# Your Help (Input) Needed



## Dave Martell (May 14, 2018)

I'm getting tired of making >$.50 an hour making knives so I thought I'd try adding in some work that I got known for - modifying Japanese knives. :cool2:

An example would be how I used to rework Hiromoto AS knives with a rehandle, blade thinning/etching, etc.


If I was to buy some Japanese knives (new), which ones specifically do you think would work out well for re-selling with a modification? What modifications do you think I should offer on these knives? 

I'll welcome all ideas!


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## Godslayer (May 14, 2018)

Anything san mai that looks cool when etched would probably be a decent seller, tip thinning, basic upgrades, basically I'd buy a bunch of tanakas or similar "diamonds in the rough" and sexify them.


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## KCMande (May 14, 2018)

I know you said Japanese knives, but how about some Sabatier? Grind off that bolster, thin the blade, rehandle. I know I would buy one, just a thought.


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## Matus (May 14, 2018)

Definitely some stainless-clad blades with stainless, SS or carbon core. Keep making those wester handles. Also - add some smaller knives - 120 - 180 that can be bought as a gift for spouses. What about a collaboration with someone like JCK? Consider having a short logo/mark added to a butt of a handle on rehandled knives.


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## chinacats (May 14, 2018)

Not exactly what you're asking about but figure with your skillset and tools it's a need that doesn't seem to be filled...could probably do it production style once you got a good design...maybe a standard design of say 10-12 gyutos and a couple of petties and then add custom jobs to spec.

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/36530-Knife-block-for-multiple-large-knives


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## Pensacola Tiger (May 14, 2018)

Misono Dragons, like this one you did five years ago:







More pics here:

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...ery-Re-Handles?p=182947&viewfull=1#post182947


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## Barmoley (May 14, 2018)

That looks really good. I have a Masamoto Yo, that I wouldn't mind something like that done to.


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## Godslayer (May 14, 2018)

Make mid techs and sell them on chef knives 2go :justkidding:

But seriously mid techs, basic yo or yo hybrid handles, heck even if you just mass produced a bunch of 240's it would atleast be more efficient.


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## Dave Martell (May 14, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> Anything san mai that looks cool when etched would probably be a decent seller, tip thinning, basic upgrades, basically I'd buy a bunch of tanakas or similar "diamonds in the rough" and sexify them.



I like what you're talking here. 





KCMande said:


> I know you said Japanese knives, but how about some Sabatier? Grind off that bolster, thin the blade, rehandle. I know I would buy one, just a thought.



I like this idea too. I wonder about the end price though....would be pretty high, might push it a bit.





Matus said:


> Definitely some stainless-clad blades with stainless, SS or carbon core. Keep making those wester handles. Also - add some smaller knives - 120 - 180 that can be bought as a gift for spouses. What about a collaboration with someone like JCK? Consider having a short logo/mark added to a butt of a handle on rehandled knives.



Yeah the stainless clad blades can be a winner. 

Smaller Martell knives could happen, that's a good idea.

I'd love to do a collaboration yet every time I've reached out to vendors it's been a no go for one reason or another. I'd be down for it though.

I like the idea of marking the butt/tang of the blade with my name on an upgrade.






chinacats said:


> Not exactly what you're asking about but figure with your skillset and tools it's a need that doesn't seem to be filled...could probably do it production style once you got a good design...maybe a standard design of say 10-12 gyutos and a couple of petties and then add custom jobs to spec.
> 
> http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/36530-Knife-block-for-multiple-large-knives




That's for sure a hole in the market currently, not sure I could handle that though. 






Pensacola Tiger said:


> Misono Dragons, like this one you did five years ago:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Those dragons sure look nice rehandled. I'd love to do some of those, maybe this would be a good one to start with.






Barmoley said:


> That looks really good. I have a Masamoto Yo, that I wouldn't mind something like that done to.



PM me! 






Godslayer said:


> Make mid techs and sell them on chef knives 2go :justkidding:
> 
> But seriously mid techs, basic yo or yo hybrid handles, heck even if you just mass produced a bunch of 240's it would atleast be more efficient.



Mid techs - Hahahahaha!!!! Seen too many knife makers get burned on that idea. 

I wish I could mass produce on any level. Seems like the best I can do is 2 or 3 of anything at a time. But then I can't sell them quick enough making me wish I only did one.


