# Yoshikane SKD gyuto - hammered vs nashiji finish



## jbou (Jan 19, 2021)

Hello, that question has been debated here for the Nakiri, but still not answered at the end.






Yoshikane SKD - Hammered vs Nashiji Nakiri


Anybody know the differences between the two finishes? EpicEdge has the hammered, while Carbon Knife has the Nashiji. I do see that the knife at Carbon is taller, which would be a preference. I've read good things about Yoshikane and while I know Watanabe is the default nakiri suggestion...




www.kitchenknifeforums.com





Is there any difference in the grind between those two finish?
Does the finish behave differently in terms of maintenance?

In terms of specs here we are (hammered/nashiji):
Edge lenght : 214/214 mm
Blade height : 44,9/45,7 or even 48 mm on Carbon knife
Weight : 143/144 g (but different handle - ho vs wengé)
Thickness : ? measured at différent points for each seller...









Yoshikane Hamono SKD Gyuto 210mm


Looking for a high quality and trusty sidekick for every job then this definitely fits the bill! It hits all the positive notes in a gyuto - well balanced, excellent sharpness right of the box and looks wonderful.




cuttingedgeknives.co.uk










Gyuto


Gyuto Yoshikane - Semi stainless Blade length: 210 mm



www.cleancut.eu













Yoshikane Nashiji SKD Gyuto 210mm


Yoshikane Hamono is located in Sanjo, Niigata and founded in 1919. It is lead by Mr. Kazuomi Yoshida who continues to excel and evolve in making high grade kitchen knives. This series is forged from SKD tool steel (64hrc) and cladded in stainless steel. SKD is considered a semi stainless and...




carbonknifeco.com


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## ModRQC (Jan 19, 2021)

I bought Tsuchime for both units because they were less expensive; also vendor could confirm 48mm at heel for the 210mm gyuto, whereas Nashiji units are pretty much always measured at 46mm. IDK why, or if its variations found within both lines.

In the end I paid 100$ less for a taller unit with the crappy ho handle. I don't think finish or wenge handle warrants for the nashijis to be so much more expensive. Finish I couldn't care about less, but food release is nice enough for both I guess. Handle makes no difference in a pinch grip, but I could see myself rehandle to get it from mid 140s to mid 160s grams.


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## timebard (Jan 19, 2021)

Adding to @ModRQC above, be aware that the Tsuchime version isn't necessarily taller. I have one and it measures about 46 at the heel. If that's a selling point for you maybe confirm with the merchant before you buy.


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## jbou (Jan 19, 2021)

I guess height may vary and is not dependant on the finish. 
If I summarize they seem to be the same in term of performance. But nashiji may be more expensive.
Thank you guys for answering! It may be my next knife...I want to try what a good grind means!


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## Jason183 (Jan 19, 2021)

Yoshikane Grind is pretty much the same, one is wenge handle(heavier), the balance point right at the heel. The ho wood handle from carbon CO is lighter, so it’s blade heavy.


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## JaVa (Jan 19, 2021)

My Yoshikane tsuchime blade hight is also 46mm. The specks seem close enough so probably won't make a significant difference either way. 
BTW From EE you get a 10% forum discount. Does that raise any additional interest? I got mine there. Great experience, great knife.


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## jbou (Jan 19, 2021)

JaVa said:


> The specks


I love speck and automatic corrector


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## jbou (Jan 19, 2021)

JaVa said:


> BTW From EE you get a 10% forum discount. Does that raise any additional interest? I got mine there. Great experience, great knife.


Good idea but I have to check import fees to EU. Maybe a better deal at Cleancut in the end.


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## SeattleB (Jan 19, 2021)

It's odd that the Cleancut link says the tsuchime pattern version is made of SKD-11, aka SLD or D2 steel. Mine is made of SKD-12, the semi-stainless, aka A2. Even more odd that Cleancut calls their version SKD-11 "semi-stainless" though that steel has 12% chromium.

The link to Carbon Knife Co says the nashiji version is made with "SKD" without mentioning which of the nine variants of SKD steel it is.

I'm a newbie and it's unfortunate that the stores are misleading and even I would spot major errors like this.


