Jack, thanks! I happened to use Danish oil already for my handles, so I guess there's no need to change 

One question, though: as I know from experience, Danish oil makes handles slightly more dark/yellowish. Now I've got a handle made of almost white birch wood and I was adviced to use Tru oil, since that wouldn't leave that yellowish finish on the wood. Can you say anything about this?


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## _PixelNinja (Jan 8, 2016)

mark76 said:


> One question, though: as I know from experience, Danish oil makes handles slightly more dark/yellowish. Now I've got a handle made of almost white birch wood and I was adviced to use Tru oil, since that wouldn't leave that yellowish finish on the wood. Can you say anything about this?


Just as anything else Tru-Oil will change the color of the wood. Here's a comparison between a naked ho wood saya and a ho wood handle I treated with Tru-Oil to give you an idea:


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## Asteger (Jan 8, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> Just as anything else Tru-Oil will change the color of the wood. Here's a comparison between a naked ho wood saya and a ho wood handle I treated with Tru-Oil to give you an idea:



Nice difference on the handle; looks like a keyaki handle I have. 

There must be differences in the quality of ho wood, though, and that might also affect the woods in your photos. I've got loads of handles (spares) in ho, and they're usually plain. Some handles I have, however, are more sleek and seem to be of a special grade.


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## jacko9 (Jan 8, 2016)

The finishing product will give a spectrum of colors on different woods, woodworking stores will have a group of different woods and how they look with a specific finishing product they happen to be selling and the color variations are quite striking.

Here is a link to Understanding Wood Finishes that will give you a layman's view of the different products out on the market (without the market hype).

http://woodtools.nov.ru/books/Understanding_Wood_Finishes.pdf

Jack


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 8, 2016)

my Tanaka hou/buffalo handle would never darken for me, it was weird. Everybody notes the difference between a Tanaka and a normal hou handle though.


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## Gark (Jan 8, 2016)

Step 1: Slather your wood liberally with oil.

Step 2: Rub until the desired result is achieved.

Hope this helps!


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## bkultra (Jan 8, 2016)

Gark said:


> Step 1: Slather your wood liberally with oil.
> 
> Step 2: Rub until the desired result is achieved.
> 
> Hope this helps!



there are somethings you don't post about in public forums. :biggrin:


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## Asteger (Jan 8, 2016)

I suggest you 2 move to 'The Off Topic Room' ... :O


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## icanhaschzbrgr (Jan 8, 2016)

mark76 said:


> That's a very informative film, Jack, thanks! I happened to use Danish oil already for my handles, so I guess there's no need to change
> 
> One question, though: as I know from experience, Danish oil makes handles slightly more dark/yellowish. Now I've got a handle made of almost white birch wood and I was adviced to use Tru oil, since that wouldn't leave that yellowish finish on the wood. Can you say anything about this?


I guess you can ask Robin for pictures, since he have lots of handles made from Birch and uses tru-oil as well. 
My own experience is the following: Tru-Oil wouldn't darken wood as much as Danish oil, but still would work in a similar way: Birch would became darker and more yellowish after initial coat (further layers won't change colour, but would add glossiness).


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## JayGee (Jan 8, 2016)

I very knowledgable japanese woodworker told me that all tools - including knives - should have their handles sanded up to about 400 and treated with a drying oil (pure tung oil etc) before first use. After that you can do whatever you like - i.e 0000 steel wool and more oil applications - but you don't really need to treat them again. The initial treatment makes the handles age in a much more beautiful way.


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## _PixelNinja (Jan 8, 2016)

Asteger said:


> Nice difference on the handle; looks like a keyaki handle I have.
> 
> There must be differences in the quality of ho wood, though, and that might also affect the woods in your photos. I've got loads of handles (spares) in ho, and they're usually plain. Some handles I have, however, are more sleek and seem to be of a special grade.


I'm not quite sure what you mean. If you are implying the untreated ho wood of the handle would/could have been originally of a different hue than the saya, out of the box they were virtually identical:


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 8, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> I'm not quite sure what you mean. If you are implying the untreated ho wood of the handle would/could have been originally of a different hue than the saya, out of the box they were virtually identical:



which knives are these? I think asteger was making a general comment about all hou handles not necessarily about the handle and saya in your pictures.

those saya are beautiful. are the characters burned in?


