# Questions about natural stones



## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 30, 2013)

I've just recently gootten into using natural finishing stones. It's been hard to find information on them though. I was wondering what it means when a
Stone has a toxic line. I'm assuming it doesn't litterally mean toxic but I really have no idea. I bought I a stone on eBay that seemed like a really good deal and right after I bought it I noticed it said it had a toxic line. Was it a bad buy?


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## tripleq (Jul 30, 2013)

I beleive the term refers to something in the stone that is harder than the stone itself and may damage whatever you are sharpening.


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## JBroida (Jul 30, 2013)

they are parts of the stone where it scratches instead of sharpening... mineral deposits and whatnot. Sometimes even small pebbles.


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## Dusty (Jul 30, 2013)

Somone more experienced may correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that a 'toxic line' refers to an inclusion in the stone that is harder than the surrounding stone, and can therefore scratch the finish of a knife whilst polishing. They can sometimes be 'scratched out' of the stone using a hard carbide point.

Maxim's JNS wiki is a great place to start reading about jnats, but I'm not sure if those articles cover this issue or not.

I guess you should just try out the stone on a knife that you don't mind getting scratched first to work out how harsh the inclusion is.


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## Crothcipt (Jul 30, 2013)

Do what maxum did when he found he got a toxic inclusion. He turned it into some finger stones.


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## tk59 (Jul 30, 2013)

I'd try digging it out. If it's not too big, it won't matter. Got pics?


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## brainsausage (Jul 30, 2013)

Crothcipt said:


> Do what maxum did when he found he got a toxic inclusion. He turned it into some finger stones.



+1. Finger stones for long time. Assuming you can't 'repair' it anyways...


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## GlassEye (Jul 30, 2013)

One of my stones has a toxic line, it is not really a big issue on my stone. The line does not wear as quickly as the rest of stone, so I have to occasionally cut the line out with an Xacto when the stone wears to the line.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 30, 2013)

Here's some pics. It's a Nakayama Suita. 


. If anyone knows how and if it can be repaired please let me know.


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## sachem allison (Jul 30, 2013)

looks like you got a bunch of quartzite lines all over it. finger stones maybe the answer here. try it out on a beater and found out what happens.


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## schanop (Jul 30, 2013)

I hope you didn't pay anywhere near 425.20 Nakaoka was asking for.

At least you can try digging it out, if it happens to scratch the blade.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 31, 2013)

schanop said:


> I hope you didn't pay anywhere near 425.20 Nakaoka was asking for.
> 
> At least you can try digging it out, if it happens to scratch the blade.



No I think I paid $170. So hopefully it wasn't a complete loss. How would you go about digging them out. Figure it's worth a try if the other alternative is finger stones.


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## maxim (Jul 31, 2013)

If lines reddish rust colored then they usually never do much. Also many mistake toxic lines with hard lines. Hard lines can be fixed with proper flattening. Flatten your stone very well and smoothen it with some naguras or higher synthetics stone then try it out 

Try it out on hard edge inky with a lot of pressure if it will chip your edge then you a very bad toxic stone, if it just scratch the finish of softer steel then you might have hard lines or to hard stone

PS not all stones is good for fingerstones ! If stone is ted to hard it will ruin your finish in no time. It have to be quite soft stone to be used as fingerstones and from pics it seems like that one is not


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 31, 2013)

maxim said:


> If lines reddish rust colored then they usually never do much. Also many mistake toxic lines with hard lines. Hard lines can be fixed with proper flattening. Flatten your stone very well and smoothen it with some naguras or higher synthetics stone then try it out
> 
> Try it out on hard edge inky with a lot of pressure if it will chip your edge then you a very bad toxic stone, if it just scratch the finish of softer steel then you might have hard lines or to hard stone
> 
> PS not all stones is good for fingerstones ! If stone is ted to hard it will ruin your finish in no time. It have to be quite soft stone to be used as fingerstones and from pics it seems like that one is not



Thanks maxim. I was going to contact you directly but figured you probably have a lot to catch up on. I'll give it a try.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 31, 2013)

I flattened the stone and noticed the lines are red once I got it wet. Doesn't seem to leave any scratches. Actually leaves a pretty nice finish which really surprised me. Thanks for all the help. If anyone knows any more in depth resources where I can find out more about jnats please let me know. It's really has surprised me how little info I can find apart from maxims sight.


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## Crothcipt (Jul 31, 2013)

Right there with you. A lot of what I have read gets lost in my translation.


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## Asteger (Jul 31, 2013)

You can also read somewhere how a fav stone used by Shigefusa (ohira suita) has a large line that's been gouged out, and what a brilliant stone it still is and they use it all the time. Basically, it's not what you'd want at first, but doesn't mean you have to break it into fingerstones like many imagine, and that's often not appropriate. Experienced users aren't supposed to freak out. In fact, if you have an eye how to assess and deal with lines and incursions then I imagine you might be able to get some nice deals when you purchase compared to people who will pay premium prices for stones that appear pristine.


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## ChuckTheButcher (Jul 31, 2013)

Asteger said:


> You can also read somewhere how a fav stone used by Shigefusa (ohira suita) has a large line that's been gouged out, and what a brilliant stone it still is and they use it all the time. Basically, it's not what you'd want at first, but doesn't mean you have to break it into fingerstones like many imagine, and that's often not appropriate. Experienced users aren't supposed to freak out. In fact, if you have an eye how to assess and deal with lines and incursions then I imagine you might be able to get some nice deals when you purchase compared to people who will pay premium prices for stones that appear pristine.



That makes sense. The problem is I don't have any idea how to take the line out and can't find any information on how. Or much else about jnats.


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