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## jbou (Jan 19, 2021)

SeattleB said:


> It's odd that the Cleancut link says the tsuchime pattern version is made of SKD-11, aka SLD or D2 steel. Mine is made of SKD-12, the semi-stainless, aka A2. Even more odd that Cleancut calls their version SKD-11 "semi-stainless" though that steel has 12% chromium.
> 
> The link to Carbon Knife Co says the nashiji version is made with "SKD" without mentioning which of the nine variants of SKD steel it is.


I would not worry that much, it must be a mistake from Cleancut : IIRC Yoshikane SLD is only used on the damascus version wich is way more expensive. SKD is user both on nashiji and tsuchime.


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## ModRQC (Jan 19, 2021)

Yes and probably Yoshikane is behind Konosuke "Sanjo SLD" as well as I know he does the YS variants.


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## LostHighway (Jan 19, 2021)

JaVa said:


> My Yoshikane tsuchime blade hight is also 46mm. The specks seem close enough so probably won't make a significant difference either way.
> BTW From EE you get a 10% forum discount. Does that raise any additional interest? I got mine there. Great experience, great knife.




Current KKF discount is 5%, no longer 10%


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## SeattleB (Jan 19, 2021)

jbou said:


> I would not worry that much, it must be a mistake from Cleancut : IIRC Yoshikane SLD is only used on the damascus version wich is way more expensive. SKD is user both on nashiji and tsuchime.



I suppose. You veterans would know better than I would. I can see from the steel industry specifications that SKD-11 and SKD-12 are very different in composition. I have read several places that SKD-11 (aka SLD) is much more difficult to sharpen and difficult to remove the burr. The electron photographs show the carbides are very different in distribution and size. 

There are so many other good choices I don't see any advantage in choosing SKD-11. I would prefer SKD-12 or another steel. 

It does appear that there is a great deal of confusion about these two steels. The retailers should be crystal clear about what they're selling.


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## LostHighway (Jan 19, 2021)

SeattleB said:


> I suppose. You veterans would know better than I would. I can see from the steel industry specifications that SKD-11 and SKD-12 are very different in composition. I have read several places that SKD-11 (aka SLD) is much more difficult to sharpen and difficult to remove the burr. The electron photographs show the carbides are very different in distribution and size.
> 
> There are so many other good choices I don't see any advantage in choosing SKD-11. I would prefer SKD-12 or another steel.
> 
> It does appear that there is a great deal of confusion about these two steels. The retailers should be crystal clear about what they're selling.



Epicurean Edge confirms that the hammered knives are SKD12 and that a damascus knives are a proprietary version of SKD11/Hitachi SLD. They say they have this direct from Yoshikane. They state that, in their experience, Yoshikane SKD is less reactive than A2 but still only semi-stainless and that Yoshikane SLD is even more stainless than D2. On paper SKD should definitely be less rust resistant and eventually take some degree of patina as well as being a bit easier to sharpen and possibly a bit less prone to chip (assuming identical grinds/sharpening angles). SLD should be effectively stainless and should hold an edge longer (again all else being equal). How you balance those attributed is up to you.


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## madmotts (Jan 19, 2021)

I think there were some folks on KKF talking about the grind on the nashiji vs hammered being a little different. I don't know where the thread is... 

Last year, i bought a hammered 210 ktip from EE that's pretty thin behind the edge and have an older nashiji 240 w2 that's much thicker. From what i've read i thought was the opposite.


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## SeattleB (Jan 19, 2021)

There are a couple of threads about the Yoshikane Tsuchime vs the Konosuke (Yoshikane) Tsuchime being ground differently based upon having different weights (more than a handle difference). Other threads seem to indicate that the knives are different from year to year (or batch to batch) even in those sold under the same brand. I suggest asking for weights and dimensions. I bought mine from Epicurian Edge and love it. The grind is so smooth and consistent you'd think a CNC router did it.


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## captaincaed (Jan 19, 2021)

SeattleB said:


> It's odd that the Cleancut link says the tsuchime pattern version is made of SKD-11, aka SLD or D2 steel. Mine is made of SKD-12, the semi-stainless, aka A2. Even more odd that Cleancut calls their version SKD-11 "semi-stainless" though that steel has 12% chromium.
> 
> The link to Carbon Knife Co says the nashiji version is made with "SKD" without mentioning which of the nine variants of SKD steel it is.
> 
> I'm a newbie and it's unfortunate that the stores are misleading and even I would spot major errors like this.



This is frustrating. If it's mystery steel, call it mystery steel. Every since I learned, I feel like a grammar Nazi whenever sellers mess up they're terms.


