# Great value carbons



## JanusInTheGarden (Jan 18, 2014)

I was hoping to take a quick poll on everyones favorite sub-$200 carbon gyutos for professional use. So, for less than $200, what carbon gyuto would you buy as a primary knife in a pro setting.


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## easy13 (Jan 18, 2014)

Misono Swedish ain't a bad option. You can get a 240 Dragon for around $170.


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## daddy yo yo (Jan 18, 2014)

easy13 said:


> Misono Swedish ain't a bad option. You can get a 240 Dragon for around $170.


+1

those have a western handle.

sakai yusuke could be an option, ashi hamono and gesshin ginga as well. gesshin gingas are above the US$ 200 mark, SY and AH might be below, i am not sure.


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## greasedbullet (Jan 18, 2014)

Wa-converted forgecraft


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## Hbeernink (Jan 18, 2014)

JanusInTheGarden said:


> I was hoping to take a quick poll on everyones favorite sub-$200 carbon gyutos for professional use. So, for less than $200, what carbon gyuto would you buy as a primary knife in a pro setting.



hiromono AS gyuto is a great option - blue super steel, good profile, pretty solid/rugged knife. a 240mm will run you ~$160 at JCK, 270 is $183. They run pretty true to size.

Another great option is the gesshin and gesshin uraku lines (give jon a call and tell him what you need), and if you can stretch just a bit more you should really look at the gesshin ginga gyutos (which has the added bonus of being fun to say!)


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## Mrmnms (Jan 18, 2014)

I might consider a Kikuichi. Maybe the steels is a little softer, but that's not necessarily a bad thing in a pro environment. A little more forgiving perhaps , and very easy to put an edge on.


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## pleue (Jan 18, 2014)

zakuri is a great budget carbon


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## panda (Jan 18, 2014)

masamoto hc


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## labor of love (Jan 18, 2014)

tanaka damascus blue steel line seems to be pretty high value. i havent tried one yet, but ive heard some pretty good things.


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## icanhaschzbrgr (Jan 18, 2014)

Yamawaku is a great value for around 100$. Though I'm not a chef and my recommendations could be terribly wrong.


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 18, 2014)

Gesshin Uraku White #2 Kurouchi 240mm 135.00


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## Jordanp (Jan 18, 2014)

Id defiently get a misono dragon for about $180 or a tanaka blue #2 damascus with a little work becomes an awesome knife and I love using both of them.


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## franzb69 (Jan 19, 2014)

don't forget fujiwara fkh line for bang for the buck entry level j knives.


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## Yamabushi (Jan 20, 2014)

Honsho-Kanemasa is a pretty decent carbon knife for the money, IMHO.


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## Notaskinnychef (Jan 20, 2014)

I wish that misono came in the dragon for the 210 size. Its WAY cheaper but it is only a flower design, not ideal to say the lease. It is 119 so being 2/3 of the price for 30 mm less is a great deal, sadly the flowers kinda kills it


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## Yamabushi (Jan 20, 2014)

Notaskinnychef said:


> I wish that misono came in the dragon for the 210 size. Its WAY cheaper but it is only a flower design, not ideal to say the lease. It is 119 so being 2/3 of the price for 30 mm less is a great deal, sadly the flowers kinda kills it


What's wrong with flowers? Dragons are way overrated, IMHO!


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## Notaskinnychef (Jan 20, 2014)

Yamabushi said:


> What's wrong with flowers? Dragons are way overrated, IMHO!



bang for buck, its a great knife, esp from JCK as they are awesome, but if it just a flower for the whole line I wouldn't mind as much, downside ofc is that it goes from dragon to flowers....quite the shift lol.


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## Yamabushi (Jan 20, 2014)

LOL, real men laugh at dragons and confidently use flower knives! Haha! :justkidding:


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## Notaskinnychef (Jan 20, 2014)

well I laugh at dragons but fear flowers


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## Von blewitt (Jan 20, 2014)

You can order from JCK without the flower/dragon. You could possibly order a 210mm with A Dragon


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## nachuraru (Jan 20, 2014)

So out of these carbons which of them could be considered to be lasers or close to lasers?
If one isn't mentioned but you have a suggestion please toss it in.

I am looking for a fairly cheap carbon laser, used or new to replace my miyabi 600D, it's sharp and it served me well as a good first knife but it's thick and hard to get the cuts I want on vegetables.

I have a shorter santoku in White #2 and it's lovely, it is however just 160 mm and I would want a 240mm long gyuto.


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## Notaskinnychef (Jan 20, 2014)

Von blewitt said:


> You can order from JCK without the flower/dragon. You could possibly order a 210mm with A Dragon



i thought the design was there and not an option for removal.


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## labor of love (Jan 20, 2014)

the tanaka damascus is considered a laser.