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## panda (May 14, 2018)

dave every single knife ive ever bought ive always modified to how i want it. mostly thinning, but if too thin behind the edge i would intentionally thicken and add convexity back, or in a lot of instances i would adjust the profile to a more KS-like shape. so pretty much any popular knife would be a good candidate for modify and resell. takeda would be a prime example. 

i bet if you bought like 20 fujiwara nashiji direct @ a bulk discount rate, regrind, put your fit & finish on it with a spa treatment + rehandle you'd make a killing. call it a hitech, heck this midtech crap.


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## labor of love (May 14, 2018)

panda said:


> dave every single knife ive ever bought ive always modified to how i want it. mostly thinning, but if too thin behind the edge i would intentionally thicken and add convexity back, or in a lot of instances i would adjust the profile to a more KS-like shape. so pretty much any popular knife would be a good candidate for modify and resell. takeda would be a prime example.
> 
> i bet if you bought like 20 fujiwara nashiji direct @ a bulk discount rate, regrind, put your fit & finish on it with a spa treatment + rehandle you'd make a killing. call it a hitech, heck this midtech crap.



+1
No meito with real western handles would be nice!


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## panda (May 14, 2018)

what i really want is this https://www.aframestokyo.com/masashi-wa-gyuto-semimirror-finish-240mm-sld-chef-kn240.html
but fix the retarded profile, turn it into martell profile.
also offer dave handle for it and then offer me the original one


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## Von blewitt (May 14, 2018)

KCMande said:


> I know you said Japanese knives, but how about some Sabatier? Grind off that bolster, thin the blade, rehandle. I know I would buy one, just a thought.



I like this idea too


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## niwaki-boy (May 15, 2018)

panda said:


> dave every single knife ive ever bought ive always modified to how i want it. mostly thinning, but if too thin behind the edge i would intentionally thicken and add convexity back, or in a lot of instances i would adjust the profile to a more KS-like shape. so pretty much any popular knife would be a good candidate for modify and resell. takeda would be a prime example.
> 
> i bet if you bought like 20 fujiwara nashiji direct @ a bulk discount rate, regrind, put your fit & finish on it with a spa treatment + rehandle you'd make a killing. call it a hitech, heck this midtech crap.



Thats a knife, TF! It took alotta hours getting mine to where I want them. People want them but are afraid because of the variances, I think this is referred to as the tf lotto. The western handles, as labor mentioned, could use some big help!
.. and Tanakas could always use some Dave love &#128149;


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## daddy yo yo (May 15, 2018)

How about a good monosteel carbon knife such as the Misono Dragon, the Suien VC or Masahiro VC? 

The Misono comes with excellent f&f, so only the blade would need some work. Can't say anything about the other knives I mentioned but these seem to be highly regarded given their fair price... But maybe they need some handle-work too...


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## daddy yo yo (May 15, 2018)

daddy yo yo said:


> How about a good monosteel carbon knife such as the Misono Dragon, the Suien VC or Masahiro VC?
> 
> The Misono comes with excellent f&f, so only the blade would need some work. Can't say anything about the other knives I mentioned but these seem to be highly regarded given their fair price... But maybe they need some handle-work too...



All the above mentioned knives have Western handles. Another good knife with fair pricing would be Wakui, comes with a simple wa-handle... Think of one with handle upgrade (conversion or wa) and a little thinning here and there or whatever is required...


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## panda (May 15, 2018)

naozumi
mono white#1


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

panda said:


> dave every single knife ive ever bought ive always modified to how i want it. mostly thinning, but if too thin behind the edge i would intentionally thicken and add convexity back, or in a lot of instances i would adjust the profile to a more KS-like shape. so pretty much any popular knife would be a good candidate for modify and resell. takeda would be a prime example.
> 
> i bet if you bought like 20 fujiwara nashiji direct @ a bulk discount rate, regrind, put your fit & finish on it with a spa treatment + rehandle you'd make a killing. call it a hitech, heck this midtech crap.



Some good ideas here, well, except for Takeda. :scared4: 

On the Fujiwara Nashiji, are you talking about the cheaper no bolster line, the one with just wood scales? 






labor of love said:


> +1
> No meito with real western handles would be nice!