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## captaincaed (Jan 19, 2021)

SeattleB said:


> I have read several places that SKD-11 (aka SLD) is much more difficult to sharpen and difficult to remove the burr. The electron photographs show the carbides are very different in distribution and size.


D2 (SKD-11) is something I've had in several pocket knives, and now a couple kitchen knives. God I'm sick of it.


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## zizirex (Jan 20, 2021)

I like A2/Chromax/SKD-12 better than D2/SKD-11/SLD. My A2(Yoshikane) holds it's toothy-ness edge better than SLD (Masashi and Nihei). Chef's Edge just got their Yoshikane restock with a nice Oct burn chestnut handle (Most burn Chestnut handle are ****, only some are properly executed).


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## inferno (Jan 20, 2021)

here is one distributor of yoshikane.





Akifusa


Finest Kitchen Knives from the land of the rising sun - made by experienced and high-class blacksmiths!




www.akifusa.com




skd stainless steel. that indicates skd11.

i can confirm that my yoshi is as close to stainless as at it gets. its not a 5%Cr steel at least.
a2 is not a semi stainless steel its just a tool steel.


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## JaVa (Jan 20, 2021)

LostHighway said:


> Current KKF discount is 5%, no longer 10%


Didn't know that it had changed. Thanks for the info.


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## JaVa (Jan 20, 2021)

madmotts said:


> I think there were some folks on KKF talking about the grind on the nashiji vs hammered being a little different. I don't know where the thread is...
> 
> Last year, i bought a hammered 210 ktip from EE that's pretty thin behind the edge and have an older nashiji 240 w2 that's much thicker. From what i've read i thought was the opposite.


The difference in thickness could be just due to the size difference. I've had a couple of knives in 21 and 240 which have had very different spine thickness making them feel like completely different knives. 

Also different steels usually means other differences as well. Then there's the fact that some vendors like order some knives with their own specs (like Bernals thinner Wakui Hairline vs Cleancuts thicker Wakui Hairline). Ad to that some degree of differences because the knives are hand made. Plus I've noticed quite a lot of accidental miss information on some vendors sites. Sometimes there's changes when smiths make corrections following the demands of certain trends. Like ATM taller profiles and higher grinds on wide bevels etc. 

If there's uncertainty in any knives specification, to be sure it's better to verify everything from the seller before purchase.


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## Nemo (Jan 20, 2021)

inferno said:


> here is one distributor of yoshikane.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My Yoshi SKD doesn't rust in sensible normal use but the core steel does patina a little. Looks kinda cool.

My understanding was that Yoshi calls SKD-11 "SLD" and they call SKD-12 "SKD". Possible I'm mixed up about this, I guess.

Great knife either way.


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## captaincaed (Jan 20, 2021)

JaVa said:


> The difference in thickness could be just due to the size difference. I've had a couple of knives in 21 and 240 which have had very different spine thickness making them feel like completely different knives.



My 270 Kochi feels like a different kind of knife compared to the 210, same steel and construction. It's kind of wacky, and doesn't help the persistent urge to collect and try all options at all.


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## DavidPF (Jan 24, 2021)

captaincaed said:


> the persistent urge to collect and try all


This can sometimes be cured (or at least partly remedied) by a very harsh method, harmless to the knives but unfortunately not to you: choose one of the knives you have, one that you would definitely not be willing to give up regardless of others. For one week, every time that you see it or think of it or remember it, you must clearly and very audibly pronounce the word "Pikachu".


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## panda (Jan 24, 2021)

which yoshi is actually skd12?? does anyone own both and can confirm if the grinds are different?


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## zizirex (Jan 24, 2021)

hammered, Nashiji, Konosuke SKD & YS


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## captaincaed (Jan 24, 2021)

panda said:


> which yoshi is actually skd12?? does anyone own both and can confirm if the grinds are different?


I'm about to in about a week.


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## captaincaed (Jan 24, 2021)

Nemo said:


> My understanding was that Yoshi calls SKD-11 "SLD" and they call SKD-12 "SKD". Possible I'm mixed up about this, I guess.


Talked with Carbon yesterday, this is what I heard as well.


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## jbou (Jan 24, 2021)

Yoshi skd is also found at japan messer shop, but it seems more on the workhorse style : 196 g and 1,5mm at the tip.