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## _PixelNinja (Jan 8, 2016)

spoiledbroth said:


> which knives are these? I think asteger was making a general comment about all hou handles not necessarily about the handle and saya in your pictures.
> 
> those saya are beautiful. are the characters burned in?


I dunno what Asterger meant to be honest; hopefully he will chime along and clarify : ) I was under the impression he was implying that because of the line '[A]nd that might also affect the woods in your photos'.

Otherwise, the knives are frome Nenohi's Wa-Ryouba line (semi-stainless, mono-steel)  270mm _Kiristuke Wa-Gyuto_ and 180mm _Petty_. The Nenohi logo is indeed burned in on the sayas.


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## jacko9 (Jan 8, 2016)

mark76 said:


> That's a very informative film, Jack, thanks! I happened to use Danish oil already for my handles, so I guess there's no need to change
> 
> One question, though: as I know from experience, Danish oil makes handles slightly more dark/yellowish. Now I've got a handle made of almost white birch wood and I was adviced to use Tru oil, since that wouldn't leave that yellowish finish on the wood. Can you say anything about this?



Mark - Sorry about getting back to you so late. If you look at the Safety Data Sheet Tru Oil is Lindseed Oil with a Propriety oil mix and solvent so I see no reason that it would keep birch from yellowing. The only finishes that I have used to keep light color woods from yellowing are wax finishes that work great for furniture but not for items that see water exposure.


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## jacko9 (Jan 8, 2016)

Asteger said:


> Nice difference on the handle; looks like a keyaki handle I have.
> 
> There must be differences in the quality of ho wood, though, and that might also affect the woods in your photos. I've got loads of handles (spares) in ho, and they're usually plain. Some handles I have, however, are more sleek and seem to be of a special grade.



Asteger, If you think about a tree growing in concentric circles the exposure of open pores is related to the way the boards are cut from the tree. Some wood cuts expose more open grain than others in woodworking terms plain sawn vs quartered sawn cuts of wood yield greatly different looks and pore structure.

If your interested a book at the library "Understanding Wood" by R Bruce Hoadley explains how wood cut from a tree in different directions behave. It's a great book for anybody interested in woodworking or wood finishing.


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## spoiledbroth (Jan 8, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> I dunno what Asterger meant to be honest; hopefully he will chime along and clarify : ) I was under the impression he was implying that because of the line '[A]nd that might also affect the woods in your photos'.
> 
> Otherwise, the knives are frome Nenohi's Wa-Ryouba line (semi-stainless, mono-steel)  270mm _Kiristuke Wa-Gyuto_ and 180mm _Petty_. The Nenohi logo is indeed burned in on the sayas.



ah yes I thought I recognized the saya from Korin's website! Very nice.


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## mark76 (Jan 8, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> Just as anything else Tru-Oil will change the color of the wood. Here's a comparison between a naked ho wood saya and a ho wood handle I treated with Tru-Oil to give you an idea:



Thanks! I guess I won't have to order Tru oil...


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## mark76 (Jan 8, 2016)

icanhaschzbrgr said:


> I guess you can ask Robin for pictures, since he have lots of handles made from Birch and uses tru-oil as well.



I did (well, I asked him, not for pictures). Hence my question  . But thanks for your experiences! I always like to hear it from more than one person.


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## mark76 (Jan 8, 2016)

jacko9 said:


> Mark - Sorry about getting back to you so late. If you look at the Safety Data Sheet Tru Oil is Lindseed Oil with a Propriety oil mix and solvent so I see no reason that it would keep birch from yellowing. The only finishes that I have used to keep light color woods from yellowing are wax finishes that work great for furniture but not for items that see water exposure.



Thanks, Jack!


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## RDalman (Jan 9, 2016)

I was actually more concerned for the white horn, danish can tend to make it a little yellow, while tru-oil seems to not discolour it that way. The wood does indeed turn more yellow when you apply oil the first time


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## RDalman (Jan 9, 2016)

Of course you could try the danish, and if it discolors and you're not happy with it, you could strip with acetone. 100% tung is something I'm looking to try.