There's a reason why "No" is in the name. :wink: 

Just joking though, I do think that these knives pimped out would sell.






panda said:


> what i really want is this https://www.aframestokyo.com/masashi-wa-gyuto-semimirror-finish-240mm-sld-chef-kn240.html
> but fix the retarded profile, turn it into martell profile.
> also offer dave handle for it and then offer me the original one



That's an interesting idea. But maybe you just want a source for these handles? :razz:







niwaki-boy said:


> Thats a knife, TF! It took alotta hours getting mine to where I want them. People want them but are afraid because of the variances, I think this is referred to as the tf lotto. The western handles, as labor mentioned, could use some big help!
> .. and Tanakas could always use some Dave love &#62613;



Here's the TF being mentioned again....this is for sure not something I love the idea of but yeah they could sell if worked over.

Tanaka being mentioned again too. I have to look into these , it's been years since I researched what can be had and for what prices.







daddy yo yo said:


> How about a good monosteel carbon knife such as the Misono Dragon, the Suien VC or Masahiro VC?
> 
> The Misono comes with excellent f&f, so only the blade would need some work. Can't say anything about the other knives I mentioned but these seem to be highly regarded given their fair price... But maybe they need some handle-work too...



I like this idea a lot, and it's what I always gravitate towards when I consider these projects, but there's always a downside - perceived value. Seems most people won't be willing to pay say $300+ for a $100 knife. Some will though, it's a bit of a gamble.







daddy yo yo said:


> All the above mentioned knives have Western handles. Another good knife with fair pricing would be Wakui, comes with a simple wa-handle... Think of one with handle upgrade (conversion or wa) and a little thinning here and there or whatever is required...



I'll look into these, not a brand that I've had much experience with.







panda said:


> naozumi
> mono white#1



And another one I know little about. I'll do some research.


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## labor of love (May 15, 2018)

Ehh...Id actually disagree with the wakui suggestion. Not really anything there to improve with the blade or grind. Handle upgrade sure but the same could be said for most $200 knives.
Misono dragon and masahiro vc gyutos that are thinned, eased spine and choil and rehandled would be nice.


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## Godslayer (May 15, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Ehh...Id actually disagree with the wakui suggestion. Not really anything there to improve with the blade or grind. Handle upgrade sure but the same could be said for most $200 knives.



He could probably etch the San mai ones and make them look cooler, do that, a tip thinning (it can never be too thin) and toss on a super basic yo handle or a sexier wa handle. The issue with wakui in my mind, is are people going to be willing to pay the $150-$200 premium for daves improvements, obviously if he does batch work he can keep labour down and make a decent profit, maybe a pre buy Dave for one of these (do a forum vote) to determine which blade would sell best, do a dozen and bang them out relatively quickly. 2 piece or 3 piece handle construction, classy wood and Blackwood ferrule(or horn). Spacer optional. Not sure if you can do yo or wa quicker but atleast personally I'd prefer wa from you.


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## labor of love (May 15, 2018)

I guess we will see what happens. I dont disagree with you with exception to the the tip thinning part, these are some of the thinnest behind the edge San mai knives that can bought at $199. My thoughts here are that it would make sense to pick up something that performs mediocre and pimp it. Wakui are already pretty excellent performers. Just my 2 cents.


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

labor of love said:


> Ehh...Id actually disagree with the wakui suggestion. Not really anything there to improve with the blade or grind. Handle upgrade sure but the same could be said for most $200 knives.
> Misono dragon and masahiro vc gyutos that are thinned, eased spine and choil and rehandled would be nice.





Godslayer said:


> He could probably etch the San mai ones and make them look cooler, do that, a tip thinning (it can never be too thin) and toss on a super basic yo handle or a sexier wa handle. The issue with wakui in my mind, is are people going to be willing to pay the $150-$200 premium for daves improvements, obviously if he does batch work he can keep labour down and make a decent profit, *maybe a pre buy Dave for one of these (do a forum vote) to determine which blade would sell best, do a dozen and bang them out relatively quickly.* 2 piece or 3 piece handle construction, classy wood and Blackwood ferrule(or horn). Spacer optional. Not sure if you can do yo or wa quicker but atleast personally I'd prefer wa from you.




*Now that's an idea! *

Wa or western is pretty even time wise for me. The actual wood used and the amount of finish required plays the largest part in time consumption. Maybe poly handled wa's - they be quick to do! :biggrin:


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

labor of love said:


> I guess we will see what happens. I dont disagree with you with exception to the the tip thinning part, these are some of the thinnest behind the edge San mai knives that can bought at $199. My thoughts here are that it would make sense to pick up something that performs mediocre and pimp it. Wakui are already pretty excellent performers. Just my 2 cents.