Actually sold out, but they told me that it should be back in stock in 2 weeks.

Anyway those specs look a bit strange.
I will ask them to confirm for the new stock.



https://www.japan-messer-shop.de/Messer/gyuto-messer--gyuto-hocho--gyutomesser-/Yoshikane-Tsuchime-Gyuto--21cm--handgeschmiedet-und--signiert.html


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## captaincaed (Jan 28, 2021)

Hammered vs nashiji. Also 210 vs 240, so take it with a grain of salt.
Feel similar so far. I'll know more over dinner tomorrow. I got a yam and yucca that are hard AF. They ought to give some feedback.


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## madmotts (Feb 2, 2021)

Just received a yoshi 240 skd nashiji gyuto (KKF) and it's kinda similar to the w2 240 nashiji gyuto (KKF) i bought earlier last year. I threw in my 210 skd tsuchime ktip just for comparison. it's significantly thinner than the others. Makes me really want a ktip 240. Although I've only seen at staysharpmtl for 475usd- say Wat?


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## daveb (Feb 2, 2021)

Did you mean K&S as source for the W2 and SKD?


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## madmotts (Feb 2, 2021)

daveb said:


> Did you mean K&S as source for the W2 and SKD?


Um... not sure about the sources. based on the handle the W2 is from K&S, not sure about the SKD & Ktip from EE. I bought both 240s off KKF.


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

LostHighway said:


> Current KKF discount is 5%, no longer 10%


Discount for KKF member to purchase where? Sorry I'm new so have no idea. Can you please share some info  I appreciate it


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## LostHighway (Jun 25, 2022)

Se1ryu said:


> Discount for KKF member to purchase where? Sorry I'm new so have no idea. Can you please share some info  I appreciate it


Epicurean Edge, but they don't have anything longer than 180mm in stock in Yoshikane SKD.


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

LostHighway said:


> Epicurean Edge, but they don't have anything longer than 180mm in stock in Yoshikane SKD.


Ok thank you for the info


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## LostHighway (Jun 25, 2022)

Knives & Stone Australia has 7% off right now until July 1st and does show 240 mm SKD Yoshikane/Hatsukokoro gyurtos as in stock (with Teak handle and saya).


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

LostHighway said:


> Knives & Stone Australia has 7% off right now until July 1st and does show 240 mm SKD Yoshikane/Hatsukokoro gyurtos as in stock (with Teak handle and saya).


Yes EOFY sale. Knife that I'm after mostly sold out. Lol
Especially Yu Kurosaki knives. All sold out! Maybe couple senko left


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## HumbleHomeCook (Jun 25, 2022)

Se1ryu said:


> Yes EOFY sale. Knife that I'm after mostly sold out. Lol
> Especially Yu Kurosaki knives. All sold out! Maybe couple senko left



I don't know if the shipping would be prohibitive, but @Sharp Knife Shop has a variety of Yu Kurosaki's in stock.









Yu Kurosaki


Sharp Knife Shop is a Japanese knife store in Hamilton, ON carrying handcrafted Japanese kitchen knives, sharpening accessories and knife storage options, as well as a large selection of high-quality cutting boards and aprons. We also provide knife and butchery classes, as well as sharpening...



sharpknifeshop.com


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

HumbleHomeCook said:


> I don't know if the shipping would be prohibitive, but @Sharp Knife Shop has a variety of Yu Kurosaki's in stock.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, thank you. I checked their website already. Most of the Yu Kurosaki knives available on the website are senko line with teak + purple heart handle which I'm not a fan of purple heart ferrule. I thing those handle great for ladies (No offence). I see one Fujin SG2 sujihiki with wenge blur turquoise and one santoku,1 210mm Gekko Gyuto which is HAP40 steel by Kurosaki san and some more senko with western handle ( acrilic).

I'm looking for Yu Kurosaki Fujin AS Gyuto or 270mm suji, Kurosaki SRS13 or SG2 Fujin sujihiki or sakimaru sujihiki with blue turquoise handle and all of the good stuff from Kurosaki san which most of those knives are sold out internationally.

But thank you for letting me know.


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## madmotts (Jun 25, 2022)

Se1ryu said:


> with teak + purple heart handle


I had a SharpKnifeshop oak & purple heart handle and it wasn't my favorite. there was something kind of funky about the geometry- almost no taper, small facets, and narrow. It looks like they've made some adjustments tho. I do think it's a better option than straight up 'ho'.


