# Stone to use after Aizu?



## SolidSnake03 (Oct 4, 2020)

Hey All!

So this might be a dumb thread and maybe I should just settle with my Aizu but wanted to see if or what people were using after the Aizu for edges? I currently finish most of my knives especially carbon steel one's on either my Aizu from Watanabe or my Ardennes Coticule (works great on stainless stuff and semi-stainless) and then with either I strop on denum or cardboard or something like that depending what I have laying around just to finish off the edge. I really enjoy the Aizu edge especially for how toothy it is and how well it seems to do on all my carbon knives. The edge seems to be just about the perfect food edge. That said, in the forever chasing the dragon situation, I'm wondering if there is a natural or synth (splash and go only, not a soaker fan) that is a good next step from the Aizu to go even further, finish the edges with an even more "magically toothy yet wonderfully smooth performing" edge than what the Aizu does? Or really am I just being silly and I should stick with the Aizu/just buy a bigger Aizu? (I have a smaller bout coticule type one that was fairly cheap to try the type of stone out)

Thanks


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## Matus (Oct 4, 2020)

Suita would be the next logical step for me. Suita with Aizu tomonagura is an interesting option too.


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## Unstoppabo (Oct 4, 2020)

Aizu grit could get stuck in the su holes. Maybe flip it and try aizu with a finer tomonagura for a bit more refinement? I'll give it a shot and let you know if I can feel a difference.


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## captaincaed (Oct 4, 2020)

This is a cool idea. I'm curious too


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## zizirex (Oct 5, 2020)

Unstoppabo said:


> Aizu grit could get stuck in the su holes. Maybe flip it and try aizu with a finer tomonagura for a bit more refinement? I'll give it a shot and let you know if I can feel a difference.


yes, it will have a slightly finer and refine edge but still have some bite from Aizu. I have tried to use it with Tomo Nagura (don't know which mine or layer), Meijiro Nagura and Kuro Nagura. Meijiro is one of the nicest ones.


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## SolidSnake03 (Oct 5, 2020)

Thanks for all the suggestions on that guys, sounds like a nagura on my Aizu might be the way to go? I've been happy with Watanabe before so maybe look through his nagura list again?


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## Robert Lavacca (Oct 5, 2020)

You could. Or you could ask Sin If he has anything that won’t break the bank when it comes to a stone you can use after your aizu. He might have a koppa you can follow with after the aizu. I actually finish on an aizu most of the time. Obviously depending on the knife. For work gyutos, always aizu. Then i’ll strop on loaded or bare felt.

edit: or you can check out maksim’s rejected stones. I saw some mizukihara on there that look like they just need to be flattened. Some more than others. Could always email him and ask if one those would be good for your needs.


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## Bensbites (Oct 5, 2020)

I have been happy with my Aizu. Sometime for fun I will strip lightly on a king 8000 after the Aizu.


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## Desert Rat (Oct 6, 2020)

A coticule is probably finer then a guy needs and they get expensive in bigger sizes but they are a nice. Is there a knife steel they don't work well on?


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## SolidSnake03 (Oct 6, 2020)

Definitely going to check with Sin if he has anything koppa wise that might be nice and won't crush the wallet. That was kinda my concern with suita stuff is how expensive it tends to get...

The coticule can definitely produce very fine edges with water dilution, that's true, but I find it leaves less toothy and aggressive edge on carbon than something like the Aizu and so was thinking of if there was a natural Aizu progression  

Getting a lot of great ideas here fyi so thanks all.


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## Alder26 (Oct 6, 2020)

if you want tooth and more refinement Suita is way..


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## SolidSnake03 (Oct 6, 2020)

my poor poor wallet...


Okay so those that have recommended Suita, any recommendations on where to get one and not skip eating this month? Any more "affordable" mines or locations for Suita?


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## JDC (Oct 6, 2020)

This is a stone in my list, take it then I don't need to worry about the hole on my wallet...









No.124 Tenjou Suita | Mysite


#124 Ozaki akapinA very useful bench stone in a modestly price size. Shorter but wide and thick, it is perfect for knives or tools like chisels. This is a sharpenng stone but it is also a polishing stone that can create a variety of polishes on the softest of irons and the hardest of steels...




www.japanstones.com





Looks to be a great polisher, and with aizu slurry it will probably give you a bit refinement.


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## Alder26 (Oct 6, 2020)

Another option would be to hit up Bernal they have lots of affordable stones that often produce nice kitchen edges. If you call them they can usually point you to a good stone that fits your needs.


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## Robert Lavacca (Oct 6, 2020)

Alder26 said:


> Another option would be to hit up Bernal they have lots of affordable stones that often produce nice kitchen edges. If you call them they can usually point you to a good stone that fits your needs.