Thanks for the info on the tips and behind the edge thickness, this is important to know.


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## Godslayer (May 15, 2018)

Dave Martell said:


> *Now that's an idea! *
> 
> Wa or western is pretty even time wise for me. The actual wood used and the amount of finish required plays the largest part in time consumption. Maybe poly handled wa's - they be quick to do! :biggrin:



My logic is rather then you putting up 2k+ for the dozen blades, take the blade payment upfront and charge the rest once work commences similar to dalman. I'd also reach out to a couple of vendors and see if they have anything they want to clear out, maybe Koki has a dozen misono dragons kicking around or anything similar/budget friendly or even if James knows anyone with a bunch of Sakai seconds you could buy cheap, since your sexting them up anyway it won't really matter.


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> My logic is rather then you putting up 2k+ for the dozen blades, take the blade payment upfront and charge the rest once work commences similar to dalman. I'd also reach out to a couple of vendors and see if they have anything they want to clear out, maybe Koki has a dozen misono dragons kicking around or anything similar/budget friendly or even if James knows anyone with a bunch of Sakai seconds you could buy cheap, since your sexting them up anyway it won't really matter.



:doublethumbsup:


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## panda (May 15, 2018)

No the masashi looks like a really good knife including grind, just has stupid profile and it's huge so plenty of stock to reprofile.

I bet you people would gladly pay $450 for that with Martell profile and handle. This guy used to work.for yoshikane so the pedigree is already there. Add an American twist and you got yourself a winner.


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## Godslayer (May 15, 2018)

panda said:


> No the masashi looks like a really good knife including grind, just has stupid profile and it's huge so plenty of stock to reprofile.
> 
> I bet you people would gladly pay $450 for that with Martell profile and handle. This guy used to work.for yoshikane so the pedigree is already there. Add an American twist and you got yourself a winner.



I'll bump this, his work comes with sayas from aframes. Get 10, ask for 240/270 x 62 or something and you'd have a Takeda slayer.


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## Von blewitt (May 15, 2018)

what about a simple pimp of a Tojiro DP, rounding the spine & choil, light thinning, set the bevels
A little reshaping of the handle & bolster ( like you did on my hiromoto http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/16501-Hiromoto-White-Steel-Redeux)

It would make an excellent entry level knife, and the price could probably kept low enough to appeal to a larger market


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

panda said:


> No the masashi looks like a really good knife including grind, just has stupid profile and it's huge so plenty of stock to reprofile.
> 
> I bet you people would gladly pay $450 for that with Martell profile and handle. This guy used to work.for yoshikane so the pedigree is already there. Add an American twist and you got yourself a winner.






Godslayer said:


> I'll bump this, his work comes with sayas from aframes. Get 10, ask for 240/270 x 62 or something and you'd have a Takeda slayer.




Interesting indeed. :thumbsup:


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## Dave Martell (May 15, 2018)

Von blewitt said:


> what about a simple pimp of a Tojiro DP, rounding the spine & choil, light thinning, set the bevels
> A little reshaping of the handle & bolster ( like you did on my hiromoto http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/16501-Hiromoto-White-Steel-Redeux)
> 
> It would make an excellent entry level knife, and the price could probably kept low enough to appeal to a larger market




I would have never thought of that.


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## Godslayer (May 16, 2018)

If you go for the maboroshi no meito, i thought I'd let you know they look stellar with a mirror polish below the hammered finish, I started doing mine and it's beautiful, with the contrast of the patinad edge and rustic miaty hammer marks above it. Plus I can see my ugly mug(mine was redone by adam marr years ago) and it really does improve the whole package.


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## chinacats (May 16, 2018)

Only thing with TF is you could get into the whole Moritaka **** grind thing all over again...I like the Dragon or DP thoughts myself.


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## niwaki-boy (May 16, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> If you go for the maboroshi no meito, i thought I'd let you know they look stellar with a mirror polish below the hammered finish, I started doing mine and it's beautiful, with the contrast of the patinad edge and rustic miaty hammer marks above it. Plus I can see my ugly mug(mine was redone by adam marr years ago) and it really does improve the whole package.