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## jacko9 (Jan 9, 2016)

I don't think the acetone will take the discoloration off the handle, it might need to be sanded. In my experience pure Tung oil discolors wood a lot less than other oils.


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## Asteger (Jan 10, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> I'm not quite sure what you mean. If you are implying the untreated ho wood of the handle would/could have been originally of a different hue than the saya, out of the box they were virtually identical:



Yes, I was wondering along those lines, and also how some of the ho wood I've dealt with seems finer/denser/smoother, etc, or less so. However, jacko's already given more interesting info on this and how cuts affects this. Yeah, the treatment and colour result you got on your handle is nice. 

I mentioned the yellowishness reminded me of a keyaki handle I have, similar to this (googled photo - not my own):


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## _PixelNinja (Jan 10, 2016)

Asteger said:


> Yes, I was wondering along those lines, and also how some of the ho wood I've dealt with seems finer/denser/smoother, etc, or less so. However, jacko's already given more interesting info on this and how cuts affects this. Yeah, the treatment and colour result you got on your handle is nice.
> 
> I mentioned the yellowishness reminded me of a keyaki handle I have, similar to this (googled photo - not my own):



Asteger,

Thanks for clarifying. 

Yeah, that was my first time using Tru-Oil and in retrospect I am very happy with the result, to which I owe a bunch to CPD here on KKF. I'm not really into messing with handles (I share your _Less is More_ view on this) but considering the context in which I use these knives I needed some water resistance and protection. 

Regarding the color of the handle, indeed, it does resemble _keyaki_. I've never held some before, is there any notable difference or similarities to _ho_ and/or _ichii_ in terms of feel?


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## Asteger (Jan 10, 2016)

_PixelNinja said:


> It does resemble _keyaki_. I've never held some before, is there any notable difference or similarities to _ho_ and/or _ichii_ in terms of feel?



I've got one just keyaki and one ichii. They're different sizes and on differently sized/weighted handles, and I didn't install these nor play around with them first so harder to 'know' them, but both very nice. I have an ichii saya too and the wood is quite red on that, but less so on the handle (wood seems to brown when used on the handle). I like it for being distinctive, and it or ebony for eg are about being as 'special' as I'd like to go as I don't like busy handles that make knives more about the handle than the blade. I like the feel of the keyaki more because mine has a little more grip to it due to the grains; it's a little more yellow and aesthetic than most of my ho handles, but not that different that burl-type handle devotees would give it a second glace. If I'd installed these handles myself I would have weighed them, and I wonder about the relative densities.

My ho handles are all over the place. Most are the kind many don't like, with that plainer colour and fuzzy, grippier feeling - which I also like and there are obvious benefits too. A few would seem close to the keyaki and ichii, which makes me think there must be variation and 'better' grades with ho.

I'd just say that if I were working a kitchen again, I'd want the ho grip and wouldn't oil my handles for fear it'd close up the grains. (Don't J chefs/cooks sometimes sand their handles to clean them but maybe also to create grip? Some of those hourglass ones are a real odd sight.) And then at home where you don't use your tools as much as they deserve, a bit of a sleeker look and feel is good for me.


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## Asteger (Jan 10, 2016)

... Here you go. Just to add to the above, I went and took a photo. Various handles/woods I've got in/through Japan. All of them here but one (sakura wood):







L-R are: Makassar ebony (Indonesian I presume; couldn't be grown in Japan), burnt chestnut, shitan (rosewood), ichii (yew), keyaki ('Japanese elm'), Japanese walnut, ho handle, ho handle again, and a second example of ichii (yew) with the saya below

Of course it doesn't look the same in real life. The far-right ho handle is duller looking, but really grippy and great for wetness and the 2nd ho handle from right, is shinier and pattered and nicer in looks and smoothness than the 'avg ho'; the keyaki's colour is also slightly subdued in the photo


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## Dave Martell (Jan 10, 2016)

Asteger said:


> ... Here you go. Just to add to the above, I went and took a photo. Various handles/woods I've got in/through Japan. All of them here but one (sakura wood):
> 
> 
> 
> ...