This is a good call as well. Also JNS is having a sale on all stones! Check it out. Wish I could. Lol


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## SolidSnake03 (Oct 6, 2020)

Thanks for recommendations guys, look into it now. The JNS sale is nice and may find something that way....


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## DanielC (Oct 7, 2020)

Try an Ueno. I love my Ueno. I use it mostly as a 3k scratch remover for wide bevel polishing but have enjoyed edges from it as well.

A considerably consistent stone if you get a good one (badgertooth has had access to the good ones that I've seen). Its of the speckled mid grit Jnat types, and is on the medium-hard side. Given some atoma slurry kick up and its really a swift stone.

After an Ueno, awesedo seem to remove Ueno scratches with relative ease. An easy, easy set up for a suita if you are polishing and very fast for a progressive sharpening routine.


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## Unstoppabo (Oct 15, 2020)

zizirex said:


> yes, it will have a slightly finer and refine edge but still have some bite from Aizu. I have tried to use it with Tomo Nagura (don't know which mine or layer), Meijiro Nagura and Kuro Nagura. Meijiro is one of the nicest ones.



I haven't gotten around to trying any asano nagura but definitely curious. Finally got around to experimenting with tomo on the aizu and found that it worked best with a softer tomo. Got my best results with a relatively muddy green/grey mystery koppa from Watanabe labeled 38 (HSD I think). A touch more refined vs. the aizu on its own but toothier than the edge off a suita. 

Also tried to work up a slurry with harder/finer stones but didn't have a stone on hand that would auto slurry on the aizu (mine is pretty hard and works best with diamond plate).


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## thebradleycrew (Oct 15, 2020)

I'm all about leaving it at the Aizu and some good stropping to finish it off. I find that, particularly for White and Blue steels (and similar compositions) that is a perfect balance for me of tooth and refined cutting feel. I'm the first person to go spend more money on knives and related stuff, but I don't us my Ohira Suita much for edges now that I have two good Aizu, two Aoto, and a good strop.


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## Marcelo Amaral (Oct 15, 2020)

Besides a suita, a finer Atagoyama could be an option. It is also cheaper.
I love my green Atago (finer than my Aizu) as a stone between my second stone and the suita.

If you are comfortable with harder naturals, you could also try an Ohira Tomae.
In case you favor a bit softer stones, a hakka or a softer but finer shoubudani could do the trick.


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## captaincaed (Nov 1, 2020)

I also have an Aizu from CNC that I’ve been liking. I have some finer synthetics (6k JKI diamond and a Naniwa 8k). If I go from a natural to a synthetic like this, am I losing most of the benefit from the Aizu? I assume it also matters if I use the synthetic for a couple of strokes vs. a good polishing.

Also wondering how to step things up a hair with what I have lying around. Also have yellow and blue coticule, black and translucent Ark, leather strop with 1k diamond, bare balsa. Have some green compound out in the shop too.


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## SolidSnake03 (Nov 1, 2020)

Started playing around more with the Aizu and really liking the edge after that and a good stropping. Interesting enough but don't seem to totally need more stones beyond that. They do add to the fine feeling of the edge but the edge seems to lose durability much faster this way compared to Aizu and strop.


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## captaincaed (Nov 1, 2020)

Gotcha thanks. Yeah Aizu edges just seem to last a little longer than many synthetic stones. Not leaps and bounds, but it's a nice bump


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## toddnmd (Nov 6, 2020)

captaincaed said:


> If I go from a natural to a synthetic like this, am I losing most of the benefit from the Aizu? I assume it also matters if I use the synthetic for a couple of strokes vs. a good polishing.



I have the same question. I recently picked up a Takashima Koppa from Watanabe. Shinichi suggested I progress from Aizu to Arashiyama 6k to Takashima. It seems weird to put a synthetic in the middle there, but I trust his recommendation. He seems pretty positive about the Arashiyama, as I’ve seen other people say he recommends it. 
So, I’m also interested in a good Jnats to follow an Aizu.


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## M1k3 (Nov 6, 2020)

toddnmd said:


> I have the same question. I recently picked up a Takashima Koppa from Watanabe. Shinichi suggested I progress from Aizu to Arashiyama 6k to Takashima. It seems weird to put a synthetic in the middle there, but I trust his recommendation. He seems pretty positive about the Arashiyama, as I’ve seen other people say he recommends it.
> So, I’m also interested in a good Jnats to follow an Aizu.


I'm no jnat expert, so yeah... 

The Oouchi from JKI is about the 6Kish grit range. I'm sure there's other stones in that range, I'm just not that knowledgeable about them.


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