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## labor of love (Jan 20, 2014)

Notaskinnychef said:


> i thought the design was there and not an option for removal.



you can get a dragonless misono swed from rakuten really cheap


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## Notaskinnychef (Jan 20, 2014)

labor of love said:


> you can get a dragonless misono swed from rakuten really cheap



link? sorry couldnt find it


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## labor of love (Jan 20, 2014)

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/13897-Rakuten-finds?highlight=rakuten


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## easy13 (Jan 20, 2014)

210 Misono Swedish from Korin doesn't have a flower on it. I wouldn't consider Tanaka Blue Damascus a Lazer. Have one and like it (minus stock handle) but definitely not as thin/light as Konosuke/Yusuke/Suisin IH even TKC to name a few lazery knives.


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## labor of love (Jan 20, 2014)

sorry just repeating what i read and heard from fellow forum members about tanaka damascus. after looking at a choil shot here http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...-Blue-2-Gyuto/page2?highlight=tanaka+damascus i have to agree it doesnt look like a laser at all.


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## Jordanp (Jan 20, 2014)

Yea the tanaka is definitely not a laser much more of a workhorse knife.


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## Jordanp (Jan 20, 2014)

I don't know if it is in your price range nachuraru but you can get a ginga in white #2 on ebay for $173.


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## daddy yo yo (Jan 20, 2014)

Jordanp said:


> I don't know if it is in your price range nachuraru but you can get a ginga in white #2 on ebay for $173.



I must resist !!! I am not in the market for a gyuto right now but still I am considering buying this one just because... The choil looks nicely rounded!


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## Chef Andy (Jan 20, 2014)

Bookmarked this topic. I'll be looking into getting a carbon in a few months. Mostly looking right now for knives to use at work, and I know I can't take care of a carbon at work properly yet. I'm used to the plastic handle knives, and we get them sharpened every week so I got used to abusing knifes. It's been fun trying to break those habits now that I'm using my HHH aeb-l gyuto haha


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## JanusInTheGarden (Jan 20, 2014)

Looks like the Misono Dragon is getting a lot of love. I've never owned one, but I'm really wanting to snag one. Can some dragon owners tell me what to expect out of that particular knife in 240? It seems to be somewhere between a laser and a workhorse, and I've heard comparisons to Sabs--sound about right? Is it lighter or heavier by heft?


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## Chuckles (Jan 20, 2014)

My favorite things about the dragon are the profile and the comfortable handle. If you don't finish it at too high a grit you will have good edge retention. Make sure you read Dave's thread on asymmetry before you sharpen it. http://http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/5656-Asymmetry--The-REAL-DEAL

The dragon is a great middle weight warrior.


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## nachuraru (Jan 20, 2014)

Jordanp said:


> I don't know if it is in your price range nachuraru but you can get a ginga in white #2 on ebay for $173.



Is this the one you are talking about?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Japanese-GI...767?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35d0d31f77

I prefer not spending incredible amounts but if it's something I will be satisfied with I'd rather spend more now and not be a cheapo and regret it.
I wouldn't mind getting a used laser either if it's been taken care of.


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## Jordanp (Jan 20, 2014)

nachuraru said:


> Is this the one you are talking about?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Japanese-GI...767?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35d0d31f77
> 
> I prefer not spending incredible amounts but if it's something I will be satisfied with I'd rather spend more now and not be a cheapo and regret it.
> I wouldn't mind getting a used laser either if it's been taken care of.



Yea that's the one Jon carries them and from what i hear they are pretty great knives idk if you can get a cheaper carbon laser unless someone is selling one on BST.


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## longhorn (Jan 20, 2014)

+1 Misono Swedish...Masahiro Virgin Carbon series is also a terrific value, I know a few cooks who use them in a professional setting and I hear nothing but praises from them.


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## nachuraru (Jan 21, 2014)

Jordanp said:


> Yea that's the one Jon carries them and from what i hear they are pretty great knives idk if you can get a cheaper carbon laser unless someone is selling one on BST.



How much better of a knife would I get if I climbed in price?
I have to admit I don't really have a good knowledge of lasers but I feel like one would fit me perfectly, I take care of my knives and I want it to slide trough food as easy as possible.


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## daddy yo yo (Jan 21, 2014)

FWIW, the Ginga on ebay isn't Identifikation with the one Jon carries. True, it comes from the same manufacturer (Ashi) but Jon has it built to his specs.

While I expect Jon's Gesshin Ginga to be immaculate, the standard Ashi Ginga will be a fantastic knife too. It just isn't identical.


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## Benuser (Jan 21, 2014)

If the OP is considering a Misono Swedish: I love mine dearly, but I'm a home cook. Edge retention is not its most prominent quality. As for the price: instead of the 240 you may get a Hiromoto 270.


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## labor of love (Jan 21, 2014)

labor of love said:


> the tanaka damascus is considered a laser.





easy13 said:


> 210 Misono Swedish from Korin doesn't have a flower on it. I wouldn't consider Tanaka Blue Damascus a Lazer. Have one and like it (minus stock handle) but definitely not as thin/light as Konosuke/Yusuke/Suisin IH even TKC to name a few lazery knives.


just a quick update here. if you order a tanaka damascus from that "other" guy it will be a laser. im guessing tanaka may have made changes in their damascus line over the years, but ive spoken to people who definitely would know for sure about this...


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## toddnmd (Jan 21, 2014)

I have a Tanaka blue damascus petty. It's quite thin--I'd call it a laser, even if it's a petty.