Thats exactly what I did to mine but did it myself.. uggg. Only took a couple hours.. not and I swear there was a gift shop at the bottom of one the overgrinds :scared4:

Lol .. Adam Marr redid your mug?!?


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## Matus (May 16, 2018)

Ok, I have one more.

Dave, you have a lot of experience and knowledge with grinding blades and finishing them and making handles. What about a collaboration with a smith that would weldforge sanmai, forge the blade and then you would turn it into a finished knife? A bit of Japanese-style of working. Forging would open up the possibilities of the blade geometry (distal taper, integral bolster, etc) and sanmai would add a lot of value too.


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## Godslayer (May 16, 2018)

niwaki-boy said:


> Thats exactly what I did to mine but did it myself.. uggg. Only took a couple hours.. not and I swear there was a gift shop at the bottom of one the overgrinds :scared4:
> 
> Lol .. Adam Marr redid your mug?!?



Adam Marr did a fancy custom red wood burl, with mosaic pin, I'm polishing the area behind the lamination line in my free time and can see my reflection, as for over and under grinds I think dave could fix those pretty easily on his 2 x 72, I like the misono dragon Idea as well and I know they sell seconds for cheap, like a 240 around $100, that since dave is sexifying them any minor issue shouldnt be an issue


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## Dave Martell (May 16, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> If you go for the maboroshi no meito, i thought I'd let you know they look stellar with a mirror polish below the hammered finish, I started doing mine and it's beautiful, with the contrast of the patinad edge and rustic miaty hammer marks above it. Plus I can see my ugly mug(mine was redone by adam marr years ago) and it really does improve the whole package.




I'd sure like doing that over doing the stone finish on them.


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## Dave Martell (May 16, 2018)

chinacats said:


> Only thing with TF is you could get into the whole Moritaka **** grind thing all over again...I like the Dragon or DP thoughts myself.



You had to say the M word.


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## Dave Martell (May 16, 2018)

Matus said:


> Ok, I have one more.
> 
> Dave, you have a lot of experience and knowledge with grinding blades and finishing them and making handles. What about a collaboration with a smith that would weldforge sanmai, forge the blade and then you would turn it into a finished knife? A bit of Japanese-style of working. Forging would open up the possibilities of the blade geometry (distal taper, integral bolster, etc) and sanmai would add a lot of value too.




Not a bad idea if the parties can get on the same page.


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## Dave Martell (May 16, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> ... as for over and under grinds I think dave could fix those pretty easily on his 2 x 72, I like the misono dragon Idea as well and I know they sell seconds for cheap, like a 240 around $100, that since dave is sexifying them any minor issue shouldnt be an issue




I should try one a tester.


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## parbaked (May 16, 2018)

I don't understand why you'd want to buy the new knives to upgrade.
i thought you had cash flow problems. 
You will just end up having to discount the upgraded knives to sell them - same as you do with the new knives you make.
Also there is no reason for you to purchase the new knives unless you get a significant discount (wholesale) compared to your customer.
Otherwise you'd have to mark up the cost of the new knife to get a fair return on your investment - so the end product is more expensive.
Passing along the cost of the new knife with no mark up is not good business. 

i suggest you instead just promote your pimping/refurbishing and let your customers provide the knives.
They can send you their knives or buy a new one and have it shipped to you. This way you are not out cash up front!
And you know you have the customer for the work you're doing.

I think promoting your upgrading and refurbishing services is good business.
One key to grow this business is to be transparent on the pricing and provide reliable turnaround times.

1. Put a price list on your website with price ranges for etching, polishing, re-handling, pimping etc.
2. Provide a reasonable turnaround time and don't charge until the work is done and ready to ship.


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## Nomsdotcom (May 16, 2018)

It does seem like you could come into a deal with a smith in Japan to send you forged steel sans handles. Then you could do finished grinds and fancy yo/wa fit ups. It'd be more of a collab rather than buying unfortunately finished knives and going through the trouble of rehandles ect. 
Just my thoughts.
I'd be super down for a Wat/Martell collaboration knife...


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## Nemo (May 16, 2018)

Nomsdotcom said:


> I'd be super down for a Wat/Martell collaboration knife...



Wow, that is an interesting idea.