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## Delat (Jun 25, 2022)

Se1ryu said:


> Yes, thank you. I checked their website already. Most of the Yu Kurosaki knives available on the website are senko line with teak + purple heart handle which I'm not a fan of purple heart ferrule. I thing those handle great for ladies (No offence). I see one Fujin SG2 sujihiki with wenge blur turquoise and one santoku,1 210mm Gekko Gyuto which is HAP40 steel by Kurosaki san and some more senko with western handle ( acrilic).
> 
> I'm looking for Yu Kurosaki Fujin AS Gyuto or 270mm suji, Kurosaki SRS13 or SG2 Fujin sujihiki or sakimaru sujihiki with blue turquoise handle and all of the good stuff from Kurosaki san which most of those knives are sold out internationally.
> 
> But thank you for letting me know.



I sold my Fujin AS 210 earlier this year and have been regretting it ever since. Really nice knife at the price point. Good luck finding one though - I don’t think you can find them new anymore.

I should add that the reason I sold it is that cutting feel/performance was so close to my Yoshikane tsuchime k-tip from EE that I felt there was too much redundancy to keep both. The Kurosaki was much better looking though, imho.


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## Perverockstar (Jun 25, 2022)

I would love one with migaki finish. The more I use knives, the more I notice I dislike textured finishes. Even Kurouchi. I love the look but, for volume prepping, they are very uncomfortable.


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## madmotts (Jun 25, 2022)

Perverockstar said:


> I would love one with migaki finish. The more I use knives, the more I notice I dislike textured finishes. Even Kurouchi. I love the look but, for volume prepping, they are very uncomfortable.


So... the Yoshikane nashiji feel varies from batch to batch. My skd (hatsukokoro) is pretty smooth whereas the much older w#2 has way more texture feel. Not that you or someone would, but a little bit of sanding goes a long way. I still have some knives with some sharp ass kanji.


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

Delat said:


> I sold my Fujin AS 210 earlier this year and have been regretting it ever since. Really nice knife at the price point. Good luck finding one though - I don’t think you can find them new anymore.
> 
> I should add that the reason I sold it is that cutting feel/performance was so close to my Yoshikane tsuchime k-tip from EE that I felt there was too much redundancy to keep both. The Kurosaki was much better looking though, imho.


Yes it's very hard to find one. Maybe Kurosaki san doesn't make them Fujin AS for now, so I just wait. Now I want to get the Yoshikane SKD (Hatsukokoro version available) but someone give me a good deal on Y Tanaka Shirogami 1 Damascus gyuto 240mm. So let see which one I get. Do you try Yoshikazu tanaka Shirogami Damascus gyuto 210/240 ?


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## Delat (Jun 25, 2022)

Se1ryu said:


> Yes it's very hard to find one. Maybe Kurosaki san doesn't make them Fujin AS for now, so I just wait. Now I want to get the Yoshikane SKD (Hatsukokoro version available) but someone give me a good deal on Y Tanaka Shirogami 1 Damascus gyuto 240mm. So let see which one I get. Do you try Yoshikazu tanaka Shirogami Damascus gyuto 210/240 ?



I think his current series is the Raijin in cobalt special steel or some such. I don’t think he’s making Fujin in AS anymore, although I do see a fair amount of Fujin VG10 available. He changes series regularly and doesn’t revisit old ones, so don’t hold your breath waiting for him to make more Fujin AS.

I don’t know about Y Tanaka white 1, but his white 2 is not that great - dulls quite fast IME.


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## Se1ryu (Jun 25, 2022)

Delat said:


> I think his current series is the Raijin in cobalt special steel or some such. I don’t think he’s making Fujin in AS anymore, although I do see a fair amount of Fujin VG10 available. He changes series regularly and doesn’t revisit old ones, so don’t hold your breath waiting for him to make more Fujin AS.
> 
> I don’t know about Y Tanaka white 1, but his white 2 is not that great - dulls quite fast IME.


Yup, Fujin AS is gone. Maybe in the future who knows, or waiting for someone to sell their Kurosaki AS on BTS . I just love the look on Fujin AS line. I have Fujin SG2 with wenge and blue turquoise handle which I made as my profile picture. Shirogami 2 has less carbon than shirogami 1, so it will get dull faster.


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