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## easy13 (Jan 21, 2014)

About a Half a year old Tanaka Blue Damascus On Left, Konosuke White #2 On Right





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## JKerr (Jan 21, 2014)

Sugimoto HM, $130 for a 240, $220AUD for a 270. I haven't used a gyuto from this line, but I have an HM petty and hankotsu; F+F is good, handle's comfortable, easy to sharpen and takes a nice edge, retention is so-so but I expect that from most carbons. They take a nice patina too.

The Hiromoto white 2 is nice for the price too, a little chunky behind the edge but otherwise it's well finished and feels good in hand. Stainless clad though.


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## JKerr (Jan 21, 2014)

Also, it's not my cup of tea, but you can get the Masamoto KS for around $230USD on rakuten.


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## Keith Sinclair (Jan 22, 2014)

The Sakai Yusuke's on Blueway(E-Bay)white steel are true Lazors.Knife care is very important,protect your edges.These are high quality specialty blades at a very fair price for what they are.You should aways sharpen these knives yourself,they are super easy to sharpen and do quick touch ups.You go up a little in price you can get a choice carbon lazor.


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## Von blewitt (Jan 22, 2014)

I bought this for $80 delivered off Rakuten, I thought it was a Misono but I'm honestly not sure what it is. Handle F&F is horrendous, but for $70 us its pretty solid



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## Yamabushi (Jan 22, 2014)

That's a Honsho Kanemasa, Von blewitt.


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## daddy yo yo (Jan 24, 2014)

I need to add a little comment on the Misono Dragon which is the most frequently used knife in my kitchen. I have other knives, more expensive ones, more beautiful ones, Shigs, DT ITK, Hattori KDs, Hiromoto AS, but still I reach for the Dragon most of the times. Why? It is a great cutter, a workhorse. It isn't too expensive. I have more respect from my other blades, meaning ruining one of the other blades would probably make me cry like a baby. I do not have that fear with the Dragon...

Have I said that it is the hell of a great cutter? F&F are perfect, and the patina it takes is beautiful! Only disadvantage: only available with a Western handle.


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## tomsch (Jan 25, 2014)

I have a Tanaka 210 and it is more of a workhorse. Cuts well but just with more resistance.


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## Benuser (Jan 25, 2014)

tomsch said:


> I have a Tanaka 210 and it is more of a workhorse. Cuts well but just with more resistance.


Put a decent relief bevel on it, right behind the very edge.


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## tomsch (Jan 25, 2014)

I'll have to try that. So far I have just been doing touch ups. Would be worth the time to take the shoulder off between the primary and secondary edge.


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## Benuser (Jan 25, 2014)

Have the the relief bevel almost reaching the very edge. Verify with the scratch pattern or the marker trick.


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## JanusInTheGarden (Jan 26, 2014)

Daddy Yo Yo et al, thanks for the info on the Dragon. I've honestly been wanting one for a long time so I think its just high time I went with my instinct and pulled the trigger on it. Thanks for the info, I'm looking forward to checking it out.


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## daddy yo yo (Feb 20, 2014)

daddy yo yo said:


> I need to add a little comment on the Misono Dragon which is the most frequently used knife in my kitchen. I have other knives, more expensive ones, more beautiful ones, Shigs, DT ITK, Hattori KDs, Hiromoto AS, but still I reach for the Dragon most of the times. Why? It is a great cutter, a workhorse. It isn't too expensive. I have more respect from my other blades, meaning ruining one of the other blades would probably make me cry like a baby. I do not have that fear with the Dragon...
> 
> Have I said that it is the hell of a great cutter? F&F are perfect, and the patina it takes is beautiful! Only disadvantage: only available with a Western handle.


One more thing: BEWARE OF THE DRAGON !!! Always remember that a Dragon is a fierce beast. It might look asleep, you may think it is peacefully asleep, maybe even a friend, but a dragon will always be a fierce creature that bites and spits fire...

I got bitten yesterday... Now I fear the Dragon...

But now it is mine !!! And I will learn to rule that beast !!!


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## chefjohnboyardee (Feb 20, 2014)

One must be bit by a blade to know to own it.


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## daddy yo yo (Feb 20, 2014)

i should have removed the existing patina and have it patina with my own warm blood... :scared4:


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## Benuser (Feb 20, 2014)

daddy yo yo said:


> i should have removed the existing patina and have it patina with my own warm blood... :scared4:


remember to degrease before applying your blood


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## Vangelis (Feb 24, 2014)

All my Gyutos are carbon  just love them and for under 200$ I have had or still have a Hiro AS (have), a Tanaka blue (had), a K-Sab (have). All different but I will say I am reaching for a different Gyuto based on what i am having and sometimes (often) i will use two when I am preparing food (home cook).

Hiro As, great one but it isn't tall for some goodies (cabbage for e.g.). I also like it as i dont have to baby it too much if I am cutting 1-2 kg of ognions. 
K-Sab, all carbon but not reactive at all !!! I can trust even my guests to use it  and it is under 100$. However it is a thick blade and a bit heavy.
Tanaka, not to thin not to thick, tall for cabbage as well.


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