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## Godslayer (May 16, 2018)

That's not a bad idea, although I'd probably go for a lower profile factory esque knife, like an apprentice of Ikeda or shiraki, if your spending over 80-100 bucks at that point you'd be better off getting one of the mentioned knives, doing some minor tweaking and running with it. Basically your end goal should be 3-$400 max, basically entry level custom pricing but with better then average handles and sexy looking blades.


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## daddy yo yo (May 17, 2018)

Dave Martell said:


> I like this idea a lot, and it's what I always gravitate towards when I consider these projects, but there's always a downside - perceived value. Seems most people won't be willing to pay say $300+ for a $100 knife. Some will though, it's a bit of a gamble.



Yeah, but wasn't that the case with Hiromoto AS Full Spa Treatments too?

I like the idea of having a good knife, not fancy, not exotic, but a good steel with good heat treatment, pimped by you.

Watanabe? I like his knives as they are. But I like the idea of a young talented smith, the son of someone, or so...


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

parbaked said:


> I don't understand why you'd want to buy the new knives to upgrade.
> i thought you had cash flow problems.
> You will just end up having to discount the upgraded knives to sell them - same as you do with the new knives you make.
> Also there is no reason for you to purchase the new knives unless you get a significant discount (wholesale) compared to your customer.
> ...




Very good advice - thank you!


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

Nomsdotcom said:


> It does seem like you could come into a deal with a smith in Japan to send you forged steel sans handles. Then you could do finished grinds and fancy yo/wa fit ups. It'd be more of a collab rather than buying unfortunately finished knives and going through the trouble of rehandles ect.
> Just my thoughts.
> I'd be super down for a Wat/Martell collaboration knife...





Nemo said:


> Wow, that is an interesting idea.





Godslayer said:


> That's not a bad idea, although I'd probably go for a lower profile factory esque knife, like an apprentice of Ikeda or shiraki, if your spending over 80-100 bucks at that point you'd be better off getting one of the mentioned knives, doing some minor tweaking and running with it. Basically your end goal should be 3-$400 max, basically entry level custom pricing but with better then average handles and sexy looking blades.




More good ideas. So much to consider!


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

daddy yo yo said:


> Yeah, but wasn't that the case with Hiromoto AS Full Spa Treatments too?
> 
> I like the idea of having a good knife, not fancy, not exotic, but a good steel with good heat treatment, pimped by you.
> 
> Watanabe? I like his knives as they are. But I like the idea of a young talented smith, the son of someone, or so...




The Hiromotos were never much of a gamble since I did group buys for 75% of them and following that there was a decent amount of interest for any that I bought. The price never made much sense yet people always bought them. :dontknow:


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## Godslayer (May 17, 2018)

Dave Martell said:


> The Hiromotos were never much of a gamble since I did group buys for 75% of them and following that there was a decent amount of interest for any that I bought. The price never made much sense yet people always bought them. :dontknow:



Your a custom maker... Hype is life


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

Godslayer said:


> Your a custom maker... Hype is life




Unfortunately that's true.


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## ashy2classy (May 17, 2018)

panda said:


> dave every single knife ive ever bought ive always modified to how i want it. mostly thinning, but if too thin behind the edge i would intentionally thicken and add convexity back, or in a lot of instances i would adjust the profile to a more KS-like shape. so pretty much any popular knife would be a good candidate for modify and resell. takeda would be a prime example.
> 
> i bet if you bought like 20 fujiwara nashiji direct @ a bulk discount rate, regrind, put your fit & finish on it with a spa treatment + rehandle you'd make a killing. call it a hitech, heck this midtech crap.



Modified TFs would be a good idea - good thinking Panda! They're overpriced everywhere, so if you modify them to make them better you'll be able to get a good price for them, IMO.


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## zitangy (May 17, 2018)

Nemo said:


> Wow, that is an interesting idea.



to take it further, with your skillset i would buy heat treated blades with with the basic grind.... no polishing or finishing and then you do your magic,,, grind and handles....


a) yr special grind to achieve that with the first cut... you now that this knife is special

b) your finishing

c.) Handles... Not too many in japan can do nice western handles. My Fav is Sajisan which i believe that other makers gets him to do it but with limited types of wood. One or 2 large makers tried but didnt work out. Rest of world mainly Wa handles.. I suspectb that being a masochist... you prefer to do western handles 

d.) You need to hook up with a blacksmith who will sell you the blanks at dealers price and allow you to label it as your brand... if possible or the very least... with their brand.. THere shld be some good money there..