This is a great picture to show the differences of the wood types used on handles from Japan. Would you mind posting this in the "Kitchen Knife Knowledge" sub-forum as it's own thread? I think this could help a lot of new users. 

Thanks for sharing it!

Dave


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## Asteger (Jan 10, 2016)

Dave Martell said:


> This is a great picture to show the differences of the wood types used on handles from Japan. Would you mind posting this in the "Kitchen Knife Knowledge" sub-forum as it's own thread? I think this could help a lot of new users. Thanks for sharing it! Dave



Sure. As far as I know these are all the normal woods that you see for handle wood in Japan, so maybe it's useful. Does anyone know of another? (Maybe unburnt chestnut. I don't have that...) 

As said before, however, I have a sakura one too which isn't included in the photo (though it's not strikingly different) so maybe I can take a new photo to show the full array.


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## _PixelNinja (Jan 17, 2016)

Asteger,

Thank you for taking the time to write a rather elaborate answer to my question and taking that photo. I also apologize for not getting back to you. 

Reading your feedback and looking at the photo, _keyaki_ comes off to me as an interesting wood. It seems like a nice middle ground between looks (subdued/not taking away from the blade while having a nice color and grain) and feel (between _ho_ and _ichii_ if I understand correctly).


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## CowichanBay (Jan 18, 2016)

Wow, what a timely thread, I haven't been on the forum much in the last year and was just wondering about some of my handles. Fantastic info, thanks all!


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## Asteger (Jan 18, 2016)

I'll post something new related to the above in the Kitchen Knife Knowledge thread sometime soon.


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## Asteger (Feb 26, 2016)

Dave Martell said:


> This is a great picture to show the differences of the wood types used on handles from Japan. Would you mind posting this in the "Kitchen Knife Knowledge" sub-forum as it's own thread? I think this could help a lot of new users.



Just to follow up, I finally got around to it: http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/26355-Japanese-wa-handle-woods?p=402412#post402412


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## Keith Sinclair (Feb 28, 2016)

Can only speak from my own experience. Have noticed most Sushi Chefs do not treat their handles. They clean yanagiba blade & handle after shift. Often over time the handles get worn down from scrubbing. I got my first quality Yanagiba years ago because was cutting Brunch and Banquet sashimi and sushi topping. I would scrub handle after work because fish would get on it.

After my first fish blade was showing wear bought another quality blade used it a while then had a Stefan handle put on it. I preferred the feel of the larger handle. Did not worry at all about grip even with heavy use. It was easy to clean, just wipe it down. Found that the handle could be spiffed up again with a little buffing.

Now I use Stefan's mix to treat Ho handles. Works for Saya's too which can get dirty & funky in a production kitchen.


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## koikeeper (May 18, 2016)

Thanks to everyone. Wonderful responses to my question. Great forum for getting questions answered. Regards from Lakewood, Ca.


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## Lucretia (May 18, 2016)

You can put a little bit of mineral oil (maybe a couple Tbsp) in a plastic bag, put it around your knife handle, squeeze the air out and put a twist tie on it rather than putting your handle in a glass overnight. It works pretty well. You might get a little leakage where the tie is, but it's not nearly as bad as knocking over a glass of mineral oil...


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## spoiledbroth (May 19, 2016)

Also much more economical. Yay money!


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## koikeeper (May 20, 2016)

Now I will only need only 65 bags. :rofl2:


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## Tanalasta (Apr 3, 2019)

Has anyone tried using silicone? As in the scuba diving silicone grease that comes in a small tub in the area between the tang and the handle? Just a thought...


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## lowercasebill (Apr 3, 2019)

I do not treat all my handles.. some of my knives came with instructions to seal the wa handle.
I use Behlen's salad bowl finish.. I put the knife handle down in a tall narrow glass vase making sure it wont fall over and fill the vase till the handle is covered and let it soak for an hour.. remove knife and hang it handle down over a towel and let it drip and cure .. I use magnet or clamp or tape depending on the knife and my mood to hang the knife .
silicone will trap dirt and dust. I have used epoxy to seal the tang handle junction.


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