DO send a couple of nice handled knives my way should you implement this idea. it wld be much appreciated

as always best wishes and good luck...Z


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## panda (May 17, 2018)

how about offering up your services of pimping out knives people already have?
do a quote system
they email you what they have and what they want done and you give them a price and estimated completion time.

one candidate i have is my yoshihiro western in mono ginsanko. wouldnt mind knocking the bolster off do a lot of rounding on spine/choil and popping on a stock wa handle and some thinning as well.


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

zitangy said:


> to take it further, with your skillset i would buy heat treated blades with with the basic grind.... no polishing or finishing and then you do your magic,,, grind and handles....
> 
> 
> a) yr special grind to achieve that with the first cut... you now that this knife is special
> ...




Now that's ambitious thinking! I need to digest this some more before commenting. Thanks


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

panda said:


> how about offering up your services of pimping out knives people already have?
> do a quote system
> they email you what they have and what they want done and you give them a price and estimated completion time.



I've been doing that forever....but not for you and I'd like to change that. :wink:





panda said:


> one candidate i have is my yoshihiro western in mono ginsanko. wouldnt mind knocking the bolster off do a lot of rounding on spine/choil and popping on a stock wa handle and some thinning as well.



And along comes the first candidate! 

BTW, did you see this before? *Misono Dragon - Western to Wa Conversion*


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## panda (May 17, 2018)

how did i miss that before? looks awesome! and i love that the neck is nice and thick so you actually have some place to grip. 

i will definitely hit you up about it later down the line as i currently have another project in the works.


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

panda said:


> how did i miss that before? looks awesome! and i love that the neck is nice and thick so you actually have some place to grip.
> 
> i will definitely hit you up about it later down the line as i currently have another project in the works.



:thumbsup:


PS - it's nice that you like the neck/choil but I can do much better/nicer today, doesn't have to be like I did it back then.


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## milkbaby (May 17, 2018)

parbaked said:


> I don't understand why you'd want to buy the new knives to upgrade.
> i thought you had cash flow problems.
> You will just end up having to discount the upgraded knives to sell them - same as you do with the new knives you make.
> Also there is no reason for you to purchase the new knives unless you get a significant discount (wholesale) compared to your customer.
> ...



This except for maybe #2. I know that I wouldn't want to invest time working on something that the owner might stiff me on. On the other hand, you'd be able to hold the knife until payment is made?

Buying a bunch of knives to "upcycle" means sinking perhaps thousands of dollars into inventory. Okay if you have the cash to invest and not need to make a profit right away, but not so good otherwise. You'd be doing something similar to Chris Weidmark, don't know if you know him, google him and etsy japanese knives (he also has a website). As far as I can tell, he buys from the blades from Japanese bladesmiths and then sells them with his custom handles.

Why not do the custom handle thing? It seems people are willing to pay $100-$200 or more for a fancy schmantzy wa handle. And a lot of them seem happy to pay extra for them to be installed. Charging somebody $200 for that seems like taking candy from a baby to me, just my opinion.


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## Dave Martell (May 17, 2018)

milkbaby said:


> Buying a bunch of knives to "upcycle" means sinking perhaps thousands of dollars into inventory. Okay if you have the cash to invest and not need to make a profit right away, but not so good otherwise. You'd be doing something similar to Chris Weidmark, don't know if you know him, google him and etsy japanese knives (he also has a website). As far as I can tell, he buys from the blades from Japanese bladesmiths and then sells them with his custom handles.



I hadn't heard of Chris before now. I'll check him out. Thanks





milkbaby said:


> Why not do the custom handle thing? It seems people are willing to pay $100-$200 or more for a fancy schmantzy wa handle. And a lot of them seem happy to pay extra for them to be installed. Charging somebody $200 for that seems like taking candy from a baby to me, just my opinion.




I've been doing this for about a year or so.


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## Godslayer (May 17, 2018)

Chris does good work and is a stand up chef and dealer I bought a takamura from him a while back... Dave has the advantage of adding blade modifications and improving minor flaws in the blade, better tires vs better tires, lightened frame and a new paint job. As mentioned before a pre buy with members voting for wha blade is chosen is your best bet and then reinvest capital in what members were also interested in or things you can get cheap from vendors, smiths or bst


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